Overland Content Feedback Thread

disky

LaintalAy wrote: »

RaptorRodeoGod wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

It has yet to occur to some people that maybe they have met 'end game' conditions.

Buy a new account and start again. At least then you'll see why not everyone wants (or needs) a harder overland.

Sounds good in theory, but someone who has "met endgame conditions" will never be able to shed muscle memory and game skill knowledge. Yes, they can start over on a new account - but they're still going to know exactly how to kill pretty much everything as easily and quickly as possible....

Yeah its basically the same as not slotting cp when leveling a new character. Slightly harder, but not that difficult.

If they're so against making overland optionally more difficult for those that want it, they need to find a different method to make it more engaging. The story isn't enough for the group of people that think the overland combat is too easy.

Some people don't realise that they have finished the game. The rest of us might not have.

It's not even about that. Overland is so egregiously easy that a brand-new character with basic gear (or no gear!) and no CP can defeat most overland enemies without much worry. Overland is rated for a character that has nothing and a player that knows nothing. There is no way to scale up for anyone who has any kind of gear, skills or experience, and that is a missed opportunity. People in this thread are simply asking for that to be rectified.

vsrs_au

disky wrote: »

Overland is so egregiously easy that a brand-new character with basic gear (or no gear!) and no CP can defeat most overland enemies without much worry.

Sorry, but that's just wrong. There are plenty of ESO players who, for various reasons (lack of coordination or skill, age, physical issues, etc.), find some overland enemies pretty challenging. I remember trying on a troll in W Skyrim 3 years ago when I first started the game on a new character, and it was some time before I tried that again, because it just owned me.

With respect, you're just assuming everyone has your level of combat skill, but ESO players have a wide variation in combat skills (there's plenty of evidence of that in previous threads on this forum).

disky

vsrs_au wrote: »

disky wrote: »

Overland is so egregiously easy that a brand-new character with basic gear (or no gear!) and no CP can defeat most overland enemies without much worry.

Sorry, but that's just wrong. There are plenty of ESO players who, for various reasons (lack of coordination or skill, age, physical issues, etc.), find some overland enemies pretty challenging. I remember trying on a troll in W Skyrim 3 years ago when I first started the game on a new character, and it was some time before I tried that again, because it just owned me.

With respect, you're just assuming everyone has your level of combat skill, but ESO players have a wide variation in combat skills (there's plenty of evidence of that in previous threads on this forum).

I'm not saying those players don't exist and I have acknowledged the variety of player skill levels in ESO in responses to this thread. I'm not ignoring that. But if you're a person who regularly plays other games of this type, then the skill floor for this game's overland content is far too low.

A page or two ago, a couple of videos were posted which showed a character standing still and allowing their basic health regeneration to mitigate all damage from an overland enemy. If that's not a stark indication of a lack of challenge then I don't know what is. And to be clear, if it isn't already, I don't want the experience for those players to change in any way. I feel like this discussion has been had more than once.

colossalvoids

vsrs_au wrote: »

disky wrote: »

Overland is so egregiously easy that a brand-new character with basic gear (or no gear!) and no CP can defeat most overland enemies without much worry.

Sorry, but that's just wrong. There are plenty of ESO players who, for various reasons (lack of coordination or skill, age, physical issues, etc.), find some overland enemies pretty challenging. I remember trying on a troll in W Skyrim 3 years ago when I first started the game on a new character, and it was some time before I tried that again, because it just owned me.

With respect, you're just assuming everyone has your level of combat skill, but ESO players have a wide variation in combat skills (there's plenty of evidence of that in previous threads on this forum).

There are always outliers in any scenario, but we've been explicitly told that overland questing is balanced around brand new players since One Tamriel. Not sure that death to trolls is a common new player experience (wasn't mine at least), but for some anything might be the case undeniably and there's no workaround for it. It would be actually a good thing if that was the case generally, as people should expect dying in a game where you conquer content by repeatedly dying and learning the pattern. It shouldn't not be a late game shock as it might be another quit moment, when you had expectations set by first tens of hours and be crushed afterwards doing your first arena or something in the way.

casparian

colossalvoids wrote: »

we've been explicitly told that overland questing is balanced around brand new players

The problem is that there is no way to do all of the overland quests as a brand new player. You are inevitably going to progress as you move through the game -- your gear gets better, you get access to new systems and skill lines that give you more power, you start to gain CP, and you just get better at the game. My early-game questing experience was fine, but by the time I made it a few zones into the story, I was starting to wonder why enemies weren't continuing to provide a challenge, even as they got more dangerous and scary in terms of their lore.

