PVP Mass Exodus: Give them a reason to return

StamPlar_1976

I don't care about the mass exodus of us pvpers. The only thing that kept me here was the crying of pve-ers during Midyear Mayhem. Other than that, pvp can die in this game. The devs don't care about fixing Cyrodiil or pvp period. So why should I or anyone else care?

I'm loving it in New World and another pvp game that I knew about, but didn't try until a couple of weeks ago. I'm never coming back. ZOS won't ever fix Cyrodiil and pvp. So why should I ever come back? It's clear as day they don't want us here. Let the pve-ers have it.

Amottica

Agalloch wrote: »

Eso was launched as a PVP centric MMO.

Since 2014 many of the original devs left the team.

Now ESO is more PVE and fashion MMO game.

The original concept disappeared.

I agree that PvP is at the center of the game since that is the location of Cyrodiil.

I would disagree that it was PvP centric. 90% or more of the map was PvE at launch. Most of the energy developing the game, outside of combat, was PvE quest writing requires significant work. A large portion of the cost was voice acting and Zenimax went after some big names for that as well. It would seem odd that most of the cost and most of the work was PvE related but the game is a PvP centric game. If ESO was every a PvP centric game we would have seen PvP everywhere instead of one limited area.

The three-banner war was a big part of advertising the game but that war is woven into the PvE stories so it is not a PvP centric theme.

Kwoung

Amottica wrote: »

Agalloch wrote: »

Eso was launched as a PVP centric MMO.

Since 2014 many of the original devs left the team.

Now ESO is more PVE and fashion MMO game.

The original concept disappeared.

I agree that PvP is at the center of the game since that is the location of Cyrodiil.

I would disagree that it was PvP centric. 90% or more of the map was PvE at launch. Most of the energy developing the game, outside of combat, was PvE quest writing requires significant work. A large portion of the cost was voice acting and Zenimax went after some big names for that as well. It would seem odd that most of the cost and most of the work was PvE related but the game is a PvP centric game. If ESO was every a PvP centric game we would have seen PvP everywhere instead of one limited area.

The three-banner war was a big part of advertising the game but that war is woven into the PvE stories so it is not a PvP centric theme.

If it actually worked though, ESO would be the hands down best PVP game on the market. I find that "most" PVE players, of which I was one until I tried Cyrodiil, have huge misconceptions about PVP here, based on some experience they had in some other game in the past. The combat system, goals, size, sieging, lack of loss for dying, all come together to make this the best PVP since DAOC, which was the only other game I enjoyed PVPing in. ESO is very similar to DAOC in this respect, except a lot bigger and better... if it only worked.

propertyOfUndefined

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

I've hit a wall in ESO PvP where I'm having trouble finding a reason to play. There's no carrot to chase. Battlegrounds have always been my go-to but after 400+ deathmatch the excitement is wearing off.

I need achievements with good rewards and a proper ranking system for me to get invested.

I agree with this wholeheartedly.

I've been playing an average of just 2 matches per day all week, which is about a fifth of what I usually do. It's not because the matches aren't fun for me, but because I would rather be playing a game that I enjoy a lot less if it at at least makes me feel like I'm progressing towards something.

dinokstrunz

Amottica wrote: »

Agalloch wrote: »

Eso was launched as a PVP centric MMO.

Since 2014 many of the original devs left the team.

Now ESO is more PVE and fashion MMO game.

The original concept disappeared.

I agree that PvP is at the center of the game since that is the location of Cyrodiil.

I would disagree that it was PvP centric. 90% or more of the map was PvE at launch. Most of the energy developing the game, outside of combat, was PvE quest writing requires significant work. A large portion of the cost was voice acting and Zenimax went after some big names for that as well. It would seem odd that most of the cost and most of the work was PvE related but the game is a PvP centric game. If ESO was every a PvP centric game we would have seen PvP everywhere instead of one limited area.

The three-banner war was a big part of advertising the game but that war is woven into the PvE stories so it is not a PvP centric theme.

