[Class Rep] Nightblade Feedback Thread

Captain_OP

I am not a fan of leeching strike and it’s morph’s. It feels like to be only rewarding to good players which don’t fail to use light attacks. Drain power is a cool ability, but only the magicka morph feels good to play. For stamina there are other abilities for aoe burst, which are more effective at that. I think the major brutality and sorcery buff is not the right place at drain power.

I would be happy if leeching strikes give for it’s duration the major buffs, this way drain power can get changed to a stronger aoe and maybe to something that heals on both morphs.

Chilly-McFreeze

Captain_OP wrote: »

I am not a fan of leeching strike and it’s morph’s. It feels like to be only rewarding to good players which don’t fail to use light attacks.

I really don't see the issue here. What's wrong with rewarding players for keeping up a good weave?

I would be happy if leeching strikes give for it’s duration the major buffs, this way drain power can get changed to a stronger aoe and maybe to something that heals on both morphs.

Agree. It really feels out of place. However, I'm unsure if ZOS wouldn't nerf leeching strikes in some way when they add major brut/sorc there.

Tommy_The_Gun

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

I really don't see the issue here. What's wrong with rewarding players for keeping up a good weave?

I don't think it is super problematic, if you have good rotation. But for the newer player it can be a big culprit. They will try NB, see what dmg they can do, what sustain they have and if they try other class - they will get better result.

In their eyes, NB will be inferior.

It is very similar case as with Shadow Image. It is a very good skill, but very hard to master. It makes NB a class that has very steep learning curve (probably the steepest of all classes).

I know that in a thread about NB, there is probably a lot of NB mains, so making class easier to play would probably not be a popular opinion amongst NB mains, but I am NB main also... And I don't think that gate-keeping is a good idea.

Captain_OP

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

I really don't see the issue here. What's wrong with rewarding players for keeping up a good weave?

There is nothing wrong for good players, but it feel underwhelming if not utilized. If i fail and miss LA and timing to recast, then it feels like a 1:1 ressource trade and a useless skill.

Agree. It really feels out of place. However, I'm unsure if ZOS wouldn't nerf leeching strikes in some way when they add major brut/sorc there.

This could happen, but in generell it would be better and drain power would get adjusted.

Captain_OP

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

I really don't see the issue here. What's wrong with rewarding players for keeping up a good weave?

I don't think it is super problematic, if you have good rotation. But for the newer player it can be a big culprit. They will try NB, see what dmg they can do, what sustain they have and if they try other class - they will get better result.

In their eyes, NB will be inferior.

It is very similar case as with Shadow Image. It is a very good skill, but very hard to master. It makes NB a class that has very steep learning curve (probably the steepest of all classes).

I know that in a thread about NB, there is probably a lot of NB mains, so making class easier to play would probably not be a popular opinion amongst NB mains, but I am NB main also... And I don't think that gate-keeping is a good idea.

This to be honest

wheresbes

I would make merciless a toggle, so that you don't have to refresh it and just fire it on the 5th or keep it up for the bonus once full. Also, a better cue should be given when's ready, that would remove the need to look at the bar if a lot of movement is happening and I may have missed a LA.

Cast times on ultimates can also go.

Captain_OP

When i saw Mirris outfit with all the potion on her belt i wonder why no class has potions in generall utilized. The Syphoning tree is some where in between blood magic and a Potion Assasine. What do you think? Should the Syphonig tree be reinterpretated as a Poisioning tree?

There is even no class that has effects for applying posions and i thinking maybe that tree could utilize that or should the spell for magical damage stay blood magic and the stamina ones go poisioning theme?

Or do you think it is fine the way it is?

Maybe removing the blood magic from nightblade could benefit the game in generall, because i feel like it is blocking vampire skills. I mean like skills would be redundant or duplicated.

Captain_OP

wheresbes wrote: »

I would make merciless a toggle, so that you don't have to refresh it and just fire it on the 5th or keep it up for the bonus once full. Also, a better cue should be given when's ready, that would remove the need to look at the bar if a lot of movement is happening and I may have missed a LA.

Cast times on ultimates can also go.

A toggle wouldnt work with a skill that could be reactivated for a different action, but maybe it could be a passive toggle that activates if it gets slotted.

I would like that, because some time i kind of forget to watch if it run out.

Chilly-McFreeze

Captain_OP wrote: »

Maybe removing the blood magic from nightblade could benefit the game in generall, because i feel like it is blocking vampire skills. I mean like skills would be redundant or duplicated.

You think it will be well recieved to rip out a third of a class toolkit?

Why not the other way around: a dedicated world-skillline about enchants or alchemy that e.g. prolongs potion effects... Oh, wait...

Captain_OP

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Captain_OP wrote: »

Maybe removing the blood magic from nightblade could benefit the game in generall, because i feel like it is blocking vampire skills. I mean like skills would be redundant or duplicated.

