madmufffin wrote: »YandereGirlfriend wrote: »GloatingSwine wrote: »But that's exactly what I'm proposing, damage for casting it, you'd actually need to use it, it should definitely not give you free damage for just being slotted.GloatingSwine wrote: »There are better ways to deal with Grim Focus passitivity rather than just completely removing the Weapon/Spell damage, this will hit pure NBs the hardest.
Making so the damage is only granted after firing the bow would be a much better approach, even if at the expense of a lower value.
People keep saying this but no other class has 400 weapon/spell damage that it can just sit on forever on a class line that already has really good offensive passives.
People will slot and use Grim Focus now when they actually want to use Grim Focus. Imagine that, slotting a skill to actually cast it!
I do agree that 400 is too much though, that's why I said "at the expense of a lower value."
I'm just not convinced that Nightblade is so weak it needs an extra source of weapon/spell damage at all. Especially not on Assassination, the skill line that everyone is still going to take as a subclass line.
It's because it isn't. Folk are just used to that line and singular ability being wildly OP and want to keep it that way. Sometimes nerfs are justified (but also usual wise caveats that other lines also need buffs because everyone is STILL going to be passively running Assass even after the Bowproc nerf as the passives are just that overloaded).
Most beam builds will likely swap Assassination for either Ardent Flame or Aedric Spear next patch if things go down this route, Assassination passivity isn't good enough to outperform other options if you're not using at least 3 skills from the kit, which beam builds can't do super well, but I could be wrong.
Excuse me? Assasination that gives you 10% crit damage, minor savagery, 7% crit chance while flanking, and 2.5% crit chance per skill from the line doesn't have good passives?
madmufffin wrote: »YandereGirlfriend wrote: »GloatingSwine wrote: »But that's exactly what I'm proposing, damage for casting it, you'd actually need to use it, it should definitely not give you free damage for just being slotted.GloatingSwine wrote: »There are better ways to deal with Grim Focus passitivity rather than just completely removing the Weapon/Spell damage, this will hit pure NBs the hardest.
Making so the damage is only granted after firing the bow would be a much better approach, even if at the expense of a lower value.
People keep saying this but no other class has 400 weapon/spell damage that it can just sit on forever on a class line that already has really good offensive passives.
People will slot and use Grim Focus now when they actually want to use Grim Focus. Imagine that, slotting a skill to actually cast it!
I do agree that 400 is too much though, that's why I said "at the expense of a lower value."
I'm just not convinced that Nightblade is so weak it needs an extra source of weapon/spell damage at all. Especially not on Assassination, the skill line that everyone is still going to take as a subclass line.
It's because it isn't. Folk are just used to that line and singular ability being wildly OP and want to keep it that way. Sometimes nerfs are justified (but also usual wise caveats that other lines also need buffs because everyone is STILL going to be passively running Assass even after the Bowproc nerf as the passives are just that overloaded).
Most beam builds will likely swap Assassination for either Ardent Flame or Aedric Spear next patch if things go down this route, Assassination passivity isn't good enough to outperform other options if you're not using at least 3 skills from the kit, which beam builds can't do super well, but I could be wrong.
Excuse me? Assasination that gives you 10% crit damage, minor savagery, 7% crit chance while flanking, and 2.5% crit chance per skill from the line doesn't have good passives?
That's not what I said, Assassination on live has such a passive potential due to Relentless Focus giving you 400 W/S Damage while just on the backbar, on top of the already good passives you mentioned, yes.
Thing is, with that W/S Damage going away, it's very likely that most Arcanists will swap out to Ardent Flame so they can run things that better support a beam build, like Claw and FoO, Assa passives alone won't outperform that, and most of its skills require active usage, which doesn't work well with beam.
