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Now that mist form is out of the way, next up - Bolt Escape!
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_Proteus_✭✭It's quite simple, if Mistform got a nerf Bolt Escape should too, as it's basically a better version of Mistform. Of course they could also rebuff mistform because it does give us somewhat of a chance to catch a sorc.1 -
LadyChaos✭✭✭✭maxilaub17_ESO wrote: »Bolt Escape really needs to be hit hard with the nerf bat.
My suggestion : make it cost 3 times more, and only teleport 1/2 as far.
It definitely needs to cost more. I don't think it needs a reduction in range, it just needs to cost enough that can't it be used more than a few times without running out of magicka.
Make is cost enough to retain the ability of an escape but not a spam run fast ability, or spam catch up to anyone and than escape with it if you can't win. <--- That's what makes "bolt escape" obnoxious.
That's the crux for most of the PvP problems atm, for some builds and itemization's there is too little cost and penalty in using an ability; which is the entire reason for a limited stamina and magicka reserve and ability cost in the first place. That's where the focus of balancing should be tuned to atm (in my opinion).
You didn't read not only THIS entire thread, nor the other 50 repetitive topics.
You know how much it costs? What % of a sorcerers spell bar is used casting it?
Do you know it's the most expensive spell on many of our hot-bars as is, mine only has one more expensive, barely. If your problem is with spell cost it lays in the light armor reduction line more than anything else put together.. in some synergies by double.Edited by LadyChaos on 6 May 2014 20:35VR2 Ataxia - [NA] Veteran Dominion Sorcerer [Auriel's Bow]
PvP, PvE, Crafting, and General Shenanigans
Sorcery and Mayhem online since 1999
Current PvP Class/Supernatural Census0 -
Aimelin✭✭✭Firellight wrote: »So you're basically saying you want something, not a skill, to counter a skill? GG?
If you don't know how to counter sorcs that use bolt escape, i suggest you take a good look at all the weapon lines & their morphs....
to give you a hint, the poison arrow from bow, can be morphed to stun casters .... what does a sorc that uses bolt escape do? oh my god, he is casting ! oh but right, you don't want an ability to counter an ability, you just want to look at the sorc and make him stop in place..... riiiiight
how about the DKs that are perfectly able to time the moment sorcs get out of bolt escape to pull them back to them & kill em instantly, caus they'll have me stunned after pulled, so i have to use the cc breaker, and then bolt escape, which usually results in me being dead, oh my god another counter, but right its an ability, sry
People have been given things way too easely, this is actually a pvp game where you have to decide what skills and synergies you take with you on the battlefield, resulting in you not being able to counter somethings ...... though luck?
Actually, for more central game features it is more healthy to have a central counter. If you needed a werewolf to take down a vampire, then you would be spending hours on a low-populated campaign looking for a werewolf to take down a vampire (terrible example I know).
If lots of sorcerers are using Bolt Escape, then we have a central skill. Imo, any player should have a way to counter it, instead of having to rely on certain skills available to certain players to counter BE.
________________________
How about!
An enemy must be within a certain range to Bolt Escape, and in order to BE within a longer range (against ranged enemies) the player must have a target?
So if you are about to be attacked by a bunch of swordsmen, you can escape, and if an archer is about to snipe, you can escape. Any other casually convenient time to use BE would be a no-go.
Imo, this would make using BE more interesting than regular circumstances. Got to think when to use your skills. And, it would allow the counter to be any means of hitting a Sorc off-guard, or ranging them without being targeted. And a skillful Sorcerer would use BE better than others when being overwhelmed. Basically, don't jump into a crowd of dps fighters, unless you are a tank who is ready to whoosh around players. Comments?
Video for thought for those who are defending BE:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPR7oUbG0IM
So if it was you in that video, how did the sorc escaping you hurt you? he runs, you won, he can't at that point hope to kill someone & live or retreat, so he retreats, move on, focus on what's more important for you, unless you tunnel vision EHUEEUEUEUEUEU SORC MUST KILLLLL but i think not?
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Niffo✭✭✭maxilaub17_ESO wrote: »Bolt Escape really needs to be hit hard with the nerf bat.
My suggestion : make it cost 3 times more, and only teleport 1/2 as far.
It definitely needs to cost more. I don't think it needs a reduction in range, it just needs to cost enough that can't it be used more than a few times without running out of magicka.
Make is cost enough to retain the ability of an escape but not a spam run fast ability, or spam catch up to anyone and than escape with it if you can't win. <--- That's what makes "bolt escape" obnoxious.
