ESO needs a simple difficulty slider.

idk

Hate to bring up an obvious remark but they already have difficulty slider. One that only affects the character and not the game. It works for solo and open world content.

Remove gear/CP points. Heck, use a lower level/quality weapon.

This is not a NW feature to ESO either. I've seen this same feature in many MMOs.

Happy to help.

Dahveed

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Difficulty sliders don't work in MMOs, because you can't just have different groups of people running around in their own game world.

First of all, no need to go name calling. I am not "naive".

Secondly, ironic that the person calling me naive still didn't understand the basic concept of this thread. If you did, you would know that what I am proposing would not force players to "run around in their own game world."

Read my original post - carefully, this time - and you'll understand why.

Dahveed

Fleshreaper wrote: »

Delves already take the group leader's Level in to count. It shouldn't be a problem for the delve to look at the group leaders, difficulty settings. As far as letting other players know what difficulty setting the leader has set it's simple enough, the same way you see if a delve is vet or regular.

Indeed, the group leader would just have to advertise his difficulty setting. Yet another problem easily solved. Yet people still want to argue and say it can't be done... I just don't understand why people are being so obstinate.

Dahveed

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Hate to bring up an obvious remark but they already have difficulty slider. One that only affects the character and not the game. It works for solo and open world content.

Remove gear/CP points. Heck, use a lower level/quality weapon.

This is not a NW feature to ESO either. I've seen this same feature in many MMOs.

Happy to help.

[...]

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting Comments]

Argoniawind

I knew this topic was gonna get heat from the mmo players, while the Elder Scrolls players aka me are gonna be for the slider. I could use this slider to make stuff easy for me since all I do is play solo and I know some areas that are insane hard. But its up to the devs to make it happen!

baratron

Dahveed wrote: »

xDonMega wrote: »

The difficulty in this game isn't the content... It's having the metal fortitude to grind through 14 veteran ranks with an xp nerf...

And by this game going subscription free after only 1 year, I think that difficulty setting might be way too high already.

This is where we disagree. I think the big gap in the player base are the "MMO gu;ys" and the "Elder Scrolls/RP guys". I would put myself in the latter category.

The "MMO guys" are all about level cap; this is what most MMOs seem to be about. Get to the end level, get the best loot, kill the boss and get the achievement. Feel like you've won.

The "Elder Scrolls/RP guys" are all about taking their time to soak in the atmosphere, delve into the lore, explore the zones and see all the sights, listen to the quest dialogue and try to stay in character. For us (I wouldn't presume to speak for all of "us" of course), we want fun and challenging quests and dungeons as our character progresses and explores Tamriel.

The problem is that most content, with rare exceptions, feels redundant. You just spent the last 60 minutes on this quest chain? gratz, here's the boss. A non-elite leveled NPC who might spout 1 or 2 lines of dialogue before you kill him in 4 seconds, finishing the fight at full health, barely even using your abilities. Then you complete the quest and the loot, while perhaps an upgrade, feels redundant because your character is OP as hell anyways compared to current leveled content.

This is why a simple difficulty slider would be perfect. Straight out of the gates at lvl 1 I could put it on "Master" difficulty to nerf my character's stats... the fights now just got way more challenging, and I can still feel like I can push myself and my character to the highest level possible using all the tools the game provides (gear, talents, buffs, interrupts dodge etc etc) while still having to stay on my toes against powerful opponents.

It amuses me that you're the same sort of player that I am, and yet your experience of the game has been so different.

I'm a massive, massive Elder Scrolls fan, but I hate fighting. I enjoy the background and Lore, and the dialogue in quests, and levelling up my Acrobatics skill by jumping off roofs in Bravil. I have always started new single-player ES games on the easiest difficulty setting, because I wanted the combat easy enough for me to be able to progress in the story. I considered it a great achievement once I'd become good enough at Skyrim to begin a new, Level 1 character on "Adept" rather than "Novice"! Even now after over 1000 hours of Skyrim, I still don't know how anyone could ever want to play the game on "Legendary" difficulty.

