Why do people hate Zergs so much?

Ghostbane

Zergs in IC? Never.

NightbladeMechanics

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

Kilandros wrote: »

And I've just learned from Vort that apparently Kirsi is VE's resident hardcasting frag Reactive Sorc. Can confirm we aren't worried about that farming us.

Reactive is just 1 of 5 DW setups I use. If you actually tested the numbers as I have, it's not actually that bad: Frags for instance hits (hits, not tooltip) 942 less dmg on players compared to a standard build.

You hit 18k frags against heavy armor impen players wearing 5h Reactive?

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

Here's another thing you probably didn't know, just being in a Negate procs the Reactive Armor bonus. Stacking that + Pirate Skele + Undeath gives 68.15% dmg mitigation on top of my shields. Are my Frags gona hit like Pixysticks reborn? No, but I'm fine with that since I'm not the one equating 'moar dps' with victory.

There is supposed to be a cap at 50% mitigation from sources like these. In your testing, have you mitigated beyond the cap, or are you building to reach it with two out of three of your sources?

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

That makes it a nice option for raid play, and works especially well for an Encase build.

This thread has officially been zerged.

paulsimonps

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

Here's another thing you probably didn't know, just being in a Negate procs the Reactive Armor bonus. Stacking that + Pirate Skele + Undeath gives 68.15% dmg mitigation on top of my shields. Are my Frags gona hit like Pixysticks reborn? No, but I'm fine with that since I'm not the one equating 'moar dps' with victory.

There is supposed to be a cap at 50% mitigation from sources like these. In your testing, have you mitigated beyond the cap, or are you building to reach it with two out of three of your sources?

Wrong. There is no mitigation cap. Only thing that has a hard cap is resistance. Please check my thread, Damage mitigation explained to learn how it all actually works. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-and-list-of-options/p1

LadyLavina

Wouldn't have a problem w/ them at all if the performance/latency didn't go to s*** in the really big fights.

IxSTALKERxI

paulsimonps wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

Here's another thing you probably didn't know, just being in a Negate procs the Reactive Armor bonus. Stacking that + Pirate Skele + Undeath gives 68.15% dmg mitigation on top of my shields. Are my Frags gona hit like Pixysticks reborn? No, but I'm fine with that since I'm not the one equating 'moar dps' with victory.

There is supposed to be a cap at 50% mitigation from sources like these. In your testing, have you mitigated beyond the cap, or are you building to reach it with two out of three of your sources?

Wrong. There is no mitigation cap. Only thing that has a hard cap is resistance. Please check my thread, Damage mitigation explained to learn how it all actually works. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-and-list-of-options/p1

^
It's why sap tanks were so OP back in 1.5, the old 60% damage mitigation veil of blades + undeath vamp passive.

paulsimonps

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

Here's another thing you probably didn't know, just being in a Negate procs the Reactive Armor bonus. Stacking that + Pirate Skele + Undeath gives 68.15% dmg mitigation on top of my shields. Are my Frags gona hit like Pixysticks reborn? No, but I'm fine with that since I'm not the one equating 'moar dps' with victory.

There is supposed to be a cap at 50% mitigation from sources like these. In your testing, have you mitigated beyond the cap, or are you building to reach it with two out of three of your sources?

Wrong. There is no mitigation cap. Only thing that has a hard cap is resistance. Please check my thread, Damage mitigation explained to learn how it all actually works. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-and-list-of-options/p1

^
It's why sap tanks were so OP back in 1.5, the old 60% damage mitigation veil of blades + undeath vamp passive.

The undeath passive isn't really that powerful. It only gives you 33% mitigation if you are at 1%> HP Undeath gives you 1% mitigation per 1.5% HP lost below 50%. So even if you are at 25% HP you will only get around 16% from undeath. So while it can be useful its not as OP as people think.

NightbladeMechanics

paulsimonps wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

Here's another thing you probably didn't know, just being in a Negate procs the Reactive Armor bonus. Stacking that + Pirate Skele + Undeath gives 68.15% dmg mitigation on top of my shields. Are my Frags gona hit like Pixysticks reborn? No, but I'm fine with that since I'm not the one equating 'moar dps' with victory.

