PTS Update 16 - Feedback Thread for Nightblades

zyk

exeeter702 wrote: »

zyk wrote: »

Except maybe most players currently playing Nightblade aren't healers and don't want to be healers and possibly some might even be using the Agony line effectively.

The only reason to use agony was for meteor combo. No one made use of the 30 second polymorph type skills in pve and there are far more useful CC than agony in pvp. Its damage component was absolute garbage even despite the battle spirit ignoring bug.

This is an overall excellent change for magblades both pvp and pve.

It is useful for all types of burst combos, not only those using meteor. Beyond that, it is also very useful for fleeing foes and as a ranged CC that also provides siphoning passives. It is also a useful tool for escapes.

Losing a class CC at the same time another class CC is being nerfed is a big deal.

I hope ZOS considers retaining the Malefic Wreath morph as a compromise.

technohic

KingJ wrote: »

The agony change is just bad why use a heal that hurts you.Change the base morph to a HOT that attach to you or a ally and one of the morph give minor mending.

Yeah, I liked it as an escape from gap closer spam. Buy just enough time to cloak away. If the tell is too visible, they'll just pop imoveabilty pots then charge.

exeeter702

zyk wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

zyk wrote: »

Except maybe most players currently playing Nightblade aren't healers and don't want to be healers and possibly some might even be using the Agony line effectively.

The only reason to use agony was for meteor combo. No one made use of the 30 second polymorph type skills in pve and there are far more useful CC than agony in pvp. Its damage component was absolute garbage even despite the battle spirit ignoring bug.

This is an overall excellent change for magblades both pvp and pve.

It is useful for all types of burst combos, not only those using meteor. Beyond that, it is also very useful for fleeing foes and as a ranged CC that also provides siphoning passives. It is also a useful tool for escapes.

Losing a class CC at the same time another class CC is being nerfed is a big deal.

I hope ZOS considers retaining the Malefic Wreath morph as a compromise.

You cant really use it for burst combos though.. the only reason its good for meteor is because of the impact timing and its guaranteed 1 second stun. And only then is it even used when you are playing a ranged game, otherwise fear does everything you would want agony to do for burst combos. You cant use it in conjunction with assasins will proc because with the projectiles travel time, you have to immediately agony them after firing the bow which will cut of its micro cast time and thus cancel the attack entirely. And if you agony before they are going to break free anyways.

Agony as a stun for a target out of stam is equally lousy since it breaks from damage. When needing a ranged CC for kill combos on those that have been stam drained lightning and fire clench / reach are both better.

I dont really understand why you feel it can be used as an escape tool. People will only sit in stuns when they can afford to or its strategically sound to do so. If you have successfully drained a targets stam as a ranged magnb, you should have the win, and if you are on the run, they likely are not out of stam, and will break free anyways.

And since you can only use the skill on 1 target at a time, its useless in scenarios where you are outnumbered.

umagon

After testing the agony changes I found both morphs are effected by the champion points which is good; as it allows for more healing. So, for example with shrewd offering the tool tip was reporting 42% but the actual value I was getting was 34%. I am not sure what else it’s effected by I didn’t test the other buffs.

But the healing is also effected by battle spirit in cyrodiil; which I suggest that it not be effected by it as it ruins its usefulness. The healing at least on my tankblade is comparable to vigor but with agony's zero cost, agony becomes the better choice. The only problem I have with it is it being effected by battle spirit.

The change is a good start and I can say I am somewhat satisfied with it so far; just need to make it not effected by battle spirit. Also, I would like a way to lock the skill so it only targets my character. I say that under my assumption that it can only heal one target and not the target and caster (I didn’t test that part). And I want to be able to use it in a self-healing only mode.

OdinForge

I found the healing for healthy offering to be exceptionally strong on an offensive endgame magnb for pvp. On a 5 LA build with 3K crit resistance, 55% spell critical, 3K spell damage 35K magicka and 1.7K magicka regen. I was able to get over 23K on the tooltip buffed but without buffs like continuous.

Not bad for a skill that cost zero magicka.

SydneyGrey

So you can heal your group members, and kill yourself doing it.
Then they'll kick you from the dungeon while screaming L2P because you kept dying while they stayed alive.
I'm thinking this sounds pretty terrible. I can see ZERO reason to use that.

Mojmir

SydneyGrey wrote: »

So you can heal your group members, and kill yourself doing it.
Then they'll kick you from the dungeon while screaming L2P because you kept dying while they stayed alive.
I'm thinking this sounds pretty terrible. I can see ZERO reason to use that.

So now nbs have a class specific version of spell symmetry, lol.

