Justice System impact on Provisioning skill and motif/recipe farming? ZOS please help with answer...
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isengrimb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Agree, this definitely needs some clarification. Babylon could be right, but we'd be stupid to take his word for it, unless he's a stealth ZOS employee.
I really do hope he's right though, and if he is, I'd be happy to bake him a cookie.
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babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭isengrimb16_ESO wrote: »Agree, this definitely needs some clarification. Babylon could be right, but we'd be stupid to take his word for it, unless he's a stealth ZOS employee.
I really do hope he's right though, and if he is, I'd be happy to bake him a cookie.
*she. Had to stop you there
I'm just trying to make sense of it all from what we've seen and been told.Edited by babylon on July 24, 2014 7:32PM2 -
DenverRalphy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »
Oh boy are you way off. Whether you're crouching or not makes no difference. Taking the items is stealing either way. Crouching/sneaking simply increases your chance of looting it without getting caught.There will be no change at all. To steal you need to be crouching...if you're crouching the use action on the container will change from "search" to "steal".
If you're not crouching you get the container loot same as always.
Stolen goods will have a gold price, while normally obtained goods won't have a gold price.Justice System: You can take items from crates etc as normal but instead now you are stealing items. Items will have value if they are stolen. To steal something, you need to be hidden.
Also it's likely that people won't be able to sell their stolen goods to other players.
Nope - to steal you need to be crouching. Read the quote above, it explains everything.
You need to be crouching/stealth to Successfully steal. Standing upright doesn't make those items free to take.
No you don't need to not be seen to steal. You can steal at any time, right in front of a guard - just getting seen means you get caught.
To get the steal action, you'll need to be crouching.
Where are you coming to the conclusion that you need to be crouching to get the steal action? The items in a container are flagged as stealing (in red) whether you're crouching or not. Where exactly are you getting anything different from that?
It states you need to be hidden (crouching) to steal items, and that items will have value IF stolen. This implies that items don't have value if they are not stolen...so items will be taken from containers as normal unless players are crouched. This will bring up the "steal" action instead of the "search" action.
Als it's been stated that you can't sell stolen items normally, you have to find a special NPC to sell them to (a fence)...so it's likely the items won't be able to be crafted with either.
By your own description, you used the word "implies", and you're reading way too much into it.
You need to be hidden (whether that requires you to be crouching, NPC's not looking your direction, whatever) to successfully steal an item without being caught. Be seen doing it and a guard immediately pops up and nabs you.
Items that are flagged as stealing are flagged that way regardless whether you're hidden or not.
Stolen items don't suddenly hold value "because" they're stolen. The items will hold value regardless.
But I digress. When the justice system publishes, you'll see.2 -
isengrimb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭isengrimb16_ESO wrote: »Agree, this definitely needs some clarification. Babylon could be right, but we'd be stupid to take his word for it, unless he's a stealth ZOS employee.
I really do hope he's right though, and if he is, I'd be happy to bake him a cookie.
*she. Had to stop you there
Ooh, sorry. "She" here, too. Hello fellow female gamer with ambiguous name. Do you like playing big muscly guys, too?
The cookie offer still stands, though. PLEASE be right!
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XquixoticalX✭✭✭Also a she! Gamer ladies ftw!
But seriously, I do think your information is ambiguous at best. I would like some clarification from ZOS. If it is indeed going to be harder to find mats for food, I am going to put a considerable amount of time and effort storing them up until then. Otherwise I am not going to waste my time and bank space.Edited by XquixoticalX on July 24, 2014 7:33PM~ Belle Folie
"I'm here to kick ass and eat sweetrolls. And I'm all out of sweetrolls."1 -
SirAndy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Looks like your stealing without consequences days are coming to an end ...XquixoticalX wrote: »Very true, but anyone who has maxed Provisioning and dumped the max amount of skill points into it and does it as one of their main crafting skills knows that towns are the best places for provisioning mats. Specifically inns, banks, and taverns.
;-)
PS: Correct me if i'm wrong, but isn't that the whole point of a justice system?Edited by SirAndy on July 24, 2014 7:34PM0 -
isengrimb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
Looks like your stealing without consequences days are coming to an end ...XquixoticalX wrote: »Very true, but anyone who has maxed Provisioning and dumped the max amount of skill points into it and does it as one of their main crafting skills knows that towns are the best places for provisioning mats. Specifically inns, banks, and taverns.
