So my subscription has 2 weeks left. Last plea for a better ESO+.

desciviib14_ESO

Valymer wrote: »

What world do you guys live in where you feel the need to financially support a multi-million dollar, for-profit company?

If that is indeed the only reason why many people still pay a sub.

My reason and guess for others is that it's not to support a company explicitly but rather a way of saying I enjoy what they are doing and good products deserve payment but as myself and others have noted the tide feels like it has turned.

Valymer

desciviib14_ESO wrote: »

Valymer wrote: »

What world do you guys live in where you feel the need to financially support a multi-million dollar, for-profit company?

If that is indeed the only reason why many people still pay a sub.

My reason and guess for others is that it's not to support a company explicitly but rather a way of saying I enjoy what they are doing and good products deserve payment but as myself and others have noted the tide feels like it has turned.

Well I can understand that I guess...even if my stance is pretty much the polar opposite.

I guess its just harder for me to accept that some people still feel that ZOS is moving in the right direction.

Raash

Gidorick wrote: »

When I made this thread on April 20th @Giles.floydub17_ESO, I did because, as subscriber that truly wants to continue to subscribe, I wanted to know I did everything I could to let ZOS know my thoughts.

I knew I wasn't alone... The number of threads we have all posted about this shows that.

It's not that I'm saying "give me this or I'll quit " it's more "I don't want to quit but I have no reason not to."

Fine line? Sure. But it's a defined line.

Why turn a blind eye to the 3rd option? Continue play for free?

EQBallzz wrote: »

Raash wrote: »

I really dont understand people. Why throw around "I cancel my sub" as some important statement when this game doesnt even have a sub? Im sorry but you are like 6 months or more off. What you are doing is more like throwing a bucket worth of water at the ocean believing it will kill the damn thing.

Uhhhhh..the game still has a sub...it's just not mandatory. The purpose of the thread is to call attention to the fact that the current benefits from subbing are not worth the cost. Reading comprehension FTW.

Making use of what resides between the ears are also a good start. The game canned subscription and went b2p & ftp.
Paying monthly for crowns and get minor perks as a token of appreciation is just that. Its not an act of heroism or charity. Its only another way to buy crowns then through the store packs.

olsborg

I wont resub when my sub expires in 38 days, atleast not if ESO+ is then what it is now. No new content on the horizon either.

Gandrhulf_Harbard

desciviib14_ESO wrote: »

Valymer wrote: »

What world do you guys live in where you feel the need to financially support a multi-million dollar, for-profit company?

If that is indeed the only reason why many people still pay a sub.

My reason and guess for others is that it's not to support a company explicitly but rather a way of saying I enjoy what they are doing and good products deserve payment but as myself and others have noted the tide feels like it has turned.

Pretty much in agreement there.

Also I was brought up to believe in a simple principle - fair pay for fair work.

I'm not at end-game yet so I guess there is still a lot that is new for me to discover yet, and while that is the case I'll gladly continue to sub. But I can't foresee that I'll feel the same once I am in to the EGG (End-Game-Grind).

All The Best

Ysne58

@Gidorick has never said he is going stop playing. He is looking for a reason to keep paying the optional sub.

I'm in the same boat he is, except my sub expires the end of May.

Here's the thing.
1. The company has engaged in deceptive behavior. Many of us believe they have outright lied to us, more than once.
2. They have not fixed the Lag issue in Cyrodiil. It sounds like they need to rewrite the programming for that from the ground up.
3. The new content promises they made at the beginning have not been kept. It appears to many of us that at least some of that content has been ready to go for months.
4. The amount of crowns we get per month don't even match the best deal available.

So what reason is there to keep paying a sub. The devs have not even acknowledged that the lack of business ethics is a problem. If we were to get an apology from them with a promise to improve, that would help.

They need to set aside enough of their team to rewrite the part of the program responsible for the lag and then restart cyrodiil.

They should consider raising the number of crowns to match the best deal in the crown store.

I still think that for me the most important issue is the lack of integrity they have displayed.

Gidorick

Oh, I'm going to continue to play @Raash, for sure!

Raash

Ysne58 wrote: »

@Gidorick has never said he is going stop playing. He is looking for a reason to keep paying the optional sub.

