2.1.1 Stamina Sorcerers?

CP5

Mr_Koh wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

Bound armaments is too hard to put on the bar, and it has to be on both bars, it is also the only ability worth slotting for stam sorcs. This 20% stam regen buff will be utilized most by magicka sorcs and I think should be reverted unless they can find a way to have this exclusively for stam sorc builds. As for the weapon damage buff you will not find yourself using more than 2 sorc abilities on your bar TOPS just from the nature of stam sorc having to rely on weapon abilities for gap closers, and some dps. So you're looking at a whopping 1% more weapon damage MAYBE. honestly I think they should just give the stam sorcs more weapon damage and leave the regen out of it since it creates a balancing issue.

I just hope whatever Eric was talking about in ESO Live along with these passives makes it to live. These changes are a step in the right direction, but there is still a lot to be done. @ZOS_RichLambert, any insight into what Eric's team is doing with that?

Just remember for over a year we (myself and a couple others) have been asking for an offensive ability and passive redesign and just recently Eric gave us Thundering Presence and they celebrated and patted each other on the back as if they listened and gave us what we needed/wanted. I have 0 faith in their ability to steer this failboat.

The redesign to Expert Mage and Daedric Protection testify that they know very little about how their classes work in combat settings, let alone PvP.

edit: Not trying to be a negative Nancy, just being realistic. @ZOS I heard transparency is a good thing...

I agree 100%, they better pull a rabbit out of their hat with that apparent change to improve the class but their record has left, little to be hopeful for. I was happy to see the passive changes make it into pts finally but with that really being it...

No, stam sorcs are actually FINE imo. They haven't done the best job with it but they made useable improvements. These passive are just IMPOSSIBLE to take advantage of since half a percent is an insult, and 20 percent stam recovery on a skill so difficult to slot is just silly. Stam sorcs currently have one of, if not the best mobility for a stam build, but they lack reliable damage and sustain. They're hard to be successful with, but very fun if used correctly imo. Please make these passives useable and I will be happy with the win we got for now.

No they are not FINE.
In fact after stating that the rest of your post goes on to contradict it.
Just because we have mobility doesn't mean we should play like a class neutral weapon spec. Sorry, but it's true.
Every single class feels like exactly what they are (nbs, temps, and DKs). Sorcs on the otherhand outside of Ightning form are bound to whatever weapon they are wielding. We need a Stam ability from one of our lines (preferably a shard) and a more serious adjustment to our passives. This recent change is a joke.

Nightblades are stealthy burst. (they might do this too well but that's another story)
Templars are big damage and sustain, but low mobility.
DK'S are brutes with great DOTS, but low burst dmg
And the sorcs are high mobility

This is for stam builds and the current situation on the PTS. Stam sorcs are FINE and if they could actually get this stam regen and some more weapon damage they will fit that role well enough for me to pick mine up. (which I will be doing either way next patch)

Your own post goes against that. You said its impossible to use the passives since there aren't skills for stamina sorcs to utilize for them to matter, and that the class is therefore more of a weapons platform. Nightblades make significantly better "mobility fighters" with 3 sources of the major movement buff, and one of them is tied to a dodge chance skill. You want mobility and that alone, the nightblade class blows stamina sorcs out of the water. So what does the sorcerer toolkit provide, aside from a nice empty skill bar to load with weapon and guild skills?

Dyride

I will ignore Bound Armaments except for PVE dps. I'm going to be slotting the Clannfear because it can at least provide an oh snap heal despite taking over half my magicka to cast.

I'm fine with these changes though they will require some creative bar tinkering to take advantage of. I also worry about the buff to Magicka Sorcerer stamina management if they run drinks.

Just think of this PVE AoE DPS setup: Bound Armaments, Crit Surge, Restraining Prison, Thundering Presence, Steel Tornado, Flawless DB.

+16% Weapon damage! +15% damage from DW Ruffian Passive. Thundering Presence for Disintegrate ticks. Though I would probably have Shooting Star on my AoE bar.

I can do one for single target if you like though it won't have as many synergies.

Bound Armaments, Liquid Lightning, Rune prison, Wrecking Blow, Executioner, Flawless DB.

You can skip Rally if you have Crit Surge on the other bar, Rune Prison for pesky adds, Liquid Lightning for Disintegrate procs once they are execute range.

Xael

Mr_Koh wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

Bound armaments is too hard to put on the bar, and it has to be on both bars, it is also the only ability worth slotting for stam sorcs. This 20% stam regen buff will be utilized most by magicka sorcs and I think should be reverted unless they can find a way to have this exclusively for stam sorc builds. As for the weapon damage buff you will not find yourself using more than 2 sorc abilities on your bar TOPS just from the nature of stam sorc having to rely on weapon abilities for gap closers, and some dps. So you're looking at a whopping 1% more weapon damage MAYBE. honestly I think they should just give the stam sorcs more weapon damage and leave the regen out of it since it creates a balancing issue.

I just hope whatever Eric was talking about in ESO Live along with these passives makes it to live. These changes are a step in the right direction, but there is still a lot to be done. @ZOS_RichLambert, any insight into what Eric's team is doing with that?

