Vivec EU-PC

Blobsky

BohnT wrote: »

Blobsky wrote: »

Nermy wrote: »

We regularly see DC guilds like Blackswords, Daggerfall Authority/Army, Hungry Wolves etc. but DC do have some real mega zergs. We tend to go elsewhere when we see them, no point fighting the.

DA, last I heard, have lost most key leaders looking to make or involve in other guilds. Are either of those other 2 the white tabard mega zerg always bridge camping and pretending ti be small scale?

All these guilds are running with 20+. DC is the brother that tries to be an elitist by pretending to be filled with solo players but i can't remember when i saw the last DC walking around solo. Even the small-scaler group up with 6+ people turning almost any encounter into a Xv1 or Xv2 fight when you are actually small-scaling against them.

There is just a huge problem with Cyro atm and that is based on the low population cap which leads to 2-3 fights on the map where 90% of all players are which then again increases lag.

To be fair, you just said that to a guy who cant even remember the last time he ran in a group in cyro. Even duo is rare for me. And I am DC (Mostly on MagDK 'Awful' and MagNB 'Blobs')

BohnT

Blobsky wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Blobsky wrote: »

Nermy wrote: »

We regularly see DC guilds like Blackswords, Daggerfall Authority/Army, Hungry Wolves etc. but DC do have some real mega zergs. We tend to go elsewhere when we see them, no point fighting the.

DA, last I heard, have lost most key leaders looking to make or involve in other guilds. Are either of those other 2 the white tabard mega zerg always bridge camping and pretending ti be small scale?

All these guilds are running with 20+. DC is the brother that tries to be an elitist by pretending to be filled with solo players but i can't remember when i saw the last DC walking around solo. Even the small-scaler group up with 6+ people turning almost any encounter into a Xv1 or Xv2 fight when you are actually small-scaling against them.

There is just a huge problem with Cyro atm and that is based on the low population cap which leads to 2-3 fights on the map where 90% of all players are which then again increases lag.

To be fair, you just said that to a guy who cant even remember the last time he ran in a group in cyro. Even duo is rare for me. And I am DC (Mostly on MagDK 'Awful' and MagNB 'Blobs')

Yeah i know but it's rare that solo players from different factions ( i think i saw you on Saturday but i can bet it's been 5 months before that when i last saw you due to different spots where we fight) meet as EP gets the best fights between Roe and Nikel, DC has the bridge and AD goes to Chally/Bleakers as those are the spots with the most potential enemies meaning you habe a better Chance of fighting smaller groups

Jawasa

Tda, black swords and hungry wolves all play and often stack. Then you have exiles but i dont think They are on every day but are the best dc guild from My observation.

Ad have uf and lokis guard?

EP have zs, wabba, drachen guard and do from what i know.

Please help me fill out the list. I only play in vivec 2-3 days a week.

Edit to be fair We on EP also often end up at the same keep or with some pugs.

Biro123

BohnT wrote: »

Blobsky wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Blobsky wrote: »

Nermy wrote: »

We regularly see DC guilds like Blackswords, Daggerfall Authority/Army, Hungry Wolves etc. but DC do have some real mega zergs. We tend to go elsewhere when we see them, no point fighting the.

DA, last I heard, have lost most key leaders looking to make or involve in other guilds. Are either of those other 2 the white tabard mega zerg always bridge camping and pretending ti be small scale?

All these guilds are running with 20+. DC is the brother that tries to be an elitist by pretending to be filled with solo players but i can't remember when i saw the last DC walking around solo. Even the small-scaler group up with 6+ people turning almost any encounter into a Xv1 or Xv2 fight when you are actually small-scaling against them.

There is just a huge problem with Cyro atm and that is based on the low population cap which leads to 2-3 fights on the map where 90% of all players are which then again increases lag.