Smerchy

Does vampire damage reduction affects new agony? I think this isn't bad skill for NB healers, and it cost no magicka which is a big bonus..

Love Wizard

Thanks for these awesome changes, I very much look forward to playing a class that is highly competitive in terms of PvE DPS. /s

Lifecode666

Grim focus should be reworked again.

x4 light attacks!

DDuke

Lifecode666 wrote: »

Grim focus should be reworked again.

x4 light attacks!

I'd prefer if it worked like Rally tbh, current implementation feels very clunky.

Alternatively, would be nice if the light attacks from previous buff carried over to the next one when you refresh it.

taleth

Agony was a useful CC takeing that away is what hurts. Especially with the horrible replacement. When I think of agony I think of a dot that increases exponentially when a target is moving. You could have the stam morph version cause a bleed of thier mind and magicka deal magicka damage. I would still like to see disorient but it seems your removing it from all classes wich kinda sux.

Trashs1

does the dmg proc pirate skeleton?

olsborg

Malevolent Offering: Needs to scale of highest stats, so stamblades can actually have some kinda healing. In theory it sounds good to finally get minor mending, but the ability itself isnt worth a slot for stamblades (or magblades)cause it scales of magicka and it actually dmges yourself.

Mass Hysteria nerf, yea ok, but the Terror runes takes 3 seconds to arm so its basicly useless in pvp. You need to cc ppl when you cast the ability, not 3s later, that will get you killed.

What about power extraction? And what about the fact that Restoration staff ulti and healing thicket(warden) is way better then soul siphon and cost about half. You dont see darkness ulti used either becasue it cost 200 ulti, for a stationary rune for a class thats supposed to be quite mobile.

DDuke

Trashs1 wrote: »

does the dmg proc pirate skeleton?

No, it doesn't proc any "when you take damage" sets.

Wrubius_Coronaria

Mass hysteria should remain as it is on live.

Tommy_The_Gun

Ok so here is some feedback:

Link to current NB skills: http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Nightblade+Skills
Aspect of Terror morphs (currently in game):

Mass Hysteria:

Summon a dark spirit to terrify up to 3 enemies, causing them to flee in fear for 4 seconds. Even after recovering, enemies have Movement Speed reduced 50% for 4 seconds and are afflicted with Minor Maim, which reduces their damage done by 15%. Also applies Minor Maim to the enemy when the fear ends, reducing their damage done.

Manifestation of Terror:

Conceal two sinister traps, one at the targeted location and another next to you, which take 3 seconds to arm and last for 33 seconds. When each trap is triggered, a dark spirit is summoned to terrify up to 2 enemies, causing them to flee in fear for 4 seconds. After the fear ends, their Movement Speed is reduced by 50% for 5 seconds. Creates two traps instead, which fear the enemy that trigger them.

And here is the current PTS version:

Shadow:

Mass Hysteria (Aspect of Terror morph):
This morph no longer fears an additional enemy, but only fears the same amount of enemies as the base ability (2 enemies). It continues to inflict Minor Maim as a morph effect.

Manifestation of Terror (Aspect of Terror morph):
This morph now fears up to 6 enemies per trap, up from 2, and the trap no longer triggers if a crowd control-immune enemy walks over it. Enemies can also now see an initial projectile marking the trap’s location.

The thing is that this skill and its morphs are purely PvP skills. Almost never used in PvE. All bosses are resistant to fear and there is no point in using fear on trash-mobs when you can literally vaporise them.

Now, lets think of how this skills are used in PvP:

Fear is used only when you want to break fight and escape. NB attack from stealth, stunning the enemy and if they don't succeed in killing an enemy - they use fear to break fight and go back to stealth. Also - when a group is chasing you - you can fear them and escape.

The thing that makes the second morph (Manifestation of Terror) useless in PvP is basically this part:
The trap takes 3 seconds to arm. Even if you place it - someone can just walk or run over it (before 3 sec passed) and it will not trigger...
If you want to escape fast by the time you place a trap and it arms after 3 seconds - NB is dead. It does not matter how many players you can "fear". It does not matter if it is 6, 12 , 24, or even 100 players. 3 second of "arming" time pretty much kills this morph.
That is why - nobody will use it. It simply has a terrible flaw that disqualify it in any means and especially in PvP where 3 seconds feels like eternity.... And to add even more to it on PTS it is now visible to enemy when you place it.
- making it even more pointless.

As for the first morph (Mass Hysteria) - it is unnecessary to reduce the "feared" target to 2 (3->2). People will always complain even if it will fear only 1 player (especially magicka builds that often have no stamina recourse to break free). It is a sustain / survivability skill.

