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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668861
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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668861
Now that mist form is out of the way, next up - Bolt Escape!
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Niffo✭✭✭drwoody44b14_ESO wrote: »f0rgiv3n27b14_ESO wrote: »drwoody44b14_ESO wrote: »
Nerf Bolt escape, and i'll only switch to my lesser mana intensive aoe root/snare, which can be spammed more than bolt escape can.
Then you'll cry about that.
No because if you are casting that, then you are in range for gap closers and other attacks, Root is not a get out of jail free card. (Granted w/o an immunity to it atm, it kinda is, but at least you aren't half way across the map in 3 seconds).
If you want to theory craft
Bolt Escape, I'm not doing anything.
Spamming my almost manaless aoe root, I'm also attacking you and probably kiting you around.
I already use my aoe root to bomb 30 people with my 6 person group. Assuming PvP continues to head in the direction its going, it'll be dead in a few months anyways. But this is a story for another day..
Ignoring overpowered abilities is what will kill pvp, not trying to bring about balance. Sorcerer immobilize has a high cost, and is a frontal cone, and immobilize will get an immunity added to it when you break it, at least if Zenimax doesn't want the game to boil down to whoever brings more immobilize to a fight wins.
Is this what gamers are now? They can't enjoy a game unless they're abusing broken mechanics? You guys are a joke.
6 -
Syndy✭✭✭L2P is really all there is left to say at this point.
I'm going to get a guildie to go with me and teach you guys some of the counters in a video though. You're welcome in advance.
Your video is actually proof that it does need to be looked at...
L2P? I would tell that sorc to L2P and dismount you sooner then leave you in the dust as he spam Bolt Escapes away..
You also assume that players can just mount up on a whim. I don't know if you are aware of this but combat doesn't end for a good 30 seconds until after the last person is dead. So if your counter to Bolt Escape is to just have one person mount "in case" someone is a sorc so you can ride them down, I would love to see some more insight from you, because that is truely an amazing counter. Can't believe I didn't think to myself about when we enter a fight for someone to stay mounted and not take part in the fight "in case".
Even in the "in case" scenario what's stopping the sorc from hitting Bolt escape twice, dismounting you, you cc, he breaks it, then continues on in his Bolt Escape spamming ways...
Clearly its a L2P issue for the sorcs, if they die, they need to L2P...
Syndy - VR14 Breton Templar
Sacrilege
Daggerfall Covenant
Warhammer
Syndia - 100 Zealot, Syndai - 99 Black Guard, Cyndrana - 84 Sorceress2 -
Niffo✭✭✭OP how about we just nerf all classes into dust..
Then give you a big red button on your screen to "kill all"
..would that work?
My suggestion ..
ST*U and L2P
or leave
k?
thx
bye!
Exaggerate to win eh? I don't want my overpowered ability to be balanced, so leave the game. Brilliant strategy, when everyone that wants balance is gone and the game is left with too few people to justify keeping the game open what happens then? You seem to think that your side of this arguement is just strictly based on your emotions, your post shows it, and it will not help the game to survive. ESO is not in a unique situation, everything that brings down other MMOs will bring it down too, and ignoring balance is one of the things that ruins games.
1 -
LadyChaos✭✭✭✭ChairGraveyard wrote: »
If you put The Steed mundus stone on, Mist Form is now slower than running.
The only people that think Mist Form was OP are newbs that don't know bash exists.
I've never had an issue with mist. I don't care that they were/are faster. Just amazes me that the title of this thread assumes making mist match our run speed boost as an excuse to justify why they have l2p issues. (not saying you do)
Mist runner this morning with scroll... I couldn't keep up with him on my full speed horse. We all in fact told him to slow down in /zone a couple times for running off. He actually turned around and ran back at us when he hit reds, and it took 30s+ of run time for him to catch the lead ally chasers just running back to us.
Mist stacks with rapid maneuvers and if you have a solid sta ability its pretty uncatchable synergy... along with sprint redux equip etc and other synergies. But the guy.. I could not catch on a full speed horse, as "an OP bolter", specifically specd to bolt almost indefinitely... but mist form doesn't leave a taunting trail like bolt. You NOTICE when we move out. You don't even notice the misters half the time lol. I'm so "OP" I couldn't catch em ... and he was "nerfed".
