Console player experience's VR ranks for first time!

TequilaFire

I totally disagree with those that think they have to be VR14 to enjoy pvp.
This is self imposed, and news flash you get stomped even as a VR14.
It will be even better if ZOS goes through with the proposed new pvp battle leveling for the VR ranks.

Rinmaethodain

Arato wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Grinding? What grinding? Untill i reacher VR12
...................................
I love veteran rank lvls. I can finally make good gear without being afrad that in one minute ill outlevel it again.

Once you hit VR10 or 11ish you run out of quests though and just have to repeat the same quests in Cyrodiil or Craglorn on a daily basis for the last few ranks. That IS grinding, and it's poor design and planning.

You want a 100% grindless experience? Would you like french fries with that? : P

You cant have 100% grindless experience. It would happen only if upon completing everything in game player gets a ban that prevents him from repeating anything that he did already before.

Grinding starts at VR10/11? Based on my experience with other MMO games, where i had to grind all the way throught lvls and quest were a minor part of game this is a great feat on ESO side. Even if as you said grinding starts at VR10/11 at that point player completed about ~80% of the content and is at ~85% of reaching max lvl

For me its pretty nice balance. And as you said there are still quests in Cyrodiil and Craglorn which can be completed once for quest achievement without need to grind them yet. That should without problem push player another VR ahead.

I did not say there is no grinding in eso, i just say the need for grind starts VERY late in ESO and most of times when i see people "oh no, im so low lvl, where do i grind" i ask them simple question "did you start caldwell gold or silver?" and they are like "what, what is this?"

Its like everyone around want everything but with 0 effort, just like real life "want fast money but preferably it should appear on account on its own"

Arato

MissBizz wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Grinding? What grinding? Untill i reacher VR12

NEVER GRINDED in ESO

Just make sure you complete all quests in every zone. Caldwell gold and silver. Sidequests.

They give TON of exp and lot of cash, items for decon or vendoring.

It makes me laugh when people hit VR1 and start crying that they have to grind but they didnt expierence even 1/3 of whole game.

I love veteran rank lvls. I can finally make good gear without being afrad that in one minute ill outlevel it again.

Once you hit VR10 or 11ish you run out of quests though and just have to repeat the same quests in Cyrodiil or Craglorn on a daily basis for the last few ranks. That IS grinding, and it's poor design and planning.

This heavily depends on how you play. As I enjoy the VR content, I play through all of the zones, not rushing through it, as well break up my time by doing group activities such as guild events and dungeons (mostly veteran). I am sitting at VR12 in a VR8 zone. I have absolutely no doubts I will be VR14 before I hit Craglorn.

Arato wrote: »

There's a small minority of players who defend VR's to the end of the earth though.

Hmm.. well, I do defend them in a way that states I enjoy them, although I can also see the other side and understand why (I would say the majority) players do not like them. Really, get rid of them. I'd be a bit saddened as I love the idea of level progression, but it wouldn't kill me. Leave Caldwell's as optional and boom - everyone should be happy. (Won't be, as it is completely impossible to make everyone happy, but hey, in my opinion I think it would make the majority of players happy)

I did every single quest, every single delve, every single public dungeon, every single dolmen, every single world boss, every single POI, found every crafting station, every skyshard, etc....

still shy of VR11 by the time I finished cadwell's gold.

Arato

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Grinding? What grinding? Untill i reacher VR12
...................................
I love veteran rank lvls. I can finally make good gear without being afrad that in one minute ill outlevel it again.

Once you hit VR10 or 11ish you run out of quests though and just have to repeat the same quests in Cyrodiil or Craglorn on a daily basis for the last few ranks. That IS grinding, and it's poor design and planning.

You want a 100% grindless experience? Would you like french fries with that? : P

You cant have 100% grindless experience. It would happen only if upon completing everything in game player gets a ban that prevents him from repeating anything that he did already before.

Grinding starts at VR10/11? Based on my experience with other MMO games, where i had to grind all the way throught lvls and quest were a minor part of game this is a great feat on ESO side. Even if as you said grinding starts at VR10/11 at that point player completed about ~80% of the content and is at ~85% of reaching max lvl

For me its pretty nice balance. And as you said there are still quests in Cyrodiil and Craglorn which can be completed once for quest achievement without need to grind them yet. That should without problem push player another VR ahead.