I spent my beta weekends in ESO basically crying because of how hard the combat in the game was, and I almost didn't buy the game because of the lack of a difficulty slider. When they introduced scaling for solo dungeons, so you couldn't just overlevel it and come back later, I cried again. When they introduced scaling for group dungeons, I threw a fairly major tantrum.

Now, a year into playing, I have three Veterans and I'm finally at the stage where I can pick up a new character in a new class with a weapon I haven't used before and not die three times an hour. I can run any solo dungeon without even blinking. But only because I know the quests backwards, and exactly how each type of monster behaves, and my newbies are starting out with nice green or blue enchanted armour with set bonuses and a whole load of Champion Points.

Frankly, as an "Elder Scrolls/RP" fan, it amazed me that ESO didn't have a difficulty slider, because to me combat is such a minor part of the game.

bloodenragedb14_ESO

a difficulty slider? no, but maybe a level slider, allowing you to scale your level to the area you are in. allowing you to actually get some fun exploring lowbie area's every once and awhile. i mean, there is no reason to backtrack once you outlevel a area, and there is no fun in steamrolling the enemies in a lowbie area.

BuggeX

Well i think the slider would work with 3 states only. Easy - Normal - Hard. Every State has it own Phase.
Groupdungeons and Trails should not be affected by this.

It increases server load since the server has to keep a track on people on different difficulties and create instances differently for different people. this increases already bad performance.
It's not as easy as just nerfing stats. It would require different AI for enemies as well.

This would work easy, the Server allready creat x Phase for the Player. IF now the Server has to generate a Moob with 10k Hp and 5k dmg or 5k Hp and 2k dmg doesnt matter.

Draxys

Yes I'd like a difficult slider for PvP so I can set it to easy and one shot everyone.

Dahveed

BuggeX wrote: »

Well i think the slider would work with 3 states only. Easy - Normal - Hard. Every State has it own Phase.
Groupdungeons and Trails should not be affected by this.

It increases server load since the server has to keep a track on people on different difficulties and create instances differently for different people. this increases already bad performance.
It's not as easy as just nerfing stats. It would require different AI for enemies as well.

This would work easy, the Server allready creat x Phase for the Player. IF now the Server has to generate a Moob with 10k Hp and 5k dmg or 5k Hp and 2k dmg doesnt matter.

I appreciate the input, but there goes another poster talking about "phases".

Phasing is completely unnecessary with a difficulty slider. I've explained why.

The player character is the only object which would be affected, not the mobs.

Audigy

I have to say that I don't want to gimp my char to gain a challenge, what I want is that the actual content scales to me. Why find a brand new sword if I have to unequip it all the time?

Dahveed

baratron wrote: »

Dahveed wrote: »

xDonMega wrote: »

The difficulty in this game isn't the content... It's having the metal fortitude to grind through 14 veteran ranks with an xp nerf...

And by this game going subscription free after only 1 year, I think that difficulty setting might be way too high already.

This is where we disagree. I think the big gap in the player base are the "MMO gu;ys" and the "Elder Scrolls/RP guys". I would put myself in the latter category.

The "MMO guys" are all about level cap; this is what most MMOs seem to be about. Get to the end level, get the best loot, kill the boss and get the achievement. Feel like you've won.

The "Elder Scrolls/RP guys" are all about taking their time to soak in the atmosphere, delve into the lore, explore the zones and see all the sights, listen to the quest dialogue and try to stay in character. For us (I wouldn't presume to speak for all of "us" of course), we want fun and challenging quests and dungeons as our character progresses and explores Tamriel.

The problem is that most content, with rare exceptions, feels redundant. You just spent the last 60 minutes on this quest chain? gratz, here's the boss. A non-elite leveled NPC who might spout 1 or 2 lines of dialogue before you kill him in 4 seconds, finishing the fight at full health, barely even using your abilities. Then you complete the quest and the loot, while perhaps an upgrade, feels redundant because your character is OP as hell anyways compared to current leveled content.

