Patch 1.6.3 MORE SORC NERFS

Vis

Expert Mage: This passive ability has been changed. It now grants 2% Spell Power for each Sorcerer ability slotted instead of 10% reduced cost to lightning spells.


Liquid Lighting (Lightning Splash Morph): Increased this ability’s duration to ten seconds, and removed the additional damage from the first hit.


Overload: Reduced the rank up bonus damage for this ability from 3% to 1%.

Also, Overload and its morphs will no longer trigger Ultimate gain from Light and Heavy Attacks.

Makes you wonder ...

Gorthax

Vis wrote: »

Makes you wonder ...

.....which class to re roll too? Y ea I can start to agree lol I was hoping for more spell damage bonus tbh. I will not make any call until I actually see this for myself and try it out. My fingers are still crossed that this brought our (sorcs) damage up to be in a better place

Ezareth

You forgot the most important nerf.....Damage shields reduced by 15%.

Well it is a good thing this game is going FTP as the influx of newbs should give the sorc diehards something they can kill....until those newbs LTP at least.

So many nerfs to the sorc class in 1.6 despite them already being weakest in pts. It boggles the mind. Do they even play their own game?

Dracane

The change to 'Expert Mage' is unbelieveable. Prior to that, I have seen many people saying "If this is only 2%, it's not worth it" BAM there we have it, laughable 2%.

Ancile

Gorthax wrote: »

Vis wrote: »

Makes you wonder ...

.....which class to re roll too? Y ea I can start to agree lol I was hoping for more spell damage bonus tbh. I will not make any call until I actually see this for myself and try it out. My fingers are still crossed that this brought our (sorcs) damage up to be in a better place

For a magicka build, 10% spell power increase is about 2-3% increase in damage from spells that use spell power. It's a hard nerf.

pugyourself

Add in the increased load time for destruction staff heavy attacks as a stealth nerf to the class.

TheLaw

Zenimax needs to look at a serious class redesign for sorcs. Until then, my sorc is no longer my main.

Erock25

Alcast wrote: »

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NB actually had a 3-4 month period where they hijacked every single thread about class balance and cried for buffs. I personally haven't tested NB much in 1.6, but in 1.5, NBs are in a very good place is all aspects of the game.

Vis

Alcast wrote: »

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Try again.

Maulkin

Alcast wrote: »

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Ha ha, thanks for making my day

Vis

Alcast wrote: »

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Must be LOL farming.

xaraan

Most of the changes are for the better IMO.

Overload is way OP, some just aren't using it effectively to see how OP it can be.

Lightning Splash lasting longer and being a better DoT is a good thing. As is increasing spell damage for Expert Mage, I'd rather have that than a little more cost reduction. I can see how a stam sorc might not like it, but realistically a bonus like that should be more helpful to a caster than a stam user IMO, they have plenty of tools for doing damage already and have a different resource to worry about.

Flaminir

I'm.... shocked!

ZOS... I'm guessing we have maybe one more patch before 1.6 goes live? PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE.... engage with us... pick a small handful of constructive Sorcs and lets have a quick chat over TS and chuck a few ideas around. Its SO easy to solve all of these issues with just 3 or 4 simple & realistic changes!

We don't want to be OP... we just want the class to not be at the bottom of every pile in PvE. On Friday in ESO liveEric Wrobel acknowledged that you had seen there was a problem... PLEASE let us help you fix it!

Ancile

xaraan wrote: »

Most of the changes are for the better IMO.

Overload is way OP, some just aren't using it effectively to see how OP it can be.

Lightning Splash lasting longer and being a better DoT is a good thing. As is increasing spell damage for Expert Mage, I'd rather have that than a little more cost reduction. I can see how a stam sorc might not like it, but realistically a bonus like that should be more helpful to a caster than a stam user IMO, they have plenty of tools for doing damage already and have a different resource to worry about.

Sorc isn't your main, eh? I care less about my alts being nerfed too.

Tamanous

Is going to be another 10+ page thread filled with people who haven't even tested the changes but simply knee-jerk reacting?

xaraan

Ancile wrote: »

xaraan wrote: »

Most of the changes are for the better IMO.

Overload is way OP, some just aren't using it effectively to see how OP it can be.

Lightning Splash lasting longer and being a better DoT is a good thing. As is increasing spell damage for Expert Mage, I'd rather have that than a little more cost reduction. I can see how a stam sorc might not like it, but realistically a bonus like that should be more helpful to a caster than a stam user IMO, they have plenty of tools for doing damage already and have a different resource to worry about.

