Ze blobbings vill continue...

Maulkin

Blobbing is awesome...so long as it doesn't bring the server down

They can easily be avoided if you don't want to play them and sometimes when they begin to wipe because of siege or just too many players around then you can jump in the bandwagon and get 20 kills in 10 secs. It's a win-win :P

But seriously, considering how much the NPCs have been buffed, keeps would never change hands if it weren't for blobs. I saw some veteran pugs try to take Roe yesterday and they got absolutely slaughtered. At every flag you now have:
- 4 DK NPCs with 10k Health and then 2-3 more spawn out of nowhere
- 2 Healers healing those DKs for 1k hp per sec if not interrupted and also now putting Negates on the flags
- 2 Archers sniping from atop for 2.5k dmg
- 1-2 Storm Mages putting down a storm AoE for 500 DPS

Remember how easy it was to clear those NPCs a couple of months back? If there's some decent defence inside with oils and such, anything but big organised groups will wipe. Every step of the way, I see ZOS making changes that strongly encourage strict grouping or blobbing.

Like I said, so long as the servers hold out, what's the issue really? Especially if they intend to introduce Arena style small-scale combat.

jonasa100

I love to see blobs=fton AP. this a l2p issue

Thechemicals

Yeah its hard to kill a blob zerg when your in a gank group. Maybe l2p War.

Maulkin

Who *** LOLed me!
Come out from the shadows and defend yourself you forum ganker! Probably some NB

mgoss79b14_ESO

I typically run around with a pocket healer and we stay on the fringes killing strays and reinforcements trying to link up. We also look for smaller battles so that the lag and zerging is minimal. It's the most fun I've had in a long time.

We still get caught up in the blob action but it's part of what makes Cyrodiil fun. I suggest using tactics if you don't want to be a part of it.

Thechemicals

I seen and played with the OP before. Guy thinks this is ultima online.

Homm

Huge AP-farm train incoming.. choo-choo!

Haters gonna hate. Want 1v1 - go on a less populated server. Thornblade blobbers will thank you, we don't like to stand in 100+ people queue.

Lowbei

Thechemicals wrote: »

I seen and played with the OP before. Guy thinks this is ultima online.

you have never played with me, i dont group randoms.

and again, i farm zergs. the point is that they should remove ae caps so killing blobs is easier.

you people should really read the thread before being confused by stuff that we covered pages ago lol

Anastasia

Lowbei wrote: »

giving up pvp isnt a solution for me, its the only decent endgame in eso.

the pve people do what? farm AA and HRC all night? that sounds awful

i was in some dc Awaken guild that farmed trials all night, but i couldnt take them seriously. they are 15 minute dungeons, how can that be your endgame?

---

Agreed Lowbei - but then, thats all ZOS figures PvE MMO'rs need apparently ;o/. Bleh.

eventide03b14a_ESO

Docmandu wrote: »

I approve of this message. 50+ people of stick spamming Impulse != PvP

I actually agree with this. I've come to resent that I'm forced to use impulse to do any real aoe damage. There is nothing comparable and frankly I'm getting tired of seeing the staff wielding clones all using the same moves. It's like 70% of the abilities are being ignored by everyone. I don't say this often but impulse needs a serious nerf.

Maulkin

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

Docmandu wrote: »

I approve of this message. 50+ people of stick spamming Impulse != PvP

I actually agree with this. I've come to resent that I'm forced to use impulse to do any real aoe damage. There is nothing comparable and frankly I'm getting tired of seeing the staff wielding clones all using the same moves. It's like 70% of the abilities are being ignored by everyone. I don't say this often but impulse needs a serious nerf.

Not really, the dmg it does is really poor. Sap Essense is a better AoE and I always welcome DW players with Whirling Blades into AoE squads as well. Especially since 1.3 update. Anything with a 360 AoE really.

If you look at your dmg logs the most dmg when blobbing is light attacks, because it is used to kite people right left and centre without deviating from the course and preserving magicka.

When zergs collide most of the damage comes from synergies like Liquid Lightning , Energy Orb, Fragmented Shield etc. Nerfing Impulse to the ground will have huge impact on PvE but 0 impact on PvP zerging.

Lowbei

impulse isnt the problem

ae caps must go

jaif13

Besides impulse, armor skills should be restricted to those wearing 5+ armor pieces. If you could knockdown/stun the skirts, then you could defeat the blobs.

Thechemicals

In an imaginary world where this game could have&support collision without stability failure and player griefing/exploiting, No-ae cap could work.

However, in a game where 70 players can hide inside themselves, this is just an Alliance point farmers nerdgasm.

You wanted your reason why it wont work and why the devs wont give full ae removal? There you go.

Maulkin

Lowbei wrote: »

impulse isnt the problem

ae caps must go

I don't think that's possible. Extended, maybe. Completely go? Mathematically impossible

Lowbei

Thechemicals wrote: »

In an imaginary world where this game could have&support collision without stability failure and player griefing/exploiting, No-ae cap could work.

