PTS Patch Notes - Towers have no doors???

Grunim

Sheezabeast wrote: »

Oh man, that's where I hid when I had to go to the bathroom while in a group

So so true, especially if you enjoy imbibing libations while playing as I and so many others do.

I guess we need a new Alliance War consumable called Porta Chamber. For the low low price of 10,000 AP you erect a tiny structure just large enough for one person to fit inside for 3 minutes and go AFK and do their potty business.

BFT88

yodased wrote: »

BFT88 wrote: »

I'm guilty of tower farming with a Zerg back in the day, @Elong has probably seen me do it and either win or fall flat on my face. However being more solo/small group now, I can count on one hand the amount of times I haven't been able to dodge roll immediately after going through the door.

This seems like a change favored to players like Yodased that need a sprinkling of gitgud on their wheaties in the morning.

LOL again with the b.s. trying to attack the person instead of the issue. I don't even enter towers when there are people there, so you can take that generalization and do not nice things with it.

Have you ever played with me? Seen me play? If not, hush child grown ups are talking.

The only time I've ever seen you play is as a dead body waiting for a Rez.

But let's get real, you've defended this topic throughout this entire thread all the while screaming bloody murder.

Your posts have "I've been farmed relentlessly like a noob in tower farms" written all over them.

And hey look, someone with self esteem issues that calls everyone a child, pokeball, GO!

Edited to remove a particularly inflammatory statement

IxSTALKERxI

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Did nobody play Guild War's 2 before ESO? Does nobody know how to Zerg-Surf or Zerg-Bomb with small-scale groups

A few of the people in this thread are experienced in zerg zerfing and bombing with small-scale groups or are friends with people who are. A lot of people played guild wars 2 as well as other games, infact we've done one better - we've fought zergs in ESO since launch and seen this games balance & meta change over the years.

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Resource farming the door was lame and you should feel bad for defending it. It's about time players actually had to play smart and use tactics and strategy while moving around instead of camping on a damn door lol.

People have used tactics and strategy and still do, but every patch it has become more and more difficult to fight out numbered. I agree farming at a resource door is lame, but so is getting run over by 30 people in the current meta lol.

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Seriously can't wait to see a group of 4-5 destro user's lay waste to large groups with the new destro ulty. So many 1v1 players think its a bad ulty... can't wait to see this in action in AvA combat cause this ulty is just like Guild Wars 2. Add in a couple Arrow Barrage's and Proxies its gonna be good!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TH0d-ofqbfs

I seriously can't wait to see a group of 4-5 destro users try walking into a zerg with their eye of the storm activating and die in 2 seconds before it even starts doing damage LOL. The ability does less damage per second than batswarm, it gives no utility (batswarm can heal or make you invis), it requires a destro staff on one of your bars, it costs 250 ultimate (100 more than batswarm). Sure, it lasts twice as long but if you are going to be dead long before the ultimate is over, unless you run in a group of 24 ofcourse.

Eso ≠ GW2. Only @Xsorus links vids from other games and trys to compare the 2. The balance, mechanics and meta's are completely different despite sharing a couple of aspects such as the ability to use AoE.

timidobserver

My standpoint on tower farming is that their ranking system encourages it. It takes an enormous amount of AP to reach the maximum alliance rank. If you aren't farming you most likely are not going to reach max rank in any kind of reasonable amount of time. As long as the ranking system encourages accruing an enormous amount of AP in order to max it out, I am okay with tower farming. You aren't going to 1v1 your way to max alliance war rank.

Xsorus

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Did nobody play Guild War's 2 before ESO? Does nobody know how to Zerg-Surf or Zerg-Bomb with small-scale groups

A few of the people in this thread are experienced in zerg zerfing and bombing with small-scale groups or are friends with people who are. A lot of people played guild wars 2 as well as other games, infact we've done one better - we've fought zergs in ESO since launch and seen this games balance & meta change over the years.

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Resource farming the door was lame and you should feel bad for defending it. It's about time players actually had to play smart and use tactics and strategy while moving around instead of camping on a damn door lol.

People have used tactics and strategy and still do, but every patch it has become more and more difficult to fight out numbered. I agree farming at a resource door is lame, but so is getting run over by 30 people in the current meta lol.

