Just had a look at the UI for PS4

originalbars

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

In order to trade, group, or get help players will require some form of communication. An MMO required this to succeed, you simply cannot enjoy the full game without communicating and organizing with other players. Those who cannot use voice chat are officially SOL.

Trading and large group activities are going to be a mess: (Raids and dungeons excluded, you either carefully pick these people from forums, friend list or your guild)

A ) proximity chat: You'd have to be on the right place and time to hear someone selling something, besides you might not hear exactly what said person is selling.

B ) Zone voice chat: Busy cities and Cyrodil.. yeah.. just one idiot singing to ruin it all. Alot of people will mute this.

PS4 offers an alternative we used in Diablo as well, PSN group chats, works great, can reach a large audience for selling/buying goods and LFG. Downside anyone can add anyone. Leader can't kick people. Yeah... as you'd imagine these groups go downhill pretty fast.

NewBlacksmurf

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Zazaaji wrote: »

A person on Reddit just reminded me: What about deaf people? They will have literally no way of communicating with others on the console version without any form of keyboard/text chatting.

How do deaf players play Grand Theft Auto, Destiny, Halo, Diablo 3, or any other multiplayer game already on consoles that include absolutely no keyboard support?

GTA and Destiny rarely forces you to play with others and never forces you to communicate with them. Heists may be difference as I have no played them yet. Both offer plenty of areas where you can take a break and message someone directly via PSN/ XBLive.
I have not played much of Halo, but it seems communication is helpful but not required.
I know nothing of Diablo 3. I will not comment here.

In order to trade, group, or get help players will require some form of communication. An MMO required this to succeed, you simply cannot enjoy the full game without communicating and organizing with other players. Those who cannot use voice chat are officially SOL.

So we are all jumping to the conclusion that the console version is basically the PC version with minor UI changes.
Since ZOS heavily marketed the console versions over a year ago I'm going to assume there is more info and changes not announced.

Varicite

Well, we all know what they say about assumptions...

And I'm sorry, but ZOS does not have a very good track record when it comes to actually putting in the framework that one might assume they would.

Seriously, where's my combat log? Why do I need to download an addon just to know what the heck is actually happening in a MMO?

What is this, 1998? Owait, we were already incorporating this SPACE-AGE TECHNOLOGY even back then.

Lifsteinn

I liked, nice work!

But I'm already a big fan of the original PC UI version.

Pallmor

It would be nice if someone would do a console MMO with a voice-to-text function for larger scale chat. But the technology probably isn't there yet, and certainly is way beyond the capability of anyone at ZOS anyway.

NewBlacksmurf

Varicite wrote: »

Well, we all know what they say about assumptions...

And I'm sorry, but ZOS does not have a very good track record when it comes to actually putting in the framework that one might assume they would.

Seriously, where's my combat log? Why do I need to download an addon just to know what the heck is actually happening in a MMO?

What is this, 1998? Owait, we were already incorporating this SPACE-AGE TECHNOLOGY even back then.

I believe a lot of players are trying to attach all their MMO expectations into this game and either never read or forgot the whole point of this game from ZOS's point of view.

It was to create a world from the lore of TES but do so in a way that gets people away from any traditional MMO look and feel.

That's basically their attempt "paraphrased in my words" so I have faith in this as far as console. I truly never understood why it was made on PC but that's just me. The TES PC crowd never enjoyed the games as is anyways they just jumped into modding stuff from week 1 ever since Morrowind but probably earlier than that.

Just my perspectives and why I was so interested in console and still eager.

Varicite

Oh, I haven't forgotten that. But I also see how well that has worked out.

For anything serious in this game, you want addons, or you are at a disadvantage due to a lack of information given.

That's probably what will be the best about consoles, to be completely honest. Everyone will be equally ignorant of the game's mechanics.

Now, personally, I am ever thankful for addons, because they have allowed us to FIX many of the problems in this game that would never have come to light otherwise (and whether you like or dislike addons, nobody can deny that they have made ESO a better game for EVERYBODY). Addons have made ESO a much better experience due to their contribution to a vast number of bug fixes.

So I guess an even playing field will be cool, but I kinda feel sorry for the console players in that they will not have any real way to tell if their game is working, and thus not be able to accurately depict most problems.

Without the PC game, consoles would have a broken, buggy mess. Fact. They probably still will, to be completely honest. Just not as broken as it would have been w/out the PC version. ; )

Kalifas

Varicite wrote: »

Oh, I haven't forgotten that. But I also see how well that has worked out.