My suggestion:

To make second morph a valid choice is to either reduce "arming" time significantly to like 0.5 or 1 second.

The other way is to simply make it just like regular un-morphed skill but limit the number of feared players to 1 and make it a ranged skill (25 - 28m range).

As for the Agony rework here are my thoughts:

Current Agony morphs:

Prolonged Suffering:

Shackle an enemy in torment disorienting them for 30 seconds and dealing [x] Magic Damage over 7 seconds when the effect ends. You can only have one Prolonged Suffering at a time. The damage over time effect lasts for longer.

Malefic Wreath

Shackle an enemy in torment disorientating them for 30 seconds and damaging all nearby enemies when the effect ends for [x] Magic Damage plus 5% for each second the target was stunned. You can only have one Malefic Wreath at a time. Deals area damage when the effect ends.

And here is the current PTS version:

Agony: This ability and its morphs is now an ally-targeted spell that heals them over time and damages you for 50% of the amount healed. We also renamed this ability to Malevolent Offering.

Malefic Wreath (Agony morph): This morph now grants Minor Mending when it deals damage to you, and has been renamed to Healthy Offering.

Prolonged Suffering (Agony morph): This morph now decreases the amount of self-inflicted damage dealt to you to 35% of the amount healed, and has been renamed to Shrewd Offering.

That is a drastic change - Removal of second NB CC ability. Instead we have healing ability that basically transfers health to a target and can even kill the caster... this is the part that should be fixed. You should not be able to kill yourself while healing an allay.

My suggestion:

Ability could be be changed slightly. Make it to only heal while the caster has more health. When it drops to less than 30% of base health - it will heal the caster instead.

I just hope that someone from ZOS team will actually read this and think this changes through. All of those changes fell a bit rushed and unthought - and some of them (especially NB Mass Hysteria changes) unnecessary.

Nox_Noir

Some feedback for Malevolent Offerings:

Sounded exciting at first, a nice HoT for NB healer with a unique cool mechanic in line with the whole blood magic and syphoning theme.
It's a free skill that can be targeted at one single ally, including oneself.

I tested the healthy offerings morph for its minor mending buff as a healer for the new trial.
It's a strong hot, it's free, and the damage I received back seemed manageable, I was able to heal through it.
However, being able to only heal a single ally from the whole trial group seems frankly quite useless. I tried to heal our tank with it but even the targeting was already a problem, trying to pick out one player amidst 11 others in the heat of battle is very difficult. Maybe it's more useful for 4-man content, but for trials I find it extremely impractical.

Interestingly, the skill can also be used as a self heal, if it's cast while not targeting any other ally.
This seems to be a much more practical use of it. From what I can tell it's healing and damaging me simultaneously, effectively just decreasing the strength of the HOT by the amount of damage it inflicts, it nets me about 1.7k hps self heal which is pretty good. The other morph would probably net me even more.

So what's the point of this skill?
The usefulness of it as a tool to heal group members is in my opinion very questionable, especially in a trial.
The only good use I can see is self healing for solo content or PVP, but MagNB already has a lot of self healing from other skills, so this seems like a wasted opportunity to me, it's just more of the same, instead of expanding the usefulness of Nightblade as a group healer it's just making them even more self-healy in PVP or vMA.

My suggestion:
Make this more useful for group healing instead of self-healing!
I would love this to be an AOE heal over time instead of single target, with output and inflicted damage scaled down accordingly. Weather this would be a targeted AOE like healing spring or affecting a number of allies in a certain range around caster I don't really care, anything would be more useful than only hitting one ally.
Or at least make it a smart targeting skill instead of manually, automatically choosing the lowest health target or something like that.
The self damage inflicted is an interesting mechanic that could justify it beeing an extraordinarily powerful heal to make up for the sacrifice.

With the other changes in recent patches, Nightblade has become more viable as a healer, I think if this new heal could be tweaked into something useful for group healing, it would help NB heal to come out of the shadows and make more people actually consider to play it.

Koolio

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Ok so here is some feedback:

Link to current NB skills: http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Nightblade+Skills
Aspect of Terror morphs (currently in game):

Mass Hysteria:

Summon a dark spirit to terrify up to 3 enemies, causing them to flee in fear for 4 seconds. Even after recovering, enemies have Movement Speed reduced 50% for 4 seconds and are afflicted with Minor Maim, which reduces their damage done by 15%. Also applies Minor Maim to the enemy when the fear ends, reducing their damage done.