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Seriously can't wait to see a group of 4-5 destro user's lay waste to large groups with the new destro ulty. So many 1v1 players think its a bad ulty... can't wait to see this in action in AvA combat cause this ulty is just like Guild Wars 2. Add in a couple Arrow Barrage's and Proxies its gonna be good!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TH0d-ofqbfs

I seriously can't wait to see a group of 4-5 destro users try walking into a zerg with their eye of the storm activating and die in 2 seconds before it even starts doing damage LOL. The ability does less damage per second than batswarm, it gives no utility (batswarm can heal or make you invis), it requires a destro staff on one of your bars, it costs 250 ultimate (100 more than batswarm). Sure, it lasts twice as long but if you are going to be dead long before the ultimate is over, unless you run in a group of 24 ofcourse.

Eso ≠ GW2. Only @Xsorus links vids from other games and trys to compare the 2. The balance, mechanics and meta's are completely different despite sharing a couple of aspects such as the ability to use AoE.

Hmm; mechanics are often shared between MMOs and metas can end up similar as well. Hence why aoe caps in ESO resulted in similar issues that GW2 had cause of aoe caps. You can also look at balance in comparison to previous MMOs and what they did if the circumstances are right.

Anyway as for the destro ult vs batswarm; the reason destro ult would be used over batswarm is the massive radius destroy ult as along with the status effects it ca. Apply; so it will probably end up being used at some point unless it's changed before live.

GreenSoup2HoT

@IxSTALKERxI

I seriously can't wait to see a group of 4-5 destro users try walking into a zerg with their eye of the storm activating and die in 2 seconds before it even starts doing damage LOL. The ability does less damage per second than batswarm, it gives no utility (batswarm can heal or make you invis), it requires a destro staff on one of your bars, it costs 250 ultimate (100 more than batswarm). Sure, it lasts twice as long but if you are going to be dead long before the ultimate is over, unless you run in a group of 24 ofcourse.

Ive seen someone with a 7k tooltip on destro ulty. Which is plenty in my opinion. 3.5k per second for 10 seconds in pvp with a giant radius is very good. Add in a negate and your golden. You also would not use Eye of the Storm. You put just place the AoE on a resource when people are capping like in the video i showcased of GW2 from ranged.

Both games are very compare-able though. They both have AoE caps and similar systems and abilitys.

You may be spectical now but i know for a fact some groups will pull it off and you'll be sorry.

IxSTALKERxI

People can already do this with nova. Nova's do the same dps as the new ultimate, can be placed on the ground at the same range, and cost the same ultimate. So, why aren't people already using this tactic of standing back and dropping nova's from range and wiping zergs?

Drdeath20

Chuga_Rei wrote: »

Drdeath20 wrote: »

You can still bottleneck people in the tower but now you actually gotta gitgud. I'm loving this change.

less about that, more about siege coming in.

Sooo its ok for people in the tower to use seige? The hoops people will jump through. Well now it's time to actually use strategy and not cripple yourself to the cancerous tower spamming.

Drdeath20

Darnathian wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

Darnathian wrote: »

manny254 wrote: »

NACtron wrote: »

This change is fantastic. Perhaps this will result in more map control focused gameplay.

Translation: This change Benefits Zerging, and discourages small group play.

i cant believe u are saying that. You always call out broke mechanics. That door delay crap was bs.

shocked u of all people are against this.
you condone killing people as the load in? wow

Except if you actually played with him he usually waits at the top or 2nd floor of the tower if there is siege. There's no door required to get up there. If what causes people problems is the door delay, then you deal with the door delay. You don't mitigate gameplay experience simply because RPer#9546 likes that it takes an acceptable amount of time to get through doors. That's not at all what people are bringing up as an issue, which proves the point that in this thread certain players just don't get it.

oh i get it. the majority of farmers use the bottom floor. and its about farming bads. not hiding from zergs.

and it kills performance.

It was a flawed mechanic that was exploited to death, especially by the zergs.

Armitas

This is so freaking dumb. Did some devs get farmed at a tower or something? Or is this their way of preventing gap closers. How freaking lazy. "we can't fix it so we will remove doors". I would be fired if I did that, shoot I would fire myself and write myself an angry letter.

They should just eliminate all environmental chokes in the game. Then implement a system that sends you verbal affirmations if you are in a group of 40 losing to a small group. And if you die it should take you to a safe space filled with teddy bears that you can cuddle with for 1m.