;-)
Bah. In Skyrim I'd just dump a bucket on a vendor's head. Or /changeownership on everything in his damn shop and steal my head off with no consequences.
It'd be kind of fun to go around sticking buckets on NPCs heads for the theives, though.
Don't wanna kill or bump 'em, just turn them into Buckethead. If we could do it to bards, maybe they'd play better music!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dLcvn3VwhgU Edited by isengrimb16_ESO on July 24, 2014 7:37PM0 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭isengrimb16_ESO wrote: »isengrimb16_ESO wrote: »Agree, this definitely needs some clarification. Babylon could be right, but we'd be stupid to take his word for it, unless he's a stealth ZOS employee.
I really do hope he's right though, and if he is, I'd be happy to bake him a cookie.
*she. Had to stop you there
Ooh, sorry. "She" here, too. Hello fellow female gamer with ambiguous name. Do you like playing big muscly guys, too?
The cookie offer still stands, though. PLEASE be right!
I hope so, it makes sense (that we can still get provisioning mats everywhere as normal without being forced into the justice system, and that stolen items wouldn't be able to be crafted with anyway because they need to be disposed of at a fence - so there'd be no way at all to get mats if this was not the case). And all cookies happily accepted 1 -
Tremulous✭✭✭XquixoticalX wrote: »
That's because you can't eat an ingot or find it in a basket. Think of it like this if you had a basket of grapes what you would consider it to be if someone just took them all?
I would want to see plants in the wild that grow mats or even when we get housing small farms on the plots. But in any case there will always be more food in a solo dungeon then any town.0 -
Tyr✭✭✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »
Oh boy are you way off. Whether you're crouching or not makes no difference. Taking the items is stealing either way. Crouching/sneaking simply increases your chance of looting it without getting caught.There will be no change at all. To steal you need to be crouching...if you're crouching the use action on the container will change from "search" to "steal".
If you're not crouching you get the container loot same as always.
Stolen goods will have a gold price, while normally obtained goods won't have a gold price.Justice System: You can take items from crates etc as normal but instead now you are stealing items. Items will have value if they are stolen. To steal something, you need to be hidden.
Also it's likely that people won't be able to sell their stolen goods to other players.
Nope - to steal you need to be crouching. Read the quote above, it explains everything.
You need to be crouching/stealth to Successfully steal. Standing upright doesn't make those items free to take.
I keep hearing this but Isn't this just player speculation?
Where was this confirmed by devs?0 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »
Oh boy are you way off. Whether you're crouching or not makes no difference. Taking the items is stealing either way. Crouching/sneaking simply increases your chance of looting it without getting caught.There will be no change at all. To steal you need to be crouching...if you're crouching the use action on the container will change from "search" to "steal".
If you're not crouching you get the container loot same as always.
Stolen goods will have a gold price, while normally obtained goods won't have a gold price.Justice System: You can take items from crates etc as normal but instead now you are stealing items. Items will have value if they are stolen. To steal something, you need to be hidden.
Also it's likely that people won't be able to sell their stolen goods to other players.
Nope - to steal you need to be crouching. Read the quote above, it explains everything.
You need to be crouching/stealth to Successfully steal. Standing upright doesn't make those items free to take.
I keep hearing this but Isn't this just player speculation?
Where was this confirmed by devs?
Well in all the videos you'll notice they were crouched. You wouldn't need to be crouched to begin a kill if that was not the case (that crouching gives you access to justice system actions like targeting NPCs and stealing) because you're going to get seen anyway.0 -
Skwor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Honestly I hope it does make mats harder to get, they are already to easy and to cheap.2 -
Tyr✭✭✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »
Oh boy are you way off. Whether you're crouching or not makes no difference. Taking the items is stealing either way. Crouching/sneaking simply increases your chance of looting it without getting caught.There will be no change at all. To steal you need to be crouching...if you're crouching the use action on the container will change from "search" to "steal".
If you're not crouching you get the container loot same as always.
Stolen goods will have a gold price, while normally obtained goods won't have a gold price.Justice System: You can take items from crates etc as normal but instead now you are stealing items. Items will have value if they are stolen. To steal something, you need to be hidden.
Also it's likely that people won't be able to sell their stolen goods to other players.