Just remember for over a year we (myself and a couple others) have been asking for an offensive ability and passive redesign and just recently Eric gave us Thundering Presence and they celebrated and patted each other on the back as if they listened and gave us what we needed/wanted. I have 0 faith in their ability to steer this failboat.

The redesign to Expert Mage and Daedric Protection testify that they know very little about how their classes work in combat settings, let alone PvP.

edit: Not trying to be a negative Nancy, just being realistic. @ZOS I heard transparency is a good thing...

I agree 100%, they better pull a rabbit out of their hat with that apparent change to improve the class but their record has left, little to be hopeful for. I was happy to see the passive changes make it into pts finally but with that really being it...

No, stam sorcs are actually FINE imo. They haven't done the best job with it but they made useable improvements. These passive are just IMPOSSIBLE to take advantage of since half a percent is an insult, and 20 percent stam recovery on a skill so difficult to slot is just silly. Stam sorcs currently have one of, if not the best mobility for a stam build, but they lack reliable damage and sustain. They're hard to be successful with, but very fun if used correctly imo. Please make these passives useable and I will be happy with the win we got for now.

No they are not FINE.
In fact after stating that the rest of your post goes on to contradict it.
Just because we have mobility doesn't mean we should play like a class neutral weapon spec. Sorry, but it's true.
Every single class feels like exactly what they are (nbs, temps, and DKs). Sorcs on the otherhand outside of Ightning form are bound to whatever weapon they are wielding. We need a Stam ability from one of our lines (preferably a shard) and a more serious adjustment to our passives. This recent change is a joke.

Nightblades are stealthy burst. (they might do this too well but that's another story)
Templars are big damage and sustain, but low mobility.
DK'S are brutes with great DOTS, but low burst dmg
And the sorcs are high mobility

This is for stam builds and the current situation on the PTS. Stam sorcs are FINE and if they could actually get this stam regen and some more weapon damage they will fit that role well enough for me to pick mine up. (which I will be doing either way next patch)

Not sure what DKs you have been running with, mine hits harder than my Sorc and puts out as much pressure/dmg as my NB. DKs when built properly have insane burst, particularly from stealth.

I get this is YOUR vision for what classes should be, but this is not anywhere near optimized. Calling something high mobility when they have a major design flaw and nothing else BUT mobility is rather misleading. Being a class neutral weapon spec is not "fine." I suppose if I lowered my standards and just accepted things for what they are I could abide it. Even then it's nothing more than being culled or acquiescing.

Mr_Koh

CP5 wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

Bound armaments is too hard to put on the bar, and it has to be on both bars, it is also the only ability worth slotting for stam sorcs. This 20% stam regen buff will be utilized most by magicka sorcs and I think should be reverted unless they can find a way to have this exclusively for stam sorc builds. As for the weapon damage buff you will not find yourself using more than 2 sorc abilities on your bar TOPS just from the nature of stam sorc having to rely on weapon abilities for gap closers, and some dps. So you're looking at a whopping 1% more weapon damage MAYBE. honestly I think they should just give the stam sorcs more weapon damage and leave the regen out of it since it creates a balancing issue.

I just hope whatever Eric was talking about in ESO Live along with these passives makes it to live. These changes are a step in the right direction, but there is still a lot to be done. @ZOS_RichLambert, any insight into what Eric's team is doing with that?

Just remember for over a year we (myself and a couple others) have been asking for an offensive ability and passive redesign and just recently Eric gave us Thundering Presence and they celebrated and patted each other on the back as if they listened and gave us what we needed/wanted. I have 0 faith in their ability to steer this failboat.

The redesign to Expert Mage and Daedric Protection testify that they know very little about how their classes work in combat settings, let alone PvP.

edit: Not trying to be a negative Nancy, just being realistic. @ZOS I heard transparency is a good thing...

I agree 100%, they better pull a rabbit out of their hat with that apparent change to improve the class but their record has left, little to be hopeful for. I was happy to see the passive changes make it into pts finally but with that really being it...

No, stam sorcs are actually FINE imo. They haven't done the best job with it but they made useable improvements. These passive are just IMPOSSIBLE to take advantage of since half a percent is an insult, and 20 percent stam recovery on a skill so difficult to slot is just silly. Stam sorcs currently have one of, if not the best mobility for a stam build, but they lack reliable damage and sustain. They're hard to be successful with, but very fun if used correctly imo. Please make these passives useable and I will be happy with the win we got for now.

No they are not FINE.
In fact after stating that the rest of your post goes on to contradict it.
Just because we have mobility doesn't mean we should play like a class neutral weapon spec. Sorry, but it's true.
Every single class feels like exactly what they are (nbs, temps, and DKs). Sorcs on the otherhand outside of Ightning form are bound to whatever weapon they are wielding. We need a Stam ability from one of our lines (preferably a shard) and a more serious adjustment to our passives. This recent change is a joke.

