The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
Was VR difficulty increase intended?
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Niliu✭✭✭
if a brain surgeon cuts your brain in half you can damn well criticize him
Yes you do. I can't criticize a brain surgeon for his work because I'm not one.
I won't criticize art because I can barely draw a stick figure.
If you can't do something yourself, what gives you the right to criticize the work of someone who is? You don't know how hard it is.
dunno why you want a world where people can just run their profession the way they want without thinking about their customers. tell them you won't put up with it, tell them to get their *** straight. critique is important
If I brain surgeon cuts your brain in half, pretty sure you won't be able to criticize.
I dunno, maybe it's a Canadian thing. We're politer to other people. It's considered rude to berate people who are doing their jobs.Gimme back my sweetroll or so help me1 -
LadyDestiny✭✭✭✭✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hey guys,
This change was not intended, though some VR content and monsters are indeed more difficult after yesterday’s patch. We are working on a fix now to revert the difficulty back to what you were familiar with prior to patch 1.1.2, and plan to have this rolled out in the next 24 hours. Thanks so much for your patience!
Awesome! Thank you for letting us know something.
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Wavemoore✭✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hey guys,
This change was not intended, though some VR content and monsters are indeed more difficult after yesterday’s patch. We are working on a fix now to revert the difficulty back to what you were familiar with prior to patch 1.1.2, and plan to have this rolled out in the next 24 hours. Thanks so much for your patience!
Well we finally have an answer! Thanks for information.0 -
Yes you do. I can't criticize a brain surgeon for his work because I'm not one.
I won't criticize art because I can barely draw a stick figure.
If you can't do something yourself, what gives you the right to criticize the work of someone who is? You don't know how hard it is.
What if that brain surgeon made a mistake while operating, and it killed the patient or left them with brain damage. Can I criticize them then?
What if the art I was looking at was just not what I liked, can I criticize then?
Bad examples
Edited by epictrollheals513 on May 23, 2014 4:37PM0 -
GreasedLizard✭✭✭Went from good topic -> troll -> finally a response -> back to trolls-only club
Move on plzEdited by GreasedLizard on May 23, 2014 4:32PM2 -
The point is they're not doing their jobs, they're failing to do a good job, or maybe they're doing a truly terrible job.
A patch has unintended consequences when applied on a ridiculously large scale. That's not failing to do your job. Niliu's analogies are a little too broad to be appropriate, but he still makes a valid point, which is that you have zero clue how difficult it is to run an MMO, so instead of giving useful critiques that are substantive, like how they might go about finding and fixing the issue, you resort to useless criticism to the degree of "Idiots can't do anything right," "this last patch is garbage and has ruined the game," "why wasn't every single potential issue thought of and pre-fixed before patch was released?"
Criticisms like this are not helpful at all. Similarly, while you can criticize a brain surgeon for cutting out half a brain, you apply this same level of criticism to every situation, even if, say, a patient died due to an unforeseen complication. Then you criticize the doctor for not divining every possible complication beforehand.
It's either that patches aren't coming fast enough, or that they aren't testing them enough. Nothing is good enough for some people. They didn't respond within 24 hours? Shame on them for not wanting to jump the gun and possibly give inaccurate information. Some issues get fixed and others pop up in the process. Instead of engaging in useful criticism you resort to mouthbreathing complaining. Try posting a polite comment to ZOS asking them to fix it and move on. Your bellyaching doesn't help anyone unless there's a solution attached to it.Edited by Patchgrabber on May 23, 2014 4:37PM4 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Patchgrabber wrote: »snip
Oh look the head programmer aka the janitor just showed up.0 -
Oh look the head programmer aka the janitor just showed up.
Eloquent in its brevity. But par for the course as far as the usefulness of your comments has been.0 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Patchgrabber wrote: »Oh look the head programmer aka the janitor just showed up.
Eloquent in its brevity. But par for the course as far as the usefulness of your comments has been.