I understand that ZOS wants people to be able to buy the newest expansion and start playing it immediately. They probably think something like "questing is for new players, then we hook them with endgame systems like housing and group content". This would work if you could do all of the questing as a new player, but the quest content is hundreds and hundreds of hours long. So if you want to actually play all of the quest content in the game, you spend most of your time in this weird null-progress zone where none of the character-building you're doing (making your character stronger) actually interacts with the game system you're trying to engage with (quests).

colossalvoids

casparian wrote: »

colossalvoids wrote: »

we've been explicitly told that overland questing is balanced around brand new players

The problem is that there is no way to do all of the overland quests as a brand new player. You are inevitably going to progress as you move through the game -- your gear gets better, you get access to new systems and skill lines that give you more power, you start to gain CP, and you just get better at the game. My early-game questing experience was fine, but by the time I made it a few zones into the story, I was starting to wonder why enemies weren't continuing to provide a challenge, even as they got more dangerous and scary in terms of their lore.

I understand that ZOS wants people to be able to buy the newest expansion and start playing it immediately. They probably think something like "questing is for new players, then we hook them with endgame systems like housing and group content". This would work if you could do all of the questing as a new player, but the quest content is hundreds and hundreds of hours long. So if you want to actually play all of the quest content in the game, you spend most of your time in this weird null-progress zone where none of the character-building you're doing (making your character stronger) actually interacts with the game system you're trying to engage with (quests).

Yes, I agree. Personally I've started as a total newbie to MMOs and ended my last quest as an "end game" player, which made my later experience... Let's just say less memorable and bland. I went miles convincing myself to finish Necrom, it was way harder task mentally than doing worst trifectas out there. Especially when I was playing Elden Ring simultaneously...

Arrodisia

I'd be interested to have all PvE content in this game in 2 or 3 modes as follows the current normal mode, plus vet mode, and possibly the 3rd HC Vet mode with a toggle. In the HC vet mode we shouldn't be able to summon companions anywhere outside of a city, we should have 10 min ultimate cds, 30 min cd on major and minor buffs, and a 10 min cd on all potions and no speed buffs on mounts or characters to run past mobs and no legendaries...

I'm only interested if the changes are optional and If it's going to break the game, I'm not interested at all. I can do the gazillion hm dungeons and trials already available or jump back into PvP if I want a challenge. How much challenge do I need? I already have a job. I don't need another one during my free time.

Now, let's view this from the devs perspective too. It's a massive endeavour to make changes like these. We'll most likely lose multiple DLC cycles. This may be something they might consider when they have a larger team in the future and when a much larger portion of the player base is interested.

I completely understand their hesitation, because the majority of players won't participate. It also divides the players further. Plus, other games have tried this and failed hard. Their current model of releasing new content almost every quarter works for them. In the end, the devs have to decide if it's worth their resources.

Releasing 2 or 3 modes will either be the death of ESO if designed and coded poorly or it'll be the sprinkles on the sundae because some players will have a bit more to play. The wrong decision and/or the wrong execution could cost them dearly.

The points, made by some earlier, still stand. They aren't going to create something just to prove it won't be as well received as some of us hope.They aren't going create a system which could destroy what has been working well enough for the majority.

As far as rewards go plus 10% gold per higher difficulty for the extra repairs, and a title or achievement for completing each region in another mode, nothing else. It should be all about the fun baked into the challenge. If it isn't already enticing, no reward will make it more fun.

Uvi_AUT

vsrs_au wrote: »

disky wrote: »

Overland is so egregiously easy that a brand-new character with basic gear (or no gear!) and no CP can defeat most overland enemies without much worry.

