Sorc dominating BGs
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Akinos✭✭✭✭✭
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I think this guy is going to cry IRL....
Show me on the doll where the naughty sorc touched you?
What class do you play that's getting packed so badly by sorcerers? I don't mind giving some advice if you really need it.
I'm a magplar and a I haven't lost to a mag sorc in quite some time. That doesn't mean that sorcs still aren't stupid strong. But that's because I've mastered my class, putting thousands of hours into it. Sorcs on the other hand, you could have 30 hours of pvp on a sorc and still be able to beat 70% of the people in cyrodil with little to no effort. I know people who are first time sorcs or barely play their sorcs that always talk about how easy it is compared to their other classes.
MagSorcs just have too much dps, survivalbility and mobility, in and out of BG. Why should one class have it all?Edited by Akinos on June 14, 2017 6:22PMPC NA | @AkinosPvP 1vX/Small Scaler, Raid Leader, Youtuber and Twitch.tv Streamer.MAGICKA MELEE IS LIFE!Magplar, MagDK, Magden, Magblade, Magsorc & Magcro PvP/Build videos & moretwitch.tv/akinospvp4 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
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@Minalan why don't you grab a mDK and come do a BG with me? We'll be on the same team and you can tell me first hand how it compares to Sorc.
The only classes I play are sorc and stam NB. The latter has VERY little trouble with Sorcs. But that's probably the proc sets talking, it's not hard to viper/veli through an 8K shield and so little health.
If the Sorcs are making you this mad, suit up in shieldbreaker, knight slayer, and put oblivion enchants on a lightning staff. It's hilarious.0 -
Akinos✭✭✭✭✭
✭my forums are broke apparently.
Edited by Akinos on June 14, 2017 6:21PMPC NA | @AkinosPvP 1vX/Small Scaler, Raid Leader, Youtuber and Twitch.tv Streamer.MAGICKA MELEE IS LIFE!Magplar, MagDK, Magden, Magblade, Magsorc & Magcro PvP/Build videos & moretwitch.tv/akinospvp0 -
Kilandros✭✭✭✭✭
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The only classes I play are sorc and stam NB. The latter has VERY little trouble with Sorcs. But that's probably the proc sets talking, it's not hard to viper/veli through an 8K shield and so little health.
If the Sorcs are making you this mad, suit up in shieldbreaker, knight slayer, and put oblivion enchants on a lightning staff. It's hilarious.
So you don't play DK or Templar, yet you presume to say stuff like "Show me on the doll where the naughty sorc touched you?" Please explain to me how you think you are able to speak intelligently on the issue of balance when you do not play 3 of the 5 classes currently in game?
Also, I'm not mad. I'm having a lot of fun on my Sorc. But I like to get an understanding of the people who come here and post stuff like "L2P against Sorc, scrub." That invitation to join me in BGs stands btw. I would like to see you try mDK. You can bring whatever cheese/shieldbreaker build you want.Edited by Kilandros on June 14, 2017 6:30PMInvictus
Kilandros - Dragonknight / Grand Overlord
Deimos - Templar / Grand Warlord
Sias - Sorcerer / PrefectZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
DK IS NOT JUST A TANK CLASS. #PLAYTHEWAYYOUWANT2 -
Akinos✭✭✭✭✭
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The only classes I play are sorc and stam NB. The latter has VERY little trouble with Sorcs. But that's probably the proc sets talking, it's not hard to viper/veli through an 8K shield and so little health.
If the Sorcs are making you this mad, suit up in shieldbreaker, knight slayer, and put oblivion enchants on a lightning staff. It's hilarious.
Lmao. You're hilarious. You play the two best classes with the two best build types for those classes, which are generally regarded as OP in PvP. Yet you have the audacity to tell others that they should "L2P".
PC NA | @AkinosPvP 1vX/Small Scaler, Raid Leader, Youtuber and Twitch.tv Streamer.MAGICKA MELEE IS LIFE!Magplar, MagDK, Magden, Magblade, Magsorc & Magcro PvP/Build videos & moretwitch.tv/akinospvp4 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
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To be fair, it's exaggerations like "DKs just reflect most of my damage!" that I find particularly annoying given that 1) it's only 1 skill that is actually reflectable; and 2) most mDKs have dropped reflect entirely due to the repeated nerfs to the skill, high skill cost, and continued revisions by ZOS making formerly reflectable abilities unreflectable.
