Rohamad_Ali wrote: »Some good ideas being posted now to deal with this . The limited time exclusive to lockbox then crown store later deal is better then nothing . The idea of keeping exclusive items out of RNG boxes is best idea if we have to have these . Hope ZOS_MattFiror ZOS_GinaBruno and ZOS_JessicaFolsom are reading those posts from MAdkat124b14_ESO and others like MissBizz put in her good video .
Yeah I think putting items up for sale after a chance of them in the grab bag wouldn't be too bad. That was people can still choose to buy an item and make an informed decision on what exactly they are purchasing. Link to my video if anyone was wondering.
Nice video and I quite like your real life personality as well - I agree to pretty much all you said in the video - especially on the spending part, I am a lot like you - I buy stuff I like, if I consider it worth it, but I want to know what I buy and not gamble for it. But in addition to what you said, I do not want gambling at all in this game - this will just lead to ZOS focussing on developing items for the RNG boxes instead to focus on developing the actual game - but otherwise I agree with your video statements.
It is so frustrating - the awesomeness of One Tamriel, the redesign of Craglorn and such, all good features which would make me be such a happy subscriber - if it would not be about those boxes - they really ruin this game for me and I am so disappointed, that ZOS is going down this route. I might not even be interested to buy a TES game ever again, to not be reminded of this - it would just ruin my mood.
Hand_Bacon wrote: »I didn't put you in any of those categories, did you put yourself in one and then feel threatened for doing so?
Well that was not my intention, apologies for not being clear. The bubble wrap people are those who unlike you can't be bothered to look out for people, they'd rather make everything completely and impossibly safe (bubblewrap).Rohamad_Ali wrote: »Well you kind of did lol .
Rohamad_Ali wrote: »Some good ideas being posted now to deal with this . The limited time exclusive to lockbox then crown store later deal is better then nothing . The idea of keeping exclusive items out of RNG boxes is best idea if we have to have these . Hope ZOS_MattFiror ZOS_GinaBruno and ZOS_JessicaFolsom are reading those posts from MAdkat124b14_ESO and others like MissBizz put in her good video .
Yeah I think putting items up for sale after a chance of them in the grab bag wouldn't be too bad. That was people can still choose to buy an item and make an informed decision on what exactly they are purchasing. Link to my video if anyone was wondering.
Nice video and I quite like your real life personality as well - I agree to pretty much all you said in the video - especially on the spending part, I am a lot like you - I buy stuff I like, if I consider it worth it, but I want to know what I buy and not gamble for it. But in addition to what you said, I do not want gambling at all in this game - this will just lead to ZOS focussing on developing items for the RNG boxes instead to focus on developing the actual game - but otherwise I agree with your video statements.
It is so frustrating - the awesomeness of One Tamriel, the redesign of Craglorn and such, all good features which would make me be such a happy subscriber - if it would not be about those boxes - they really ruin this game for me and I am so disappointed, that ZOS is going down this route. I might not even be interested to buy a TES game ever again, to not be reminded of this - it would just ruin my mood.
It is frustrating. I was/am very excited for what One Tamriel can do for the PvE community, even though I don't PvP I really think it's great they are offering people an option to duel where others cannot interfere, and a ton of other changes we have coming.
I don't like the lottery boxes at all either. At all. I guess I'm just a bit of a pushover and really believe this has likely been in the pipeline for a long time, and it's too late to stop it. As far as we know, there is no monetized update coming in Q4, so this appears to be their main monetization route for the quarter. At this point I'm just grasping at straws hoping that they will make these RNG boxes more sensible than what appears to be their current plan. (I say appears because unfortunately there are still a lot of unknowns about these boxes)
Hand_Bacon wrote: »Well that was not my intention, apologies for not being clear. The bubble wrap people are those who unlike you can't be bothered to look out for people, they'd rather make everything completely and impossibly safe (bubblewrap).Rohamad_Ali wrote: »Well you kind of did lol .
I might buy one of these just to see what I would get. However, after experiencing the lockboxes in the game we get for armors (like the ones you can buy from NPC Merchants) and not getting what I needed due to RNG, I can't see me being a customer of lockboxes purchased with my own money.
Simple reason, I like to know what I am buying before I buy it.
I might buy one of these just to see what I would get. However, after experiencing the lockboxes in the game we get for armors (like the ones you can buy from NPC Merchants) and not getting what I needed due to RNG, I can't see me being a customer of lockboxes purchased with my own money.
Simple reason, I like to know what I am buying before I buy it.