Sorry, but that's just wrong. There are plenty of ESO players who, for various reasons (lack of coordination or skill, age, physical issues, etc.), find some overland enemies pretty challenging. I remember trying on a troll in W Skyrim 3 years ago when I first started the game on a new character, and it was some time before I tried that again, because it just owned me.

With respect, you're just assuming everyone has your level of combat skill, but ESO players have a wide variation in combat skills (there's plenty of evidence of that in previous threads on this forum).

No. Just no. You can Leftclick everything in Overlandcontent to death with even the simplest of builds (Green Gear).
The difficulty of the whole game shouldnt be made around the few people who cant even leftclick. Sorry, but thats the way it is.

vsrs_au

Uvi_AUT wrote: »

vsrs_au wrote: »

disky wrote: »

Overland is so egregiously easy that a brand-new character with basic gear (or no gear!) and no CP can defeat most overland enemies without much worry.

Sorry, but that's just wrong. There are plenty of ESO players who, for various reasons (lack of coordination or skill, age, physical issues, etc.), find some overland enemies pretty challenging. I remember trying on a troll in W Skyrim 3 years ago when I first started the game on a new character, and it was some time before I tried that again, because it just owned me.

With respect, you're just assuming everyone has your level of combat skill, but ESO players have a wide variation in combat skills (there's plenty of evidence of that in previous threads on this forum).

No. Just no. You can Leftclick everything in Overlandcontent to death with even the simplest of builds (Green Gear).
The difficulty of the whole game shouldnt be made around the few people who cant even leftclick. Sorry, but thats the way it is.

No, you're just assuming everyone plays like you do, whereas my post was saying that ESO players have a wide range of skills (and physical abilities). People are different, and my post was pointing that out. That's exactly why a lot of people are posting on this thread arguing for any overland difficulty change to be optional.

RaptorRodeoGod

Realistically, there's no reason the gap between the floor and the ceiling needs to be as enormous as it is in regards to damage. A gap should exist for the feeling of progressing in power, but not to the extent that it exists now.

Uvi_AUT

vsrs_au wrote: »

No, you're just assuming everyone plays like you do, whereas my post was saying that ESO players have a wide range of skills (and physical abilities). People are different, and my post was pointing that out. That's exactly why a lot of people are posting on this thread arguing for any overland difficulty change to be optional.

Sigh... Its not a playstyle, its LEFTCLICKING! There is no playstyle involved. Its that easy. There is no arguing about it. It has been tested extensively.

disky

Uvi_AUT wrote: »

vsrs_au wrote: »

disky wrote: »

Overland is so egregiously easy that a brand-new character with basic gear (or no gear!) and no CP can defeat most overland enemies without much worry.

Sorry, but that's just wrong. There are plenty of ESO players who, for various reasons (lack of coordination or skill, age, physical issues, etc.), find some overland enemies pretty challenging. I remember trying on a troll in W Skyrim 3 years ago when I first started the game on a new character, and it was some time before I tried that again, because it just owned me.

With respect, you're just assuming everyone has your level of combat skill, but ESO players have a wide variation in combat skills (there's plenty of evidence of that in previous threads on this forum).

No. Just no. You can Leftclick everything in Overlandcontent to death with even the simplest of builds (Green Gear).
The difficulty of the whole game shouldnt be made around the few people who cant even leftclick. Sorry, but thats the way it is.

As someone who really wants to see ZOS deliver an option to increase the challenge, I think we have to accept that the game is built to accommodate a wide range of players. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Just because the game is missing something for us, that doesn't mean it can't also provide enjoyment for those who like what it is now.

It's frustrating that it's missing such an important component which is why we keep talking about it. However, that discussion doesn't have to be couched in an us/them context. In fact, the less we argue, the easier it will be to get more people of all perspectives to agree, and to actually encourage a change.

Nharimlur_Finor

RaptorRodeoGod wrote: »

Year 5 of waiting for more engaging overland since I first posted about it on the forums in some random post from 2019

and yet, here you are, still engaged with the current 'easy' overland.

RaptorRodeoGod

LaintalAy wrote: »

RaptorRodeoGod wrote: »

Year 5 of waiting for more engaging overland since I first posted about it on the forums in some random post from 2019

and yet, here you are, still engaged with the current 'easy' overland.

