What do you think of Crown Crates? -- New Poll for PTS Implementation

Elsonso

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

starkerealm wrote: »

That said, TSW's gambleboxes have one serious issue, they actually include (or used to include) augments. These are straight up stat bonuses that you can attack to your skills. It's possible to obtain them through a tedious process... or just cough up cash.

I wonder if this would be classified by ZOS as "do no harm". A tedious grind that is conveniently bypassed in the Crown Store. It is the same thinking behind selling combat oriented skill lines, as near as I can tell.

Mandragora wrote: »

So I can imagine one day some[one] told them they could make a lot of money by gamble boxes (or did anyone were thinking that what could work for MOBA can work for RPG?), they agreed and did all the work to implement that, instead of repairing their game.

I would imagine the same thing happened over at Bethesda/ZOS that has lead to Crown Crates.

Mandragora wrote: »

But ESO was doing good, listening to players, after those DLCs they were on the way to get more of players. So it wasn't really needed to have boxes? Now every mistake they will make will make everyone angry - nobody will forget them anything.

Well, if there is one hallmark of note in the gaming industry, it is that they are generally bereft of new ideas on how to make and finance games. ESO has one degree of separation from games like TSW and WildStar. Both of them should be viewed as models for ESO's future, for both the Cash Shop and the (predicted) Free To Play transition.

SantieClaws

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

lordrichter wrote: »

Well, if there is one hallmark of note in the gaming industry, it is that they are generally bereft of new ideas on how to make and finance games. ESO has one degree of separation from games like TSW and WildStar. Both of them should be viewed as models for ESO's future, for both the Cash Shop and the (predicted) Free To Play transition.

Khajiit would say also that a free to enter Tamriel would also fit with the desire for more of casual travellers that this one recalls being mentioned.

The thing is though yes you can have as many casual travellers as you wish but without long term residents there will be no one to help them out, answer their questions, get them through the dungeons, provide video guides, create UI addons and all the other things that are greatly beneficial - indeed some would say required - for the long term health of Tamriel.

The con crates have upset many of these long term residents. Be sure you do not empty the jug of milk just to get at the drops in the bottom.

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

Lysette

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

I have downloaded the update - my first time since August that I logged in again. I did not see the crown crates in the store yet - or maybe I was just not able to find them. I would be quite happy, if this would be off the table - it is a bad idea, which I cannot support, that is why I did not play for over a month. So what is the current state of this?

Are crates still happening or is this something what ZOS might rethink and eventually stay away from implementing it?- I would come back to ESO, if these crates would not be implemented - or any other form of gambling for crowns/real money. But with these crates still in the line, I would return to play other games and leave this alone for good.

SantieClaws

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

Lysette wrote: »

I have downloaded the update - my first time since August that I logged in again. I did not see the crown crates in the store yet - or maybe I was just not able to find them. I would be quite happy, if this would be off the table - it is a bad idea, which I cannot support, that is why I did not play for over a month. So what is the current state of this?

Are crates still happening or is this something what ZOS might rethink and eventually stay away from implementing it?- I would come back to ESO, if these crates would not be implemented - or any other form of gambling for crowns/real money. But with these crates still in the line, I would return to play other games and leave this alone for good.

The crates they were removed before the last patch on the PTS this one she thinks.

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

Elsonso

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

SantieClaws wrote: »

The thing is though yes you can have as many casual travellers as you wish but without long term residents there will be no one to help them out, answer their questions, get them through the dungeons, provide video guides, create UI addons and all the other things that are greatly beneficial - indeed some would say required - for the long term health of Tamriel.

The con crates have upset many of these long term residents. Be sure you do not empty the jug of milk just to get at the drops in the bottom.

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

ZOS can address the lack of long term players by making the game easier and making sure that players are provided with exactly what they need to succeed, at least in terms of the development-approved goals of the game. Alternately, they can also make it so that no matter what the players do, they cannot fail. No mentors required. Mentorless.

Acrolas

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

I've been doing some research, and you know, if ZOS kept everything like it was on PTS, with lots of consumables and fairly low drop rates on everything else, they could do it kind of like Overwatch. You don't get anything for the first 50 levels, but you get one crate for every CP you earn. Then if you really want more crates - or you're below level 50 on all characters - you buy them.

Then everybody gets some bonus items just for playing, you get a chance at mounts and costumes in game, ZOS gets a way to sell extra crates, and the seasonal box approach makes more sense because the cap will always be increasing. You just won't get those boxes until your levels past cap are unlocked.