This is why a simple difficulty slider would be perfect. Straight out of the gates at lvl 1 I could put it on "Master" difficulty to nerf my character's stats... the fights now just got way more challenging, and I can still feel like I can push myself and my character to the highest level possible using all the tools the game provides (gear, talents, buffs, interrupts dodge etc etc) while still having to stay on my toes against powerful opponents.

It amuses me that you're the same sort of player that I am, and yet your experience of the game has been so different.

I'm a massive, massive Elder Scrolls fan, but I hate fighting. I enjoy the background and Lore, and the dialogue in quests, and levelling up my Acrobatics skill by jumping off roofs in Bravil. I have always started new single-player ES games on the easiest difficulty setting, because I wanted the combat easy enough for me to be able to progress in the story. I considered it a great achievement once I'd become good enough at Skyrim to begin a new, Level 1 character on "Adept" rather than "Novice"! Even now after over 1000 hours of Skyrim, I still don't know how anyone could ever want to play the game on "Legendary" difficulty.

I spent my beta weekends in ESO basically crying because of how hard the combat in the game was, and I almost didn't buy the game because of the lack of a difficulty slider. When they introduced scaling for solo dungeons, so you couldn't just overlevel it and come back later, I cried again. When they introduced scaling for group dungeons, I threw a fairly major tantrum.

Now, a year into playing, I have three Veterans and I'm finally at the stage where I can pick up a new character in a new class with a weapon I haven't used before and not die three times an hour. I can run any solo dungeon without even blinking. But only because I know the quests backwards, and exactly how each type of monster behaves, and my newbies are starting out with nice green or blue enchanted armour with set bonuses and a whole load of Champion Points.

Frankly, as an "Elder Scrolls/RP" fan, it amazed me that ESO didn't have a difficulty slider, because to me combat is such a minor part of the game.

Actually in some respects we're more alike than you might think.

The biggest difference, I believe, is that the difficulty for me adds a better sense of realism and danger to the world. A vast world with war zones, beasts, diseases, undead, civil strife and so forth ought to feel dangerous, but if my level 1 noobie in Skyrim or Oblivion goes out and just ploughs through everything easily, it takes away that feeling of danger.

I like to feel that every time I step into the wilderness, my life is balanced on a blade's edge and I have to be careful about what I'm doing and where I'm going, because I am very mortal indeed and don't want to die.

But what ESO has right now just doesn't feel dangerous or exciting to me. Nothing in the world can kill my character, so it just feels like an artificial MMO "grind".

I appreciate your thoughts, however... It just goes to show that it's impossible to pick one difficulty level for the entire game, and that a slider would be all the more appreciated.

Dahveed

Audigy wrote: »

I have to say that I don't want to gimp my char to gain a challenge, what I want is that the actual content scales to me. Why find a brand new sword if I have to unequip it all the time?

EXACTLY!

i wish people telling us to remove our gear and talents etc. would understand this.

Part of the fun of this game and others like it is that you WANT to gear up and improve your character to RISE to the challenge.

BuggeX

Dahveed wrote: »

BuggeX wrote: »

Well i think the slider would work with 3 states only. Easy - Normal - Hard. Every State has it own Phase.
Groupdungeons and Trails should not be affected by this.

It increases server load since the server has to keep a track on people on different difficulties and create instances differently for different people. this increases already bad performance.
It's not as easy as just nerfing stats. It would require different AI for enemies as well.

This would work easy, the Server allready creat x Phase for the Player. IF now the Server has to generate a Moob with 10k Hp and 5k dmg or 5k Hp and 2k dmg doesnt matter.

I appreciate the input, but there goes another poster talking about "phases".

Phasing is completely unnecessary with a difficulty slider. I've explained why.

The player character is the only object which would be affected, not the mobs.

