Where is the fun, skill or challenge in this?

reggielee

I see the future and its going to be packs of veterans, not willing to group with low levels, zerging the dailies on their fast mounts. New players will be left out in the cold, not finding groups, or if grouped riding their starter mounts to resource areas only to find them capped, not getting credit for the cap, running desperately after the zerg to the keep... not getting credit for taking the keep and so on. Add to it long rides back to the action where they die fast.

hours later of frustration and feeling left out they leave, go to the forums and complain, complain in general reviews that ESO sucks and the pvp is unbalanced and unfair. Result? low sub rates, empty campaigns with low player volume, veterans complaining theres nothing to do and no one to fight against. We already are seeing most of that happening now.

we shouldnt have had veteran ranks on the first day, we shouldnt have had so much gold in the game that so many have the fast mount the first few days. Its borked. It'll only get worse with time

tplink3r1

Magischzwei wrote: »

Random mass zergs with V5+ people running around 2 shotting everyone else while themselfes beeing unkillable.

sorry, but MMORPGs are not for you, go play LoL of something else.
one of the most fun things to do in MMORPGs is improve your character in order to be better in PvP.

beravinprb19_ESO

tplink3r1 wrote: »

sorry, but MMORPGs are not for you, go play LoL of something else.
one of the most fun things to do in MMORPGs is improve your character in order to be better in PvP.

Then they might start by allowing us to improve our characters through PvP. The rewards are not very good, the experience gain is low. Its not exactly the best place to level up new skill lines and abilities... If people actually leveled up at a reasonable rate in PvP, then this would be far less of a problem. PvE feels like the only option for progression.

tplink3r1

beravinprb19_ESO wrote: »

tplink3r1 wrote: »

sorry, but MMORPGs are not for you, go play LoL of something else.
one of the most fun things to do in MMORPGs is improve your character in order to be better in PvP.

Then they might start by allowing us to improve our characters through PvP. The rewards are not very good, the experience gain is low. Its not exactly the best place to level up new skill lines and abilities... If people actually leveled up at a reasonable rate in PvP, then this would be far less of a problem. PvE feels like the only option for progression.

leveling in PvP? these new mmos ruined leveling...

montgomery.luke07b16_ESO

reggielee wrote: »

I see the future and its going to be packs of veterans, not willing to group with low levels, zerging the dailies on their fast mounts. New players will be left out in the cold, not finding groups, or if grouped riding their starter mounts to resource areas only to find them capped, not getting credit for the cap, running desperately after the zerg to the keep... not getting credit for taking the keep and so on. Add to it long rides back to the action where they die fast.

hours later of frustration and feeling left out they leave, go to the forums and complain, complain in general reviews that ESO sucks and the pvp is unbalanced and unfair. Result? low sub rates, empty campaigns with low player volume, veterans complaining theres nothing to do and no one to fight against. We already are seeing most of that happening now.

we shouldnt have had veteran ranks on the first day, we shouldnt have had so much gold in the game that so many have the fast mount the first few days. Its borked. It'll only get worse with time

And this is exactly what happened in Daoc am i right??

Veteran players and guilds are going to figure out new strategies and tactics thus evolving the meta. Very soon you will see the zerg groups decimated by smaller groups with superior tactics. This is the way of these games, heck even GW2 with its massively flawed pvp had a semblance of this on the better servers.

drwoody44b14_ESO

For those that want instant any level PVP:

GuildWars 2 is still going strong. Please head that way.

drwoody44b14_ESO

reggielee wrote: »

I see the future and its going to be packs of veterans, not willing to group with low levels, zerging the dailies on their fast mounts. New players will be left out in the cold, not finding groups, or if grouped riding their starter mounts to resource areas only to find them capped, not getting credit for the cap, running desperately after the zerg to the keep... not getting credit for taking the keep and so on. Add to it long rides back to the action where they die fast.

hours later of frustration and feeling left out they leave, go to the forums and complain, complain in general reviews that ESO sucks and the pvp is unbalanced and unfair. Result? low sub rates, empty campaigns with low player volume, veterans complaining theres nothing to do and no one to fight against. We already are seeing most of that happening now.

we shouldnt have had veteran ranks on the first day, we shouldnt have had so much gold in the game that so many have the fast mount the first few days. Its borked. It'll only get worse with time

You new to mmo's?

Serious question.