That's the crux for most of the PvP problems atm, for some builds and itemization's there is too little cost and penalty in using an ability; which is the entire reason for a limited stamina and magicka reserve and ability cost in the first place. That's where the focus of balancing should be tuned to atm (in my opinion).
You didn't read not only THIS entire thread, nor the other 50 repetitive topics.
You know how much it costs? What % of a sorcerers spell bar is used casting it?
Do you know it's the most expensive spell on many of our hot-bars as is, mine only has one more expensive, barely. If your problem is with spell cost it lays in the light armor reduction line more than anything else put together.. in some synergies by double.
Its not just light armour, you can get another 15% cost reduction to Storm Calling abilities, that is 36% cost reduction with light armour, and not including any other options. So we should do something about light armour cost reduction which affect all of the classes to bring Bolt Escape in-line?
Not one reply has been a hard counter, you stun a Sorcerer they break out and bolt away before you can put enough damage into them. Root has no effect on Bolt Escape, they can just keep casting to get away. Venom Arrow and Crushing Shock require you to know when the cast is about to happen to be able to interrupt.
Bolt Escape costs 392 magicka with 0 cost reduction, so about a third of the base magicka of a naked statless VR 10, which is enough to get you out of range of any abilities that could stop you. This is ignoring that your magicka is recovering during this time. There is no ability that bring that much power for the cost it has.2 -
LadyChaos✭✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »maxilaub17_ESO wrote: »Bolt Escape really needs to be hit hard with the nerf bat.
My suggestion : make it cost 3 times more, and only teleport 1/2 as far.
It definitely needs to cost more. I don't think it needs a reduction in range, it just needs to cost enough that can't it be used more than a few times without running out of magicka.
Make is cost enough to retain the ability of an escape but not a spam run fast ability, or spam catch up to anyone and than escape with it if you can't win. <--- That's what makes "bolt escape" obnoxious.
That's the crux for most of the PvP problems atm, for some builds and itemization's there is too little cost and penalty in using an ability; which is the entire reason for a limited stamina and magicka reserve and ability cost in the first place. That's where the focus of balancing should be tuned to atm (in my opinion).
You didn't read not only THIS entire thread, nor the other 50 repetitive topics.
You know how much it costs? What % of a sorcerers spell bar is used casting it?
Do you know it's the most expensive spell on many of our hot-bars as is, mine only has one more expensive, barely. If your problem is with spell cost it lays in the light armor reduction line more than anything else put together.. in some synergies by double.
Its not just light armour, you can get another 15% cost reduction to Storm Calling abilities, that is 36% cost reduction with light armour, and not including any other options. So we should do something about light armour cost reduction which affect all of the classes to bring Bolt Escape in-line?
Not one reply has been a hard counter, you stun a Sorcerer they break out and bolt away before you can put enough damage into them. Root has no effect on Bolt Escape, they can just keep casting to get away. Venom Arrow and Crushing Shock require you to know when the cast is about to happen to be able to interrupt.
Bolt Escape costs 392 magicka with 0 cost reduction, so about a third of the base magicka of a naked statless VR 10, which is enough to get you out of range of any abilities that could stop you. This is ignoring that your magicka is recovering during this time. There is no ability that bring that much power for the cost it has.
That is aprox the same cost as talons and chains ...
I said light armor is where the majority of it comes from as light armor is ~30% that is close to double what the class line gives.. and hence why I said your problem with the cost is in the light armor line, and this is why you never rage about the plate sorcerers using it.
Put anyone in a dress and they get the same ~30% spell cost redux... double what our class line gives.
Also mag recovery stops when you bolt. It's been this way since launch. It's why we don't bolt as soon as mag comes in, because we get no regen after.. we do it in spurts... offering another nice window to snag us as mentioned many times.
This is still you trying to justify why you should be able to counter 1 ability without compromising your personal current load-out. Like I said I traded to be able cast it as much as I do. Make it cost more ONLY VRs in full light armor can effectively use it all, when we are the ones you are complaining about now. All this does is cripple the lower level player and non-light armor sorcerer. Pajama bolters will still annoy the crap out of you, just die more doing it.VR2 Ataxia - [NA] Veteran Dominion Sorcerer [Auriel's Bow]
PvP, PvE, Crafting, and General Shenanigans Sorcery and Mayhem online since 1999
Current PvP Class/Supernatural Census1 -
Adernath✭✭✭✭✭Oh my... so many QQing about an escape mechanic.