Not true at all, after some quest you have 2 possibilitis to Chance the world around you. No matter wath you do there, the Server generate a uniqe Phase.
For example, if u kill, at the end of the qs, the npc and i not, we will never see us in this place at the world.
Every Phase has it own paramenters and arent equal.

Phasing would be the easiest way to do it. Make 3 Mainphase, one for each state.

edit: also the Option to add Moobs and random Worldbosses would work with phases.

Cazic

This is a crazy idea that will never work. The idea is simple and common in single player games, but actually having this type of a mechanic in a MMO is anything but.

It wouldn't make sense for one player to be taking more or less damage than another, just because they adjust a slider. And having to consider what difficulty every other player is set to when grouping? That would suck.

Part of the idea of a MMO is that we're all playing in the same world, and work together to deal with the same encounters and scenarios. If each individual can drastically change those encounters on the fly, it creates a disconnect between the players as they're no longer on common ground.

I agree that ESO can feel too easy sometimes, but this isn't the solution to that.

Anilahation

bad option...

Making things hit harder , or making me do less damage is literally false difficulty.

imagine if VR dungeons were literally just dungeons with extra dmg... and no new mechanics.

Cazic

Dahveed wrote: »

SadieJoan wrote: »

Just go questing naked, and fight with your fists

Not sure if serious or being facetious... I'll take the smiley as a "just kidding".

But yeah, people have suggested nerfing oneself or doing "ironman challenges" and such, but by handicapping yourself you are effectively prohibiting yourself from playing half of the game.

The fun and challenge of this type of action RPG is working on your character to make him/her the best he/she can possibly be to overcome obstacles... Purposefully making myself weak just feels artificial and isn't fun.

You're kind of contradicting your own idea there. The difficulty slider idea does exactly that - nerfs your own character intentionally. It would feel artificial.

Cazic

Dahveed wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Difficulty sliders don't work in MMOs, because you can't just have different groups of people running around in their own game world.

First of all, no need to go name calling. I am not "naive".

Secondly, ironic that the person calling me naive still didn't understand the basic concept of this thread. If you did, you would know that what I am proposing would not force players to "run around in their own game world."

Read my original post - carefully, this time - and you'll understand why.

Consider "their own game world" more figuratively than literally. Having everyone be able to adjust their difficulty this way would segment the player base, and that's not what a MMO is about.

nerevarine1138

Argoniawind wrote: »

I knew this topic was gonna get heat from the mmo players, while the Elder Scrolls players aka me are gonna be for the slider. I could use this slider to make stuff easy for me since all I do is play solo and I know some areas that are insane hard. But its up to the devs to make it happen!

Been playing Elder Scrolls games much longer than I have MMOs. The fact that you mostly play solo doesn't remove the limitations of MMO mechanics on the world.

Cazic wrote: »

Dahveed wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Difficulty sliders don't work in MMOs, because you can't just have different groups of people running around in their own game world.

First of all, no need to go name calling. I am not "naive".

Secondly, ironic that the person calling me naive still didn't understand the basic concept of this thread. If you did, you would know that what I am proposing would not force players to "run around in their own game world."

Read my original post - carefully, this time - and you'll understand why.

Consider "their own game world" more figuratively than literally. Having everyone be able to adjust their difficulty this way would segment the player base, and that's not what a MMO is about.

And pretty much this. I pointed out a number of potential problems (and didn't even get in to the issues with PvP) with having people running around with permanent debuffs. Your response was that people could just avoid grouping with them, which ignores the issue. You also seem to be pretending earlier that this would be different than artificially increasing the damage dealt by enemies by removing your gear/CP. It would have exactly the same effect, so why are you so against it?

Spottswoode

I was going to suggest this very thing when I got home.

The grouping problem can be solved by forcing the group leader's difficulty setting. Same way level is enforced now.

nerevarine1138

Spottswoode wrote: »

I was going to suggest this very thing when I got home.

The grouping problem can be solved by forcing the group leader's difficulty setting. Same way level is enforced now.