Drdeath20

Armitas wrote: »

This is so freaking dumb. Did some devs get farmed at a tower or something? Or is this their way of preventing gap closers. How freaking lazy. "we can't fix it so we will remove doors". I would be fired if I did that, shoot I would fire myself and write myself an angry letter.

Gitgud

The-Baconator

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

@IxSTALKERxI

I seriously can't wait to see a group of 4-5 destro users try walking into a zerg with their eye of the storm activating and die in 2 seconds before it even starts doing damage LOL. The ability does less damage per second than batswarm, it gives no utility (batswarm can heal or make you invis), it requires a destro staff on one of your bars, it costs 250 ultimate (100 more than batswarm). Sure, it lasts twice as long but if you are going to be dead long before the ultimate is over, unless you run in a group of 24 ofcourse.

Ive seen someone with a 7k tooltip on destro ulty. Which is plenty in my opinion. 3.5k per second for 10 seconds in pvp with a giant radius is very good. Add in a negate and your golden. You also would not use Eye of the Storm. You put just place the AoE on a resource when people are capping like in the video i showcased of GW2 from ranged.

Both games are very compare-able though. They both have AoE caps and similar systems and abilitys.

You may be spectical now but i know for a fact some groups will pull it off and you'll be sorry.

You don't bomb with a bunch of ranged DoT ults. Meteor is 10x better for ranged bombs and bats is still 10x better on pushes with the health return, cheaper cost, and the same damage. Also the duration may look nice but chances are even if you're alive the full 10 seconds you'll only be hitting a meaningful amount of people for about the first 3-5 seconds before they all blow up to vd or you try to kite. The ult is just bad.

ZOS_DaryaK

We understand this is a controversial topic, but we expect you to keep your posts reasonably civil and constructive, even here, in the Alliance War section of the forums.

GreenSoup2HoT

The-Baconator wrote: »

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

@IxSTALKERxI

I seriously can't wait to see a group of 4-5 destro users try walking into a zerg with their eye of the storm activating and die in 2 seconds before it even starts doing damage LOL. The ability does less damage per second than batswarm, it gives no utility (batswarm can heal or make you invis), it requires a destro staff on one of your bars, it costs 250 ultimate (100 more than batswarm). Sure, it lasts twice as long but if you are going to be dead long before the ultimate is over, unless you run in a group of 24 ofcourse.

Ive seen someone with a 7k tooltip on destro ulty. Which is plenty in my opinion. 3.5k per second for 10 seconds in pvp with a giant radius is very good. Add in a negate and your golden. You also would not use Eye of the Storm. You put just place the AoE on a resource when people are capping like in the video i showcased of GW2 from ranged.

Both games are very compare-able though. They both have AoE caps and similar systems and abilitys.

You may be spectical now but i know for a fact some groups will pull it off and you'll be sorry.

You don't bomb with a bunch of ranged DoT ults. Meteor is 10x better for ranged bombs and bats is still 10x better on pushes with the health return, cheaper cost, and the same damage. Also the duration may look nice but chances are even if you're alive the full 10 seconds you'll only be hitting a meaningful amount of people for about the first 3-5 seconds before they all blow up to vd or you try to kite. The ult is just bad.

You obviously have never played GW2 to know why i have such high hopes for this ultimate. This ultimate has big potenail for ultimate bombing if used correctly and in tandem with AoE stun ultimate's, Vicious Death, Proxi/Inevitable, Bombard, Endless Hail, etc.

It's also worth noting this Ultimate is very good at procing Valkin Skoria which got buffed in Update 12 . This ultimate if you choose the first morph would apply the Burning Status effect to everyone it hits!

This destro ulty can be cast from range and it has twice the radius and duration of Bat Swarm. Imagine 4-5 of these ulty's on an inner keep flag where a huge zerg is. They will get melted very fast trust me. You can throw in a couple meteors, soul tethers, proxies, anything and it will help 100% but i wouldn't underestimate what this ultimate can do!

I thought you would be more open-minded about this ability. If i could think of anyone who would use this ability effectively in a zerg-bombing small-scale scenario it would be you.


