1.6.3 Sorc Magicka Builds Still Ruined!!!

ToRelax

I love the idea behind many of the Sorc spells and I don't see why you should decrease the burst potential in PvP.
reliable direct damage and eventually a DoT and selfheal is all that is needed imo.

Also the Expert Mage passive is indeed very weak. Look at NB passives, they have a passive in every tree to get a certain benefit for slotting skills of that tree. The Expert Mage passive is similar in the way that it gives the same bonus for any skill tree, but it is not competitive yet. should be more like 5% Spell Power.

Carter_DC

As far as I'm concerned, i just abandonned the idea of playing a magika base dps sorcerer.

Lots of Sorc magika builds are still fun to play in solo pve content, and sorc is still enjoyable in PVP with multiple play styles as well.

But there is no way any sound mind would group a magika based Sorcerer in HL PVE (dunjeons or trials).
Magika Based Sorc does about 2/3 of the DPS a Stam Sorc does... At best.

Sorc players still have the option to turn stam-based if what they want is a decent DPS, but i can understand one wanting to have the opportunity to play magika. (damn, i'm a magika based sorc dps myself on 1.5)

As for the Sorc skills revamp, i don't think a full revamp is needed, but sorcerer class still lacks a class dps skill. (no, cristal frag is not a dps skill)

In order to find a use to my 1.6 Sorc, i'm gonna make him a tank.. i think that's a viable option (except for vet arena)

Kingdinguhling

In 1.6.3 atm the biggest problem I have is Magicka on my Sorc and that's a High Elf Fully maxxed CP Sorc.


It shouldn't be this hard to cast spells at will for a sorcerer (especially a VR14 or Endgame Character) ... your Cinematic trailer Shows a Sorc going nuts casting like 20 times back to back ..... where is that Cream all spell at.

the second problem i have is what everyone keeps stating here the DPS spells just aren't good.

15 spells and 3 Ultimate's and none of them do predictable Burst Damage and The spells cost so much they eat our Magicka up trying to get something to hit.

Its easier to just Use other Trees available and save your magicka for Bolt Escape.

If sorc is gonna stay this paper thin it should be the other way around.

We Should have tons of High Damage spells and to save our butts we got plenty of magicka to Bolt Escape too.

This just isn't the case.

I think Most everyone Expects a Nuker DPS class when they First Create a Sorc and then it turns out to be all Shield stacking to stay alive and hugely inconsistent DPS spells with just about no Utility.

Nerfing CC's by granting a full 5 second Immunity across the board ...... Now Sorc Cant Stay at a distance and this is seriously crippling. We are totally dependant on Bolt Escape or Shield stacking.

(Hardened Ward 3500 Magicka second cast of Bolt Escape your looking at like 4200 magicka)

I KNOW NO ONE WANTS TO BE STUN LOCKED BUT IF YOU INDIVIDUALLY BALANCE SPELLS AND ACCTUALLY TEST THEM IT CAN BE DONE. MANY OTHER GAMES HAVE DONE THIS!!!!

I'm not Asking for everything but Pick a Direction at least for the general play style your going after for Sorcerer and make some adjustments...... PLEASE..... so we can tell how we are suppose to be using this class. If all these gamers cant figure it out or the learning curve is just that High Then I think it needs to be dumbed down for the general casual gamers like me that only play 8-10 hours a day .... lulz

Kingdinguhling

PS - People should see a Sorc in PVP and be Fearing us Casting.....

DezIsDead

Carter_DC wrote: »

As far as I'm concerned, i just abandonned the idea of playing a magika base dps sorcerer.

Lots of Sorc magika builds are still fun to play in solo pve content, and sorc is still enjoyable in PVP with multiple play styles as well.

But there is no way any sound mind would group a magika based Sorcerer in HL PVE (dunjeons or trials).
Magika Based Sorc does about 2/3 of the DPS a Stam Sorc does... At best.