Nope - to steal you need to be crouching. Read the quote above, it explains everything.
You need to be crouching/stealth to Successfully steal. Standing upright doesn't make those items free to take.
I keep hearing this but Isn't this just player speculation?
Where was this confirmed by devs?
Well in all the videos you'll notice they were crouched. You wouldn't need to be crouched to begin a kill if that was not the case (that crouching gives you access to justice system actions like targeting NPCs and stealing) because you're going to get seen anyway.
Oh I see, so it wasn't confirmed anywhere and it is 100% speculation based on an assumption from what you saw in the video.
Thanks for clarification.3 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »
Oh boy are you way off. Whether you're crouching or not makes no difference. Taking the items is stealing either way. Crouching/sneaking simply increases your chance of looting it without getting caught.There will be no change at all. To steal you need to be crouching...if you're crouching the use action on the container will change from "search" to "steal".
If you're not crouching you get the container loot same as always.
Stolen goods will have a gold price, while normally obtained goods won't have a gold price.Justice System: You can take items from crates etc as normal but instead now you are stealing items. Items will have value if they are stolen. To steal something, you need to be hidden.
Also it's likely that people won't be able to sell their stolen goods to other players.
Nope - to steal you need to be crouching. Read the quote above, it explains everything.
You need to be crouching/stealth to Successfully steal. Standing upright doesn't make those items free to take.
I keep hearing this but Isn't this just player speculation?
Where was this confirmed by devs?
Well in all the videos you'll notice they were crouched. You wouldn't need to be crouched to begin a kill if that was not the case (that crouching gives you access to justice system actions like targeting NPCs and stealing) because you're going to get seen anyway.
Oh I see, so it wasn't confirmed anywhere and it is 100% speculation based on an assumption from what you saw in the video.
Thanks for clarification.
Yep speculation. Same as what everyone else is doing. Except this makes more sense than the assumption that mats will now be impossible to find except in the wild.- we need to be crouching (stated in quote above)
- items IF stolen now have value, so other items are obviously not stolen
- stolen items cannot be sold to normal vendors and need to be sold to a special NPC/fence (so probably can't be used in crafting)
So if stolen items can't be crafted with then it would be impossible to craft at all, as everyone seems to be thinking all (or almost all) items from containers now have to be stolen.
It also makes sense that ZOS would not be forcing crafters into the justice system to get their mats (mats which, as above, could not be used in crafting anyway if stolen).Edited by babylon on July 24, 2014 7:57PM1 -
XquixoticalX✭✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »
Oh boy are you way off. Whether you're crouching or not makes no difference. Taking the items is stealing either way. Crouching/sneaking simply increases your chance of looting it without getting caught.There will be no change at all. To steal you need to be crouching...if you're crouching the use action on the container will change from "search" to "steal".
If you're not crouching you get the container loot same as always.
Stolen goods will have a gold price, while normally obtained goods won't have a gold price.Justice System: You can take items from crates etc as normal but instead now you are stealing items. Items will have value if they are stolen. To steal something, you need to be hidden.
Also it's likely that people won't be able to sell their stolen goods to other players.
Nope - to steal you need to be crouching. Read the quote above, it explains everything.
You need to be crouching/stealth to Successfully steal. Standing upright doesn't make those items free to take.
I keep hearing this but Isn't this just player speculation?
Where was this confirmed by devs?
Well in all the videos you'll notice they were crouched. You wouldn't need to be crouched to begin a kill if that was not the case (that crouching gives you access to justice system actions like targeting NPCs and stealing) because you're going to get seen anyway.
Oh I see, so it wasn't confirmed anywhere and it is 100% speculation based on an assumption from what you saw in the video.
Thanks for clarification.
Yep speculation. Same as what everyone else is doing. Except this makes more sense than the assumption that mats will now be impossible to find except in the wild.- we need to be crouching (stated in quote above)
- items IF stolen now have value, so other items are obviously not stolen
- stolen items cannot be sold to normal vendors and need to be sold to a special NPC/fence (so probably can't be used in crafting
So if stolen items can't be crafted with then it would be impossible to craft at all, as everyone seems to be thinking all (or almost all) items from containers now have to be stolen.
It also makes sense that ZOS would not be forcing crafters into the justice system to get their mats (mates which, as above, could not be used in crafting anyway if stolen).