I'm in the same boat he is, except my sub expires the end of May.

Here's the thing.
1. The company has engaged in deceptive behavior. Many of us believe they have outright lied to us, more than once.
2. They have not fixed the Lag issue in Cyrodiil. It sounds like they need to rewrite the programming for that from the ground up.
3. The new content promises they made at the beginning have not been kept. It appears to many of us that at least some of that content has been ready to go for months.
4. The amount of crowns we get per month don't even match the best deal available.

So what reason is there to keep paying a sub. The devs have not even acknowledged that the lack of business ethics is a problem. If we were to get an apology from them with a promise to improve, that would help.

They need to set aside enough of their team to rewrite the part of the program responsible for the lag and then restart cyrodiil.

They should consider raising the number of crowns to match the best deal in the crown store.

I still think that for me the most important issue is the lack of integrity they have displayed.

I think the messege when game went b2p & f2p were pretty straight forward, monthly sub was a dead end - we ditch it!

I agree on all your points (1, 2, 3 ) but it has little to nothing to do with ESO+ at this moment.
I am not sure i wholeheartly agree with point 4, because you actually recieve the 10% more ingame gold, more xp etc. If you want a raised number of crowns sure, but then those who buy just the crowns should also get the perks to match it.
There is no sub, all who ever payed for the game can play it for free. its all just different ways to pay for crowns and it must be fair in both directions when choosing paying monthly for them or just straight up in the packs.

Gidorick

Ysne58 wrote: »

4. The amount of crowns we get per month don't even match the best deal available.

This is THE single greatest reason I want the sub to be better.

If you pay for 6 months sub you get 9000 Crowns for $77.94. or 115.47 Crowns/$1
If you buy the large Crown pack you get 5500 Crowns for $39.99 or 137.53 Crowns/$1

For $80, you will get 2,000 MORE Crowns for NOT being a subscriber. I'm curious how many XP pots 2,000 Crowns will buy.
I'm thinking unless you're the type to play 8-12 hours every day, you get a MUCH better deal if you just buy the Crown packs.

So now the benefit to the sub is just the crafting inspiration and gold boost.

Raash

Gidorick wrote: »

Oh, I'm going to continue to play @Raash, for sure!

Ah ok, thats good to hear
I think many got the wrong idea what this game payment system is all about now. since when a game ditch monthly subs and goes b2p & f2p, all players that has bought the game is on even ground.
The moment they add too much to the membership over regular purchases the game has gone p2w and is no longer a pure b2p game.

Bouvin

Vaerth wrote: »

They wont add anything in 2 weeks to keep one person from unsubscribing. But...I am with ya on it. If we have no content announced by May 1st I am cancelling as well. Console means nothing to me, and is not content for me when I play PC. This game has become boring and stagnant because they do not add content like they once promised.

Right.

Reality is, they probably won't add anything in the next several months to keep thousands of people subscribing.

Just like they didn't add anything over the past 9+ months to keep tens of thousands of people subscribing....

Bouvin

olsborg wrote: »

I wont resub when my sub expires in 38 days, atleast not if ESO+ is then what it is now. No new content on the horizon either.

Awwww but there has been new content on the horizon. Since Quake Con in July last year. This is when they showed off the following content that STILL HASN'T BEEN RELEASED AFTER 9 MONTHS since showing it off

• Imperial City
• Spellcrafting
• Enforcer System (the half of justice that got canned)
• Murkmire Adventure Zone
• Wrothgar Adventure Zone

It's just their ability to actually release that content that's the problem.

Source: http://dulfy.net/2014/07/18/eso-quakecon-the-future-of-eso-panel-notes/

Raash

Gidorick wrote: »

Ysne58 wrote: »

4. The amount of crowns we get per month don't even match the best deal available.

This is THE single greatest reason I want the sub to be better.

If you pay for 6 months sub you get 9000 Crowns for $77.94. or 115.47 Crowns/$1
If you buy the large Crown pack you get 5500 Crowns for $39.99 or 137.53 Crowns/$1

For $80, you will get 2,000 MORE Crowns for NOT being a subscriber. I'm curious how many XP pots 2,000 Crowns will buy.
I'm thinking unless you're the type to play 8-12 hours every day, you get a MUCH better deal if you just buy the Crown packs.

