1.6.3 Sorc Magicka Builds Still Ruined!!!

Lussura

Alcast wrote: »

Lied wrote: »

Lussura wrote: »

This proves nothing.....there is no damage break down to prove anything. Unless you can provided a clear cut damage breakdown of spells casted and damage amounts....you are simply trolling. So you are clearly trolling. If you don't play Sorc, feel free to move along.

You know what kind of [lack of] information proves even less?

Why should we release any gear and build setup? We gave you the possible numbers, so now it is actually up to you to do smth. We do not have to shovel everything up your asses.

I am sry if I sound very aggressive, but all this sorc stuff makes me just mad

Forgot to add this is with 70 CP

If you plan to post numbers, without a clear break down...then it's fake. You know it and we do as well. The fault of proof does not fall to us. It falls to you from whom the proof was offered.

If you can't do this, then you are trolling, and flaming which are CLEARLY against the Code of Conduct. So I suggest you read it. Anyways just reporting you as a troll and the mods will sort you out.

SirEwan

Erock25 wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Lied wrote: »

Lussura wrote: »

This proves nothing.....there is no damage break down to prove anything. Unless you can provided a clear cut damage breakdown of spells casted and damage amounts....you are simply trolling. So you are clearly trolling. If you don't play Sorc, feel free to move along.

You know what kind of [lack of] information proves even less?

Why should we release any gear and build setup? We gave you the possible numbers, so now it is actually up to you to do smth. We do not have to shovel everything up your asses.

I am sry if I sound very aggressive, but all this sorc stuff makes me just mad

@Alcast I do not wish to know gear set ups or anything of the sort. I am just wondering if that Sorc was a 70-90CP character or if he was max CP?

40 Champion points spent in the Mage.
20 Champion points spent in the Theif.

Could be achieved with less.

johnyeh87

Lussura wrote: »

johnyeh87 wrote: »

All I gotta say is....

No Sorcerer Abilities Slotted and Basic PTS gear:


One Sorcerer Ability Slotted and Basic PTS gear:


So I contacted the original poster and had him send me screenshots via PTS. The math is still correct as you can clearly see. It's still only 26 spell power person. No food buff for either screenshot. Nothing changes at all. However thank you for taking the time to point this out. Now that we know buff food for magicka doesn't even increase spell power....we now know we are further nerfed.

Thanks for help prove the point.

Actually the math is incorrect.... reason is the max magicka of the first screenshot is more than the 2nd screenshot, this effects the spell power.... so you are wrong.

Snit

Erock25 wrote: »

There are now 5+ posts with people claiming 12k+ single target dps from a magicka sorc. The evidence is mounting that they are in a good spot. I just hope these aren't 3600CP characters posting these numbers.

Yep, people need to clarify this when posting results. 1.4 billion additional exp, relative to live, is likely to influence the numbers somewhat

If people are knocking out tremendous DPS numbers with 70 - 100 or so CP's, then I hope they post details for a different reason -- I'd like to learn how to do that myself!

Lussura

SirEwan wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Lied wrote: »

Lussura wrote: »

This proves nothing.....there is no damage break down to prove anything. Unless you can provided a clear cut damage breakdown of spells casted and damage amounts....you are simply trolling. So you are clearly trolling. If you don't play Sorc, feel free to move along.

You know what kind of [lack of] information proves even less?

Why should we release any gear and build setup? We gave you the possible numbers, so now it is actually up to you to do smth. We do not have to shovel everything up your asses.

I am sry if I sound very aggressive, but all this sorc stuff makes me just mad

@Alcast I do not wish to know gear set ups or anything of the sort. I am just wondering if that Sorc was a 70-90CP character or if he was max CP?

40 Champion points spent in the Mage.
20 Champion points spent in the Theif.

Could be achieved with less.

Once again!

If you plan to post numbers, without a clear break down...then it's fake. You know it and we do as well. The fault of proof does not fall to us. It falls to you from whom the proof was offered.

If you can't do this, then you are trolling, and flaming which are CLEARLY against the Code of Conduct. So I suggest you read it. Anyways just reporting you as a troll and the mods will sort you out.

Erock25

Thanks Hodor guys. I have been pretty vocal in fighting for sorc buffs (mostly stamina ones though) and even I am getting annoyed at the people screaming the sky is falling while others are presenting facts that it is in fact not in a bad spot at all. Sorcs need to recognize that people ARE doing good DPS and this is at range which in fact does have its benefits in many trials and dungeons. No matter if DKs can do 10-15% more DPS if they must be in melee range at times as long as there are boss mechanics that make melee range dangerous.