I just wanted to be clear; I HAVE NO ISSUE with mist or any other class abilities, even talons. I've taken the time to counter them or accept I'm not spec'd to counter.VR2 Ataxia - [NA] Veteran Dominion Sorcerer [Auriel's Bow]
PvP, PvE, Crafting, and General Shenanigans
Sorcery and Mayhem online since 1999
Current PvP Class/Supernatural Census0 -
LadyChaos✭✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
That's who I hunt down... ever see what shield bash does to me, or NB who jumps me, even worse what bow abilities do to me if I'm not ready for em... Best is when talons hit but I never get a chance to bolt... that happens a lot.
Bolt doesn't kill those players mentioned either it just counter's one of their abilities effectively and reduces the others effectiveness. Mist > bolt, still.VR2 Ataxia - [NA] Veteran Dominion Sorcerer [Auriel's Bow]
PvP, PvE, Crafting, and General Shenanigans Sorcery and Mayhem online since 1999
Current PvP Class/Supernatural Census1 -
Nox_Aeterna✭✭✭✭✭
✭L2P is really all there is left to say at this point.
"Video"
I'm going to get a guildie to go with me and teach you guys some of the counters in a video though. You're welcome in advance.
Hehehe , so your fix is really to have a group atk the guy to win :P.
Like i said , if the only thing you can show for it , is someone mounted , then the nerf is already at the door.
You pretty much need atleast 1 guy that will need to beat the sorcs , remember he can actually win the fight, and then you need a pursue team , cause the sorc will run away :P."Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."
-Hanlon's razor1 -
NordJitsu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
That's who I hunt down... ever see what shield bash does to me, or NB who jumps me, even worse what bow abilities do to me if I'm not ready for em... Best is when talons hit but I never get a chance to bolt... that happens a lot.
Bolt doesn't kill those players mentioned either it just counter's one of their abilities effectively and reduces the others effectiveness. Mist > bolt, still.
So what I'm reading here is that each class has particularly things that it does well that are exclusive to this class. This makes classes a meaningful choice that leads to diverse builds and facilitates group play since no one can do anything on their own.
Sounds good to me.
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Kolache✭✭✭✭That's who I hunt down... ever see what shield bash does to anyone, or NB who jumps anyone, even worse what bow abilities do to anyone...
Fixed it for you. Your build doesn't have a perfect yin-yang balance thing going on because you're getting wrecked by ambushes or bash spam and escaping anything else. Everyone else is just getting wrecked by ambushes and bash spam.Something being unbalanced in 1v1 does not imply that it is balanced in group play.0 -
Niffo✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
That's who I hunt down... ever see what shield bash does to me, or NB who jumps me, even worse what bow abilities do to me if I'm not ready for em... Best is when talons hit but I never get a chance to bolt... that happens a lot.
Bolt doesn't kill those players mentioned either it just counter's one of their abilities effectively and reduces the others effectiveness. Mist > bolt, still.
If only you could use Bolt Escape while rooted... Oh hey! You can! Mist is not even in the same building as Bolt Escape, it is hard countered by immobilize as you cannot dodge roll while in mist form. You also have to move across the terrain while Bolt Moves you instantly forward.
You guys can't even make a remotely sensible arguement for leaving Bolt Escape as it is. You show me hard counters that aren't countered by the abilities themselves.
2 -
Kolache✭✭✭✭
Edited by Kolache on 6 May 2014 19:13Something being unbalanced in 1v1 does not imply that it is balanced in group play.3 -
Syndy✭✭✭That's who I hunt down... ever see what shield bash does to me, or NB who jumps me, even worse what bow abilities do to me if I'm not ready for em... Best is when talons hit but I never get a chance to bolt... that happens a lot.
Bolt doesn't kill those players mentioned either it just counter's one of their abilities effectively and reduces the others effectiveness. Mist > bolt, still.
I guessing they do the same thing to you that they do to everyone else, Tons of Damage. The difference is everyone else can't just say, whoop, that guy got the drop on me and can kill me, well I'm out, I'll come back when the odds are in my favor though.Edited by Syndy on 6 May 2014 19:20Syndy - VR14 Breton Templar
Sacrilege
Daggerfall Covenant
Warhammer
Syndia - 100 Zealot, Syndai - 99 Black Guard, Cyndrana - 84 Sorceress0 -
LadyChaos✭✭✭✭Nox_Aeterna wrote: »L2P is really all there is left to say at this point.
"Video"
I'm going to get a guildie to go with me and teach you guys some of the counters in a video though. You're welcome in advance.
Hehehe , so your fix is really to have a group atk the guy to win :P.
Like i said , if the only thing you can show for it , is someone mounted , then the nerf is already at the door.