So now the benefit to the sub is just the crafting inspiration and gold boost.

I think you should look at this as with any other sales of services or goods. Why would your payment of 15 dollars a month for crowns be worth more then the 40 dollars when someone buys that package straight up?
There is this saying that cash is king, and most often you get a discount or better deals when buying larger quantities of something straight up then when you buy small portions of it over time.
They should add that if you sign on for lets say a 6 month sub then you should get more crowns then those who just sign one month at a time. That would make sense.

Gidorick

Raash wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

Ysne58 wrote: »

4. The amount of crowns we get per month don't even match the best deal available.

This is THE single greatest reason I want the sub to be better.

If you pay for 6 months sub you get 9000 Crowns for $77.94. or 115.47 Crowns/$1
If you buy the large Crown pack you get 5500 Crowns for $39.99 or 137.53 Crowns/$1

For $80, you will get 2,000 MORE Crowns for NOT being a subscriber. I'm curious how many XP pots 2,000 Crowns will buy.
I'm thinking unless you're the type to play 8-12 hours every day, you get a MUCH better deal if you just buy the Crown packs.

So now the benefit to the sub is just the crafting inspiration and gold boost.

I think you should look at this as with any other sales of services or goods. Why would your payment of 15 dollars a month for crowns be worth more then the 40 dollars when someone buys that package straight up?
There is this saying that cash is king, and most often you get a discount or better deals when buying larger quantities of something straight up then when you buy small portions of it over time.
They should add that if you sign on for lets say a 6 month sub then you should get more crowns then those who just sign one month at a time. That would make sense.

If a 6 month sub yielded 11000 crowns, I'd probably just stay subbed.

nastuug

Valymer wrote: »

What world do you guys live in where you feel the need to financially support a multi-million dollar, for-profit company?

If that is indeed the only reason why many people still pay a sub.

It looks like people feel sorry for them. Yeah, I sure feel bad for a company that owns the rights to: Doom, Quake, The Elder Scrolls, Fallout, Wolfenstein, Rage, Dishonored. lol

Potenza

NowURDeadXD wrote: »

I too would like additional benifits for subscribing that's worth more as he was saying pets are useless they don't help you out they are just pointless and I refuse to buy any more pets and what good is 10 percent Bonus when you already get nothing for experience and gold what's ten percent of nothing well that would be nothing right and subscribers should not have a limit on how many characters they can delete that's rediculous and now with out rewards like loyalty system you tell me why people should sub to your game and support it if your not going to show some thanks for sub scribing me my self I subscribed for another 6 months cause I want you to keep the game running and fix things you should give discounts on things in crown store for subscribers at least 25 to 50 percent since we are the ones that will be supporting your jobs and keep you in business longer trust me I know people are cheap and don't want to subscribe that's why you should give back to those that do subscribe and show them you want them to stay and keep subscribing other wise people are gonna get wise to this kinda stuff and your gonna be loosing money and we all know at the end of the day it's all about the money for and company and business or you wouldn't be making this game and with out players paying your salaries you won't have a job this needs to be addressed for the fans and for your sake but much love for the game couple of *** ups after launch but I'm hoping you guys get your ducks in a row and at least make it look like your not just trying to make everyone look like a bunch of fat horkers for buying a subcription

Probly the longest sentence I ever read?

EQBallzz

Raash wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

When I made this thread on April 20th @Giles.floydub17_ESO, I did because, as subscriber that truly wants to continue to subscribe, I wanted to know I did everything I could to let ZOS know my thoughts.

I knew I wasn't alone... The number of threads we have all posted about this shows that.

It's not that I'm saying "give me this or I'll quit " it's more "I don't want to quit but I have no reason not to."

Fine line? Sure. But it's a defined line.

Why turn a blind eye to the 3rd option? Continue play for free?

EQBallzz wrote: »

Raash wrote: »

I really dont understand people. Why throw around "I cancel my sub" as some important statement when this game doesnt even have a sub? Im sorry but you are like 6 months or more off. What you are doing is more like throwing a bucket worth of water at the ocean believing it will kill the damn thing.

Uhhhhh..the game still has a sub...it's just not mandatory. The purpose of the thread is to call attention to the fact that the current benefits from subbing are not worth the cost. Reading comprehension FTW.