For anything serious in this game, you want addons, or you are at a disadvantage due to a lack of information given.

That's probably what will be the best about consoles, to be completely honest. Everyone will be equally ignorant of the game's mechanics.

Now, personally, I am ever thankful for addons, because they have allowed us to FIX many of the problems in this game that would never have come to light otherwise (and whether you like or dislike addons, nobody can deny that they have made ESO a better game for EVERYBODY). Addons have made ESO a much better experience due to their contribution to a vast number of bug fixes.

So I guess an even playing field will be cool, but I kinda feel sorry for the console players in that they will not have any real way to tell if their game is working, and thus not be able to accurately depict most problems.

Without the PC game, consoles would have a broken, buggy mess. Fact. They probably still will, to be completely honest. Just not as broken as it would have been w/out the PC version. ; )

Yeah if someone is not a huge ES fan but wants to try this mmo. They will most likely be in for a rude awakening when they have a hard time finding all the lorebooks, skyshards, wayshrines, and have to guess on exactly how much damage they are doing. I enjoy seeking these out sometime, but I am not forced to. It is an option on PC.

NewBlacksmurf

Varicite wrote: »

Oh, I haven't forgotten that. But I also see how well that has worked out.

For anything serious in this game, you want addons, or you are at a disadvantage due to a lack of information given.

That's probably what will be the best about consoles, to be completely honest. Everyone will be equally ignorant of the game's mechanics.

Now, personally, I am ever thankful for addons, because they have allowed us to FIX many of the problems in this game that would never have come to light otherwise (and whether you like or dislike addons, nobody can deny that they have made ESO a better game for EVERYBODY). Addons have made ESO a much better experience due to their contribution to a vast number of bug fixes.

So I guess an even playing field will be cool, but I kinda feel sorry for the console players in that they will not have any real way to tell if their game is working, and thus not be able to accurately depict most problems.

Without the PC game, consoles would have a broken, buggy mess. Fact. They probably still will, to be completely honest. Just not as broken as it would have been w/out the PC version. ; )

My only gripe with add-ons for any MMO is that the developer never places the add-ons in the download or make it optional but instead you have to go to a third party website. (I got hacked two times in other games doing that)

Maybe it's just me

c.p.garrett1993_ESO

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Zazaaji wrote: »

A person on Reddit just reminded me: What about deaf people? They will have literally no way of communicating with others on the console version without any form of keyboard/text chatting.

How do deaf players play Grand Theft Auto, Destiny, Halo, Diablo 3, or any other multiplayer game already on consoles that include absolutely no keyboard support?

GTA and Destiny rarely forces you to play with others and never forces you to communicate with them. Heists may be difference as I have no played them yet. Both offer plenty of areas where you can take a break and message someone directly via PSN/ XBLive.
I have not played much of Halo, but it seems communication is helpful but not required.
I know nothing of Diablo 3. I will not comment here.

In order to trade, group, or get help players will require some form of communication. An MMO required this to succeed, you simply cannot enjoy the full game without communicating and organizing with other players. Those who cannot use voice chat are officially SOL.

So we are all jumping to the conclusion that the console version is basically the PC version with minor UI changes.
Since ZOS heavily marketed the console versions over a year ago I'm going to assume there is more info and changes not announced.

Essentially? Yes. I'm sure there will be plenty of differences but at it's core it is the same game and it will be frustrating to deal with social aspects of the game without any form of text chat in place.

NewBlacksmurf

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Zazaaji wrote: »

A person on Reddit just reminded me: What about deaf people? They will have literally no way of communicating with others on the console version without any form of keyboard/text chatting.

How do deaf players play Grand Theft Auto, Destiny, Halo, Diablo 3, or any other multiplayer game already on consoles that include absolutely no keyboard support?

GTA and Destiny rarely forces you to play with others and never forces you to communicate with them. Heists may be difference as I have no played them yet. Both offer plenty of areas where you can take a break and message someone directly via PSN/ XBLive.
I have not played much of Halo, but it seems communication is helpful but not required.
I know nothing of Diablo 3. I will not comment here.

In order to trade, group, or get help players will require some form of communication. An MMO required this to succeed, you simply cannot enjoy the full game without communicating and organizing with other players. Those who cannot use voice chat are officially SOL.

So we are all jumping to the conclusion that the console version is basically the PC version with minor UI changes.
Since ZOS heavily marketed the console versions over a year ago I'm going to assume there is more info and changes not announced.

