Class Performance in Battlegrounds

Kilandros

Now that the NDA has been partially lifted, here's how I found the classes to perform in Battlegrounds. I played each class for several hours, both magicka and stamina variants. I'll be focusing on Magicka because that's what I prefer/am better at.

Sorcerer - Will be the dominant class for BGs. They were hardly touched by the sustain nerfs because Sorc (particularly Magicka Sorc) has tremendous burst even with a full sustain build. Furthermore, Shields seem to be even more important because blocking is far less reliable. Sorc will essentially have the best sustain, the best mobility, the best damage, and the best defense of the four base game classes. Negate remains a game-changing ultimate, particularly on capture points. I rarely ever died on my Mag Sorc in BGs and was a beast at securing objectives thanks to my mobility. For the record I was running Spinners/Lich/Engine Guardian.

TL;DR - Sorcerer is completely dominant.

Templar - Though the removal of Major Mending significantly hurt Magplar's tankiness, a well-built and well-played Magplar is still very hard to take down and can dish out considerable single target damage. I definitely found sustain to be a big limitation, but remember CP is disabled so it felt just like Magplar during no CP. That is to say, you run through resources quickly but it's manageable if you're smart and don't spam abilities. In terms of their performance in Battlegrounds I feel that Templar is largely unchanged from what you would experience in Azura's Star currently (minus the Major Mending nerf, obviously). The biggest hit to Templars was to their ability to support other players.

TL;DR - Templar feels more or less the same as it would in Azuras on Live. The biggest hit to the class was to their support abilities.

Dragonknight - I tried a variety of DK builds ranging from S/B + S/B to double Destro. Single target damage can be fierce against inexperienced PvPers, but the class still lacks effective DoTs/Burst to take down a seasoned Sorc. Templars continue to purge DK damage with impunity. Worse yet, sustain went from bad to worse and is simply atrocious on mDK now. I felt the nerf to Light Armor more on DK than on any other class. Simply maintaining my Major Sorcerery, Major Ward/Resolve buffs typically drained close to 50% of my Magicka pool. I would complain about the Major Mending nerf to Igneous Shield more, but honestly, the cost of mDK abilities are so high I more often than not could not afford casting Igneous Shield before casting Coagulating Blood anyway and had to go straight for casting the heal. Lastly, mobility is important in BGs and DK has none.

TL;DR - DK currently lacks the sustain and the damage to compete. Avoid.

Nightblade - NB sustain actually isn't that bad because there's no point building for a full Bomblade spec in BGs. Siphoning/Leeching are not worthwhile for the Magicka/Stam recovery but the increased healing was noticeable. NB's saving grace is that it still has access to the single most powerful CC in the game in Mass Hysteria. All that being said, the best way to describe NB performance is simply recognizing that it's just a weaker version of Sorc.

TL;DR - NB is just an inferior version of Sorc right now. It has a great CC but is just OK at everything else.

FlyLionel

I thought Fossalize was the strongest CC in the game single target?

Generally I agree with you, give Templars their damn major mending...they're Templars. NBs still bad. Once PTS is closed and patch notes are confirmed as final we can draw conclusions. I think DKs will still be good, just need to adjust. You don't need to be mobile to win in BGs I bet, they make up for it with being the tank class. Just wish the patch notes can be changed and finalized so we can figure it all out completely. Timeeee.

Kilandros

FlyLionel wrote: »

I thought Fossalize was the strongest CC in the game single target?

Generally I agree with you, give Templars their damn major mending...they're Templars. NBs still bad. Once PTS is closed and patch notes are confirmed as final we can draw conclusions. I think DKs will still be good, just need to adjust. You don't need to be mobile to win in BGs I bet, they make up for it with being the tank class. Just wish the patch notes can be changed and finalized so we can figure it all out completely. Timeeee.

DKs are not the tank class anymore. Fossilize is a strong single-target CC, but Fear is stronger and is an AoE.

