if you didnt know why ZOS is nerfing COA, WGT and ICP

Mojmir

i still haven't even tried the ic dungeons,would love to,but all I ever see is ppl looking for "exp".well,how do you get experienced if you don't run it.lol

Brrrofski

I disagree with city of Ash.

It's super easy, even on gold pledge.

Did it the other day with two people who have never done it before and I'd only done it once om vet.

The there two are more difficult. Probably a bit too much for PUGs.

dotlife

It's the casuals! "resistance is futile".

Shunravi

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

. If you can't have a good run without encyclopedic knowledge of the mechanics it's poor design.

Wait you need encyclopedic knowledge of how it works for a good run? I should apologise to my team....







And yea, the rng is terribad.

Not knowing that you have to stack on this, of kill the boss before he starts hulk smashing the ground and don't stop, roll dodge this but only after a few seconds other wise the meteor will still follow you and let's not forget hey after X time/health he calls so many adds.

If you have to know that much details then how do you have fun that a damn job. Think about all the you must do this at this point that a player that lives in Cyrodiil don't know cause they never do this stuff.

I have the benefit you great gear and powers what do PvE noobs have. Frustration and random number generator.

'Dont stand in stupid' and 'do good dps' tend to cover that. Good gear is rediculously easy to get through crafting. May not be bis, but it's more than adequate.

Magdalina

Mojmir wrote: »

i still haven't even tried the ic dungeons,would love to,but all I ever see is ppl looking for "exp".well,how do you get experienced if you don't run it.lol

By running with friends and guildies, if nothing else

I have specifically been looking for pugs to do vWGT and ICP with at some point, just for fun. You'd be surprised how few people answered though:/

hamgatan

Magdalina wrote: »

Mojmir wrote: »

i still haven't even tried the ic dungeons,would love to,but all I ever see is ppl looking for "exp".well,how do you get experienced if you don't run it.lol

By running with friends and guildies, if nothing else

I have specifically been looking for pugs to do vWGT and ICP with at some point, just for fun. You'd be surprised how few people answered though:/

heh thats because you do stupidly insane DPS (60-70k) on Volha.. :x

you could run with 3 PUGs and still smash vICP :x

Magdalina

hamgatan wrote: »

Magdalina wrote: »

Mojmir wrote: »

i still haven't even tried the ic dungeons,would love to,but all I ever see is ppl looking for "exp".well,how do you get experienced if you don't run it.lol

By running with friends and guildies, if nothing else

I have specifically been looking for pugs to do vWGT and ICP with at some point, just for fun. You'd be surprised how few people answered though:/

heh thats because you do stupidly insane DPS (60-70k) on Volha.. :x

you could run with 3 PUGs and still smash vICP :x

Lol! XD My dps is actually very mediocre, she does like 15k without Overload, ~30k with it. I'm mainly healing on her lately and still occasionally pulling like 25k dps while healing though. That is fun

Seriously though, I am not a bad player and I don't mind teaching unexperienced people, I think it can be fun. It upsets me that instead of being encourage to teach and learn they're just continuously nerfing everything.

Shunravi

Magdalina wrote: »

hamgatan wrote: »

Magdalina wrote: »

Mojmir wrote: »

i still haven't even tried the ic dungeons,would love to,but all I ever see is ppl looking for "exp".well,how do you get experienced if you don't run it.lol

By running with friends and guildies, if nothing else

I have specifically been looking for pugs to do vWGT and ICP with at some point, just for fun. You'd be surprised how few people answered though:/

heh thats because you do stupidly insane DPS (60-70k) on Volha.. :x

you could run with 3 PUGs and still smash vICP :x

Lol! XD My dps is actually very mediocre, she does like 15k without Overload, ~30k with it. I'm mainly healing on her lately and still occasionally pulling like 25k dps while healing though. That is fun

Seriously though, I am not a bad player and I don't mind teaching unexperienced people, I think it can be fun. It upsets me that instead of being encourage to teach and learn they're just continuously nerfing everything.

Imo this has been a discouragement for many genuinely helpful and nice players.


That and constantly being attacked for attempting to be helpful.

bloodenragedb14_ESO

to be honest, i think its a good move socially, the amount of hatred people have for players that do not conform to their idea of the perfect build devalue's the community, ive been guilty of this a few times myself and i never feel good afterward for sinking to that level.

the people hurt by this are the people who want a challenge, and leet's. and to be wholly honest, i really wont be sad to see those people in a tizzy.

lathbury

where have they said they are nerfing them?