Nightblades are stealthy burst. (they might do this too well but that's another story)
Templars are big damage and sustain, but low mobility.
DK'S are brutes with great DOTS, but low burst dmg
And the sorcs are high mobility

This is for stam builds and the current situation on the PTS. Stam sorcs are FINE and if they could actually get this stam regen and some more weapon damage they will fit that role well enough for me to pick mine up. (which I will be doing either way next patch)

Your own post goes against that. You said its impossible to use the passives since there aren't skills for stamina sorcs to utilize for them to matter, and that the class is therefore more of a weapons platform. Nightblades make significantly better "mobility fighters" with 3 sources of the major movement buff, and one of them is tied to a dodge chance skill. You want mobility and that alone, the nightblade class blows stamina sorcs out of the water. So what does the sorcerer toolkit provide, aside from a nice empty skill bar to load with weapon and guild skills?

I played a ton of nightblade and in the PTS stam sorcs are more mobile if streak is used as a magicka dump. Thundering presence gives movement speed, and with a bow on top of that they almost always have the major expedition buff. That with streak covers more ground than NB

Mr_Koh

Xael wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

Bound armaments is too hard to put on the bar, and it has to be on both bars, it is also the only ability worth slotting for stam sorcs. This 20% stam regen buff will be utilized most by magicka sorcs and I think should be reverted unless they can find a way to have this exclusively for stam sorc builds. As for the weapon damage buff you will not find yourself using more than 2 sorc abilities on your bar TOPS just from the nature of stam sorc having to rely on weapon abilities for gap closers, and some dps. So you're looking at a whopping 1% more weapon damage MAYBE. honestly I think they should just give the stam sorcs more weapon damage and leave the regen out of it since it creates a balancing issue.

I just hope whatever Eric was talking about in ESO Live along with these passives makes it to live. These changes are a step in the right direction, but there is still a lot to be done. @ZOS_RichLambert, any insight into what Eric's team is doing with that?

Just remember for over a year we (myself and a couple others) have been asking for an offensive ability and passive redesign and just recently Eric gave us Thundering Presence and they celebrated and patted each other on the back as if they listened and gave us what we needed/wanted. I have 0 faith in their ability to steer this failboat.

The redesign to Expert Mage and Daedric Protection testify that they know very little about how their classes work in combat settings, let alone PvP.

edit: Not trying to be a negative Nancy, just being realistic. @ZOS I heard transparency is a good thing...

I agree 100%, they better pull a rabbit out of their hat with that apparent change to improve the class but their record has left, little to be hopeful for. I was happy to see the passive changes make it into pts finally but with that really being it...

No, stam sorcs are actually FINE imo. They haven't done the best job with it but they made useable improvements. These passive are just IMPOSSIBLE to take advantage of since half a percent is an insult, and 20 percent stam recovery on a skill so difficult to slot is just silly. Stam sorcs currently have one of, if not the best mobility for a stam build, but they lack reliable damage and sustain. They're hard to be successful with, but very fun if used correctly imo. Please make these passives useable and I will be happy with the win we got for now.

No they are not FINE.
In fact after stating that the rest of your post goes on to contradict it.
Just because we have mobility doesn't mean we should play like a class neutral weapon spec. Sorry, but it's true.
Every single class feels like exactly what they are (nbs, temps, and DKs). Sorcs on the otherhand outside of Ightning form are bound to whatever weapon they are wielding. We need a Stam ability from one of our lines (preferably a shard) and a more serious adjustment to our passives. This recent change is a joke.

Nightblades are stealthy burst. (they might do this too well but that's another story)
Templars are big damage and sustain, but low mobility.
DK'S are brutes with great DOTS, but low burst dmg
And the sorcs are high mobility

This is for stam builds and the current situation on the PTS. Stam sorcs are FINE and if they could actually get this stam regen and some more weapon damage they will fit that role well enough for me to pick mine up. (which I will be doing either way next patch)

Not sure what DKs you have been running with, mine hits harder than my Sorc and puts out as much pressure/dmg as my NB. DKs when built properly have insane burst, particularly from stealth.

I get this is YOUR vision for what classes should be, but this is not anywhere near optimized. Calling something high mobility when they have a major design flaw and nothing else BUT mobility is rather misleading. Being a class neutral weapon spec is not "fine." I suppose if I lowered my standards and just accepted things for what they are I could abide it. Even then it's nothing more than being culled or acquiescing.

I'm just going to say I disagree and leave it at that since I don't know where to begin here honestly.

Jar_Ek

2% weapon power per sorcerer skills on my bar. Not bad, but we have only 3 stamina morphs and maybe 5 magicka morphs we might use in a few circumstances (surge, encase, rune cage, streak and clannfear). And out of that lot you'll see maybe 2 on a bar at most. Combined with a passive that only works for 1 ability that scales with stamina (20% stamina regeneration).

Maybe if @zos provide another / a few more stamina friendly morphs and let pets scale of max resource it will make stamina sorcerers workable.

Still better than we are now!

[Edited as I misread the patch notes!]

TBois

I posted this on the thread about the new 20% stam regen passive in the deadric summoning skill line. I will say stats look good, but ZOS should address toggles or give us a useful stam morph, as many people don't want to slot Bound Armaments. Also as Mojar Stalker said you can get up to 44k Stam with Imperial/Reguard characters.

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Jar_Ek wrote: »

@lxSTALKERxl Mind telling what you used to get 40k stamina, and what your other stats were?