Dracane

The Freedom of Opinions

Kilandros

Dracane wrote: »

The Freedom of Opinions

I tried to make that an as unbiased an assessment as possible. Full disclosure, I do have the most time invested on DK and Templar. Moving forward I will be maining Sorcerer, however.

UnKnowNKiLLeRR

I agree with you, but I will draw my conclusion after next pts patch on Monday. If ZOS changed DK passive back to normal then DK will be good in BG's. I was using black rose with lich did not see any sustain issues compared to live servers.

Paraflex

Appreciate the insight and your thoughts on the changes

NightbladeMechanics

Wardless, streakless, mineless sorc.

And all of my damage is blockable or dodgeable.

At least I don't have to worry about my class becoming fotm, I guess...

Kilandros

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Wardless, streakless, mineless sorc.

And all of my damage is blockable or dodgeable.

At least I don't have to worry about my class becoming fotm, I guess...

Pretty much. The one thing Magblade has going for it in open world PvP (bombing groups) just isn't really relevant in BGs. Good groups will focus down individual targets and not try to AoE smash everything.

NightbladeMechanics

Kilandros wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Wardless, streakless, mineless sorc.

And all of my damage is blockable or dodgeable.

At least I don't have to worry about my class becoming fotm, I guess...

Pretty much. The one thing Magblade has going for it in open world PvP (bombing groups) just isn't really relevant in BGs. Good groups will focus down individual targets and not try to AoE smash everything.

Hmmm mageblade might actually be stronger in BGs than you give it credit for in a couple of niche build styles. Overall, though, yea from what I've heard and seen on PTS, it does look to be outclassed.

Kilandros

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Kilandros wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Wardless, streakless, mineless sorc.

And all of my damage is blockable or dodgeable.

At least I don't have to worry about my class becoming fotm, I guess...

Pretty much. The one thing Magblade has going for it in open world PvP (bombing groups) just isn't really relevant in BGs. Good groups will focus down individual targets and not try to AoE smash everything.

Hmmm mageblade might actually be stronger in BGs than you give it credit for in a couple of niche build styles. Overall, though, yea from what I've heard and seen on PTS, it does look to be outclassed.

To be fair, guys like you and Vita will be absolutely dominant on NB regardless but I think that says more about you than it does the class lol. I'm not trying to say it's bad--it's just that MagSorc feels REAL good in BGs.

D0ntevenL1ft

Kilandros wrote: »

FlyLionel wrote: »

I thought Fossalize was the strongest CC in the game single target?

Generally I agree with you, give Templars their damn major mending...they're Templars. NBs still bad. Once PTS is closed and patch notes are confirmed as final we can draw conclusions. I think DKs will still be good, just need to adjust. You don't need to be mobile to win in BGs I bet, they make up for it with being the tank class. Just wish the patch notes can be changed and finalized so we can figure it all out completely. Timeeee.

DKs are not the tank class anymore. Fossilize is a strong single-target CC, but Fear is stronger and is an AoE.

Took the words right out of my mouth. DK's lost almost everything they had going for them.

wimhwimladimf

D0ntevenL1ft wrote: »

Kilandros wrote: »

FlyLionel wrote: »

I thought Fossalize was the strongest CC in the game single target?

Generally I agree with you, give Templars their damn major mending...they're Templars. NBs still bad. Once PTS is closed and patch notes are confirmed as final we can draw conclusions. I think DKs will still be good, just need to adjust. You don't need to be mobile to win in BGs I bet, they make up for it with being the tank class. Just wish the patch notes can be changed and finalized so we can figure it all out completely. Timeeee.

DKs are not the tank class anymore. Fossilize is a strong single-target CC, but Fear is stronger and is an AoE.

Took the words right out of my mouth. DK's lost almost everything they had going for them.

They can still nerf Reflective Scales :P

Tbh, i think NB's will get nerfed more, because many NB's players camp questing areas on Cyrodil and hunt undergeared newbes. Newbes get 1-2 shoted and they will think that NB is OP -> they will write the feedback through in game client and at some point ZOS will listen, it's just a matter of how much people will complain.