I really hope you are right. But ZOS has shown that they have no problem forcing you into a different playstyle already. They forced templars to put on dresses and carry sticks if they want to be viable in VR content and PVP. They forced anyone using a sword and shield or 2h weapon to abandon it for the same reason.
Edited by XquixoticalX on July 24, 2014 7:57PM~ Belle Folie
"I'm here to kick ass and eat sweetrolls. And I'm all out of sweetrolls."1 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
I hope I'm right as well, if not they'll need to make it that way. I don't think this game can afford to push away the pve crowd.XquixoticalX wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »
Oh boy are you way off. Whether you're crouching or not makes no difference. Taking the items is stealing either way. Crouching/sneaking simply increases your chance of looting it without getting caught.There will be no change at all. To steal you need to be crouching...if you're crouching the use action on the container will change from "search" to "steal".
If you're not crouching you get the container loot same as always.
Stolen goods will have a gold price, while normally obtained goods won't have a gold price.Justice System: You can take items from crates etc as normal but instead now you are stealing items. Items will have value if they are stolen. To steal something, you need to be hidden.
Also it's likely that people won't be able to sell their stolen goods to other players.
Nope - to steal you need to be crouching. Read the quote above, it explains everything.
You need to be crouching/stealth to Successfully steal. Standing upright doesn't make those items free to take.
I keep hearing this but Isn't this just player speculation?
Where was this confirmed by devs?
Well in all the videos you'll notice they were crouched. You wouldn't need to be crouched to begin a kill if that was not the case (that crouching gives you access to justice system actions like targeting NPCs and stealing) because you're going to get seen anyway.
Oh I see, so it wasn't confirmed anywhere and it is 100% speculation based on an assumption from what you saw in the video.
Thanks for clarification.
Yep speculation. Same as what everyone else is doing. Except this makes more sense than the assumption that mats will now be impossible to find except in the wild.- we need to be crouching (stated in quote above)
- items IF stolen now have value, so other items are obviously not stolen
- stolen items cannot be sold to normal vendors and need to be sold to a special NPC/fence (so probably can't be used in crafting
So if stolen items can't be crafted with then it would be impossible to craft at all, as everyone seems to be thinking all (or almost all) items from containers now have to be stolen.
It also makes sense that ZOS would not be forcing crafters into the justice system to get their mats (mates which, as above, could not be used in crafting anyway if stolen).
I really hope you are right. But ZOS has shown that they have no problem forcing you into a different playstyle already. They forced templars to put on dresses and carry sticks if they want to be viable in VR content and PVP. They forced anyone using a sword and shield or 2h weapon to abandon it for the same reason.
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ShedsHisTail✭✭✭✭✭
✭XquixoticalX wrote: »Will there be a new way to obtain provisioning ingredients in the future, or will all provisioners have to resort to sneaking around towns and stealing?
Also I wonder what impact this will have on farming containers for motifs and recipes and such. If opening containers in public areas and removing their contents is considered stealing, how will we obtain motifs in the future?
I'm less concerned with the provisioning issue but I see the motif thing being a legitimate problem.
With the provisioning revamp thread they've proposed making it easier to tell what's in a container based on what the container looks like; see beans, get beans. And if it follows the pattern of other Elder Scrolls games, looting items which belong to hostile NPCs (ie: all those bags of junk in various bandit caves) won't be counted as stealing. So provisioners will be able to get ingredients more consistently by focusing on containers which appear to contain what they're after (rather than just scrounging through everything and hoping for the best), and doing more gathering outside of towns.
The motifs, though, seem more troublesome as, as far as I've seen, those only seem to come from NPC owned wardrobes and stuff. Which would make them much more difficult to acquire.Edited by ShedsHisTail on July 24, 2014 8:06PM"As an online discussion of Tamrielic Lore grows longer, the probability of someone blaming a Dragon Break approaches 1." -- Sheds' Law
Have you seen the Twin Lamps?0 -
Kilara✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »
You need to be hidden (whether that requires you to be crouching, NPC's not looking your direction, whatever) to successfully steal an item without being caught. Be seen doing it and a guard immediately pops up and nabs you.
Items that are flagged as stealing are flagged that way regardless whether you're hidden or not.
Stolen items don't suddenly hold value "because" they're stolen. The items will hold value regardless.