Questing for a lot of people isn't end game content. A lot of people I find usually snub questing or just blaze through without caring much about the story and only do them for skill points or other important rewards.

Yes ZoS might focus on questing because that's lets be real it's all they're really good at doing as of right now. End game is a massive factor in a MMOs survival and ESO's end game is extremely stale right now, that's why people are heading for the exit.

neferpitou73

dinokstrunz wrote: »

JJOtterBear wrote: »

Crash427 wrote: »

JJOtterBear wrote: »

I mean, i'd be fine if they just removed PvP from ESO entirely. Then they could pump those resources into their PvE content which is quite arguably, the actual strength of the game. Not every game has to cater to PvP'ers. In fact, I think way too many games do now. Not sure when that paradigm shift occurred.

ESO is a fantasy RPG. Frankly, PvP isn't necessary. and it's really only there to pander to the crowd that needs to feel accomplishment by beating other people in a way that has no real world value.

just my 2 cents. and I stand by it.

Some of us bought this game specifically because we were promised a large openworld PVP map with huge battles. Now that doesn't work, so they've remade the game into a casual exploration game in a fantasy setting. If you can't understand why those of us who were there at the start, and purchased the game in part because of that promise, are annoyed then there's not much I could say that wouldn't get snipped.

Yes, and their focus changed. Large open world PvP is no longer the promise anymore. I understand why you are annoyed. But I feel your annoyance lies not with the change, but your resistance to the change. the unwillingness to adapt.

Clearly this game has changed course to be more of a PvE game with some sprinkled, not really functional PvP. Clearly that does not fulfill you, so why not find a game that does? By continuing to demand that they reverse their course for the game, you are setting yourself up for perpetual disappointment.

Elder Scrolls has never been about killing other players. ESO now, with its focus on the story and PvE content is actually more true to an elder scrolls game than ever before. There are plenty of games that will cater to your pvp needs. Why does ESO have to be one of them? How did you enjoy other ES games that never had pvp?

[snip] I wonder if you played ESO in early 2014. It was all & only about Cyrodiil. ESO had one of the most passionate PvP communities in the MMO sphere right from the get go. Also comparing the style of ESO an MMO to the single player games, really, people knew this wasn't going to be Skyrim 2 if they did then that's just silly.

ESO will always be that game with the label "what if." If ESO didn't suffer from performance issues this game could well of been one of the strongest games for PvP on the MMO market.

That's what really gets me. There's a reason the PvP population has stuck with the game through years of crappy performance. When this game works it is one of the best PvP experiences I've had in a game. If the game actually worked there would be no competition as far as PvP in MMOs go. [snip]

[edited for bashing]

cptqrk

Banetek wrote: »

Don't underestimate the power a game focused on pvp has for pvpers.

I don't. PVPers OVERESTIMATE what a game focused on PVP has for PVPers.

No content. No sets to collect. Nothing to do but 'kill other players'

You will get bored. I can't believe i have to keep saying this, but have you looked at the population of any other PVP focused MMO?

Ghost towns. All of them.

Kwoung

cptqrk wrote: »

Banetek wrote: »

Don't underestimate the power a game focused on pvp has for pvpers.

I don't. PVPers OVERESTIMATE what a game focused on PVP has for PVPers.

No content. No sets to collect. Nothing to do but 'kill other players'

You will get bored. I can't believe i have to keep saying this, but have you looked at the population of any other PVP focused MMO?

Ghost towns. All of them.

Games that "only" focus on PVP get stale, quickly. Games that successfully offer both, thrive. ESO has the ability to be the best game ever in both worlds, if they could manage to fix the lag, disconnects and stop listening to the players asking for gear to make up for their lack of skills or some imaginary problem directly related to those lack of skills or group coordination things would get better fast. I sucked at PVP for a loooong time (probably still do), but instead of asking ZOS to carry me, I wore Crafty/Spinners, experimented with different skills, learned how to play a bit better, how to deal with others attacks and I got a bit better and live longer now.