There is supposed to be a cap at 50% mitigation from sources like these. In your testing, have you mitigated beyond the cap, or are you building to reach it with two out of three of your sources?

Wrong. There is no mitigation cap. Only thing that has a hard cap is resistance. Please check my thread, Damage mitigation explained to learn how it all actually works. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-and-list-of-options/p1

I actually brought that forum post to a dev friend just recently because a test of mine showed different results. She said the resistance hard cap hadn't been in effect since 1.6, but percentage mitigation sources were capped at 50% instead.

That sounded backwards to me, but I haven't had an opportunity to follow up with my own tests (thus the "supposed to" and phrasing my post as a question). When exactly did you do your testing for physical and spell resistance and percentage mitigation, and did you take penetration into account?

Also you mentioned in your post that you had trouble calculating the exact conversion rate between crit resistance and critical modifier reduction. 68 is the correct number, and there are no diminishing returns or caps on that.

IxSTALKERxI

paulsimonps wrote: »

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

Here's another thing you probably didn't know, just being in a Negate procs the Reactive Armor bonus. Stacking that + Pirate Skele + Undeath gives 68.15% dmg mitigation on top of my shields. Are my Frags gona hit like Pixysticks reborn? No, but I'm fine with that since I'm not the one equating 'moar dps' with victory.

There is supposed to be a cap at 50% mitigation from sources like these. In your testing, have you mitigated beyond the cap, or are you building to reach it with two out of three of your sources?

Wrong. There is no mitigation cap. Only thing that has a hard cap is resistance. Please check my thread, Damage mitigation explained to learn how it all actually works. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-and-list-of-options/p1

^
It's why sap tanks were so OP back in 1.5, the old 60% damage mitigation veil of blades + undeath vamp passive.

The undeath passive isn't really that powerful. It only gives you 33% mitigation if you are at 1%> HP Undeath gives you 1% mitigation per 1.5% HP lost below 50%. So even if you are at 25% HP you will only get around 16% from undeath. So while it can be useful its not as OP as people think.

I definitely noticed a difference back in the day, even though it should have only been a total of 67%. Actually now that I think about it, I think I remember seeing a fix in the patch notes like 2 years ago where it was actually bugged.

Edit: Found it

World
Vampire
Undeath: Fixed an issue where this passive was granting significantly more damage reduction than intended.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2338695#Comment_2338695

paulsimonps

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

Here's another thing you probably didn't know, just being in a Negate procs the Reactive Armor bonus. Stacking that + Pirate Skele + Undeath gives 68.15% dmg mitigation on top of my shields. Are my Frags gona hit like Pixysticks reborn? No, but I'm fine with that since I'm not the one equating 'moar dps' with victory.

There is supposed to be a cap at 50% mitigation from sources like these. In your testing, have you mitigated beyond the cap, or are you building to reach it with two out of three of your sources?

Wrong. There is no mitigation cap. Only thing that has a hard cap is resistance. Please check my thread, Damage mitigation explained to learn how it all actually works. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-and-list-of-options/p1

I actually brought that forum post to a dev friend just recently because a test of mine showed different results. She said the resistance hard cap hadn't been in effect since 1.6, but percentage mitigation sources were capped at 50% instead.

That sounded backwards to me, but I haven't had an opportunity to follow up with my own tests (thus the "supposed to" and phrasing my post as a question). When exactly did you do your testing for physical and spell resistance and percentage mitigation, and did you take penetration into account?

Also you mentioned in your post that you had trouble calculating the exact conversion rate between crit resistance and critical modifier reduction. 68 is the correct number, and there are no diminishing returns or caps on that.

Um that makes no sense at all since EVERYTHING is a percentage mitigation. Also there are things that on their own gives more than 50% mitigation. See mist form and Bolstering Darkness.