To be fair, you just said that to a guy who cant even remember the last time he ran in a group in cyro. Even duo is rare for me. And I am DC (Mostly on MagDK 'Awful' and MagNB 'Blobs')

Yeah i know but it's rare that solo players from different factions ( i think i saw you on Saturday but i can bet it's been 5 months before that when i last saw you due to different spots where we fight) meet as EP gets the best fights between Roe and Nikel, DC has the bridge and AD goes to Chally/Bleakers as those are the spots with the most potential enemies meaning you habe a better Chance of fighting smaller groups

Its small-scalers that destroy solo play. There is no solo action at resources any more, cos every resource fight now involves a skilled 'small-scale' group Xv1ing soloers while feeling all warm and fuzxy about their small-scale skills. Until they get overwhelmed when those soloers respawn, but more have turned up..

What's a soloer to do other than run with the zergs to take down these leet small-scalers? Or just continue to get farmed by them? Or go to some far out of the way place for the miniscule chance of bumping into another soloer or some unorganised pugs away from the main zergs?

Nermy

Jawasa wrote: »

Tda, black swords and hungry wolves all play and often stack. Then you have exiles but i dont think They are on every day but are the best dc guild from My observation.

Ad have uf and lokis guard?

EP have zs, wabba, drachen guard and do from what i know.

Please help me fill out the list. I only play in vivec 2-3 days a week.

Daedric Order are another EP guild we work with.

AbraXuSeXile

Jawasa wrote: »

Tda, black swords and hungry wolves all play and often stack. Then you have exiles but i dont think They are on every day but are the best dc guild from My observation.

Ad have uf and lokis guard?

EP have zs, wabba, drachen guard and do from what i know.

Please help me fill out the list. I only play in vivec 2-3 days a week.

Edit to be fair We on EP also often end up at the same keep or with some pugs.

We play 2 days max on a good week. Maybe we do more soon after new year if we grab a few more people.

Jawasa

Ok yeah that did match the feeling i had.

@Nermy i think i mentioned do. any more guilds on EP or other factions i missed?

Nermy

Jawasa wrote: »

Ok yeah that did match the feeling i had.

@Nermy i think i mentioned do. any more guilds on EP or other factions i missed?

Sorry @Jawasa, missed that.

Not sure, I know there are other EP guilds but how much of a presence they have in Cyrodiil, I'm not sure.

Fasold666

@BohnT @Blobsky

To be honest, I wouldn't expect any changes that make the 1vX playstyle more viable again. ZOS made so many changes that favor the people that prefer to outnumber their enemys and that make it more difficult for the outnumbered. They had several years to balance things so every playstyle has a place in cyrodiil but instead they decided to strengthen group play and zerging and weaken 1vX and smallscale. I mean, why should they change it now? The vast majority (maybe like 80%?) hasn't really improved their game play over the years and sticks to their zerg and enjoys outnumbering your opponents rather then trying to look for a fair fight. Like 9/10 times when you meet somebody of them in a 1v1 situation the first they do is trying to run, cloak, streak or ride away.

Besides that there is a huge ammount of self proclaimed but fake "smallscalers" and " 1vX players" also (for example: just being ungrouped and staying next to allies is NOT a 1vX or having a 5 man group or whatever and still zergsurfing with it or focus on chasing down and timing ults on solo players is NO smallscale)

After that you have the minority of "true" smallscalers / medium size groups / raids that prefer to fight outnumbered or atleast even. Then you have a couple people playing duo, trio (outnumbered or even).

And then there is the rare species of players that play most of the time on their own, preferably far away from own allies, often where the two enemy faction zergs fight against each other. And to be honest...these "true" 1vX players are probably like 0,5 - 1% or something of the actual PvP playerbase (atleast on Vivec PC EU).
But I can understand that there is not many players left that have the patience to choose 1vX as their main playstyle nowadays. For a successful 1vX you basically need to have years of experience, a lot of patience and the possibility to play during non prime time (because of the insane lags).