There have been several year long stories I have not completed, or have only completed once when leveling a new character. I would not call that engaging.

disky

RaptorRodeoGod wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

RaptorRodeoGod wrote: »

Year 5 of waiting for more engaging overland since I first posted about it on the forums in some random post from 2019

and yet, here you are, still engaged with the current 'easy' overland.

There have been several year long stories I have not completed, or have only completed once when leveling a new character. I would not call that engaging.

Same. I'm waiting for something to change before I get stuck in. I haven't played through Necrom and I'm not even buying Gold Road until I can feel some kind of satisfaction from completing the story.

Muizer

disky wrote: »

As someone who really wants to see ZOS deliver an option to increase the challenge, I think we have to accept that the game is built to accommodate a wide range of players. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Just because the game is missing something for us, that doesn't mean it can't also provide enjoyment for those who like what it is now.

It's frustrating that it's missing such an important component which is why we keep talking about it. However, that discussion doesn't have to be couched in an us/them context. In fact, the less we argue, the easier it will be to get more people of all perspectives to agree, and to actually encourage a change.

Then we're going to have to look for something other than tinkering with existing encounters. Apart from the evident difficulties that need to be overcome to not disrupt the experience of players who like them the way they are, there's the issue that it will be difficult for ZOS to sell it as new content. It's a high risk / little reward proposition.

I still think the best bet is with player-triggered encounters. The triggered encounters actually already exist in the game ("I'm sorry, they forced me to do it!" encounters). Tailoring such encounters to the player's chosen difficulty level is something that seems eminently doable and I'm sure ZOS could come up with a chapter theme for something like that.

disky

Muizer wrote: »

disky wrote: »

As someone who really wants to see ZOS deliver an option to increase the challenge, I think we have to accept that the game is built to accommodate a wide range of players. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Just because the game is missing something for us, that doesn't mean it can't also provide enjoyment for those who like what it is now.

It's frustrating that it's missing such an important component which is why we keep talking about it. However, that discussion doesn't have to be couched in an us/them context. In fact, the less we argue, the easier it will be to get more people of all perspectives to agree, and to actually encourage a change.

Then we're going to have to look for something other than tinkering with existing encounters. Apart from the evident difficulties that need to be overcome to not disrupt the experience of players who like them the way they are, there's the issue that it will be difficult for ZOS to sell it as new content. It's a high risk / little reward proposition.

I still think the best bet is with player-triggered encounters. The triggered encounters actually already exist in the game ("I'm sorry, they forced me to do it!" encounters). Tailoring such encounters to the player's chosen difficulty level is something that seems eminently doable and I'm sure ZOS could come up with a chapter theme for something like that.

The idea has been suggested before and I think that it could be really fun. However, I feel like the circumstances under which they occur would probably have to be completely out of the player's control and would need to have little or no impact on casual players, otherwise it could affect people who don't want to deal with them. Everything that goes into this has to be done with the knowledge that casuals don't want it. Whether you think their opinions matter or not, ZOS cares a great deal about them, and they're going to base their design choices around that perspective.

The design I've been banging on about wouldn't affect anyone other than the player who chooses to enable it, because it would essentially act as personal debuffs without any changes to encounters. I feel like this is the easiest and most likely solution if anything ever does happen.

RaptorRodeoGod

Since the devs seem pretty resistant to even implement optional difficulty, does anybody have any non-combat related ideas that could drive engagement in overland for those of us that think combat is not difficult?

I'd think puzzles would be a start, like the dungeon puzzles in Skyrim, which are absent from overland content, but that'd probably be pretty difficult to apply retroactively, and it probably would not be engaging enough on its own.

Maybe various dungeon/trial mechanics could be implemented in a way to slow down quest progress, instead of killing the player as they would in dungeon/trial content?

Or maybe they can add a new system that incentivizes players to continually play overland. Beyond "New Game+" though, I couldn't even imagine what it could be.

I'd wish they'd work on a solution towards this, even if it wasn't combat related. I haven't even thought about trying to 100% zone quests since Morrowind released. That's like what, 7 years now? Yikes.