I don't want to have an argument over this ability with anyone on these forums, everyone has there own opinion. Let's see how this ultimate pans out, it's still early on and for all we know it could be buffed or changed mechanically BUT i'm very excited for this ultimate. You say you can't bomb with AoE DoT's but thats exactly what you would do in GW2. Just wait and see bro. You'll be surprised what an ultimate with this kind of radius and duration can do!

I'm so hyped for this ability i've considered switching my only character to magicka or finally taking the plunge and creating a second character.

danno8

manny254 wrote: »

BRogueNZ wrote: »

so people hole up in resource towers to get away from zergs.. lmao that's a good one.. next joke plz

So if you are on a resource with a group of 4 and 20 show up. What course of action would you recommend to the group of 4? Fall over and die? Run away while getting gap close spammed? Make a last stand in the tower? Looks like ZoS wants to increase the amount of zerging.

There are certainly stupid people that go into towers with full raids, but towers are generally a last resort to cling to life while getting zerged.

I don't think I've ever seen a 4-man tower farm. Usually there are 10+ all holed up in there, and usually against 10+ attackers. The farmers just don't want to take the chance of dying and having to horsey back, and the door delay gives them the advantage they need.

Manoekin

Darnathian wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

Darnathian wrote: »

manny254 wrote: »

NACtron wrote: »

This change is fantastic. Perhaps this will result in more map control focused gameplay.

Translation: This change Benefits Zerging, and discourages small group play.

i cant believe u are saying that. You always call out broke mechanics. That door delay crap was bs.

shocked u of all people are against this.
you condone killing people as the load in? wow

Except if you actually played with him he usually waits at the top or 2nd floor of the tower if there is siege. There's no door required to get up there. If what causes people problems is the door delay, then you deal with the door delay. You don't mitigate gameplay experience simply because RPer#9546 likes that it takes an acceptable amount of time to get through doors. That's not at all what people are bringing up as an issue, which proves the point that in this thread certain players just don't get it.

oh i get it. the majority of farmers use the bottom floor. and its about farming bads. not hiding from zergs.

and it kills performance.

It's about both because you wouldn't go in the tower in the first place if you didn't need to.The amount of bad players that go into the tower with no organization, no immovable, no pre-negate is not caused by the players inside the tower waiting to kill them. Also, many of these players are the zerg.

And LOL (where's my button) at killing performance. Bro anything you do in this game kills performance. Like, you shouldn't even PvP because it kills performance. Don't go to a resource, don't go to a keep. If you're too good and the other faction has to bring enough people to kill you that it lags the server it is obviously your fault.

Here's a tip if you care about server performance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DGNZnfKYnU

PrinceFabious

I dont think you guys understand! You dont have to flip a resource to get in a tower!!! This prevents zergs from tower farming but not true small scale groups from doing so. Think about it

Ernest145

God_flakes wrote: »

Ernest145 wrote: »

God_flakes wrote: »

Ernest145 wrote: »

God_flakes wrote: »

Ernest145 wrote: »

Towers were fine imo, if you failed to siege it down before the flagged flip then you paid the price for it. If I'm leading a 12-16 man group I don't really try to tower farm since most pugs wont run in unless you have fewer numbers. You make much more ap just kiting around and funneling them. When I'm playing in a group less than 6 then towers are much more needed since if you try kiting you just get ganked/ gap close spammed/ jesus beam spammed/ etc. and don't have enough healers and rapids to keep the group going. Pretty dumb change that just promotes larger numbers and less thoughtful decision making, like there isn't enough of that already.

So what I see you saying here is when you have a group of 6 (highly skilled since you're Earnie right?) you "need" tower farms to make ap?

Lets say a group of 2-6 and you take a resource to find some fights that are away from the zerg v zerg fights, and like a good amount of the time 20+ enemy players come rolling out of the keep. The group needs the tower door to keep them out so they can at least have sometime to regroup. It gave the group a bit of time to get away from the ambush spam/ jesus beams/ snipes/ gankers/ etc and let them get ready to fight again.

If the pugs outside knew how to play they would siege down the tower and we would be forced to jump out and kite them, which is fine but would just end up leading to the small group getting zerged down the way this cancerous snare and root meta is. Inside the tower you have a smaller confined area where you wont be getting sniped or jesus beam spammed from a mile away and you can use the bottom floor to avoid enemy siege. With the way the game is now it is so much more easier for a large pug zerg to chase down smaller numbers, the only viable way of fighting is basically rock humping which is pretty sad.