You actually have a legal right to know exactly what you are paying your money for, the 'grey' area with these RNG box systems is your not directly paying cash for them. that is one of the main things people dont understand.
If you directly paid cash for them you would be covered by consumer rights laws and they would also have to be covered by gambling laws and licences.
I might buy one of these just to see what I would get. However, after experiencing the lockboxes in the game we get for armors (like the ones you can buy from NPC Merchants) and not getting what I needed due to RNG, I can't see me being a customer of lockboxes purchased with my own money.
Simple reason, I like to know what I am buying before I buy it.
You actually have a legal right to know exactly what you are paying your money for, the 'grey' area with these RNG box systems is your not directly paying cash for them. that is one of the main things people dont understand.
If you directly paid cash for them you would be covered by consumer rights laws and they would also have to be covered by gambling laws and licences.
Yes, but this is just as long like this as people do not protest about this and get vocal about the issue - this can be changed to the better and we can weed out these abusive practices. But it will not happen, if we just take it like it is and take for granted, that it cannot be changed - it can, like so many other things in history, which I cannot name, because then my post will again be removed for bringing real life politics into the debate - like it happened to me in this thread already.
You actually have a legal right to know exactly what you are paying your money for, the 'grey' area with these RNG box systems is your not directly paying cash for them. that is one of the main things people dont understand.
If you directly paid cash for them you would be covered by consumer rights laws and they would also have to be covered by gambling laws and licences.
Hand_Bacon wrote: »You actually have a legal right to know exactly what you are paying your money for, the 'grey' area with these RNG box systems is your not directly paying cash for them. that is one of the main things people dont understand.
If you directly paid cash for them you would be covered by consumer rights laws and they would also have to be covered by gambling laws and licences.
Are you sure? Even if you directly paid cash for them. Look at the previously mentioned card game packs, the physical ones, nobody knows what they are going to get for sure. That has been the case before with things like baseball cards and the like. I think there is a long history of this being played out legally.
The legal problem would be if they promised there was a certain prize of a certain value in at least one of the boxes, giving the chance, but not actually giving that chance. That is not the case here.
Not exactly you pay for a pack of x amount of cards, you receive x amount of cards, contract complete... law ends.
Hand_Bacon wrote: »You actually have a legal right to know exactly what you are paying your money for, the 'grey' area with these RNG box systems is your not directly paying cash for them. that is one of the main things people dont understand.
If you directly paid cash for them you would be covered by consumer rights laws and they would also have to be covered by gambling laws and licences.
Are you sure? Even if you directly paid cash for them. Look at the previously mentioned card game packs, the physical ones, nobody knows what they are going to get for sure. That has been the case before with things like baseball cards and the like. I think there is a long history of this being played out legally.
The legal problem would be if they promised there was a certain prize of a certain value in at least one of the boxes, giving the chance, but not actually giving that chance. That is not the case here.
Not exactly you pay for a pack of x amount of cards, you receive x amount of cards, contract complete... law ends.
Hand_Bacon wrote: »Not exactly you pay for a pack of x amount of cards, you receive x amount of cards, contract complete... law ends.
I think that's where people are getting tripped up a little. You aren't purchasing a chance of loot, you are purchasing loot. Just like the cards, you don't know what loot is inside, but there is loot. Contract still complete regardless of what the buyer is hoping to get out of the crate.
Hand_Bacon wrote: »Not exactly you pay for a pack of x amount of cards, you receive x amount of cards, contract complete... law ends.
I think that's where people are getting tripped up a little. You aren't purchasing a chance of loot, you are purchasing loot. Just like the cards, you don't know what loot is inside, but there is loot. Contract still complete regardless of what the buyer is hoping to get out of the crate.
jedtb16_ESO wrote: »Hand_Bacon wrote: »Not exactly you pay for a pack of x amount of cards, you receive x amount of cards, contract complete... law ends.
I think that's where people are getting tripped up a little. You aren't purchasing a chance of loot, you are purchasing loot. Just like the cards, you don't know what loot is inside, but there is loot. Contract still complete regardless of what the buyer is hoping to get out of the crate.
exactly...... kinder eggs anyone?
I get really indecisive when I see law debates here because, as a lawyer, I do want to participate on it. But, because I know the law is different everywhere, I also know that it doesn't matter much if I participate on it lol
Note: Although there are no ZOS servers here in Brazil, for any company to offer their services here, they must follow our law. Since there are Brazilian costumers, I decided to weight in.
I don't think that, here, this would be considered gambling - which is forbidden, lotteries being a monopoly of the government and any other kind of raffle needing to be authorized first - for two reasons:
1 - Crowns wouldn't be considered legitimate currency, but something that you buy within a game for legitimate currency - and you always get the exact number of Crowns you paid for.