I find its mostly the sword and shield ulti doing the reflects now. DK's just often build for more uptime of it.Minalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.0 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
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Lmao. You're hilarious. You play the two best classes with the two best build types for those classes, which are generally regarded as OP in PvP. Yet you have the audacity to tell others that they should "L2P".
Oh come on, my sorc has ONE 8-9K shield and can't afford to stack three of them. I can streak maybe three or four times, and any stam build an catch me. That's not overpowered, unless you count the kill stealing I can do spamming one cheap execute over and over.
My nightblade can gank, and has no real utility outside of being able to kill someone fast who's completely unaware. If I try to hit someone in a group? I'm rolling away, running, and I'm probably going to die quickly. If I try to hit someone with shields or block up? Again, it's a failed gank, back to hiding again for god knows how long...
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Irylia✭✭✭✭✭
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I'm a magplar and a I haven't lost to a mag sorc in quite some time. That doesn't mean that sorcs still aren't stupid strong. But that's because I've mastered my class, putting thousands of hours into it. Sorcs on the other hand, you could have 30 hours of pvp on a sorc and still be able to beat 70% of the people in cyrodil with little to no effort. I know people who are first time sorcs or barely play their sorcs that always talk about how easy it is compared to their other classes.
MagSorcs just have too much dps, survivalbility and mobility, in and out of BG. Why should one class have it all?
Are you rage killin
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murdomac101✭✭✭FearlessOne_2014 wrote: »
This is me doing nearly everything wrong on my first outing.
https://youtu.be/wtwSDDzKnHY
That was a pretty successful outing. Which was completely disheartening to me. Basically confirmed my worst nightmare. ProcBlade takes no skill what so ever. Just farm the gear, put it on, and let it kill for you. GGWP
what addons are you using? i quite like your interface.0 -
Hutch679✭✭✭✭✭
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I'm just curious, but what did this DK reflect?
1: Crushing Shock? Not reflectable.
2: Endless Fury? Not reflectable.
3: Haunting Curse? Not reflectable.
4: Crystal Frag? Reflectable.
So, just to be clear, when you say this DK tank "just reflected most of it" you are, in fact, referring only to Crystal Fragments?
Light attacks reflect.0 -
Strider_Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
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Why does every sorc try to defend their broken OP class by saying something like this?
If more people wanted to be a no skill fuccboi that thinks they're amazing at pvp because of their massive sorc e-peen, I'm sure there would be more streaking around.
One doesn't need to play a sorc to know how blatant and ridiculously overpowered they are, most of us have been fighting them and putting up with the BS since day 1.
There are some people that aren't with responding to Akinos, and grim tactics is one of them. There are people that I disagree with such as minalan or Derra, but I'll still read their responses because I respect their opinion.
With that said I do have a magicka and stamina version of every class with the exception of the Warden.
And out of all the classes in the game I found the magsorc to be the most powerful by far, and with a destro 1vXing is cake.
Playing as a magsorc is the most entertaining magicka class to play as too since I can be aggressive with streak. But I still favor the stamblade due to how aggressive it is, and how unforgiving they are to make mistakes on. If it weren't for being a stamblade I would have switched back to Bloodborne or DS3 a long time ago.1 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Strider_Roshin wrote: »
There are some people that aren't with responding to Akinos, and grim tactics is one of them. There are people that I disagree with such as minalan or Derra, but I'll still read their responses because I respect their opinion.
With that said I do have a magicka and stamina version of every class with the exception of the Warden.
And out of all the classes in the game I found the magsorc to be the most powerful by far, and with a destro 1vXing is cake.
Playing as a magsorc is the most entertaining magicka class to play as too since I can be aggressive with streak. But I still favor the stamblade due to how aggressive it is, and how unforgiving they are to make mistakes on. If it weren't for being a stamblade I would have switched back to Bloodborne or DS3 a long time ago.
I have seen impressive 1vX with Stam builds.
I have never seen Fengrush ever use a magicka anything0 -
Kilandros✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »
I have seen impressive 1vX with Stam builds.
I have never seen Fengrush ever use a magicka anything
Not sure what relevance Fengrush has here since he has always played stamsorc. If your point is that because Fengrush doesn't 1vX on MagSorc no one does, then you should check out some of Leifyeric's magsorc videos, for example.Invictus
Kilandros - Dragonknight / Grand Overlord
Deimos - Templar / Grand Warlord
Sias - Sorcerer / PrefectZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
DK IS NOT JUST A TANK CLASS. #PLAYTHEWAYYOUWANT1 -
OdinForge✭✭✭✭✭
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Not sure what relevance Fengrush has here since he has always played stamsorc. If your point is that because Fengrush doesn't 1vX on MagSorc no one does, then you should check out some of Leifyeric's magsorc videos, for example.