You think it will be well recieved to rip out a third of a class toolkit?

Why not the other way around: a dedicated world-skillline about enchants or alchemy that e.g. prolongs potion effects... Oh, wait...

True, that would be way easier and more likely being accepted.

But some how I wish a little poison interaction to that tree, because potion has interaction too.

Chilly-McFreeze

I agree that often the themes of assasin an poisoning goes hand in hand. I just doubt that ZOS will "force" a class to play around weapon poisons or enchantments.

Harvokaan

wheresbes wrote: »

I would make merciless a toggle, so that you don't have to refresh it and just fire it on the 5th or keep it up for the bonus once full. Also, a better cue should be given when's ready, that would remove the need to look at the bar if a lot of movement is happening and I may have missed a LA.

Cast times on ultimates can also go.

Make it toggle and remove stacks when go into invis, that would make it better but not too op for gankers.

the1andonlyskwex

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

I agree that often the themes of assasin an poisoning goes hand in hand. I just doubt that ZOS will "force" a class to play around weapon poisons or enchantments.

It already annoys me that one of the Siphoning passives relies on potion use.

Tommy_The_Gun

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

I agree that often the themes of assasin an poisoning goes hand in hand. I just doubt that ZOS will "force" a class to play around weapon poisons or enchantments.

It already annoys me that one of the Siphoning passives relies on potion use.

That is actually very good and arguably one of the strongest NB passives, as it enables NB to acumulate ulti points outside of combat. NBs are assasins, so it makes sense for them to be able to start a fight with an ultimate. Also it gives NB a unique vibe & class identity. Assasin / Dark Knight / Blood mage. Idk about you, but I love those themes.

the1andonlyskwex

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

I agree that often the themes of assasin an poisoning goes hand in hand. I just doubt that ZOS will "force" a class to play around weapon poisons or enchantments.

It already annoys me that one of the Siphoning passives relies on potion use.

That is actually very good and arguably one of the strongest NB passives, as it enables NB to acumulate ulti points outside of combat. NBs are assasins, so it makes sense for them to be able to start a fight with an ultimate. Also it gives NB a unique vibe & class identity. Assasin / Dark Knight / Blood mage. Idk about you, but I love those themes.

Not everybody like to burn consumables all the time (especially out of combat). NB is the only class with such a requirement. I'd rather have pretty much any other ult generation passive in the game.

Foxtrot39

So can we all agree the following skills are outdated/useless and in dire need of a full rework

Aspect of Terror

A CC which only positive is being a decent AOE sized CC but limited to 3 targets

One morph double the number of enemies you can fear the other make it a trap with an activation delay both where you stand and where you aim

The skill is totaly outclassed by the fighters guild repel evil that grants you minor protection/endurance AOE for 20s + fear on casting for just a slightly shorter range and changing the cost to stam

Mark target

A no cost debuff skill (major breach) lasting 20s that grants a burst heal on kill, but only 1 enemy can be marked at any given time

One morph is a PVP oriented invisibility counter and also extend the mark's duration and the other buff the burst heal effect and give minor berserk for 5s on top of it when killing the target

The kill requirement to get any of its benefits along the target limit make it unreliable and dead useless in PVP or boss fights with no adds while elemental drain give you multi target capability and a bonuses upon damaging the target rather than kill

The burst heal also benefits tanks the most as the healing scale with max hp (as a tank my tooltip shows 31k instant heal while unbuffed, by far the largest instant heal I am aware off in game that isn't an ult) but you can't decide when the target die to get the massive burst heal when you need it so its not used by tanks

Consumming darkness

A small AOE granting major protection for 18s with a massive snare effect, ally can use a synergy to turn invisible and get a burst heal

Morph either adds damage or allow major protection buff to remain even when out of the AOE until ult timer expire

This is a defence oriented skill, the caster gets nothing out of it worth a ult skill slot ever since damage mitigation got nerfed by a factor of x6, the skill worth was entirely dependent on major protection's damage mitigation wich has been gutted a long time ago

Captain_OP

Foxtrot39 wrote: »

Mark target

A no cost debuff skill (major breach) lasting 20s that grants a burst heal on kill, but only 1 enemy can be marked at any given time

One morph is a PVP oriented invisibility counter and also extend the mark's duration and the other buff the burst heal effect and give minor berserk for 5s on top of it when killing the target

The kill requirement to get any of its benefits along the target limit make it unreliable and dead useless in PVP or boss fights with no adds while elemental drain give you multi target capability and a bonuses upon damaging the target rather than kill

The burst heal also benefits tanks the most as the healing scale with max hp (as a tank my tooltip shows 31k instant heal while unbuffed, by far the largest instant heal I am aware off in game that isn't an ult) but you can't decide when the target die to get the massive burst heal when you need it so its not used by tanks

I think i would like to see dd/pvp morph and a tank morph, since Veiled Strike doesnt apply major breach anymore it is cool to have some access to such a skill.