Vampire/WW are only optional skill trees and are not meant to be 'upgrades'. They have advantages and disadvantages. The advantages were toned down now, to be more in line with their disadvantages.
Happens in almost every MMO... people come to the forums and whine for nerfs. Lets cross fingers that Zeni will ignore such threads.
@OP: The descriptions of all abilities and spells were right there, before you made your char. You have the freedom to play what you want. No one forced you to play a certain build or a certain class. You get what you choose.1 -
Firellight✭✭✭So if it was you in that video, how did the sorc escaping you hurt you? he runs, you won, he can't at that point hope to kill someone & live or retreat, so he retreats, move on, focus on what's more important for you, unless you tunnel vision EHUEEUEUEUEUEU SORC MUST KILLLLL but i think not?
I was never affected by BE. Never bothered me. But there are lots of people on the forums who are not liking it, so I jumped into the discussion.
I get your point. If a sorcerer escapes, they escaped.
Do you know what I think is bad in the game? Being attacked by someone out of nowhere (sneak?), knocked down, and you die before you can get up to run or even swing a sword. Melee must have it hard; evidence that swords are becoming obsolete
. 4 -
Aimelin✭✭✭Firellight wrote: »So if it was you in that video, how did the sorc escaping you hurt you? he runs, you won, he can't at that point hope to kill someone & live or retreat, so he retreats, move on, focus on what's more important for you, unless you tunnel vision EHUEEUEUEUEUEU SORC MUST KILLLLL but i think not?
I was never affected by BE. Never bothered me. But there are lots of people on the forums who are not liking it, so I jumped into the discussion.
I get your point. If a sorcerer escapes, they escaped.
Do you know what I think is bad in the game? Being attacked by someone out of nowhere (sneak?), knocked down, and you die before you can get up to run or even swing a sword. Melee must have it hard; evidence that swords are becoming obsolete .
My friend, lets make a new bandwagon & scream qq nerf melee ! lol just kidding
i know, and if everyone would go about it like you, everything will be fine !
But nope, people make DKs that can tank 50 people and not die & kill people (standard of one shot(hue) inb4 someone screams it doesnt one shot !), people make NBs that can sneak attack someone to 0 in mere seconds, but my oh my, once in awhile someone escapes, so they don't feel OP and awesome, so it must be nerfed
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maxilaub17_ESO✭✭✭maxilaub17_ESO wrote: »Bolt Escape really needs to be hit hard with the nerf bat.
My suggestion : make it cost 3 times more, and only teleport 1/2 as far.
It definitely needs to cost more. I don't think it needs a reduction in range, it just needs to cost enough that can't it be used more than a few times without running out of magicka.
Make is cost enough to retain the ability of an escape but not a spam run fast ability, or spam catch up to anyone and than escape with it if you can't win. <--- That's what makes "bolt escape" obnoxious.
That's the crux for most of the PvP problems atm, for some builds and itemization's there is too little cost and penalty in using an ability; which is the entire reason for a limited stamina and magicka reserve and ability cost in the first place. That's where the focus of balancing should be tuned to atm (in my opinion).
You didn't read not only THIS entire thread, nor the other 50 repetitive topics.
You know how much it costs? What % of a sorcerers spell bar is used casting it?
Do you know it's the most expensive spell on many of our hot-bars as is, mine only has one more expensive, barely. If your problem is with spell cost it lays in the light armor reduction line more than anything else put together.. in some synergies by double.
I don't have to read 50 other post of people crying how much it cost's , when In game I actually see guildies and enemies spam it non-stop almost forever. If you "read my post" than you'd know the broken part is the itemization and ability combination that makes it spammable almost forever, that is the real problem. It doesn't matter what the base cost is if u can itemize and get it to a point wher you can use it non-stop....and ANYONE who PvP's see's Sorc's using it non-stop for extended periods all the time.
I can't even count how many times a sorc has caught me on my horse using bolt escape then saw they were losing the fight (using more mana) than spam bolt escape away. Dam right it is too cheap when they can:
1. Bolt into the fight to catch up
2. Immediately use all there best magic attacks
3. Than escape Bolting away non-stop away
There's no strategy, just mindless attacks and mindless escaping if they don't kill you. They need to think about using Bolt escape, like if they bolt into a fight from too far they won't have enough mana reserves to fight properly, OR if they use all their best abilities to attack and don't kill you they won't have enough mana to bolt escape. I always have to think about management of my Magicka and Stamina pools, everyone should... IT'S THE REASON FOR ABILITY COST AND RESERVES IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!!