You pretty much need atleast 1 guy that will need to beat the sorcs , remember he can actually win the fight, and then you need a pursue team , cause the sorc will run away :P.
first, the guy on the horse was only one hitting bolter for quite a bit of that video. The final hits might have been group, but you don't see others hitting em till end, if that.
second, the part of the video to take away is the sorcerer was never able to escape him. She bolted several times but he used other abilities to keep up with her the whole time. They were unmounted for a while. If that player had been there for the very first bolt she never would have got anywhere. He stopped her several times mid bolt, then kept up with her as she bolted ahead several times.
It wasn't from being OOM he caught her... he stopped her because she had no STA to break stuns. She had no ability to stun break after the first one. We can only break once. After that we can get a bolt off IF stun wears off, but as you saw she didn't get very far. She was indefinitely bolting (the amount of pauses in between bolts)... she was never running out of magicka, only STA and HP. we get 1 stunbreak and then we die, how fast depends on whats hitting us. Stun us we die. And the video proves you can move as fast as us even without the horse.
I hadn't seen someone do it that way before but then again I have a different view lol..VR2 Ataxia - [NA] Veteran Dominion Sorcerer [Auriel's Bow]
PvP, PvE, Crafting, and General Shenanigans Sorcery and Mayhem online since 1999
Current PvP Class/Supernatural Census1 -
Aimelin✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
That's who I hunt down... ever see what shield bash does to me, or NB who jumps me, even worse what bow abilities do to me if I'm not ready for em... Best is when talons hit but I never get a chance to bolt... that happens a lot.
Bolt doesn't kill those players mentioned either it just counter's one of their abilities effectively and reduces the others effectiveness. Mist > bolt, still.
If only you could use Bolt Escape while rooted... Oh hey! You can! Mist is not even in the same building as Bolt Escape, it is hard countered by immobilize as you cannot dodge roll while in mist form. You also have to move across the terrain while Bolt Moves you instantly forward.
You guys can't even make a remotely sensible arguement for leaving Bolt Escape as it is. You show me hard counters that aren't countered by the abilities themselves.
So you're basically saying you want something, not a skill, to counter a skill? GG?
If you don't know how to counter sorcs that use bolt escape, i suggest you take a good look at all the weapon lines & their morphs....
to give you a hint, the poison arrow from bow, can be morphed to stun casters .... what does a sorc that uses bolt escape do? oh my god, he is casting ! oh but right, you don't want an ability to counter an ability, you just want to look at the sorc and make him stop in place..... riiiiight
how about the DKs that are perfectly able to time the moment sorcs get out of bolt escape to pull them back to them & kill em instantly, caus they'll have me stunned after pulled, so i have to use the cc breaker, and then bolt escape, which usually results in me being dead, oh my god another counter, but right its an ability, sry
People have been given things way too easely, this is actually a pvp game where you have to decide what skills and synergies you take with you on the battlefield, resulting in you not being able to counter somethings ...... though luck?
2 -
Niffo✭✭✭Nox_Aeterna wrote: »L2P is really all there is left to say at this point.
"Video"
I'm going to get a guildie to go with me and teach you guys some of the counters in a video though. You're welcome in advance.
Hehehe , so your fix is really to have a group atk the guy to win :P.
Like i said , if the only thing you can show for it , is someone mounted , then the nerf is already at the door.
You pretty much need atleast 1 guy that will need to beat the sorcs , remember he can actually win the fight, and then you need a pursue team , cause the sorc will run away :P.
first, the guy on the horse was only one hitting bolter for quite a bit of that video. The final hits might have been group, but you don't see others hitting em till end, if that.
second, the part of the video to take away is the sorcerer was never able to escape him. She bolted several times but he used other abilities to keep up with her the whole time. They were unmounted for a while. If that player had been there for the very first bolt she never would have got anywhere. He stopped her several times mid bolt, then kept up with her as she bolted ahead several times.
It wasn't from being OOM he caught her... he stopped her because she had no STA to break stuns. She had no ability to stun break after the first one. We can only break once. After that we can get a bolt off IF stun wears off, but as you saw she didn't get very far. She was indefinitely bolting (the amount of pauses in between bolts)... she was never running out of magicka, only STA and HP. we get 1 stunbreak and then we die, how fast depends on whats hitting us. Stun us we die. And the video proves you can move as fast as us even without the horse.
I hadn't seen someone do it that way before but then again I have a different view lol..
You don't know how much magicka the Sorcerer had, considering the bolts were intermittent so she more than likely was out of magicka and was casting bolt when possible. That video shows how powerful it is, there is no spin to it, the Sorcerer had the scroll and was being pursued by multiple people, and was only caught because they finally ran out of resources after evading all the people that had been chasing her. Its almost like you guys aren't even trying to look from a unbiased view.