Manifestation of Terror:

Conceal two sinister traps, one at the targeted location and another next to you, which take 3 seconds to arm and last for 33 seconds. When each trap is triggered, a dark spirit is summoned to terrify up to 2 enemies, causing them to flee in fear for 4 seconds. After the fear ends, their Movement Speed is reduced by 50% for 5 seconds. Creates two traps instead, which fear the enemy that trigger them.

And here is the current PTS version:

Shadow:

Mass Hysteria (Aspect of Terror morph):
This morph no longer fears an additional enemy, but only fears the same amount of enemies as the base ability (2 enemies). It continues to inflict Minor Maim as a morph effect.

Manifestation of Terror (Aspect of Terror morph):
This morph now fears up to 6 enemies per trap, up from 2, and the trap no longer triggers if a crowd control-immune enemy walks over it. Enemies can also now see an initial projectile marking the trap’s location.

The thing is that this skill and its morphs are purely PvP skills. Almost never used in PvE. All bosses are resistant to fear and there is no point in using fear on trash-mobs when you can literally vaporise them.

Now, lets think of how this skills are used in PvP:

Fear is used only when you want to break fight and escape. NB attack from stealth, stunning the enemy and if they don't succeed in killing an enemy - they use fear to break fight and go back to stealth. Also - when a group is chasing you - you can fear them and escape.

The thing that makes the second morph (Manifestation of Terror) useless in PvP is basically this part:
The trap takes 3 seconds to arm. Even if you place it - someone can just walk or run over it (before 3 sec passed) and it will not trigger...
If you want to escape fast by the time you place a trap and it arms after 3 seconds - NB is dead. It does not matter how many players you can "fear". It does not matter if it is 6, 12 , 24, or even 100 players. 3 second of "arming" time pretty much kills this morph.
That is why - nobody will use it. It simply has a terrible flaw that disqualify it in any means and especially in PvP where 3 seconds feels like eternity.... And to add even more to it on PTS it is now visible to enemy when you place it.
- making it even more pointless.

As for the first morph (Mass Hysteria) - it is unnecessary to reduce the "feared" target to 2 (3->2). People will always complain even if it will fear only 1 player (especially magicka builds that often have no stamina recourse to break free). It is a sustain / survivability skill.

My suggestion:

To make second morph a valid choice is to either reduce "arming" time significantly to like 0.5 or 1 second.

The other way is to simply make it just like regular un-morphed skill but limit the number of feared players to 1 and make it a ranged skill (25 - 28m range).

As for the Agony rework here are my thoughts:

Current Agony morphs:

Prolonged Suffering:

Shackle an enemy in torment disorienting them for 30 seconds and dealing [x] Magic Damage over 7 seconds when the effect ends. You can only have one Prolonged Suffering at a time. The damage over time effect lasts for longer.

Malefic Wreath

Shackle an enemy in torment disorientating them for 30 seconds and damaging all nearby enemies when the effect ends for [x] Magic Damage plus 5% for each second the target was stunned. You can only have one Malefic Wreath at a time. Deals area damage when the effect ends.

And here is the current PTS version:

Agony: This ability and its morphs is now an ally-targeted spell that heals them over time and damages you for 50% of the amount healed. We also renamed this ability to Malevolent Offering.

Malefic Wreath (Agony morph): This morph now grants Minor Mending when it deals damage to you, and has been renamed to Healthy Offering.

Prolonged Suffering (Agony morph): This morph now decreases the amount of self-inflicted damage dealt to you to 35% of the amount healed, and has been renamed to Shrewd Offering.

That is a drastic change - Removal of second NB CC ability. Instead we have healing ability that basically transfers health to a target and can even kill the caster... this is the part that should be fixed. You should not be able to kill yourself while healing an allay.

My suggestion:

Ability could be be changed slightly. Make it to only heal while the caster has more health. When it drops to less than 30% of base health - it will heal the caster instead.

I just hope that someone from ZOS team will actually read this and think this changes through. All of those changes fell a bit rushed and unthought - and some of them (especially NB Mass Hysteria changes) unnecessary.

Manifestation of terror is awesome on live. Finally after a change a few patches ago which made it terrible. The 3 seconds to arm isn't an issue once you get used to the skill. Please don't change it to 1 target at range.

Masel

Nox_Noir wrote: »

Some feedback for Malevolent Offerings:

Sounded exciting at first, a nice HoT for NB healer with a unique cool mechanic in line with the whole blood magic and syphoning theme.
It's a free skill that can be targeted at one single ally, including oneself.

I tested the healthy offerings morph for its minor mending buff as a healer for the new trial.
It's a strong hot, it's free, and the damage I received back seemed manageable, I was able to heal through it.
However, being able to only heal a single ally from the whole trial group seems frankly quite useless. I tried to heal our tank with it but even the targeting was already a problem, trying to pick out one player amidst 11 others in the heat of battle is very difficult. Maybe it's more useful for 4-man content, but for trials I find it extremely impractical.