Sorc players still have the option to turn stam-based if what they want is a decent DPS, but i can understand one wanting to have the opportunity to play magika. (damn, i'm a magika based sorc dps myself on 1.5)

As for the Sorc skills revamp, i don't think a full revamp is needed, but sorcerer class still lacks a class dps skill. (no, cristal frag is not a dps skill)

In order to find a use to my 1.6 Sorc, i'm gonna make him a tank.. i think that's a viable option (except for vet arena)

Stam sorc is pretty good, but you run into serious stam sustain issues especially with the expert Mage change. Idk how viable stam sorc is as I haven't tested stam sorc on the pts since the expert Mage change. Bu just base on the passive tooltip change it causes more issues than before

Saint_JiubB14_ESO

DezIsDead wrote: »

Carter_DC wrote: »

As far as I'm concerned, i just abandonned the idea of playing a magika base dps sorcerer.

Lots of Sorc magika builds are still fun to play in solo pve content, and sorc is still enjoyable in PVP with multiple play styles as well.

But there is no way any sound mind would group a magika based Sorcerer in HL PVE (dunjeons or trials).
Magika Based Sorc does about 2/3 of the DPS a Stam Sorc does... At best.

Sorc players still have the option to turn stam-based if what they want is a decent DPS, but i can understand one wanting to have the opportunity to play magika. (damn, i'm a magika based sorc dps myself on 1.5)

As for the Sorc skills revamp, i don't think a full revamp is needed, but sorcerer class still lacks a class dps skill. (no, cristal frag is not a dps skill)

In order to find a use to my 1.6 Sorc, i'm gonna make him a tank.. i think that's a viable option (except for vet arena)

Stam sorc is pretty good, but you run into serious stam sustain issues especially with the expert Mage change. Idk how viable stam sorc is as I haven't tested stam sorc on the pts since the Expert Mage change. Bu just base on the passive tooltip change it causes more issues than before

Same, the stam sorcs I know only usually used a couple abilities (most from Storm Calling) so the cost reduction loss is a big hit for them. same with the cooldown on surge.

I feel like ZoS is afraid to give sorcs too much cc. The class description in game basically implies CC (as part of the Dark Magic tree) was supposed to be a major factor for them. But the knockdown on CF and Negate are all anybody uses. Encase is buggy and doesn't compare to Talons, Rune Prison is worthless, and Daedric mines CC aspect is minimal. If that line is supposed to be about control, in a game where CC is already weak, shouldn't those skills be powerful?

It doesn't directly relate to the DPS problems, but it is just a point about the lack of direction in the class. Pets have been awful until now. It feels like they had concepts for the skill lines, but they were never fully realized at launch. So the whole class is behind and needs a lot of work. I think these problems have led to where we are now, with very little build diversity.

Teargrants

Nutronic wrote: »

That being said, I could be selfish and view everything done to the sorcerer so far as a buff for the specific way I play; Deadric Tank

I see in your build you call Bound Armaments one of the key abilities on your bar. If that's the case, you should be more incensed than your magicka sorc commrads about the changes in 1.6.

That's what you get, an astonishing, incredible, unbelievable, stupendous 960 armor... where armor mitigation caps around 30,000.

1.6 brings a huge nerf to its dmg mitigation, the only saving grace is 8% stam.

DezIsDead

Saint_JiubB14_ESO wrote: »

DezIsDead wrote: »

Carter_DC wrote: »

As far as I'm concerned, i just abandonned the idea of playing a magika base dps sorcerer.

Lots of Sorc magika builds are still fun to play in solo pve content, and sorc is still enjoyable in PVP with multiple play styles as well.

But there is no way any sound mind would group a magika based Sorcerer in HL PVE (dunjeons or trials).
Magika Based Sorc does about 2/3 of the DPS a Stam Sorc does... At best.