0 -
NordJitsu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
That's who I hunt down... ever see what shield bash does to me, or NB who jumps me, even worse what bow abilities do to me if I'm not ready for em... Best is when talons hit but I never get a chance to bolt... that happens a lot.
Bolt doesn't kill those players mentioned either it just counter's one of their abilities effectively and reduces the others effectiveness. Mist > bolt, still.
If only you could use Bolt Escape while rooted... Oh hey! You can! Mist is not even in the same building as Bolt Escape, it is hard countered by immobilize as you cannot dodge roll while in mist form. You also have to move across the terrain while Bolt Moves you instantly forward.
You guys can't even make a remotely sensible arguement for leaving Bolt Escape as it is. You show me hard counters that aren't countered by the abilities themselves.
So you're basically saying you want something, not a skill, to counter a skill? GG?
If you don't know how to counter sorcs that use bolt escape, i suggest you take a good look at all the weapon lines & their morphs....
to give you a hint, the poison arrow from bow, can be morphed to stun casters .... what does a sorc that uses bolt escape do? oh my god, he is casting ! oh but right, you don't want an ability to counter an ability, you just want to look at the sorc and make him stop in place..... riiiiight
how about the DKs that are perfectly able to time the moment sorcs get out of bolt escape to pull them back to them & kill em instantly, caus they'll have me stunned after pulled, so i have to use the cc breaker, and then bolt escape, which usually results in me being dead, oh my god another counter, but right its an ability, sry
People have been given things way too easely, this is actually a pvp game where you have to decide what skills and synergies you take with you on the battlefield, resulting in you not being able to counter somethings ...... though luck?
@jobo11b16_ESO doesn't want to learn how to counter it. I've literally given him a dozen options. He comes up with some excuse each time as to why he can't do it.
The best one was that the counter I suggested would require him to "out play" the Sorcerer. So he literally admitted that he wanted to be able to beat a more skilled player by playing badly.
God forbid you should have to play well to counter something, right?1 -
LadyChaos✭✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »Nox_Aeterna wrote: »L2P is really all there is left to say at this point.
"Video"
I'm going to get a guildie to go with me and teach you guys some of the counters in a video though. You're welcome in advance.
Hehehe , so your fix is really to have a group atk the guy to win :P.
Like i said , if the only thing you can show for it , is someone mounted , then the nerf is already at the door.
You pretty much need atleast 1 guy that will need to beat the sorcs , remember he can actually win the fight, and then you need a pursue team , cause the sorc will run away :P.
first, the guy on the horse was only one hitting bolter for quite a bit of that video. The final hits might have been group, but you don't see others hitting em till end, if that.
second, the part of the video to take away is the sorcerer was never able to escape him. She bolted several times but he used other abilities to keep up with her the whole time. They were unmounted for a while. If that player had been there for the very first bolt she never would have got anywhere. He stopped her several times mid bolt, then kept up with her as she bolted ahead several times.
It wasn't from being OOM he caught her... he stopped her because she had no STA to break stuns. She had no ability to stun break after the first one. We can only break once. After that we can get a bolt off IF stun wears off, but as you saw she didn't get very far. She was indefinitely bolting (the amount of pauses in between bolts)... she was never running out of magicka, only STA and HP. we get 1 stunbreak and then we die, how fast depends on whats hitting us. Stun us we die. And the video proves you can move as fast as us even without the horse.
I hadn't seen someone do it that way before but then again I have a different view lol..
You don't know how much magicka the Sorcerer had, considering the bolts were intermittent so she more than likely was out of magicka and was casting bolt when possible. That video shows how powerful it is, there is no spin to it, the Sorcerer had the scroll and was being pursued by multiple people, and was only caught because they finally ran out of resources after evading all the people that had been chasing her. Its almost like you guys aren't even trying to look from a unbiased view.
I do know, because I use the spell, every day. I know exactly how much mana it costs after it's full reduction and what % of the magicka bar it takes each cast. I know how long pause in between casts shows how fast they are regening mana or using potions... because I use it... YOU don't.
Yeah she ran out of resources ... STA and HP. Usually running out of HP is the sign of someone winning.
It's so powerful all someone had to do was stun her to stop her dead in tracks... over and over. She stood there staring off into space... not running on her feet.. she was stunned not OOM. When you are OOM you just stop moving in the middle of a fight... not blocking, not turning, not running, not sprinting...? STUN countered her and then he killed her.