I do believe magicka sorcs could use some minor tweaks and definitely a bit more group buffs especially now that negate is nerfed so much, but they are in a good spot. I know stamina builds overall are strong in PVE DPS but it is a damn shame what Sorc skills are around that do not synergize with stamina builds at all.

Lussura

Actually the math is incorrect.... reason is the max magicka of the first screenshot is more than the 2nd screenshot, this effects the spell power.... so you are wrong.

Take a look at the original post. It's been updated. The math is completely correct.

xherics

Alcast wrote: »

My friends have 13k DPS as sorcs. So I dunno what you guys do wrong. (that is approx for 40sec)

It is now one of the stronger classes, so why do you keep moaning about weak sorcs.

Yes, it was exactly this: Blood Spawn (46.5s) - 615,459 Total Damage (13239.1 DPS)

But, we need to mention as well:
- Permanent Combat Prayer
- DPS boost War horn
- used ultimate on the Fight start

So, this 13k will be not sustainable in longer fights than 1 minute and even will be less, when we do not receive Combat prayer.

johnyeh87

Okay, screenshots fixed.. thanks

Lussura

johnyeh87 wrote: »

Okay, screenshots fixed.. thanks

I am taking the screenshots. Stop trolling and move along. The math is correct and updated in the main post. The max magicka doesn't differ at all.

Lussura

xherics wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

My friends have 13k DPS as sorcs. So I dunno what you guys do wrong. (that is approx for 40sec)

It is now one of the stronger classes, so why do you keep moaning about weak sorcs.

Yes, it was exactly this: Blood Spawn (46.5s) - 615,459 Total Damage (13239.1 DPS)

But, we need to mention as well:
- Permanent Combat Prayer
- DPS boost War horn
- used ultimate on the Fight start

So, this 13k will be not sustainable in longer fights than 1 minute and even will be less, when we do not receive Combat prayer.

Hodor and your guild mates. Unless you can post clear damage break downs. No one here is going to take you seriously.

Once again!

If you plan to post numbers, without a clear break down...then it's fake. You know it and we do as well. The fault of proof does not fall to us. It falls to you from whom the proof was offered.

If you can't do this, then you are trolling, and flaming which are CLEARLY against the Code of Conduct. So I suggest you read it. Anyways just reporting you as a troll and the mods will sort you out.

Erock25

Lussura wrote: »

xherics wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

My friends have 13k DPS as sorcs. So I dunno what you guys do wrong. (that is approx for 40sec)

It is now one of the stronger classes, so why do you keep moaning about weak sorcs.

Yes, it was exactly this: Blood Spawn (46.5s) - 615,459 Total Damage (13239.1 DPS)

But, we need to mention as well:
- Permanent Combat Prayer
- DPS boost War horn
- used ultimate on the Fight start

So, this 13k will be not sustainable in longer fights than 1 minute and even will be less, when we do not receive Combat prayer.

Hodor and your guild mates. Unless you can post clear damage break downs. No one here is going to take you seriously.

Once again!

If you plan to post numbers, without a clear break down...then it's fake. You know it and we do as well. The fault of proof does not fall to us. It falls to you from whom the proof was offered.

If you can't do this, then you are trolling, and flaming which are CLEARLY against the Code of Conduct. So I suggest you read it. Anyways just reporting you as a troll and the mods will sort you out.

As a Sorc who only plays a Sorc and only wants to play a Sorc ... I disagree with you. There doesn't seem to be anything nefarious about their claims and they are only trying to enlighten. Honestly it appears to me like you are the only trolling with your repeated and misguided Code of Conduct threats.

Jujujitsu

One of the biggest problems that I see from this thread is that the people posting to say that Sorcs are in a good spot seem to be hostile towards the community. It is hard to take them serious at that point because you can not trust that what they are saying is 100% accurate.

Also from one of the previous posts they stated that testing was done while only using 70 CPs ... but then they listed that it was specifically 40pts in Mage and 30pts in Thief. Since at 1.6 release we will only get approximately 23 CP points to put into each of the trees (Mage, Thief, Warrior) this means that they put an EXTRA 16-17 pts into the Mage tree. Since those are placed in a rotation -> 1 Mage then 1 Thief then 1 Warrior before you can put another pt into Mage again ... that means they would need 48 -51 EXTRA CP LEVELS @ 400,000 exp per level that is 20,000,000 experience needed to gain in 1.6 before that becomes a viable build.