I agree (based on my personal assumption ) - I think the differentiating factor will be red or white container text - irrespective of whether the player crouches or stands upright. Crouching/sneak will just increase the chances of the theft being successful.
And the determining factor for red or white container text will be whether the container has an owner or not, and going by my experiences from Skyrim, there will very likely be enough "unowned" containers in towns & houses to satisfy all provisioners without them having to revert to criminal actions.
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DenverRalphy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭DenverRalphy wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »
Oh boy are you way off. Whether you're crouching or not makes no difference. Taking the items is stealing either way. Crouching/sneaking simply increases your chance of looting it without getting caught.There will be no change at all. To steal you need to be crouching...if you're crouching the use action on the container will change from "search" to "steal".
If you're not crouching you get the container loot same as always.
Stolen goods will have a gold price, while normally obtained goods won't have a gold price.Justice System: You can take items from crates etc as normal but instead now you are stealing items. Items will have value if they are stolen. To steal something, you need to be hidden.
Also it's likely that people won't be able to sell their stolen goods to other players.
Nope - to steal you need to be crouching. Read the quote above, it explains everything.
You need to be crouching/stealth to Successfully steal. Standing upright doesn't make those items free to take.
I keep hearing this but Isn't this just player speculation?
Where was this confirmed by devs?
Every ES title as an example would be a better starting point than the guy stating unequivocally otherwise.0 -
XquixoticalX✭✭✭ShedsHisTail wrote: »XquixoticalX wrote: »Will there be a new way to obtain provisioning ingredients in the future, or will all provisioners have to resort to sneaking around towns and stealing?
Also I wonder what impact this will have on farming containers for motifs and recipes and such. If opening containers in public areas and removing their contents is considered stealing, how will we obtain motifs in the future?
I'm less concerned with the provisioning issue but I see the motif thing being a legitimate problem.
With the provisioning revamp thread they've proposed making it easier to tell what's in a container based on what the container looks like; see beans, get beans. And if it follows the pattern of other Elder Scrolls games, looting items which belong to hostile NPCs (ie: all those bags of junk in various bandit caves) won't be counted as stealing. So provisioners will be able to get ingredients more consistently by focusing on containers which appear to contain what they're after (rather than just scrounging through everything and hoping for the best), and doing more gathering outside of towns.
The motifs, though, seem more troublesome as, as far as I've seen, those only seem to come from NPC owned wardrobes and stuff. Which would make them much more difficult to acquire.
I've been thinking for a while that it might be a good idea for ZOS to start including motifs in dungeon mob and boss drops, as well as elite recipes. I know purple recipes supposedly drop in dungeons, but I have spent days farming dungeon mobs and bosses and never gotten over a green.
Also they could consider including motifs and recipes in treasure chests out in the world. Like the kind you need a lockpick for. Not really an ideal situation but if it becomes stealing to find motifs there will need to be other avenues for obtaining them because I intend to remain a "good" character and join the guards.
~ Belle Folie
"I'm here to kick ass and eat sweetrolls. And I'm all out of sweetrolls."3 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I think the differentiating factor will be red or white container text - irrespective of whether the player crouches or stands upright.
I doubt this because otherwise players would be subject to accidental theft (sleepy people automatically hitting E thinking it was search but it's really steal).
To avoid that it would make much more sense that ZOS made it so players have to actively change their entire position from standing to crouching, and this is when the action key turns into "steal". Otherwise it will be "search", as normal.0 -
Robotukas✭✭✭XquixoticalX wrote: »If that's the case, then provisioners would have to put skill points into thieves guild just to continue doing their craft as before. How is this fair in relation to the other crafting skills? It's not becoming "theft" to collect alchemy reagents or blacksmithing ores for example. What if we don't want to join thieves guild skill line? What if I want to be an honorable provisioner who joins the guards?
What happened to play your way? Just seems like this change will be forcing provisioners into being on the wrong side of the justice system. Just like the game forced templars who want to succeed into wearing light armor and waving sticks. I'm generally not a complainer and I'm not trying to be negative, but this presents a legitimate problem in my opinion and I'm just curious.