I am just assuming based on the latest parses I'm seeing though, haven't really parsed on beam this PTS.
madmufffin wrote: »YandereGirlfriend wrote: »GloatingSwine wrote: »But that's exactly what I'm proposing, damage for casting it, you'd actually need to use it, it should definitely not give you free damage for just being slotted.GloatingSwine wrote: »There are better ways to deal with Grim Focus passitivity rather than just completely removing the Weapon/Spell damage, this will hit pure NBs the hardest.
Making so the damage is only granted after firing the bow would be a much better approach, even if at the expense of a lower value.
People keep saying this but no other class has 400 weapon/spell damage that it can just sit on forever on a class line that already has really good offensive passives.
People will slot and use Grim Focus now when they actually want to use Grim Focus. Imagine that, slotting a skill to actually cast it!
I do agree that 400 is too much though, that's why I said "at the expense of a lower value."
I'm just not convinced that Nightblade is so weak it needs an extra source of weapon/spell damage at all. Especially not on Assassination, the skill line that everyone is still going to take as a subclass line.
It's because it isn't. Folk are just used to that line and singular ability being wildly OP and want to keep it that way. Sometimes nerfs are justified (but also usual wise caveats that other lines also need buffs because everyone is STILL going to be passively running Assass even after the Bowproc nerf as the passives are just that overloaded).
Most beam builds will likely swap Assassination for either Ardent Flame or Aedric Spear next patch if things go down this route, Assassination passivity isn't good enough to outperform other options if you're not using at least 3 skills from the kit, which beam builds can't do super well, but I could be wrong.
Excuse me? Assasination that gives you 10% crit damage, minor savagery, 7% crit chance while flanking, and 2.5% crit chance per skill from the line doesn't have good passives?
That's not what I said, Assassination on live has such a passive potential due to Relentless Focus giving you 400 W/S Damage while just on the backbar, on top of the already good passives you mentioned, yes.
Thing is, with that W/S Damage going away, it's very likely that most Arcanists will swap out to Ardent Flame so they can run things that better support a beam build, like Claw and FoO, Assa passives alone won't outperform that, and most of its skills require active usage, which doesn't work well with beam.
I am just assuming based on the latest parses I'm seeing though, haven't really parsed on beam this PTS.
Renato90085 wrote: »madmufffin wrote: »YandereGirlfriend wrote: »GloatingSwine wrote: »But that's exactly what I'm proposing, damage for casting it, you'd actually need to use it, it should definitely not give you free damage for just being slotted.GloatingSwine wrote: »There are better ways to deal with Grim Focus passitivity rather than just completely removing the Weapon/Spell damage, this will hit pure NBs the hardest.
Making so the damage is only granted after firing the bow would be a much better approach, even if at the expense of a lower value.
People keep saying this but no other class has 400 weapon/spell damage that it can just sit on forever on a class line that already has really good offensive passives.
People will slot and use Grim Focus now when they actually want to use Grim Focus. Imagine that, slotting a skill to actually cast it!
I do agree that 400 is too much though, that's why I said "at the expense of a lower value."
I'm just not convinced that Nightblade is so weak it needs an extra source of weapon/spell damage at all. Especially not on Assassination, the skill line that everyone is still going to take as a subclass line.
It's because it isn't. Folk are just used to that line and singular ability being wildly OP and want to keep it that way. Sometimes nerfs are justified (but also usual wise caveats that other lines also need buffs because everyone is STILL going to be passively running Assass even after the Bowproc nerf as the passives are just that overloaded).
Most beam builds will likely swap Assassination for either Ardent Flame or Aedric Spear next patch if things go down this route, Assassination passivity isn't good enough to outperform other options if you're not using at least 3 skills from the kit, which beam builds can't do super well, but I could be wrong.
Excuse me? Assasination that gives you 10% crit damage, minor savagery, 7% crit chance while flanking, and 2.5% crit chance per skill from the line doesn't have good passives?
That's not what I said, Assassination on live has such a passive potential due to Relentless Focus giving you 400 W/S Damage while just on the backbar, on top of the already good passives you mentioned, yes.