IxSTALKERxI

I had the same findings in battlegrounds. Mag sorc stands out as best performing, Templar did well despite the nerfs. Had a guildy on his Mag sorc and I was on my stamplar and the 2 of us together were getting good results.

I did get rekt a few times by stam cost poison + fear combo though, and a well known NB got me a few times with proc sets on his stam nb.

Still early days though.

D0ntevenL1ft

wimhwimladimf wrote: »

D0ntevenL1ft wrote: »

Kilandros wrote: »

FlyLionel wrote: »

I thought Fossalize was the strongest CC in the game single target?

Generally I agree with you, give Templars their damn major mending...they're Templars. NBs still bad. Once PTS is closed and patch notes are confirmed as final we can draw conclusions. I think DKs will still be good, just need to adjust. You don't need to be mobile to win in BGs I bet, they make up for it with being the tank class. Just wish the patch notes can be changed and finalized so we can figure it all out completely. Timeeee.

DKs are not the tank class anymore. Fossilize is a strong single-target CC, but Fear is stronger and is an AoE.

Took the words right out of my mouth. DK's lost almost everything they had going for them.

They can still nerf Reflective Scales :P

Tbh, i think NB's will get nerfed more, because many NB's players camp questing areas on Cyrodil and hunt undergeared newbes. Newbes get 1-2 shoted and they will think that NB is OP -> they will write the feedback through in game client and at some point ZOS will listen, it's just a matter of how much people will complain.

Scales still doesn't work half the time regardless, I'm not even going to mention the unreliability of leap. At least crit charge works right? Just kidding at least stam dk's have a sick aoe ult to use in open world. Wait….

WhiteMage

I have to say your experience with templars is pretty near spot on with how I experienced it. It's like Azuras, but slightly less tankiness and slightly quicker resource expenditure. The biggest difference is there is less time between encounters to actually regenerate those expenditures, so you have to pay greater attention or just take a death and respawn if you can't manage it. Which, isn't always a bad idea if you need the resources.

arkansas_ESO

"TL;DR - NB is just an inferior version of Sorc right now. It has a great CC but is just OK at everything else."

If anybody at ZOS is wondering, this pretty much sums up magic NB as it stands on live as well. Nerfs to Cloak, Concealed, Proxy Det, Soul Harvest, etc. along with things like Impale's range buff redesignated mNB from "melee range caster skirmisher" to "ranged caster", which means we're directly competing with magic sorc, yet magic sorc was built from the ground up to be a ranged caster and no other class can beat them (nor should they) at their own role.

TL;DR: I miss melee magic NB, ZOS pls buff:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2qL7-I1M08

makreth

Everyone's talking about magblades (well, when refering to a nb at least). What about stamblades? Have they been erased completely?? People don't even mention that anymore....have they forgotten that route?

Ahzek

makreth wrote: »

Everyone's talking about magblades (well, when refering to a nb at least). What about stamblades? Have they been erased completely?? People don't even mention that anymore....have they forgotten that route?

Stamblades still have the best single target ultimate and spammable in the game, as well as access to fear and cloak, but they seem to have a harder time sustaining through longer BG fights with the nerfed siphoning attacks.

santos.vellab16_ESO

Kilandros wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

The Freedom of Opinions

I tried to make that an as unbiased an assessment as possible. Full disclosure, I do have the most time invested on DK and Templar. Moving forward I will be maining Sorcerer, however.

You misspelled "forever"
Bad jokes aside, thanks for the informative report.

Kay1

No one will play in BG's, it sucks I was hyped about it, but no CP and sustain nerf? They will become a 3 proc place where people only do heavy attacks.

D0ntevenL1ft

Kay1 wrote: »

No one will play in BG's, it sucks I was hyped about it, but no CP and sustain nerf? They will become a 3 proc place where people only do heavy attacks.

This is sad to hear because i really liked the idea behind battlegrounds as was quite excited, but i can see this being completely accurate. Nobody wants to sit and heavy attack on a flag for 15 minutes per game.

