Where is the fun, skill or challenge in this?

sSolutionSs

beravinprb19_ESO wrote: »

I could forgive most of the PvP issues if it did not take 10 minutes just to get back in the fight. At any rate, regardless of how you lot feel about the OP and the other people who disagree with you, the reality is that, while fun, the game does have some problems. Just a few examples (and please keep in mind, these are mostly my opinions):

1. Towers around farms, mines and lumbermills might as well be the new keeps. There is only one way to get in, and a small group of players can easily hold it with a few oils. This happens quite often and is starting to get more than a little out of hand.

2. The rewards are a joke. I can craft better stuff at V1 than some of the epic PvP stuff at V10. Not to mention how much everything costs. 600k alliance points for a mediocre piece of armour? No thanks. The PvP economy leaves a great deal to be desired.

3. The experience gain is very low for most people. I think I have leveled once in PvP, if that, over several hours of play. As a V1 player, my experience bar barely moves at all after a session. I feel like I am forced to PvE to make any character progression.

4. Stop sending me useless greens in the mail. Either give me something useful or stop wasting my time. How about some crafting materials? A siege weapon? A blue piece of equipment? Some gold? A forward camp? Anything that actually has value?

5. The population imbalance needed to be dealt with some time ago. We have about 10 campaigns, and barely any of them have more than 1 bar of population for any alliance. I want campaigns with people in them, not the barren wastelands we have now.

6. Magicka builds seem to be far stronger than stamina builds. Ironically, most stamina builds are melee, which is enough of a disadvantage already. Heck, our main resource is usually needed for rolls, stun breaks, sneaking, blocking, sprinting, etc...

I could go on. The point is, while it is certainly enjoyable, I can't help but agree with the OP to some extent. Having fun does not mean the game is without issues. Please stop giving him such a hard time, for while you may not agree with him, that does not make him wrong. While it is quite enjoyable to play, it also has a lot of room for improvement.

A fair way to put it.

Drachenfier

drwoody44b14_ESO wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

drwoody44b14_ESO wrote: »

Am I reading this right? Low level players are upset that they go to pvp and are getting killed by higher level players?

Maybe you should....I dunno....level up also?

Maybe they should .. I dunno ... implement an option to only fight vs players of reasonably equal level.

Last I checked, the RvR was for max level characters. The fact that it auto levels you to 50 is a pretty good indicator. Its been like this in every single game that has WvW/RvR. Every single one.

Absolutely false.

WHO divided RvR maps by level.
L2 didn't boost at all, and it had the most awesome clan war/siege/open world pvp of any game ever made.

This game's pvp is boring.

tawok

LilMcGinley wrote: »

MysticAura wrote: »

They really need separate areas set to level ranges, as well as some limiter in place to not allow high level to jump on low level. While the naturalization was 'possibly' good on paper, it's fundamentally flawed in practice. It's definitely not encouraging to people.

I know some people enjoy the free for all, and beating up little people with no limits, but I really do think that if lower levels could train in areas fitting to them, they'd create a much more fulfilling hunt, than two shotting some poor new person who just wanted to learn, help and have fun.

I'm trying to remember a time in history when a more skilled army wasn't allowed to fight another army..

"Sorry <country> you can't invade us right now because aren't as skilled as you. Please, come back later."

War is War.

I'm trying to remember a time in history where a competitive video game is supposed to be as brutal and unforgiving as real war.

"Sorry <person> you're not allowed to have fun. Normalization is for [snip], ***. Please come back later once you've gotten enough skill points."

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

tawok

apterous wrote: »

let me repeat, when i went to pvp first time i was lvl 22, and i killed veterans as easy as any other. it's about skill.

He wants you to think this is real advice, and he's not just being a *** to compensate for another failure in life. In reality, he's just an *** that's probably severely diminished in his home life, so he lashes out on internet people. Feel better yet, buddy?

Jadeviper1974

I am still stunned by the thought that someone thinks an MMO, pvp or not actually takes some kind of skill.

Sykotik_ESO

I like how almost everyone on this thread thinks their opinion should be law and everyone should abide to it :P

sSolutionSs

I think they removed one of the most entertaining aspects of any PvP in an MMO and that is the ability to take the war to people questing and hold their real towns. For example: 100 Daggerfall Holding Skywatch, slaying AD and Forcing them to respond!