Edited by LadyChaos on 6 May 2014 19:44VR2 Ataxia - [NA] Veteran Dominion Sorcerer [Auriel's Bow]
PvP, PvE, Crafting, and General Shenanigans Sorcery and Mayhem online since 1999
Current PvP Class/Supernatural Census1 -
Aimelin✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »Nox_Aeterna wrote: »L2P is really all there is left to say at this point.
"Video"
I'm going to get a guildie to go with me and teach you guys some of the counters in a video though. You're welcome in advance.
Hehehe , so your fix is really to have a group atk the guy to win :P.
Like i said , if the only thing you can show for it , is someone mounted , then the nerf is already at the door.
You pretty much need atleast 1 guy that will need to beat the sorcs , remember he can actually win the fight, and then you need a pursue team , cause the sorc will run away :P.
first, the guy on the horse was only one hitting bolter for quite a bit of that video. The final hits might have been group, but you don't see others hitting em till end, if that.
second, the part of the video to take away is the sorcerer was never able to escape him. She bolted several times but he used other abilities to keep up with her the whole time. They were unmounted for a while. If that player had been there for the very first bolt she never would have got anywhere. He stopped her several times mid bolt, then kept up with her as she bolted ahead several times.
It wasn't from being OOM he caught her... he stopped her because she had no STA to break stuns. She had no ability to stun break after the first one. We can only break once. After that we can get a bolt off IF stun wears off, but as you saw she didn't get very far. She was indefinitely bolting (the amount of pauses in between bolts)... she was never running out of magicka, only STA and HP. we get 1 stunbreak and then we die, how fast depends on whats hitting us. Stun us we die. And the video proves you can move as fast as us even without the horse.
I hadn't seen someone do it that way before but then again I have a different view lol..
You don't know how much magicka the Sorcerer had, considering the bolts were intermittent so she more than likely was out of magicka and was casting bolt when possible. That video shows how powerful it is, there is no spin to it, the Sorcerer had the scroll and was being pursued by multiple people, and was only caught because they finally ran out of resources after evading all the people that had been chasing her. Its almost like you guys aren't even trying to look from a unbiased view.
I do know, because I use the spell, every day. I know exactly how much mana it costs after it's full reduction and what % of the magicka bar it takes each cast. I know how long pause in between casts shows how fast they are regening mana or using potions... because I use it... YOU don't.
Yeah she ran out of resources ... STA and HP. Usually running out of HP is the sign of someone winning.
It's so powerful all someone had to do was stun her to stop her dead in tracks... over and over. She stood there staring off into space... not running on her feet.. she was stunned not OOM. When you are OOM you just stop moving in the middle of a fight... not blocking, not turning, not running, not sprinting... STUN countered her and then he killed her.
Please say that again, caus i still don't think everyone will understand how to counter bolt escape !
2 -
Syndy✭✭✭So you're basically saying you want something, not a skill, to counter a skill? GG?
If you don't know how to counter sorcs that use bolt escape, i suggest you take a good look at all the weapon lines & their morphs....
to give you a hint, the poison arrow from bow, can be morphed to stun casters .... what does a sorc that uses bolt escape do? oh my god, he is casting ! oh but right, you don't want an ability to counter an ability, you just want to look at the sorc and make him stop in place..... riiiiight
how about the DKs that are perfectly able to time the moment sorcs get out of bolt escape to pull them back to them & kill em instantly, caus they'll have me stunned after pulled, so i have to use the cc breaker, and then bolt escape, which usually results in me being dead, oh my god another counter, but right its an ability, sry
People have been given things way too easely, this is actually a pvp game where you have to decide what skills and synergies you take with you on the battlefield, resulting in you not being able to counter somethings ...... though luck?
Ummm, NO, just NO... Bolt Escape is an instant cast, Therefore you cannot interrupt it... Now if the sorc is bad, and is just spamming Crystal shards over and over again maybe. But then Said sorc can break out of the stun and Bolt Away, your argument was not well thought out.
Your second Option is basically saying, be a DK and you need to pull off that one in a million perfectly timed shot you might kill me but I am going to bolt away again. So you better do your worst or pray you land another 1 in a million chain shot.
Edited by Syndy on 6 May 2014 19:47Syndy - VR14 Breton Templar
Sacrilege
Daggerfall Covenant
Warhammer
Syndia - 100 Zealot, Syndai - 99 Black Guard, Cyndrana - 84 Sorceress0 -
Niffo✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
That's who I hunt down... ever see what shield bash does to me, or NB who jumps me, even worse what bow abilities do to me if I'm not ready for em... Best is when talons hit but I never get a chance to bolt... that happens a lot.