Making use of what resides between the ears are also a good start. The game canned subscription and went b2p & ftp.
Paying monthly for crowns and get minor perks as a token of appreciation is just that. Its not an act of heroism or charity. Its only another way to buy crowns then through the store packs.

You don't have to recognize that there is still a sub but that doesn't mean there is no sub. There is still a sub called "ESO+" and it also applies to future content. If you don't sub you won't have access to that content unless you buy the content. So the question isn't whether or not there is a sub but rather..is it worth a sub now when there is no new content in-sight and that also leads to the question of whether it will ever be a viable option if there will be year long stretches between content updates. That's the whole point of the thread..to point out that there needs to be more value attached to the sub option with more/better perks as well as more content. By all means..make use of your brain next time.

NadiusMaximus

And if you're subbed you get that content for free or pay for it? They already said you don't keep it if you unsubbed and don't pay for it.

So why sub? You still end up paying twice for the new ***.

Mettaricana

thinking of ditching subs aswell its not really doing anything pvp or pve for me the 10% is so small an increase its just not worth my money

EQBallzz

NadiusMaximus wrote: »

And if you're subbed you get that content for free or pay for it? They already said you don't keep it if you unsubbed and don't pay for it.

So why sub? You still end up paying twice for the new ***.

Well in theory you would stay subbed as long as you wanted to keep playing and any DLC that comes out you would have access to without having to purchase it from the P2W shop (plus you get the other bonuses). If you quit..you don't continue to have access to DLC but you quit so no reason to buy it. In practice, this isn't working out that way because there is no content that a sub gives access to (which is the point of the thread)!

Spottswoode

I've said this when the b2p change occured, (and directly before) but the b2p development schedule will likely be the reason I quit playing this game. As the priority will inevitably be shifted to developing new shop items to drive cash shop sales, ( It happens in every f2p game.) the level of actual content development will drop off slowly and eventually fade out completely. As this relates to this topic, pretty much the only way I'll stay subbed to this game is if the perks are worth a crap. Other than that, I'll probably stay subbed for about another 2 months and stop playing daily until new content comes out. Then the slow death will begin from there.


They really should give priority queues to subscribers at minimum. Extra storage and free mounts would be even better.

Gidorick

You're right @Spottswoode. If we were getting regular DLC there would be more reason to sub... as it is, I just don't see a reason to stay subbed.

Heromofo

Gidorick wrote: »

You're right @Spottswoode. If we were getting regular DLC there would be more reason to sub... as it is, I just don't see a reason to stay subbed.

Mmm not really bud

1. Because we only rent the dlc if subbed it will work out better just to buy the dlc for what ever price the consensus is they will be between 15-30 dollars.
2. The little exp boost does not really help especially since most players capped there crafting before b2p
3. The crowns are not needed your better just buying crowns if you see something you like

Atm we are trying to get them to change this especially before console release.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/168807/eso-multi-tier-suggestion-requesting-feedback#latest

Let me know what you think bud.

Jixjax

The answer is very simple. ESO subscription = value when crown store has enough attractive items for purchase (there aren't enough now) and there's DLC content available.

The solution isn't playing around with bonsues of the subscription. It's making what the subscription gives you (equivalent crown purchases and content access) attractive enough to commit to.

Until then, it's not worth it.

Slurg

Jixjax wrote: »

The answer is very simple. ESO subscription = value when crown store has enough attractive items for purchase (there aren't enough now) and there's DLC content available.

The solution isn't playing around with bonsues of the subscription. It's making what the subscription gives you (equivalent crown purchases and content access) attractive enough to commit to.

Until then, it's not worth it.

Agreed. People demanding all kinds of changes to the subscription plan right now are being very short sighted. In a year when the crown store is full and there are multiple DLC packages, it will be of value. Demanding the devs change it right now to make a few people who can't accept that subs aren't neceasary anymore happy for the next couple of months is not the way to go.

Merlin13KAGL

It's sad to see it get to this point, especially from many avid supporters from before Day 1.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but unsubbing is simply one more step in the same same direction. As @Gidorick has previously explained in various ways, you go where there is purpose. The sub helped reflect that.

