Dueling should be considered a crime

thankyourat

Not this again

FleetwoodSmack

I like my bar fights, thank you very much.

Iron_Butterfly

I have no problem with duelling in general (although personally I don't do it). However, in main towns like capitals cities and starter towns it's ridiculous. Also interferes with accessing guild traders in those towns.

In some towns in other games, the developers make it impossible to duel near waypoints, banks, crafting and trade areas. Seems to be much better.

Nerouyn

Arato wrote: »

Make it incur a bounty so that duelers have to avoid the guards/witnesses and take that bother out in the wilderness where it doesn't bother anyone else.

Oh Azura, yes please!

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

Or, you could just ignore it. Let them have their fun.

Can I ignore the chronic lag they create away? Pretty sure I can't.

So they can take their fun and have it elsewhere.

b101uk

duelling would be fine in city if citing past IRL history, providing they stuck with conventional weapons of that past IRL history used in duels, but AoE weapons or magic has never formed part of duelling IRL.

now IMO spamming negative effect AoE weapons/magic in crowded areas, which obviously would be affecting citizens if it were IRL or if damage to civilians etc was turned on, should incur interest of the guards putting a stop to it and placing a bounty on you.

and in most cases if you wanted to duel and use busy waypoints to join with another to duel, it would take little more than 30sec to 1min to take it out of town, and the only reason people don't is because it doesn't have the "look at me, I am great" effect they perceive, but little do they know on the whole people just think much the opposite.

FleetwoodSmack

In no way has a duel ever affected me from using

• A wayshrine
• A guild trader
• A banker
• Any NPC
• Dye/crafting stations
• Caused my computer to lag and I run on a technological potato

It hasn't changed since OT's inception and it's likely to not change anytime soon. How do I know? See the plethora of other threads that have been made since OT dropped.

covenant_merchant

b101uk wrote: »

and the only reason people don't is because it doesn't have the "look at me, I am great" effect they perceive, but little do they know on the whole people just think much the opposite.

Duel me, bro. *triggering intensifies*

Banetek

Arato wrote: »

Just as I figured when they added in dueling it'd be happening right next to the waypoints in every city in every zone unless the zone is dead. It's a bother in MMO's and a visual eyesore that doesn't belong smack in the middle of towns.

Make it incur a bounty so that duelers have to avoid the guards/witnesses and take that bother out in the wilderness where it doesn't bother anyone else.

[Edit to remove inappropriate remark.]

Spoken like a true RPer... You know some people actually utilize skill and surprise, versus staged glamour dueling set in a staged location more befitting of a duel...

Sorry if its not your online safe space but you can not dictate other peoples free expression in how they choose to duel.. or glamour lol duel haha.. Sorry , I saw a staged duel on time in Rifted.. thought it was funny..

Silver_Strider

Arato wrote: »

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

Dueling should not be a crime.

How is an agreement between two people against the law? Just because you don't like to see it....

...people these days.

Go try to challenge someone to a duel right now, irl, go out in the streets and start punching each other in front of the cops. Surely they'll just let you have at it because it's an agreement between two people, it's not like you're disrupting other people at all!

Arato wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

Dueling should not be a crime.

How is an agreement between two people against the law? Just because you don't like to see it....

...people these days.

Go try to challenge someone to a duel right now, irl, go out in the streets and start punching each other in front of the cops. Surely they'll just let you have at it because it's an agreement between two people, it's not like you're disrupting other people at all!

It's not called Duels irl.
It's called World Stars
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PL8yhdGJPI

.. if people do that worldstar stuff knockout game, any of that in front of police officers, they're getting themselves arrested (at best, you know, cops can be pretty overzealous these days, they'd best HOPE they just go to jail). In this game, duelers should be avoiding the guards.

Maybe at 1 point they would've been arrested but this kind of stuff happens on a near daily basis in my neighborhood that the police don't even bother to make arrests. It's become more a spectator sport now, with the police only bothering to show up to break up the fight if it escalates too greatly (before weapons start getting drawn usually). Hell, the last time the police were called, they stayed and watched the entire fight til it was over and then they just sort of told everyone to go home before they left, not a single arrest or even a warning.