Yet easily eclipses the usefulness of your patches.1 -
Totally agree with you. The fix brought a lot of changes and fixes, fixes are completly ignored, changes only mentioned when people dont like them. They finally updated the blurry puke-green veteran gears to way more clear and shiny textures and people still make posts all over the forum QQing about the changes.Patchgrabber wrote: »It's either that patches aren't coming fast enough, or that they aren't testing them enough. Nothing is good enough for some people. Some issues get fixed and others pop up in the process. Instead of engaging in useful criticism you resort to mouthbreathing complaining. Try posting a polite comment to ZOS asking them to fix it and move on. Your bellyaching doesn't help anyone unless there's a solution attached to it.
The increased veteran mob hp/damage was pretty clearly not intended or it would have been mentioned in the patch since it was a major not just a minor change. Even after they stated they worked on it, solved the issue and will patch it within 24 hours people still complain, swear at them and tell them they arent doing their job (which most people dont even know about since they never tried programming something or dont know how data files and patches work and how fragile they are when you change them).
Whatever you do, as much as you try, you wont ever be able to satisfy everyone, theres always those that complain and whine, it really makes me sad. I figured the community in a sub-game would be more mature and patient about things, atm im rather disappointed of how a lot people act.
Edited by KerisDoin on May 23, 2014 4:46PM0 -
Chrysolis✭✭✭I've been quite critical of the errors introduced in this patch, yet I have to agree with Patchgrabber. There isn't anything useful about simply berating or insulting the company or its employees, if you want to make a criticism it should be constructive or informative in some way. You don't bring about change by personal attacks.1 -
kirnmalidus✭✭✭✭
Yes you do. I can't criticize a brain surgeon for his work because I'm not one.
I won't criticize art because I can barely draw a stick figure.
If you can't do something yourself, what gives you the right to criticize the work of someone who is? You don't know how hard it is.
Lot's of art critics aren't artists, that argument/analogy is ridiculous.
I am a programmer, and what is going on here is an unmitigated disaster fueled by incompetence. QA totally dropped the ball on this one. If I was a manager/boss at Zenimax, people would be getting fired today over this patch (not just the difficulty increase bug, read the forums to see how many other issues the introduced, many players lost all active quests with the update which is complete crap).Life of a Nightblade (Screenshot Tumblr)
“Attention Zenimax: Stamina builds don't hold up to magicka builds, and this is causing most of your class imbalance. It makes melee weapons and bows weaker than staves and class abilities. It makes medium and heavy armor less desirable than light armor. Fix this imbalance, and you'll address most of your balance issues.”
- @ruze84b14_ESO4 -
Patchgrabber wrote: »Oh look the head programmer aka the janitor just showed up.
Eloquent in its brevity. But par for the course as far as the usefulness of your comments has been.
Yet easily eclipses the usefulness of your patches.
Because anyone who doesn't fly off the handle with useless criticism is a ZOS employee. Do yourself a favour and unsubscribe if you're so offended by the uselessness of the game. I know I'll be happier with one less whiny person running around in Tamriel. If you have useful criticism of the game, I'm sure ZOS would love to hear it. You apparently just want a complaining circle jerk.Edited by Patchgrabber on May 23, 2014 4:50PM0 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Patchgrabber wrote: »Patchgrabber wrote: »Oh look the head programmer aka the janitor just showed up.
Eloquent in its brevity. But par for the course as far as the usefulness of your comments has been.
Yet easily eclipses the usefulness of your patches.
Because anyone who doesn't fly off the handle with useless criticism is a ZOS employee.
No, because anyone who doesn't see the quality is lacking here is lying to themselves and to others, or maybe is the person responsible for such poor quality work themselves.
Ask anyone, this is becoming a greater joke every day and is just frustrating watching this company shoot itself in the foot over and over with their bad choices and incompetent employees.5 -
Phinix1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I can't criticize a brain surgeon for his work because I'm not one.
I won't criticize art because I can barely draw a stick figure.
If you can't do something yourself, what gives you the right to criticize the work of someone who is? You don't know how hard it is.
OK, I understand you want to support the company and everything but this sort of "blind faith" thinking just bothers me everywhere that it crops up in human society from religion to politics to the fan base of just about anything.