NightbladeMechanics

paulsimonps wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

Here's another thing you probably didn't know, just being in a Negate procs the Reactive Armor bonus. Stacking that + Pirate Skele + Undeath gives 68.15% dmg mitigation on top of my shields. Are my Frags gona hit like Pixysticks reborn? No, but I'm fine with that since I'm not the one equating 'moar dps' with victory.

There is supposed to be a cap at 50% mitigation from sources like these. In your testing, have you mitigated beyond the cap, or are you building to reach it with two out of three of your sources?

Wrong. There is no mitigation cap. Only thing that has a hard cap is resistance. Please check my thread, Damage mitigation explained to learn how it all actually works. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-and-list-of-options/p1

I actually brought that forum post to a dev friend just recently because a test of mine showed different results. She said the resistance hard cap hadn't been in effect since 1.6, but percentage mitigation sources were capped at 50% instead.

That sounded backwards to me, but I haven't had an opportunity to follow up with my own tests (thus the "supposed to" and phrasing my post as a question). When exactly did you do your testing for physical and spell resistance and percentage mitigation, and did you take penetration into account?

Also you mentioned in your post that you had trouble calculating the exact conversion rate between crit resistance and critical modifier reduction. 68 is the correct number, and there are no diminishing returns or caps on that.

Um that makes no sense at all since EVERYTHING is a percentage mitigation. Also there are things that on their own gives more than 50% mitigation. See mist form and Bolstering Darkness.

By percentage mitigation, I meant buffs like Protection, Undeath, Hardy, and Ele Defender. They don't have a separate stat component like physical and spell resistances and crit chance.

That's what I said in reply, though. Are some sources capped and some coded to surpass the cap, or does ZOS think there's a cap when there isn't? It doesn't add up. When did you perform your tests on these things?

paulsimonps

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

Here's another thing you probably didn't know, just being in a Negate procs the Reactive Armor bonus. Stacking that + Pirate Skele + Undeath gives 68.15% dmg mitigation on top of my shields. Are my Frags gona hit like Pixysticks reborn? No, but I'm fine with that since I'm not the one equating 'moar dps' with victory.

There is supposed to be a cap at 50% mitigation from sources like these. In your testing, have you mitigated beyond the cap, or are you building to reach it with two out of three of your sources?

Wrong. There is no mitigation cap. Only thing that has a hard cap is resistance. Please check my thread, Damage mitigation explained to learn how it all actually works. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-and-list-of-options/p1

I actually brought that forum post to a dev friend just recently because a test of mine showed different results. She said the resistance hard cap hadn't been in effect since 1.6, but percentage mitigation sources were capped at 50% instead.

That sounded backwards to me, but I haven't had an opportunity to follow up with my own tests (thus the "supposed to" and phrasing my post as a question). When exactly did you do your testing for physical and spell resistance and percentage mitigation, and did you take penetration into account?

Also you mentioned in your post that you had trouble calculating the exact conversion rate between crit resistance and critical modifier reduction. 68 is the correct number, and there are no diminishing returns or caps on that.

Um that makes no sense at all since EVERYTHING is a percentage mitigation. Also there are things that on their own gives more than 50% mitigation. See mist form and Bolstering Darkness.

By percentage mitigation, I meant buffs like Protection, Undeath, Hardy, and Ele Defender. They don't have a separate stat component like physical and spell resistances and crit chance.

That's what I said in reply, though. Are some sources capped and some coded to surpass the cap, or does ZOS think there's a cap when there isn't? It doesn't add up. When did you perform your tests on these things?

It was bit ago since I did my initial testing but nothing has changed and I redo a lot of my testing from time to time, usually have to include it when I test new things as well. It would make no sense for anything to cap out. How would you even decide what would be included into the cap? And why have one? Maxed out Resistance + blocking, that alone is 75% mitigation, add the blocking passives from S&B and DK and you are at 82%. But things have a diminishing returns so adding more and more will add very little and staying at really high numbers comes at a great cost of other stats or can only be achieved for a short period.