However, in a game where 70 players can hide inside themselves, this is just an Alliance point farmers nerdgasm.

You wanted your reason why it wont work and why the devs wont give full ae removal? There you go.

lol thats adorable, you should really get some experience in the topic you discuss.

daoc had no ae caps and no collision. you COULD stack up like that... if you wanted to be free ap to any bomb group.

your concept of "ae caps are needed because people stack up" is the most hilarious thing i have seen on the forum today, second only to you claiming that you cant stack annulment on sorc ward lol

Maulkin

@Lowbei‌

I have not played DAOC. Did they really have no caps? How did they get around the issue of the server having to do thousands of calculations on AoE dmg? As a programmer, thta'd be my nightmare.

Lowbei

daoc had no ae caps. its aes were balanced by a simple radius falloff calculation that caused zero lag. i have been bombing zergs 8v100+ for like a decade, and i have never seen a server crash from a bomb.

by the way, daocs rvr zone is the place that cyrodiil is copied from, almost exactly

by the way, as far as processing cycles go, this calculation is literally nothing. it wasnt enough to cause lag in 2001, and its not enough now in 2014.

Maulkin

Lowbei wrote: »

daoc had no ae caps. its aes were balanced by a simple radius falloff calculation that caused zero lag. i have been bombing zergs 8v100+ for like a decade, and i have never seen a server crash from a bomb.

by the way, daocs rvr zone is the place that cyrodiil is copied from, almost exactly

by the way, as far as processing cycles go, this calculation is literally nothing. it wasnt enough to cause lag in 2001, and its not enough now in 2014.

It's not the radius calculation that would be the issue at all. A radius calculation already happens in ESO, if anything it also picks the 6 players closer to the epicenter from the entire list of people that meet the radius calculation.

The pain would be doing the much heavier dmg calculations. Each player has different passives, spell pen, spell res, vamp/ww or not etc etc.

How I see it:

• If 2 groups of 20 collide (40 people in total) their aoes cannot hit more than 6 people atm, so you have to do 40x6 = 240 damage calculations.
• If the AoE hit everyone else the calcs are 2*20squared = 800 damage calcs. If the groups are 50 people sized that's 2*50squared = 5000 calcs. It gets exponentially expensive.

Not sure how they did it in DAOC, was it maybe that there were limited players per instance? Or that the dmg calcs were not as heavy (less coefficient) as in ESO?

Shaggygaming

Lowbei wrote: »

daoc had no ae caps. its aes were balanced by a simple radius falloff calculation that caused zero lag. i have been bombing zergs 8v100+ for like a decade, and i have never seen a server crash from a bomb.

by the way, daocs rvr zone is the place that cyrodiil is copied from, almost exactly

by the way, as far as processing cycles go, this calculation is literally nothing. it wasnt enough to cause lag in 2001, and its not enough now in 2014.

In DAOC casters had an entirely different mechanic. If you were hit by anything while you casting it would interrupt you. It also had a weird delay you had to time right in order to cast again or you would trick yourself into fail casting. You could always throw the one quick cast in if you wanted but you couldn't just stand and cast non stop while someone was hitting you.

You cannot compare the two games since their mechanics were entirely different.

Thechemicals

Lowbei wrote: »

Thechemicals wrote: »

In an imaginary world where this game could have&support collision without stability failure and player griefing/exploiting, No-ae cap could work.

However, in a game where 70 players can hide inside themselves, this is just an Alliance point farmers nerdgasm.

You wanted your reason why it wont work and why the devs wont give full ae removal? There you go.

lol thats adorable, you should really get some experience in the topic you discuss.

daoc had no ae caps and no collision. you COULD stack up like that... if you wanted to be free ap to any bomb group.

your concept of "ae caps are needed because people stack up" is the most hilarious thing i have seen on the forum today, second only to you claiming that you cant stack annulment on sorc ward lol

This isn't daoc.

Lowbei

dmg calculations arent enough to cause lag, not even close. its simple math, on a machine meant to handle millions of calculations per second.

and it wasnt a limited players thing, as again, we are talking about 8v100s

google daoc zerg bombing and have a look

Lowbei

Adonikam wrote: »

Lowbei wrote: »

daoc had no ae caps. its aes were balanced by a simple radius falloff calculation that caused zero lag. i have been bombing zergs 8v100+ for like a decade, and i have never seen a server crash from a bomb.

by the way, daocs rvr zone is the place that cyrodiil is copied from, almost exactly

by the way, as far as processing cycles go, this calculation is literally nothing. it wasnt enough to cause lag in 2001, and its not enough now in 2014.

In DAOC casters had an entirely different mechanic. If you were hit by anything while you casting it would interrupt you. It also had a weird delay you had to time right in order to cast again or you would trick yourself into fail casting. You could always throw the one quick cast in if you wanted but you couldn't just stand and cast non stop while someone was hitting you.