Ajaxandriel

b101uk wrote: »

duelling would be fine in city if citing past IRL history, providing they stuck with conventional weapons of that past IRL history used in duels, but AoE weapons or magic has never formed part of duelling IRL.

now IMO spamming negative effect AoE weapons/magic in crowded areas, which obviously would be affecting citizens if it were IRL or if damage to civilians etc was turned on, should incur interest of the guards putting a stop to it and placing a bounty on you.

and in most cases if you wanted to duel and use busy waypoints to join with another to duel, it would take little more than 30sec to 1min to take it out of town, and the only reason people don't is because it doesn't have the "look at me, I am great" effect they perceive, but little do they know on the whole people just think much the opposite.

This is the whole point.

But as we understand that some people obviously don't give a damn about immersion (thanks @thomas.k.grayb14_ESO for telling it so franckly...) there we go to the solution about a "RP" instance of the world and a "Less-RP" one.
I'm sure the technology is here, Tamriel is already instanced. Just give people this mere checkbox to freely switch in and out of a Roleplay Phase instead of letting us pissing each other off that way. ^^'

LadyLavina

CapnPhoton wrote: »

You can choose to turn off area chat.

You cannot choose to turn off mass attention seekers dueling in populated areas.

lol jesus, what a nasty and bitter little comment.

I also love the implication that they're attention seekers because they're dueling in a place that's allowed/convenient for them lmao.

I sense either an rp'er that rages because something that breaks their immersion happens in a multiplayer game (god forbid), or someone that just wants to ruin something a lot of people enjoy simply because they're unhappy with it.

It's called deal with it. People spam abilities everywhere all the time making a gigantic scene/a lot of noise. Dueling simply enabled people to kill each other with said abilities. What're you going to do, propose bans for people that use attacks/whatever outside of dungeons/cyrodiil? lmao

Loc2262

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

As things stand, we can duel in these areas and no amount of condescending claptrap from you and your ilk is gonna change that. I have as much right to duel anywhere that will allow it as you do using a crafting table or trading with other players.

You guys really don't get it, do you?

Again: Dueling can be moved anywhere, easily. Last time I checked though we were not able to move crafting tables to locations that are not being haunted by duelers. (And don't get me started on Homestead.) In other words: Duelers have free choice where they do their stuff, crafters do not.

Also: Dueling has a huge impact on distracting activity on the screen (even if the player's rig is strong enough so that no FPS loss occurs). Crafting/trading has no impact on screen activity whatsoever.

So, any dueler who chooses a place like the market area in Rawl'kha to do their thing are in my view inconsiderate at best.

Cpt_Teemo

Just put the option on "Auto decline Duels"

Nahz

As someone who really enjoys dueling, I'd like to weigh in on this conversation.

I've seen roleplayers make the argument that they roleplay using /say and /emote (as opposed to grouping with the other roleplayers or using /guild chat for more privacy and to avoid disturbing other players) because they want to invite other people to join them in their session. I imagine that having a random person in the area join in would make the story more vibrant, and would be more challenging as you'd have to adapt to an unexpected addition.

I like to duel by the undaunted enclave in wayrest because people who are passing by may be interested in joining. They may be experienced duelists themselves, interested in enjoying the game's pvp content, or they may just want to test out changes to their builds. Whatever the reason, I like fighting new people and new builds for the challenge, and because I may be able to pick up on some things that I'd like to try. I've come across a lot of build components that I try to incorporate into my own playstyle whenever possible.

I've improved my skills as a pve and pvp player by dueling other players. You can inflate a monster's health and damage as much as you want, but it's still just AI. An enemy player is able to anticipate what you're going to do, and adapt to your playstyle. An enemy player will also be able to give you meaningful feedback to help you improve. I think you'd find a lot of duelers to be friendly if you talked to them.

That's my two crowns on the issue.

CapnPhoton

LadyLavina wrote: »

CapnPhoton wrote: »

You can choose to turn off area chat.

You cannot choose to turn off mass attention seekers dueling in populated areas.

lol jesus, what a nasty and bitter little comment.

I also love the implication that they're attention seekers because they're dueling in a place that's allowed/convenient for them lmao.

I sense either an rp'er that rages because something that breaks their immersion happens in a multiplayer game (god forbid), or someone that just wants to ruin something a lot of people enjoy simply because they're unhappy with it.