Pretty sure Fengrush played a pretty good orc magsorc before the 1.6 patch, back then there were only like 5 stamina players.
The Age of Wrobel.0 -
Strider_Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »
I have seen impressive 1vX with Stam builds.
I have never seen Fengrush ever use a magicka anything
Oh I've 1vX'd several times with my stamblade. I've 1vX'd with all of my characters. That's more dependant on player skill than anything. I'm just saying in the context of being a magsorc with a destro ult; I've yet to find an easier opportunity to do so.0 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Shields are very strong and annoying 1v1, apart from that they get melted.
Fury is annoying in deathmatch only. Otherwise its the worst execute in the game.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...1 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭There is a lot of people needing to learn how to play this game.
About "op" sorc :
Burst damage ? Let's take a curse + Frag + Execute.
It's telegraphed as hell, and everyone know how to counter it, by shield, dodge or block.
With proc sets, every stam player can have similar/better burst than sorc : take selene, it's similar damage/up time than curse in BG. A gap closer or dizzing swing + selene with cut anim execute is easy to do, unpredictable and similar to the sorc burst.
Templar can have a good burt with power of the light in the magicka and stamina modes (stamina burst one is very strong).
Magblade have a pretty good burst too, difficult to time and do it, but very strong, with assassins will + stun.
Mag dk is more about consistant pressure, but can have a decent burst with skoria + leap + wiph.
Tanking ? Let's speak about shield staking.
Hardened ward (or Dampen similar shield value) alone with healing ward is not OP (no one ever complain about nb shieldstacking).
What's OP ?
Harness magicka : against magicka player, you are gaining magicka (spaming harness vs magicka damage mean you can regen all your magicka pool very fast).
Then, there is the annulment and hardened ward shield stacking : it's too much shield, and with harness problem, it's often cheap.
Mobility ? Let's look about streak.
Streak is not OP at all, sorc can't spam it, it's just a repositioning tool.
Every stamina build have good mobility, because of gap closer, sprint, shuffle, and major expedition.
Magblade have shadow image and cloak
Magdk and magplar have mistform.
Everyone except 100% tank build have a good mobility.0 -
Brutusmax1mus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Waffennacht wrote: »Wrath. It steals all kills. A lot of players are learning that sorc is one of the best in BGs because of streak and wrath. Proc MBs are also top dogs, but can't steal kills.
I was desperately trying mTemp, the moment I went to mSorc I actually had fun
Say it ain't so!!!0 -
Satiar✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Magsorc is very strong but easily outstripped by a good stam build atm.Vehemence -- Commander and Raid Lead -- Tri-faction PvP
Knights Paravant -- Co-GM and Raid Lead -- AD Greyhost2 -
Texas✭✭✭This thread has definitely delivered the LoL's. Thank you everyone for brightening my evening!Vehemence Mindless Zergling
All Classes and All Factions1 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
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No they are not lol !!!! they are completely out of balance
No they aren't, they are strong 1v1 other than that they get melted if 2 decent players is on them.
Fury is only stupid in deathmatch other than that it doesn't matter.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...0 -
DemonDruaga✭✭✭✭
To be fair, it's exaggerations like "DKs just reflect most of my damage!" that I find particularly annoying given that 1) it's only 1 skill that is actually reflectable; and 2) most mDKs have dropped reflect entirely due to the repeated nerfs to the skill, high skill cost, and continued revisions by ZOS making formerly reflectable abilities unreflectable.
I want to meteor ping pong again, was the most funny and bad ass thing between two dk's. Both using meteor at the same time.
R.i.p scales
Ardor // Dunkelsicht // Pakt0 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Strider_Roshin wrote: »
There are some people that aren't with responding to Akinos, and grim tactics is one of them. There are people that I disagree with such as minalan or Derra, but I'll still read their responses because I respect their opinion.
With that said I do have a magicka and stamina version of every class with the exception of the Warden.
And out of all the classes in the game I found the magsorc to be the most powerful by far, and with a destro 1vXing is cake.
Playing as a magsorc is the most entertaining magicka class to play as too since I can be aggressive with streak. But I still favor the stamblade due to how aggressive it is, and how unforgiving they are to make mistakes on. If it weren't for being a stamblade I would have switched back to Bloodborne or DS3 a long time ago.