The problem is too many kiddies want to just spam buttons forever and not have to think or fight strategically.Edited by maxilaub17_ESO on 6 May 2014 21:385 -
Niffo✭✭✭
That is aprox the same cost as talons and chains ...
I said light armor is where the majority of it comes from as light armor is ~30% that is close to double what the class line gives.. and hence why I said your problem with the cost is in the light armor line, and this is why you never rage about the plate sorcerers using it.
Put anyone in a dress and they get the same ~30% spell cost redux... double what our class line gives.
Also mag recovery stops when you bolt. It's been this way since launch. It's why we don't bolt as soon as mag comes in, because we get no regen after.. we do it in spurts... offering another nice window to snag us as mentioned many times.
This is still you trying to justify why you should be able to counter 1 ability without compromising your personal current load-out. Like I said I traded to be able cast it as much as I do. Make it cost more ONLY VRs in full light armor can effectively use it all, when we are the ones you are complaining about now. All this does is cripple the lower level player and non-light armor sorcerer. Pajama bolters will still annoy the crap out of you, just die more doing it.
Both chains and talons cost more, and DKs don't have the magicka passives that Sorcerers do, Light Armour is not the issue, Sorcerers have passives that make it easier for them to use magicka abilities more frequently than other classes. If they nerfed Light Armour to hurt Bolt Escape everyone is screwed over by that change. You're trying to deflect the blame to Light Armour just to protect your overpowered ability, pathetic. Oh and I had a guildy check to see if the recovery reduction was actually making any difference with his ability to spam it, and it wasn't.2 -
LadyChaos✭✭✭✭maxilaub17_ESO wrote: »maxilaub17_ESO wrote: »Bolt Escape really needs to be hit hard with the nerf bat.
My suggestion : make it cost 3 times more, and only teleport 1/2 as far.
It definitely needs to cost more. I don't think it needs a reduction in range, it just needs to cost enough that can't it be used more than a few times without running out of magicka.
Make is cost enough to retain the ability of an escape but not a spam run fast ability, or spam catch up to anyone and than escape with it if you can't win. <--- That's what makes "bolt escape" obnoxious.
That's the crux for most of the PvP problems atm, for some builds and itemization's there is too little cost and penalty in using an ability; which is the entire reason for a limited stamina and magicka reserve and ability cost in the first place. That's where the focus of balancing should be tuned to atm (in my opinion).
You didn't read not only THIS entire thread, nor the other 50 repetitive topics.
You know how much it costs? What % of a sorcerers spell bar is used casting it?
Do you know it's the most expensive spell on many of our hot-bars as is, mine only has one more expensive, barely. If your problem is with spell cost it lays in the light armor reduction line more than anything else put together.. in some synergies by double.
I don't have to read 50 other post of people crying how much it cost's , when In game I actually see guildies and enemies spam it non-stop almost forever. If you "read my post" than you'd know the broken part is the itemization and ability combination that makes it spammable almost forever, that is the real problem. It doesn't matter what the base cost is if u can itemize and get it to a point wher you can use it non-stop....and ANYONE who PvP's see's Sorc's using it non-stop for extended periods all the time.
I can't even count how many times a sorc has caught me on my horse using bolt escape then saw they were losing the fight (using more mana) than spam bolt escape away. Dam right it is too cheap when they can:
1. Bolt into the fight to catch up
2. Immediately use all there best magic attacks
3. Than escape Bolting away non-stop away
There's no strategy, just mindless attacks and mindless escaping if they don't kill you. They need to think about using Bolt escape, like if they bolt into a fight from too far they won't have enough mana reserves to fight properly, OR if they use all their best abilities to attack and don't kill you they won't have enough mana to bolt escape. I always have to think about management of my Magicka and Stamina pools, everyone should... IT'S THE REASON FOR ABILITY COST AND RESERVES IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!!
The problem is too many kiddies want to just spam buttons forever and not have to think or fight strategically.
stopped reading when I saw you say you didn't have to read...
healer spam single heal spells.. they OP?
So spamming = OP?VR2 Ataxia - [NA] Veteran Dominion Sorcerer [Auriel's Bow]
PvP, PvE, Crafting, and General Shenanigans Sorcery and Mayhem online since 1999
Current PvP Class/Supernatural Census0 -
Niffo✭✭✭
stopped reading when I saw you say you didn't have to read...
healer spam single heal spells.. they OP?
