Am I alone in disliking Naryu?

HatchetHaro

Sometimes I fantasize about being a Morag Tong target just so she can kill me. I bet it would be a euphoric death.

Then I respawn and let her kill me again.

... yeah I need sleep.

F7sus4

No. You're not alone. I genuinely hate her "I'm sooo awesome" style with that strong 'Murica feel at the top.

Iluvrien

Artis wrote: »

She is NOT fitting a stereotype of a dunmeri woman, though, and that's the thing. She's the only dunmeri woman like that. Just talk to any other NPC and see for yourself. Moreover, she wasn't like that before Morrowind.

I addressed her more extreme behaviours in my earlier post suggesting that this is part of a character arc. That said, these are character traits that I, and others in this thread, have recognised. Did you play the original Morrowind? (honest question)

Artis wrote: »

Also, there are no stereotypes for nord, dunmeri or other women. Where do you even get it from? There are no books about women of different races or anything of a sort in the game.

I suggest:

The Pocket Guide to the Empire 1st Edition which outlines the traits that the author ascribes to the Dunmer of Morrowind. There is no differentiation by gender, suggesting that they are common to both. Adjectives in use include: savage, proud, extremely haughty, (considering themselves) superior, xenophobic, despises outsiders.

To this I add the various tomes of The Real Barenziah, in which the primary protagonist is a Dunmeri woman (who eventually became Queen of Mournhold)

Given these, and our experiences with Dunmeri NPCs on the mainland of Morrowind (as opposed to Vvardenfell itself) I would suggest that the Dunmeri NPCs in this game that we have seen up to this point aren't acting like Vvardenfell Dunmer. Whereas, although it has been taken to extrenes, Naryu Virian may be doing so.

dodgehopper_ESO

Speaking of Dunmer traits it does make me a little sad they don't have that husky growly voice they had from the original Morrowind.

Iluvrien

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

Speaking of Dunmer traits it does make me a little sad they don't have that husky growly voice they had from the original Morrowind.

Me too, but someone (in another thread) pointed out that this was probably due to the ash storms, something that hasn't happened yet. It was a good point and I had to accept it even if I didn't like it much.

SantieClaws

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

Speaking of Dunmer traits it does make me a little sad they don't have that husky growly voice they had from the original Morrowind.

Khajiit speculates that might have been caused by breathing in all the ash from Red Mountain which, in the times we live, is much calmer than it will be in future days.

Either that or some enterprising Khajiit gets the people of Vvardenfell interested in cheap booze and tobacco products yes.

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

Koensol

Morrowind overall is very cringe worthy in the aspect of characters. And not only in characters but also in story. The story with Sun-in-Shadows and that 'poor' and seemingly helpless *** named Eoki... For *** sake that questline was bad. All you ever do is fetch and kill stuff for that lizard, and somehow the devs want me to feel sorry for Eoki? Poor Eoki this, poor Eoki that... It is all so over dramatized and the questline isn't developed in a way that would create a lot of sympathy for the whole situation. Very, very bad and annoying questline.

I know ZOS can do it though, they proved it with Wrothgar. That was hands down the best zone I have ever played through in an MMO. The music, characters, questline, plot. Everything was good.

Rahotu

She's overcompensating for loving you,deal with it

Titansteele

10/10 would smash

Rahotu

Enslaved wrote: »

EvilCroc wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

EvilCroc wrote: »

She is a filthy Morag Tong. She should be send to Sithis one time...

BTW, Morag Tong >>> DB.

In wet Dunmer dreams only.

Its lore, bro.

this from a pvper should make you recoil in horror

GuarBoy

Naryu is my waifu

Khenarthi

I can see why she would flirt with my Khajiit - they are gorgeous and powerful, after all. It does not surprise me that she'd seek to solidify their alliance. Or maybe she's just the flirty type. My characters (both male and female) simply shrug it off, and some may even play along.

What I do miss is Darien's cheerful flirtyness... or even Jakarn's. Here's hoping that in a DLC not too far into the future we get to venture to an Oblivion pocket realm to rescue Darien.

Linaleah

ok, here's the thing. not every female character needs to be a "strong woman" - its how we end up with boring characters in a first place (and btb, part of what makes Lyris interesting is not her litteral strength, but rather her softness, her doubts and guilt, her awkwardness), not every good character needs to be a good person. Naryu to me is interesting. she is NOT perfect, far from it, but its part of what makes her interesting.

Rahotu

Linaleah wrote: »

ok, here's the thing. not every female character needs to be a "strong woman" - its how we end up with boring characters in a first place (and btb, part of what makes Lyris interesting is not her litteral strength, but rather her softness, her doubts and guilt, her awkwardness), not every good character needs to be a good person. Naryu to me is interesting. she is NOT perfect, far from it, but its part of what makes her interesting.

for some strange reason that sounded in my head like a Boston accent,are you Ben Affleck?

Feanor

If a virtual pixelated something that just exists in your brain connects with your emotion and produces strong reactions then story writing did an excellent job. I always thought that the story writing was the strong part of ESO. It's really very well done. Whether you like Naryu or not is inconsequential to that matter.