Bolt doesn't kill those players mentioned either it just counter's one of their abilities effectively and reduces the others effectiveness. Mist > bolt, still.
If only you could use Bolt Escape while rooted... Oh hey! You can! Mist is not even in the same building as Bolt Escape, it is hard countered by immobilize as you cannot dodge roll while in mist form. You also have to move across the terrain while Bolt Moves you instantly forward.
You guys can't even make a remotely sensible arguement for leaving Bolt Escape as it is. You show me hard counters that aren't countered by the abilities themselves.
So you're basically saying you want something, not a skill, to counter a skill? GG?
If you don't know how to counter sorcs that use bolt escape, i suggest you take a good look at all the weapon lines & their morphs....
to give you a hint, the poison arrow from bow, can be morphed to stun casters .... what does a sorc that uses bolt escape do? oh my god, he is casting ! oh but right, you don't want an ability to counter an ability, you just want to look at the sorc and make him stop in place..... riiiiight
how about the DKs that are perfectly able to time the moment sorcs get out of bolt escape to pull them back to them & kill em instantly, caus they'll have me stunned after pulled, so i have to use the cc breaker, and then bolt escape, which usually results in me being dead, oh my god another counter, but right its an ability, sry
People have been given things way too easely, this is actually a pvp game where you have to decide what skills and synergies you take with you on the battlefield, resulting in you not being able to counter somethings ...... though luck?
Oh hey another person saying you can use Venom Arrow to stop a Bolt Escape, all you need is to be able to see into the future and tell exactly when the Sorcerer is casting an instant cast ability to interrupt them. Unless of course they have Ball of Lightning in which cast Venom Arrow is now useless. I bet you the Sorcerer can cast Bolt Escape more than the DK can cast Fiery Grip.
This is not about wanting things easy, this about wanting things to be balanced. Keep your emotions out of the posts, they don't make you right.
1 -
Aimelin✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
That's who I hunt down... ever see what shield bash does to me, or NB who jumps me, even worse what bow abilities do to me if I'm not ready for em... Best is when talons hit but I never get a chance to bolt... that happens a lot.
Bolt doesn't kill those players mentioned either it just counter's one of their abilities effectively and reduces the others effectiveness. Mist > bolt, still.
If only you could use Bolt Escape while rooted... Oh hey! You can! Mist is not even in the same building as Bolt Escape, it is hard countered by immobilize as you cannot dodge roll while in mist form. You also have to move across the terrain while Bolt Moves you instantly forward.
You guys can't even make a remotely sensible arguement for leaving Bolt Escape as it is. You show me hard counters that aren't countered by the abilities themselves.
So you're basically saying you want something, not a skill, to counter a skill? GG?
If you don't know how to counter sorcs that use bolt escape, i suggest you take a good look at all the weapon lines & their morphs....
to give you a hint, the poison arrow from bow, can be morphed to stun casters .... what does a sorc that uses bolt escape do? oh my god, he is casting ! oh but right, you don't want an ability to counter an ability, you just want to look at the sorc and make him stop in place..... riiiiight
how about the DKs that are perfectly able to time the moment sorcs get out of bolt escape to pull them back to them & kill em instantly, caus they'll have me stunned after pulled, so i have to use the cc breaker, and then bolt escape, which usually results in me being dead, oh my god another counter, but right its an ability, sry
People have been given things way too easely, this is actually a pvp game where you have to decide what skills and synergies you take with you on the battlefield, resulting in you not being able to counter somethings ...... though luck?
Oh hey another person saying you can use Venom Arrow to stop a Bolt Escape, all you need is to be able to see into the future and tell exactly when the Sorcerer is casting an instant cast ability to interrupt them. Unless of course they have Ball of Lightning in which cast Venom Arrow is now useless. I bet you the Sorcerer can cast Bolt Escape more than the DK can cast Fiery Grip.
This is not about wanting things easy, this about wanting things to be balanced. Keep your emotions out of the posts, they don't make you right.
i guess theres alot of people that can see into the future then, as i've been stunned alot by bow users or people with skills & morphs that stun casters, and ball of lightning yea ok, that absorbs projectiles, which also shows you where the sorc teleported, which also lingers for quite awhile, allowing you to see & chase him, caus if you don't go balls deep in magicka you will be out of it in 5-7 casts, if you spam it repeatedly, which isnt rly that far if people chase you.