This isn't even a farming ap issue, it mainly just hurts to small groups who need to take a break from the zergs chasing them to reset the fight. It's not their fault for the enemy players poor decisions to not siege it down and just mindlessly just zerg everything they see. Like good luck to the small mans who try to pull off and get other players to pull off the faction stacks, and get them to actually think about what they should do and punish them if they don't make the right decision.

Again, and I can only surmise this, but it appears the devs don't want you guys capping a resource and squatting on it. Apparently, they don't want you to go in the tower and "regroup". They want you to cap it and move on. I guess they weighed the benefits and found the annoyance of constant out of control tower farming (and all 3 factions do it) to be not worth it anymore. It will be interesting to see how it pans out. But I won't miss the annoying groups of 12+ who cap resources and set up inside the tower and gobble up ones and twos at a time. If you think this is skilled gameplay you're delusional, my friend.

Nobody said it takes skill tower farm. Tell me though why should this benefit the bad players who don't siege the tower down before it flips? You do realize how easy it is to bust a tower farm lol? like immovable pot and get a negate, problem solved..

A few skillful players can easily end a tower farm or at least make time for other pugs to get in and help, but no zos just caters to bad players who don't want to pay the consequences for their bad decisions. ZOS has there reasons for this change, I don't agree with them and think it only favors larger numbers even more but oh well.

Yes, I do realize. Yes, I have broken them from within groups that know what they're doing. My best friend in game @RinaldoGandolphi runs negate for miles and loves to break up farms and fights in towers. And yes, I've been inside setting up ballista aimed at the door. But let's face it, along with many other things in pvp this gameplay had become stale, predictable and boring. It's time for a change. I mean are tower farmers even making that much ap anymore doing them?

As I said before its not an ap issue, any good player doesn't need a tower to make ap and will still farm bads regardless. Most tower farms aren't even that successful anymore you use the tower when you are being zerged down and need a break to survive, mostly when small scaling. When you take a resource and a zerg of enemy players come after you and you are barely alive trying to make it into the tower is when these changes will really hurt, not when you want ap.

timidobserver

ZOS_DaryaK wrote: »

We understand this is a controversial topic, but we expect you to keep your posts reasonably civil and constructive, even here, in the Alliance War section of the forums.

Having such an unlikely expectation is setting yourself up for disappointment.

God_flakes

Ernest145 wrote: »

God_flakes wrote: »

Ernest145 wrote: »

God_flakes wrote: »

Ernest145 wrote: »

God_flakes wrote: »

Ernest145 wrote: »

Towers were fine imo, if you failed to siege it down before the flagged flip then you paid the price for it. If I'm leading a 12-16 man group I don't really try to tower farm since most pugs wont run in unless you have fewer numbers. You make much more ap just kiting around and funneling them. When I'm playing in a group less than 6 then towers are much more needed since if you try kiting you just get ganked/ gap close spammed/ jesus beam spammed/ etc. and don't have enough healers and rapids to keep the group going. Pretty dumb change that just promotes larger numbers and less thoughtful decision making, like there isn't enough of that already.

So what I see you saying here is when you have a group of 6 (highly skilled since you're Earnie right?) you "need" tower farms to make ap?

Lets say a group of 2-6 and you take a resource to find some fights that are away from the zerg v zerg fights, and like a good amount of the time 20+ enemy players come rolling out of the keep. The group needs the tower door to keep them out so they can at least have sometime to regroup. It gave the group a bit of time to get away from the ambush spam/ jesus beams/ snipes/ gankers/ etc and let them get ready to fight again.

If the pugs outside knew how to play they would siege down the tower and we would be forced to jump out and kite them, which is fine but would just end up leading to the small group getting zerged down the way this cancerous snare and root meta is. Inside the tower you have a smaller confined area where you wont be getting sniped or jesus beam spammed from a mile away and you can use the bottom floor to avoid enemy siege. With the way the game is now it is so much more easier for a large pug zerg to chase down smaller numbers, the only viable way of fighting is basically rock humping which is pretty sad.

This isn't even a farming ap issue, it mainly just hurts to small groups who need to take a break from the zergs chasing them to reset the fight. It's not their fault for the enemy players poor decisions to not siege it down and just mindlessly just zerg everything they see. Like good luck to the small mans who try to pull off and get other players to pull off the faction stacks, and get them to actually think about what they should do and punish them if they don't make the right decision.