Rickter

My gender neutral mind cant handle this

vyndral13preub18_ESO

Feanor wrote: »

If a virtual pixelated something that just exists in your brain connects with your emotion and produces strong reactions then story writing did an excellent job. I always thought that the story writing was the strong part of ESO. It's really very well done. Whether you like Naryu or not is inconsequential to that matter.

Unless the feeling it induces are this story sucks, or these people would never act like this. I mean I get what you are driving at. But just because the story makes you feel something, doesn't make it a good story.

crashen17b14_ESO

Pretty much every time a quest ends with her, she talks about getting hammered. When things go south with her apprentice, she comments about needing a drink. If you have her kill her apprentice, you find her getting completely trashed in the safe house, and later at the docks of Vivec she seems barely hanging on.

It doesnt matter to her if you aren't attracted to her, she is a ranking member of a cult devoted to a daedric god of sex and murder. Sex is a part of HER. Its a tool, its a weapon, and its a shield.

It is fine if you dont like her because she offends your values. She is supposed to. She isnt Lyris-the-Good. She is Naryu-the-Okay. But that doesnt make her a bad character. Not everyone should be a squeaky clean sai sahan or lyris. Some have to be Abnur Tharn.

Ghanima_Atreides

crashen17b14_ESO wrote: »

It doesnt matter to her if you aren't attracted to her, she is a ranking member of a cult devoted to a daedric god of sex and murder. Sex is a part of HER. Its a tool, its a weapon, and its a shield.

It is fine if you dont like her because she offends your values. She is supposed to. She isnt Lyris-the-Good. She is Naryu-the-Okay. But that doesnt make her a bad character. Not everyone should be a squeaky clean sai sahan or lyris. Some have to be Abnur Tharn.

I think several people have been missing the point of our complaints about the incessant flirting, at least as far as I'm concerned.

It has nothing to do with my values, I am not offended. She is welcome to have all the sex she wants and with whomever she wants. I just want my characters to have a choice in the way they respond to her constant innuendos and not be left feeling that there HAS to be some enforced sexual tension there because the writers want it to be.

I also don't want her to be Lyris-the-Good. Abnur Tharn is my favourite member of the Five Companions, actually. Being "good" or "bad" has nothing to do with any of this, the issue is how a character is written and some of us find the way she is written highly annoying.

Anti_Virus

She's a Morag Tong agent they follow mephala of course she will be sexually promiscuous.

adriant1978

In fact you're out of luck even if you want to RP that your character is into her, since there's no dialogue options which even get you to first base that I remember. You're doomed to be treated like you're her not very bright sidekick with a crush.

crashen17b14_ESO

If you feel like there is sexual tension between her and your character, thats on you. My dead-eyed vampire blood mage feels nothing towards her flirting and just ignores it. If you wanted to crawl inside his head, he would speculate that it is a product of an all-too-mortal being so close to the crushing emptiness of death, that she is desperately trying to cling to the concept of life. As a mephalan cultist, it especially manifests as sex.

He thinks her flirting and innuendo is as meaningless and ineffectual as throwing a bucket of water on a cliff face.

Artis

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

Artis wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

So, Lyris mostly fitting into the stereotype for a "Nord woman" is acceptable, but Naryu mostly fitting into the stereotype for a "Dunmeri woman" isn't.

Interesting.

That said, I would prefer it if Naryu was available as a companion for some of the quests that she sends you on. I can understand the mental processes behind not doing it, but it would give a chance for more interesting storytelling.

She is NOT fitting a stereotype of a dunmeri woman, though, and that's the thing. She's the only dunmeri woman like that. Just talk to any other NPC and see for yourself. Moreover, she wasn't like that before Morrowind.

Also, there are no stereotypes for nord, dunmeri or other women. Where do you even get it from? There are no books about women of different races or anything of a sort in the game.

Btw, no one said a word about stereotypes or nord women. He just said - and correctly - that she is a much better portrayal of a strong woman. It's not even the only example.There are tons of other women in game that portray strong woman much much better AND much more realistically than Naryu: captrains Lerissa and Kayleen from stros mkai, Queen Ayrenn, Any female Telvanni Magister or Mouth that we meet, all females of Thieves Guild, Sees-all-colors and even Aelif, and many many more including some HIRELINGS who we don't even see.

Naryu became terrible. Won't be surprised if in the next DLC she will have blue wild locks and complain that female characters are under-represented in trial groups.

In terms of feminine strength of the like I have to say I'm not particularly impressed when masculine power is overplayed as well. Darien pushed the line for certain, but they toned him down thankfully. The problem with naryu is that they play her up a little bit. Again though it fits Morag Tong.

For sure, I agree. Male or female - that's just not cool. I disagree about Darien, he came across more like a funny guy, than a guy bragging about his power.

But a good example is Naryu's friend from Morag Tong - Ashur was his name? Let's assume that So yeah, that Ashur guy is basically a male version of Naryu and was talking the talk just as much. Their lines literally were interchangeable.

Can you explain what you mean it fits morag tong? I don't see how it does, I actually think it doesn't. I don't think the ones that are boasting live too long.