And how do you suggest the developers deal with the mountain of complaints that "no one wants to play at my difficulty level", etc.?

Spottswoode

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Spottswoode wrote: »

I was going to suggest this very thing when I got home.

The grouping problem can be solved by forcing the group leader's difficulty setting. Same way level is enforced now.

And how do you suggest the developers deal with the mountain of complaints that "no one wants to play at my difficulty level", etc.?

Need my lol button. I don't. It is an absurd expectation to expect developers to fix the human condition.

Argoniawind

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Argoniawind wrote: »

I knew this topic was gonna get heat from the mmo players, while the Elder Scrolls players aka me are gonna be for the slider. I could use this slider to make stuff easy for me since all I do is play solo and I know some areas that are insane hard. But its up to the devs to make it happen!

Been playing Elder Scrolls games much longer than I have MMOs. The fact that you mostly play solo doesn't remove the limitations of MMO mechanics on the world.

Well to be honest since I am an Elder Scrolls player, If I had it my way there would be zero mmo elements in this game and have only past Elder Scrolls and new innovative mechanics implemented, but that's a whole other story!

nerevarine1138

Argoniawind wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Argoniawind wrote: »

I knew this topic was gonna get heat from the mmo players, while the Elder Scrolls players aka me are gonna be for the slider. I could use this slider to make stuff easy for me since all I do is play solo and I know some areas that are insane hard. But its up to the devs to make it happen!

Been playing Elder Scrolls games much longer than I have MMOs. The fact that you mostly play solo doesn't remove the limitations of MMO mechanics on the world.

Well to be honest since I am an Elder Scrolls player, If I had it my way there would be zero mmo elements in this game and have only past Elder Scrolls and new innovative mechanics implemented, but that's a whole other story!

Elder Scrolls VI is coming. That's what you're looking for.

Spottswoode wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Spottswoode wrote: »

I was going to suggest this very thing when I got home.

The grouping problem can be solved by forcing the group leader's difficulty setting. Same way level is enforced now.

And how do you suggest the developers deal with the mountain of complaints that "no one wants to play at my difficulty level", etc.?

Need my lol button. I don't. It is an absurd expectation to expect developers to fix the human condition.

You're right. And it's equally absurd to expect them to waste time and resources developing a difficultly slider for the 0.05% of the population who want it just so that they can whine about no one else using the difficulty slider.

Spottswoode

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Argoniawind wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Argoniawind wrote: »

I knew this topic was gonna get heat from the mmo players, while the Elder Scrolls players aka me are gonna be for the slider. I could use this slider to make stuff easy for me since all I do is play solo and I know some areas that are insane hard. But its up to the devs to make it happen!

Been playing Elder Scrolls games much longer than I have MMOs. The fact that you mostly play solo doesn't remove the limitations of MMO mechanics on the world.

Well to be honest since I am an Elder Scrolls player, If I had it my way there would be zero mmo elements in this game and have only past Elder Scrolls and new innovative mechanics implemented, but that's a whole other story!

Elder Scrolls VI is coming. That's what you're looking for

You're right. And it's equally absurd to expect them to waste time and resources developing a difficultly slider for the 0.05% of the population who want it just so that they can whine about no one else using the difficulty slider.

One of the two is possible. So, no, they aren't remotely equivalents.
Anything else from the Majority?

Fleshreaper

Cazic wrote: »

This is a crazy idea that will never work. The idea is simple and common in single player games, but actually having this type of a mechanic in a MMO is anything but.

It wouldn't make sense for one player to be taking more or less damage than another, just because they adjust a slider. And having to consider what difficulty every other player is set to when grouping? That would suck.

Part of the idea of a MMO is that we're all playing in the same world, and work together to deal with the same encounters and scenarios. If each individual can drastically change those encounters on the fly, it creates a disconnect between the players as they're no longer on common ground.

I agree that ESO can feel too easy sometimes, but this isn't the solution to that.