2 - The definition of a gambling game in my country's Criminal Law is "A game on which winning or losing depend exclusively or mainly on luck". When you open a box, you won't find an empty box. Ever. Therefore, I doubt any judge will consider "losing" if you only get consumables. I don't think they would even consider opening the box "a game"; more like buying consumables and having a chance of getting something extra - and this is allowed.
jedtb16_ESO wrote: »Hand_Bacon wrote: »Not exactly you pay for a pack of x amount of cards, you receive x amount of cards, contract complete... law ends.
I think that's where people are getting tripped up a little. You aren't purchasing a chance of loot, you are purchasing loot. Just like the cards, you don't know what loot is inside, but there is loot. Contract still complete regardless of what the buyer is hoping to get out of the crate.
exactly...... kinder eggs anyone?
Kinder Egg never started as just chocolate then charged people for a "chance" of getting chocolate xD
jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »Hand_Bacon wrote: »Not exactly you pay for a pack of x amount of cards, you receive x amount of cards, contract complete... law ends.
I think that's where people are getting tripped up a little. You aren't purchasing a chance of loot, you are purchasing loot. Just like the cards, you don't know what loot is inside, but there is loot. Contract still complete regardless of what the buyer is hoping to get out of the crate.
exactly...... kinder eggs anyone?
Kinder Egg never started as just chocolate then charged people for a "chance" of getting chocolate xD
i used to give my kids a little bit of money so they could buy a couple kinder eggs each. they weren't that interested in the chocolate - just the toys inside. they had a collection of them.... always excited to open them because they never new what they would get....
jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »Hand_Bacon wrote: »Not exactly you pay for a pack of x amount of cards, you receive x amount of cards, contract complete... law ends.
I think that's where people are getting tripped up a little. You aren't purchasing a chance of loot, you are purchasing loot. Just like the cards, you don't know what loot is inside, but there is loot. Contract still complete regardless of what the buyer is hoping to get out of the crate.
exactly...... kinder eggs anyone?
Kinder Egg never started as just chocolate then charged people for a "chance" of getting chocolate xD
i used to give my kids a little bit of money so they could buy a couple kinder eggs each. they weren't that interested in the chocolate - just the toys inside. they had a collection of them.... always excited to open them because they never new what they would get....
jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »Hand_Bacon wrote: »Not exactly you pay for a pack of x amount of cards, you receive x amount of cards, contract complete... law ends.
I think that's where people are getting tripped up a little. You aren't purchasing a chance of loot, you are purchasing loot. Just like the cards, you don't know what loot is inside, but there is loot. Contract still complete regardless of what the buyer is hoping to get out of the crate.
exactly...... kinder eggs anyone?
Kinder Egg never started as just chocolate then charged people for a "chance" of getting chocolate xD
i used to give my kids a little bit of money so they could buy a couple kinder eggs each. they weren't that interested in the chocolate - just the toys inside. they had a collection of them.... always excited to open them because they never new what they would get....
My point was that they were always that way.
jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »Hand_Bacon wrote: »Not exactly you pay for a pack of x amount of cards, you receive x amount of cards, contract complete... law ends.
I think that's where people are getting tripped up a little. You aren't purchasing a chance of loot, you are purchasing loot. Just like the cards, you don't know what loot is inside, but there is loot. Contract still complete regardless of what the buyer is hoping to get out of the crate.
exactly...... kinder eggs anyone?
Kinder Egg never started as just chocolate then charged people for a "chance" of getting chocolate xD
i used to give my kids a little bit of money so they could buy a couple kinder eggs each. they weren't that interested in the chocolate - just the toys inside. they had a collection of them.... always excited to open them because they never new what they would get....
How often did they want a specific toy? How many eggs did they have to buy to get the specific toy?
jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »Hand_Bacon wrote: »Not exactly you pay for a pack of x amount of cards, you receive x amount of cards, contract complete... law ends.
I think that's where people are getting tripped up a little. You aren't purchasing a chance of loot, you are purchasing loot. Just like the cards, you don't know what loot is inside, but there is loot. Contract still complete regardless of what the buyer is hoping to get out of the crate.
exactly...... kinder eggs anyone?
Kinder Egg never started as just chocolate then charged people for a "chance" of getting chocolate xD
i used to give my kids a little bit of money so they could buy a couple kinder eggs each. they weren't that interested in the chocolate - just the toys inside. they had a collection of them.... always excited to open them because they never new what they would get....