Essentially? Yes. I'm sure there will be plenty of differences but at it's core it is the same game and it will be frustrating to deal with social aspects of the game without any form of text chat in place.

I'm looking forward to no more zone chat text
Really excited about voice vs text

See what happens is people really begin to play vs using the game zone chat as a trolling station, recruiting session, trade market, topic of the day discussion. When people have to use their own voices, you no longer hide behind a keyboard. It brings personality and I'd imagine that lots of behaviors will just not be present which pulls out and brings people together for the greater good OR greater evil.

It's what PC can't do for this game.

Ser Lobo

I think me and NewBlackSmurf are on the same page in this.

Even in beta, players have worked exceptionally hard to turn this very 'immersion focused game' into a traditional MMO. The pursuit of adding cooldown timers, mini-maps, macro-capabilities, larger power's bars, etc.

Much like PC gaming has helped distort other Elder Scrolls games away from the developers intent into things the players intended (world overhauls, additional races, anime adaptations, etc), the PC version of ESO has been steadily distorted into an action RPG with a rather singular and detailed focus on immersion, into a poorly-functioning adaptation into a traditional MMO.

I have much hope for the console versions. In fact, I think they will be fantastic, especially to that audience that isn't as used to or reliant upon mods and third-party programs. Customization is what the PC gaming community does well. But sometimes a good story and beautiful world can be ruined by one too many mods.



And a caveat ... I'm not above using mods. I use many. Nor am I beyond asking for traditional MMO features in this game. I'm about one week away from actually being a supporter of auction houses, etc. But I feel that, when I finally leave the PC version of ESO to play the console version of ESO full-time (assuming it actually functions ... who knows yet), I don't think I'll really miss my mini-maps or custom UI's or macro-mods.

We'll see.

Varicite

I don't enjoy using voice chat. I never have.

But I grew up in an era where you talked to people face to face, and if they were online, you typed. Yes, I grew up before the internet.

Yes, I'm also weird about my voice, though people seem to like it.

/shrug

NewBlacksmurf

^ Exactly!

Ser Lobo

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Zazaaji wrote: »

A person on Reddit just reminded me: What about deaf people? They will have literally no way of communicating with others on the console version without any form of keyboard/text chatting.

How do deaf players play Grand Theft Auto, Destiny, Halo, Diablo 3, or any other multiplayer game already on consoles that include absolutely no keyboard support?

GTA and Destiny rarely forces you to play with others and never forces you to communicate with them. Heists may be difference as I have no played them yet. Both offer plenty of areas where you can take a break and message someone directly via PSN/ XBLive.
I have not played much of Halo, but it seems communication is helpful but not required.
I know nothing of Diablo 3. I will not comment here.

In order to trade, group, or get help players will require some form of communication. An MMO required this to succeed, you simply cannot enjoy the full game without communicating and organizing with other players. Those who cannot use voice chat are officially SOL.

So we are all jumping to the conclusion that the console version is basically the PC version with minor UI changes.
Since ZOS heavily marketed the console versions over a year ago I'm going to assume there is more info and changes not announced.

Essentially? Yes. I'm sure there will be plenty of differences but at it's core it is the same game and it will be frustrating to deal with social aspects of the game without any form of text chat in place.

As I've mentioned before, those social aspects WILL be available using third-party websites. Much like PC players use a variety of programs for voice chat and whatnot (vent, TS, mumble, etc) or managing gamepads and macros, console players use third-party websites like Reddit and DestinyLFG in order to do what guild or local chat usually do in MMO's.

I'm already posting sales, forming dungeon runs and recruiting guild mates for Neverwinter using third party websites. And NWO has a chat box. It's quite literally easier for me, because the third party sites are more dedicated and easier to access on my tablet than that little chat box is to type in from across my living room with the on-screen keyboard (much less a wired one).

Just comparing my current experiences with the expectations of others who may not be involved with the social aspects of console gaming yet.

Naivefanboi

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Zazaaji wrote: »

A person on Reddit just reminded me: What about deaf people? They will have literally no way of communicating with others on the console version without any form of keyboard/text chatting.

How do deaf players play Grand Theft Auto, Destiny, Halo, Diablo 3, or any other multiplayer game already on consoles that include absolutely no keyboard support?

GTA and Destiny rarely forces you to play with others and never forces you to communicate with them. Heists may be difference as I have no played them yet. Both offer plenty of areas where you can take a break and message someone directly via PSN/ XBLive.
I have not played much of Halo, but it seems communication is helpful but not required.
I know nothing of Diablo 3. I will not comment here.