What is there to say that hasn't been said? And it's not like sorc haters are somehow going to change their perception.
Akinos is a very good player but he's not quite right when he says when been putting up with their BS since Day 1. On release sorcs were busted because Streak didn't scale and it had 4 ultimate bats, but by the time these were nerfed/fixed, say by 1.4, sorc was the worst class and it wasn't close; the "instant" cast for frags was not instant, soft caps made stacking magicka a non-starter, almost all attacks it used was reflected by a DK. It was a negate monkey and that's it. And it was terrible in PvE.
It was not until the 1.6 removal of soft caps did we start putting up with sorc BS.
I do think shield stacking is a dumb mechanic and their on demand burst is miles better than other mag specs, but that does not mean the sorcerer does not have weaknesses. Defensive Posture screws them over hard because all of them want to use frags as part of their burst. Provided they survive the first frag that's reflected back at them, circumvent defensive posture is not going to be easy; they could use an immovable pot - which very few even bother equipping - most light attack and stun themselves just to get a frag off (which interrupts their burst). Good sorcs can adapt, but there are not that many and the defensive posture user still should not die as long as they are also experienced.
And as many have correctly said, shields are not strong when being attacked by multiple players.
But most players don't want to slot sword and board for reflect because that means sacrificing their damage and not getting off as many Viper and Red Mountain procs. 90% of the people in Cyrodiil are DPS specs. Many of these players' idea of balance is that they should spec for max damage with barely enough sustain and when this tactic fails to get them kills, ask the devs to nerf the defensive mechanic that foils them.
I do think the sorcerer is the "easiest" class, but that does not mean it's the most powerful nor does it mean a skilled player cannot take advantage of its weaknesses. And they are by no means "dominating" BGs.0 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »
What is there to say that hasn't been said? And it's not like sorc haters are somehow going to change their perception.
Akinos is a very good player but he's not quite right when he says when been putting up with their BS since Day 1. On release sorcs were busted because Streak didn't scale and it had 4 ultimate bats, but by the time these were nerfed/fixed, say by 1.4, sorc was the worst class and it wasn't close; the "instant" cast for frags was not instant, soft caps made stacking magicka a non-starter, almost all attacks it used was reflected by a DK. It was a negate monkey and that's it. And it was terrible in PvE.
It was not until the 1.6 removal of soft caps did we start putting up with sorc BS.
I do think shield stacking is a dumb mechanic and their on demand burst is miles better than other mag specs, but that does not mean the sorcerer does not have weaknesses. Defensive Posture screws them over hard because all of them want to use frags as part of their burst. Provided they survive the first frag that's reflected back at them, circumvent defensive posture is not going to be easy; they could use an immovable pot - which very few even bother equipping - most light attack and stun themselves just to get a frag off (which interrupts their burst). Good sorcs can adapt, but there are not that many and the defensive posture user still should not die as long as they are also experienced.
And as many have correctly said, shields are not strong when being attacked by multiple players.
But most players don't want to slot sword and board for reflect because that means sacrificing their damage and not getting off as many Viper and Red Mountain procs. 90% of the people in Cyrodiil are DPS specs. Many of these players' idea of balance is that they should spec for max damage with barely enough sustain and when this tactic fails to get them kills, ask the devs to nerf the defensive mechanic that foils them.
I do think the sorcerer is the "easiest" class, but that does not mean it's the most powerful nor does it mean a skilled player cannot take advantage of its weaknesses. And they are by no means "dominating" BGs.
This seems like a very balanced view. I thought you were firmly in the 'nerf sorcs' camp..?
Minalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.0 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
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This seems like a very balanced view. I thought you were firmly in the 'nerf sorcs' camp..?
In the thousands of posts I have made, I have never been in the nerf any class camp.
ESO's issues are almost always rooted more deeply and ZoS's nerfs are usually counterproductive and just annoying.0 -
NordJitsu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭And then you realized that the best thing to play is stamina procbuilds........
This.
My experience couldn't be more different from OP.
Stamina DKs and NBs are dominating BGs.
I will say I don't see many successful Templars, stamina or Magicka.
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NordJitsu✭✭✭✭✭
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Sorcs are easily the most nerfed class, when there's really no reason for it.
Dude... You don't have to defend your OP class on the forums, sorcs never get nerfs, you have nothing to worry about. OP4LifeEdited by NordJitsu on June 15, 2017 2:58PM0