Thing is, with that W/S Damage going away, it's very likely that most Arcanists will swap out to Ardent Flame so they can run things that better support a beam build, like Claw and FoO, Assa passives alone won't outperform that, and most of its skills require active usage, which doesn't work well with beam.
I am just assuming based on the latest parses I'm seeing though, haven't really parsed on beam this PTS.
hope they not remove dk 300 wd too
madmufffin wrote: »madmufffin wrote: »YandereGirlfriend wrote: »GloatingSwine wrote: »But that's exactly what I'm proposing, damage for casting it, you'd actually need to use it, it should definitely not give you free damage for just being slotted.GloatingSwine wrote: »There are better ways to deal with Grim Focus passitivity rather than just completely removing the Weapon/Spell damage, this will hit pure NBs the hardest.
Making so the damage is only granted after firing the bow would be a much better approach, even if at the expense of a lower value.
People keep saying this but no other class has 400 weapon/spell damage that it can just sit on forever on a class line that already has really good offensive passives.
People will slot and use Grim Focus now when they actually want to use Grim Focus. Imagine that, slotting a skill to actually cast it!
I do agree that 400 is too much though, that's why I said "at the expense of a lower value."
I'm just not convinced that Nightblade is so weak it needs an extra source of weapon/spell damage at all. Especially not on Assassination, the skill line that everyone is still going to take as a subclass line.
It's because it isn't. Folk are just used to that line and singular ability being wildly OP and want to keep it that way. Sometimes nerfs are justified (but also usual wise caveats that other lines also need buffs because everyone is STILL going to be passively running Assass even after the Bowproc nerf as the passives are just that overloaded).
Most beam builds will likely swap Assassination for either Ardent Flame or Aedric Spear next patch if things go down this route, Assassination passivity isn't good enough to outperform other options if you're not using at least 3 skills from the kit, which beam builds can't do super well, but I could be wrong.
Excuse me? Assasination that gives you 10% crit damage, minor savagery, 7% crit chance while flanking, and 2.5% crit chance per skill from the line doesn't have good passives?
That's not what I said, Assassination on live has such a passive potential due to Relentless Focus giving you 400 W/S Damage while just on the backbar, on top of the already good passives you mentioned, yes.
Thing is, with that W/S Damage going away, it's very likely that most Arcanists will swap out to Ardent Flame so they can run things that better support a beam build, like Claw and FoO, Assa passives alone won't outperform that, and most of its skills require active usage, which doesn't work well with beam.
I am just assuming based on the latest parses I'm seeing though, haven't really parsed on beam this PTS.
People already run Herald/Assassination/Ardent in most content. Assassination having the strongest passives in the game means it's an auto-slot even without the weapon damage from grim focus.
Renato90085 wrote: »madmufffin wrote: »YandereGirlfriend wrote: »GloatingSwine wrote: »But that's exactly what I'm proposing, damage for casting it, you'd actually need to use it, it should definitely not give you free damage for just being slotted.GloatingSwine wrote: »There are better ways to deal with Grim Focus passitivity rather than just completely removing the Weapon/Spell damage, this will hit pure NBs the hardest.
Making so the damage is only granted after firing the bow would be a much better approach, even if at the expense of a lower value.
People keep saying this but no other class has 400 weapon/spell damage that it can just sit on forever on a class line that already has really good offensive passives.
People will slot and use Grim Focus now when they actually want to use Grim Focus. Imagine that, slotting a skill to actually cast it!
I do agree that 400 is too much though, that's why I said "at the expense of a lower value."
I'm just not convinced that Nightblade is so weak it needs an extra source of weapon/spell damage at all. Especially not on Assassination, the skill line that everyone is still going to take as a subclass line.
It's because it isn't. Folk are just used to that line and singular ability being wildly OP and want to keep it that way. Sometimes nerfs are justified (but also usual wise caveats that other lines also need buffs because everyone is STILL going to be passively running Assass even after the Bowproc nerf as the passives are just that overloaded).