So spamming = OP?
If they could spam them 16 times without stopping, yes they would be, but heals have a high cost, and single target ones even higher. The nerf bat is on the way to Bolt Escape, and you're going to have to rely on some other broken ability to make up for your lack of skill.5 -
LadyChaos✭✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
stopped reading when I saw you say you didn't have to read...
healer spam single heal spells.. they OP?
So spamming = OP?
If they could spam them 16 times without stopping, yes they would be, but heals have a high cost, and single target ones even higher. The nerf bat is on the way to Bolt Escape, and you're going to have to rely on some other broken ability to make up for your lack of skill.
You know resto heal is way less than bolt...? I can spam it an incredible amount more than bolt. My DD is way less... I spam the crap out of that.. My AoE cost so much less I use it like a single target whenever a vamp gets close...
TY for your honesty.VR2 Ataxia - [NA] Veteran Dominion Sorcerer [Auriel's Bow]
PvP, PvE, Crafting, and General Shenanigans Sorcery and Mayhem online since 1999
Current PvP Class/Supernatural Census0 -
maxilaub17_ESO✭✭✭maxilaub17_ESO wrote: »maxilaub17_ESO wrote: »Bolt Escape really needs to be hit hard with the nerf bat.
My suggestion : make it cost 3 times more, and only teleport 1/2 as far.
It definitely needs to cost more. I don't think it needs a reduction in range, it just needs to cost enough that can't it be used more than a few times without running out of magicka.
Make is cost enough to retain the ability of an escape but not a spam run fast ability, or spam catch up to anyone and than escape with it if you can't win. <--- That's what makes "bolt escape" obnoxious.
That's the crux for most of the PvP problems atm, for some builds and itemization's there is too little cost and penalty in using an ability; which is the entire reason for a limited stamina and magicka reserve and ability cost in the first place. That's where the focus of balancing should be tuned to atm (in my opinion).
You didn't read not only THIS entire thread, nor the other 50 repetitive topics.
You know how much it costs? What % of a sorcerers spell bar is used casting it?
Do you know it's the most expensive spell on many of our hot-bars as is, mine only has one more expensive, barely. If your problem is with spell cost it lays in the light armor reduction line more than anything else put together.. in some synergies by double.
I don't have to read 50 other post of people crying how much it cost's , when In game I actually see guildies and enemies spam it non-stop almost forever. If you "read my post" than you'd know the broken part is the itemization and ability combination that makes it spammable almost forever, that is the real problem. It doesn't matter what the base cost is if u can itemize and get it to a point wher you can use it non-stop....and ANYONE who PvP's see's Sorc's using it non-stop for extended periods all the time.
I can't even count how many times a sorc has caught me on my horse using bolt escape then saw they were losing the fight (using more mana) than spam bolt escape away. Dam right it is too cheap when they can:
1. Bolt into the fight to catch up
2. Immediately use all there best magic attacks
3. Than escape Bolting away non-stop away
There's no strategy, just mindless attacks and mindless escaping if they don't kill you. They need to think about using Bolt escape, like if they bolt into a fight from too far they won't have enough mana reserves to fight properly, OR if they use all their best abilities to attack and don't kill you they won't have enough mana to bolt escape. I always have to think about management of my Magicka and Stamina pools, everyone should... IT'S THE REASON FOR ABILITY COST AND RESERVES IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!!
The problem is too many kiddies want to just spam buttons forever and not have to think or fight strategically.
stopped reading when I saw you say you didn't have to read...
healer spam single heal spells.. they OP?
So spamming = OP?
Interpretation: you stooped reading when you saw an intelligent and reasonably argued point you couldn't answer in the same manner. What you are doing is called "self serving spin" in the political and marketing world..
You can fool some of the people.....
3 -
Kaskako✭✭Some of these counters and solutions are starting to take shape like the ones vs vampires... cmon...
You need 20 people all with slows, speed buffs and fast horses, only dismount one at a time so you can keep damaging the sorcerer spamming BE, and you have him! /sarcasm2 -
Niffo✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
stopped reading when I saw you say you didn't have to read...
healer spam single heal spells.. they OP?
So spamming = OP?
If they could spam them 16 times without stopping, yes they would be, but heals have a high cost, and single target ones even higher. The nerf bat is on the way to Bolt Escape, and you're going to have to rely on some other broken ability to make up for your lack of skill.