Streak on the other hand has no ball of lightning that absorbs projectiles. and to time the poison arrow is perfectly doable.
try it out more first
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Aimelin✭✭✭@Aimelin
Not only that, but Crushing Shock isn't even a projectile. It cannot be stopped by Ball of Lightning.
And if someone is spamming it to escape, you don't need to predict anything. Just fire it off when they start spamming and you'll absolutely get an interrupt.
Exactly !
People just don't take the time to read and use / try out skills and their morphs !
If i wanted i could make 100 QQ NERF posts about the other classes
people crying that templars don't do what DKs do, which is go balls deep, well im sry but either you have templars that don't want to do that, or can't, caus the templar that runs with us, and heals us, is in full heavy armor, resto staff & sword/shield, and he even gets most of the kills out of us, while perfectly able to manage his magicka, to keep us 6 alive from bigger numbers.
Honestly, learn to use different skills & synergies !
Us sorcs are like living in some fear that one of our crucial survivability skills is probably going to get nerfed out of all these QQ nerf threads, you can say we have lightning armor, bound armor, but i don't even have that on my bar(s). Why would you ask? caus they're useless ? Bound armor would require me to sacrifice 2 slots if i want to keep it up at all times when weapon swapping, lightning armor is in theory a nice buff, but meh, everyone who goes into cyrodiil gets 300 extra armor penetration, yea sure, i'll use lightning armor ......... waste a skill slot, and still be squishy .....
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Niffo✭✭✭
@jobo11b16_ESO doesn't want to learn how to counter it. I've literally given him a dozen options. He comes up with some excuse each time as to why he can't do it.
The best one was that the counter I suggested would require him to "out play" the Sorcerer. So he literally admitted that he wanted to be able to beat a more skilled player by playing badly.
God forbid you should have to play well to counter something, right?
Keep trying to make it seem like you aren't putting up ridiculous requirements to beat 1 ability. Nord everytime you post you try your best to make me look like I'm the one that is defending an overpowered ability that has no hard counter.2 -
Aimelin✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
@jobo11b16_ESO doesn't want to learn how to counter it. I've literally given him a dozen options. He comes up with some excuse each time as to why he can't do it.
The best one was that the counter I suggested would require him to "out play" the Sorcerer. So he literally admitted that he wanted to be able to beat a more skilled player by playing badly.
God forbid you should have to play well to counter something, right?
Keep trying to make it seem like you aren't putting up ridiculous requirements to beat 1 ability. Nord everytime you post you try your best to make me look like I'm the one that is defending an overpowered ability that has no hard counter.
again, and i repeat again, caus idk how many times ppl have said it
STUN IS THE HARD COUNTER HIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
now go play & kill bolt escapers
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LadyChaos✭✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
@jobo11b16_ESO doesn't want to learn how to counter it. I've literally given him a dozen options. He comes up with some excuse each time as to why he can't do it.
The best one was that the counter I suggested would require him to "out play" the Sorcerer. So he literally admitted that he wanted to be able to beat a more skilled player by playing badly.
God forbid you should have to play well to counter something, right?
Keep trying to make it seem like you aren't putting up ridiculous requirements to beat 1 ability. Nord everytime you post you try your best to make me look like I'm the one that is defending an overpowered ability that has no hard counter.
He's not making you look that way, you are. You have said that line every time someone gives you a counter you can't close your eyes or plug your ears and say "nananananananananannnerrrrrrrf" over the sound.
It adds up to a bunch of counter skills, synergies, trade offs, videos, testimony, hand holding for you, and you respond with ..."well that's just one thing you fail!" I an hear the count in the background going "1 counter ability, 2 counter abilities 3 counter abilities.... muahhaha".
IMO adapt to the game, try the tips and tactics spoon fed to you, or you will always be miserable waiting for it to change to your individual needs in a PvP setting.VR2 Ataxia - [NA] Veteran Dominion Sorcerer [Auriel's Bow]
PvP, PvE, Crafting, and General Shenanigans Sorcery and Mayhem online since 1999
Current PvP Class/Supernatural Census2 -
beravinprb19_ESO✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
@jobo11b16_ESO doesn't want to learn how to counter it. I've literally given him a dozen options. He comes up with some excuse each time as to why he can't do it.
The best one was that the counter I suggested would require him to "out play" the Sorcerer. So he literally admitted that he wanted to be able to beat a more skilled player by playing badly.
God forbid you should have to play well to counter something, right?