Uvi_AUT

disky wrote: »

As someone who really wants to see ZOS deliver an option to increase the challenge, I think we have to accept that the game is built to accommodate a wide range of players. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Just because the game is missing something for us, that doesn't mean it can't also provide enjoyment for those who like what it is now.

Despite what the 1% of objections in this Thread like to say, I dont believe there is any range of players who find the Overlandcontent challenging.
Thats not an opinion, its a fact. All Overlandcontent can be finished by Leftclicking only. Thats not hyperboly, it has been done. There is no playerbase for something like that.

Muizer

Uvi_AUT wrote: »

Despite what the 1% of objections in this Thread like to say, I dont believe there is any range of players who find the Overlandcontent challenging.

I don't think there's much of a point in focusing on this, because we already know for certain that any solution that implements a bigger challenge in terms of combat is going to be one that won't be imposed uniformly.

The difficulty those of us wanting a bigger challenge want is definitely going to be too much for many players. Perhaps not so much because they can't overcome it, but because they simply don't want to expend time and effort on combat. That's not their game.

Whichever way you qualify current overland, it will have to remain by and large unaffected.

TaSheen

@Uvi_AUT - I remain very tired of people telling me how I play this game. I CANNOT get through a lot of overland "simply by leftclicking". I have crap for reflexes - mine were never very good even when I was 40 years younger, and as I age they're much worse. Also, my ping even with a new machine (which did help some) is well over 500+ ms, which means that no, I cannot weave reliably, I cannot bar swap, and much of the time staying alive against more than a couple of real enemies (I'm not talking wolves and bears here - enemies as in three plus spell casters, etc.) means I'd better be on one of my CP160s who is wearing Oakensoul plus something in the way of gear with a decent ward.

It took me a LOT of tries to get past the last boss in the High Isle story line. My hands and wrists were sore for days after. I had a headache of unimaginable proportions. Because of ping, the "help" from the npcs wasn't reliable either - by the time I got the popup to use the hotkey, and pressed it, it was too late. And that's "overland" - a zone story. That's also the last zone story I tried.... there's only so much abuse I'm willing to put up with when it comes to stuff that's not really necessary for my particular sort of fun.

So basically, you and others like you think I should just take my money and play some other game. That's sad. I remain hopeful that ZOS will find a way to give you what you want - and still manage to somehow continue to allow me to play one of my favorite games of all time.

disky

Uvi_AUT wrote: »

disky wrote: »

As someone who really wants to see ZOS deliver an option to increase the challenge, I think we have to accept that the game is built to accommodate a wide range of players. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Just because the game is missing something for us, that doesn't mean it can't also provide enjoyment for those who like what it is now.

Despite what the 1% of objections in this Thread like to say, I dont believe there is any range of players who find the Overlandcontent challenging.
Thats not an opinion, its a fact. All Overlandcontent can be finished by Leftclicking only. Thats not hyperboly, it has been done. There is no playerbase for something like that.

It doesn't matter if it can be done standing perfectly still, the game exists to be played by people with a lot of different perspectives and approaches to the content. I think the best way to approach this situation is to simply accept that not everyone is playing the same game you're playing, and that in spite of that, ZOS is still capable of delivering a game that we can all enjoy. We just have to show that there is a demand for something that better suits your playstyle, and mine.

disky

RaptorRodeoGod wrote: »

Since the devs seem pretty resistant to even implement optional difficulty, does anybody have any non-combat related ideas that could drive engagement in overland for those of us that think combat is not difficult?

I'd think puzzles would be a start, like the dungeon puzzles in Skyrim, which are absent from overland content, but that'd probably be pretty difficult to apply retroactively, and it probably would not be engaging enough on its own.

Maybe various dungeon/trial mechanics could be implemented in a way to slow down quest progress, instead of killing the player as they would in dungeon/trial content?

Or maybe they can add a new system that incentivizes players to continually play overland. Beyond "New Game+" though, I couldn't even imagine what it could be.

I'd wish they'd work on a solution towards this, even if it wasn't combat related. I haven't even thought about trying to 100% zone quests since Morrowind released. That's like what, 7 years now? Yikes.