I did not say there is no grinding in eso, i just say the need for grind starts VERY late in ESO and most of times when i see people "oh no, im so low lvl, where do i grind" i ask them simple question "did you start caldwell gold or silver?" and they are like "what, what is this?"

Its like everyone around want everything but with 0 effort, just like real life "want fast money but preferably it should appear on account on its own"

Not just me, a lot of players, including the OP of this thread. The game is floundering because of VR's absolutely killing people's enjoyment of the game.

Funkopotamus

Cp will still be a grind.

And I agree with one of the above posters.

What would make you happier?
Grinding 6 dailies and a 1 shot dungeon for gear drops "Until you are fully geared"then you only have your 6 dailies.?

Funkopotamus

Osiinin wrote: »

So I did a quick search, just checking I have this right?

VR is going away and being replaced by champion points?

VR ranks make your character stronger? And there is some content that only opens up at later VR levels?

So just curious, at 50, is there end game PVE content? Or do you need to be VR x for PVE end game?

What sort of 'power' difference is there in PVP comparing a level 50 VR1 to a Vr14?

A HUGE difference when you throw in CP's. This is why the transfers were a bad idea IMHO. although it will not matter to much in 6 months.

Molsondry

ı wanna enjoy other alliance quest in Alts ... Not in an endless grinding. Then if I start an alt on different faction I just do the same quest all over again.

So basicly once you have done a VR 11 (you cant reach vr 14 with quest) You have done almost every damn quest in the game even tho you only did 1 faction ... its stupid.

Not to mention Id rather have multiple alt then havinga noneneding grind for my vr 14.

Funkopotamus

Molsondry wrote: »

ı wanna enjoy other alliance quest in Alts ... Not in an endless grinding. Then if I start an alt on different faction I just do the same quest all over again.

So basicly once you have done a VR 11 (you cant reach vr 14 with quest) You have done almost every damn quest in the game even tho you only did 1 faction ... its stupid.

Not to mention Id rather have multiple alt then havinga noneneding grind for my vr 14.

When you grind CP's they are for all your characters.

Yet another reason transfers were bad.. You get the CP's even on your "ALT"

Endurance

Zevris wrote: »

not impressed, I had so much fun going through the questline and all the different zones and such to get to lvl 50 or vr1. I honestly didn't know what to expect from VR ranks but so far I'm heartbroken, its a wall of pure grinding to make you come back and play but frankly this is not the type of grind that I want. The only type of grind that should ever exist in an mmorpg is gear, reputations, professions etc but not lvling. This is a rant and yes I'm upset but I have no one else to blame other than myself I guess. I just don't have the time to put 8 hours a day grinding to go up a quarter of a lvl. Keep in mind that this is console, there are very few people at the vr ranks yet so there are no vr grind parties and even then there is no fun in this type of grinding. I will be going back to FF XIV for the release of Heavensward but I will return to this when they decide to make a change to the whole VR thing (if that ever happens). Please do not hate on my post, understand that this is my opinion and that I respect everyone's opinion aslong as they aren't ignorant.

[snip] have you even played Scions of Fate? do you have any idea how LOW the exp rate is in that game? level 1 to 70 = 1 year, level 71 to 95 = another year, 95 to 125 = another 3 years.. and guess what? there is about 4 people at the level cap! and nobody complains about the grind at all!

EDIT: got to be nice to people i guess
[edited for trolling]

Funkopotamus

Endurance wrote: »

Zevris wrote: »

not impressed, I had so much fun going through the questline and all the different zones and such to get to lvl 50 or vr1. I honestly didn't know what to expect from VR ranks but so far I'm heartbroken, its a wall of pure grinding to make you come back and play but frankly this is not the type of grind that I want. The only type of grind that should ever exist in an mmorpg is gear, reputations, professions etc but not lvling. This is a rant and yes I'm upset but I have no one else to blame other than myself I guess. I just don't have the time to put 8 hours a day grinding to go up a quarter of a lvl. Keep in mind that this is console, there are very few people at the vr ranks yet so there are no vr grind parties and even then there is no fun in this type of grinding. I will be going back to FF XIV for the release of Heavensward but I will return to this when they decide to make a change to the whole VR thing (if that ever happens). Please do not hate on my post, understand that this is my opinion and that I respect everyone's opinion aslong as they aren't ignorant.