You can simply not do this in this game. You Must Go To Cyrodiil

This game is like: oh you wanna PvP? Go to the Playground Children. No rough Housing inside, Which is so far From the "Realism" that this games seems to want to stand by with their lack of ui additions.

sSolutionSs

I'd Also agree with the OP on the point that the majority of this games PVP is in fact Skillless and requires little strategy when You have Max lvls Vs Non Max levels.... besides that there are some good fights you can find out there with people of equal level, That is just a task to find...

Darka

Sometimes camping cities does more to discourage then encourage the fight
being mindlessly slaughtered by players where most can not and will not fight back in hopes to encourage people who are busy elsewhere doing other things

Yeah you will get the time where it works, and goes well
But I do feel in my experience with those type encounters of raiding NPC cities, is you get less response or interest from people

I am sure there could be something that could work to better sort this out with out having people being disturbed and those who want to fight able to fight, I believe that it could be done, just that its not as great at encouragement to fight
Encourage pvp, and people will fight
Enforce pvp and people will go elsewhere

Magischzwei

As it stands, this game is barely more then a glorified single player as of now. PvP stinks and is unrewarding, Dungeons stink and are unrewarding, Solo Dungeons are a Joke and just loot pinatas.

The only way you can progress in this game efficiently is solo questing atm.

Ghenra

Less zerging, more roaming, and Cirodiil becomes a better land for the war. I can't undertand the *** noobs zerging all the day killing all arround them, for what? for nothing, boring the game soon.

sSolutionSs

Magischzwei wrote: »

As it stands, The only way you can progress in this game efficiently is solo questing atm.

Agree'd

TheGrandAlliance

reggielee wrote: »

hours later of frustration and feeling left out they leave, go to the forums and complain, complain in general reviews that ESO sucks and the pvp is unbalanced and unfair. Result? low sub rates, empty campaigns with low player volume, veterans complaining theres nothing to do and no one to fight against. We already are seeing most of that happening now.

we shouldnt have had veteran ranks on the first day... It'll only get worse with time

EXACTLY! Finally someone on these forums has a brain, and the skill to condense that logic, into a single post.

IT doesn't matter what the "hard core-ers" think... as long as there is; even a small amount, of players going around trashing ESO wrongly, this game is done. (Not so) Healthy, Pure and Simple.

apterous

Magischzwei wrote: »

As it stands, this game is barely more then a glorified single player as of now. PvP stinks and is unrewarding, Dungeons stink and are unrewarding, Solo Dungeons are a Joke and just loot pinatas.

The only way you can progress in this game efficiently is solo questing atm.

if your only goal is to level up then pvp is not for you. hell i'd say the whole game is not for you.

Magischzwei

apterous wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

As it stands, this game is barely more then a glorified single player as of now. PvP stinks and is unrewarding, Dungeons stink and are unrewarding, Solo Dungeons are a Joke and just loot pinatas.

The only way you can progress in this game efficiently is solo questing atm.

if your only goal is to level up then pvp is not for you. hell i'd say the whole game is not for you.

According to 90% of the responses in this topic, I am supposed to and obliged to level to max before I have any right to enjoy pvp content or anything else.

Logical fallacies, logical fallacies everywhere.

Cydone

TheGrandAlliance wrote: »

reggielee wrote: »

hours later of frustration and feeling left out they leave, go to the forums and complain, complain in general reviews that ESO sucks and the pvp is unbalanced and unfair. Result? low sub rates, empty campaigns with low player volume, veterans complaining theres nothing to do and no one to fight against. We already are seeing most of that happening now.

we shouldnt have had veteran ranks on the first day... It'll only get worse with time

EXACTLY! Finally someone on these forums has a brain, and the skill to condense that logic, into a single post.

IT doesn't matter what the "hard core-ers" think... as long as there is; even a small amount, of players going around trashing ESO wrongly, this game is done. (Not so) Healthy, Pure and Simple.

You really don't get how MMO's work do you?? There will ALWAYS be ppl misrepresenting games out there based on their own personal bias. This has never lead to the entire demise of a game. Devs making knee jerk reactions, on the other hand, within 2 weeks of the games launch CAN, in fact, kill a game.

SwampRaider

Magischzwei wrote: »

It should not be possible for high level players to farm lowies.

Just remove Cryodil already and add some BGs with level instancing.

except you are wrong

Cyrodiil is great. At level 40, ive killed VR3's

at level VR3 i've been one shotted by a level 10 NB using teleport strike..or ambush..

