Morrowind...and ESO+

P3ZZL3

Myrrah wrote: »

I'll just repeat what i said in the other thread since i'm baffled by this attitude: no other high profile mmo releases expansions for free to subscribers. They release content patches for free but not expansions. So am not sure why anyone here would expect it to be free for subscribers?

Well, on the same note I'll refer you to all my other posts - including the OT that you posted.

Re-Read EDIT2. Take you're time. There are a couple of long words in there as well.

Merenwen_812

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Merenwen_812 wrote: »

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Its 40$ and no sub is required... please get off it.

WoW charges 60$ per pop and a sub model.

40$ for an Elk??? Done

40$ for a new zone, class, battlegrounds, dungeons and trial?... BLASPHEMY!!!!

Sorry, but I am sure most of us spend that much a month on coffee. I am an ESO+ member since the game was released on PC.

don't forget the new motif that was available for a little while just now, was 6000 crowns what was that $50.00 ?

Which was totally optional and even farm-able through the game. Just like Ancient Orc and other motifs that are 5000 crowns. Man you guys are nit picking everything. Its sad.

don't get me wrong, not nit picking just while they were showing how much the elk was they forgot the motif
(which I bought since I had tons of crowns not being used) I am not arguing price or dlc vs expansion. Idc
ESO brings me joy and lots of game play, I am preordering as soon as it is available xD

rynth

lol have none of you played an MMO before? Lol you act this is first time that sub's have had to purchase an expansion for an MMO. Get over yourselves we as sub's get all dlc for free in a way, we get bag to hold all our resources, we get the 10 percent xp boost, etc.

This is an expansion not a DLC there is a big difference

ThePaleItalian

Merenwen_812 wrote: »

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Merenwen_812 wrote: »

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Its 40$ and no sub is required... please get off it.

WoW charges 60$ per pop and a sub model.

40$ for an Elk??? Done

40$ for a new zone, class, battlegrounds, dungeons and trial?... BLASPHEMY!!!!

Sorry, but I am sure most of us spend that much a month on coffee. I am an ESO+ member since the game was released on PC.

don't forget the new motif that was available for a little while just now, was 6000 crowns what was that $50.00 ?

Which was totally optional and even farm-able through the game. Just like Ancient Orc and other motifs that are 5000 crowns. Man you guys are nit picking everything. Its sad.

don't get me wrong, not nit picking just while they were showing how much the elk was they forgot the motif
(which I bought since I had tons of crowns not being used) I am not arguing price or dlc vs expansion. Idc
ESO brings me joy and lots of game play, I am preordering as soon as it is available xD

Me too, just as soon as the PS Store lets me grrrrr..

I am just seeing these forums blow up with all this outrage and we still do not know everything.

helediron

30 hours of quests is nothing but a DLC. And not a huge one either. Just ZOS BS about chapter of one thin page.

Evangele

Worth is determined by individuals.

What has worth to me, may not have worth to you, and vice versa.

I find worth in the expansion, especially at $40, so I will purchase it...and likely the physical collectors edition bc I feel that the worth is there for the money I would spend on it.

If you do not feel like the worth is there, you do not buy it. Tada, amazing how that works. You have choice and the freedom to make your own decisions regarding the money in your possession.

You do not get to tell me what worth I place in something based on my preferences. What is shady is telling other people that cannot enjoy something because you do not personally find worth in it.

M0bi

That's it, I'm done. Have fun folks but I'm certainly not paying for this. [/quote]

kbye

Acrolas

So now that we've all been *** by at least one facet of the game, can we please stop in-fighting and be a community unified by a belief that we are, eh, hmmm...

You know what? "Separate but equally ***" just has a nice ring to it...

(edit: thinking of that d word, not the f word)

Jimbullbee85

sevomd69 wrote: »

All games are downloadable and its definitely content... so is it a DLC? According to the stream it seems that Morrowind can be standalone game... don't need 1 tam to play it so I don't get all these salty tears.

Hmmmmm you may have a point. I suppose the proof of the pudding is seeing wether it has the value of a full game. Something we can't judge yet. I suppose the uproar is mainly due to the fact that we've been promised a big update after homestead. I'm not really surprised that first impressions of ESO+ loyalists are salty if we're having to shell out money for something we've been promised.

Aliniel

This is a rip off for ESO+ members. So, basically you're giving us Homestead, which is free for everybody, we got to buy Morrowind and there's maybe a chance of another one or two DLC which also may be free. Why should I be paying for ESO+ besides crafting bag? I can use crown stores to get DLCs (which I don't even need to be honest since I played them through).

You promised more information on this tomorrow. You're walking on a thin ice. Be careful now.

Oompuh

New class, new trial. Cant wait

usmcjdking

Downloadable? Yes.
New content? Yes.

Obviously not DLC.