Anyways, ESO has the underpinning of the best PVP system ever, they shouldn't be squandering that.

DarcyMardin

Even though I don’t PvP much, I can see why the new game’s approach is appealing — PVP there has major consequences for the world. Even if, like me, you’re not flagging for PvP, you can’t really ignore it. It affects everything.

Even so, all the running around on foot doing repetitive "kill 10 rats" quests that you need to do to level might bring players back in droves.

Xebov

I dont see any issue. A new game comes out and ppl venture out and try it. This was always the case. some will stay, some will come back. New MMOs are a bit more rare these days, but in the past this was common.

They have their own take on PvP which will undoubtedly come with its own set of issues. In a month or 2 you will see more players being max level and population numbers start to settle. Then you will be able to determine how good it realy is.

Austacker

I'm a healer main.

I'd rather scoop my eyeballs out with a rusty spoon than play PvP in this game.

I do it for events - then quickly remember why I hate doing it.

To the DPS bros, it's a fun experience. For everyone else.... it ranges from tedious and boring to just a frustrating mess.

This is one area IMHO MMOs like World of Warcraft run absolute rings around ESO.

- Objective based BGs with 2 sides only and large player counts.
- Arena play with Seasons
- Dedicated PvP sets so they don't conflict with PvE sets creating endless frustration

There's no area of PvP in ESO I actually enjoy. I honestly hate it all.

I played as a healer main in WoW for years & it leaves healer PvP play in ESO for dead IMHO.

Why don't I just go and play WoW instead then?

I play on Console nowadays and there's no WoW here.

Plus, the PvE side of ESO is actually really damn good so I'm content to spit on the PvP side of this game and just stick to PvE.

Skoomah

Austacker wrote: »

I'm a healer main.

I'd rather scoop my eyeballs out with a rusty spoon than play PvP in this game.

I do it for events - then quickly remember why I hate doing it.

To the DPS bros, it's a fun experience. For everyone else.... it ranges from tedious and boring to just a frustrating mess.

This is one area IMHO MMOs like World of Warcraft run absolute rings around ESO.

- Objective based BGs with 2 sides only and large player counts.
- Arena play with Seasons
- Dedicated PvP sets so they don't conflict with PvE sets creating endless frustration

There's no area of PvP in ESO I actually enjoy. I honestly hate it all.

I played as a healer main in WoW for years & it leaves healer PvP play in ESO for dead IMHO.

Why don't I just go and play WoW instead then?

I play on Console nowadays and there's no WoW here.

Plus, the PvE side of ESO is actually really damn good so I'm content to spit on the PvP side of this game and just stick to PvE.

Why so much negativity? You actually spent time writing up an essay to go out of your way to hurt players that you don’t even interact with?

tonyblack

Austacker wrote: »

I'm a healer main.

I'd rather scoop my eyeballs out with a rusty spoon than play PvP in this game.

I do it for events - then quickly remember why I hate doing it.

To the DPS bros, it's a fun experience. For everyone else.... it ranges from tedious and boring to just a frustrating mess.

This is one area IMHO MMOs like World of Warcraft run absolute rings around ESO.

- Objective based BGs with 2 sides only and large player counts.
- Arena play with Seasons
- Dedicated PvP sets so they don't conflict with PvE sets creating endless frustration

There's no area of PvP in ESO I actually enjoy. I honestly hate it all.

I played as a healer main in WoW for years & it leaves healer PvP play in ESO for dead IMHO.

Why don't I just go and play WoW instead then?

I play on Console nowadays and there's no WoW here.

Plus, the PvE side of ESO is actually really damn good so I'm content to spit on the PvP side of this game and just stick to PvE.

If you think it is fun for dps whats the problem to play one? It’s not like every class can already play all roles.

Dragonnord

They abandoned the ship and we're supposed to want them back? I hope they don't ever come back.
 