In order to trade, group, or get help players will require some form of communication. An MMO required this to succeed, you simply cannot enjoy the full game without communicating and organizing with other players. Those who cannot use voice chat are officially SOL.

So we are all jumping to the conclusion that the console version is basically the PC version with minor UI changes.
Since ZOS heavily marketed the console versions over a year ago I'm going to assume there is more info and changes not announced.

Essentially? Yes. I'm sure there will be plenty of differences but at it's core it is the same game and it will be frustrating to deal with social aspects of the game without any form of text chat in place.

I'm looking forward to no more zone chat text
Really excited about voice vs text

See what happens is people really begin to play vs using the game zone chat as a trolling station, recruiting session, trade market, topic of the day discussion. When people have to use their own voices, you no longer hide behind a keyboard. It brings personality and I'd imagine that lots of behaviors will just not be present which pulls out and brings people together for the greater good OR greater evil.

It's what PC can't do for this game.

Wtf are you talking about? Have you relied on group finder for daily pledges trials?
Never saw it stated that they were removing zone chat, link plz?
Just cause no mouse or keyboard support, doesnt mean controller cant type.
Also factions needs zone chat in cyrodil

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

I think me and NewBlackSmurf are on the same page in this.

Even in beta, players have worked exceptionally hard to turn this very 'immersion focused game' into a traditional MMO. The pursuit of adding cooldown timers, mini-maps, macro-capabilities, larger power's bars, etc.

Much like PC gaming has helped distort other Elder Scrolls games away from the developers intent into things the players intended (world overhauls, additional races, anime adaptations, etc), the PC version of ESO has been steadily distorted into an action RPG with a rather singular and detailed focus on immersion, into a poorly-functioning adaptation into a traditional MMO.

I have much hope for the console versions. In fact, I think they will be fantastic, especially to that audience that isn't as used to or reliant upon mods and third-party programs. Customization is what the PC gaming community does well. But sometimes a good story and beautiful world can be ruined by one too many mods.



And a caveat ... I'm not above using mods. I use many. Nor am I beyond asking for traditional MMO features in this game. I'm about one week away from actually being a supporter of auction houses, etc. But I feel that, when I finally leave the PC version of ESO to play the console version of ESO full-time (assuming it actually functions ... who knows yet), I don't think I'll really miss my mini-maps or custom UI's or macro-mods.

We'll see.

Even Destiny has damage numbers, gee wonder why that could be? Oh idk maybe soo players can see that weapon (x) does more then weapon (y )
Nahh thats nonsense

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Zazaaji wrote: »

A person on Reddit just reminded me: What about deaf people? They will have literally no way of communicating with others on the console version without any form of keyboard/text chatting.

How do deaf players play Grand Theft Auto, Destiny, Halo, Diablo 3, or any other multiplayer game already on consoles that include absolutely no keyboard support?

GTA and Destiny rarely forces you to play with others and never forces you to communicate with them. Heists may be difference as I have no played them yet. Both offer plenty of areas where you can take a break and message someone directly via PSN/ XBLive.
I have not played much of Halo, but it seems communication is helpful but not required.
I know nothing of Diablo 3. I will not comment here.

In order to trade, group, or get help players will require some form of communication. An MMO required this to succeed, you simply cannot enjoy the full game without communicating and organizing with other players. Those who cannot use voice chat are officially SOL.

So we are all jumping to the conclusion that the console version is basically the PC version with minor UI changes.
Since ZOS heavily marketed the console versions over a year ago I'm going to assume there is more info and changes not announced.

Essentially? Yes. I'm sure there will be plenty of differences but at it's core it is the same game and it will be frustrating to deal with social aspects of the game without any form of text chat in place.

As I've mentioned before, those social aspects WILL be available using third-party websites. Much like PC players use a variety of programs for voice chat and whatnot (vent, TS, mumble, etc) or managing gamepads and macros, console players use third-party websites like Reddit and DestinyLFG in order to do what guild or local chat usually do in MMO's.

I'm already posting sales, forming dungeon runs and recruiting guild mates for Neverwinter using third party websites. And NWO has a chat box. It's quite literally easier for me, because the third party sites are more dedicated and easier to access on my tablet than that little chat box is to type in from across my living room with the on-screen keyboard (much less a wired one).

Just comparing my current experiences with the expectations of others who may not be involved with the social aspects of console gaming yet.