Interestingly, the skill can also be used as a self heal, if it's cast while not targeting any other ally.
This seems to be a much more practical use of it. From what I can tell it's healing and damaging me simultaneously, effectively just decreasing the strength of the HOT by the amount of damage it inflicts, it nets me about 1.7k hps self heal which is pretty good. The other morph would probably net me even more.

So what's the point of this skill?
The usefulness of it as a tool to heal group members is in my opinion very questionable, especially in a trial.
The only good use I can see is self healing for solo content or PVP, but MagNB already has a lot of self healing from other skills, so this seems like a wasted opportunity to me, it's just more of the same, instead of expanding the usefulness of Nightblade as a group healer it's just making them even more self-healy in PVP or vMA.

My suggestion:
Make this more useful for group healing instead of self-healing!
I would love this to be an AOE heal over time instead of single target, with output and inflicted damage scaled down accordingly. Weather this would be a targeted AOE like healing spring or affecting a number of allies in a certain range around caster I don't really care, anything would be more useful than only hitting one ally.
Or at least make it a smart targeting skill instead of manually, automatically choosing the lowest health target or something like that.
The self damage inflicted is an interesting mechanic that could justify it beeing an extraordinarily powerful heal to make up for the sacrifice.

With the other changes in recent patches, Nightblade has become more viable as a healer, I think if this new heal could be tweaked into something useful for group healing, it would help NB heal to come out of the shadows and make more people actually consider to play it.

Agreed.

DDuke

Koolio wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Ok so here is some feedback:

Link to current NB skills: http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Nightblade+Skills
Aspect of Terror morphs (currently in game):

Mass Hysteria:

Summon a dark spirit to terrify up to 3 enemies, causing them to flee in fear for 4 seconds. Even after recovering, enemies have Movement Speed reduced 50% for 4 seconds and are afflicted with Minor Maim, which reduces their damage done by 15%. Also applies Minor Maim to the enemy when the fear ends, reducing their damage done.

Manifestation of Terror:

Conceal two sinister traps, one at the targeted location and another next to you, which take 3 seconds to arm and last for 33 seconds. When each trap is triggered, a dark spirit is summoned to terrify up to 2 enemies, causing them to flee in fear for 4 seconds. After the fear ends, their Movement Speed is reduced by 50% for 5 seconds. Creates two traps instead, which fear the enemy that trigger them.

And here is the current PTS version:

Shadow:

Mass Hysteria (Aspect of Terror morph):
This morph no longer fears an additional enemy, but only fears the same amount of enemies as the base ability (2 enemies). It continues to inflict Minor Maim as a morph effect.

Manifestation of Terror (Aspect of Terror morph):
This morph now fears up to 6 enemies per trap, up from 2, and the trap no longer triggers if a crowd control-immune enemy walks over it. Enemies can also now see an initial projectile marking the trap’s location.

The thing is that this skill and its morphs are purely PvP skills. Almost never used in PvE. All bosses are resistant to fear and there is no point in using fear on trash-mobs when you can literally vaporise them.

Now, lets think of how this skills are used in PvP:

Fear is used only when you want to break fight and escape. NB attack from stealth, stunning the enemy and if they don't succeed in killing an enemy - they use fear to break fight and go back to stealth. Also - when a group is chasing you - you can fear them and escape.

The thing that makes the second morph (Manifestation of Terror) useless in PvP is basically this part:
The trap takes 3 seconds to arm. Even if you place it - someone can just walk or run over it (before 3 sec passed) and it will not trigger...
If you want to escape fast by the time you place a trap and it arms after 3 seconds - NB is dead. It does not matter how many players you can "fear". It does not matter if it is 6, 12 , 24, or even 100 players. 3 second of "arming" time pretty much kills this morph.
That is why - nobody will use it. It simply has a terrible flaw that disqualify it in any means and especially in PvP where 3 seconds feels like eternity.... And to add even more to it on PTS it is now visible to enemy when you place it.
- making it even more pointless.

As for the first morph (Mass Hysteria) - it is unnecessary to reduce the "feared" target to 2 (3->2). People will always complain even if it will fear only 1 player (especially magicka builds that often have no stamina recourse to break free). It is a sustain / survivability skill.

My suggestion:

To make second morph a valid choice is to either reduce "arming" time significantly to like 0.5 or 1 second.

The other way is to simply make it just like regular un-morphed skill but limit the number of feared players to 1 and make it a ranged skill (25 - 28m range).