Most beam builds will likely swap Assassination for either Ardent Flame or Aedric Spear next patch if things go down this route, Assassination passivity isn't good enough to outperform other options if you're not using at least 3 skills from the kit, which beam builds can't do super well, but I could be wrong.
Excuse me? Assasination that gives you 10% crit damage, minor savagery, 7% crit chance while flanking, and 2.5% crit chance per skill from the line doesn't have good passives?
That's not what I said, Assassination on live has such a passive potential due to Relentless Focus giving you 400 W/S Damage while just on the backbar, on top of the already good passives you mentioned, yes.
Thing is, with that W/S Damage going away, it's very likely that most Arcanists will swap out to Ardent Flame so they can run things that better support a beam build, like Claw and FoO, Assa passives alone won't outperform that, and most of its skills require active usage, which doesn't work well with beam.
I am just assuming based on the latest parses I'm seeing though, haven't really parsed on beam this PTS.
hope they not remove dk 300 wd too
Unlikely, to properly build up those 300 W/S Damage it needs 2-3 other skills, plus, it has a duration, Grim Focus gives you more damage for just light attacking and they last forever, it's way too much on a single skill.
I do still think they should have toned Focus back to pre-U46 and made it only pop W/S Damage after casting arrow, through a very short duration, that would reward weaving it and render it unusable for anyone using it passively.madmufffin wrote: »madmufffin wrote: »YandereGirlfriend wrote: »GloatingSwine wrote: »But that's exactly what I'm proposing, damage for casting it, you'd actually need to use it, it should definitely not give you free damage for just being slotted.GloatingSwine wrote: »There are better ways to deal with Grim Focus passitivity rather than just completely removing the Weapon/Spell damage, this will hit pure NBs the hardest.
Making so the damage is only granted after firing the bow would be a much better approach, even if at the expense of a lower value.
People keep saying this but no other class has 400 weapon/spell damage that it can just sit on forever on a class line that already has really good offensive passives.
People will slot and use Grim Focus now when they actually want to use Grim Focus. Imagine that, slotting a skill to actually cast it!
I do agree that 400 is too much though, that's why I said "at the expense of a lower value."
I'm just not convinced that Nightblade is so weak it needs an extra source of weapon/spell damage at all. Especially not on Assassination, the skill line that everyone is still going to take as a subclass line.
It's because it isn't. Folk are just used to that line and singular ability being wildly OP and want to keep it that way. Sometimes nerfs are justified (but also usual wise caveats that other lines also need buffs because everyone is STILL going to be passively running Assass even after the Bowproc nerf as the passives are just that overloaded).
Most beam builds will likely swap Assassination for either Ardent Flame or Aedric Spear next patch if things go down this route, Assassination passivity isn't good enough to outperform other options if you're not using at least 3 skills from the kit, which beam builds can't do super well, but I could be wrong.
Excuse me? Assasination that gives you 10% crit damage, minor savagery, 7% crit chance while flanking, and 2.5% crit chance per skill from the line doesn't have good passives?
That's not what I said, Assassination on live has such a passive potential due to Relentless Focus giving you 400 W/S Damage while just on the backbar, on top of the already good passives you mentioned, yes.
Thing is, with that W/S Damage going away, it's very likely that most Arcanists will swap out to Ardent Flame so they can run things that better support a beam build, like Claw and FoO, Assa passives alone won't outperform that, and most of its skills require active usage, which doesn't work well with beam.
I am just assuming based on the latest parses I'm seeing though, haven't really parsed on beam this PTS.
People already run Herald/Assassination/Ardent in most content. Assassination having the strongest passives in the game means it's an auto-slot even without the weapon damage from grim focus.
On live running Dawn's Wrath on Beam builds is more common than Ardent, you're ignoring the fact that outside of Grim Focus giving W/S Damage, the whole Assassination line is counterintuitive to run on a Beam build.