In ESO doesn't exit to play your way from beginning. Only few MMO games manage to make to play your way.0 -
XquixoticalX✭✭✭All of this aside, I think the Justice System will be an exciting addition to the game and I am looking forward to it. I just want to be informed, and as I stated earlier, mainly I just want to know if I should invest some quality time into collecting and storing food mats now before the change happens. It would be a waste of time and space to do this if nothing will change.
Again, please someone from ZOS weigh in here...~ Belle Folie
"I'm here to kick ass and eat sweetrolls. And I'm all out of sweetrolls."0 -
ShedsHisTail✭✭✭✭✭
✭DenverRalphy wrote: »
You need to be hidden (whether that requires you to be crouching, NPC's not looking your direction, whatever) to successfully steal an item without being caught. Be seen doing it and a guard immediately pops up and nabs you.
Items that are flagged as stealing are flagged that way regardless whether you're hidden or not.
Stolen items don't suddenly hold value "because" they're stolen. The items will hold value regardless.
I agree (based on my personal assumption ) - I think the differentiating factor will be red or white container text - irrespective of whether the player crouches or stands upright. Crouching/sneak will just increase the chances of the theft being successful.
And the determining factor for red or white container text will be whether the container has an owner or not, and going by my experiences from Skyrim, there will very likely be enough "unowned" containers in towns & houses to satisfy all provisioners without them having to revert to criminal actions.
This. ^
"As an online discussion of Tamrielic Lore grows longer, the probability of someone blaming a Dragon Break approaches 1." -- Sheds' Law
Have you seen the Twin Lamps?1 -
vyndral13preub18_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭XquixoticalX wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »
Oh boy are you way off. Whether you're crouching or not makes no difference. Taking the items is stealing either way. Crouching/sneaking simply increases your chance of looting it without getting caught.There will be no change at all. To steal you need to be crouching...if you're crouching the use action on the container will change from "search" to "steal".
If you're not crouching you get the container loot same as always.
Stolen goods will have a gold price, while normally obtained goods won't have a gold price.Justice System: You can take items from crates etc as normal but instead now you are stealing items. Items will have value if they are stolen. To steal something, you need to be hidden.
Also it's likely that people won't be able to sell their stolen goods to other players.
Nope - to steal you need to be crouching. Read the quote above, it explains everything.
You need to be crouching/stealth to Successfully steal. Standing upright doesn't make those items free to take.
I keep hearing this but Isn't this just player speculation?
Where was this confirmed by devs?
Well in all the videos you'll notice they were crouched. You wouldn't need to be crouched to begin a kill if that was not the case (that crouching gives you access to justice system actions like targeting NPCs and stealing) because you're going to get seen anyway.
Oh I see, so it wasn't confirmed anywhere and it is 100% speculation based on an assumption from what you saw in the video.
Thanks for clarification.
Yep speculation. Same as what everyone else is doing. Except this makes more sense than the assumption that mats will now be impossible to find except in the wild.- we need to be crouching (stated in quote above)
- items IF stolen now have value, so other items are obviously not stolen
- stolen items cannot be sold to normal vendors and need to be sold to a special NPC/fence (so probably can't be used in crafting
So if stolen items can't be crafted with then it would be impossible to craft at all, as everyone seems to be thinking all (or almost all) items from containers now have to be stolen.
It also makes sense that ZOS would not be forcing crafters into the justice system to get their mats (mates which, as above, could not be used in crafting anyway if stolen).
I really hope you are right. But ZOS has shown that they have no problem forcing you into a different playstyle already. They forced templars to put on dresses and carry sticks if they want to be viable in VR content and PVP. They forced anyone using a sword and shield or 2h weapon to abandon it for the same reason.
Have you played VR content lately?0 -
XquixoticalX✭✭✭vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »XquixoticalX wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »DenverRalphy wrote: »
Oh boy are you way off. Whether you're crouching or not makes no difference. Taking the items is stealing either way. Crouching/sneaking simply increases your chance of looting it without getting caught.There will be no change at all. To steal you need to be crouching...if you're crouching the use action on the container will change from "search" to "steal".
If you're not crouching you get the container loot same as always.
Stolen goods will have a gold price, while normally obtained goods won't have a gold price.Justice System: You can take items from crates etc as normal but instead now you are stealing items. Items will have value if they are stolen. To steal something, you need to be hidden.
Also it's likely that people won't be able to sell their stolen goods to other players.
Nope - to steal you need to be crouching. Read the quote above, it explains everything.