If you kept up on destiny forums youd know HOW SICK AND TIRED OF RELYING ON 3RD PARTY FORUMS the players are! Its litterally one of their biggest legitimate complaints.
Lets not go out of our way to add Destiny trash to eso, theres a reason people quit that garbage

Ser Lobo

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

See what happens is people really begin to play vs using the game zone chat as a trolling station, recruiting session, trade market, topic of the day discussion. When people have to use their own voices, you no longer hide behind a keyboard. It brings personality and I'd imagine that lots of behaviors will just not be present which pulls out and brings people together for the greater good OR greater evil.

It's what PC can't do for this game.

I agree with all of that reply. But I will point out one downside. Roleplay.

As an avid roleplayer, I've yet to ever get involved with roleplay on a console game. There's something about using my voice that makes me want to be and represent me, while typing allows me to pretend much more easily.

Not saying my characters don't have backstories or detailed motives. Just that the moment I talk with another gamer, it's between gamers, not characters.

Ser Lobo

Naivefanboi wrote: »

Even Destiny has damage numbers, gee wonder why that could be? Oh idk maybe soo players can see that weapon (x) does more then weapon (y )
Nahh thats nonsense

That's their choice. And Neverwinters.

I personally was a little disappointed when Destiny did damage numbers. I hate the little annoying numbers rolling up my screen. And I've had one friend quit Destiny, an otherwise great game, because he said it looked too much like 'an annoying MMO'.

Regretfully for some, the traditional MMO approach of players micromanaging timers, damage totals, ability rotations and the like does NOT appeal to all gamers who like massively multiplayer online roleplaying games. I've downloaded mods in some games just to get rid of those.

So of course, my preference for ESO is to not include many of those traditional elements ... much akin to what ZOS originally designed. For me, a loyal console port would be just fine.

As the vast majority of those who play MMO games are already on PC, a more console-friendly design for console gamers doesn't seem like too much of a stretch to me.

Ser Lobo

Naivefanboi wrote: »

If you kept up on destiny forums youd know HOW SICK AND TIRED OF RELYING ON 3RD PARTY FORUMS the players are! Its litterally one of their biggest legitimate complaints.
Lets not go out of our way to add Destiny trash to eso, theres a reason people quit that garbage

I thought their biggest complaint was the fact that content revolves around going through the exact same twenty-something missions over and over again.

I'm sure an in-game grouping service would be nice and appreciated. I've even pushed for a better grouping and queuing mechanics for ESO. I just don't think a text box is critical to that at all. In fact, as you demonstrate in your post with your language and the manner which you're disagreeing with me, there's more and more proof that I don't want to read or hear most of what others have to say anyhow, because instead of being polite or at least respectful in their debates, they have to be insulting and dismissive in order to further accentuate their points.

I can send messages to others on Xbox, anytime I wish. I'm not sure what more I, personally, need in that social context.

Naivefanboi

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Naivefanboi wrote: »

If you kept up on destiny forums youd know HOW SICK AND TIRED OF RELYING ON 3RD PARTY FORUMS the players are! Its litterally one of their biggest legitimate complaints.
Lets not go out of our way to add Destiny trash to eso, theres a reason people quit that garbage

I thought their biggest complaint was the fact that content revolves around going through the exact same twenty-something missions over and over again.

I'm sure an in-game grouping service would be nice and appreciated. I've even pushed for a better grouping and queuing mechanics for ESO. I just don't think a text box is critical to that at all. In fact, as you demonstrate in your post with your language and the manner which you're disagreeing with me, there's more and more proof that I don't want to read or hear most of what others have to say anyhow, because instead of being polite or at least respectful in their debates, they have to be insulting and dismissive in order to further accentuate their points.

I can send messages to others on Xbox, anytime I wish. I'm not sure what more I, personally, need in that social context.

Doesnt sound like you would, also i said it was 1 of their complaints. Try re reading it. If you dont like zone chat, then turn the chat log off, pretty simple, but no lets have it removed from the game like your suggesting. Which is all it is btw, they have said nothing about removing zone chat. And dont worry were on seperate consoles thankfully

Varicite

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

I think me and NewBlackSmurf are on the same page in this.

Even in beta, players have worked exceptionally hard to turn this very 'immersion focused game' into a traditional MMO. The pursuit of adding cooldown timers, mini-maps, macro-capabilities, larger power's bars, etc.