Flameheart

Wait, Zenimax will nerf those three instances again ? They already did that once for WGT and twice for ICP (if you count the new mechanic - which makes the second boss even easier - as an extra) now. Difficulty lvl is already pretty easy.

Somebody above mentioned that evading mechanics because of superior dps is an issue in this game...maybe, but my experience in this game shows me, that especially achieving enough dps seems to be a major issue for a lot of players. People who are able to deliver good dps usually won't have a hard time to beat mechanics either, but people who lack the ability to achieve sufficient dps scores usually lack much more knowledge about game mechanics and/or even manual agility.

On topic, those instances are the only vet dungeons that let me log in and play as a PvEer right now, maybe add the Maw to that...

Totalitarian

Waseem wrote: »

these dungeons are easy mode for elites already, and ultra hard for normal players and/or casuals

During the last vCOA pledge, I put in zone chat that I was looking for a group.

Some person invited me. I thought I recognized them, and I figured it was because I had done a pledge with them before.

I tp into vCOA, and see that he has the 'Flawless Conqueror' title. I say nothing.

I look around, and see the other player in the dungeon, and he has the same title.

I said that I was surprised with 2 Flawless Conquerors in the group.

They said that there were actually 3 of them.


About 20 minutes later, we're at Valkyn Skoria and finally someone dies: me. I cry internally as I just ruined the no-death run achievement for myself. I get cheered up by the perfect helm drop I get though .

I've been told I'm a good healer. But I couldn't keep up with those three at all. I was lagging behind, trying to catch up to them as they soloed groups of mobs, and the bosses went down just as quickly as the mobs.

We finish vCOA with 1 death, 2 perfect helm drops, 3 Flawless Conquerers, and 0 idea on how I got matched up with a group that was that strong just by pugging in zone chat.

After the group ends, I thought about where I saw one of the members. I look in the leaderboards and see him in the vMA leaderboards. I also see one of the other group members. Then I looked again the other day, and one of them was on the vMOL leaderboard.


That was my second time beating vCOA, and most of my other attempts were pain-filled, 2+ hour attempts. Then I go with some group who invited me because they 'needed' a healer, and it was the cleanest dungeon I've ever run, and 95% of my time was spent running to catch up, or heavy attacking in awe as a boss gets completely rekt.


I can confirm that vCOA is easy mode for elites. And it is difficult for normal players.

rokrdt05

Is this all speculation? Where did they post they were nerfing these dungeons?

code65536

rokrdt05 wrote: »

Is this all speculation? Where did they post they were nerfing these dungeons?

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2894042#Comment_2894042

DRXHarbinger

Vangy wrote: »

Lamthalas wrote: »

Talyena wrote: »

How about a solution to make everyone happy? Tone down the vet versions, but add a trigger at the beginning that bumps the difficulty back to where it is now but increases the drop rate. Those who can't do it now have a better chance at completion and their gold key, and those who can have a better drop rate. Everyone wins.

They already did. Just click on non-vet for easy mode, vet for hard mode.

Vet mode drops v16 and normal drops v15 yes? It isnt just about drop rates but gear level now I think. Really no point in getting a v15 kena helm -_-"

You can't get a Kena helm on non vet. Myth it doesn't happen.

WolfingHour

ESOTU: Skyrim with friends.

Congratz, fellow players. You did it.

lathbury

in that comment he says icp and wgt and vet coa so maybe its the normal modes of icp and tower as he only states vet for coa

lathbury

Mojmir wrote: »

i still haven't even tried the ic dungeons,would love to,but all I ever see is ppl looking for "exp".well,how do you get experienced if you don't run it.lol

what server/platform you on i would take you through prison as im still farming it and dont mind showing people the ropes

susmitds

Waseem wrote: »

Destyran wrote: »

You can already 3dps and 1 tank them man they are easy enough. If anything they meed to leave it and make gear drops more common because i feel of they merf it the gear will become a crazy grinds

they are easy enough for you and me, but what about the others?
have you tried to do them with random people for pledges in Deshaan?
you could join a group who cant kill first boss.. or if so... stay for 2 hours before finishing 2nd boss.
everyone no matter grouped with who shall be able to finish all the dungeons. the difference should be the time only. 20 mins or 2 hours.. players we dont know will feel better if they finish vICP after 2 hours instead disbanding group after their heavy effort.
and remember, it'll still not a walk in the park...