Can't criticize a brain surgeon because you aren't one? OK, so your mother goes in for brain surgery and they lobotomize and paralyze her and accidentally sew the sutures up inside her head. Do you need to be a brain surgeon to complain, or sue them for malpractice? ABSURD!
Art I agree is a bit more subjective, however just because someone calls themselves an artist does it make them immune to criticism as well, even if all they are drawing IS stick figures?
You see, the problem here is that society has become so spineless. People are so sensitive and overly pampered that they aren't able to constructively criticize or critically THINK about ANYTHING without fear they might offend someone, and then rubbish like this is cited as the reason we should all be blanked out conformist automatons. NOT COOL MAN.
What gives people the right to complain about a product? THE FACT THEY'RE PAYING FOR IT. Jesus this should NOT have to be explained to a race of intelligent beings!
That said, I am happy to see progress being made and I commend ZOS for their efforts to communicate and admit they made a mistake. But if it weren't for these people that have no right to complain, do you honestly think that would have been the case?Edited by Phinix1 on May 23, 2014 4:58PM6 -
I figured the patches released by a sub game would be of much better quality, atm I'm rather disappointed at how a lot of these patches are.
Which leads me to this:
"Even after they stated they worked on it, solved the issue and will patch it within 24 hours people still complain, swear at them and tell them they arent doing their job (which most people dont even know about since they never tried programming something or dont know how data files and patches work and how fragile they are when you change them)."0 -
Ask anyone, this is becoming a greater joke every day and is just frustrating watching this company shoot itself in the foot over and over with their bad choices and incompetent employees.
And yet you're still playing...if you are a consumer that is that upset, speak with your wallet and begone. Toxic vitriol is not productive, nor will ZOS take you seriously. Be an adult and realize that nothing is perfect, but if this game is so beyond repair, and that ZOS is as incompetent as you claim, why do you still bother with it? Tantrum all you want at home, but try being a productive member of the community here.Edited by Patchgrabber on May 23, 2014 4:59PM1 -
Phinix1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Patchgrabber wrote: »Ask anyone, this is becoming a greater joke every day and is just frustrating watching this company shoot itself in the foot over and over with their bad choices and incompetent employees.
And yet you're still playing...if you are a consumer that is that upset, speak with your wallet and begone. Toxic vitriol is not productive, nor will ZOS take you seriously. Be an adult and realize that nothing is perfect, but if this game is so beyond repair, and that ZOS is as incompetent as you claim, why do you still bother with it? Tantrum all you want at home, but try being a productive member of the community here.
Oh and you are really contributing to the community being a condescending jerk to him about it. Get off your high horse man. You are cluttering up the forums with your sanctimonious fanboiism just as much as they are with frustration.3 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Patchgrabber wrote: »Ask anyone, this is becoming a greater joke every day and is just frustrating watching this company shoot itself in the foot over and over with their bad choices and incompetent employees.
And yet you're still playing...if you are a consumer that is that upset, speak with your wallet and begone. Toxic vitriol is not productive, nor will ZOS take you seriously. Be an adult and realize that nothing is perfect, but if this game is so beyond repair, and that ZOS is as incompetent as you claim, why do you still bother with it? Tantrum all you want at home, but try being a productive member of the community here.
I want to play this game, not going to leave because some fool tells me to. People who are passionate about something are the ones who keep that something functioning at a decent level; the people who accept anything and accept any standard of work no matter how poor are the ones who destroy everything that could be good.
TL;DR: YOU are the problem here, I hope ZOS ignores you, and ignores and removes the incompetent people from their team.2 -
JD2013✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭If they were doing a terrible job, they wouldn't be trying to roll out a fix within 24 hours. That, to me, isn't a terrible job and is indeed thinking about the customers.Edited by JD2013 on May 23, 2014 5:05PMSweetrolls for all!
Christophe Mottierre - Breton Templar with his own whole darn estate! Templar Houses are so 2015. EU DC
PC Beta Tester January 2014
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Crafting bag OP! ZOS nerf pls!2 -
Reenlister✭✭✭I figured the patches released by a sub game would be of much better quality, atm I'm rather disappointed at how a lot of these patches are.