Now imagine: I guess in ESO we have way more PvE then PvP players. And now only like 1% of the PvP playerbase actually plays 1vX. They are very few people so that ZOS (who wants to reach the majority of the playerbase) can basically completely ignore them. Or even better: You don't want to frustrate the majority of the players (people playing in a zerg) that have trouble killing the few 1vX players (they are the "cheaters", "macro users" for them anyways) so you even weaken them even further.

The best group that reflects everything that went wrong with ESO PvP is the bigboss pug group nowadays. Playing solo you will experience the following:

• 15-20 people trying to zerg you down and chasing you for the next 15+ minutes
• all kind of poisions (higher ult cost, ressource poisions, root poisions, double damage poisions)
• mark
• major defile
• shieldbreaker
• befoul cp stacking
• chain spamming
• detect potions
• snare spam
• root spam

Don't get me wrong. Smallscale and even duo or trio still works fine without much frustration. True 1vX on the other side..that is dying out completely and only very few players are left that still prefer to play 1vX and even less that are actually succesful with it. And honestly, I think it is naive to think that this will ever change again.

Damn, I didn't want to write that much actually

visionality

Fasold666 wrote: »

True 1vX on the other side..that is dying out completely and only very few players are left that still prefer to play 1vX and even less that are actually succesful with it.

I know only one player who does real 1vsX in Cyro, which is Malcolm who is usually capping some ressource. Everybody else runs in teams or just tags ppl during a fight and then runs/streaks away to pull a small number of randoms to his cc-bot and spambusher.

Might miss a lonlely DC 1vsXer though since thats my own alliance.

WillhelmBlack

Good fights tonight boys and girls!

WillhelmBlack

Fasold666 wrote: »

@BohnT @Blobsky

To be honest, I wouldn't expect any changes that make the 1vX playstyle more viable again. ZOS made so many changes that favor the people that prefer to outnumber their enemys and that make it more difficult for the outnumbered. They had several years to balance things so every playstyle has a place in cyrodiil but instead they decided to strengthen group play and zerging and weaken 1vX and smallscale. I mean, why should they change it now? The vast majority (maybe like 80%?) hasn't really improved their game play over the years and sticks to their zerg and enjoys outnumbering your opponents rather then trying to look for a fair fight. Like 9/10 times when you meet somebody of them in a 1v1 situation the first they do is trying to run, cloak, streak or ride away.

Besides that there is a huge ammount of self proclaimed but fake "smallscalers" and " 1vX players" also (for example: just being ungrouped and staying next to allies is NOT a 1vX or having a 5 man group or whatever and still zergsurfing with it or focus on chasing down and timing ults on solo players is NO smallscale)

After that you have the minority of "true" smallscalers / medium size groups / raids that prefer to fight outnumbered or atleast even. Then you have a couple people playing duo, trio (outnumbered or even).

And then there is the rare species of players that play most of the time on their own, preferably far away from own allies, often where the two enemy faction zergs fight against each other. And to be honest...these "true" 1vX players are probably like 0,5 - 1% or something of the actual PvP playerbase (atleast on Vivec PC EU).
But I can understand that there is not many players left that have the patience to choose 1vX as their main playstyle nowadays. For a successful 1vX you basically need to have years of experience, a lot of patience and the possibility to play during non prime time (because of the insane lags).

Now imagine: I guess in ESO we have way more PvE then PvP players. And now only like 1% of the PvP playerbase actually plays 1vX. They are very few people so that ZOS (who wants to reach the majority of the playerbase) can basically completely ignore them. Or even better: You don't want to frustrate the majority of the players (people playing in a zerg) that have trouble killing the few 1vX players (they are the "cheaters", "macro users" for them anyways) so you even weaken them even further.

The best group that reflects everything that went wrong with ESO PvP is the bigboss pug group nowadays. Playing solo you will experience the following:

• 15-20 people trying to zerg you down and chasing you for the next 15+ minutes
• all kind of poisions (higher ult cost, ressource poisions, root poisions, double damage poisions)
• mark
• major defile
• shieldbreaker
• befoul cp stacking
• chain spamming
• detect potions
• snare spam
• root spam

Don't get me wrong. Smallscale and even duo or trio still works fine without much frustration. True 1vX on the other side..that is dying out completely and only very few players are left that still prefer to play 1vX and even less that are actually succesful with it. And honestly, I think it is naive to think that this will ever change again.