As for the Agony rework here are my thoughts:

Current Agony morphs:

Prolonged Suffering:

Shackle an enemy in torment disorienting them for 30 seconds and dealing [x] Magic Damage over 7 seconds when the effect ends. You can only have one Prolonged Suffering at a time. The damage over time effect lasts for longer.

Malefic Wreath

Shackle an enemy in torment disorientating them for 30 seconds and damaging all nearby enemies when the effect ends for [x] Magic Damage plus 5% for each second the target was stunned. You can only have one Malefic Wreath at a time. Deals area damage when the effect ends.

And here is the current PTS version:

Agony: This ability and its morphs is now an ally-targeted spell that heals them over time and damages you for 50% of the amount healed. We also renamed this ability to Malevolent Offering.

Malefic Wreath (Agony morph): This morph now grants Minor Mending when it deals damage to you, and has been renamed to Healthy Offering.

Prolonged Suffering (Agony morph): This morph now decreases the amount of self-inflicted damage dealt to you to 35% of the amount healed, and has been renamed to Shrewd Offering.

That is a drastic change - Removal of second NB CC ability. Instead we have healing ability that basically transfers health to a target and can even kill the caster... this is the part that should be fixed. You should not be able to kill yourself while healing an allay.

My suggestion:

Ability could be be changed slightly. Make it to only heal while the caster has more health. When it drops to less than 30% of base health - it will heal the caster instead.

I just hope that someone from ZOS team will actually read this and think this changes through. All of those changes fell a bit rushed and unthought - and some of them (especially NB Mass Hysteria changes) unnecessary.

Manifestation of terror is awesome on live. Finally after a change a few patches ago which made it terrible. The 3 seconds to arm isn't an issue once you get used to the skill. Please don't change it to 1 target at range.

Yeah, agreed.

With Manifestation of Terror, you don't trigger GCD when you CC your opponent - meaning you get 1 second worth of extra burst on target before CC break happens.

If anything, they should be buffing Mass Hysteria to be on par. I haven't had it on my bar for years (you already get Minor Maim on target with Shadow Image and you already get stun with Incap & cloak->heavy attack+SA).

Just an idea: how about making Mass Hysteria a delayed CC as well?

I.e. "After 1,5 seconds, summon a dark spirit to terrify up to 3 nearby enemies, causing them to flee in fear for 4.5 seconds."

Dojohoda

PVP perspective- A little salty here. Nightblades are tired of getting nerfed.

Manifestation of Terror

Manifestation of Terror (Aspect of Terror morph): This morph now fears up to 6 enemies per trap, up from 2, and the trap no longer triggers if a crowd control-immune enemy walks over it. Enemies can also now see an initial projectile marking the trap’s location.

Mass Hysteria (Aspect of Terror morph): This morph no longer fears an additional enemy, but only fears the same amount of enemies as the base ability (2 enemies). It continues to inflict Minor Maim as a morph effect.

Developer Comments:

We wanted to distinguish the gameplay between Aspect of Terror’s morphs. Mass Hysteria grants an instant fear and strong debuff, while Aspect of Terror is more delayed but affects more targets.

Because Aspect of Terror is now more powerful against groups, we’ve made the initial projectile visible to help add counterplay to the ability.

I don't understand the nerf to Mass Hysteria. It does not work half the time anymore because of the buff to CC immunity in previous patch, yet it still costs us our magicka. I suspect Mass Hysteria is bugged in that if it hits one person with cc immunity, then it breaks the skill. This bug is terrible for stamblades because of their smaller magicka pool. Please check to see if Mass Hysteria is bugged as described above.

(Salty comment) Also, why nerf a useful nightblade CC skill while giving DK's and Sorcs unblockable, undodgable and spammable CC's? Never mind that they might not use the new skills, but WHY NERF Mass Hysteria??

If you do decide to follow through with this nerf to Mass Hysteria, you should rename it to something else like 'Maybe Scare Two People'.

If you are going to continue gimping Nightblades, then please buff our sturdiness in our passives. Also please add two seconds or more to all instances of Major Expedition that we have in our skill lines.

Manifestation of terror might be okay for nightblades that defend keeps or play on bridges and gates. One would have to rely on the pure madness of the zerg running into it and not noticing the runes as well as the server not rendering the runes. BUT-- I do not have an experienced view on this morph since I do not use it. I would think that because the new version is visible, the nightblades who use the current invisible version would rather it stay as it is. Just guessing, please overlook.


Siphoning

Siphoning
Agony: This ability and its morphs is now an ally-targeted spell that heals them over time and damages you for 50% of the amount healed. We also renamed this ability to Malevolent Offering.