That's the best compromise between rewarding long-term players and getting some microtransactions from new players.

GhostwalkerLD

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

SantieClaws wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Well, if there is one hallmark of note in the gaming industry, it is that they are generally bereft of new ideas on how to make and finance games. ESO has one degree of separation from games like TSW and WildStar. Both of them should be viewed as models for ESO's future, for both the Cash Shop and the (predicted) Free To Play transition.

Khajiit would say also that a free to enter Tamriel would also fit with the desire for more of casual travellers that this one recalls being mentioned.

The thing is though yes you can have as many casual travellers as you wish but without long term residents there will be no one to help them out, answer their questions, get them through the dungeons, provide video guides, create UI addons and all the other things that are greatly beneficial - indeed some would say required - for the long term health of Tamriel.

The con crates have upset many of these long term residents. Be sure you do not empty the jug of milk just to get at the drops in the bottom.

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

Well said, Santie Claws. Perhaps they have heard of the old practice of leaving silver coins in milk to prevent it from spoiling, and would rather just dump out the milk to get at those silver coins and then throw the jug away?

Eiagra

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

So with One Tamriel and the Halloween event taking off, there's a little slowdown on the comments, so I thought it would be a good time to take a quick look at the metrics.

First, we're standing at 450 votes, compared to the first poll's 1407 votes. The initial surge of strong emotions has waned a bit, but that's not a bad thing since it also means more time and thought behind the vote.

Of those 450 votes....

253 (56.2%) have not directly tested them on PTS. This doesn't mean they haven't seen them (youtube videos and prior experience with this concept lends credence to their voice), just that they haven't had the chance to actually try it in person.
188 (41.7%) have tested the crates on PTS.

18 (4%) are in favor of Crown Crates.
78 (17.3%) are neutral.
345 (76.7%) are against Crown Crates.
9 (2%) have feelings outside of this spectrum.

Over three-quarters of those on the forums and aware of the poll have voiced displeasure. Interesting to see.

I'm curious as to developer thoughts on these metrics. I understand that, given the circumstances and resource investments, the developers likely cannot give any positioning as to their thoughts (either as individuals or as a group entity), but that doesn't stop me from being curious.

Either way, I hope the metrics are useful in some way.

Solid_Metal

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

anyone who vote "positive" seriously need to recheck their brain function

jeevin

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

It would be nice to get some sort of input from someone at Zos about the feedback here. Maybe they could explain how it's not just a predatory scam?

Elsonso

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

Solid_Metal wrote: »

anyone who vote "positive" seriously need to recheck their brain function

It is never wise to insult the company's preferred customers.

Korah_Eaglecry

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

jeevin wrote: »

It would be nice to get some sort of input from someone at Zos about the feedback here. Maybe they could explain how it's not just a predatory scam?

They already have. Matt pretty much made it clear he feels we're blowing things out of proportion here and over reacting. Until those things drop in the store hes likely not to change his opinion.

jeevin

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

jeevin wrote: »

It would be nice to get some sort of input from someone at Zos about the feedback here. Maybe they could explain how it's not just a predatory scam?

They already have. Matt pretty much made it clear he feels we're blowing things out of proportion here and over reacting. Until those things drop in the store hes likely not to change his opinion.

He said that it was a "baseless fear" before the Crates went on the PTS for testing. He also said that our fears would be alleviated once we got our hands on them.

Now the data is in and it's very clear just what the Crates are and how much money you may have to spend to get the reward you want.

WhiteCoatSyndrome

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

Lysette wrote: »

I have downloaded the update - my first time since August that I logged in again. I did not see the crown crates in the store yet - or maybe I was just not able to find them. I would be quite happy, if this would be off the table - it is a bad idea, which I cannot support, that is why I did not play for over a month. So what is the current state of this?

Are crates still happening or is this something what ZOS might rethink and eventually stay away from implementing it?- I would come back to ESO, if these crates would not be implemented - or any other form of gambling for crowns/real money. But with these crates still in the line, I would return to play other games and leave this alone for good.

@Lysette Last I heard Crown Crates were scheduled for end of November, so they're not in yet.

GhostwalkerLD

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

jeevin wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

jeevin wrote: »

It would be nice to get some sort of input from someone at Zos about the feedback here. Maybe they could explain how it's not just a predatory scam?