Damn, I didn't want to write that much actually

But you're awesome for laying it down like it is my man!

Jawasa

Great evening with loads of guild groups up! Prime time emp EP!

LarsS

Had a fun moment at Black Booth reds and yellow were fighting outside the yellow keep. Suddenly they stoped when they realized that the keep was blue

Nermy

LarsS wrote: »

Had a fun moment at Black Booth reds and yellow were fighting outside the yellow keep. Suddenly they stoped when they realized that the keep was blue

Sneaky...

Tillalarrien

Short assesment of current situation on Vivec primetime:

-AD (if UF is not online its a joke)
-EP (guild groups spreading out to different keeps. Pugs probably capturing stuff behind.
-DC (all guild group stacking up and pushing chalman :P )

Currently happy with amount of action at all times, tho it might be fun to sometimes find a DC guild alone for a keep battle and get bit more pressure from other AD guilds (Lokis, any other? )

Nermy

Tillalarrien wrote: »

Short assesment of current situation on Vivec primetime:

-AD (if UF is not online its a joke)
-EP (guild groups spreading out to different keeps. Pugs probably capturing stuff behind.
-DC (all guild group stacking up and pushing chalman :P )

Currently happy with amount of action at all times, tho it might be fun to sometimes find a DC guild alone for a keep battle and get bit more pressure from other AD guilds (Lokis, any other? )

We've been having some great battles with ExileCorps the past week or so. Had a great running battle around the bridge of points last night. Good fun.

LarsS

There is some sayings among DC; like all DC go to Chalman and EP are always going on DC, as a scientist by profession I decided to collect some data. I am on line at primetime 19-24 cet most days and and intermittently between 07-19 cet. I counted all enemy keeps (and outposts) DC and EP owend when I logged on and all captures while online. Data collection lasted from Monday until Sunday last week.

This is the result
DC captured 91 AD keeps and 46 EP keeps.
EP captured 47 AD keeps and 59 DC keeps.

Analysis
The DC Chalman hypotesis is disproved, DC mostly fights AD. Most DC Guild do infact go on AD, most of the time.
The hypotesis that EP preferably attacks DC is supported by the data.

Conclusion
EP thus tend to help AD to win the campaign.

Nermy

LarsS wrote: »

This is the result
DC captured 91 AD keeps and 46 EP keeps.
EP captured 47 AD keeps and 59 DC keeps.

Analysis
The DC Chalman hypotesis is disproved, DC mostly fights AD. Most DC Guild do infact go on AD, most of the time.
The hypotesis that EP preferably attacks DC is supported by the data.

Conclusion
EP thus tend to help AD to win the campaign.

I don't know, I'd have to contest that on the grounds that the range of keeps EP captured is very low (12) when compared to the range of keeps taken by DC (45). This would lead you to believe that EP attacks DC and AD much more evenly than it may seem at the outset.

Also the data is skewed to when you are online and does not factor in keeps taken during the day and until you have data for the amount of keeps AD takes, doesn't really stand up to scrutiny.

I would also contest your conclusion. Big Boss and the zerg win the campaign with their PvDoor antics, no-one else is that bothered anymore.

Azurya

EP is performing real good form time to time and they push AD
but then they turn around and started to push DC or get the weird idea to make some joke emperor(brings no points!)

But if you want to be better then 3rd every campaign, you must realize that your points are not in DC territory
AD has your points needed, this endless battling between chalman and ales makes no sense

nor does it make sense for EP to get an emperor and in 20 minutes afterwards you have only 3 keeps left,
that is a waste of effords and points!

BohnT

Azurya wrote: »

EP is performing real good form time to time and they push AD
but then they turn around and started to push DC or get the weird idea to make some joke emperor(brings no points!)