Malefic Wreath (Agony morph): This morph now grants Minor Mending when it deals damage to you, and has been renamed to Healthy Offering.

Prolonged Suffering (Agony morph): This morph now decreases the amount of self-inflicted damage dealt to you to 35% of the amount healed, and has been renamed to Shrewd Offering.

Developer Comments:

This redesign of Agony and its morphs gave us an opportunity to create a new ability more in-line with the theme of Siphoning. It helps Nightblades fulfill the healing role in a unique way, and synergizes with the other Siphoning abilities that let you steal health like Strife or Siphoning Strikes. You can then transfer that health to your allies.

Like Cauterize, this ability can be self-cast. Since you’re taking damage each time it heals, the total return will be less efficient than casting it on an ally instead.

Agony, now known as Malevolent Offering, is a powerful heal and it only damages you if the target is actually healed. But be careful! You can kill your character with this ability.

Agony Changes.. Are Nightblades now Tanks? Did I miss something here? Agony Changes might be okay (or not), but is it a substitute for any other heals (which also happen to be offensive skills) that already take a place in our skill bar? It goes against the (Magicka) Nightblade healing theme: "If you're not killing, then you're not healing" (aka Drain Power and Strife lines and Tether).. unless you mean the part where we can kill ourselves? Trying to be funny, but not sure whether to laugh or cry.

Lastly, if the Agony Changes are supposed to be for ALL nightblades, then make it scale off the maximum pool. Currently it scales off magicka.

(Additionally, there is nothing wrong with Agony. Nevermind that it isn't often used. Nightblades slot it when they think they will need it. Yes, it is niche, but it is very useful.)


Soul Siphon (Soul Shred morph)

Soul Siphon (Soul Shred morph): Increased the distance an ally can travel away from you before the heal tether snaps to 25 meters, up from 20 meters.

Soul Shred: It's still a trash ultimate. Might be good for groups, but typically PVP groups will want you to Do Damage with an ultimate. If you really want to make this good, add Major Expedition and make sure the tethers cloak if the nightblade cloaks. It could be an OH SH** nightblade-get-away card with the Mass Hysteria nerf.

Sounomi

Not too thrilled with NBs losing one of their ranged targeted CCs, the one that could actually not be dodged by endless dodge rollers that seem to infest PvP these days at that. But if you're gonna change it into something other than a CC than remove the agony skill from mobs too. The number reason I used the skill at all in PvE was put the stupidly annoying mobs that cast it on you the instant you aggro them and they're usually in a pack where I find it useful to just put them out of decommission til I'm done with the rest.

SirAndy

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for Nightblades. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the changes on the Agony and Manifestation of Terror abilities.

Why do you hate Nightblades so much?

Heresyall

x

Heresyall

Hello ,

I'll talk mostly here about the new agony (Malevolent Offerings).
Actually the idea was good but it has alot of weaknesses that will make it totally useless in pvp :

1) Magblade is already one of the squishiest class in cyrodiil right now ,making it sacrifying hp to heal another one is kinda meh.

2)You have to target someone to heal : ????? it's actually impossible in cyrodiil even with the help of the ui , every ally that will be nearer than the target you want to heal will take it instead of him and you'll basicaly lost hp for nothing by healing a random guy.

3)Rapid regen is way better this patch because of the vma resto staff up : don't need to target , heal yourself , gives magicka back and for mutagen ,can purge .Magblade in pvp basically don't have slots for random skill even if it's totally free.

4)Was wrong on this one.

OdinForge

Heresyall wrote: »

Hello ,

I'll talk mostly here about the new agony (Malevolent Offerings).
Actually the idea was good but it has alot of weaknesses that will make it totally useless in pvp :

1) Magblade is already one of the squishiest class in cyrodiil right now ,making it sacrifying hp to heal another one is kinda meh.

2)You have to target someone to heal : ????? it's actually impossible in cyrodiil even with the help of the ui , every ally that will be nearer than the target you want to heal will take it instead of him and you'll basicaly lost hp for nothing by healing a random guy.

3)Rapid regen is way better this patch because of the vma resto staff up : don't need to target , heal yourself , gives magicka back and for mutagen ,can purge .Magblade in pvp basically don't have slots for random skill even if it's totally free.

4)Make the minor mending morph a selfhealing one if not targetting anyone : -> put the cost at like 2 k magicka and if you don't target an ally make it heal the caster for 50% of the base healing , it might be worth it to slot if like that ( should give around the same hots as rapid regen or even a bit more) / 1 target maximum possible.

Did you test the change?