Sorc isn't your main, eh? I care less about my alts being nerfed too.

Non-constructive comments/insults are really helpful - yay. But a sorc is the second character I created after my NB and have played one since shortly after launch. I also run with several players who play them as a main and know their characters well (ZoS does talk to players that play sorcs btw).

I don't want any of my characters nerfed, and those aren't nerfs by-and-large.

A DoT lasting longer? How horrible.

Getting more spell damage? OH, how awful.

And in some cases, there are some broken things in the game that do need nerfed - Overload and Wrecking Blow (from 2H) are a couple of those skills.

Also, I love the lol's, bring 'em on. They made everyone giving me lol's when we talked about the game going B2P oh so right a couple months ago? Also, don't bother actually adding anything constructive about how a better dot or more damage equals a nerf. We wouldn't want that.

Vis

Tamanous wrote: »

Is going to be another 10+ page thread filled with people who haven't even tested the changes but simply knee-jerk reacting?

What's there to test. If you are being nerfed from an already weak position, the only direction to go is down. If we were talking about "trade-offs" it would be one thing. What we're seeing here is just pure nerfs.

macabrex

Ancile

Going to retire my sorc for a while.

Hell, going to go back to Eve for month or so and see how this all plays out.

Peace!

Holycannoli

Tamanous wrote: »

Is going to be another 10+ page thread filled with people who haven't even tested the changes but simply knee-jerk reacting?

Test what. the increased cost of Surge and Bolt Escape?

We know what the problem is, and we know the answer isn't an increased lightning splash duration or a tradeoff of reduced cost for increased spell power.

glentcb14_ESO

How much more proof do we need that the Devs really only want Sorcs to be 1-shot easy kills in PvP? I'm just waiting for those Dev clowns to add a 1.5/sec cooldown timer for streaking.

Tamanous

Vis wrote: »

Tamanous wrote: »

Is going to be another 10+ page thread filled with people who haven't even tested the changes but simply knee-jerk reacting?

What's there to test. If you are being nerfed from an already weak position, the only direction to go is down. If we were talking about "trade-offs" it would be one thing. What we're seeing here is just pure nerfs.

PTS: Public Test Server

What is there to test? Evidently nothing according to you ... just endless whining with no data to back it up. You are getting up to 10% more spell power and an ability that offers layered damage beneath your spam abilities. It MAY increase your dps. How would we know you say? ****ing test it? How about that?

Are you considering the design philosophy for a magicka sorc? Is it supposed to have equal single target damage IF it has superior AOE damage too? Is it supposed to have the ultimate burst damage when it can teleport with impunity? If you ask for a change you may suffer the consequences in other areas.

At the very least, show some damn numbers to back up what your are saying.

Yet you wonder why ZOS isn't bending to your demands?

ToRelax

Even if it was that you use only class abilities on one bar, that's 12% spell damage only. That stat is rediculously overvalued by people who really don't have an idea of how little extra damage/healing it provides.

I don't see any big nerfs and I personally think 15% decrease on damage shields is only fair. If you can crit damage shields that is a whole different matter.

Overall I don't see big nerfs (apart from critting shields maybe) and no mentionable buffs either.

cschwingeb14_ESO

It's a terrible change. It will drive people from the class. Most sorcs use 3-4 skills at most, because sorc class skills suck so bad. But 2-3 of those are in lightning. If you already have some cost reduction, this is a 14-18% cost increase on skills that are already so so much more expensive than what other classes have. Oh, but we could get 2-5% more damage.

Riiiiight. Or we could get that just by changing one armor set bonus from magicka recovery to Spell damage.

Going on memory, Surge is going to cost about 4.5k for medium armor sorcs? That's unusable. Streak at over 3k?

DEVS: Don't nerf the entire class because you're unhappy with Bolt Escape

Gyudan

xaraan wrote: »

And in some cases, there are some broken things in the game that do need nerfed - Overload and Wrecking Blow (from 2H) are a couple of those skills.

Overload had never been an optimal Ultimate for a Sorcerer. Now for the first time it could be used in PVE without DPS loss and I was really eager to do so on Live because of how cool the skill looks. I really enjoyed it on the PTS.
Now it's back to uselessness again.

nun_nonrb19_ESO

xaraan wrote: »

Ancile wrote: »

xaraan wrote: »

Most of the changes are for the better IMO.

Overload is way OP, some just aren't using it effectively to see how OP it can be.