Again, and I can only surmise this, but it appears the devs don't want you guys capping a resource and squatting on it. Apparently, they don't want you to go in the tower and "regroup". They want you to cap it and move on. I guess they weighed the benefits and found the annoyance of constant out of control tower farming (and all 3 factions do it) to be not worth it anymore. It will be interesting to see how it pans out. But I won't miss the annoying groups of 12+ who cap resources and set up inside the tower and gobble up ones and twos at a time. If you think this is skilled gameplay you're delusional, my friend.

Nobody said it takes skill tower farm. Tell me though why should this benefit the bad players who don't siege the tower down before it flips? You do realize how easy it is to bust a tower farm lol? like immovable pot and get a negate, problem solved..

A few skillful players can easily end a tower farm or at least make time for other pugs to get in and help, but no zos just caters to bad players who don't want to pay the consequences for their bad decisions. ZOS has there reasons for this change, I don't agree with them and think it only favors larger numbers even more but oh well.

Yes, I do realize. Yes, I have broken them from within groups that know what they're doing. My best friend in game @RinaldoGandolphi runs negate for miles and loves to break up farms and fights in towers. And yes, I've been inside setting up ballista aimed at the door. But let's face it, along with many other things in pvp this gameplay had become stale, predictable and boring. It's time for a change. I mean are tower farmers even making that much ap anymore doing them?

As I said before its not an ap issue, any good player doesn't need a tower to make ap and will still farm bads regardless. Most tower farms aren't even that successful anymore you use the tower when you are being zerged down and need a break to survive, mostly when small scaling. When you take a resource and a zerg of enemy players come after you and you are barely alive trying to make it into the tower is when these changes will really hurt, not when you want ap.

Trust me I do see your point. I guess they want us to use the terrain more? Idk. :-/

Darnathian

Manoekin wrote: »

Darnathian wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

Darnathian wrote: »

manny254 wrote: »

NACtron wrote: »

This change is fantastic. Perhaps this will result in more map control focused gameplay.

Translation: This change Benefits Zerging, and discourages small group play.

i cant believe u are saying that. You always call out broke mechanics. That door delay crap was bs.

shocked u of all people are against this.
you condone killing people as the load in? wow

Except if you actually played with him he usually waits at the top or 2nd floor of the tower if there is siege. There's no door required to get up there. If what causes people problems is the door delay, then you deal with the door delay. You don't mitigate gameplay experience simply because RPer#9546 likes that it takes an acceptable amount of time to get through doors. That's not at all what people are bringing up as an issue, which proves the point that in this thread certain players just don't get it.

oh i get it. the majority of farmers use the bottom floor. and its about farming bads. not hiding from zergs.

and it kills performance.

It's about both because you wouldn't go in the tower in the first place if you didn't need to.The amount of bad players that go into the tower with no organization, no immovable, no pre-negate is not caused by the players inside the tower waiting to kill them. Also, many of these players are the zerg.

And LOL (where's my button) at killing performance. Bro anything you do in this game kills performance. Like, you shouldn't even PvP because it kills performance. Don't go to a resource, don't go to a keep. If you're too good and the other faction has to bring enough people to kill you that it lags the server it is obviously your fault.

Here's a tip if you care about server performance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DGNZnfKYnU

First off... lol for that last part.

I agree everything kills performance. but farming is second only to last keep dethrone.

WuffyCerulei

Gotta love how people complain that meerly removing doors on resource towers is "the death of small group pvp," when they literally would only farm AP off by proxy-detting and burning down poor noobs and pugs who don't know that they shouldn't feed the farm. Wanna really do pvp? Take keeps, resources to take keeps, scrolls, etc. There's a million and one things you can do to get AP other than farm.

Xsorus

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

People can already do this with nova. Nova's do the same dps as the new ultimate, can be placed on the ground at the same range, and cost the same ultimate. So, why aren't people already using this tactic of standing back and dropping nova's from range and wiping zergs?

Because Nova isn't 10m Radius and doesn't move with you.