Flynch

I'm a bit confused as to why it is being portrayed as a stand-alone game, when purchasing Morrowind gives you OneTam anyway. Presumably that's the 'expansion/dlc' cost plus the base-game cost, hence why it's more expensive?

This is a bit of a trainwreck atm.

Linaleah

MasterSpatula wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

moreover, lets look at sizes of content packs. typical size of SWTOR content pack? 5-6 hours of story, maybe 2 more hours of other gameplay. that's counting cutscenes btw. swtor so called expansion are a fraction in size compared to ESO content packs, let alone an expansion we have just had announced.

if you had actualy played SWTOR? you wouldn't be comparing it favorably to ESO. hell I WISH swtor was more like ESO's monetanization/content release model, then I would still be playing it instead of giving up on it after 5 years.

SWTOR's KOTFE expansion includes the initial expac release and additional "chapters" as part of the overall "expansion." Sure, they release 5-6 hours of content at the beginning, but you have to include everything that gets trickled out over the course of months in your final figure of the size of the expansion.

And you made a pretty big and false assumption about me there. I, too, gave up on SWTOR and came here, and things are looking mighty familiar.

things are not even remotely familiar. and yes you get all that acess. me? i PAID for all that acess. you get acess years after it was released. probably the only fair thing about that whole system. but hey... guess what ESO did? or right, 4 pack of DLC at fraction of a cost of original individual purchases. and gold edition again, at much lower cost from original base game.

more over. there is very little that trickles over in SWTOR. all those chapters of KOTFE? you had to individually keep subscribing for - as non subscriber, you only got acess to chapters "so far" you didn't get acess to entire story - and don't even get me started on entire "bonus" chapter that was only available if you stayed subscribed through entire expansion and cannot be acquired in any other way (no, gating actual content in already content starved game is NOT a good subscription incentive). oh you can acess them if you subscribe now, but that's because its older content. KOTET is not getting any more story chapters. I will bet you, right now - that the new update? will require subscription to unlock. and did you forget the whole "oh btw? you literally cannot acess end game group content unless you stay subscribed. right now my friend can run trials, can go into Cyrodill etc without needing ESO plus. he has some bag space limitations and doesn't get to just splurge in crown shop like I do, but otherwise, we play together with no issues. in SWTOR? subscribe or gtfo.

there are paywalls on top of paywalls in SWTOR and when you drop subscription, you cannot use your store currency to just buy permanent acess. and your experience playing as non subscribers is not even remotely similar to the one as subscriber. oh and you get a third of a coins, that you get crowns here with monthly subscription.

I don't know what it is you are smoking but thinking that bioware is doing it better when it comes to monetanization is just... hilarious to me. its not even remotely the dejavu here.

reguvin

If the Expansion is Good I would buy it.

ESO + Discount would make it cooler.

deepseamk20b14_ESO

I've pretty much played games with monthly subs my entire MMO gaming career. Though I'm a little sad, as an ESO+ member for so long, that it won't be included. However, it's only $40. A lot of game play and features being added. This is about the same price as other game expansions out there unless you buy a season pass. Since ESO+ is apparently a limited season pass, we will just have to fork over the money if we want to play the morrowind expansion.

I do find it kind of funny though, that during the twitch stream one of the guys specifically said he didn't like to use the term expansion.

Either way, it comes out in June. That's one less pack of cigarettes a month or two less sodas or one less pizza delivery. I'm not sure why people expect to not pay for content that other people literally make their living on. Other free to play games make there money through the cash shops that are P2W. ESO crown store is at least not P2W like those other games. So pick your battles. Me? I'm forking over $40.

Davor

Phinix1 wrote: »

The answer is quite simple:

DLC != (is not the same as) EXPANSION

But it is. If you are not buying the disc version of Morrowind it is Down Loadable Content. Doesn't matter the size if it's 1mb DLC or a 100 GB DLC. It's Down Loadable Content and that is what is listed in the Crown Store.

Since Morrowind is not being sold in the Crown Store, that is how Zenimax is getting away with it. The "promise" is anything in the crown store that is DLC is free and don't have to pay for if you don't want to. Since there is no option to buy in the Crown Store, Morrowind DLC doesn't have to be "legally" free.

So yes DLC = Expansion= New Chapter. Explain that to the judge. There is no legal difference. DLC is anything that is downloadable. That is why Zenimax/Bethesda call their Expansions DLC now. Ironically with TES:Morrowind PC players got free content called "Plug-ins". They stopped using the word Plug-ins because they wanted to charge for "DLC" at the time (it was a new term). Zenimax/Bethesda can't legally change what DLC means. Call it a New Chapter, or expansion it's still DLC if it's not on a disc.

hingarthuub17_ESO

gard wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

What part of expansion do players not understand?

This isn't a DLC and the OP still refuses to acknowledge that ...

It's not a dlc because.. ?