I got almost 39k stam with little effort as a Bosmer. Sets: Molag Kena (1 light and 1 heavy; stam enchants), Essence Thief (5 medium; stam enchants), Agility on all weapons and robust jewlery (all regen enchants)

Given PTS food; Tower Mundus Stone; Bound Armaments

w/o rally and Molag Kena buff

I would be able to boost it a bit more with crafted food and if I was an Imperial.



I am a vamp on that char but no skills slotted. Two sorc skills slotted. I still have enough regen with this too.

Edit: Although I think the 20% regen buff was a lazy move on ZOS's part, I use Bound Armaments on live currently; so it will be effective with my build. What I think would have helped the class more would be bringing back our advantages from previous iterations of the game, i.e. highest weapon damage, better crit heals and highest mobility (streak before multiple nerfs and boundless storm).

Xael

sixuponthelot wrote: »

I posted this on the thread about the new 20% stam regen passive in the deadric summoning skill line. I will say stats look good, but ZOS should address toggles or give us a useful stam morph, as many people don't want to slot Bound Armaments. Also as Mojar Stalker said you can get up to 44k Stam with Imperial/Reguard characters.

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Jar_Ek wrote: »

@lxSTALKERxl Mind telling what you used to get 40k stamina, and what your other stats were?

I got almost 39k stam with little effort as a Bosmer. Sets: Molag Kena (1 light and 1 heavy; stam enchants), Essence Thief (5 medium; stam enchants), Agility on all weapons and robust jewlery (all regen enchants)

Given PTS food; Tower Mundus Stone; Bound Armaments

w/o rally and Molag Kena buff

I would be able to boost it a bit more with crafted food and if I was an Imperial.



I am a vamp on that char but no skills slotted. Two sorc skills slotted. I still have enough regen with this too.

Edit: Although I think the 20% regen buff was a lazy move on ZOS's part, I use Bound Armaments on live currently; so it will be effective with my build. What I think would have helped the class more would be bringing back our advantages from previous iterations of the game, i.e. highest weapon damage, better crit heals and highest mobility (streak before multiple nerfs and boundless storm).

Bound Armaments is garbage and the passive Daedric Protection is either a cruel jest or a design flaw completely out of touch.

You are also using The Tower for mundus, have less than 30% crit, and have 2k Weapon Damage, that's really terrible given the damage reduction in PvP. Having that much Stamina is hubris and essentially places you in the "tickle fight" category of PvP damage, no thanks.

TBois

Xael wrote: »

sixuponthelot wrote: »

I posted this on the thread about the new 20% stam regen passive in the deadric summoning skill line. I will say stats look good, but ZOS should address toggles or give us a useful stam morph, as many people don't want to slot Bound Armaments. Also as Mojar Stalker said you can get up to 44k Stam with Imperial/Reguard characters.

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Jar_Ek wrote: »

@lxSTALKERxl Mind telling what you used to get 40k stamina, and what your other stats were?

I got almost 39k stam with little effort as a Bosmer. Sets: Molag Kena (1 light and 1 heavy; stam enchants), Essence Thief (5 medium; stam enchants), Agility on all weapons and robust jewlery (all regen enchants)

Given PTS food; Tower Mundus Stone; Bound Armaments

w/o rally and Molag Kena buff

I would be able to boost it a bit more with crafted food and if I was an Imperial.



I am a vamp on that char but no skills slotted. Two sorc skills slotted. I still have enough regen with this too.

Edit: Although I think the 20% regen buff was a lazy move on ZOS's part, I use Bound Armaments on live currently; so it will be effective with my build. What I think would have helped the class more would be bringing back our advantages from previous iterations of the game, i.e. highest weapon damage, better crit heals and highest mobility (streak before multiple nerfs and boundless storm).

Bound Armaments is garbage and the passive Daedric Protection is either a cruel jest or a design flaw completely out of touch.

You are also using The Tower for mundus, have less than 30% crit, and have 2k Weapon Damage, that's really terrible given the damage reduction in PvP. Having that much Stamina is hubris and essentially places you in the "tickle fight" category of PvP damage, no thanks.

The build was more about resources to show what is possible. Also this is w/o rally and Molag Kena proc, although I am wearing the set. My weapon damage with those will be about 3.5k.

Edit: I understand you don't like bound armaments, but some people do. It is far from garbage but definitely mediocre at best. I have been able to fit it on my build and don't feel like I'm missing anything. So I have kept it there. I do well with it currently on live, having 4k weapon damage and 29k stamina with food. If I run drink I'm at 4k weapon damage and 24k stamina. Hardly tickling on live and 3.5k weapon damage with 39k stamina is not tickling on PTS.

Xael

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

sixuponthelot wrote: »

I posted this on the thread about the new 20% stam regen passive in the deadric summoning skill line. I will say stats look good, but ZOS should address toggles or give us a useful stam morph, as many people don't want to slot Bound Armaments. Also as Mojar Stalker said you can get up to 44k Stam with Imperial/Reguard characters.

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Jar_Ek wrote: »

@lxSTALKERxl Mind telling what you used to get 40k stamina, and what your other stats were?