I am all for more puzzles and content beyond combat in overland and I think that more of what they've done in some of the Necrom/Infinite Archive content would be really nice to see in overland. TES puzzles have never really been particularly challenging but I'd love to see ZOS flex their puzzle muscles a bit, even if it is optional content.

As for something akin to a New Game+, they did try that with Cadwell's Silver/Gold and they've said that very few people were interested in doing it. I'm betting that anything even remotely similar will never happen as they've been so soured on the idea.

Yuji34

Hello everyone, I'm back after a while, but only on the forum and not in the game even though I miss it. I won't return to the game until there is a difficulty system for overland. I've read the previous pages and it seems it's still not planned by the developers. I think we need to be realistic and accept that it will never be implemented. The game still has a significant daily player flow, so why would Zenimax bother to implement this for a percentage of players (I don't know exactly how many) who are not satisfied?



Now, the best solution remains for players who really want a difficulty feature, to not play the game and see if that truly impacts Zenimax.

colossalvoids

RaptorRodeoGod wrote: »

Since the devs seem pretty resistant to even implement optional difficulty, does anybody have any non-combat related ideas that could drive engagement in overland for those of us that think combat is not difficult?

I'd think puzzles would be a start

The thing is zenimax isn't famous for their amazing puzzles, but the combat team is universally praised in the end game community. We know they're capable, they've proven it miriad of times. Puzzle wise I prefer ones like we have in Elden Ring for example, but those aren't fit for ESO for different reasons and funny enough the main one is that everything should be easily solvable by general population, that's why we're rotating same cube 3 times until it "solves" itself.

disky

colossalvoids wrote: »

Puzzle wise I prefer ones like we have in Elden Ring for example, but those aren't fit for ESO for different reasons and funny enough the main one is that everything should be easily solvable by general population, that's why we're rotating same cube 3 times until it "solves" itself.

Sadly this is true. As much as I want more puzzles in the game, the only way I think we'll ever see them is if they're as optional as an opt-in increase to overland challenge.

Eridanus

I stopped playing years ago due to the the lackluster combat and the non existent, soporiferous difficulty of the vast majority of the content. I come back to check the forums from time to time, and I'm always left in disappointment when I see that that ZOS still refuses to do anything about it.

For those who claim that the difficulty shouldn't be changed because there allegedly are people who can't go beyond left clicking a mob or press 1 button -which is all it takes right now to kill anything from the overland- maybe the difficulty of most of the game shouldn't be balanced around people who have the gaming skills of your 95 year old grandma, because it comes in the detriment of everyone else. But of course, the two players can coexist if they implemented some sort of optional debuff that made you weaker.

CP5

I haven't even thought of this thread for months (years?) at this point, but decided to see how the conversation has gone. It does seem like nothing has changed, but I thought why not just put something here, in the event a developer is still reading this thing.

I still log in twice a week, for a while this was to do pledges with friends but recently changed to doing one random dungeon instead, with the occasional IA run. I don't log in for anything else. Trials had me hooked until my trial guild died, and for a long time I ran pugs, but when I try to pug as a healer, for example, I end up out damaging the dps. How? I have no clue, I'm using only gear sets that buff damage and skills to heal allies and debuff enemies, so any dungeon run feels very likely to turn into a slog (and it doesn't help that these players likely haven't had a solo opportunity to practice for harder content since the entirety of overland is based around fresh characters being able to explore with minimum resistance). So beyond dungeons and trials, and skipping pvp since that just isn't for me, what else is there?

There are the solo arenas, but I don't fancy running the same loop through the same content over and over, the moment I start to memorize spawns and go through the same motions to complete the same combat encounters that isn't engaging to me, it's just routine. IA is nice, but I prefer to do it with a friend. But then there is the entire rest of the world. I used to quest, I used to explore each zone thoroughly, I used to actually care about the story being presented, but I just don't anymore.

With the upcoming scribing system, and having a major source of scripts be from guild dailies, I thought about what that would look like, and it instantly killed any drive I had to do the content. As someone who has done vet trials and dungeons to the point that I expect that level of intensity from combat encounters, going into a zone where everything is based around such a simple standard is mind-numbing, and boils the process of doing these quest to load screens. I may be willing to burn my time on worthless things occasionally, but I'm not going to do that.