I'll answer: Because ZOS names it so.

A turd by any other name is still a turd.

Preach! As an ESO+ subscriber, this thing's a kick in the face.

/Cancelled.

vyndral13preub18_ESO

Aliniel wrote: »

This is a rip off for ESO+ members. So, basically you're giving us Homestead, which is free for everybody, we got to buy Morrowind and there's maybe a chance of another one or two DLC which also may be free. Why should I be paying for ESO+ besides crafting bag? I can use crown stores to get DLCs (which I don't even need to be honest since I played them through).

You promised more information on this tomorrow. You're walking on a thin ice. Be careful now.

Just pull the plug on your sub. Save the money. If you feel like getting the xpac by the time it comes out you will have saved enough to pay for it. And if it is so big and awesome like they say you wont even have to turn your sub back on, because you know, you will have the xpac to play. So maybe 9 months from now you need to turn your sub back on if they actually release anything.

I tend to think given past preformance it will be end of year or early next year before we see any more real content after the xpac so that is a good 9-12 months of saving.

Vizier

More and more the benefit of ESO plus membership is just not worth it. I guess the question to ask is, is the crafting bag, 10% xp and 1500 crowns a month worth it? I suppose the only way that makes sense is if you were likely to spend money on crowns. Truth be told I probably would so that's kind of a wash really. At least for me. I subscribe, but I also purchased the game when it was sub based only.

Still, ZOS, did say ALL future content would be afforded members that subscribed. This is obviously someone altering what the definition of "future content" is. For instance will someone that purchases Morrowind only be able to play in Morrowind? Or will they have access to content available already? If they do have access to content available already then Morrowind is merely added content for what already exists.

If someone purchases Morrowind after having subscribed to ESO plus or bought the previous content will they now have double character slots and storage over someone who purchased Morrowind only? If not then the content is not stand alone and IS future content due to it's connection.

ESO ZOS...by doing this you've shown an incredible lack of integrity as a business. I really don't know how you can say Morrowind isn't "future content" and I'm pretty certain somebody once explained that expansions were part of that so...certainly leaves a bad taste in one's mouth.

I mean you did give yourselves the right to re-write the rules as you go and we did all accept that...but...come on...really?

NewBlacksmurf

App

Let me get this right


You (some not all)
Would rather subscribe for what....6 months and never own any dlc vs paying $39 for access?

Some of you have subbed for 1-2 years or more

Cireous

[/quote]

Good questions. We'll be getting into this more tomorrow - stay tuned for an article on our website that should give some insight. [/quote]

Spellcrafting? Please? Q2 basegame patch to go along with Morrowind: Spellcrafting. And that's why the Warden has a single one-handed sword. Because it's bound. And magical. And I won't even need a stave anymore, or fireballs, or force pulse, or wall of elements, or two swords that you can't even slash with. Just a magical sword, a spell, and healing, and nature, and ice, and whatever the third thing is, and awesomeness.

A girl can dream.

Davor

Hammy01 wrote: »

I am an ESO Plus subscriber and I am more than happy to purchase this Morrowind expansion... ecstatic even! However if any current ESO Plus subscribers are not happy that this expansion is not covered by their ESO Plus perks then you can just cancel ESO Plus for the next 3 months and use the money you saved to buy the expansion. After that you can decide to resume ESO Plus for the perks (up to and including free future DLC's) or play without ESO Plus.

Or you can not respond to people who have a differing opinion and mock them.

Lexxypwns wrote: »

So, how does such a *** group of developers get their hands on such a valuable and treasured IPO?

They own the company who owns and created the IP.

Luigi_Vampa

I just have to say this to all the people I am arguing with. I have absolutly no problem paying for an expansion. I have subbed since launch. I don't expect my sub to cover all future expansions. This is not my first mmo.

My only problem is how they said ESO+ would cover all future dlc content and now they are just calling this not dlc, or at least it won't be in the crown store. 30 hours of content is not an expansion in my book. Not in an mmo. Most hardcore, or even highly active players will have this done in under a week. Before someone says it; yes I work and have a family, yet I still find a lot of time to play this game because this is my favorite hobby. I don't live in a basement, I own my own house.

I simply think a lot of people are blinded by the MORROWIND hype to see that this isn't really adding that much content. 30 hours. Battlegrounds will be great but they could have been added to any update. They should have been in the base game. PvPers have been ignored and content starved for too long. It is nice to get a new class, but this also should have been in the base game. It was there, it just got scrapped before the game launched.

They said this game wouldn't go B2P.
They said this game wouldn't have cash shops.
They said crafting would always provide the best gear.
They said ESO+ would give us access to all future content.