But if you want to be better then 3rd every campaign, you must realize that your points are not in DC territory
AD has your points needed, this endless battling between chalman and ales makes no sense

nor does it make sense for EP to get an emperor and in 20 minutes afterwards you have only 3 keeps left,
that is a waste of effords and points!

It doesn't matter nightcap wins campaigns not good Performance during primetime

LarsS

Nermy I agree with you that the morning capping is the biggest problem. I dont understand the numbers you use they are not in my data. Ofcourse I am not online att all times who is but to signifcantly change the numbers the statistics between 01-07 cet have to be very different from the rest of the time. I was online like once per hour during day time so the statisics is good. I dont see how AD data would in any way change the results for DC and EP. Fact is that DC mostly go on AD while EP tend to go on DC. There not point in distrusting the data just because you dont like them.

Nermy

Azurya wrote: »

EP is performing real good form time to time and they push AD
but then they turn around and started to push DC or get the weird idea to make some joke emperor(brings no points!)

But if you want to be better then 3rd every campaign, you must realize that your points are not in DC territory
AD has your points needed, this endless battling between chalman and ales makes no sense

nor does it make sense for EP to get an emperor and in 20 minutes afterwards you have only 3 keeps left,
that is a waste of effords and points!

EP would love to win a campaign but in the present environment, it ain't going to happen. Most EP probably are looking at coming 2nd, in which case DC does have the points we need.

Also, why not have Emp?

LarsS wrote: »

Nermy I agree with you that the morning capping is the biggest problem. I dont understand the numbers you use they are not in my data. Ofcourse I am not online att all times who is but to signifcantly change the numbers the statistics between 01-07 cet have to be very different from the rest of the time. I was online like once per hour during day time so the statisics is good. I dont see how AD data would in any way change the results for DC and EP. Fact is that DC mostly go on AD while EP tend to go on DC. There not point in distrusting the data just because you dont like them.

Lars, having AD results would just make the picture a bit clearer but you and I both know, no matter how much data you get the true picture is too weird for that.

For instance we spent last night fighting DC around Alessia bridge. We weren't pushing DC, we were pushing AD yet we have to fight our way through a DC raid to get at them!! lol!

LarsS

Nermy no need to fight at Alessa bridge, Chalman gate or Ash gate, there is more roads

Nermy

Azurya wrote: »

EP is performing real good form time to time and they push AD
but then they turn around and started to push DC or get the weird idea to make some joke emperor(brings no points!)

But if you want to be better then 3rd every campaign, you must realize that your points are not in DC territory
AD has your points needed, this endless battling between chalman and ales makes no sense

nor does it make sense for EP to get an emperor and in 20 minutes afterwards you have only 3 keeps left,
that is a waste of effords and points!

LarsS wrote: »

Nermy no need to fight at Alessa bridge, Chalman gate or Ash gate, there is more roads

Eh? That goes against your argument that EP doesn't fight AD enough. We rarely get round to Ash gate and if we stay at Chally mile gate, we are doing exactly what you say we shouldn't be doing! Damn! Get your arguments straight... lol!

LarsS

It was a general statment there is more gates than the gates at the emperor keeps. If we have to start from DC home keeps to go on AD we avoid the Ash gate if there is fighting there. You can do the same and take another bridge.

Nermy

LarsS wrote: »

It was a general statment there is more gates than the gates at the emperor keeps. If we have to start from DC home keeps to go on AD we avoid the Ash gate if there is fighting there. You can do the same and take another bridge.

True. my point it what are DC doing there in the first place?

LarsS

True, but I see EP at Ash gate and AD at Chal gate to.

BohnT

LarsS wrote: »

True, but I see EP at Ash gate and AD at Chal gate to.

The only players there are smallscalers and Uf or ZS when they farm plebs.

ToRelax

@LarsS if you really want to investigate DC's alleged obsession with Chalman, it would help actually having data on the number of times it was captured by different factions and time held by each.