Sorc players still have the option to turn stam-based if what they want is a decent DPS, but i can understand one wanting to have the opportunity to play magika. (damn, i'm a magika based sorc dps myself on 1.5)

As for the Sorc skills revamp, i don't think a full revamp is needed, but sorcerer class still lacks a class dps skill. (no, cristal frag is not a dps skill)

In order to find a use to my 1.6 Sorc, i'm gonna make him a tank.. i think that's a viable option (except for vet arena)

Stam sorc is pretty good, but you run into serious stam sustain issues especially with the expert Mage change. Idk how viable stam sorc is as I haven't tested stam sorc on the pts since the Expert Mage change. Bu just base on the passive tooltip change it causes more issues than before

Same, the stam sorcs I know only usually used a couple abilities (most from Storm Calling) so the cost reduction loss is a big hit for them. same with the cooldown on surge.

I feel like ZoS is afraid to give sorcs too much cc. The class description in game basically implies CC (as part of the Dark Magic tree) was supposed to be a major factor for them. But the knockdown on CF and Negate are all anybody uses. Encase is buggy and doesn't compare to Talons, Rune Prison is worthless, and Daedric mines CC aspect is minimal. If that line is supposed to be about control, in a game where CC is already weak, shouldn't those skills be powerful?

It doesn't directly relate to the DPS problems, but it is just a point about the lack of direction in the class. Pets have been awful until now. It feels like they had concepts for the skill lines, but they were never fully realized at launch. So the whole class is behind and needs a lot of work. I think these problems have led to where we are now, with very little build diversity.

That what I was saying in another thread, or maybe earlier in this one. I really feel ZOS intended sorc to be a cc fight controller/support. The issue with that is their is no use for that in PvE where everything is a dps race. As far as PvP goes it is useful, but encase is garbage on pts, people just walk right out of it when your casting it. Rune prison is pointless, mines only work if someone is dumb enough to walk right through a glowing purple circle. I'm glad they buffed pets, but that being the only viable build is ridiculous. thats pigeon holing an entire class to one build. All while claiming 1.6 is going to open up new "builds" and "diverse" builds. As far as negate goes, yeah it's still nice for PvE, but people have been pulling less sorcs for trials etc lately because you don't NEED a negate, you can dps through the bosses, and heal through their damage while mitigating it with veils. So why take a sorc who has less dps than this DK or NB that wants to run it. So they buffed pets, great so now I can run a pet build or gtfo of group

ZOS_EveP

We edited the title and removed comments from this thread as they were not line with our Community Rules.
Please stay on topic and don’t interrupt discussions.

DezIsDead

ZOS_EveP wrote: »

We edited the title and removed comments from this thread as they were not line with our Community Rules.
Please stay on topic and don’t interrupt discussions.

Thanks for helping keep it on track<3 now if you could just pass this thread onto the dev team I'd love you forever

Exstazik

I make Breton sorc v14 template on pts.Here is numbers without CP and food,with major buff.








Even with breton who specialized on magicka build stamina>magicka

olsborg

Jujujitsu wrote: »

I agree @Derra. From my limited previous testing it appeared that max magicka affected my damage more than my spell power. So when I saw the change to Expert Mage I didn't think it would be that great. I waited until 1.6.3 came out and I have to say that it is majorly underwhelming. At this stage it looks like I will not be changing my build around to take advantage of this passive. So for my sorc it is a major nerf ... because I lost the spell cost reduction and got nothing in return.

I watched ESO live and they stated several times that they are talking with members of the community to help them with changes and I really do have to wonder just "who" is talking for the sorcs?

To "help us" ZoS:

• made the magicka build that is dependant on light armor super squishy, then you nerfed our pvp bubbles.
• nerfed the worst class self heal in game ... I'm a ranged magicka user and not a melee aoe staff spammer.
• determined that I have one dps staple in CS, gave it an unreliable insta-cast proc. It is reflected more than it hits.
• gave me a laughable passive to increase spell damage when max magicka is a more viable dps increase.
• took away my spell cost reduction making me more dependant on light armor usage. (see first point)
• nerfed the negate ultimate, which I am pretty much required to have on my bar to help my group.

On top of all this, and as far as I know, we are the only class that has a skill with a timer on it to increase it's cost when spammed. You think that is fair? Put that timer on some of the other classes skills and see what they say!