Lightning Splash lasting longer and being a better DoT is a good thing. As is increasing spell damage for Expert Mage, I'd rather have that than a little more cost reduction. I can see how a stam sorc might not like it, but realistically a bonus like that should be more helpful to a caster than a stam user IMO, they have plenty of tools for doing damage already and have a different resource to worry about.

Sorc isn't your main, eh? I care less about my alts being nerfed too.

Non-constructive comments/insults are really helpful - yay.

I don't want any of my characters nerfed, and those aren't nerfs by-and-large.

A DoT lasting longer? How horrible.

Getting more spell damage? OH, how awful.

And in some cases, there are some broken things in the game that do need nerfed - Overload and Wrecking Blow (from 2H) are a couple of those skills.

Lightning splash in it's current form is not that useful and it's not the extra seconds that it'll stay on a spot that all but static bosses will move out from that'll make it more useful.

glentcb14_ESO

Tamanous wrote: »

knee-jerk reacting?

More like the knee capping of the Sorc class.

Jahosefat

Erock25 wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

I AM SICK OF SORCS QQ LIKE LITTLE BABIES.

NBs are more broken than sorcs and do you see ANY of them QQ?

NB actually had a 3-4 month period where they hijacked every single thread about class balance and cried for buffs. I personally haven't tested NB much in 1.6, but in 1.5, NBs are in a very good place is all aspects of the game.

They are still doing this (this guys for example), and unfortunately ZOS is listening. Actually, want to do something fun? Go read a "Buff NB" thread, surprisingly you see a lot of the same faces that talk in the sorc threads, and they are always the ones with the negative opinion of "sorcs are fine, what about NB!?!" and "I've got a sorc and he is super strong! (but I play my nb)".

Before anyone gets excited that "OMG surge will work in pvp now!!", surge proccing on bubbles means you can crit bubbles now. Bubbles have 0 mitigation. So, casting bubble = unmitigated crits. If you happen to have a small sliver of a bubble left, and some gets a crit on you, it is going to hurt much worse than if it hit you without the bubble.

xaraan

ToRelax wrote: »

Even if it was that you use only class abilities on one bar, that's 12% spell damage only. That stat is rediculously overvalued by people who really don't have an idea of how little extra damage/healing it provides.

I don't see any big nerfs and I personally think 15% decrease on damage shields is only fair. If you can crit damage shields that is a whole different matter.

Overall I don't see big nerfs (apart from critting shields maybe) and no mentionable buffs either.

I agree with you mostly, just wanted to comment on some issues you raise.

Well, the shield change is a PvP thing that effects all classes and was done because of how easy it is to stack shields in Cyro now. It will still be easy and that 15% won't hold back players that do it, it's just to bring it in line with the other 15% reductions to damage and the like from entering Cyrodiil.

As for buffs, the biggest changes they went into was trying to make caster sorcs a bit more powerful vs pet builds, which is why they increased the lightning splash dot to help long term dps and the reason they added the spell power increase b/c pets scale off of max magicka and won't get the increase with spell power, only sorc spells and staff abilities will get a benefit from that.

nikolaj.lemcheb16_ESO

Its really weird, they treat sorcs like they did archers in DaoC. They keep on nerfing them even though they are already hurting and weak.

xaraan

nun_nonrb19_ESO wrote: »

xaraan wrote: »

Ancile wrote: »

xaraan wrote: »

Most of the changes are for the better IMO.

Overload is way OP, some just aren't using it effectively to see how OP it can be.

Lightning Splash lasting longer and being a better DoT is a good thing. As is increasing spell damage for Expert Mage, I'd rather have that than a little more cost reduction. I can see how a stam sorc might not like it, but realistically a bonus like that should be more helpful to a caster than a stam user IMO, they have plenty of tools for doing damage already and have a different resource to worry about.

Sorc isn't your main, eh? I care less about my alts being nerfed too.

Non-constructive comments/insults are really helpful - yay.

I don't want any of my characters nerfed, and those aren't nerfs by-and-large.

A DoT lasting longer? How horrible.

Getting more spell damage? OH, how awful.

And in some cases, there are some broken things in the game that do need nerfed - Overload and Wrecking Blow (from 2H) are a couple of those skills.

Lightning splash in it's current form is not that useful and it's not the extra seconds that it'll stay on a spot that all but static bosses will move out from that'll make it more useful.

That is not all together true. I use it on my caster sorc all the time even on live now for PvE fights. I'm looking forward to it being a bigger aoe and lasting longer, that means more attacking while it works and no, stuff doesn't move out of it all that often.