Tanked VCoA with med armor with 18k HP. With almost any v12+ random group, it becomes a breeze.

MidnightBlue

I'm the complete opposite of elite and still able to complete these dungeons with non-elite players fine.

Destyran

hamgatan wrote: »

Destyran wrote: »

I am not elite i am Australian i can never be good enough to play with the real elites because of my ping rate gives me slightly less dps than them. Same in pvp i go ok in pvp but the constant disconnects and lag and inability to bar swap makes it almost no fun when some one gan dodge roll and hit me with two bow abilitys a 2H ability and two class abilitys ill just stay in pve where at least i can pretend im good

<<-- THIS EXACTLY!

We are at a serious disadvantage vs North American players. And the problem is, it will never go away. Its a technology constraint. Subsea Cable limitation + Distance means we will never ping under 200. Thats the reality.. Pretty much every subsea fiber link crossing the Pacific has around a 200-250 ping from where it leaves the US on its first hop to either Guam or Auckland.

The average North American player with Fiber connections are pinging around 50-60. The average xDSL Australian is pinging around 300. Thats nearly a quarter of a second delay (which incidentally is the average human reaction time to a visual stimulus). That is almost crucial for a game like this. That's providing conditions are ideal. If you begin to compensate for peak Cyrodiil lag then that can stretch out to 0.5 seconds easily in difference! The difference between a shield being popped..and dead.

Even at work on 100mb Fiber I still ping at 280. I hear you on that PvP lag. I like PvP.. been spending a lot of time doing it lately even though its a broken skill, lag filled zerg fest.. its still (somewhat) enjoyable.

For those crying about it - I've tanked each of those dungeons maybe slightly under 50 times each (vICP half that). It only appears to get easier for 'elites' because they have the experience running them to know the mechanics. Keep in mind we had to learn those mechanics too at some stage as well.. This is time vested, lessons learned and improvement. I'm not for nerfing them because if i had to struggle getting there with *** ping rates.. why can't everyone else? Shouldn't have to make things easier for the 'I want it now Generation'.. Put in the time and effort like we did. Is that elitist? No.. it's just achievements should be earned.. not handed out over a dummy spit.

This is the straight truth they get to face roll vmsa while if we even get close to red even tho we roll dodged or left the environmental damage a second earlier we still die and yet we still complete this content. I have had americans comment first hand on some of these cases of lag and even they think its a joke and its mental we can still do half the content with them.

Destyran

Any way point of the story is if we can do it so can the privileged want it now players!!! Dont nerf anything anymore!! Increase drop rates thos vicp is wayy to long to have to run 200 times+ for gear

LadyNalcarya

Vangy wrote: »

Lamthalas wrote: »

Talyena wrote: »

How about a solution to make everyone happy? Tone down the vet versions, but add a trigger at the beginning that bumps the difficulty back to where it is now but increases the drop rate. Those who can't do it now have a better chance at completion and their gold key, and those who can have a better drop rate. Everyone wins.

They already did. Just click on non-vet for easy mode, vet for hard mode.

Vet mode drops v16 and normal drops v15 yes? It isnt just about drop rates but gear level now I think. Really no point in getting a v15 kena helm -_-"

What? I did my first clears of these dungeons in vr14 gear.
Of course, statistically, vr16 is better than vr15. But this difference is small and will only matter on minmaxed setup and rotation. Of course, minmaxers on forums will say that its so much better that wearing vr15 is not worth it, but they assume its for minmaxing purposes on already optimized character. Such character wont have issues in vet versions, so...
I just dont see how vr16 helmet or set would make any difference for a person who cant finish vet version of these dungeons. Its not an insult, its just truth. Same for vMA weapons etc... I saw players with golden BiS crafted gear who had absolutely no idea how to play their char.

P.S. Theres also monster helm vendor now. She sells infused, but then again, the difference between infused and divines in 0,8% crit of so if youre using Thief stone. And even if you farm vWGT youre not guaranteed top get divines.

LadyNalcarya

Totalitarian wrote: »

Waseem wrote: »

these dungeons are easy mode for elites already, and ultra hard for normal players and/or casuals

During the last vCOA pledge, I put in zone chat that I was looking for a group.

Some person invited me. I thought I recognized them, and I figured it was because I had done a pledge with them before.

I tp into vCOA, and see that he has the 'Flawless Conqueror' title. I say nothing.

I look around, and see the other player in the dungeon, and he has the same title.