It's called deal with it. People spam abilities everywhere all the time making a gigantic scene/a lot of noise. Dueling simply enabled people to kill each other with said abilities. What're you going to do, propose bans for people that use attacks/whatever outside of dungeons/cyrodiil? lmao

The comment was to the point. There is no bitterness.

This is the first game I have played where dueling is allowed in range of city guards. Other games, the guards will attack. Where it's a matter of having a performance issue for some, others it's just an annoyance to wayshrine into a place and have to run through it. I have good internet, however I can no longer go to Rawl'kha via the wayshrine.

There is perhaps a more sporting solution. If they duel in cities, they become attackable by every player.

Prof_Bawbag

Loc2262 wrote: »

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

As things stand, we can duel in these areas and no amount of condescending claptrap from you and your ilk is gonna change that. I have as much right to duel anywhere that will allow it as you do using a crafting table or trading with other players.

You guys really don't get it, do you?

Again: Dueling can be moved anywhere, easily. Last time I checked though we were not able to move crafting tables to locations that are not being haunted by duelers. (And don't get me started on Homestead.) In other words: Duelers have free choice where they do their stuff, crafters do not.

Also: Dueling has a huge impact on distracting activity on the screen (even if the player's rig is strong enough so that no FPS loss occurs). Crafting/trading has no impact on screen activity whatsoever.

So, any dueler who chooses a place like the market area in Rawl'kha to do their thing are in my view inconsiderate at best.

Nah, I get it. We can duel anywhere otherwise we wouldn't be able to. It's that simple. Again, it's cute that you think you somehow should have preference over myself and others. Also, in case it's escaped your attention, there are a fair number of crafting stations scattered across the entire wilderness. Not happy? Take your character to one of those. Taking some of your own advice onboard would be a good start.

LadyLavina

Edit: Deleted b/c while what I had to say was somewhat valid, it was rather inflammatory.

Loc2262

LadyLavina wrote: »

What're you're basically trying to do here is get dueling disabled in certain areas simply because you don't like it, while trying to throw up this nonsense as your reasoning.

Oh, thanks for letting me know what my actual reason is! Never would have guessed!

Funny thing though that the duelers tell "us crafters" that we pretend to own the place, when it's actually their on-screen graphics and sound effect overload that's intrusive.

Seriously, I don't mind people dueling. I actually regularly stop and watch it. And actually there are players considerate enough to take it at least a few steps outside the main town areas.

But yeah, I get it. ZOS seemingly doesn't care, and as long as there's people like you with that "go to another place if our intrusion disturbs you" attitude, I guess it's best to do just that. Due to the current client bugs, Rawl'kha is a bad choice anyway except you like being thrown to login screens multiple times a day.

I'm looking forward to the day when ZOS introduces some new mechanic that reverses roles here and puts the inconsiderate duelers in a place where others get on their nerves. Oh wait, haven't they done that already? Hmm, maybe I'll just execute my ZOS-sanctioned right to sit there and throw mudballs at town center duelers? I mean, if they don't like that, they can just go someplace else, right?

WalkingLegacy

Arato wrote: »

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

Dueling should not be a crime.

How is an agreement between two people against the law? Just because you don't like to see it....

...people these days.

Go try to challenge someone to a duel right now, irl, go out in the streets and start punching each other in front of the cops. Surely they'll just let you have at it because it's an agreement between two people, it's not like you're disrupting other people at all!

I think your concept fails when we consider fantasy to "irl". Because we also don't run around in full body armor or in our skivvies (most of us), or we also don't see people crouched around lockboxes, or jumping on signs, or hopping around on horses, etc, etc, etc

Besides, barring any local/federal laws, I'm sure there is a lawyer out there that can prove - that an agreement between two people that doesn't effect anyone else is sound.

Cadbury

covenant_merchant wrote: »

b101uk wrote: »

and the only reason people don't is because it doesn't have the "look at me, I am great" effect they perceive, but little do they know on the whole people just think much the opposite.

Duel me, bro. *triggering intensifies*

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFkdcQgNJHo

Phica_Lovic

This convo again. It'll never happen.

LadyLavina

Loc2262 wrote: »

Oh, thanks for letting me know what my actual reason is! Never would have guessed!

Yeah my wording was crappy lol.