You know resto heal is way less than bolt...? I can spam it an incredible amount more than bolt. My DD is way less... I spam the crap out of that.. My AoE cost so much less I use it like a single target whenever a vamp gets close...
TY for your honesty.
If spamming regeneration actually made any difference it would be overpowered, but all it does is refresh the buff, and the healing won't save anyone. Yet another example of complete nonsense.3 -
LadyChaos✭✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
stopped reading when I saw you say you didn't have to read...
healer spam single heal spells.. they OP?
So spamming = OP?
If they could spam them 16 times without stopping, yes they would be, but heals have a high cost, and single target ones even higher. The nerf bat is on the way to Bolt Escape, and you're going to have to rely on some other broken ability to make up for your lack of skill.
You know resto heal is way less than bolt...? I can spam it an incredible amount more than bolt. My DD is way less... I spam the crap out of that.. My AoE cost so much less I use it like a single target whenever a vamp gets close...
TY for your honesty.
If spamming regeneration actually made any difference it would be overpowered, but all it does is refresh the buff, and the healing won't save anyone. Yet another example of complete nonsense.
You really can't be reasoned with. You say one thing, then when it's handed to you... you change, again and again.
Your entire complaint is about how inexpensive the spell costs, then when you see its about our most expensive it's about how we can spam it, when we show how much else we can spam and do.. it's about what class roles are worthy for the game... you are an endless loop of "nuhuh.."
You are not trying to learn how the skills work. Not trying to lend constructive feedback.... just discredit. Enjoy yourself.VR2 Ataxia - [NA] Veteran Dominion Sorcerer [Auriel's Bow]
PvP, PvE, Crafting, and General Shenanigans Sorcery and Mayhem online since 1999
Current PvP Class/Supernatural Census1 -
Niffo✭✭✭
You really can't be reasoned with. You say one thing, then when it's handed to you... you change, again and again.
Your entire complaint is about how inexpensive the spell costs, then when you see its about our most expensive it's about how we can spam it, when we show how much else we can spam and do.. it's about what class roles are worthy for the game... you are an endless loop of "nuhuh.."
You are not trying to learn how the skills work. Not trying to lend constructive feedback.... just discredit. Enjoy yourself.
I haven't mentioned the cost of spells at all, you should probably go back to my first posts. You are trying really hard to make it seem like I'm the one talking nonsense when every post from you is basically just a random collection of whatever you feel like posting. I know how the skills work, you don't seem to though and you prefer to ignore anything that shows how overpowered Bolt Escape is. All of my posts are right here in the thread, feel free to actually read them instead of just foaming at the mouth and posting crap.
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Tintinabula✭✭✭✭✭
✭odd...they can mess with vamp stats that players were abusing but cant fix simple vamp passives?...something isnt balanced in the "priority: dept.Edited by Tintinabula on 7 May 2014 05:261 -
kasain✭✭✭Why nerf, let the game grow and adjust. You guys want to nerf everything to make a dry boring game. And while their may not be other skills that do the exact same thing for other jobs, why should there be? How boring if most jobs can do the same thing but just different name and animations. More job trees are going to come out so no need to nerf it just yet.
As a sor, I do use it but mostly as a way to travel from point A to B as we walk so slow and I can keep up with horses. If you want to kill a PvP, make sure you hit hard enough and don't have to gimp other players due to your own lack or builds not putting out enough dmg.
I don't cry when a bow attack oe shots me, nor do people complain when I kill them.2 -
Niffo✭✭✭Why nerf, let the game grow and adjust. You guys want to nerf everything to make a dry boring game. And while their may not be other skills that do the exact same thing for other jobs, why should there be? How boring if most jobs can do the same thing but just different name and animations. More job trees are going to come out so no need to nerf it just yet.
As a sor, I do use it but mostly as a way to travel from point A to B as we walk so slow and I can keep up with horses. If you want to kill a PvP, make sure you hit hard enough and don't have to gimp other players due to your own lack or builds not putting out enough dmg.
I don't cry when a bow attack oe shots me, nor do people complain when I kill them.
Such a balanced ability, allowing you to match the speed of a mount. It's so nice to have every Sorcerer come in and just make the case of Bolt Escape being absolutely broken so I don't have to.