[snip] have you even played Scions of Fate? do you have any idea how LOW the exp rate is in that game? level 1 to 70 = 1 year, level 71 to 95 = another year, 95 to 125 = another 3 years.. and guess what? there is about 4 people at the level cap! and nobody complains about the grind at all!

EDIT: got to be nice to people i guess

Yea we can thank WoW for ruining MMO's. The gear handouts not to mention easy mode character leveling systems Devolved MMO expectations to a point to where if players cannot become fully geared and maxed out in a week they will throw a fit..

The game has been out 9 days.. NINE days and we are already seeing it..

/Cries...

[edited to remove quote]

Arato

Funkopotamus wrote: »

Cp will still be a grind.

And I agree with one of the above posters.

What would make you happier?
Grinding 6 dailies and a 1 shot dungeon for gear drops "Until you are fully geared"then you only have your 6 dailies.?

CP's don't gate content and gear that you can use, VR's do.

HeathenDeacon

Zevris wrote: »

not impressed, I had so much fun going through the questline and all the different zones and such to get to lvl 50 or vr1. I honestly didn't know what to expect from VR ranks but so far I'm heartbroken, its a wall of pure grinding to make you come back and play but frankly this is not the type of grind that I want. The only type of grind that should ever exist in an mmorpg is gear, reputations, professions etc but not lvling. This is a rant and yes I'm upset but I have no one else to blame other than myself I guess. I just don't have the time to put 8 hours a day grinding to go up a quarter of a lvl. Keep in mind that this is console, there are very few people at the vr ranks yet so there are no vr grind parties and even then there is no fun in this type of grinding. I will be going back to FF XIV for the release of Heavensward but I will return to this when they decide to make a change to the whole VR thing (if that ever happens). Please do not hate on my post, understand that this is my opinion and that I respect everyone's opinion aslong as they aren't ignorant.

...and this is why i keep rolling my eyes @ everyone on my friends list that is power grinding to level cap. skipping every last quest they possibly can along the way. I've got twice as much play time as most my friends, but half the level. I have friends that already hit cap and i just hit 17, lol. Having a blast now exploring every nook and cranny, because i know whats coming. Especially after i heard about xp potions i'm in even less of a rush to grind points for pvp..zzzzzzzz.

technohic

TequilaFire wrote: »

I totally disagree with those that think they have to be VR14 to enjoy pvp.
This is self imposed, and news flash you get stomped even as a VR14.
It will be even better if ZOS goes through with the proposed new pvp battle leveling for the VR ranks.

That will make it a lot better for a PvP player; but the PvEer wanting to do end game stuff still has a ways to go. ANd really; I would advise you just enjoy your pre-end game experience as far as that goes. There is only disappointment and more grinding in the end.

phairdon

Zevris wrote: »

eviltims wrote: »

I'm not at end game yet, but have been reading on it, and it seems the end game content is not what I expect I guess. Since I stop playing FF XIV I thought something like this would be fun for a long time, but probably not. Told myself to stop comparing it to FF XIV but I can't sadly.

If you don't mind spending hours a day doing quests and killing mobs to get very little xp and crap

MissBizz wrote: »

Many people dislike the VR levelling experience - hence ZOS is planning to remove it.

On the other hand, some (like myself) do enjoy it. I find it enjoyable because I just keep enjoying the quests and carry on, no need to rush. I honestly don't find it different from 1-50 (except that the whole zone is one level, instead of like 12 levels) Although, obviously, everyone is different.

I definitely understand where you are coming from, I just don't enjoy this type of experience, I enjoy end game. I loved questing in WoW because I felt the effort that went into a lot of the questlines but this games quests are sort of dull to me since I pretty much did the same ones just in a different faction : P

Always been my gripe about the veteran levels. Quests are pretty much the same throughout different factions. Other than that, I do not mind the veteran levels.