You cannot compare the two games since their mechanics were entirely different.

again, cyrodiil is clearly a copy of daocs rvr zone (new frontiers) and mechanics are a nonfactor if they are spread across the board to all, like they are. in fact eso has no real cc so theres even LESS excuse to get caught in a bomb

Shaggygaming

Lowbei wrote: »

Adonikam wrote: »

Lowbei wrote: »

daoc had no ae caps. its aes were balanced by a simple radius falloff calculation that caused zero lag. i have been bombing zergs 8v100+ for like a decade, and i have never seen a server crash from a bomb.

by the way, daocs rvr zone is the place that cyrodiil is copied from, almost exactly

by the way, as far as processing cycles go, this calculation is literally nothing. it wasnt enough to cause lag in 2001, and its not enough now in 2014.

In DAOC casters had an entirely different mechanic. If you were hit by anything while you casting it would interrupt you. It also had a weird delay you had to time right in order to cast again or you would trick yourself into fail casting. You could always throw the one quick cast in if you wanted but you couldn't just stand and cast non stop while someone was hitting you.

You cannot compare the two games since their mechanics were entirely different.

again, cyrodiil is clearly a copy of daocs rvr zone (new frontiers) and mechanics are a nonfactor if they are spread across the board to all, like they are. in fact eso has no real cc so theres even LESS excuse to get caught in a bomb

I didn't say anything about Cyrodiil and I didn't mention anything about CC. You did play DAOC right? You do remember that you couldn't cast a spell if you were hit? So the casting mechanics of ESO and DAOC are way different.

Lowbei

yeah... and what does that have to do with the discussion at hand? we were talking about server processing damage calculations and its effect on server lag, and you want to discuss daoc interrupt mechanics? lol k

Shaggygaming

Lowbei wrote: »

yeah... and what does that have to do with the discussion at hand? we were talking about server processing damage calculations and its effect on server lag, and you want to discuss daoc interrupt mechanics? lol k

Since casters can cast through everything in ESO they're spamming every AOE ability on their bar. The constant spam of all these AOE abilities cause server issues which is what some of your discussion was about. In DAOC, you could NOT do this because you COULDN'T cast non stop as a caster. If you were hit by anything, melee, spell, AOE root, whatever, you were interrupted which would therefore be less stressful on the server instead of 100-200 people standing in one area on your screen spamming AOE abilities like they do in ESO.

Thechemicals

Lowbei wrote: »

yeah... and what does that have to do with the discussion at hand? we were talking about server processing damage calculations and its effect on server lag, and you want to discuss daoc interrupt mechanics? lol k

So this discussion isn't about blobs (as in zergs/massive player groups?) continuing until ae(area effect) caps are removed? That's 2 threads involving you that are getting pretty pointless.

This is how people in eso community with some skill in creating threads do it...same topic better understanding.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/122609/the-horrible-aoe-cap-are-they-even-listening-o/p1

L2write bro, your threads are a hot mess.

Lowbei

Adonikam wrote: »

Lowbei wrote: »

yeah... and what does that have to do with the discussion at hand? we were talking about server processing damage calculations and its effect on server lag, and you want to discuss daoc interrupt mechanics? lol k

Since casters can cast through everything in ESO they're spamming every AOE ability on their bar. The constant spam of all these AOE abilities cause server issues which is what some of your discussion was about. In DAOC, you could NOT do this because you COULDN'T cast non stop as a caster. If you were hit by anything, melee, spell, AOE root, whatever, you were interrupted which would therefore be less stressful on the server instead of 100-200 people standing in one area on your screen spamming AOE abilities like they do in ESO.

right, sure... but his question i was responding to, was does massive aoe damage calculations affect server performance. he said he was interested because he was a programmer. to which the answer was "no, not significantly".

Thechemicals wrote: »

Lowbei wrote: »

yeah... and what does that have to do with the discussion at hand? we were talking about server processing damage calculations and its effect on server lag, and you want to discuss daoc interrupt mechanics? lol k

So this discussion isn't about blobs (as in zergs/massive player groups?) continuing until ae(area effect) caps are removed? That's 2 threads involving you that are getting pretty pointless.

This is how people in eso community with some skill in creating threads do it...same topic better understanding.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/122609/the-horrible-aoe-cap-are-they-even-listening-o/p1

L2write bro, your threads are a hot mess.

the discussion in total is about that, i was clearly answering mikes question. perhaps if you read the entire thread, you would be less confused by the topic. also there are dozens if not hundreds of ae threads, and mine have been quite successful in bringing it to the attention of the devs, since one of the threads i detailed it in received the official response about them "having internal discussions on ae caps".

also, im not sure i can take you seriously after you claimed i was wrong about hardened ward, when you had no idea what skill we were talking about. that seems to happen to you often. jussayin

Durham

You could also make pbaoe no movement spell.. meaning u cannot move while casting...

Lowbei

Durham wrote: »

You could also make pbaoe no movement spell.. meaning u cannot move while casting...

i would be fine with that or a 1sec cast timer if they also removed ae caps.