I created this character so I could be a magic user, a mage, but most of my class skills sit unused as abilities from other areas outshine my own. I am not giving up on my sorc, but I have to admit that it feels like "the red-headed step child" right about now.

I could not have said it better myself, however, Ive already given up on sorc, more or less, im now leveling other classes for 1.6.3. Its a shame, yes, but ZOS didnt really give me another choice since they pushed me ever closer to switching class with every update.

Exstazik

olsborg wrote: »

I could not have said it better myself, however, Ive already given up on sorc, more or less, im now leveling other classes for 1.6.3. Its a shame, yes, but ZOS didnt really give me another choice since they pushed me ever closer to switching class with every update.

And what to do people who don't want up again PvP rank and earned achievements?

WarrioroftheWind_ESO

I would like it for them to buff storm atronach, charged variety. IMO he seems the weakest of the ults. Negate has wide applications and utility, overload turns you into a DBZ chara for a few seconds, but every time I deploy stormie he gets knocked flat on his tummy and doesn't get more than a tickling shock off for a few seconds before expiring. Sometimes he gets negated outright and goes poof! At the very least he should be un-stunnable and immune to knockdown/dispel. His aoe is kinda meh too with its limited range.

Sorc pets are still pretty weak too. Scamps are scamps, they're supposed to be expendable little dudes, but twinkies. If you ever ran into a twinkie out in the Grazelands, they'd fly into our face, smack you with their wings, rip you with their talons, and stab you with their tails. Twinkies in ESO however just spit shock bolts. Very weak ones. The last time I tried a template with pets they did barely any damage and I spent more time resummoning them than actual dpsing. Just felt very clunky.

ZOS you need to revert all the changes you've made to sorcs thus far or completely redesign the class. If nothing is done and this goes live, it'll be very unfeasible.

ToRelax

WarrioroftheWind_ESO wrote: »

I would like it for them to buff storm atronach, charged variety. IMO he seems the weakest of the ults. Negate has wide applications and utility, overload turns you into a DBZ chara for a few seconds, but every time I deploy stormie he gets knocked flat on his tummy and doesn't get more than a tickling shock off for a few seconds before expiring. Sometimes he gets negated outright and goes poof! At the very least he should be un-stunnable and immune to knockdown/dispel. His aoe is kinda meh too with its limited range.

Sorc pets are still pretty weak too. Scamps are scamps, they're supposed to be expendable little dudes, but twinkies. If you ever ran into a twinkie out in the Grazelands, they'd fly into our face, smack you with their wings, rip you with their talons, and stab you with their tails. Twinkies in ESO however just spit shock bolts. Very weak ones. The last time I tried a template with pets they did barely any damage and I spent more time resummoning them than actual dpsing. Just felt very clunky.

ZOS you need to revert all the changes you've made to sorcs thus far or completely redesign the class. If nothing is done and this goes live, it'll be very unfeasible.

Well, Morrowind Winged Twilights were extremely resistant and had a high chance to reflect every magic you casted on them back at you. Pretty much the opposite of ESO's Twilights ^^.

Tankqull

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

I don't agree with the velocious curse change, as it stands it's the only realiable burst that we have to catch the enemy off guard in pvp. It would be nice if we instead add another damage spell worth something instead. What could a sorc live without, oh yeah rune prison. Why don't we get a decent damage spell instead of that bs.

this what needs to be changed in regard of VC is that multiple curses are aplyable to one target by multiple sorcs
so from 1 curse per sorc AND target to 1 curse per sorc only. [ah and btw the bloack ability needs to be reverted to live behaviour]

your dot though needs to be implemented in dark magic for one of the 3 redundand ccs.
wich would help pve sorcs significantly. as currently no boss can be cced so no boss will ever under the effect of a dark magic spell thus the passive exploitation is completly useless in PvE.

and 3rd the changes to expertert mage needed to be revised and the spellpower increasement needs to replace desintegration instead. wich is completly unreliable in pve and in some case totally OP in pvp. instead of deintegrate procs the dmg of lightning splash and mage wrath (base dmg - not the finisher proc) needs to be increased by a moderate amount.

kkampaseb17_ESO

Teargrants wrote: »

the only saving grace is 8% stam.