Skoomah

Dragonnord wrote: »

They abandoned the ship and we're supposed to want them back? I hope they don't ever come back.
 

For good reason though. As with any relationship, you have to continually work at it to maintain it. It’s been years since PVP has been given any water or plant food in the form of new maps, zones, classes, game modes, something new.

And the game continues to degrade in terms of playability. For example, starting with this patch, I crash and have to restart the computer at least once per play session. And many patches ago at this point, my DK dragon leap and fossilize stopped working when I try to use the skill at seemingly random times. And unplayable lag has dogged cyrodiil for years now to the point I just ignore an entire portion of the PVP in this game. That’s just some examples of unaddressed unplayability.

gariondavey

Austacker wrote: »

I'm a healer main.

I'd rather scoop my eyeballs out with a rusty spoon than play PvP in this game.

I do it for events - then quickly remember why I hate doing it.

To the DPS bros, it's a fun experience. For everyone else.... it ranges from tedious and boring to just a frustrating mess.

This is one area IMHO MMOs like World of Warcraft run absolute rings around ESO.

- Objective based BGs with 2 sides only and large player counts.
- Arena play with Seasons
- Dedicated PvP sets so they don't conflict with PvE sets creating endless frustration

There's no area of PvP in ESO I actually enjoy. I honestly hate it all.

I played as a healer main in WoW for years & it leaves healer PvP play in ESO for dead IMHO.

Why don't I just go and play WoW instead then?

I play on Console nowadays and there's no WoW here.

Plus, the PvE side of ESO is actually really damn good so I'm content to spit on the PvP side of this game and just stick to PvE.

Cringe. I heal in bgs on a magsorc and magplar and really enjoy it. I played wow in tbc and wotlk and played the heck out of bgs/arena there. Arena master, battlemaster, ____ of the horde, conqueror, duelist. While I certainly miss aspects of pvp in that golden era of wow, I find eso to be far superior in pvp. The lack of communication and support from zos, and the performance are my major gripes with it.

BalticBlues

Dragonnord wrote: »

They abandoned the ship and we're supposed to want them back?
I hope they don't ever come back. 

First I thought you meant the serious game developers.
Developers knowing what fine-tuning means
instead of hammering on game core mechanics every 3 months now
because when you only have a hammer, each stain looks like nail.

Then I realized you meant the players.
As if smart players would not simply play the best games available.

DestroyerPewnack

LMAO at people saying players will come back after the New World hype dies down! 😂

As someone who has made the switch, I can tell you honestly, ESO is a hundred times bigger than New World. Even when ESO first launched, it was bigger. More things to do, more build variety, more skills to learn, etc.

I (and people like me) made the switch, knowing all of that. Why? Because at least in New World, I don't die to lag. If by some miracle, Zos finally fixes performance in Cyrodiil (hiiiiighly unlikely, but I still check in from time to time) some of us might come back. But for others, it's too late. They've been treated like crap for far too long, and they're happy to finally leave this game.

No reason why any of you should care, obviously. But please don't fool yourselves by thinking we've been "tricked" by the New World hype. We left because we've had enough of ESO's devs. If we get bored of New World, we'll play something else. Just not ESO.

Skoomah

DestroyerPewnack wrote: »

LMAO at people saying players will come back after the New World hype dies down! 😂

As someone who has made the switch, I can tell you honestly, ESO is a hundred times bigger than New World. Even when ESO first launched, it was bigger. More things to do, more build variety, more skills to learn, etc.

I (and people like me) made the switch, knowing all of that. Why? Because at least in New World, I don't die to lag. If by some miracle, Zos finally fixes performance in Cyrodiil (hiiiiighly unlikely, but I still check in from time to time) some of us might come back. But for others, it's too late. They've been treated like crap for far too long, and they're happy to finally leave this game.

No reason why any of you should care, obviously. But please don't fool yourselves by thinking we've been "tricked" by the New World hype. We left because we've had enough of ESO's devs. If we get bored of New World, we'll play something else. Just not ESO.