I apologize. It's clear we're both passionate about the game and the issue. I should've never commented

grom1024

Solution to 2/3 of duels in towns is very simple. The global Tamriel-wide LFG chat. People pack in the capital city zones because they have nothing to do while spamming something like "DD 600+ LFG vet daily pledges". Global LFG channel would have solved the problem. They would have been able to go to other zones and do quests while waiting for group.

kylewwefan

Easy fix. Game automatically turns off prevent attacking innocents when dueling. One little accidental AOE taps an Npc and here come the guards to add an extra element to your fun.

heyjrey

I personally enjoy watching people duel each other. The only thing that bothered me about dueling was the fact that I'd be bombarded with duel invitations as soon as I ported into a zone or logged on to my toon. HOWEVER, I fixed that issue by turning on Auto-Decline duel invitations. But it's not because I'm "against" dueling, it's because I'm tired of having accidentally accepted a duel invitation when I was in the middle of something or wondering who the heck is trying to duel me because everyone around me is still a black silhouette.

LadyLavina

edit: Deleted b/c I need to leave this thread alone.

gediv2

How about making it so players can approach a guard and click on a "Complain about dueling" dialog. Guard then will patrol and alert on any player in duel mode. Then duelers are offered a dialog to cancel duel or face a fine or be attacked like a thief would etc... A "Narc" feature.

Cadbury

I just want to heal the duelers. Is that a crime?

bulbousb16_ESO

Yes, I absolutely think Dueling inside cities should be considered a crime and cracked down upon by the guards!

Molydeus

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Molydeus wrote: »

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

I used to be against it in towns until I got bored of the same old PvE thing and now, I don't mind it at all. It allows people wishing to duel to find others quickly. Do I think people should be doing it in banks or next to crafting tables etc etc? No, but busy wayshrines are fine because it's where most people just hang around anyway doing nothing other than trash talk or spamming their AoE's. At least now they have the option of actually doing something the game encourages them to do.

I think something should be done about the bots and rubber banders that ruin certain areas for those wishing to play the game how it's intended to be played, not those using a feature ZoS gave us to use.

But it also means people have problems loading into towns where people are dueling right on the wayshrine. I end up having to alt+f4 and pick a wayshrine outside of the town in order to go to a town now, it's obnoxious. All because duel w****s feel they need an audience. Let's face it, if you're so cool that people would want to watch you, they'd subscribe to your twitch stream, if you need to FORCE people to watch you by doing stuff right on top of populated areas, you're not so cool.

@Arato As things stand, we can duel in these areas and no amount of condescending claptrap from you and your ilk is gonna change that. I have as much right to duel anywhere that will allow it as you do using a crafting table or trading with other players. I can't speak on behalf of others and I don't claim to do so, but I'm 42 years old and my days of trying to impress people are long gone. What people may think about me in-game, whether it be negative or positive is water of a duck's back. I duel at wayshrines because it's the easiest and quickest method to find like minded people and it has absolutely nothing to do with trying to impress you. Seriously, don't flatter yourself. I don't know you, you don't know me, so what you think of me means nothing to me. Not being a ***, because lets be honest, you don't give a jot about what I think about you either. Works both ways.

The flip side of the coin, yes, there are some try hards, but there are try hards everywhere; Group dungeons, PvP, duelling, Trails etc. Rather than gripe about us, aim your destain towards ZoS. Only they can improve the lag and load times. People who duel aren't the ones at fault, that will be the current servers or whatever it is that are at fault.

Take notes everyone. This is what a selfish person looks like.

So people are now selfish because they use an in-game feature? Or because you thinking I shouldn't be using that feature makes no difference to me? Heard it all now. It's like calling you selfish because you choose to craft in the general vicinity whilst I'm entering a large hub. Last I checked, people have as much right to duel as you do to craft or use vendors. Selfish would be me going out my way to grief you doing something that the devs never intended us to do.

I loathe to use the word "entitled", but for some bizarre reason a lot of people around here think they're more entitled to craft etc than others are to duel. Nope. I'd say expecting everyone to pander to your desires is more selfish than allowing people to get on and play the game as its intended to be played. If people aren't supposed to fight in busy hubs, they'd have made it so. Use a crafting table or vendor way out in the wilderness if it irks you so.

I don't think you really understand why dueling inside cities is frowned upon by so many people.