They can't afford to actively cast Grim Focus when they can't properly weave with Beam, Killer's Blade isn't that great when you have Radiant Glory/Opression which they're already running, the only really useful skill for them would be Soul Harvest/Incap.
Slotting skills they can't actively use due to Beam just for free passives isn't going to outperform an Arcanist running Ardent with Claw and FoO on U47.
Again, I'm talking about U47, it's undeniable that Assassination is the BiS line on U46 for any setup, but for beam builds, Molten Whip will very likely take Grim Focus place, the best beam parses on PTS I've seen ALL replaced Assa for Ardent, and if you actually want to run a line purely for passives, Aedric Spear is just better for that.
YandereGirlfriend wrote: »It remains bewildering why they changed the NB Pen passive, which had zero implications for PvE power-creep, into Crit Chance, the most coveted damage stat in the game and a direct and obvious driver of PvE power-creep. Makes zero sense.
ArctosCethlenn wrote: »Shadow is in such a sad state, the skills are niche at best and the only really good reasons to run it are
1) you want to have invisibility
2) uncapped fear
the rest is extremely situational. Why ever take shadow as a defensive line over restoring, winter, soldier, etc, there's nothing in it that makes a tank go "this skill is amazing and useful and I want to build to use it".
I appreciate the changes to Northern Storm in U46, but now I wonder if it could be improved some more. Perhaps it can be turned into a purely offensive skill? The Major Protection buff could then be dropped in exchange for e.g. a longer lasting DoT. It would make the skill more useful for damage dealers in PvE, and it would also make the morphs of Sleet Storm more distinctive from each other.
Maybe losing the major prot could justify giving it more damage. It'd be nice to see NB's veil of blades also get some love.madmufffin wrote: »Northern storm giving ele rage levels of damage for 200 less ult would be nice. The archetype desperately needs some love.
I appreciate the changes to Northern Storm in U46, but now I wonder if it could be improved some more. Perhaps it can be turned into a purely offensive skill? The Major Protection buff could then be dropped in exchange for e.g. a longer lasting DoT. It would make the skill more useful for damage dealers in PvE, and it would also make the morphs of Sleet Storm more distinctive from each other.
It'd be nice to see NB's veil of blades also get some love.madmufffin wrote: »Northern storm giving ele rage levels of damage for 200 less ult would be nice. The archetype desperately needs some love.
I appreciate the changes to Northern Storm in U46, but now I wonder if it could be improved some more. Perhaps it can be turned into a purely offensive skill? The Major Protection buff could then be dropped in exchange for e.g. a longer lasting DoT. It would make the skill more useful for damage dealers in PvE, and it would also make the morphs of Sleet Storm more distinctive from each other.
Permafrost needs to be looked at as well. Another source of major brittle would thematically fit the skill and put it closer to other support ultimates.
madmufffin wrote: »I appreciate the changes to Northern Storm in U46, but now I wonder if it could be improved some more. Perhaps it can be turned into a purely offensive skill? The Major Protection buff could then be dropped in exchange for e.g. a longer lasting DoT. It would make the skill more useful for damage dealers in PvE, and it would also make the morphs of Sleet Storm more distinctive from each other.
Permafrost needs to be looked at as well. Another source of major brittle would thematically fit the skill and put it closer to other support ultimates.
Or major berserk
madmufffin wrote: »I appreciate the changes to Northern Storm in U46, but now I wonder if it could be improved some more. Perhaps it can be turned into a purely offensive skill? The Major Protection buff could then be dropped in exchange for e.g. a longer lasting DoT. It would make the skill more useful for damage dealers in PvE, and it would also make the morphs of Sleet Storm more distinctive from each other.
Permafrost needs to be looked at as well. Another source of major brittle would thematically fit the skill and put it closer to other support ultimates.
Or major berserk
I think major brittle is better. Berserk is unique to DK chains on a single non-ulti ability without any other requirements.
Brittle fits with an ice themed subclass.