It is fine the way it is.

Currently there is a scaling bug that allows VR10's to keep their stats, when they sohudl be scaled down to VR1. Once they fix that they are golden

If they added BG's i'll quit the game. I BOUGHT THIS GAME SPECIFICALLY for Cyrodiil

drwoody44b14_ESO

Magischzwei wrote: »

apterous wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

As it stands, this game is barely more then a glorified single player as of now. PvP stinks and is unrewarding, Dungeons stink and are unrewarding, Solo Dungeons are a Joke and just loot pinatas.

The only way you can progress in this game efficiently is solo questing atm.

if your only goal is to level up then pvp is not for you. hell i'd say the whole game is not for you.

According to 90% of the responses in this topic, I am supposed to and obliged to level to max before I have any right to enjoy pvp content or anything else.

Or go play Guildwars 2

Cydone

SwampRaider wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

It should not be possible for high level players to farm lowies.

Just remove Cryodil already and add some BGs with level instancing.

except you are wrong

Cyrodiil is great. At level 40, ive killed VR3's

at level VR3 i've been one shotted by a level 10 NB using teleport strike..or ambush..

It is fine the way it is.

Currently there is a scaling bug that allows VR10's to keep their stats, when they sohudl be scaled down to VR1. Once they fix that they are golden

If they added BG's i'll quit the game. I BOUGHT THIS GAME SPECIFICALLY for Cyrodiil

To the bolded, I haven't heard of this being a bug. Do you have a link to an official statement for this being a bug?? Cause if there isn't, then it's just conjecture and would make reaching VR10 essentially worthless. I highly doubt it's a bug and should they scale me down, after putting in this many hours grinding out the veteran levels, I'd probably quit or take a long break from the game. I'd imagine a lot of players would feel the same way.

Bunk

Magischzwei wrote: »

apterous wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

As it stands, this game is barely more then a glorified single player as of now. PvP stinks and is unrewarding, Dungeons stink and are unrewarding, Solo Dungeons are a Joke and just loot pinatas.

The only way you can progress in this game efficiently is solo questing atm.

if your only goal is to level up then pvp is not for you. hell i'd say the whole game is not for you.

According to 90% of the responses in this topic, I am supposed to and obliged to level to max before I have any right to enjoy pvp content or anything else.

Logical fallacies, logical fallacies everywhere.

You're obligated to git gud

SwampRaider

Cydone wrote: »

SwampRaider wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

It should not be possible for high level players to farm lowies.

Just remove Cryodil already and add some BGs with level instancing.

except you are wrong

Cyrodiil is great. At level 40, ive killed VR3's

at level VR3 i've been one shotted by a level 10 NB using teleport strike..or ambush..

It is fine the way it is.

Currently there is a scaling bug that allows VR10's to keep their stats, when they sohudl be scaled down to VR1. Once they fix that they are golden

If they added BG's i'll quit the game. I BOUGHT THIS GAME SPECIFICALLY for Cyrodiil

To the bolded, I haven't heard of this being a bug. Do you have a link to an official statement for this being a bug?? Cause if there isn't, then it's just conjecture and would make reaching VR10 essentially worthless. I highly doubt it's a bug and should they scale me down, after putting in this many hours grinding out the veteran levels, I'd probably quit or take a long break from the game. I'd imagine a lot of players would feel the same way.

you didn't hear? it's common knowledge that those in the VR ranks get scaled down..how could you NOT know this?

For a more concrete example. At vr2 I had the exact same stats as a Vr8

apterous

Magischzwei wrote: »

apterous wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

As it stands, this game is barely more then a glorified single player as of now. PvP stinks and is unrewarding, Dungeons stink and are unrewarding, Solo Dungeons are a Joke and just loot pinatas.

The only way you can progress in this game efficiently is solo questing atm.

if your only goal is to level up then pvp is not for you. hell i'd say the whole game is not for you.

According to 90% of the responses in this topic, I am supposed to and obliged to level to max before I have any right to enjoy pvp content or anything else.

Logical fallacies, logical fallacies everywhere.

from what i understand, you want rewards, not pvp.

TheOnix

Magischzwei wrote: »

apterous wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

As it stands, this game is barely more then a glorified single player as of now. PvP stinks and is unrewarding, Dungeons stink and are unrewarding, Solo Dungeons are a Joke and just loot pinatas.