Much like PC gaming has helped distort other Elder Scrolls games away from the developers intent into things the players intended (world overhauls, additional races, anime adaptations, etc), the PC version of ESO has been steadily distorted into an action RPG with a rather singular and detailed focus on immersion, into a poorly-functioning adaptation into a traditional MMO.

I have much hope for the console versions. In fact, I think they will be fantastic, especially to that audience that isn't as used to or reliant upon mods and third-party programs. Customization is what the PC gaming community does well. But sometimes a good story and beautiful world can be ruined by one too many mods.



And a caveat ... I'm not above using mods. I use many. Nor am I beyond asking for traditional MMO features in this game. I'm about one week away from actually being a supporter of auction houses, etc. But I feel that, when I finally leave the PC version of ESO to play the console version of ESO full-time (assuming it actually functions ... who knows yet), I don't think I'll really miss my mini-maps or custom UI's or macro-mods.

We'll see.

Oh, I totally do understand where you're coming from. I wholeheartedly believe that everyone being forced to use the same tools will actually be good for a few reasons.

I am just also wary of some of the good that has come from the PC version due to addons, most notably in the case of bugs that would go largely unnoticed w/out them.

For example: Some NB passives are becoming inactive on death again (at launch, NONE of the NB passives actually worked, discovered through addons), such as Master Assassin. You would never know this on a console. Even if you had an inkling, you would never be able to prove it.

If an ability is not hitting for what it says on the tooltip, you wouldn't know. You have no clue what it actually hits people for, just what it TELLS you it SHOULD hit people for. If the tooltip is even correct, which they haven't been many times in the past.

The thing is: What detracts from YOUR immersion may not detract from another player's. I don't feel LESS immersed because I have a tiny mini-map in the corner of my screen. I feel less lost (I'm notorious for getting lost). I feel less immersed when I spend a great deal of my time opening and closing my large map.

I don't feel less immersed because I actually know the number of hit points I have left. Certainly not any less immersed than staring at an ambiguous red bar.

Immersion is entirely subjective, and addons are entirely customizable. Sure, you can potentially "ruin" your experience w/ too many mods, but you can also ruin it by feeling completely left in the dark by game mechanics.

PS) In the real world, I don't need a red bar OR numbers to tell me that I just got stabbed in the gut and it hurts like heck and I am probably in need of assistance of some kind. But these things exist in the default UI.

Immersion will ALWAYS take a back seat to functionality; this is just one of those cases where players have a bit of control over their own immersion.

NewBlacksmurf

Naivefanboi wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

c.p.garrett1993_ESO wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Zazaaji wrote: »

A person on Reddit just reminded me: What about deaf people? They will have literally no way of communicating with others on the console version without any form of keyboard/text chatting.

How do deaf players play Grand Theft Auto, Destiny, Halo, Diablo 3, or any other multiplayer game already on consoles that include absolutely no keyboard support?

GTA and Destiny rarely forces you to play with others and never forces you to communicate with them. Heists may be difference as I have no played them yet. Both offer plenty of areas where you can take a break and message someone directly via PSN/ XBLive.
I have not played much of Halo, but it seems communication is helpful but not required.
I know nothing of Diablo 3. I will not comment here.

In order to trade, group, or get help players will require some form of communication. An MMO required this to succeed, you simply cannot enjoy the full game without communicating and organizing with other players. Those who cannot use voice chat are officially SOL.

So we are all jumping to the conclusion that the console version is basically the PC version with minor UI changes.
Since ZOS heavily marketed the console versions over a year ago I'm going to assume there is more info and changes not announced.

Essentially? Yes. I'm sure there will be plenty of differences but at it's core it is the same game and it will be frustrating to deal with social aspects of the game without any form of text chat in place.

I'm looking forward to no more zone chat text
Really excited about voice vs text

See what happens is people really begin to play vs using the game zone chat as a trolling station, recruiting session, trade market, topic of the day discussion. When people have to use their own voices, you no longer hide behind a keyboard. It brings personality and I'd imagine that lots of behaviors will just not be present which pulls out and brings people together for the greater good OR greater evil.

It's what PC can't do for this game.

Wtf are you talking about? Have you relied on group finder for daily pledges trials?
Never saw it stated that they were removing zone chat, link plz?
Just cause no mouse or keyboard support, doesnt mean controller cant type.
Also factions needs zone chat in cyrodil

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

I think me and NewBlackSmurf are on the same page in this.