I got almost 39k stam with little effort as a Bosmer. Sets: Molag Kena (1 light and 1 heavy; stam enchants), Essence Thief (5 medium; stam enchants), Agility on all weapons and robust jewlery (all regen enchants)

Given PTS food; Tower Mundus Stone; Bound Armaments

w/o rally and Molag Kena buff

I would be able to boost it a bit more with crafted food and if I was an Imperial.



I am a vamp on that char but no skills slotted. Two sorc skills slotted. I still have enough regen with this too.

Edit: Although I think the 20% regen buff was a lazy move on ZOS's part, I use Bound Armaments on live currently; so it will be effective with my build. What I think would have helped the class more would be bringing back our advantages from previous iterations of the game, i.e. highest weapon damage, better crit heals and highest mobility (streak before multiple nerfs and boundless storm).

Bound Armaments is garbage and the passive Daedric Protection is either a cruel jest or a design flaw completely out of touch.

You are also using The Tower for mundus, have less than 30% crit, and have 2k Weapon Damage, that's really terrible given the damage reduction in PvP. Having that much Stamina is hubris and essentially places you in the "tickle fight" category of PvP damage, no thanks.

The build was more about resources to show what is possible. Also this is w/o rally and Molag Kena proc, although I am wearing the set. My weapon damage with those will be about 3.5k.

Edit: I understand you don't like bound armaments, but some people do. It is far from garbage but definitely mediocre at best. I have been able to fit it on my build and don't feel like I'm missing anything. So I have kept it there. I do well with it currently on live, having 4k weapon damage and 29k stamina with food. If I run drink I'm at 4k weapon damage and 24k stamina. Hardly tickling on live and 3.5k weapon damage with 39k stamina is not tickling on PTS.

Saying the skill is garbage is not a personal bias. 8% Stamina is under 500 tooltip damage for a big ability like Wrecking Blow. If you are using other abilities you are getting way less, around 200 for some, around 100 for dual wield. This is not worth a toggle slot and we don't run around charging heavy attacks. That said, this skill is garbage. It's fine if you like it, even New Kids on the Block had fans, doesn't make their music good

Live is not PTS. Saying "hardly tickling" is taking what I said about PTS and applying it to something else. This is neither here nor there. On Live I hit like a truck... it's irrelevant.

Regarding this build on PTS you have under 30% crit, thats really below average. You could not use this build and still have around 34k Stamina, 45% Crit, Armor Penetration, Physical Damage, and 4750 Weapon Damage. I don't think you can compare the 2 at this point.

TBois

Xael wrote: »

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

sixuponthelot wrote: »

I posted this on the thread about the new 20% stam regen passive in the deadric summoning skill line. I will say stats look good, but ZOS should address toggles or give us a useful stam morph, as many people don't want to slot Bound Armaments. Also as Mojar Stalker said you can get up to 44k Stam with Imperial/Reguard characters.

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Jar_Ek wrote: »

@lxSTALKERxl Mind telling what you used to get 40k stamina, and what your other stats were?

I got almost 39k stam with little effort as a Bosmer. Sets: Molag Kena (1 light and 1 heavy; stam enchants), Essence Thief (5 medium; stam enchants), Agility on all weapons and robust jewlery (all regen enchants)

Given PTS food; Tower Mundus Stone; Bound Armaments

w/o rally and Molag Kena buff

I would be able to boost it a bit more with crafted food and if I was an Imperial.



I am a vamp on that char but no skills slotted. Two sorc skills slotted. I still have enough regen with this too.

Edit: Although I think the 20% regen buff was a lazy move on ZOS's part, I use Bound Armaments on live currently; so it will be effective with my build. What I think would have helped the class more would be bringing back our advantages from previous iterations of the game, i.e. highest weapon damage, better crit heals and highest mobility (streak before multiple nerfs and boundless storm).

Bound Armaments is garbage and the passive Daedric Protection is either a cruel jest or a design flaw completely out of touch.

You are also using The Tower for mundus, have less than 30% crit, and have 2k Weapon Damage, that's really terrible given the damage reduction in PvP. Having that much Stamina is hubris and essentially places you in the "tickle fight" category of PvP damage, no thanks.

The build was more about resources to show what is possible. Also this is w/o rally and Molag Kena proc, although I am wearing the set. My weapon damage with those will be about 3.5k.

Edit: I understand you don't like bound armaments, but some people do. It is far from garbage but definitely mediocre at best. I have been able to fit it on my build and don't feel like I'm missing anything. So I have kept it there. I do well with it currently on live, having 4k weapon damage and 29k stamina with food. If I run drink I'm at 4k weapon damage and 24k stamina. Hardly tickling on live and 3.5k weapon damage with 39k stamina is not tickling on PTS.

Saying the skill is garbage is not a personal bias. 8% Stamina is under 500 tooltip damage for a big ability like Wrecking Blow. If you are using other abilities you are getting way less, around 200 for some, around 100 for dual wield. This is not worth a toggle slot and we don't run around charging heavy attacks. That said, this skill is garbage. It's fine if you like it, even New Kids on the Block had fans, doesn't make their music good

Live is not PTS. Saying "hardly tickling" is taking what I said about PTS and applying it to something else. This is neither here nor there. On Live I hit like a truck... it's irrelevant.

Regarding this build on PTS you have under 30% crit, thats really below average. You could not use this build and still have around 34k Stamina, 45% Crit, Armor Penetration, Physical Damage, and 4750 Weapon Damage. I don't think you can compare the 2 at this point.