Lol no, believe me it is not its only saving grace....

Nefrast

So did anybody actually spend some hours and tested the new sorcerer and other classes in-game and can post for example comparable DPS test results? I see much drama here but I miss such posts with hard numbers which should be a good basis for any discussion, should they not?

In the DPS results some nice people posted on Tamirel Foundry the (pet-less) sorcerer doesn't look worse then other classes.

The norm seems to be that about everyone there does around 10k sustained unbuffed dps. The dragonknight does 10-20% more but the fights were short and it should get closer to the same 10k if the fights are longer and the relative uptime of their ultimate decreases. Are those test results there wrong and people here have completely other numbers? Please post!

pppontus

Exstazik wrote: »

I make Breton sorc v14 template on pts.Here is numbers without CP and food,with major buff.
[pics]


Even with breton who specialized on magicka build stamina>magicka

Your numbers for CF look crap. Mine is like 7,5K unbuffed (with a staff).

Anyway, while the whining has been going rampant here I took one hour and made a Sorc build without toggles that you can find here: http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/1-6-sorceress-petless-by-pppontus-70-cp/

With combat prayer, buffs etc. and when I learn to play my rotation it should be at least 11-12K. This took me like 3-4 tests to come up with. Comparably Melee NB 10,5K and could be improved a little further, but is clearly harder to play due to melee blabla.



Also consider when you compare to DKs that they drop their Standard of Might increasing all their damage for 20 secs, if the fight is then not longer than 30 secs it's not representative for DKs. I suggest DKs use Shifting Standard for DPS tests as the results get horribly skewed otherwise.

Nefrast wrote: »

So did anybody actually spend some hours and tested the new sorcerer and other classes in-game and can post for example comparable DPS test results? I see much drama here but I miss such posts with hard numbers which should be a good basis for any discussion, should they not?

In the DPS results some nice people posted on Tamirel Foundry the (pet-less) sorcerer doesn't look worse then other classes.

The norm seems to be that about everyone there does around 10k sustained unbuffed dps. The dragonknight does 10-20% more but the fights were short and it should get closer to the same 10k if the fights are longer and the relative uptime of their ultimate decreases. Are those test results there wrong and people here have completely other numbers? Please post!

This is exactly what I've been saying for days without even having the opportunity to test it properly (templates) and then I logged on the PTS yesterday and spent a short time.. and came up with the petless build which works just fine. It's better than most classes at range for sure.

Exstazik

pppontus wrote: »

Your numbers for CF look crap. Mine is like 7,5K unbuffed (with a staff).

[/quote]

As i wrote
Here is numbers without CP and food,with major buff.

Now proof with CF 7,5 k unbuffed,with template gear,without CP and spent characteristics

Tankqull

well in your tamriel post you call liquid lightning a strong dot.
just in comparison bow user dont even feel "scorced earth" to be mentioned in pve wich is a even better/stronger dot than liquid lightning...
i guess that says all about the current standing of sorc abilities...

Alcast

My friends have 13k DPS as sorcs. So I dunno what you guys do wrong. (that is approx for 40sec)

It is now one of the stronger classes, so why do you keep moaning about weak sorcs.

daemonios

Alcast wrote: »

My friends have 13k DPS as sorcs. So I dunno what you guys do wrong. (that is approx for 40sec)

It is now one of the stronger classes, so why do you keep moaning about weak sorcs.

Yeah? Well MY friend does 1 bazillion dps on his Sorc for an indefinite amount of time. Seriously, I do think that Sorcs are better in 1.6.3, but if you're going to claim numbers, please post the build or a screen grab of the DPS, or preferably both.

pppontus

Exstazik wrote: »

As i wrote
Here is numbers without CP and food,with major buff.