They already have. Matt pretty much made it clear he feels we're blowing things out of proportion here and over reacting. Until those things drop in the store hes likely not to change his opinion.

He said that it was a "baseless fear" before the Crates went on the PTS for testing. He also said that our fears would be alleviated once we got our hands on them.

Now the data is in and it's very clear just what the Crates are and how much money you may have to spend to get the reward you want.

Yep... he basically ignored the overwhelmingly negative feedback in the first Crown Crate thread, and no dev has even given us a response or acknowledgement in this "new" thread either. Frankly, I don't give a toss and I'll continue to voice my displeasure with them. And when they finally do hit the game? Well, I've already unsubbed, but that will be the day I give serious thought to whether or not I will even continue playing at all.

Elsonso

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

jeevin wrote: »

He said that it was a "baseless fear" before the Crates went on the PTS for testing. He also said that our fears would be alleviated once we got our hands on them.

Now the data is in and it's very clear just what the Crates are and how much money you may have to spend to get the reward you want.

Heh. I was less against these things back when they were merely a "baseless fear". My whole perception of them changed the instant I got to play with them on PTS. So, yeah, thanks Matt for rolling these out on PTS so we could all see what sort of shenanigans you were up to.

jeevin

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

lordrichter wrote: »

jeevin wrote: »

He said that it was a "baseless fear" before the Crates went on the PTS for testing. He also said that our fears would be alleviated once we got our hands on them.

Now the data is in and it's very clear just what the Crates are and how much money you may have to spend to get the reward you want.

Heh. I was less against these things back when they were merely a "baseless fear". My whole perception of them changed the instant I got to play with them on PTS. So, yeah, thanks Matt for rolling these out on PTS so we could all see what sort of shenanigans you were up to.

That's the other thing. These "harmless" Crown Crates are actually worse than most expected! Hats off to Matt Firor for showing just what sort of person it takes to manage a game like Eso.

Lysette

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

Well, if ZOS sticks to this kind of abuse, I will just play the whole AC series and give my money to Ubisoft.

Kram8ion

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

It's an unfortunate situation that overwhelming negative responses to crown crates early on that devs "stick to their guns" and do it anyway
Maybe promises were made to someone or something we'll never know
It would take big balls to reverse it
But gain respect of so many

Abeille

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

Lysette wrote: »

Well, if ZOS sticks to this kind of abuse, I will just play the whole AC series and give my money to Ubisoft.

LOL

You know you messed up as a game company when people start to prefer to give their money to Ubisoft instead of to you.

Lysette

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

Abeille wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

Well, if ZOS sticks to this kind of abuse, I will just play the whole AC series and give my money to Ubisoft.

LOL

You know you messed up as a game company when people start to prefer to give their money to Ubisoft instead of to you.

Well, I played Syndicate and Unity (not finished Unity yet), both are great games and I had real fun with it - what I cannot say about ESO, where I did not have fun since end of August anymore. I mean there is a clear vote by the community, to not implement these RNG crates - and ZOS is not stepping back from it, what basically means, they give a damn about us. I do not need to support a company which gives a damn about us and instead insists to implement something what is designed to conceal what an item, someone wants would really cost him (hundreds of dollars each) if he is using these RNG boxes to get it. This is an immoral attempt to drain money out of their customer base and it tells how much they value us - not at all.

Elsonso

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

Kram8ion wrote: »

It's an unfortunate situation that overwhelming negative responses to crown crates early on that devs "stick to their guns" and do it anyway
Maybe promises were made to someone or something we'll never know
It would take big balls to reverse it
But gain respect of so many

They are sticking to their guns simply because the response is pretty much what the expected before they even told us. They know these things are not popular, and they also know that they can be very successful, anyway. They aren't going to let a little thing like people complaining stand between them and the goal.

Lysette

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

lordrichter wrote: »

Kram8ion wrote: »

It's an unfortunate situation that overwhelming negative responses to crown crates early on that devs "stick to their guns" and do it anyway
Maybe promises were made to someone or something we'll never know
It would take big balls to reverse it
But gain respect of so many

They are sticking to their guns simply because the response is pretty much what the expected before they even told us. They know these things are not popular, and they also know that they can be very successful, anyway. They aren't going to let a little thing like people complaining stand between them and the goal.