PvP/DD Morph could stay almost as it is right now, maybe a stronger heal.
PVE/Tank morph could be the heal removed and the limitation to be at only one target. Maybe a aoe or target close targets aswell and give flanking attacks minor or major berserk.

Hescrow

1- Cloak duration is too short, needs double times for avoiding spam and having sustain issue, otherwise give 30% speed up at least
2- Shadow Image would be good to first cast at a target range instead of itself

master_vanargand

Was Nightblade deserted?
Hopeless PTS patchnote

burglar

master_vanargand wrote: »

Was Nightblade deserted?
Hopeless PTS patchnote

I don't know. Part of me feels like this hybridization patch makes melee magicka nightblade viable, finally. As someone who has been providing AP to everyone else in cyrodiil forever, I look forward to finding combos that work. Like, using 2h on back bar for momentum for major sorc/brut before entering battle is a huge buff. Granted, these changes might not be realized by all to the same extent as some classes. However, the classes receiving the largest buff from this have been dealing with being irrelevant for years.

One thing I have been wishing for is to add major sorc/brut to siphoning strikes. Having access via momentum is great, but I don't want to be forced to use 2h for the pre-emptive major sorc buff, if possible.

Don't get me wrong, though. I feel you. The average changes to nightblades are bug fixes and nerfs.

Scallan

Foxtrot39 wrote: »

So can we all agree the following skills are outdated/useless and in dire need of a full rework

Aspect of Terror

A CC which only positive is being a decent AOE sized CC but limited to 3 targets

One morph double the number of enemies you can fear the other make it a trap with an activation delay both where you stand and where you aim

The skill is totaly outclassed by the fighters guild repel evil that grants you minor protection/endurance AOE for 20s + fear on casting for just a slightly shorter range and changing the cost to stam

Mark target

A no cost debuff skill (major breach) lasting 20s that grants a burst heal on kill, but only 1 enemy can be marked at any given time

One morph is a PVP oriented invisibility counter and also extend the mark's duration and the other buff the burst heal effect and give minor berserk for 5s on top of it when killing the target

The kill requirement to get any of its benefits along the target limit make it unreliable and dead useless in PVP or boss fights with no adds while elemental drain give you multi target capability and a bonuses upon damaging the target rather than kill

The burst heal also benefits tanks the most as the healing scale with max hp (as a tank my tooltip shows 31k instant heal while unbuffed, by far the largest instant heal I am aware off in game that isn't an ult) but you can't decide when the target die to get the massive burst heal when you need it so its not used by tanks

Consumming darkness

A small AOE granting major protection for 18s with a massive snare effect, ally can use a synergy to turn invisible and get a burst heal

Morph either adds damage or allow major protection buff to remain even when out of the AOE until ult timer expire

This is a defence oriented skill, the caster gets nothing out of it worth a ult skill slot ever since damage mitigation got nerfed by a factor of x6, the skill worth was entirely dependent on major protection's damage mitigation wich has been gutted a long time ago

Two of the abilities you referenced have great PVP utility and are still very relevant, not useless. Also many Nightblades run Reapers Mark over Piercing Mark because it's far more valuable in 1vX scenarios, plus the detection time is so short it's not really worth it.

master_vanargand

ProbablePaul wrote: »

master_vanargand wrote: »

Was Nightblade deserted?
Hopeless PTS patchnote

One thing I have been wishing for is to add major sorc/brut to siphoning strikes. Having access via momentum is great, but I don't want to be forced to use 2h for the pre-emptive major sorc buff, if possible.

Yes, I wanted move major Sorcery/Brutality to Siphoning Strikes.
I strongly wish that it will be that way.

rbfrgsp

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

I agree that often the themes of assasin an poisoning goes hand in hand. I just doubt that ZOS will "force" a class to play around weapon poisons or enchantments.

It already annoys me that one of the Siphoning passives relies on potion use.

That is actually very good and arguably one of the strongest NB passives, as it enables NB to acumulate ulti points outside of combat. NBs are assasins, so it makes sense for them to be able to start a fight with an ultimate. Also it gives NB a unique vibe & class identity. Assasin / Dark Knight / Blood mage. Idk about you, but I love those themes.

Not everybody like to burn consumables all the time (especially out of combat). NB is the only class with such a requirement. I'd rather have pretty much any other ult generation passive in the game.

That passive is frankly a godsend. You know all those purple pots you get as daily rewards? Quickslot them. Get in the habit of chugging them your whole life. If you e been playing for six months or more you probably have an infinite stack of those things already.

master_vanargand

Nightblade
Assassination
Mark Target
Piercing Mark (morph):
Fixed an issue where the heal from this morph was lower than the base ability.
Increased the duration of the effects to 60 seconds at rank IV, up from 30.