You are right about me bringing in a Live build, but I also said right after that with this build I don't tickle on PTS. Also I will not be running this build once PTS goes live. The tower mundus stone sucks, warrior is a much better choice with 20% buff from rally, and I don't like that Drain Essence set. I was trying to max out the benefit of Bound Armor, which does apply a damage bonus to medium attacks and many sorcs weave them in with their Wrecking Blows. I was also trying to see what I could do without worrying about crit because currently you can't crit shields, and meta magicka sorcs make me salty.

Xael

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

sixuponthelot wrote: »

I posted this on the thread about the new 20% stam regen passive in the deadric summoning skill line. I will say stats look good, but ZOS should address toggles or give us a useful stam morph, as many people don't want to slot Bound Armaments. Also as Mojar Stalker said you can get up to 44k Stam with Imperial/Reguard characters.

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Jar_Ek wrote: »

@lxSTALKERxl Mind telling what you used to get 40k stamina, and what your other stats were?

I got almost 39k stam with little effort as a Bosmer. Sets: Molag Kena (1 light and 1 heavy; stam enchants), Essence Thief (5 medium; stam enchants), Agility on all weapons and robust jewlery (all regen enchants)

Given PTS food; Tower Mundus Stone; Bound Armaments

w/o rally and Molag Kena buff

I would be able to boost it a bit more with crafted food and if I was an Imperial.



I am a vamp on that char but no skills slotted. Two sorc skills slotted. I still have enough regen with this too.

Edit: Although I think the 20% regen buff was a lazy move on ZOS's part, I use Bound Armaments on live currently; so it will be effective with my build. What I think would have helped the class more would be bringing back our advantages from previous iterations of the game, i.e. highest weapon damage, better crit heals and highest mobility (streak before multiple nerfs and boundless storm).

Bound Armaments is garbage and the passive Daedric Protection is either a cruel jest or a design flaw completely out of touch.

You are also using The Tower for mundus, have less than 30% crit, and have 2k Weapon Damage, that's really terrible given the damage reduction in PvP. Having that much Stamina is hubris and essentially places you in the "tickle fight" category of PvP damage, no thanks.

The build was more about resources to show what is possible. Also this is w/o rally and Molag Kena proc, although I am wearing the set. My weapon damage with those will be about 3.5k.

Edit: I understand you don't like bound armaments, but some people do. It is far from garbage but definitely mediocre at best. I have been able to fit it on my build and don't feel like I'm missing anything. So I have kept it there. I do well with it currently on live, having 4k weapon damage and 29k stamina with food. If I run drink I'm at 4k weapon damage and 24k stamina. Hardly tickling on live and 3.5k weapon damage with 39k stamina is not tickling on PTS.

Saying the skill is garbage is not a personal bias. 8% Stamina is under 500 tooltip damage for a big ability like Wrecking Blow. If you are using other abilities you are getting way less, around 200 for some, around 100 for dual wield. This is not worth a toggle slot and we don't run around charging heavy attacks. That said, this skill is garbage. It's fine if you like it, even New Kids on the Block had fans, doesn't make their music good

Live is not PTS. Saying "hardly tickling" is taking what I said about PTS and applying it to something else. This is neither here nor there. On Live I hit like a truck... it's irrelevant.

Regarding this build on PTS you have under 30% crit, thats really below average. You could not use this build and still have around 34k Stamina, 45% Crit, Armor Penetration, Physical Damage, and 4750 Weapon Damage. I don't think you can compare the 2 at this point.

You are right about me bringing in a Live build, but I also said right after that with this build I don't tickle on PTS. Also I will not be running this build once PTS goes live. The tower mundus stone sucks, warrior is a much better choice with 20% buff from rally, and I don't like that Drain Essence set. I was trying to max out the benefit of Bound Armor, which does apply a damage bonus to medium attacks and many sorcs weave them in with their Wrecking Blows. I was also trying to see what I could do without worrying about crit because currently you can't crit shields, and meta magicka sorcs make me salty.

I think shields make everyone salty. BTW the first few weeks of PTS was a shielding Sorc's wetdream.

No, I am sure you don't tickle on PTS, however without that Molag Kena (a set you did reveal when I originally responded) proc you are under 3k weapon damage, hence my response.
I get that Bound Armaments gives 8% stamina which effects all our weapon abilities and attacks, however the other bonus is Heavy Attack only.

The build I am running now on PTS (4700 weapon damage and 45 crit) I will likely run on Live depending on w/e last minute adjustments are made. I might even permanently drop something in favor of Radiant Magelight. Right now I am vacillating between that and Shuffle. both of which are really awesome in their own right.

TBois

Xael wrote: »

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

sixuponthelot wrote: »

I posted this on the thread about the new 20% stam regen passive in the deadric summoning skill line. I will say stats look good, but ZOS should address toggles or give us a useful stam morph, as many people don't want to slot Bound Armaments. Also as Mojar Stalker said you can get up to 44k Stam with Imperial/Reguard characters.

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Jar_Ek wrote: »

@lxSTALKERxl Mind telling what you used to get 40k stamina, and what your other stats were?