Now proof with CF 7,5 k unbuffed,with template gear,without CP and spent characteristics

But why are you constantly comparing things that have nothing to do with reality? If it's a bad build, does it matter if wrecking blow or CF does more damage? Neither will do any good DPS anyway.

This is the reason people hate the Sorcerer threads, it's all about speculation on different tooltips and has nothing to do with DAMAGE PER effing SECOND. If you provide examples of situations that actually exists, then you might be able to raise issues that actually exists and then people might listen.

Tankqull wrote: »

well in your tamriel post you call liquid lightning a strong dot.
just in comparison bow user dont even feel "scorced earth" to be mentioned in pve wich is a even better/stronger dot than liquid lightning...
i guess that says all about the current standing of sorc abilities...

Have you tried bow on the PTS? Now that *** is broken. I can barely do 8K with it.

Alcast wrote: »

My friends have 13k DPS as sorcs. So I dunno what you guys do wrong. (that is approx for 40sec)

It is now one of the stronger classes, so why do you keep moaning about weak sorcs.

It is really strong. You can do overload for 14K DPS, pets or my no-pet build and probably do at least 11-12K on Blood Spawn. I'll try to do Blood Spawn tonight if I can to get a SS of proper group DPS..

Tankqull

pppontus wrote: »

Have you tried bow on the PTS? Now that *** is broken. I can barely do 8K with it.

use scorced earth its a really strong dot now

Fayaburn

Hi,

As already mentioned in various threads I currently main a Sorcerer and as much as I would like to see serious changes made to the class to get rid of its inner flaws, I am sorry to tell you that many of your remarks/suggestions aren't really reasonable and won't help the appropriate targets to take all this thread seriously.

Lussura wrote: »

Lastly Sorcerers need a simply redesign effort put into them. You currently have the time and man power to do this. It needs to be a top issues to be worked on. Currently many Sorcerer spells aren't even used. The VAST majority of our 3 skill trees are simply worthless. Sorcerers need at least a few new spells that offer the class sustained damage throughout a encounter, without being completely reliant on burst dps or Force Pulse.

Here you pointed out the real issue with the class. We get some really lacklusting skills combined with passives that do not synergize well. We do need a true redesign, not quick tweaking as you suggest later.

Lussura wrote: »

In short the Sorcerer class needs to be fixed before 1.6 goes live. If you plan to release 1.6 in it's current state... my gaming community I play with and myself... have sadly decided to find another game to play together. Your lack of effort and concern for these serious issues is to say the....saddening.

True as well. ZOS really need to work on the class and get rid of their "lazy fixes" fashion.

Lussura wrote: »

Lightning Field : The duration of this ability has been increased from 4 to 6 seconds.
Lightning current (change of lightning field): The duration of this ability has been increased to 10 seconds, and removed the extra damage of the first match.

As you see from above. This is the laziest fix ever implemented in the history of mankind. This changes very little about this skill. As a matter of fact, it was nerfed... the extra damage on the first hit was it's one redeeming quality. However the duration increase, without a over all damage increase...still leaves this spell seriously lacking and over all more worthless than ever.

The skill is better with the new 10s duration. It now works as a proper DoT that does not need to be reapplied every 4s. The damage is almost correct now (~1.5k DPS if target stays in zone with SP gear).
The main issue with it is that the skill is a ground target AOE. As stated many times around this forum section, a nice modification would be to make this spell targetable. The AOE would follow the target, however the target should be able to roll-dodge or CC-break to get rid of it.

Lussura wrote: »

Magic Expert : Passive ability that has been changed. Now granted 2% magic force for each equipped magician ability rather than the cost of lightning spells to reduce by 10%.

This has to be the most silly fix implemented in a game thus far. While it is a over all good change...the spell power gained for each slotted Sorcerer spell is only 26 spell power. This means that even if you have all 6 slot filled, you will only gain 156 spell power. Which is simply laughable. Screenshots have been provided to show spell power changes. On the live stream Sorcerer player were informed we had a massive change to a passive granting us a large amount of additional spellpower. However this was simply a lie on the developers behalf. The spell power bonus per slotted Sorcerer spell should be at the very least 75 spell power. For a maximum bonus of 450 spell power. Which would have made a serious impact. However as it stands...it's currently just another worthless lazy change.