Even in beta, players have worked exceptionally hard to turn this very 'immersion focused game' into a traditional MMO. The pursuit of adding cooldown timers, mini-maps, macro-capabilities, larger power's bars, etc.

Much like PC gaming has helped distort other Elder Scrolls games away from the developers intent into things the players intended (world overhauls, additional races, anime adaptations, etc), the PC version of ESO has been steadily distorted into an action RPG with a rather singular and detailed focus on immersion, into a poorly-functioning adaptation into a traditional MMO.

I have much hope for the console versions. In fact, I think they will be fantastic, especially to that audience that isn't as used to or reliant upon mods and third-party programs. Customization is what the PC gaming community does well. But sometimes a good story and beautiful world can be ruined by one too many mods.



And a caveat ... I'm not above using mods. I use many. Nor am I beyond asking for traditional MMO features in this game. I'm about one week away from actually being a supporter of auction houses, etc. But I feel that, when I finally leave the PC version of ESO to play the console version of ESO full-time (assuming it actually functions ... who knows yet), I don't think I'll really miss my mini-maps or custom UI's or macro-mods.

We'll see.

Even Destiny has damage numbers, gee wonder why that could be? Oh idk maybe soo players can see that weapon (x) does more then weapon (y )
Nahh thats nonsense

Yes I use the lfg tool all the time but I don't do pledges.
But here is the thing I noticed...it works fine for me when I use it correctly and most others. I'm curious if add-ons throw ppls results off.
I don't use add-ons and I play 100% with a controller.

In this thread I believe or the other I'm in, a MOD commented that keyboard text chat is not supported. People are assuming that this means no text or zone chat fields but that's not what was said technically.

In context tho it did sound like voice chat was about it other than certain unspecified fields.

I play destiny and it's a DPS race and pretty mindless other than that the damage number isn't of importance but instead the indicator of its its a crit or not. So the numbers tell the player if a hit is doing more or less damage which is of no concern in this game.



If I'm responding to the wrong person sorry. I'm on a phone

Ser Lobo

Naivefanboi wrote: »

ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »

Naivefanboi wrote: »

If you kept up on destiny forums youd know HOW SICK AND TIRED OF RELYING ON 3RD PARTY FORUMS the players are! Its litterally one of their biggest legitimate complaints.
Lets not go out of our way to add Destiny trash to eso, theres a reason people quit that garbage

I thought their biggest complaint was the fact that content revolves around going through the exact same twenty-something missions over and over again.

I'm sure an in-game grouping service would be nice and appreciated. I've even pushed for a better grouping and queuing mechanics for ESO. I just don't think a text box is critical to that at all. In fact, as you demonstrate in your post with your language and the manner which you're disagreeing with me, there's more and more proof that I don't want to read or hear most of what others have to say anyhow, because instead of being polite or at least respectful in their debates, they have to be insulting and dismissive in order to further accentuate their points.

I can send messages to others on Xbox, anytime I wish. I'm not sure what more I, personally, need in that social context.

Doesnt sound like you would, also i said it was 1 of their complaints. Try re reading it. If you dont like zone chat, then turn the chat log off, pretty simple, but no lets have it removed from the game like your suggesting. Which is all it is btw, they have said nothing about remocing zone chat. And sont worry were on seperate consolevs thankfully

You're right. What I've seen them say is that keyboards won't be able to be used to type in zone chat, but will be able to be used to type guild names, etc. And even this was given a caveat of 'subject to change'.

My point is that players maybe overestimating the perceived necessity of zone chat in order to enjoy their playtime on consoles. What is an essential part of playing and communicating on a PC, is fundamentally separate and takes a background to most console experiences.

I feel that what we're seeing are the confused reactions of players who almost exclusively stick with MMO's or RTS games on PC and solo games on consoles, and who are generally unaware that console gamers may handle multiplayer differently.

While the game may be the same, the tools and focus are slightly, but obviously, different. The mindset of the general gamer is also different. Customization versus accessibility. Mass communication versus personal interactions. Meta-gaming versus simply gaming.

As a veteran PC gamer AND console gamer, this one issue in ESO has made the gap between playstyles so much more apparent. I've literally noticed me rolling my shoulders back and relaxing more when I sit down on the couch. Social interactions evolve around a bunny hop or quick emote in passing while I just keep playing, talking with friends over voice chat.

Varicite

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

People are assuming that this means no text or zone chat fields but that's not what was said technically. e

That is EXACTLY what was said, technically.

ZOS_JasonLeavey wrote: »

keyboard support for chat is not something that will be available for the console version of the game. You will be able to use a keyboard for text entry in areas such as guild naming, etc., but not for chatting.