Unsubbing is not the cause, but rather the effect. It is one of many symptoms that I think a lot of hard core defenders are finding themselves in. It's getting hard to justify the ESO experience for 100 different reasons.

This causes us to lose heart. Losing heart causes us to support all aspects less, not just the ones measured in $ and cents.

It's an indication of a little less show of support, and no one, ZoS least of all, can justify the counterargument at this point.

The novelty of crown store items will wear off. Longevity of this game depends on the longevity of the players. The constant influx and outflux of new players will eventually not be enough to sustain it in the form we've come to hope for.

It hasn't been enough up to this point or they wouldn't have changed their direction.

While continuing to play now, eventually it becomes less and less. We all know where it goes from there.

Take that on a larger scale and it's easy to see the end result.

There are only so many costumes and pets you can buy.

Disappointed, and seriously considering following suit.

Valymer

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

It's sad to see it get to this point, especially from many avid supporters from before Day 1.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but unsubbing is simply one more step in the same same direction. As @Gidorick has previously explained in various ways, you go where there is purpose. The sub helped reflect that.

Unsubbing is not the cause, but rather the effect. It is one of many symptoms that I think a lot of hard core defenders are finding themselves in. It's getting hard to justify the ESO experience for 100 different reasons.

This causes us to lose heart. Losing heart causes us to support all aspects less, not just the ones measured in $ and cents.

It's an indication of a little less show of support, and no one, ZoS least of all, can justify the counterargument at this point.

The novelty of crown store items will wear off. Longevity of this game depends on the longevity of the players. The constant influx and outflux of new players will eventually not be enough to sustain it in the form we've come to hope for.

It hasn't been enough up to this point or they wouldn't have changed their direction.

While continuing to play now, eventually it becomes less and less. We all know where it goes from there.

Take that on a larger scale and it's easy to see the end result.

There are only so many costumes and pets you can buy.

Disappointed, and seriously considering following suit.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

c.p.garrett1993_ESO

Slurg wrote: »

Jixjax wrote: »

The answer is very simple. ESO subscription = value when crown store has enough attractive items for purchase (there aren't enough now) and there's DLC content available.

The solution isn't playing around with bonsues of the subscription. It's making what the subscription gives you (equivalent crown purchases and content access) attractive enough to commit to.

Until then, it's not worth it.

Agreed. People demanding all kinds of changes to the subscription plan right now are being very short sighted. In a year when the crown store is full and there are multiple DLC packages, it will be of value. Demanding the devs change it right now to make a few people who can't accept that subs aren't neceasary anymore happy for the next couple of months is not the way to go.

"In a year..."
I don't see how you can justify the concept of paying $15 a month for nothing but the possibility it will be worth it a year down the road. You will still need to pay for it then as well, making no difference if you are subscribed now or not.

Gidorick

You eloquently echo my own thoughts @Merlin13KAGL. The reason I want to subscribe is because right now, I don't see myself spending any money on what ZOS is offering.

I don't want to play dressup with different pretty pets. I want to adventure!

Slurg

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

Slurg wrote: »

Jixjax wrote: »

The answer is very simple. ESO subscription = value when crown store has enough attractive items for purchase (there aren't enough now) and there's DLC content available.

The solution isn't playing around with bonsues of the subscription. It's making what the subscription gives you (equivalent crown purchases and content access) attractive enough to commit to.

Until then, it's not worth it.

Agreed. People demanding all kinds of changes to the subscription plan right now are being very short sighted. In a year when the crown store is full and there are multiple DLC packages, it will be of value. Demanding the devs change it right now to make a few people who can't accept that subs aren't neceasary anymore happy for the next couple of months is not the way to go.

"In a year..."
I don't see how you can justify the concept of paying $15 a month for nothing but the possibility it will be worth it a year down the road. You will still need to pay for it then as well, making no difference if you are subscribed now or not.

Nice straw man argument. I don't justify it right now and you know that. I posted that before. Everyone who doesn't like what's in the sub right now should cancel. Subs are not mandatory and ZOS is no longer basing their entire income on having one. They made it optional for a reason.

Did you ever stop and think the new sub model isn't meant to be for the long timers who can buy DLC as they go? It'll be much more attractive to the new console audience coming in late after several DLC packs are introduced, who don't want to drop $100 up front on the DLC after just buying the game.