Funkopotamus

HeathenDeacon wrote: »

Zevris wrote: »

not impressed, I had so much fun going through the questline and all the different zones and such to get to lvl 50 or vr1. I honestly didn't know what to expect from VR ranks but so far I'm heartbroken, its a wall of pure grinding to make you come back and play but frankly this is not the type of grind that I want. The only type of grind that should ever exist in an mmorpg is gear, reputations, professions etc but not lvling. This is a rant and yes I'm upset but I have no one else to blame other than myself I guess. I just don't have the time to put 8 hours a day grinding to go up a quarter of a lvl. Keep in mind that this is console, there are very few people at the vr ranks yet so there are no vr grind parties and even then there is no fun in this type of grinding. I will be going back to FF XIV for the release of Heavensward but I will return to this when they decide to make a change to the whole VR thing (if that ever happens). Please do not hate on my post, understand that this is my opinion and that I respect everyone's opinion aslong as they aren't ignorant.

...and this is why i keep rolling my eyes @ everyone on my friends list that is power grinding to level cap. skipping every last quest they possibly can along the way. I've got twice as much play time as most my friends, but half the level. I have friends that already hit cap and i just hit 17, lol. Having a blast now exploring every nook and cranny, because i know whats coming. Especially after i heard about xp potions i'm in even less of a rush to grind points for pvp..zzzzzzzz.

Agree.. This game has S0 much more to offer than just to OMGRUSHGRINDTOCAPZORZNOW-WUT?
I will be enjoying this game for many months even into winter most likely.

Besides... Why are all of the new console players that are rushing to 50 are just going to meet up with transfers that are months ahead of them. So if they are rushing for that reason then they lost that race when they logged into the game. There are people that are closing in on CP's break points that I know for a fact transferred from PC. and it took them a LONG TIME to get that many CP's. So unless those players just do not log on for about 4 months the new console players will NEVER catch them.

Jando

This is what i write in every thread about veteran ranks, including my own, for the last 3-4 months:

The right approach here is not to remove VR's at all, but to reduce the xp to gain each rank to something like 150K. No other system in the game needs to be changed and they can do it in a hotfix. The 14 Veteran ranks essentially become 14 regular levels.

For those who still want a challenge in Cadwell Gold/Silver content: that content can be optimized for something like VR 15-20 and then they can "battle level" all characters up appropriately when entering those zones.

Done..problem solved. No reason it should be taking this long.

Dear Zos...Veteran Ranks are ruining your game...there's an easy fix...just do it!!

acolyte2475b14_ESO

I was kind of baffled by the xp pots on the crown store since the main gripe with this game is the end game/VR grind. Why would you want people to get there faster?

Funkopotamus

acolyte2475b14_ESO wrote: »

I was kind of baffled by the xp pots on the crown store since the main gripe with this game is the end game/VR grind. Why would you want people to get there faster?

It is kind of like selling fries without salt...

Molsondry

Dont grind any point for pvp its broken right now on pc some player can solo 12 + vr 14 player simply cauz they have complete yellow nirnhorned set with 600 + champions point. They are like a raid boss. Not to mention the macroing with animation canceling. Lol

Champions points+ Broken trait + animation canceling FTW!

But wait they said they are fixing ninhorned .. 4 month ago .

SOON *tm*

Arato

technohic wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

I totally disagree with those that think they have to be VR14 to enjoy pvp.
This is self imposed, and news flash you get stomped even as a VR14.
It will be even better if ZOS goes through with the proposed new pvp battle leveling for the VR ranks.

That will make it a lot better for a PvP player; but the PvEer wanting to do end game stuff still has a ways to go. ANd really; I would advise you just enjoy your pre-end game experience as far as that goes. There is only disappointment and more grinding in the end.

I enjoyed it until VR10-11ish when I finished Cadwell's gold, now that I've had to repeat Cyrodiil quests from VR11-VR13... I've gotten so sick of it that I just do not want to do it again.

But friends of mine who I'd love to have play this game again instead of Lord of the Rings Online that they're currently playing.. they want to be doing group content, and questing in this game with the phasing and such, is just not group friendly, so when they hit Cadwell's silver and were so tired of solo questing and they want to do end game group content but are told they really are too low level to do it, they just quit. Staring in the face of the same amount of solo content as reaching level 1-45 3 times over, and then STILL not being cap and then having to grind? They go to other games instead.