It is not the most silly fix implemented. It goes toward the correct direction even if the bonus is not that good. Tweaking the cost of the Lightning skill tree should be implemented to compensate the loss of the old passive and help the stamina Sorcs that got screwed with that change.

Lussura wrote: »

With all this said. Changes are needed to improve Sorcerer magicka based damage. Crystal Fragments which is supposed to be our main damage spell...isn't even used in pvp. Instead it is now Force Pulse spam. Crystal Fragments needs a serious change and to be frank... none of your player currently playing care what happened within pvp... so stop balancing based off it. Only a seriously small fraction from player play ESO to pvp. So it stands to reason, that you simply don't balance based off pvp.

PvP is a part of this game as is PvE. Both are equally legitimate playstyles. Just saying to ignore PvP balancing and totally neglecting the PvP crowd will have as only result to make people overlook this thread. Both PvE and PvP need to be balanced.

Lussura wrote: »

Suggested Crystal Fragments Change:

Current Effect: Cast time 1.3 seconds. Deals XXXX Magic Damage to target and knocks down for 2 seconds. 35% chance to make your next use an instant cast and cost 50% less when activating ability with a Magicka cost.

New Effect: Cast time 0.25 seconds. Deals XXXX Magic Damage to target and knocks down for 2 seconds. 75% chance to make your next use an instant cast and cost 75% less when activating ability with a Magicka cost.

This is a EXTREMELY simply change, that makes the instant cast more reliable for Sorcerer dps. Which makes it once again worth casting.

On 1.6.3, the cast time for Fragment is 1sec, not 1.3sec. And the instant cast on proc also has a 20% damage boost. The changes made with Update 6 to this skill are nice and it does not need anymore buffing.
0.25s cast time combined with 75% instant and reduced cost would make it overpowered.
The issue with Fragment is not the skill itself but the lack of a Sorcerer's instant magicka skill to help proccing it.

Lussura wrote: »

Suggested Velocious Curse Change:

Current Effect: Target is cursed for 3.5 seconds. When effect completes target takes XXXX Magic Damage, and nearby enemies take XXXX Magic Damage. Only 1 curse may be active at a time.

New Effect:Target is cursed for 15.5 seconds. When effect completes target takes XXXX Magic Damage, and nearby enemies take XXXX Magic Damage. Curse may be applied up to 6 targets.

This is another simple change. Velicious Curse would deal more damage over a longer period of time. Provided sustained damage. Being able to be applied to multiple targets allows the spell to be far more effect in aoe situations as well .

The only way to boost Curse is to add a DoT that ticks until the end explosion. Buffing the end explosion is not possible because of the burst potential it would grant. Making the curse duration longer would be nice as well as refreshing a DoT every 4-6 seconds is counter-productive.

Lussura wrote: »

Suggested Mages Wrath Change:

Current Effect: Deals XXXX Shock Damage to target. Explodes for an additional XXXX Shock Damage if the target falls below 20% health within 4 seconds. The explosion deals XXXX Shock Damage to enemies within a 4m radius of the target.

New Effect: Deals XXXX Shock Damage to target. Explodes for an additional XXXX Shock Damage if the target falls below 50% health within 4 seconds. The explosion deals XXXX Shock Damage to enemies within a 4m radius of the target.

This is a EXTREMELY simply change, that makes the execute more reliable for Sorcerer dps. Which makes it once again worth casting. This change makes the boss executable at 50% rather than 20%....it's that simple to fix.

[/quote]

I do not agree with the suggested changes here as well. Execute range starting at 50% is an aberration and that is true for whatever skill uses this mechanic. Templar execute, Reverse slash, Bow DoT and other skills starting to scale at 50% should be modified. 35% seems way more reasonnable to me.
Also, how come the execute range changes between skills? That does not make sense to me.