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Tintinabula✭✭✭✭✭
✭elusive mist paled in comparison to bolt escape...but no..everyone was on the vamp bandwagon...now they're finished with vamps..time to nerf sorcs..then it will be dks with standard of might after bash...the list keeps growing..all you who couldn't run out of a batswarm and cried..they're coming for your build next.;)1 -
Wahee✭✭✭As a NB player I'm just going to put this out there. Our "escape" (cloak) costs 420ish mag without reduction (more than BE) lasts 3 seconds, slows you down, and breaks if:
1. you are hit in any way (aoe is easy)
2. a residual dot ticks on you
3. if you have any outgoing dot on an enemy that ticks (can't use cloak if you use dot abilities)
4. if you sprint/do any ability
A NB with 2k mag can cloak maybe 5-6 times in a row which would get them maybe 100ft in stealth if it isn't broken. For 2k magicka spent, a sorc can get halfway across the map.
Now...you sorcs were saying how BE is so expensive and counterable? Cloak is not an escape. Sorcs are the only class with any kind of escape.
Mostly Harmless: PvP leader and officer
mostly-harmless-guild.com5 -
Tintinabula✭✭✭✭✭
✭and mist for vamps is still broken because the descript clearly states "invulnerable to ALL control effects" Ive been chained and taloned in mist form so many times its not even funny....yall are screaming for skills to be nerfed when current skills don't even work properly.1 -
Kolache✭✭✭✭beravinprb19_ESO wrote: »Stuns don't last the 8 or so seconds it would take to kill a Sorcerer. That, and they can be blocked, broken out of, rolled, or they could have Immovable running, etc. The one "hard counter" you keep listing is not as effective as you would like us to believe.
Don't you know? Sorcs can't block. They can't use their own CC, stamina abilities, mounts, stealth, etc. When you're talking about countering bolt escape, you only get to talk about every ability in the game at your fingertips, and one available to the Sorc.Something being unbalanced in 1v1 does not imply that it is balanced in group play.1 -
Hail_Sithis✭✭It's funny, Whenever I bolt escape, smart players teleport strike/charge/pull me, and the bads just try to sprint up to me.
Right, clowns. The reason Mist Form was nerfed was due to, not only the speed boost, but because it basically makes you untargetable, and on the off chance you get a hit in, it reduces damage by at-least 75%
Bolt escape doesn't do that, it's merely a kiting tool, you are very much so still able to just smackdown a sorc if he's unable to outrun you, especially if it's not a light armor user. "BUT WHAT IF HE'S USING BALL LIGHTNING?!" you might be asking, Teleport strike, chain pull, and all the charges/ranged stuns still work perfectly fine, and on the plus side, you got a trail of obvious balls that essentially point in neon lights where he went.
Oh, and bolt escape isn't a channeled ability that reduces damage by seventy five percent on top of it's speed boost, it fires off and it's done.
So, really, the fact Mist form was nerfed doesn't really foretell a nerf to Bolt Escape.
Get good, or get out.
Oh, and, You won't really be solving your inability to kill sorcs, even if the ability is nerfed, It's an excellent kiting tool with just one-use, I've killed many-a-bad by simply porting behind them, and unleashing the Cursed Crystal Wrath combo.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGY8fyLrXMk Edited by Hail_Sithis on 7 May 2014 13:18"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not so sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
"What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence." - Christopher Hitchens0 -
drwoody44b14_ESO✭✭✭Firellight wrote: »So you're basically saying you want something, not a skill, to counter a skill? GG?
If you don't know how to counter sorcs that use bolt escape, i suggest you take a good look at all the weapon lines & their morphs....
to give you a hint, the poison arrow from bow, can be morphed to stun casters .... what does a sorc that uses bolt escape do? oh my god, he is casting ! oh but right, you don't want an ability to counter an ability, you just want to look at the sorc and make him stop in place..... riiiiight
how about the DKs that are perfectly able to time the moment sorcs get out of bolt escape to pull them back to them & kill em instantly, caus they'll have me stunned after pulled, so i have to use the cc breaker, and then bolt escape, which usually results in me being dead, oh my god another counter, but right its an ability, sry
People have been given things way too easely, this is actually a pvp game where you have to decide what skills and synergies you take with you on the battlefield, resulting in you not being able to counter somethings ...... though luck?
Actually, for more central game features it is more healthy to have a central counter. If you needed a werewolf to take down a vampire, then you would be spending hours on a low-populated campaign looking for a werewolf to take down a vampire (terrible example I know).
If lots of sorcerers are using Bolt Escape, then we have a central skill. Imo, any player should have a way to counter it, instead of having to rely on certain skills available to certain players to counter BE.