Jenasy

The game as many things to do. If u don't like the PVP dont do it... I think the mass pvp is fun. I also think it will be even more fun when I am 50. I do think it would be a good idea for Zenimax to implement some smaller 10 vs 10 and/or arena type PVP as well. I suspect if many ppl ask for it. In time you will see it. Give it time.. I am a big believer this game will ONLY get better

LadyChaos

Players gotta start embracing their death and uttter humiliation a little more IMO to enjoy PvP. It's supposed to be hard and frustrating so that when you win a 1v1, a keep, a small skirmish, it is GLORIOUS!

I remember the details of the first time I won 1v1 out in the world trying to trek across the land to catch up to my party... I had lost every single other one ever and expected to die this time but I pulled up my skirts and let loose my lightning... the world was going black around the edges, I couldn't find him he was bobbing and weaving, and it was just a matter of my lightning form ticking one more time before he got me that I was the one who got to get to the big battle field.

Until you are the one who is the seasoned battle veteran, you should be the one who loses .. a lot... and then some more...
It makes getting there feel like an accomplishment you paid for in a lot of your own blood and tears, not just a time sink that you got for getting to level 10.

---

Magischzwei wrote: »

And yes, it is chaotic. Battle is chaos.

QFE

LilMcGinley

I've begun to forget how many times enemy groups have had to use multiple siege and triple our numbers in order to remove us from the battlefield.. we ran with 9 people last night and 12-15 throughout the week.

THIS is the fun; THIS is the challenge...

apterous

few tips to op: DON'T RUSH INTO BATTLE THAT YOU CLEARLY SEE THAT YOU CANT WIN.

Nazarousb14_ESO

At level ten I soloed several 50s.
The game scales you up and honestly I think it over scales you a bit.
Here is a tip keep your cross hairs on your target, if you don't your abilities will not come off or will hit the wrong target.

TheOnix

Nazarousb14_ESO wrote: »

At level ten I soloed several 50s.
The game scales you up and honestly I think it over scales you a bit.
Here is a tip keep your cross hairs on your target, if you don't your abilities will not come off or will hit the wrong target.

Just because you don't see your allies helping you doesn't mean that you "Solo'd several 50s at level 10". lol

Magischzwei

apterous wrote: »

few tips to op: DON'T RUSH INTO BATTLE THAT YOU CLEARLY SEE THAT YOU CANT WIN.

small tip for the pvp system: dont force people into battles they cannot win as the only option to pvp.

The amount of fanboyism and stupidity displayed in this topic makes me question human sanity as a whole.

Antonie

PvP is not all about being able to fight other players. You can defend/take a castle or any resource point. Have you tried to do that? You are able to participate by using any siege engine for such purpose and without having to fight straight on. Use your brains and do not join random "Zergs".

orchiddebale

i jumped in pvp when i was around level 20. i noticed, that players above me are simply stronger (as it should be). so i had a few funny hours in it. hell i was also online, when DC crowned his first emperor in EU on our campaign, how cool.

but i decided to level up my char first, before i go back to cyrodil. if you dont understand that , this must be your first mmo.

high level players dont just have bether gear or weapons, they (usually) also have a bether knowledge about theyr class and game mechanism. sorry to tell you that, but size maters

kedz54

Magischzwei wrote: »

The fun in an MMO comes from the rewards, and indeed, if it wasn't for the nice overall other game, I would have left by now.

There is two things that really need to be fixed by the game in order to make it competitive for the future:

- a normal and good pvp system (involing no npcs, no siege weapons and decent rewards)
- a fair and customizable interface that gives you access to all information you need including enemy damage, debuffs and cast bars.

I can live without both of the above mentioned. Why is that? I'll tell you:

- This works just fine. Don't wait around for ZoS to cater to you. Plenty of people in DAOC found ways to have small, meaningful PVP without Mythic intervening. I guess I'm just an old school MMO player and don't need gear via PVP.
- There's nothing unfair about the interface. I don't need to see an enemy's cast bar. It's stupid.

apterous

i'm a fanboy becouse i can play without whining and dying all the time?
edit: let me tell you how i do it. no addons, no guild to back me up. started pvp around lvl 20, now lvl 49 and i'm in top 5 in my alliance in that campaign. did i mention low populated campaign that was not in my alliances favor when i started.

Magischzwei

kedz54 wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

The fun in an MMO comes from the rewards, and indeed, if it wasn't for the nice overall other game, I would have left by now.

There is two things that really need to be fixed by the game in order to make it competitive for the future:

- a normal and good pvp system (involing no npcs, no siege weapons and decent rewards)
- a fair and customizable interface that gives you access to all information you need including enemy damage, debuffs and cast bars.