A modification I would like to see for the Sorcerer execute would be :
- Execute range starts at 25% instead of 20%
- Mage's Wrath morph : Each subsequent cast gains a 6% damage buff. Stacks 5 times up to 30%.
- Endless Fury morph : Each subsequent cast gains a 10% cost reduction. Stacks 5 times up to 50%.

Conclusion / General remarks on the class

As I said before. I do agree that Sorcerer class needs some deep redesign to the way it works. Simple tweaks on the skill values will no be enough to overcome the intrinsic flaws of the class.

The most outstanding issues are the presence of almost completely useless skills in their current state (Rune prison, Dark exchange, Bound armor), along with other very situationnal skills (Daedric mines, Encase). The class also suffers from the number of toggle skills which are kind of a handicap when you take into account the scarcity of our skill bars. Our ultimates are imho lacking a bit as well (Overload situational, Negate nerfed too hard, Atronach damage too low considering it is Single target damage). To finish, we also suffer from having some of our class defining skills being sadly just ersatz of common skills (Surge vs Entropy/Rally, Dark exchange vs Spell symetry, Negate vs Circle of protection).

The gamedesign team also needs to rework our passives a bit as even if most of them seem interesting on paper, in practice, they synergize really badly with out skills and playstyle in general.

To finish, I want to state also that this post is only trying to explain what are the flaws of the Sorcerer class in my opinion. These flaws are the reason why so many Sorcerer feel abandonned and are currently posting in this part of the forum. However, I do not speak here about the class balance and how Sorcerer compares to others. This is not the point of my post so please do not flame me with complains that some build is in a worse state, thank you.

samiz1

IF ZOS DOESN'T UNDERSTAND WITH WORDS THAT SORCERER ARE WEAK.

TELL ME HOW MANY SORCERER DO YOU SEE ?

THE ANSWER IS 2/60

pppontus

Tankqull wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Have you tried bow on the PTS? Now that *** is broken. I can barely do 8K with it.

use scorced earth its a really strong dot now

I did do that, main problem is Snipe weaving is 100% buggy, get stuck in Snipes for several seconds so there is no skill to use as a main DPS skill. It only seems to work if you don't weave which is when I get 8K but then it can't be sustained even for 40 seconds WITH Vicious Ophidian and full stam cost reduction..

It seems that you think that Liquid Lightning isn't a strong DOT, but you can even see since you have to cast it twice as much as Liquid Lightning.. if Scorched Earth is a DPS increase (which I believe it is) then Liquid Lightning is an AMAZING DPS increase (which it is).

So in essence, I don't know what you're trying to say.

Sacadon

Good writeup on the 1.6.3 changes except for stating that ZOS lied. ZOS didn't lie. They were clear about what they changed.

The changes were just not enough to be of any value and instead they made the situation worse. We'd be better off rolling them back and asking them to take more time to consider all of the skills lines again after the 1.6 storm subsides. I say this because right now they don't need another complexity to to deal with and mess up (nor would anyone in similar circumstances). And we have this as an example of what happens when they try a quick fix.

Sacadon

DezIsDead wrote: »

Sorry to post again, but a lot of other threads are saying people need to adapt and use pets etc. got it, pets make higher dps now, but what other class has to fill t4 slots of their bar (unless you want to toggle the. On every weapon swap) and be gimped into 1 build to pull the necessary DPS to be viable? I get it, some classes have to slot ability "x" or ability "y" to maximize DPS output. But they can be diverse. Sorc atm on pts has "the pet build", which doesn't fit my play style, I'm not willing to use, and honestly I think are silly. So I'll play my NB or my Templar unless ZOS makes the necessary changes to sorc. The most revealing thing to me was when they were doing the live show a few weeks ago, and asked the devs about the sorc class. In reply they said "they have the pet builds which is fun". I don't want my class to be a novelty. Sorry, not my play style.

I respect other peoples play styles... For me personally. Pets are just not very cool. Kinda stupid actually the way they're built currently. Give me a titan or something truly menacing and maybe then.