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How about!
An enemy must be within a certain range to Bolt Escape, and in order to BE within a longer range (against ranged enemies) the player must have a target?
So if you are about to be attacked by a bunch of swordsmen, you can escape, and if an archer is about to snipe, you can escape. Any other casually convenient time to use BE would be a no-go.
Imo, this would make using BE more interesting than regular circumstances. Got to think when to use your skills. And, it would allow the counter to be any means of hitting a Sorc off-guard, or ranging them without being targeted. And a skillful Sorcerer would use BE better than others when being overwhelmed. Basically, don't jump into a crowd of dps fighters, unless you are a tank who is ready to whoosh around players. Comments?
Video for thought for those who are defending BE:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPR7oUbG0IM
So you didnt get you 10 alliance points?
I dont see how that skill won the fight. Can you post another?0 -
xhrit✭✭✭munch.daveb14_ESO wrote: »As a NB player I'm just going to put this out there. Our "escape" (cloak) costs 420ish mag without reduction (more than BE) lasts 3 seconds, slows you down, and breaks if:
1. you are hit in any way (aoe is easy)
2. a residual dot ticks on you
3. if you have any outgoing dot on an enemy that ticks (can't use cloak if you use dot abilities)
4. if you sprint/do any ability
A NB with 2k mag can cloak maybe 5-6 times in a row which would get them maybe 100ft in stealth if it isn't broken. For 2k magicka spent, a sorc can get halfway across the map.
Now...you sorcs were saying how BE is so expensive and counterable? Cloak is not an escape. Sorcs are the only class with any kind of escape.
This. Sorc is the only class that can instantly disengage from combat at will.
The counter to a sorc pushing a button 3 times to use an at-will ability while facing in any direction - is to target the sorc, aim directly at them, then use a targeted gap closer ability. This is fine, if you are able to react in the 300 milliseconds it takes before 3 abilities trigger.
Meanwhile the counter to the skill NB use to disengage from combat using stealth is to push impulse while standing in any direction, without having to target anything.The other classes? Well, templar and DK have 0 abilities to disengage from combat. And NB stealth only works in very limited circumstances, like if you don't have dots on you, or on an enemy, and there are no guards agroed on you. Bolt escape has no such limitations.
Sorc takes less skill to disengage then NB, or any other class for that matter - that is to say sorc requires less button clicks / mouse movement to achieve a more powerful/less limited effect.
This is the very definition of 'imbalanced'.
Edited by xhrit on 7 May 2014 16:374 -
RaZaddha✭✭✭Lets try to think of a scenario:
Green guy is running on a horse, Purple guy appears out of stealth and use a ranged attack do dismount green guy, another green guy appears and tries to help, now purpple guy tries to escape, this is how each class can escape:
DK and Templar: If you didn't waste your stamina you can try to pop retreating maneuver and immovable if you can regen your stam quickly enough (very hard to pop both at the same time if you are not specced into stam), the enemy still can use gap closers and try to kill you because you. Skill required to escape: high.
Nightblade: spam your invis, pray it doesn't bug and try to dodge their AoE, Magelight completely shuts down invis. Skill required to escape: medium/high if you have some luck.
Sercerer: Click, click, click, you escaped. Got CC'd? stunbreak, Immobilized? You can still spam BE, only players with very specific builds can catch up to you, but you can run away so far it's not even worth to chase, you can just wait and setup your trap again. Skill required: low.
Thats balanced for you? BE allows sorcs to be a lot more careless on their engagements than any other class. And BE is the only real escape mechanism, I countered so many NB's with magelight and AoE spam it's not even funny.
Imagine groups of BE sorcs ganking reinforcements? As soon as you have enough numbers to take on them they just BE away, the time you spend chasing them makes it never worth it. And it's really hard to keep using gap closers because they can spam it so fast, I have seen sorcs even use LoS, BE behind you so you waste your time turning the camera, and when you turn they have already casted it another time.Edited by RaZaddha on 7 May 2014 18:523 -
ChairGraveyard✭✭✭✭Tintinabula wrote: »and mist for vamps is still broken because the descript clearly states "invulnerable to ALL control effects" Ive been chained and taloned in mist form so many times its not even funny....yall are screaming for skills to be nerfed when current skills don't even work properly.
They also broke the speed bonus on Elusive Mist - it gives 0% speed bonus, not the 30% it should post-nerf.0