I can live without both of the above mentioned. Why is that? I'll tell you:

- This works just fine. Don't wait around for ZoS to cater to you. Plenty of people in DAOC found ways to have small, meaningful PVP without Mythic intervening. I guess I'm just an old school MMO player and don't need gear via PVP.
- There's nothing unfair about the interface. I don't need to see an enemy's cast bar. It's stupid.

So you like beeing taken out with no chance of recourse because the animation to a cast didn't trigger (seems to happen 50% of the time)

So you like having no indication that you get stunned because once again the bloody animation is screwed?

I would be fine with the combat clues when they would actually work. As of right now, they don't at least half of the time for any given situation



ng n

apterous

i believe that if you get stunned, you can't move. that very much tells me that i'm stunned.

Magischzwei

apterous wrote: »

i believe that if you get stunned, you can't move. that very much tells me that i'm stunned.

Yeah but there is several pieces of info missing in that:

- How long am I stunned?
- Am I actually stunned, or just immobilzed, or silenced?
- What effect stunned me?

apterous

that info you should be able tell just by looking at the screen. and without the help of addons. can't do it? not my problem.

MysticAura

They really need separate areas set to level ranges, as well as some limiter in place to not allow high level to jump on low level. While the naturalization was 'possibly' good on paper, it's fundamentally flawed in practice. It's definitely not encouraging to people.

I know some people enjoy the free for all, and beating up little people with no limits, but I really do think that if lower levels could train in areas fitting to them, they'd create a much more fulfilling hunt, than two shotting some poor new person who just wanted to learn, help and have fun.

apterous

let me repeat, when i went to pvp first time i was lvl 22, and i killed veterans as easy as any other. it's about skill.

apterous

1 more thing, the more skilled opponent i get to fight, the more i will enjoy the fight. i don't get why you dont.

Grim13

@#$% Last Stand! It's an awful game design decision!

LilMcGinley

MysticAura wrote: »

They really need separate areas set to level ranges, as well as some limiter in place to not allow high level to jump on low level. While the naturalization was 'possibly' good on paper, it's fundamentally flawed in practice. It's definitely not encouraging to people.

I know some people enjoy the free for all, and beating up little people with no limits, but I really do think that if lower levels could train in areas fitting to them, they'd create a much more fulfilling hunt, than two shotting some poor new person who just wanted to learn, help and have fun.

I'm trying to remember a time in history when a more skilled army wasn't allowed to fight another army..

"Sorry <country> you can't invade us right now because aren't as skilled as you. Please, come back later."

War is War.

Deddarus

I'd like to start by saying that i suck at pvp

That said, i have had some awesome fun in cyrodill. I've taken a few different alts in there with different playstyles and have found a way to be productive and have fun with each of them (highest lvl char is 12)

on some of them i did die a lot, and repeatedly but that was down to the tactics i chose. i could have chosen other tactics that would keep me alive longer but they didnt have the same appeal.

for example, i took my nightblade out for a spin and quickly got into a keep defense. I decided my role would be a saboteur... i would sneak out a side door, skirt around the enemy force and up to their seige weapons setting them on fire. A lot of the time this resulted in 20 people jumping me and turning me into a bloody squish on the ground. But it was still great fun... especially with one treb where as soon as i lit it, someone put the fire out and then went hunting around trying to find me..... i spent 5 minutes dodging around, staying hidden and as soon as his back was turned setting it on fire again .... you could see his frustration and annoyance at not being able to find me .. was hilarious

bit of a tangent, but my point is... yes, if you go rushing in blindly against a vet ranked player you will die.. a lot ... but if you recognize your limitations and take them into account when devising tactics you can stay alive for quite a while

also had a small group of vets stealthed, ambushing people on the way to a keep ... ppl were complaining ... my solution, simply take a different route than the obvious straight-line route .... not rocket science

Phoenix99

L2P,

Carry gems with you, to revive other players and they will also revive you.

Learn by practice your map awareness and positioning in combat.

Use weapon swap - use it a lot. If you have only melee weapon in your inventory, you deserve to die A LOT.

Pack some CC skills, stun, snare, immobilize.

Do not blow all of your stamina instantly. Keep some for breaking CC and blocking.

Use block, to mitigate dmg and protect from CC skills.

You can really have impact in all stages and at all levels. Just pick your skills smart, use siege equipment, and carry grand soul gems to revive teammates. On top of that learn not to over extend and anticipate common gank spots (usually they wait for lone travelers between fight and spawn spot).

sSolutionSs

Magischzwei wrote: »

Topics in the forums is how you drive change. And in my opinion, and thats all it can really be, either the game will change to suit a more variable audience better or die off and go p2w after a while.

True story here. Maybe not all go p2w to die but they go atleast f2p