The sad thing with this is, that they could achieve their goals in a moral way as well, by giving us the missing provinces of Tamriel for example or by adding more RPG elements, things which benefit the experience in the game and make it enjoyable. Instead they do it the casino-way and introduce gamble with real money, well, even worse than a casino, because in a casino you get to know your actual chances - what is not the case with these RNG boxes. It is highly immoral and really disgusting.

RobTheAxe

I read the forums a little bit, and before boxes were announced, a common theme I saw were players saying they had tons of crowns saved up but nothing to spend them on. I think it's a great idea to get people to spend crowns on something that is a bit fun and rewarding

Abeille

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

RobTheAxe wrote: »

I read the forums a little bit, and before boxes were announced, a common theme I saw were players saying they had tons of crowns saved up but nothing to spend them on. I think it's a great idea to get people to spend crowns on something that is a bit fun and rewarding

After testing them on PTS, lots of us came to the conclusion that they're neither fun nor rewarding.

Lysette

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

RobTheAxe wrote: »

I read the forums a little bit, and before boxes were announced, a common theme I saw were players saying they had tons of crowns saved up but nothing to spend them on. I think it's a great idea to get people to spend crowns on something that is a bit fun and rewarding

A bit fun and rewarding?- What you effectively get is consumables, which you would not have bought ofterwise and if you are "lucky" you will most likely get a costume, which you did not buy in the first place, because it wasn't good enough for you. So where is the reward here?- Where is the fun?- It will just be fun for ZOS, when the money floods in from people, who are not clever enough to see through the scam scheme which these boxes are.

Enslaved

Neutral: I have NOT tested the crates, and my feelings are neutral, noncommital, or do not apply.

I am neutral on this one.

I will not gamble for stuff in a MMORPG, that is for sure.
Still, I won't judge ppl that will do so.

I just hope that gambling won't ruin the game.

Elsonso

Negative: I have tested the crates, and I do not want this feature to be implemented in the game.

Enslaved wrote: »

I am neutral on this one.

I will not gamble for stuff in a MMORPG, that is for sure.
Still, I won't judge ppl that will do so.

I just hope that gambling won't ruin the game.

I don't think that the GAMBLING will ruin the game. The mindset that has led to the Crown Crates will fund the game, but at the expense of the game's soul. I guess, given the main quest, this is appropriate.

Eiagra

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

They already have. Matt pretty much made it clear he feels we're blowing things out of proportion here and over reacting. Until those things drop in the store hes likely not to change his opinion.

Matt has been wrong before. Or at least, the direction of the game has been wrong before.

From Polygon article http://www.polygon.com/features/2016/10/14/13285014/elder-scrolls-online-one-tamriel-skyrim-mmo:

But in 2011, four years after work began, studio director Matt Firor and his team started to think they might be on the wrong track. The feedback from internal playtests was mixed. ESO was just OK, and OK wasn’t anywhere close to good enough.

"Basically," Firor told Polygon last month, "the feedback was [already telling us] it’s not the next Elder Scrolls game.’"

I'd say the feedback in 2016 is fairly clear. But hey. You do you, Matt.

Solus

Negative: I have NOT tested the crates, and I dislike the idea/direction and/or I dislike what I have read.

I have seen gambling/RNG boxes implemented into games that are blocked by a pay wall and i have never thought it was a good idea. In the past i have participated, and it was a very disappointing experience for me. I havent personally tested these out, however i have read feedback from people that have. They get 5000 crowns a day to test this feature out. basically what one person said was: (I'm paraphrasing here)

" I do not get anything even close to being worth 400 crowns. Just a bunch of potions and stuff i would not use."

I understand the desire to make more money ZOS, and I'm one of those people that bought every DLC, AND i pay monthly. Just so i outright own everything, and i get the extra perks of being a plus member. So i have paid someone's paycheck myself, personally. I also buy mounts, occasionally an experience scroll pack when I want to grind for CP, among other things.

You dont need this kind of deception, this magic trick kind of trickery, in your game. It would maybe be one thing if im GUARENTEED one yellow item, and one purple, one blue and a handful of normal items with one crate. And it would have to all be things I've yet to unlock. (what i mean is, mounts, skins, colors, ECT. nothing game changing, all cosmetic) If were to just get stuff i either,

A/ wouldnt use

or

B/ already have

It would make it extremely pointless to implement. Sure you'll get the suckers. But do you really want to associate with companies that take advantage of your uninformed, not overly smart and/or impulsive portion of your fan/customer base?

I would hope not, i have more faith in you than that.