CyrusArya

paulsimonps wrote: »

The undeath passive isn't really that powerful. It only gives you 33% mitigation if you are at 1%> HP Undeath gives you 1% mitigation per 1.5% HP lost below 50%. So even if you are at 25% HP you will only get around 16% from undeath. So while it can be useful its not as OP as people think.

Undeath is very strong if we are talking builds that utilize damage shields. 16% damage mitigation on a healing ward popped at execute range is extremely powerful...

And then there is pirate skelly of course which makes the passive even more powerful.

AhPook_Is_Here

paulsimonps wrote: »

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

This has been something that has been on my mind for a very long time. Whenever its brought up the idea of a large mass of players converging on one location, or a "Zerg", it's almost always met with a lot of negative comments. Personally I love being in the zerg, especially when its meet by another one. The constant push and pull of large scale fight across cyrodiil is amazing. 60+vs60+ people fighting over a keep or resource is an amazing experience and I love it. But I always here how people cheer on small scale and hate on large scale, some people even talk like small scale PvP like it makes them better than others just cause they do it. But for me Cyrodiil is not just PvP its AvA, Alliance vs Alliance. All of you vs all of us. Yet the large scale fights are always talked about with hate and disdain, why is that? Maybe this will dissipate a bit with battlegrounds coming out and some of the small scale PvP'ers go over there. But it still leaves me as said, wondering, why the hate?

I know some say that if you zerg you are unskilled but I also know a lot of people that are skilled that join the zergs as well. Obviously as an outside viewer you can't just by looking at the oncoming forces know who is and who is not skilled so saying that someone that is zerging is a bad player is just another form the small scale superiority complex. Just cause you like small scale doesn't make you better, nor does liking large scale make you better. Skill is not determined by what type of battles you like to join.

My first MMO was Warhammer Online, it had a large focus on PvP or what they called RvR which was Realm vs Realm and for me AvA is very similar. Some of the PvP Designers even worked on Warhammer. The epic fights that can arise from two or even three large forces clashing is something to behold and I love it, but for some reason saying I like it sometimes makes people automatically dislike me and shower me with negative comments or the more common superiority complex comments of "small scale if better."

So as a final note, why do you if you do, hate Zergs or if you like them what do you think about the common hate towards it?

I'm pretty sure most people don't hate zergs because most people in Cyrodiil are actually in one or surfing one.

Maybe not, but a lot of people on the forums are. As well, a lot of people are hypocrites and say they hate zergs all the while surfing one.

Soul_Demon wrote: »

Sandman929 wrote: »

NACtron wrote: »

Overall zerging requires less skill than small scale these days but that is mostly due to a lack of competitive 24 man raids.

If you had large raids fighting large raids the raid with best tactics, startegy and execution will win the day not numbers. It takes skill practice and teamwork to accomplish victory. If large scale PvP is actually competive.

It takes a lot of work to balance a raid of 24 players. With correct gear, ult rotation, player skill and ability, mastering raid roles etc. grueling trial and error. Not to mention movements and calls the raid lead makes to outsmart the opponent. I think it is just as challenging as being in a good 4 man group. For diffrent reasons. There has to be competive zergs to fight in order to make it challenging however

There some guilds out there who run large raids and provide a challenge but not as many there used to be. Meaning less large competitive play and more large casual raids being uncontested on the field.

It would be great if there were more players trying to optimize group builds rather than constantly chasing the Ultimate 1vX'er fantasy. When you come up against a large, coordinated group it's very impressive. It's tricky to put together though because there are so many egos in Cyrodiil that keeping a coordinated group together (bickering, posturing, bragging, etc) is a whole different challenge. Everyone thinks they're a leader and no one knows how to follow.