REALLY?!? Your proof is that we need to get 20 million experience first to get these numbers? Please, do not troll this thread or mislead the DEVS into thinking everything is fixed while you test with these kinds of methods. It is insulting to us all.

Lussura

As a Sorc who only plays a Sorc and only wants to play a Sorc ... I disagree with you. There doesn't seem to be anything nefarious about their claims and they are only trying to enlighten. Honestly it appears to me like you are the only trolling with your repeated and misguided Code of Conduct threats.

If there is no proof offered by screenshots of their dps. Then we can't prove what class did the dps or how they did it. Therefore if they are unwilling to offer such information (which they are). Then they are simply faking it and here to troll you and everyone else. It's that simply.

Would you believe someone if the post just a picture of a horn and then told you they own a unicorn? I would seriously hope not.

I'd like to see them post a damage break down via FTC addon and their bars. This way we see the build and the damage stats. Without this...sorry it's fake.

Lussura

Jujujitsu wrote: »

One of the biggest problems that I see from this thread is that the people posting to say that Sorcs are in a good spot seem to be hostile towards the community. It is hard to take them serious at that point because you can not trust that what they are saying is 100% accurate.

Also from one of the previous posts they stated that testing was done while only using 70 CPs ... but then they listed that it was specifically 40pts in Mage and 30pts in Thief. Since at 1.6 release we will only get approximately 23 CP points to put into each of the trees (Mage, Thief, Warrior) this means that they put an EXTRA 16-17 pts into the Mage tree. Since those are placed in a rotation -> 1 Mage then 1 Thief then 1 Warrior before you can put another pt into Mage again ... that means they would need 48 -51 EXTRA CP LEVELS @ 400,000 exp per level that is 20,000,000 experience needed to gain in 1.6 before that becomes a viable build.

REALLY?!? Your proof is that we need to get 20 million experience first to get these numbers? Please, do not troll this thread or mislead the DEVS into thinking everything is fixed while you test with these kinds of methods. It is insulting to us all.

Agree'd completely. If people would learn to read. They'd see the trolling from Hodor a mile away.

Radixo

I'll add another screenshot I took 2 weeks ago, this is solo dps blood spawn with only self buffs, so no combat prayer or war horn. The tank was doing elemetnal drain for me. This was with 70CP in patch 1.6.1 with good, but not optimal gear. I would say 12.3k sustain over 90 seconds is not too bad and there is a lot of room for improvement, but again blood spawn has lower spell resist than trial bosses. I saw DKs do more, but hard to compare if I do not know what buffs they had, and 30 second parses from DKs with standard is not sustained dps.

Alcast

Lussura wrote: »

SirEwan wrote: »

Erock25 wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Lied wrote: »

Lussura wrote: »

This proves nothing.....there is no damage break down to prove anything. Unless you can provided a clear cut damage breakdown of spells casted and damage amounts....you are simply trolling. So you are clearly trolling. If you don't play Sorc, feel free to move along.

You know what kind of [lack of] information proves even less?

Why should we release any gear and build setup? We gave you the possible numbers, so now it is actually up to you to do smth. We do not have to shovel everything up your asses.

I am sry if I sound very aggressive, but all this sorc stuff makes me just mad

@Alcast I do not wish to know gear set ups or anything of the sort. I am just wondering if that Sorc was a 70-90CP character or if he was max CP?

40 Champion points spent in the Mage.
20 Champion points spent in the Theif.

Could be achieved with less.

Once again!

If you plan to post numbers, without a clear break down...then it's fake. You know it and we do as well. The fault of proof does not fall to us. It falls to you from whom the proof was offered.

If you can't do this, then you are trolling, and flaming which are CLEARLY against the Code of Conduct. So I suggest you read it. Anyways just reporting you as a troll and the mods will sort you out.

You just cant figure things out on your own and QQ always for other ppl to do your work, why always copycat?

Lussura

Radixo wrote: »

I'll add another screenshot I took 2 weeks ago, this is solo dps blood spawn with only self buffs, so no combat prayer or war horn. The tank was doing elemetnal drain for me. This was with 70CP in patch 1.6.1 with good, but not optimal gear. I would say 12.3k sustain over 90 seconds is not too bad and there is a lot of room for improvement, but again blood spawn has lower spell resist than trial bosses. I saw DKs do more, but hard to compare if I do not know what buffs they had, and 30 second parses from DKs with standard is not sustained dps.