Surely you understand why some people are a bit upset? When they announced ESO+ they did not tell us that they would have expansions that wouldn't be covered. Many assumed ESO+ would give them access to all future content. We were wrong.

gard

STEVIL wrote: »

can one buy orsimium and play the game?
can one buy thieves guild and play the game?
can one buy dark brotherhood and play the game?
can one buy shadows of the hist and play the game?
can one buy ESO One tamriel and play the game?
can one buy ESo Morrowind and play the game?

Seems to me, two of these things are not like the other four on a very solid fundamental level.

Subbed since launch - pre-ordered original game.
No prob with the upcoming expansion.
pre-ordered collections digital upgrade after the twitch.
Will continue to sub.

But thats me...

Everyone is unique just like i am..

Good point.

I wonder how many character slots and how much bank space come with the "expansion?"
Will those be added to my existing account? Or will I need to create a new account to make use of them as opposed to combining them to my existing account? That would be an added "FU" to current players.

I'm not leaving. But I'm likely not renewing my two subs until after Morrowind release, and possibly not even then.
That's a net loss to ZOS, for anyone who can math.

DaveMoeDee

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

AdamBourke wrote: »

SaRuZ wrote: »

You also get crowns every month alongside the crafting bag. If DLC is your main concern why not do what I did and buy it outright? I paid $40 for the Megapack and now I own it

I dont care about the crowns - although the crafting back was nice, it wasn't there from the start, and is not why I subscribe*.

I subscribe* to make sure I have all the content, while at the same time supporting ESO a little bit more than I would be just buying the DLC.

But... the only paid for DLC there will have been for a year (by the time morrowind is released) will be two dungeons. I kept going, thinking that they would release something cool to make up for a year of paying for ESO+ without any significant content. And they are releasing something cool... but it's not included.

Even if i WAS interested in the crowns, the direction the crown store is going has made me consider scrapping ESO+ in protest regardless of DLC content.

I will miss the crafting bag.

---

*subscribed. It is now past tense.

Sort of my feeling on it. I kept my sub mostly out of good faith. They havent released anything in months i have been intrested in. But i kept i because i support them and in turn i get access to the dlc i do want. Except ofcourse the ones they tell me i cant have....

So no reason to keep the sub in good faith, since it seems to be a one sided transaction.

It is sooooo much cheaper getting access to DLC by buying through crowns that go on sale regularly.

A sub was already kind of a donation. Then they went two quarters with no DLC appearing in the crown store and now they will follow it with DLC you can't access with the sub so they can double dip! So you basically have 3 quarters worth of donations to the cause if you keep the sub. Crafting bags are awesome, so there is some value. Is there $135 worth? The answer is subjective.

Jimbullbee85

rynth wrote: »

lol have none of you played an MMO before? Lol you act this is first time that sub's have had to purchase an expansion for an MMO. Get over yourselves we as sub's get all dlc for free in a way, we get bag to hold all our resources, we get the 10 percent xp boost, etc.

This is an expansion not a DLC there is a big difference

Nope this is the first for me. Doesn't mean I don't feel *** on. 2 years is a long time to play one game and many have been playing for much longer. I love ESO but I don't like ZOS. WE PAY FOR THIS GAME. I think we should all sack ZOS and start taking interviews for a better developer LoL. Afterall what have they done but expand on the genius of Bethesda's elder scrolls? Theyre in it for the money. Not the lore or the gaming experience IMO. Just the money, and they're preying on the best of us. The Elder scrolls fanatics who are desperately trying to keep this game alive.

Cronopoly

So if it's not a DLC you can play it without the base game? Of course not. Bait and switch honestly. That said, it wouldn't have such a perception of being misleading if they didnt plainly use a technicality for this which is obvious. Also if I personally didn't spend $ on gambling and felt cheated by the Crown Crates.

Lemme check my bank account for how much I spent on the crown store on Vanity Costumes, Vanity Pets, Vanity Mounts, Vanity Dyes, & DLC's. I wouldn't be shocked If this amounted to over $300 or $400 dollars in the last 12 months alone.

I would suspect many are burnt up that are already ESO+ subscribers and have already feel they pay enough due to the normal periodic support of the Crown Store. I bet those person's feel like someone who worked at a company for 35 years and then find the pension plan has been stolen...

[snip]

"All those with current ESO+ subs and have purchased more than $400 dollars worth of Crown Store Vanity items get out". What the #$%...

[edited for inappropriate content]

Davor

Myrrah wrote: »

I'll just repeat what i said in the other thread since i'm baffled by this attitude: no other high profile mmo releases expansions for free to subscribers. They release content patches for free but not expansions. So am not sure why anyone here would expect it to be free for subscribers?

Didn't someone just say Star Wars MMO does this? So there goes your "no other high profile MMO" unless you are saying the Star Wars MMO is not high profile.

clocksstoppe

This new update is DLC. ZOS isn't tricking anyone here. If ESO+ won't give access to it, it means ZOS can be sued for false advertising. It doesn't matter what ZOS calls it, it still is DLC.