Isn't that what many of the small mans are? Previous large group members that were better and smarter than the groups that taught them volumes about the game? I don't mean that to demean, but to make a point. Posturing and egos often lead to alienation and no longer being part of the full raids for some players. When that happens the natural evolution seems to be small man groups who now tell others how "bads" are the ones who can gather a full raid of friends together and tolerate one another while they play......seems to me like a self defense mechanism to claim what you are doing is the right thing and what others do is just for bad players, especially when you were part of the very thing you now demonize. "by choice man, by choice"

People solo for a lot of reasons. Sometimes it's just because you don't have time to sit in a group, you have an hour or two to play and you don't want to be waiting at shrines for 5 min for afk members to show up before riding half way across the map to capture an empty keep and wait for what hopefully will be some decent fights. Not saying there aren't people who's egos drive them to anti-social behavior but for myself, I just don't usually want to do the things groups do, I want to find some fights and have some fun before I have to log. I don't care who is winning the campaign, or who controls the map or if some core keep is getting 3vdoored and somebody who thinks people are reading his words and acting on them demands the alliance stop having fun and once and run to that door to zerg down those 3 people. That's not why I play the game, I just play for fun.

Kilandros

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

Hai, the way some of you are reacting so defensively to my comment, are you sure you aren't the ones in reactive armor?

I just referenced what I've seen from 6 months of running in IC on an almost nightly basis. If we're gona get nit picky, I can dissect it further; Dreadlords routinely shows up w/ ~15 ppl, the only other large group on red I see with any regularity has ppl w/ Invictus tabbards and seems to top out ~8-10 ppl. If you're telling me that only 5 of them are Invictus, fair enough, that matches the number of tabbards I tend to see. But you sure could have fooled me w/, as Mr. I'm Not Really A Dog mentioned, the way there's 10 reds stacked on a flag refusing to come off it - expecting the 2 or 3 of us to go on the flag to fight them + the guards.

Kilandros wrote: »

And I've just learned from Vort that apparently Kirsi is VE's resident hardcasting frag Reactive Sorc. Can confirm we aren't worried about that farming us.

If we're gona talk about my build (I mean, I guess???), Reactive is just 1 of 5 DW setups I use. If you actually tested the numbers as I have, it's not actually that bad: Frags for instance hits (hits, not tooltip) 942 less dmg on players compared to a standard build. On the flip side, you gain stam regen, 5k health and reactive proc. That makes it a nice option for raid play, and works especially well for an Encase build.

Here's another thing you probably didn't know, just being in a Negate procs the Reactive Armor bonus. Stacking that + Pirate Skele + Undeath gives 68.15% dmg mitigation on top of my shields. Are my Frags gona hit like Pixysticks reborn? No, but I'm fine with that since I'm not the one equating 'moar dps' with victory.

You're right, that's a pretty dope build bro. Wish more people would run Reactive and Pirate Skeleton - Cyro would be much more fun!

Dyride

The self-styled piousness from some people when it comes to numbers is hilariously absurd. This whole discussion reminds me of the proverb, "a poor craftsman always blames his tools."

We used to always find the best fights playing the map, whether it was in the direction of our faction's momentum or not.

Now even a particularly​ Old Man will pack up their crew and leave even fights in the districts after losing a few stones. People seem to lack the drive to compete if it means fighting into adversity and taking a few losses in the near future.

Another wise person said, "Ask not what your alliance can do for you, ask what you can do for your alliance." ~ King Emeric

Without organized groups to spearhead a faction, the real "Zerg" becomes the default style of play for unorganized and less practiced players.

FENGRUSH

King Emeric was an inspirational figure. A good introduction for PvP players to learn the legend of Lord FENGRUSH.

Derra

FENGRUSH wrote: »

King Emeric was an inspirational figure. A good introduction for PvP players to learn the legend of Lord FENGRUSH.

I´ve heard rumors that lord fengrush only writes himself in caps because he´s so tiny in person

Minno

FENGRUSH wrote: »

King Emeric was an inspirational figure. A good introduction for PvP players to learn the legend of Lord FENGRUSH.

You have now learned the true history of Ranser's War, and how it led to the Second, or Greater, Daggerfall Covenant, embracing the Redguards of Hammerfell as well as the Orcs of Orsinium, who came to our aid in our hour of direst need. The free peoples of northwest Tamriel vowed to stand together against all threats, be they from within or without.