The only way you can progress in this game efficiently is solo questing atm.

if your only goal is to level up then pvp is not for you. hell i'd say the whole game is not for you.

According to 90% of the responses in this topic, I am supposed to and obliged to level to max before I have any right to enjoy pvp content or anything else.

Logical fallacies, logical fallacies everywhere.

You obviously are not playing the same game we are playing, otherwise you wouldn't make that rediculous statement. Fact is, there is no progression at all exp-wise in PvP as it currently is.

Keep in mind that this coming from someone with 5 days, 20+ hours logged in game. It took me maybe half a day to hit 15 for weapon swapping in combat, and have PvP'ed since then. I am now level 33. (and Vet 1 PvP rank) That amount of progression is pitiful in comparison to PvE, where some of my friends have hit 50 v4 playing less than I have.

sSolutionSs

SwampRaider wrote: »

=

at level VR3 i've been one shotted by a level 10 NB using teleport strike..or ambush..

Wait what?

1 Shotted? I highly doubt that. I think if you are vet rank anything and you die to anything non vet ranked in a small scale fight you need to L2P.

I saw 2 vr2+ take on 30 non vets like it was a walk in the park.

If they added bgs that would be a cool alternative option to pvp and not a reason to quit.

sSolutionSs

I swear this is whats happening on every eso forum:

Ex Skyrim Players who Loves Single player Rpg's VS The average MMO Pvp'er

Lets face it. this is a great PVE game!! PVP at its current state is kinda a joke. since this game just came out im willing to see what is added and or changed to pvp content, there is alot of potential.

skydrac

sSolutionSs wrote: »

I swear this is whats happening on every eso forum:Ex Skyrim Players who Loves Single player Rpg's VS The average MMO Pvp'er

Lets face it. this is a great PVE game!! PVP at its current state is kinda a joke. since this game just came out im willing to see what is added and or changed to pvp content, there is alot of potential.

:played the whole serie ... dragonborn before this
got 200+ mods on the game+
+ played for the 3th time de game on lvl legendary so don't give me the *** I don't know how to play
+ but eso is a arcade game in comparison with skyrim..

LadyChaos

skydrac wrote: »

sSolutionSs wrote: »

I swear this is whats happening on every eso forum:Ex Skyrim Players who Loves Single player Rpg's VS The average MMO Pvp'er

Lets face it. this is a great PVE game!! PVP at its current state is kinda a joke. since this game just came out im willing to see what is added and or changed to pvp content, there is alot of potential.

:played the whole serie ... dragonborn before this
got 200+ mods on the game+
+ played for the 3th time de game on lvl legendary so don't give me the *** I don't know how to play
+ but eso is a arcade game in comparison with skyrim..

My big complaint on PvP is faction balance personally. Most any other drama I can roll with as stuff changes all the time but having balanced 3 way war is what keeps RvRvR going... IMO. I am hopeful this will even out over time or they make a betray your faction quest lol.

I do see what you mean by ESO being less complex than skyrim, but you can't pause in an MMO. That poses a lot of needs for making all the things in skyrim that were complex, very dynamic and fast moving in ESO... only my opinion. But again there was no PvP in skyrim, at all... so this really has very little bearing on PvP mechanics. You cant copy paste skyrim to PvP ESO... no pause.

Thevenin

Cydone wrote: »

To the bolded, I haven't heard of this being a bug. Do you have a link to an official statement for this being a bug?? Cause if there isn't, then it's just conjecture and would make reaching VR10 essentially worthless. I highly doubt it's a bug and should they scale me down, after putting in this many hours grinding out the veteran levels, I'd probably quit or take a long break from the game. I'd imagine a lot of players would feel the same way.