You are using a pet....which isn't even the point of this whole thread. You are completely defeating the purpose of players wanting to have a tradional caster WITHOUT pets...which is clear by the orginal post and everyone else here.

Without Pet you lose 1,221.87 dps and without Daedric Prey you lose 794.76. On top of all this Crushing Shock took a huge nerf. With all this taken into account...you are wrong and the dps is still crazy low.

xherics

I forgot to mention, that I used 70 CP only.

And I will not comment the attacking behavior of others, useless.

I posted the DPS, said, how did I do it, just not the gear + skills combo, because as Alcast said, you need to learn/find out it as well. Just an info, I did not use PET!

Before 1.6.3 my max dps for the same time and same boss was 8K-9K with the same gear/skills like now 12k-13k.

I still think, that 2% spell damage is not enough, it needs to be min 4%. I still think, that some nerfs what we got are not correct and should be reverted; or ZOS should just boost the sorcerer class by other changes.

EDIT: I still think, that the cooldown should be removed from Surge and make it heals from max 6 targets.

Lussura

xherics wrote: »

I forgot to mention, that I used 70 CP only.

And I will not comment the attacking behavior of others, useless.

I posted the DPS, said, how did I do it, just not the gear + skills combo, because as Alcast said, you need to learn/find out it as well. Just an info, I did not use PET!

Before 1.6.3 my max dps for the same time and same boss was 8K-9K with the same gear/skills like now 12k-13k.

I still think, that 2% spell damage is not enough, it needs to be min 4%. I still think, that some nerfs what we got are not correct and should be reverted; or ZOS should just boost the sorcerer class by other changes.

Once again!

If you plan to post numbers, without a clear break down...then it's fake. You know it and we do as well. The fault of proof does not fall to us. It falls to you from whom the proof was offered.

If you can't do this, then you are trolling, and flaming which are CLEARLY against the Code of Conduct. So I suggest you read it. Anyways just reporting you as a troll and the mods will sort you out.

I'd like to see them post a damage break down via FTC addon and their bars. This way we see the build and the damage stats. Without this...sorry it's fake.

ToRelax

@Lussura it rather seems to me as if you are the one who can't be taken seriously.

There are still things left that should be done for the Sorcerer class, instant nuke, stronger Expert Mage passive, some bugs, no CD one Surge...

And I have the feeling your feedback is not going to make those fixes happen.

Lussura

ToRelax wrote: »

@Lussura it rather seems to me as if you are the one who can't be taken seriously.

There are still things left that should be done for the Sorcerer class, instant nuke, stronger Expert Mage passive, some bugs, no CD one Surge...

And I have the feeling your feedback is not going to make those fixes happen.

Sorry you don't like me. I just don't like trolls and wanna see solid numbers when someone says something.

I just offered suggestions. I agree with instant nuke, stronger passives, and such.

xherics

No, man, you are trolling, because you can not do the same as we, maybe you are not testing anything, just posting your bullshits... Bang! @Lussura Go and test and you will see the same.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/152662/magicka-sorcerer-1-6-3-good-job-zenimax-on-par-with-other-magicka-dps-classes

We were together in the dungeon.

Asgari

I'm still waiting to see a magicka sorc caster build that can eat a stamina anything build in pvp now. It just simply can't happen.

Vis

xherics wrote: »

No, man, you are trolling, because you can not do the same as we, maybe you are not testing anything, just posting your bullshits...

Making comments like that when the mods have been banning people on these forums is truly a move worthy of your guild's name.

Lussura

Vis wrote: »

xherics wrote: »

No, man, you are trolling, because you can not do the same as we, maybe you are not testing anything, just posting your bullshits...

Making comments like that when the mods have been banning people on these forums is truly a move worthy of your guild's name.

This got me good. Thank you for the laugh

Radixo

An example why you should not trust random dps meters from people on short fights, true for all classes, here is solo burst dps on a world boss in 1.6.1 with 70CP. When you see people posting 15-20k+ dps, it is mostly burst or they have 3600CP. You need to have people in the same group doing dps on the same boss to do valid dps comparisons. But I have a feeling that even if sorc dps turns out to be lower than other classes the gap will not be as high as in 1.5. Crit surge nerf still suck though.

ZOS_GinaBruno

Ok guys, we previously asked that you refrain from personal attacks and keep things constructive, but this thread has run its course and will be closed.