1.) Magnb when properly built is definitely not one of the squishiest classes, not saying it doesn't have flaws but it's definitely not one of the squishiest.

2.) It's very easy to target allies with this heal, you aren't lining up headshots here.

3.) Rapid regen is far inferior to this heal, the tooltip on this heal can easily exceed 23K. The VMA staff doesn't change that fact.

4.) This IS a self heal if you don't target anyone, and one without a cost at that.

Heresyall

OdinForge wrote: »

Heresyall wrote: »

Hello ,

I'll talk mostly here about the new agony (Malevolent Offerings).
Actually the idea was good but it has alot of weaknesses that will make it totally useless in pvp :

1) Magblade is already one of the squishiest class in cyrodiil right now ,making it sacrifying hp to heal another one is kinda meh.

2)You have to target someone to heal : ????? it's actually impossible in cyrodiil even with the help of the ui , every ally that will be nearer than the target you want to heal will take it instead of him and you'll basicaly lost hp for nothing by healing a random guy.

3)Rapid regen is way better this patch because of the vma resto staff up : don't need to target , heal yourself , gives magicka back and for mutagen ,can purge .Magblade in pvp basically don't have slots for random skill even if it's totally free.

4)Make the minor mending morph a selfhealing one if not targetting anyone : -> put the cost at like 2 k magicka and if you don't target an ally make it heal the caster for 50% of the base healing , it might be worth it to slot if like that ( should give around the same hots as rapid regen or even a bit more) / 1 target maximum possible.

Did you test the change?

1.) Magnb when properly built is definitely not one of the squishiest classes, not saying it doesn't have flaws but it's definitely not one of the squishiest.

2.) It's very easy to target allies with this heal, you aren't lining up headshots here.

3.) Rapid regen is far inferior to this heal, the tooltip on this heal can easily exceed 23K. The VMA staff doesn't change that fact.

4.) This IS a self heal if you don't target anyone, and one without a cost at that.

Actually i tried it and the selfheal is less than rapid regen by calculation of the dmg taken + healing taken. (no cp into healing)

Edit:Battle Spirit doesn't reduce the dmg taken from this skill ,wich makes the skill worse than rapid regen when you're trying to heal yourself in pvp.

exeeter702

Heresyall wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

Heresyall wrote: »

Hello ,

I'll talk mostly here about the new agony (Malevolent Offerings).
Actually the idea was good but it has alot of weaknesses that will make it totally useless in pvp :

1) Magblade is already one of the squishiest class in cyrodiil right now ,making it sacrifying hp to heal another one is kinda meh.

2)You have to target someone to heal : ????? it's actually impossible in cyrodiil even with the help of the ui , every ally that will be nearer than the target you want to heal will take it instead of him and you'll basicaly lost hp for nothing by healing a random guy.

3)Rapid regen is way better this patch because of the vma resto staff up : don't need to target , heal yourself , gives magicka back and for mutagen ,can purge .Magblade in pvp basically don't have slots for random skill even if it's totally free.

4)Make the minor mending morph a selfhealing one if not targetting anyone : -> put the cost at like 2 k magicka and if you don't target an ally make it heal the caster for 50% of the base healing , it might be worth it to slot if like that ( should give around the same hots as rapid regen or even a bit more) / 1 target maximum possible.

Did you test the change?

1.) Magnb when properly built is definitely not one of the squishiest classes, not saying it doesn't have flaws but it's definitely not one of the squishiest.

2.) It's very easy to target allies with this heal, you aren't lining up headshots here.

3.) Rapid regen is far inferior to this heal, the tooltip on this heal can easily exceed 23K. The VMA staff doesn't change that fact.

4.) This IS a self heal if you don't target anyone, and one without a cost at that.

Actually i tried it and the selfheal is less than rapid regen by calculation of the dmg taken + healing taken. (no cp into healing)

Edit:Battle Spirit doesn't reduce the dmg taken from this skill ,wich makes the skill worse than rapid regen when you're trying to heal yourself in pvp.

Well its a good thing the skill is designed for nb healers first and foremost and not band aid self heal.

The skill deals damage based on how much it heals, so if the heal is cut in half, which it is, so then is the damage.

MisterBigglesworth

I don't agree with this change to Agony, but if you're going to go ahead with this health sacrifice functionality, then here's my suggestion:

Make the heal a large instant heal with a cast time (not a heal over time). Make it the strongest non-Ultimate heal in the game. Give it a cast time so it can be interrupted in PvP to balance out the fact it's such a powerful heal.

The other benefit of combining an instant heal with the health sacrifice component being a DOT, is that you could cast it twice in quick succession and only incur 1-2 additional seconds of the self-DOT.