I said that I was surprised with 2 Flawless Conquerors in the group.

They said that there were actually 3 of them.


About 20 minutes later, we're at Valkyn Skoria and finally someone dies: me. I cry internally as I just ruined the no-death run achievement for myself. I get cheered up by the perfect helm drop I get though .

I've been told I'm a good healer. But I couldn't keep up with those three at all. I was lagging behind, trying to catch up to them as they soloed groups of mobs, and the bosses went down just as quickly as the mobs.

We finish vCOA with 1 death, 2 perfect helm drops, 3 Flawless Conquerers, and 0 idea on how I got matched up with a group that was that strong just by pugging in zone chat.

After the group ends, I thought about where I saw one of the members. I look in the leaderboards and see him in the vMA leaderboards. I also see one of the other group members. Then I looked again the other day, and one of them was on the vMOL leaderboard.


That was my second time beating vCOA, and most of my other attempts were pain-filled, 2+ hour attempts. Then I go with some group who invited me because they 'needed' a healer, and it was the cleanest dungeon I've ever run, and 95% of my time was spent running to catch up, or heavy attacking in awe as a boss gets completely rekt.


I can confirm that vCOA is easy mode for elites. And it is difficult for normal players.

So elites do not deserve to have those dungeons. Cause theyre not people and not a part of playerbase and didnt pay for the game/dlcs.
Why casuals are so greedy? Why cant they just play and enjoy the game without facerolling all the content? Elites are not asking to make everything pvp/group raids and make all quests super hardcore.

Docmandu

Destyran wrote: »

Almost every one has 501 cp

Lol.. where's that cluebat when you need it... I think you would be shocked to see the actual number.. but I can guarantee you it won't be "almost every one"

Vanzen

The Word "Elite" associated with PVE content makes me laugh. Elite for beating a predictable IA ?! Seriously ?
Come PVP if you want to know what Elite means.

MidnightBlue

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Totalitarian wrote: »

Waseem wrote: »

these dungeons are easy mode for elites already, and ultra hard for normal players and/or casuals

During the last vCOA pledge, I put in zone chat that I was looking for a group.

Some person invited me. I thought I recognized them, and I figured it was because I had done a pledge with them before.

I tp into vCOA, and see that he has the 'Flawless Conqueror' title. I say nothing.

I look around, and see the other player in the dungeon, and he has the same title.

I said that I was surprised with 2 Flawless Conquerors in the group.

They said that there were actually 3 of them.


About 20 minutes later, we're at Valkyn Skoria and finally someone dies: me. I cry internally as I just ruined the no-death run achievement for myself. I get cheered up by the perfect helm drop I get though .

I've been told I'm a good healer. But I couldn't keep up with those three at all. I was lagging behind, trying to catch up to them as they soloed groups of mobs, and the bosses went down just as quickly as the mobs.

We finish vCOA with 1 death, 2 perfect helm drops, 3 Flawless Conquerers, and 0 idea on how I got matched up with a group that was that strong just by pugging in zone chat.

After the group ends, I thought about where I saw one of the members. I look in the leaderboards and see him in the vMA leaderboards. I also see one of the other group members. Then I looked again the other day, and one of them was on the vMOL leaderboard.


That was my second time beating vCOA, and most of my other attempts were pain-filled, 2+ hour attempts. Then I go with some group who invited me because they 'needed' a healer, and it was the cleanest dungeon I've ever run, and 95% of my time was spent running to catch up, or heavy attacking in awe as a boss gets completely rekt.


I can confirm that vCOA is easy mode for elites. And it is difficult for normal players.

So elites do not deserve to have those dungeons. Cause theyre not people and not a part of playerbase and didnt pay for the game/dlcs.
Why casuals are so greedy? Why cant they just play and enjoy the game without facerolling all the content? Elites are not asking to make everything pvp/group raids and make all quests super hardcore.

IF you implying that this guy is a casual, why are you calling this guy a greedy casual for stating his story? Where in his post did he say he wants to nerf it and where did he say that elites are not people and not part of the player base?

Shader_Shibes

Seriously i couldnt care less about them nerfing this. I have farmed that place into Oblivion that i could probably run both blindfolded.

tinythinker

lathbury

Vanzen wrote: »

The Word "Elite" associated with PVE content makes me laugh. Elite for beating a predictable IA ?! Seriously ?
Come PVP if you want to know what Elite means.

zerging and mashing either aoe or heals while hoping your lag is less than the other zergs?