"Keyboard support for chat is not available." "Not for chatting." At all.

This is really very clear and I'm unsure how it could possibly be misconstrued.

Especially given the context of the situation, where this was a followup to what @ZOS_JasonLeavey told me earlier about being able to use the keyboard to chat specifically.

Ser Lobo

Varicite wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

People are assuming that this means no text or zone chat fields but that's not what was said technically. e

That is EXACTLY what was said, technically.

ZOS_JasonLeavey wrote: »

keyboard support for chat is not something that will be available for the console version of the game. You will be able to use a keyboard for text entry in areas such as guild naming, etc., but not for chatting.

"Keyboard support for chat is not available." "Not for chatting." At all.

This is really very clear and I'm unsure how it could possibly be misconstrued.

Especially given the context of the situation, where this was a followup to what @ZOS_JasonLeavey told me earlier about being able to use the keyboard to chat specifically.

I don't agree. They are saying you can't use keyboard to chat. Not that there will not be a chat box. Just that there won't be 'keyboard support for chat'.

If there IS a text field or chat box (which we're not clear on yet, and has NOT been clarified by ZOS), then interaction with it *should* be capable using the on-screen keyboard.

The lack of Keyboard support does not equal the lack of a chat box.

NewBlacksmurf

Varicite wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

People are assuming that this means no text or zone chat fields but that's not what was said technically. e

That is EXACTLY what was said, technically.

ZOS_JasonLeavey wrote: »

keyboard support for chat is not something that will be available for the console version of the game. You will be able to use a keyboard for text entry in areas such as guild naming, etc., but not for chatting.

"Keyboard support for chat is not available." "Not for chatting." At all.

This is really very clear and I'm unsure how it could possibly be misconstrued.

Especially given the context of the situation, where this was a followup to what @ZOS_JasonLeavey told me earlier about being able to use the keyboard to chat specifically.

It does not say anything about there not being a zone chat.
It does say that a keyboard is not supported for text chat.

It's logical to interpret this as zone chat text will not be available since keyboard support is not natively supported but that isn't what was said.

Here is why....on Xbox one in Neverwinter, keyboard chat is not supported but text entry is, therefore to zone chat, you use a controller to go into a text entry field first...THEN the keyboard works. To send or post into zone, lfg, trade, group you must use the controller.

This is 100% the same until they confirm not text fields which hasn't been confirmed.

Make sense?
It doesn't even say there isn't text chat

Varicite

Ah, I gotcha. You are right that they haven't clearly stated that there will not be an on-screen keyboard function.

I'll need to watch the latest video again to see if there seems to be any chat boxes shown.

Kalifas

Varicite wrote: »

Ah, I gotcha. You are right that they haven't clearly stated that there will not be an on-screen keyboard function.

I'll need to watch the latest video again to see if there seems to be any chat boxes shown.

On screen keyboard? Do you mean software keyboard? Idk if you ever used that on FFXI but it sucked typing with a controller, especially when lag was present.

Varicite

Kalifas wrote: »

Varicite wrote: »

Ah, I gotcha. You are right that they haven't clearly stated that there will not be an on-screen keyboard function.

I'll need to watch the latest video again to see if there seems to be any chat boxes shown.

On screen keyboard? Do you mean software keyboard? Idk if you ever used that on FFXI but it sucked typing with a controller, especially when lag was present.

Yeah, software keyboard is same as onscreen keyboard, that's what @ruze84b14_ESO and @NewBlacksmurf are referring to in their posts. It's not functionally the same thing, but it's better than nothing.

I used an actual keyboard in FFXI, both on PC and PS2 (I played from the day the game launched in NA until about 6 years later, top RNG on Fairy for quite a while ; )

See, FFXI actually supported keyboards on a console, even back then, and it worked great. Also cross-platform. Two things that ZOS can't seem to manage 15 years later.

/shrug

Nerio

Varicite wrote: »

Also cross-platform. Two things that ZOS can't seem to manage 15 years later.

/shrug

This is a common critism that is completely misplaced, despite there being an entire thread devoted to it with a response from Zos.

FF XI - PC & PlayStation
ESO - PC & PlayStation & Xbox

Being cross platform between PC and one console is easy. Being cross platform between both consoles isn't, because Microsoft and Sony have entirely different requirements and ultimately don't want their players mixed together. It's the same reason why a game like Destiny isn't cross platform.