Most likely... people aren't coming back. The best ZOS can hope for is to repopulate the PVP community with new players to the game. What's done is done. But to retain existing players and to attract new players, ZOS still needs to give us new content. It's a shame because the acquisition cost of obtaining new players is much more costly than keeping an existing player happy and playing.

BalticBlues

DestroyerPewnack wrote: »

If by some miracle, Zos finally fixes performance in Cyrodiil (hiiiiighly unlikely, but I still check in from time to time) some of us might come back. But for others, it's too late. [...] We left because we've had enough of ESO's devs. If we get bored of New World, we'll play something else. Just not ESO.

This is what I hear a lot. Fortunately for me, I play ESO because of the wonderful lore and the beautifully designed worlds. This is why I stay. If I would play it for PvP, I probably would have left years ago because of the incredible lag. Moreover, you cannot take any PvP game seriously where -even after years of development- the core mechanics change every 3 months because the devs either have no clue or do not care at all about fine-tuning. Three years ago, you could play all classes and all styles in PvP competitively. Nowadays, about 90% of PvP players use either a Stam setup or a Bomber setup - this bad balance has deteriorated. Finally, with the latest wild PvP Proc Cheese sets, the devs themselves applied the final deathblow to ESO PVP.

The_Lex

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.engadget.com/amp/2014-01-24-tamriel-infinium-look-a-video-not-about-elder-scrolls-online-p.html

"For the longest time it's felt as if we have been hearing about PvP and nothing but PvP. From the launch announcement trailer to the Emperor skill line, most of advertising for the game has seemed like one big PvP push."

Right from the beginning, PvP was a huge part of the game. But, yes, let's ignore players who were brought into this game because of PvP. "It's not my favorite content, so I don't care what happens to them...they should shut up and leave." </sarcasm>

If ZOS wants to phase out PvP, they should come right out and tell us.

If ZOS wants to keep PvP (and a PvP community), they need to commit the necessary resources (i.e., hire a PvP combat team, fix the servers and code, etc.).

No matter what, ZOS needs to have real conversations with it's player base to prevent unhelpful speculation over their intentions for the game and to keep the community from attacking each other over equally important content.

MissPan3024

Though performance issues are truly the biggest difficulty in Cyrodiil, I also find the lack of the Imperial army to be a significant disappointment. The Three Banners War lacks any meaning currently in Cyrodiil. It feels more like a simple exercise in capture the flag. The Imperial Army poses no threat whatsoever. Capturing a keep feels a bit silly when each of them is nothing but an empty building.
Lore is one of the most captivating aspects of ESO- until you hit Cyrodiil. It would seem that the battlefield is nothing more than an exercise in pvp, devoid of storyline, dominated by the players with this season’s buffed sets.
The Imperial Army is supposed to represent a major threat, coupled with Daedric interference. Instead of searching for the hammer I want to light the dragon fires! 😁

Curious_Death

Came coz NW have maintance now u know how i feel?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JhwxTen6yA

have fun riding SHINY mounts that u got using ur wallets

i changed laglaglaglaglag

into lalalalong

TequilaFire

Curious_Death wrote: »

Came coz NW have maintance now u know how i feel?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JhwxTen6yA

have fun riding SHINY mounts that u got using ur wallets

i changed laglaglaglaglag

into lalalalong

Shouldn't you be off grinding mats to make bullets and arrows? lol

JJOtterBear

TequilaFire wrote: »

I didn't buy ESO to have it be exactly like an Elder Scrolls game.
I would play one of the ES solo games if I wanted that.

well then, go do that? Stop trying to turn ESO into a PvP hellscape. There are plenty of other games out there that would cater to your needs. this is why people feel so sour towards PvP'ers. [snip]

[edited for baiting]

TequilaFire

JJOtterBear wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

I didn't buy ESO to have it be exactly like an Elder Scrolls game.
I would play one of the ES solo games if I wanted that.

well then, go do that? Stop trying to turn ESO into a PvP hellscape. There are plenty of other games out there that would cater to your needs. this is why people feel so sour towards PvP'ers. [snip]

I don't go do that because I don't want to.
Go through my seven years of posting and you will not find 1 post about turning ESO into PvP "hellscape".
PvP is completely optional in this game in case you were unaware.
And as to entitlement, you as a PvE player seem to be saying my opinion and money spent in this game is lesser because I enjoy both PvP and PvE.