Keep trying to make it seem like you aren't putting up ridiculous requirements to beat 1 ability. Nord everytime you post you try your best to make me look like I'm the one that is defending an overpowered ability that has no hard counter.
again, and i repeat again, caus idk how many times ppl have said it
STUN IS THE HARD COUNTER HIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
now go play & kill bolt escapers
Stuns don't last the 8 or so seconds it would take to kill a Sorcerer. That, and they can be blocked, broken out of, rolled, or they could have Immovable running, etc. The one "hard counter" you keep listing is not as effective as you would like us to believe.Edited by beravinprb19_ESO on 6 May 2014 20:233 -
Aimelin✭✭✭jobo11b16_ESO wrote: »
@jobo11b16_ESO doesn't want to learn how to counter it. I've literally given him a dozen options. He comes up with some excuse each time as to why he can't do it.
The best one was that the counter I suggested would require him to "out play" the Sorcerer. So he literally admitted that he wanted to be able to beat a more skilled player by playing badly.
God forbid you should have to play well to counter something, right?
Keep trying to make it seem like you aren't putting up ridiculous requirements to beat 1 ability. Nord everytime you post you try your best to make me look like I'm the one that is defending an overpowered ability that has no hard counter.
He's not making you look that way, you are. You have said that line every time someone gives you a counter you can't close your eyes or plug your ears and say "nananananananananannnerrrrrrrf" over the sound.
It adds up to a bunch of counter skills, synergies, trade offs, videos, testimony, hand holding for you, and you respond with ..."well that's just one thing you fail!" I an hear the count in the background going "1 counter ability, 2 counter abilities 3 counter abilities.... muahhaha".
IMO adapt to the game, try the tips and tactics spoon fed to you, or you will always be miserable waiting for it to change to your individual needs in a PvP setting.
can i hug you?
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maxilaub17_ESO✭✭✭Bolt Escape really needs to be hit hard with the nerf bat.
My suggestion : make it cost 3 times more, and only teleport 1/2 as far.
It definitely needs to cost more. I don't think it needs a reduction in range, it just needs to cost enough that can't it be used more than a few times without running out of magicka.
Make is cost enough to retain the ability of an escape but not a spam run fast ability, or spam catch up to anyone and than escape with it if you can't win. <--- That's what makes "bolt escape" obnoxious.
That's the crux for most of the PvP problems atm, for some builds and itemization's there is too little cost and penalty in using an ability; which is the entire reason for a limited stamina and magicka reserve and ability cost in the first place. That's where the focus of balancing should be tuned to atm (in my opinion).
When u can't spam abilities forever you have to think strategically, when you can u become a mindless button mashing moron who thinks they are actually good.
Edited by maxilaub17_ESO on 6 May 2014 20:330 -
Firellight✭✭✭So you're basically saying you want something, not a skill, to counter a skill? GG?
If you don't know how to counter sorcs that use bolt escape, i suggest you take a good look at all the weapon lines & their morphs....
to give you a hint, the poison arrow from bow, can be morphed to stun casters .... what does a sorc that uses bolt escape do? oh my god, he is casting ! oh but right, you don't want an ability to counter an ability, you just want to look at the sorc and make him stop in place..... riiiiight
how about the DKs that are perfectly able to time the moment sorcs get out of bolt escape to pull them back to them & kill em instantly, caus they'll have me stunned after pulled, so i have to use the cc breaker, and then bolt escape, which usually results in me being dead, oh my god another counter, but right its an ability, sry
People have been given things way too easely, this is actually a pvp game where you have to decide what skills and synergies you take with you on the battlefield, resulting in you not being able to counter somethings ...... though luck?
Actually, for more central game features it is more healthy to have a central counter. If you needed a werewolf to take down a vampire, then you would be spending hours on a low-populated campaign looking for a werewolf to take down a vampire (terrible example I know).
If lots of sorcerers are using Bolt Escape, then we have a central skill. Imo, any player should have a way to counter it, instead of having to rely on certain skills available to certain players to counter BE.
________________________
How about!
An enemy must be within a certain range to Bolt Escape, and in order to BE within a longer range (against ranged enemies) the player must have a target?
So if you are about to be attacked by a bunch of swordsmen, you can escape, and if an archer is about to snipe, you can escape. Any other casually convenient time to use BE would be a no-go.
Imo, this would make using BE more interesting than regular circumstances. Got to think when to use your skills. And, it would allow the counter to be any means of hitting a Sorc off-guard, or ranging them without being targeted. And a skillful Sorcerer would use BE better than others when being overwhelmed. Basically, don't jump into a crowd of dps fighters, unless you are a tank who is ready to whoosh around players. Comments?
Video for thought for those who are defending BE:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPR7oUbG0IM Edited by Firellight on 6 May 2014 20:560