I got almost 39k stam with little effort as a Bosmer. Sets: Molag Kena (1 light and 1 heavy; stam enchants), Essence Thief (5 medium; stam enchants), Agility on all weapons and robust jewlery (all regen enchants)

Given PTS food; Tower Mundus Stone; Bound Armaments

w/o rally and Molag Kena buff

I would be able to boost it a bit more with crafted food and if I was an Imperial.



I am a vamp on that char but no skills slotted. Two sorc skills slotted. I still have enough regen with this too.

Edit: Although I think the 20% regen buff was a lazy move on ZOS's part, I use Bound Armaments on live currently; so it will be effective with my build. What I think would have helped the class more would be bringing back our advantages from previous iterations of the game, i.e. highest weapon damage, better crit heals and highest mobility (streak before multiple nerfs and boundless storm).

Bound Armaments is garbage and the passive Daedric Protection is either a cruel jest or a design flaw completely out of touch.

You are also using The Tower for mundus, have less than 30% crit, and have 2k Weapon Damage, that's really terrible given the damage reduction in PvP. Having that much Stamina is hubris and essentially places you in the "tickle fight" category of PvP damage, no thanks.

The build was more about resources to show what is possible. Also this is w/o rally and Molag Kena proc, although I am wearing the set. My weapon damage with those will be about 3.5k.

Edit: I understand you don't like bound armaments, but some people do. It is far from garbage but definitely mediocre at best. I have been able to fit it on my build and don't feel like I'm missing anything. So I have kept it there. I do well with it currently on live, having 4k weapon damage and 29k stamina with food. If I run drink I'm at 4k weapon damage and 24k stamina. Hardly tickling on live and 3.5k weapon damage with 39k stamina is not tickling on PTS.

Saying the skill is garbage is not a personal bias. 8% Stamina is under 500 tooltip damage for a big ability like Wrecking Blow. If you are using other abilities you are getting way less, around 200 for some, around 100 for dual wield. This is not worth a toggle slot and we don't run around charging heavy attacks. That said, this skill is garbage. It's fine if you like it, even New Kids on the Block had fans, doesn't make their music good

Live is not PTS. Saying "hardly tickling" is taking what I said about PTS and applying it to something else. This is neither here nor there. On Live I hit like a truck... it's irrelevant.

Regarding this build on PTS you have under 30% crit, thats really below average. You could not use this build and still have around 34k Stamina, 45% Crit, Armor Penetration, Physical Damage, and 4750 Weapon Damage. I don't think you can compare the 2 at this point.

You are right about me bringing in a Live build, but I also said right after that with this build I don't tickle on PTS. Also I will not be running this build once PTS goes live. The tower mundus stone sucks, warrior is a much better choice with 20% buff from rally, and I don't like that Drain Essence set. I was trying to max out the benefit of Bound Armor, which does apply a damage bonus to medium attacks and many sorcs weave them in with their Wrecking Blows. I was also trying to see what I could do without worrying about crit because currently you can't crit shields, and meta magicka sorcs make me salty.

I think shields make everyone salty. BTW the first few weeks of PTS was a shielding Sorc's wetdream.

No, I am sure you don't tickle on PTS, however without that Molag Kena (a set you did reveal when I originally responded) proc you are under 3k weapon damage, hence my response.
I get that Bound Armaments gives 8% stamina which effects all our weapon abilities and attacks, however the other bonus is Heavy Attack only.

The build I am running now on PTS (4700 weapon damage and 45 crit) I will likely run on Live depending on w/e last minute adjustments are made. I might even permanently drop something in favor of Radiant Magelight. Right now I am vacillating between that and Shuffle. both of which are really awesome in their own right.

I like shuffle cause I like to do the Carlton and getting rid of snares is a bonus. I'm still working out my final pts build. It's nice to hear that thundering presence procs ravaging, as it's been a staple of my previous builds. So I might try to work something around that depending on proc rate

Huggalump

Xael wrote: »

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

sixuponthelot wrote: »

I posted this on the thread about the new 20% stam regen passive in the deadric summoning skill line. I will say stats look good, but ZOS should address toggles or give us a useful stam morph, as many people don't want to slot Bound Armaments. Also as Mojar Stalker said you can get up to 44k Stam with Imperial/Reguard characters.

sixuponthelot wrote: »

Jar_Ek wrote: »

@lxSTALKERxl Mind telling what you used to get 40k stamina, and what your other stats were?

I got almost 39k stam with little effort as a Bosmer. Sets: Molag Kena (1 light and 1 heavy; stam enchants), Essence Thief (5 medium; stam enchants), Agility on all weapons and robust jewlery (all regen enchants)

Given PTS food; Tower Mundus Stone; Bound Armaments

w/o rally and Molag Kena buff

I would be able to boost it a bit more with crafted food and if I was an Imperial.



I am a vamp on that char but no skills slotted. Two sorc skills slotted. I still have enough regen with this too.

Edit: Although I think the 20% regen buff was a lazy move on ZOS's part, I use Bound Armaments on live currently; so it will be effective with my build. What I think would have helped the class more would be bringing back our advantages from previous iterations of the game, i.e. highest weapon damage, better crit heals and highest mobility (streak before multiple nerfs and boundless storm).