Which leads me to this:
"Even after they stated they worked on it, solved the issue and will patch it within 24 hours people still complain, swear at them and tell them they arent doing their job (which most people dont even know about since they never tried programming something or dont know how data files and patches work and how fragile they are when you change them)."
Which leads me to this. While not berating the people personally at work, the result shows that the company did not take the recommendation and reports of the testing done. Sure data is a fragile quirky thing, but the idea of not implementing the testing or taking information from it to derail the potential problems shows if not incompetence, a lack of concern at the least.
Of course people are upset, and they have a right to be, they are paying for a service here, and if this were the first incident of a mess up, then I would be more than happy to give them more slack, however, this is just a continuation of a trend of sloppy work.
That is the sticker, this has become the norm, not an occasional oops. Right back to day one, the things that should have never reached a live version, despite the numerous reports and feedbacks...
EDIT: plus to add, 24 hours after the patch, they come in and tell us its not working as intended?? That does not earn a kudo..Edited by Reenlister on May 23, 2014 5:06PM2 -
Oh and you are really contributing to the community being a condescending jerk to him about it. Get off your high horse man. You are cluttering up the forums with your sanctimonious fanboiism just as much as they are with frustration.
I happen to think that telling people to bring useful criticism is contributing. I don't think this game is perfect, and the bugs with passives, skills, quests, etc. are quite frankly a much bigger problem than I thought they'd be, and while I'm disappointed that it's taken a while for fixes to roll out, it doesn't ruin my life. Does me coming onto here and saying "this patch is horrible! It's been 15 minutes since launch why haven't they responded?!?" do anything to advance the issue? No. I've submitted /feedback and /bug in the game, so what else can I do on the subject?Edited by Patchgrabber on May 23, 2014 5:06PM0 -
I would think that "intelligent beings" are more intelligent than to rage, whine or swear over something that can and will be fixed.AlienDiplomat wrote: »What gives people the right to complain about a product? THE FACT THEY'RE PAYING FOR IT. Jesus this should NOT have to be explained to a race of intelligent beings!
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Phinix1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Patchgrabber wrote: »Oh and you are really contributing to the community being a condescending jerk to him about it. Get off your high horse man. You are cluttering up the forums with your sanctimonious fanboiism just as much as they are with frustration.
I happen to think that telling people to bring useful criticism is contributing. I don't think this game is perfect, and the bugs with passives, skills, quests, etc. are quite frankly a much bigger problem than I thought they'd be, and while I'm disappointed that it's taken a while for fixes to roll out, it doesn't ruin my life. Does me coming onto here and saying "this patch is horrible! It's been 15 minutes since launch why haven't they responded?!?" do anything to advance the issue? No. I've submitted /feedback and /bug in the game, so what else can I do on the subject?
If you don't have anything good to say, then DON'T. Don't insult my intelligence by attempting to mask your trolling of people who complain with more sanctimonious drivel. Go play the game yourself instead of hanging on people's every word to waste yours and everyone's time flaming them.
You are being a total jerk.0 -
If you don't have anything good to say, then DON'T. Don't insult my intelligence by attempting to mask your trolling of people who complain with more sanctimonious drivel. Go play the game yourself instead of hanging on people's every word to waste yours and everyone's time flaming them.
You are being a total jerk.
And here you are, doing the exact same thing you're accusing me of. I don't see how I can be any more even-handed here. Someone supplies useless criticism and I suggest they post meaningful criticism. I don't blindly support the game but I also don't take kindly to people who blindly bash it either. I submit reports in game with issues/grievances rather than complain about them on forums. What exactly would you suggest I do instead?0 -
Phinix1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Like I said before, non-constructive comments clutter up the forums. So, don't mistake my condemning someone for flaming people that complain about SPECIFIC, legitimate problems as support for people that make generalizing and fatalist statements.
CONSTRUCTIVE criticism is welcome. Flame wares are NOT. That said, -I- am going to go play the game, instead of wasting my afternoon playing "Revenge of the Troll, The Flame Wars."0