UppGRAYxDD

santos.vellab16_ESO wrote: »

Kilandros wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

The Freedom of Opinions

I tried to make that an as unbiased an assessment as possible. Full disclosure, I do have the most time invested on DK and Templar. Moving forward I will be maining Sorcerer, however.

You misspelled "forever"
Bad jokes aside, thanks for the informative report.

Slotting Total Dark on my dps pvp magplar immediatly <insert evil laughter>

Kilandros

Kay1 wrote: »

No one will play in BG's, it sucks I was hyped about it, but no CP and sustain nerf? They will become a 3 proc place where people only do heavy attacks.

Look this was the first of probably 3-4 PTS iterations so changes will happen. Also, I believe ZOS intentionally took all sustain away with this initial patch so they could build up from there based on feedback.

I

KramUzibra

FlyLionel wrote: »

I thought Fossalize was the strongest CC in the game single target?

Generally I agree with you, give Templars their damn major mending...they're Templars. NBs still bad. Once PTS is closed and patch notes are confirmed as final we can draw conclusions. I think DKs will still be good, just need to adjust. You don't need to be mobile to win in BGs I bet, they make up for it with being the tank class. Just wish the patch notes can be changed and finalized so we can figure it all out completely. Timeeee.

Lol sorcs could probably tank better than a mdk

Kilandros

KramUzibra wrote: »

FlyLionel wrote: »

I thought Fossalize was the strongest CC in the game single target?

Generally I agree with you, give Templars their damn major mending...they're Templars. NBs still bad. Once PTS is closed and patch notes are confirmed as final we can draw conclusions. I think DKs will still be good, just need to adjust. You don't need to be mobile to win in BGs I bet, they make up for it with being the tank class. Just wish the patch notes can be changed and finalized so we can figure it all out completely. Timeeee.

Lol sorcs could probably tank better than a mdk

As the PTS currently stands, I think that sorcs actually would be the best tanks due to Dark Deal.

EDIT to expand: Since Tanks can no longer rely on Repentance, and because Shards no longer guarantee Stamina return, and because Blocking will become more expensive (and because Battle Roar and Helping Hands stamina return was nerfed), Sorcs will have far and away the best stamina management in the game.

ParaNostram

An annoying concern is that people will think I'm on my sorc for some meta reason (even though she's a magicka pet bosmer) when the reality is I just have had fun playing as her for a long time. Ugh...

Thank you for the very valuable feedback, let's hope this gets addressed soon.

psychotic13

I'm guessing StamDKs are now bottom of the pecking order in BG? I've tried on live playing with no reduction and only 15% recovery and find it difficult enough to sustain, with the nerfs to battle roar and igneous (and helping hands) I just can't imagine them being all that good anymore.

Kilandros

psychotic13 wrote: »

I'm guessing StamDKs are now bottom of the pecking order in BG? I've tried on live playing with no reduction and only 15% recovery and find it difficult enough to sustain, with the nerfs to battle roar and igneous (and helping hands) I just can't imagine them being all that good anymore.

There are other players with far more experience on Stamina so I'd rather just defer to them. @IxSTALKERxI could probably give you a much more insightful hierarchy of the stam classes on the pts.

IxSTALKERxI

I can't provide much insight on stamina or stamina hierarchy other than I just slotted bone pirate and 3 cost reduction jewelry with a dps set on the stamplar and I was good to go.

I've been killed pretty quick in medium at times in comparison to a magicka class using shields so I think heavy is the way to go on some stam builds.

Personally, the class choice I make isn't based on sustain or 1v1 potential, it's based on abilities/ utility it adds to a group. So far power of light + javelin has been working for me in a group setting, but now that repentance is useless I'm still considering the other classes.

Strider_Roshin

psychotic13 wrote: »

I'm guessing StamDKs are now bottom of the pecking order in BG? I've tried on live playing with no reduction and only 15% recovery and find it difficult enough to sustain, with the nerfs to battle roar and igneous (and helping hands) I just can't imagine them being all that good anymore.

Lol play with 14%, not 15%; unless of course you want to dedicate 25 champion points for that extra 1%