Lylith

as MizzBizz mentioned, previously: take your time.

i've hit v14 with two very different characters in the 4th gold zone. it's all in how you play.

Zorrashi

Remember when, back in development, there was no such thing as VR ranks? All that was planned for endgame was essentially just PvP and dungeons. Then when players voiced out that they wanted a way to experience the other alliances as well as having another avenue of playing endgame, they added veteran ranks and Cadwell's Silver/Gold.

VR ranks always seemed more like a quick patch-up to me. A quick way to add more things to do post level 50. But it has since demonstrated that most players are not content to grind their way through the levels, and many simply are not interested in Cadwell's almanac as an alternative method of leveling. The negative feedback was so prevalent, zos essentially acknowledged the problem and assured us they were going to do something about it (by removing them)....but they have yet to actually act on it.

So yeah, veteran ranks either need a revamp or need to be scrapped. I just wish they would hurry up on whatever they plan though.

Arato

acolyte2475b14_ESO wrote: »

I was kind of baffled by the xp pots on the crown store since the main gripe with this game is the end game/VR grind. Why would you want people to get there faster?

It isn't endgame that's the main complaint, it's veteran ranks, which isn't end game it's a barrier in between reaching the "level cap" and being actually able to do end game content.

It's a second level cap if you will, and it is the same amount of content as reaching the level cap of 50 more than 3x over.

technohic

Arato wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

I totally disagree with those that think they have to be VR14 to enjoy pvp.
This is self imposed, and news flash you get stomped even as a VR14.
It will be even better if ZOS goes through with the proposed new pvp battle leveling for the VR ranks.

That will make it a lot better for a PvP player; but the PvEer wanting to do end game stuff still has a ways to go. ANd really; I would advise you just enjoy your pre-end game experience as far as that goes. There is only disappointment and more grinding in the end.

I enjoyed it until VR10-11ish when I finished Cadwell's gold, now that I've had to repeat Cyrodiil quests from VR11-VR13... I've gotten so sick of it that I just do not want to do it again.

But friends of mine who I'd love to have play this game again instead of Lord of the Rings Online that they're currently playing.. they want to be doing group content, and questing in this game with the phasing and such, is just not group friendly, so when they hit Cadwell's silver and were so tired of solo questing and they want to do end game group content but are told they really are too low level to do it, they just quit. Staring in the face of the same amount of solo content as reaching level 1-45 3 times over, and then STILL not being cap and then having to grind? They go to other games instead.

Well...to be fair, the other games are indeed an option if ESO does not fit you. I really like parts of ESO but it really doesn't fit me either for different reasons than your friends. Particularly in the summer when I just don't feel like giving it much time

ESO is still confused on what it is. A single player ES game with friends occasionally/eventually? A Korean-ish grind fest? Should it focus more on its AvAvA or even expand to be a more PvP game? I think they are serious about the later but do not have all the resources, and they are definitely mixed in being a mostly solo game with friends ocassionally while having that grind fest to fill time. I guess it can be all of those things but there are a lot of things that turn off one group of players or the other.

RazzPitazz

smokes wrote: »

MCMancub wrote: »

Even if you ignore what you're doing, there's still a structure that exists. There are clearly defined goals with beginning and end points. Even if you are AFK questing while watching Netflix, it isn't grinding. There's a central purpose to what you're doing. Much in the same way that driving around my block over and over isn't the same as me spacing out as I drive 10 miles to work every day.

i'm not sure there's an oxford english dictionary definition for mmo grinding. so we're just arguing semantics and taking this thread way off course.

although the urban dictionary defines it as: Virtual Meaning: To perform repetitive tasks in a game, in order to level up the ranks.

i think: skip quest text > kill mobs > loot quest objective > skip quest text > complete quest > go to next quest > rinse/repeat, qualifies as grinding in my opinion.

there's a full wikipedia article devoted to it, but i honestly couldn't be bothered to read more than the first paragraph
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grinding_(video_gaming)

edit: brackets in the link apparently breaks the link, copy and pase if you need to.