For the rest of overland you have the main quests, which from what threads I've seen have taken a hit regarding writing, filled with npcs reminding you of things you just saw, or drumming up the antagonist when I know in advance that the fight with the big bad will be nothing more than a punching bag with invincibility phases to monologue in, I just can't care. Let the madman blow up the volcano, it'll at least make things interesting. I did the Elsweyr story quest to the end, because it had characters I cared about, because dragons were not only threatening and worthy of the title of antagonist, but were also fun to fight, and because both dragon and khajiit lore interest me. I haven't done any of the story quest since then.

For exploration, I am fascinated when I jump to a friend to help them with something in these newer zones because they are amazing. The jungles in the high isle zones are incredible, and it was stuff like that which I loved doing early on. For the first few years I played ESO I would aimlessly explore zones, having a full quest log because going around the next bend interested me more than helping the dozen people I already signed up to help. But then I stumbled across the enemies in the area, and instinctually I just skipped my way past them without a care in the world. All they're really doing to me is making it harder to take screenshots of the zone, nothing else. I don't feel like the enemies in a region compliment it, make it memorable, make me want to actually spend more time there. Since all the loot is zone gear, all the fights are so tame compared to what I enjoy, and the stories treat me like a fool, I just don't want to deal with it.

In comparison, I had brought up Dragon's Dogma ages ago when I was active in this thread, and the sequel came out a little while ago. For context, many players seem to have finished the main story by level 40ish, and I'm level 80 without having really noticed the time spent dragging my heels. Frequently I'll just wander off on trails I've already walked a dozen times, because like ESO, the world is a joy to just explore, but then there are the fights you get into that add to the memorability of the world. I remember the time a harpy picked me up and yeeted me off a cliff, and when I walk by that cliff, I remember it. I remember the broken bridge over a deep ravine where an ogre almost drop-kicked half my party into the river below. I remember the time I baited an ogre to fight a golem in the middle of some ancient ruins just to see the chaos that would follow it, because the enemies that exist in the world give the world its depth.

And, on top of this, even if you grossly out level the enemies you're fighting, you still need to at least respect them. A harpy can drop you from a cliff if you're level 1 or 50, the only thing that changes is the damage you deal and the tools at your disposal, but a failure to use either of those means that enemy is just as much a threat as they were before, and I have to actually think about their presence, and care about them being there.

So, in short, the mentality that 'people who want challenge are funneled into dungeons' misses the point. Repetitive content doesn't hold people evenly, and overland has years worth of content for people to engage in, if they were to choose to do so, that would keep players like myself interested. But as it stands, I don't care for the stories or the characters because I feel more like I'm being fooled into helping some lazy person who couldn't be bothered to deal with a trivial threat, rather than being a hero facing challenging odds but overcoming them, the world itself feels flat without something active in it to make me feel any sense of attachment (Fallout New Vegas players likely remember going north first), and it makes it difficult for me to want to log in beyond these scheduled times with friends. An entire world in a franchise I love, filled with chances to come across other people who share similar interest with me, but it is made so off-putting by being presented in this singular way.

So in short, ZOS has the tech and tools needed to implement this, given something that could perfectly accommodate this request was clear as day for ESO's first year and still exists today, they have the creativity to do this, given that enemies in dungeons and trials have interesting skills and quirks that could easily be adopted into overland enemies, but it would be a big time sink for a group of players they likely feel is too small to justify the effort. It isn't like I'm helping push the issue though, I still spend money here, and at the end of the day that's what matters to ZOS.

Muizer

CP5 wrote: »

I don't fancy running the same loop through the same content over and over, the moment I start to memorize spawns and go through the same motions to complete the same combat encounters that isn't engaging to me, it's just routine

If any devs were reading your post, I think they stopped right there. You're evidently not part of the target demographic

Yuji34

For those who are somewhat familiar, how long would it take and how much would it cost to implement just a buff like this?:

Major Debuff, reduces the damage you deal by 50% and increases the damage you receive by 100%

just for this i'll return to the game for completing all quests zone, maybe needs some adjustements, but it's a good base for player you want difficulty and they can focus on improving their character by craft, overlands sets...