You need to be crouching/stealth to Successfully steal. Standing upright doesn't make those items free to take.
I keep hearing this but Isn't this just player speculation?
Where was this confirmed by devs?
Well in all the videos you'll notice they were crouched. You wouldn't need to be crouched to begin a kill if that was not the case (that crouching gives you access to justice system actions like targeting NPCs and stealing) because you're going to get seen anyway.
Oh I see, so it wasn't confirmed anywhere and it is 100% speculation based on an assumption from what you saw in the video.
Thanks for clarification.
Yep speculation. Same as what everyone else is doing. Except this makes more sense than the assumption that mats will now be impossible to find except in the wild.- we need to be crouching (stated in quote above)
- items IF stolen now have value, so other items are obviously not stolen
- stolen items cannot be sold to normal vendors and need to be sold to a special NPC/fence (so probably can't be used in crafting
So if stolen items can't be crafted with then it would be impossible to craft at all, as everyone seems to be thinking all (or almost all) items from containers now have to be stolen.
It also makes sense that ZOS would not be forcing crafters into the justice system to get their mats (mates which, as above, could not be used in crafting anyway if stolen).
I really hope you are right. But ZOS has shown that they have no problem forcing you into a different playstyle already. They forced templars to put on dresses and carry sticks if they want to be viable in VR content and PVP. They forced anyone using a sword and shield or 2h weapon to abandon it for the same reason.
Have you played VR content lately?
I play VR content every day. I am 95% to VR9 as we speak. I know they made content easier, but stamina builds are still not viable in any way. VR content still requires mitigation, and mitigation requires stamina. As long as this is the case, no build that also uses stamina to deal damage will ever be able to kill anything significant in a VR zone. But that's a WHOLE other thread.
Edited by XquixoticalX on July 24, 2014 8:23PM~ Belle Folie
"I'm here to kick ass and eat sweetrolls. And I'm all out of sweetrolls."1 -
aipex8_ESO✭✭✭✭✭I'm going to have to disagree with Babylon here. Why would anyone risk stealing anything if they could just stand up and suddenly it wouldn't be stealing. It would be nice if she was correct, but it makes no logical sense. I agree that this could impact some crafting provisioning in a big way, so I would love to hear what ZOS has to say about it.0 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭aipex8_ESO wrote: »Why would anyone risk stealing anything if they could just stand up and suddenly it wouldn't be stealing.
Because it isn't stealing when standing - items have value when stolen, if taken as normal they have no value. It's a different action altogether and nets different items.
And because the pve crowd doesn't actually want to get involved in pvp, which is what the justice system has unfortunately been designed as. Personally I would've preferred to see the justice system designed as pure NPC action, without other players being able to thump you. Steal something, and the guards come at you - not other players. If ZOS wanted to add pvp in the open world, they should've added dueling.
The pve crowd should be able to continue playing the game as it is.Edited by babylon on July 24, 2014 8:41PM2 -
XquixoticalX✭✭✭aipex8_ESO wrote: »Why would anyone risk stealing anything if they could just stand up and suddenly it wouldn't be stealing.
Because it isn't stealing - items have value when stolen, if taken as normal they have no value.
And because the pve crowd doesn't actually want to get involved in pvp, which is what the justice system has unfortunately been designed as. Personally I would've preferred to see the justice system designed as pure NPC action, without other players being able to thump you. Steal something, and the guards come at you - not other players. If ZOS wanted to add pvp in the open world, they should've added dueling.
The pve crowd should be able to continue playing the game as it is.
The only thing that doesn't add up for me is the value. In the video, the "stolen" items were worth 1g each. Why would you risk a bounty of like 100g to steal 3g worth of food mats? This is what makes me think anything will be stealing, crouched or not.
~ Belle Folie
"I'm here to kick ass and eat sweetrolls. And I'm all out of sweetrolls."1 -
Wizzo91✭✭✭✭✭The problem only exists in towns.
In dungeons, bandit camps, etc. etc. you will still be able to farm provisioning mats.
Or do some people seriously do this in towns? I mean you get enough while questing or exploring.
And if you are max level and only farm towns I think the justice system would prevent them from having an easy time doing it.
So I do not see a problem here.[EU]
Wizzo - Stamina DK - 50 - DC
Wizzox - Magicka NB - 50 - DC
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