Allow me to rephrase your thoughts :

Cydone wrote: »

My satisfaction comes from steamrolling people who don't have the lack of life I revealed by rushing through 300+ hours of content within 2 weeks. I loathe competition, and will leave if my superiority is removed or downgraded. Players who take interest to the content of this game instead of skipping everything, or who simply don't play 8h/day should get crushed by my mighty no-lifeness, no matter their skill, teamwork or numbers. My team of idiots and I wish to keep slapping everyone else out of this game despite our deep lack of teamwork and skill, exploiting the *** out of every single broken mechanism while laughing at their crushing defeats on vent. I do know that within six months, this game will be down to a few thousands of active PvP players, mainly teams of *** like mine which will avoid fighting and create drama as soon as they realize they don't have 10x the stats of everyone else anymore. But I don't really care, because by then we'll get bored of this game and hop on a new one to ruin it like a swarm of neckbearded flies.

skydrac

LadyChaos wrote: »

skydrac wrote: »

sSolutionSs wrote: »

I swear this is whats happening on every eso forum:Ex Skyrim Players who Loves Single player Rpg's VS The average MMO Pvp'er

Lets face it. this is a great PVE game!! PVP at its current state is kinda a joke. since this game just came out im willing to see what is added and or changed to pvp content, there is alot of potential.

:played the whole serie ... dragonborn before this
got 200+ mods on the game+
+ played for the 3th time de game on lvl legendary so don't give me the *** I don't know how to play
+ but eso is a arcade game in comparison with skyrim..

My big complaint on PvP is faction balance personally. Most any other drama I can roll with as stuff changes all the time but having balanced 3 way war is what keeps RvRvR going... IMO. I am hopeful this will even out over time or they make a betray your faction quest lol.

I do see what you mean by ESO being less complex than skyrim, but you can't pause in an MMO. That poses a lot of needs for making all the things in skyrim that were complex, very dynamic and fast moving in ESO... only my opinion. But again there was no PvP in skyrim, at all... so this really has very little bearing on PvP mechanics. You cant copy paste skyrim to PvP ESO... no pause.

im talking about the auto aim ..you run you fire ,hit or something and you hit always
the same the otherway around he fire hit or spell and he hits you tru walls and side steps ...you don't have to aim at all
and about you cant copy the paste skyrim .... why do they call it the ellderscrolls then.

sorry I played them all 2 , 3 some of them 4 times

The Elder Scrolls, Chapter I - Arena (1994)
The Elder Scrolls, Chapter II - Daggerfall (1996)
The Elder Scrolls, Chapter III - Morrowind (2002)
Morrowind: Tribunal (2002) en Bloodmoon (2003)

The Elder Scrolls, Chapter IV - Oblivion (2006)
The Elder Scrolls IV: Knights of the Nine (2006)
Shivering Isles (2007)

The Elder Scrolls, Chapter V - Skyrim (2011)
The Elder Scrolls V: Dawnguard (2012)
The Elder Scrolls V: Dragonborn (2013)

who talking about pause

Cydone

Thevenin wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

To the bolded, I haven't heard of this being a bug. Do you have a link to an official statement for this being a bug?? Cause if there isn't, then it's just conjecture and would make reaching VR10 essentially worthless. I highly doubt it's a bug and should they scale me down, after putting in this many hours grinding out the veteran levels, I'd probably quit or take a long break from the game. I'd imagine a lot of players would feel the same way.

Allow me to rephrase your thoughts :

Cydone wrote: »

My satisfaction comes from steamrolling people who don't have the lack of life I revealed by rushing through 300+ hours of content within 2 weeks. I loathe competition, and will leave if my superiority is removed or downgraded. Players who take interest to the content of this game instead of skipping everything, or who simply don't play 8h/day should get crushed by my mighty no-lifeness, no matter their skill, teamwork or numbers. My team of idiots and I wish to keep slapping everyone else out of this game despite our deep lack of teamwork and skill, exploiting the *** out of every single broken mechanism while laughing at their crushing defeats on vent. I do know that within six months, this game will be down to a few thousands of active PvP players, mainly teams of *** like mine which will avoid fighting and create drama as soon as they realize they don't have 10x the stats of everyone else anymore. But I don't really care, because by then we'll get bored of this game and hop on a new one to ruin it like a swarm of neckbearded flies.

Sorry if you think that time invested in a game shouldn't be rewarded. If you don't put in the same effort as I have, over time, leveling your toon, why the hell should you be rewarded the same as me? And as others have stated, people below veteran ranks CAN and DO take out veterans. Hell I did it before I reached veteran level. At least for ppl that were below VR6. Now, I wasn't winning EVERY fight, but I was winning.

MMO's will ALWAYS be an investment in time. If you can't invest time like others can you shouldn't be rewarded the same.....for essentially NOT doing anything. It's just like saying,"I know I just started this job and that other guy has been here for a while, makes more money than I do and has a better position within the company.....but I should be getting the same rewards as him even though I haven't yet put worth the same effort as he has."