RIGHT! Because DEBUFFS are not possible in ESO, explain these then..
[img][/img]

What?

That's what this slider would do. Simple as that. Let's say, player A wants the mobs to be harder. Player A adjusts the slider to a harder settings. Player A now has a (WAIT FOR IT) debuff on him/her SELF. Not you, not phase the game, a DEBUFF on ONLY PLAYER A. This debuff will cause PLAYER A ONLY to take 5% more damage from all attacks. PLAYER A ONLY will do 5% less damage.

I don't understand this, (I don't play this game that a way, So, you shouldn't either. You HAVE to play it my way or GTFO!)

Arthur_Spoonfondle

Dahveed wrote: »

Basically, my suggestion would be a very simple difficulty slider just like Oblivion and Skyrim have, from very easy (which, let's face it, is the base difficulty for ESO at the time I am typing this) to "very hard" or "master".

This slider would only work on an individual player level, so that none of the in-game content is actually affected. The slider would work as a player-specific debuff which affects only the individual player.

That's fine in a solo game. It is never going to work in an MMO where it WILL cause all kinds of problems with players accusing others of having an unfair advantage. Even if it can be implemented in such a way as to confer no advantage, people will still complain if they are doing something on 'hard mode' and others are not, it will just cause trouble.

Fleshreaper

Arthur_Spoonfondle wrote: »

Dahveed wrote: »

Basically, my suggestion would be a very simple difficulty slider just like Oblivion and Skyrim have, from very easy (which, let's face it, is the base difficulty for ESO at the time I am typing this) to "very hard" or "master".

This slider would only work on an individual player level, so that none of the in-game content is actually affected. The slider would work as a player-specific debuff which affects only the individual player.

That's fine in a solo game. It is never going to work in an MMO where it WILL cause all kinds of problems with players accusing others of having an unfair advantage. Even if it can be implemented in such a way as to confer no advantage, people will still complain if they are doing something on 'hard mode' and others are not, it will just cause trouble.

If you run across me out in the world and I am fighting mobs. How are you going to know, if I have my slider set to hard mode? More importantly, WHY would you care what my slider is set to? How is that impacting YOUR entertainment? If I go into PvP with my slider set to hard, it ONLY means that I (ME ONLY) will be easier to kill and will have a harder time of killing you. If I zone into a delve and my slide is automatically adjusted to normal, nothing to change, nothing to mess with.

nerevarine1138

Fleshreaper wrote: »

Arthur_Spoonfondle wrote: »

Dahveed wrote: »

Basically, my suggestion would be a very simple difficulty slider just like Oblivion and Skyrim have, from very easy (which, let's face it, is the base difficulty for ESO at the time I am typing this) to "very hard" or "master".

This slider would only work on an individual player level, so that none of the in-game content is actually affected. The slider would work as a player-specific debuff which affects only the individual player.

That's fine in a solo game. It is never going to work in an MMO where it WILL cause all kinds of problems with players accusing others of having an unfair advantage. Even if it can be implemented in such a way as to confer no advantage, people will still complain if they are doing something on 'hard mode' and others are not, it will just cause trouble.

If you run across me out in the world and I am fighting mobs. How are you going to know, if I have my slider set to hard mode? More importantly, WHY would you care what my slider is set to? How is that impacting YOUR entertainment? If I go into PvP with my slider set to hard, it ONLY means that I (ME ONLY) will be easier to kill and will have a harder time of killing you. If I zone into a delve and my slide is automatically adjusted to normal, nothing to change, nothing to mess with.

If you're in my group, it impacts my game significantly.

Saturn

The leveling in MMOs are always meant to be easy so you do not get stuck and leave the game in frustration. They had to nerf the veteran content of the game already, because many people could not handle it and started complaining. A difficulty slider sounds like a lot of work and honestly, if you just persevere through the leveling experience, you shall have your fill of "hardmode" content in the form of endgame PvE like Dragonstar Arena.