Bound Armaments is garbage and the passive Daedric Protection is either a cruel jest or a design flaw completely out of touch.

You are also using The Tower for mundus, have less than 30% crit, and have 2k Weapon Damage, that's really terrible given the damage reduction in PvP. Having that much Stamina is hubris and essentially places you in the "tickle fight" category of PvP damage, no thanks.

The build was more about resources to show what is possible. Also this is w/o rally and Molag Kena proc, although I am wearing the set. My weapon damage with those will be about 3.5k.

Edit: I understand you don't like bound armaments, but some people do. It is far from garbage but definitely mediocre at best. I have been able to fit it on my build and don't feel like I'm missing anything. So I have kept it there. I do well with it currently on live, having 4k weapon damage and 29k stamina with food. If I run drink I'm at 4k weapon damage and 24k stamina. Hardly tickling on live and 3.5k weapon damage with 39k stamina is not tickling on PTS.

Saying the skill is garbage is not a personal bias. 8% Stamina is under 500 tooltip damage for a big ability like Wrecking Blow. If you are using other abilities you are getting way less, around 200 for some, around 100 for dual wield. This is not worth a toggle slot and we don't run around charging heavy attacks. That said, this skill is garbage. It's fine if you like it, even New Kids on the Block had fans, doesn't make their music good

Live is not PTS. Saying "hardly tickling" is taking what I said about PTS and applying it to something else. This is neither here nor there. On Live I hit like a truck... it's irrelevant.

Regarding this build on PTS you have under 30% crit, thats really below average. You could not use this build and still have around 34k Stamina, 45% Crit, Armor Penetration, Physical Damage, and 4750 Weapon Damage. I don't think you can compare the 2 at this point.

You are right about me bringing in a Live build, but I also said right after that with this build I don't tickle on PTS. Also I will not be running this build once PTS goes live. The tower mundus stone sucks, warrior is a much better choice with 20% buff from rally, and I don't like that Drain Essence set. I was trying to max out the benefit of Bound Armor, which does apply a damage bonus to medium attacks and many sorcs weave them in with their Wrecking Blows. I was also trying to see what I could do without worrying about crit because currently you can't crit shields, and meta magicka sorcs make me salty.

I think shields make everyone salty. BTW the first few weeks of PTS was a shielding Sorc's wetdream.

No, I am sure you don't tickle on PTS, however without that Molag Kena (a set you did reveal when I originally responded) proc you are under 3k weapon damage, hence my response.
I get that Bound Armaments gives 8% stamina which effects all our weapon abilities and attacks, however the other bonus is Heavy Attack only.

The build I am running now on PTS (4700 weapon damage and 45 crit) I will likely run on Live depending on w/e last minute adjustments are made. I might even permanently drop something in favor of Radiant Magelight. Right now I am vacillating between that and Shuffle. both of which are really awesome in their own right.

What are you doing to get that much weapon damage? My pts stam sorcs has just under 3k weapon damage with rally up

exiledtyrant

Shock master, Agility 3 set jewelry, Molag Kenna, flawless dawn breaker, 2 sorc abilities slotted, and major brutality should easily get you past the 4k weapon damage mark. Swap out shock master for sheer venom and it will push you higher since it's a double weapon damage set. Then there's the consideration of using the sword % boost or not.

I think the best sets for Stamina sorcerers coming out of 1.7 will be:

Dual wield:
2 molag + 5 shock master + 3 agility + 2 endurance

2 molag + 5 night mother's gaze + 2 endurance + 3 agility

2 molag + 5 hunding's rage + 2 endurance + 3 agility

5 night mother's gaze + 4 hunding's rage + 3 agility

5 Hunding's rage + 4 night mother's gaze + 3 agility

Two Handed:

2 molag + 5 sheer venom + 3 agility

2 molag + 5 hunding's rage + 3 agility

2 molag + 5 night mother's gaze + 3 agility

3 night mother's gaze + 5 hunding's rage + 3 agility

3 hunding's rage + 5 night mother's gaze + 3 agility


Dual wield will certainly have more stats and health but it doesn't have anything comparable to wrecking blow or executioner. I favor shock master on dual wield and sheer venom on two handed because dual wield appears to take less time to do the shock master combo, while two handed has a better execution ability to use the venom proc.

Shock master and Molag kenna are rather clunky 5 piece activations. I think the first set I'll invest in is the 5 piece night mother + 4 hunding's rage and 3 agility. Not sure on weapon yet. I like maces but I have to see what they settle on for the thief stone before I make my choice on where to stop for crit chance.

TBois

If you plan on using steel tornado, sheer venom will proc off that.

Also you could run 5 ravager + 2 molag kena + 3 w/e + weapons (or 4/5 hundings). Proc ravager off thundering presence (not to hot for 1v1 but 1vx will proc a good bit) and pump weapon damage that way. I image v16 ravaging will be hard to come by with the RNG and expensive.

exiledtyrant

I don't know if it would be worth proccing venom outside of refreshing the major endurance buff. Maybe if it procs on every target hit? If it stacks it could add a lot more damage to those whirlwind spam groups. Whirlwind doesn't really turn on like executioner does single target.