We were soon tested: in 2E 578 the Emperor Varen, with whom I had concluded a treaty, disappeared from the Imperial City, and Cyrodiil once again fell under the pall of the Daedric Cabal. In Varen's unexplained absence the "Empress" Clivia—a descendant of the savage Reachmen—assumed the Ruby Throne. Since then, the heart of the Empire has fallen into madness, murder, and decay. It is fortunate for our peoples—indeed, for all the peoples of Tamriel—that the true flame of the Empire of Man still burns in the Daggerfall Covenant. These are terrible times, but our destiny lies before us as straight and true as the Reman roads: we must march on Cyrodiil, overthrow the false empress and all her brood, and restore the Empire of Tamriel. Then once more peace and justice will rule the provinces, rather than blood and fire. - Triumphs of a Monarch
by His Majesty King Emeric
An autobiographical account of the life of King Emeric of Wayrest

Minno

And yes, King Emeric is anti-zerg:

"I was fortunate to have spent so much time with a hilt in my hand, for in 2E 541, when I was but twenty, Durcorach the Black Drake spread his wings in the Reach and mustered his feral tribesmen to war. Erupting from their mountain lairs like ants from a kicked anthill, the Reachmen howled down into Bangkorai, burning and looting." Triumphs of a Monarch
by His Majesty King Emeric
An autobiographical account of the life of King Emeric of Wayrest

Publius_Scipio

Narrator (Liam Nesson): The COVENANT army had been slaughtered at Chalman.... The Pact Militia horde of Trueflame continued to move westward burning Bleakers and Aleswell to the ground. Glademist and Rayles followed soon after. Nactron the decepticon, Icy the Ice Witch of the East (and wife of Arnold Schwarzenegger as Mr. Freeze), and the bird commander Crow, took their bloodthirsty, violent, vicious, foaming and drooling at the mouth barbarian army of 30,000, passed under Alma Ruma Gate and began marching towards South High Rock... Beyond South High Rock.... The innocent citizens of the COVENANT....

*It begins to rain at South High Rock*
*The small, now drenched and muddy, but not out of the fight(!) COVENANT force there is all that stands between the people of the COVENANT and the Pact Militia*

Minno: *Looking through a telescope towards Alma Ruma Gate* How many ready and able?
Rinaldo Gandalphi: One hundred thirty eight. One hundred fifty two if you count the injured that can still swing a sword.

Minno: *Collapses the telescope, looks over at Rinaldo, and places his hand on Rinaldo's shoulder* We've seen better days old friend. But a worse day would be if we were dead, and we are not that.
Rinaldo: *A small smile breaks across his face* No, we are not that. Not yet at least.

COVENANT Soldier: *Yelling* Look, over there!
Dezbro: Scipio!

*An injured and wobbly Scipio stumbles dragging his 2H sword through the mud at South High Rock towards the troops*
*Followed by a trusty COVENANT canine*

*the war horns of the Pact Militia sound!*

*Scipio turns towards the edge of the South High Rock landing. He sees the Pact Militia army*

*Scipio still facing the Pact Militia, with the COVENANT troops at his back, he begins to speak out loud*

Scipio:

Lo, There do I see my Father
Lo, There do I see my Mother and
My Brothers and my Sisters
All eating Greek yogurt

*Minno, Rinaldo, Dezbro, and the rest of the COVENANT soldiers all step forward and begin to speak in UNISON with Scipio*

THE COVENANT:

Lo, There do I see the line of my people back
to the beginning
Lo, They do call to me
They bid me take my place among them in the
aisles of Greek yogurt
Where thine enemies have been vanquished

*Pact Militia charges towards the troops and South High Rock itself!*

THE COVENANT (not having paused):

Where the brave shall live Forever
Nor shall we mourn but rejoice for that
have died the glorious death with a full stomach of Greek yogurt.