[edited to remove quote]

Bucky_13

Uh yeah, first we have a lack of care for the PvP community. A tiny Spinal Tap-esque siege emote is not enough. Then you add screwing over honest traders, refuse to communicate with them for well over a week before going "Oops, we screwed up when we removed all of your gold". Then you add "look at this awesome reward we're gonna hype up", and it's a dlc that's pointless for a regular sub to own.

And now I've unsubbed from ESO+ for the time being because I'm also in that other game, I'm so tired of the remarkably poor communication from ZOS. It would be nice if they didn't take their subs for granted and actually communicated with us instead of being constantly tone deaf. Don't see the point in giving ZOS more money until they actually start communicating AND improving PvP.

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo

JJOtterBear wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

I didn't buy ESO to have it be exactly like an Elder Scrolls game.
I would play one of the ES solo games if I wanted that.

well then, go do that? Stop trying to turn ESO into a PvP hellscape. There are plenty of other games out there that would cater to your needs. this is why people feel so sour towards PvP'ers. [snip]

Hi there,

I'm still seeing more hate talk in this topic which should be discussions on what can be altered/improved or implemented to spice up the PvP realms of ESO.

I'd just like to go over some points that could evolve your discussion:

1). Eso was PvP and raids for approximately 5 years and the content was advertised as such
2). Not everyone in PvP is a bully (Yes there are nice people there to)
3). Don't assume that everyone's experience is your own (All content is concerned)
4). Players who supported and paid for ESO at the 'rocky' launch were also PvP players
5). The world is a big place with diverse personalities and constant bickering gets no one anywhere
6). The realm needs serious work and is not in good health

If you are newer players joining the game, please watch your wording and thoughts before hitting the enter button on the text field. Player vs Player has been around for a long time in ESO and you can't just shove it under the door mat with negator commentary.

*Hands out warm towels so everyone calms down*

[edited to remove quote]

Aldoss

JJOtterBear wrote: »

[snip]

How you can write that and not realize the hypocrisy is possibly applause worthy.

Not a single "PvPer" in this thread wants this game to solely focus on them. We don't even want equal treatment. We just want anything that could be considered content (emotes are not content).

Or, alternatively, give us some sort of dialogue on server progress. Can you at least empathize how frustrated you would be if your preferred content in ESO didn't work? If you did everything right, but suddenly got disconnected? Or you did everything right, but failed your trifecta run because the boss stunned you and you watch in misery as your toon goes through 3 break free animations while the boss channels a heavy?

Then imagine coming to the forums to ask the devs why this has been your experience for years with pitiful dialogue in return, only for someone else on the forums to say "stop feeling entitled and go find a different game"?

The best game I can think of isn't one that is only PvE nor is it one that is only PvP focused... It's the game that offers their players the choice to play the way they want. (maybe that should be a slogan?)

ESO is the best game I've played. I love that I can choose PvE when I'm feeling that and PvP when I'm in the mood for it (and enjoy it when it works... It often doesn't). Players that value PvP aren't trying to turn ESO into a PvP only game. We're trying to get ZOS to keep/turn ESO into what should be the best game literally ever.

[edited to remove quote]

madman65

I was in Imperial sewers this morning and OH MY, the skills are terrible. I don`t run PVP much but shrouded daggers didn`t bounce half the time, I would be right up to a target and it`s like the target was not there, killed the scamp 4 times and only looted it once. I can see were gamers would get tired of these problems.