Teleport Strike
Ambush (morph):
Increased the duration of Empower granted from this morph to 10 seconds, up from 3.
This morph now also grants Minor Berserk for its duration.

Shadow
Path of Darkness
Refreshing Path (morph): This morph now also grants Minor Endurance and Intellect for 4 seconds each tick.

Veiled Strike
Surprise Attack (morph): Fixed an issue where this morph had no upgrades as it ranked up. It will now deal 1.1% more damage per rank.

Siphoning
Drain Power: Increased the duration of Major Brutality and Sorcery granted from this ability and its morphs to 30 seconds, up from 20, to make up for the fact that they require a target to gain these effects.
Power Extraction (morph): This morph now also grants the caster Minor Courage for 30 seconds upon dealing damage.

Soul Shred:
Fixed an issue where this ability and its morphs could ignore line of sight in some cases.
Fixed numerous issues where the damage or healing from these abilities could use the wrong stats to scale.

I am extremely disappointed in the changes they've made to Nightblade.
After patchnote, Nightblade is the worst class in PvP.
I am in despair and crying.

[Nightblade's wish]
Need change Drain Power's Major Brutality and Major Sorcery to Siphoning Strikes.
I want move Major Sorcery and Brutality to Siphoning Strikes.
I strongly wish that it will be that way.

Need add Major Savagery and Prophecy to Nightblade class skills.
Need add "While slotted you gain Major Savagery and Prophecy" to Teleport Strike.
I don't want to use Expert Hunter or Magelight.
Nightblade needs free space in the skill slot.
I strongly wish that it will be that way.

Listen to Nightblade's voice.

Sun7dance

I agree 100%!

Power Extraction is the best example:
What is this skill?
AoE Damage? Whirling Blade is much stronger! Not a single player slots this skill because of the damage!
Tank or Support Skill to buff and debuff? Only the caster gets Minor Courage! Really.....what?

How should this skill work in PvP?
Actually it is a spamskill like the other morph. I mean you all know the Magblades finishing with it!
But on a Stamblade you don't spam it, you would just slot it for the buff and it's a pretty weak buff compare to Relentless Focus which gives you 300 weapon and spell damage.
Further you cannot prebuff with it, so you always have to go into the fight and that's not Nightblade Style!
Give us tanky passives and then we can talk!

@ZOS_Gilliam
What is this skill? Tell me please!

RedFireDisco

Once again, magblades get shafted.

DK's got tankier, Sorc got more frag procs, Warden got free 3k pen, Necro got 300 sustain

Ranged magblades don't touch refreshing path it's trash. If you're not running wild hunt or swift jewelry, you're dead.

They gave tiny buffs to pointless NB skills while every other class got buffed. This is complete trash, yet again.

Cloak still doesn't fire many times for no reason and costs 4k. Imagine if Sorc's shields just didn't fire every 7th cast?

NB rely on Cloak for not only the crit damage for their attack but the major resolve.

I can hit cloak, heavy attack and just have cloak disappear after a second whilst not being target, receive no damage when fighting NPC's.

I have to slot mist form because at least it works most times and even then not always. So, I lose a spot on my bar because a damn class skill doesn't work

master_vanargand

RedFireDisco wrote: »

They gave tiny buffs to pointless NB skills while every other class got buffed. This is complete trash, yet again.

I agree with your opinion.
Even if you buff a skill that no one uses, no one will use it.
Nightblade has no free space in skill slots.

Sun7dance

If you want to use Nightblade's biggest weapon (crit.), you are squishy. That's ok, that's the compromise!
So we need movement.
Does Nightblades have a decent speed bonus?
Nope!
As already correctly mentioned, we always need swift, wild hunt or bow.

The biggest joke is that a crit class doesn't have any class skill for major savergy and major prophecy.
This is just ridiculous!

But why am I complaining?

Piercing Mark (morph):
Increased the duration of the effects to 60 seconds at rank IV, up from 30.


Sorry, i'm done...

RedFireDisco

...AND - They just changed the CP passives for single target and direct damage to 6% from 10

So for a magblade hitting someone who has ironclad passive (nerfed to 6%) we lose a net 4%

So 4 freakin' percent damage loss whilst Wardens get a minor breach to their main ability (worth around 4.5%^) more damage
Sorcs get more frag procs, DK just got a boosty shield and significantly cheaper talons.

Necro got massive sustain buffs to both resources.

Magblade got completely shafted and will go from being the literal weakest class of the 12 (stam & mag) to being even weaker comparatively speaking.

How on earth could this happen?

But let's give the stronger morph minor beserk when they run camo hunter anyway

WordsOfPower

1. Mark target needs some love for pvp
2. Soul Tether is clunky and doesn't go off a decent amount of the time