Ernest145

wolfninja101b14_ESO wrote: »

Gotta love how people complain that meerly removing doors on resource towers is "the death of small group pvp," when they literally would only farm AP off by proxy-detting and burning down poor noobs and pugs who don't know that they shouldn't feed the farm. Wanna really do pvp? Take keeps, resources to take keeps, scrolls, etc. There's a million and one things you can do to get AP other than farm.

I don't remember anyone saying its the death of small scaling lol... its just another change out of many that has hurt it. Have you ever tried taking an objective as a small group? You will be met with overwhelming numbers and pugs sieging you even though they outnumber you. Like really even if you are in a 2-4 person group, you take a resource and go by the keep and there is already 5 siege up hitting you. I'm not saying small numbers should be able to take main objectives, what they excel at is distracting larger numbers and pulling them off of other objectives. With this change it reduces their effectiveness.

Jaronking

This I'd just another change to hurt small scale PVp I remember doing the live stream Friday a dude asked @ZOS_BrianWheeler any chance to bring dynamic ultimate Regan back because he play solo and small group and it will help even the odds and he really liked the old system.He response was no because it was broken while true his next comment truly showed me that they don't care about solo or small groups he stated the reason why we won't add another system like that basically came down to that when we had the system it allowed more hardcore players take on more casual players and win.Its just gets more and more dont bring your small group to PVp we don't want you here.

Jules

This change is honestly just a slap in the face to small scale. Not only do I get zerged down in the tower constantly from 20+ people arriving to take back the resource, now I can't even have a moment to regroup inside the tower while they flip the flag. It's gonna be so great to be gap closed to death and not even make it up the stairs. It's going to be so great to not even have time to set up oils or any kind of defense against larger numbers.


One of the worst decisions of Update 12.

Hempyre

@yodased

Naw son, that doesn't make me sad.

There's nothing inherently wrong with tower farms, or doors on towers. It's just part of how the players are using the game mechanics.

This isn't something we need zos to fix. Don't want to be farmed? Don't go in the tower. Pretty simple really.

The towers also allow a bit of safety for the defending faction, as well they should being their purpose as -wait for it- a "tower"

Removing the doors removes the defensive capabilities, making the structure nothing more than eye candy.

Where the problem lies is with the flag. Players take the flag rather than break the tower, this is not smart, however it is their perogative to do.

Want to break the farm? Don't take the flag and siege the tower.

Simple.

jhharvest

Hempyre wrote: »

Where the problem lies is with the flag. Players take the flag rather than break the tower, this is not smart, however it is their perogative to do.

Want to break the farm? Don't take the flag and siege the tower.

Simple.

No, not simple. Trying to tell that to pugs and tourists is like herding cats. And at the same time you can't just leave the enemies in the tower, because you can be sure they'll start pinging the keep wall as soon as you walk away.

I don't think removing the door was the only option. Other possible solutions would have been:
-make towers (even friendly ones) siegeable
-players higher thank rank X can deconstruct owned structures
-ladders or other siege engines

All of these had potential exploits though. No doors on towers is a fairly exploit free solution.

Drdeath20

Ernest145 wrote: »

wolfninja101b14_ESO wrote: »

Gotta love how people complain that meerly removing doors on resource towers is "the death of small group pvp," when they literally would only farm AP off by proxy-detting and burning down poor noobs and pugs who don't know that they shouldn't feed the farm. Wanna really do pvp? Take keeps, resources to take keeps, scrolls, etc. There's a million and one things you can do to get AP other than farm.

I don't remember anyone saying its the death of small scaling lol... its just another change out of many that has hurt it. Have you ever tried taking an objective as a small group? You will be met with overwhelming numbers and pugs sieging you even though they outnumber you. Like really even if you are in a 2-4 person group, you take a resource and go by the keep and there is already 5 siege up hitting you. I'm not saying small numbers should be able to take main objectives, what they excel at is distracting larger numbers and pulling them off of other objectives. With this change it reduces their effectiveness.

It was an exploit that favored zerging. Small groups of 4-6 people last what, maybe 1 minute, vs a group of 30 zerging the tower. Small groups are better off going into the tower just to go off 2nd floor and get away.

People keep saying it's a way to escape seige but tower farmers still used seige inside the tower. It's OK for them to use it and the door delay, and the immunity from all range attacks, and the bottleneck but not ok for people to use seige back. Besides I'd rather a guy on seige. They can be ganked.

Darnathian

Lol. all the ap farmers in here claiming they do otherwise.