Iluvrien wrote: »

I addressed her more extreme behaviours in my earlier post suggesting that this is part of a character arc. That said, these are character traits that I, and others in this thread, have recognised. Did you play the original Morrowind? (honest question)

Yes I did. I also played ESO since release, and Naryu wasn't such an annoying caricature before. She was cool. She didn't try to threaten me every other dialogue line. Is she insecure? Is she trying to prove to herself that she's not that much weaker than me (which she is)? Nah, these are not her original traits.

Iluvrien wrote: »

I suggest:

The Pocket Guide to the Empire 1st Edition which outlines the traits that the author ascribes to the Dunmer of Morrowind. There is no differentiation by gender, suggesting that they are common to both. Adjectives in use include: savage, proud, extremely haughty, (considering themselves) superior, xenophobic, despises outsiders.

To this I add the various tomes of The Real Barenziah, in which the primary protagonist is a Dunmeri woman (who eventually became Queen of Mournhold)

Given these, and our experiences with Dunmeri NPCs on the mainland of Morrowind (as opposed to Vvardenfell itself) I would suggest that the Dunmeri NPCs in this game that we have seen up to this point aren't acting like Vvardenfell Dunmer. Whereas, although it has been taken to extrenes, Naryu Virian may be doing so.

Yes, I know those lorebooks. And she's not any more stereotypical than before. Every dunmeri NPC in morrowind is supposedly described by those words. But it's only her and Ashur who are being annoying so much. A great example of every adjective you described are Telvanni magisters. But not her.

Yes, all Vvardenfell Dunmer make sense, but not Naryu. Naryu is just disgusting - she's an exaggerated caricature of herself from the original game.

Maximo3rdb14_ESO

ShadowHvo wrote: »

If anything, the Vestige is a far bigger Mary Sue than Naryu ever will be. Sometimes, I really do sincerely hope that the player character could not only be offered more options, but at large options to fail through consequences of previous actions.

The Vestige isn't perfect, so I don't really think that's necessarily the case, and there are some quests where you don't get the outcome you may have otherwise thought you would get (like during the EP quests, if you help the woman whose family used to own slaves, where you only find out after the quest her actual intentions, or during the DC quests, if you hand over the cursed crown).

I much prefer the choices we get that aren't black and white, but ask you to make a choice that you think fits that particular protagonist. The kind of choices that Morrowind seemed to lack, from my own experience so far.

ShadowHvo wrote: »

While I still like Naryu, she also was the largest disappointment for me in Morrowind. Her presence was nice, and her story was good, but the fact that she completely ignores the fact that -she- knows the player character is a Silencer from the Dark Brotherhood itself, the very nemesis' of her organization, and yet despite this.. she proceeds to show and keep us around the Morag Tong without any issue, statement or otherwise consequences.

I do agree that the lack of acknowledgement in being a member of the Dark Brotherhood in Morag Tong territory is disappointing, although I also feel that way when you play as a Dunmer and the Morrowind expansion almost entirely ignores that you're Dunmer and that you're not canonically from outside of Morrowind like the Nerevarine was - I have characters who treat me like an outsider and who act like my Dunmer protagonist - a Hero of the Ebonheart Pact - has never even met a Dunmer before. It got really annoying really fast.

Pegalot

I don't like Naryu. I hate being forced to flirt with her. It feels molesty. I also cringe when my cool vamp name "Ivonna Suckalot" is forced to be renamed when there's so much more sex stuff in the game itself. Like really, don't vampires suck? Like who took offense to that? Yet I have to put up with sexual innuendos from Naryu.

Silver_Strider

My poor Argonian cannot stop his spines from erecting around Naryu. It's quite embarrassing but she's my type of woman.

Not everyone is into the borderline narcissistic, powerful woman archetype but it fits my bill just fine.

Sigtric

Silver_Strider wrote: »

My poor Argonian cannot stop his spines from erecting around Naryu. It's quite embarrassing but she's my type of woman.

Not everyone is into the borderline narcissistic, powerful woman archetype but it fits my bill just fine.

I lol'd.

Resfeber

I don't mind the personality type. However I agree with one of the earlier comments that she was a better character in the main storyline. I remember finding her cute before whereas in Morrowind she's really overacted. Can't say I like her now.

Jhalin

She's the best NPC in the entire game though Raz is a very close second. She's competent, straightforward, and a complete badass. And she's charming as all get out. Anyone who thinks of "Mary Sue" just cause she's a flirt really has no clue what a Mary Sue is.

Sigtric

Resfeber wrote: »

I don't mind the personality type. However I agree with one of the earlier comments that she was a better character in the main storyline. I remember finding her cute before whereas in Morrowind she's really overacted. Can't say I like her now.

I think we're just seeing different sides of Naryu.

Yes, she is a bit different in Vvardenfell than Deshaan, but I see reason for it.
In Vvardenfell she is home. Her organization is now doing well. She has a promising apprentice. Reasons to be proud. It causes her to boast. Boasting is a character flaw. Character flaws make for interesting characters.

She seems to be multidimensional and not one sided.

I think Naryu is an even more amazing character now than I did before.