Oxford Dictionary
Grinding: (Of a state) operative, tedious, and seemingly without end.
(Of a difficult situation) That never ends or improves.

The only difference between running in circles killing mobs for cp or questing for xp is questing had s literal beginning and ending.
You can find an area with mobs and grind them, finding the next mob in the line until the initial ones respawn. You can do this until you outlevel the mobs significantly and need a new area.
You find a quest, run it and complete it, find the next quest run it complete it until you either finish all of the quests in the area or significantly outlevel the quests, either way you need a new area.
One is a sweet potato, the other is a yam.

MissBizz

Arato wrote: »

MissBizz wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Grinding? What grinding? Untill i reacher VR12

NEVER GRINDED in ESO

Just make sure you complete all quests in every zone. Caldwell gold and silver. Sidequests.

They give TON of exp and lot of cash, items for decon or vendoring.

It makes me laugh when people hit VR1 and start crying that they have to grind but they didnt expierence even 1/3 of whole game.

I love veteran rank lvls. I can finally make good gear without being afrad that in one minute ill outlevel it again.

Once you hit VR10 or 11ish you run out of quests though and just have to repeat the same quests in Cyrodiil or Craglorn on a daily basis for the last few ranks. That IS grinding, and it's poor design and planning.

This heavily depends on how you play. As I enjoy the VR content, I play through all of the zones, not rushing through it, as well break up my time by doing group activities such as guild events and dungeons (mostly veteran). I am sitting at VR12 in a VR8 zone. I have absolutely no doubts I will be VR14 before I hit Craglorn.

Arato wrote: »

There's a small minority of players who defend VR's to the end of the earth though.

Hmm.. well, I do defend them in a way that states I enjoy them, although I can also see the other side and understand why (I would say the majority) players do not like them. Really, get rid of them. I'd be a bit saddened as I love the idea of level progression, but it wouldn't kill me. Leave Caldwell's as optional and boom - everyone should be happy. (Won't be, as it is completely impossible to make everyone happy, but hey, in my opinion I think it would make the majority of players happy)

I did every single quest, every single delve, every single public dungeon, every single dolmen, every single world boss, every single POI, found every crafting station, every skyshard, etc....

still shy of VR11 by the time I finished cadwell's gold.

@Arato Good chance it has something to do with me doing vet dungeons whenever I can, doing every dolmen I walk by that is up (so dolmens more than once), same with world bosses, oh and of course guild events.. Mainly cyrodiil ones grant me plenty of xp. I don't only quest through the zone and just hit everything for experience, I wander, and do random other group activities as well.

MissBizz

Baconlad wrote: »

I'm in the house that enjoys the vet ranks....but would love to see changes, they should not give you ANY attribute points or given increases with each level, they should NOT be a gear gate, they should only offer skill points, maybe more unique titles, and costumes, pets...maybe a gate for certain quests...i don't know. It needs to be truly horizontal, which is how they marketed vr levels. But now they are simply trying to make them regular levels that take a STUPID amount of time to level through questing. In order to play endgame content or even begin to gear up for endgame you have to be v14, there's no way around it. They could have saved SO many resources by just making level 50 the true top level, and stripping v10 gear down to level 50 a YEAR ago...instead they drug along this grind and are regretting it.

@Baconlad I have never ever thought of that. But that is brilliant! It would feel rewarding to the players doing the extra content, but at the same time, is not necessary in any way by those wanting end game sooner. I always liked it because I like progression, that would give someone like me progression.. But not hinder anyone who didn't want to do it.. @Gidorick did you see this post?

Genomic

Step 1: Create a hugely drawn out and boring VR levelling process
Step 2: Introduce XP potions to cash shop
Step 3: ????
Step 4: Profit.


All part of the plan.

Craven_Killmore

it's hilarious that this is still even in the game, stopped at vr4 and haven't logged on since, I check the forums from time to time and that's it.

remove vr ranks or lose your player base the choice is extremely simple.

Legedric

Many PC players warned that they will most definitely loose many players when they hit the VR ranks...
ZOS didn't listen to us and so they've got to learn it the hard way, aka have to look at their high bounce rate