*Just as they finished the Pact Militia was right on them*
*Scipio straining lifts his 2H sword and strikes at the Pact Militia cavalry*

Narrator (Liam Nesson): And so it began. And the COVENANT made their stand.

https://youtu.be/qQekqWha7fg

Dyride

The Alliance war always makes more sense if put into an ERP context.

Dyride's birth was the illicit pairing of a Wyress and Reachman scout, "Fingerplay."

Raised among her father's savage people, she and the boy with lobster hands escaped the affections of the bombastic Darklord Tiberiius, raid lead of a zergling tribe.

Lost amidst the wildlands between Cyrodiil and Eastmarch, she was rescued by a Nord Princess, Auohildr Hjoras, whose companions included a passionate Lettuce, a mystical Sorcerer from the land Yu Toob, a firey Knight of Dragons, a ghost, and an Argonian as pure as Snow.

Allied with an Anonymous Elf, the Lettuce and Nord Princess formed a fierce war party to serve Longhouse Emperors.

Eventually, the teachings of Dee Tick on faction balance and their origins as moralistic small scalers led these passionate folk to pledge allegiance to the embattled King Emeric and the Daggerfall Covenant.

Minno

This is now an ERP thread.

PactMender

those who whine about zergs only have 1 valid pount -lag the rest is based from arrogance and ignorance.

Rylana

because they *** lag everything

ScooberSteve

50 players vs 50 players not zerging. 50 v 1 is zerging.

Curtdogg47

I personally enjoy being in a smaller groups or solo ganking. And I love the challenge of fighting or defending a keep while outnumbered.

I don't care that people Zerg.

Anti_Virus

They hate Zerging because they can't press 3 buttons and one-shot players then upload to YouTube to show off their 'skills'.

[Edit]

Game is advertised as large-scale war.
Game has a huge map
Game has outposts/Keeps/Resources to capture
"Small scaler" buys the game

>Gets "Zerged"
> Complains at players for playing PVP the way it was designed
"OMFG YOU SCRUB NOOB YOU SUCK AND HAVE NO SKILLS DON'T ZERG THE GAME IS NOT MEANT FOR THAT!

Seems legit.

Anti_Virus

KingJ wrote: »

Anazasi wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

I swear people post these every 2-3 months.Running In a zerg require barely any skill.

And dodge rolling around the same rock or tree does? I'm really confused.........

LOS takes Way more skill than running with 30-40 people spamming light attacks,or running over small groups and solo players.

LOSing around a tree with 3-5 stupid potatoes wearing cheese sets like viper, Grothadar, Valkyn, and Selene 'quick dueling' each one individually is far from "Skill"

Rickter

So is te general consensus that being in a zerg requires no skill? Have the people preaching that ever led or otherwise run a large group? its not easy. making the right calls - making the smart calls is a gift that only a few have.

Anti_Virus wrote: »

LOSing around a tree with 3-5 stupid potatoes wearing cheese sets like viper, Grothadar, Valkyn, and Selene 'quick dueling' each one individually is far from "Skill"

i agree with you, but just curious - what set do you consider not cheese? is cheese considered anything that relies on a random proc chance to cause dmg? again i agree with you, just wanted to know more

thankyourat

Anti_Virus wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

Anazasi wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

I swear people post these every 2-3 months.Running In a zerg require barely any skill.

And dodge rolling around the same rock or tree does? I'm really confused.........

LOS takes Way more skill than running with 30-40 people spamming light attacks,or running over small groups and solo players.

LOSing around a tree with 3-5 stupid potatoes wearing cheese sets like viper, Grothadar, Valkyn, and Selene 'quick dueling' each one individually is far from "Skill"

LoS requires thought though while zerging generally does not. Kiting around a tree to split up a group to actually get kills does require a good deal of skill especially if it's multiple cp 600's. You basically have to do everything right or you will die and not get any kills. You have to prioritize targets and pay close attention to your resources. If you mean a eternal hunt build just roll dodging around Los and not killing anyone then I agree it doesn't take skill. to finish an actual 1vX though is probably the most skilled thing left in the game since small group play has lost a lot of the skill involved