[Class Rep] Nightblade Feedback Thread

Strider__Roshin

Narvuntien wrote: »

Hemorrhage
With an assasination ability slotted

Gains Minor Force

Dealing Critical Damage grants you and your group Minor Savagery, increasing Weapon Critical Strike rating by 657 for 20 seconds.

Part of the reason NB are so strong in PVE is that have a bonus crit damage over and above minor force. I suggest they just get minor force so it cannot be stacked.

This will be a buff to solo players....

Remove the Major Defile from Death Stroke, I think that is the biggest frustration with the skill, its just too overloaded for how little it costs. Killers blade is such a good execute I just don't feel like I need that defile. Incap, Killers blade, Dead.

Nightblades need to be top dog in pve otherwise there wouldn't be a point in bringing them due to how difficult their rotation is. Remember when they had comparable DPS to stamDKs? People just brought in DKs. Why? Because they were easier to use. Higher risk should be associated with higher reward. Hence why stam needs to deal significantly more damage than magicka in order to justify bringing them into trials.

Removing defile from Incap is a terrible suggestion. It would literally kill the move in PvP, and would make killing anything tanky near impossible. Not to mention it's a single target ultimate. Templars have a hard hitting spammable that causes Major defile called Dark Flare, and wardens have an AoE heal that causes Major Defile to enemies called corrupting pollen. You can let Nightblades have their only class defile associated with their ultimate.

RusevCrush

Stamblade main here. PVE only. I'm only concerned with 1 thing. Our damage ceiling. I think the gap between nb's and other classes needs to be noticeable with every patch. Very disheartening to think a shielded up ranged sorc with multiple pets and a far less challenging rotation can pull similar numbers. Keep us damage king. Otherwise what's the point.

Silver_Strider

_Salty_ wrote: »

Ive mained a Nightblade tank since console launch. It used to be a very dynamic way of tanking. Every update has gutted the class skills that defined the spec. Its a shred of its former glory. We are left with using sets to replace these skills.

My guild used to love running with me because I provided off heals and extra damage that made Vet dungeon runs quick and painless. While a Nightblade lacked group synergies and skills/passives/utilities that benifit the whole group, they made up for by providing what other tanks cannot. It had an identity.

There are obvious pain points stated by others that I wont bother touching on since they have been heavily discussed.

2 pain points.

1. Power extraction is pure garbage. Under powered and honestly a lazy half baked morph that provides nothing unique.

There is no reason to pick this skill on a stamblade unless you hate yourself. Id rather slam my baby maker in a car door than slot this skill.

Zos decided to make Nighblades a disease class. The skill does disease damage but there isn't anything disease related about it other than scaling. Make it have a percent chance to proc minor defile like siphoning had a 15% chance of procing resource return. (I believe they should remove the befoul CP all together and take a look at defile sets in general) I say this since it ties into Zos's half baked idea of disease/Nightbade pairing.

Or what Id prefer is to make it an AOE taunt, or heroism or both. Nightblade has access to maim with shades so why not give minor heroism through another skill so nightblades dont have to run heroic slash if they dont want to.

Or Just up the damage or reduce cost.

Give stamina Nightblade tanks(or all specs ) a reason to run it. Currently their isn't one. For a skill called power extraction it only extract the casters stamina. You can do better Zos.

2. No group utility other than ult gen.

There is no reason to take a Nightblade tank of any spec over a DK or even a Warden in the hardest content. Now before someone says "hurdur I have tanked all content on my Nightblade, L2P Salty" remind yourselves that Templar and Nightblade are still far behind in their current state. This is fact.

Idea for group utilty:

Make dark cloak morph heal the caster and provide an AOE minor protection to the group in a 8 Meter radius. Up the protection time for the group to 8 seconds and keep the timer at 3 seconds for the caster. This will provide protection to all the mele stam and mele mag specs. Its supposed to be a cloak right? This might encourage different group compositions and give Nightblades a niche for tanking. As we know tanks can be more than meat shields and each one should provide different group benifits.

I could go on. But Ill keep the giant wall of text to a minimum.

I don't think Dark Cloak really needs to be a group buff. There are other places utility could be placed, such as with any of the under performing skills in NB's toolkit.
Debilitate could easily be changed into a Minor Lifesteal option, giving NB Tanks and Healers a minor utility skill that won't break them, while also making Debilitate worth a damn.
Reaper's Mark getting Minor Vulnerability instantly makes the skill usable for everyone that doesn't PvP since Piercing will still be the go to morph for that.
Blur getting a Synergy for the group that offers its buffs to others. Tanks already use it for the Major Evasion so it's just a bonus for the group at that point.

As for Power Extraction, I'm really not sure what to do with it honestly. With a name like Power Extraction, you'd think it would give something like Major Maim and reduce the damage enemies do, which I feel would instantly make the skill actually pretty good as a group utility skill but I'm hesitant to actually suggest that since NB already has access to AoE Minor Maims that a AoE Major Maim might be a little much, especially in relation to the rest of their toolkit which already makes them super annoying to fight against at full strength, let alone at 55% strength.

Mazbt

Please take a look at incap. I know some selfish nb's who wants to keep their powerful toy will be in denial but it needs an adjustment. Get rid of ONE of the perks. increase cost, or delete major defile, or slight damage decrease, or stun removal.

JobooAGS

Mazbt wrote: »

Please take a look at incap. I know some selfish nb's who wants to keep their powerful toy will be in denial but it needs an adjustment. Get rid of ONE of the perks. increase cost, or delete major defile, or slight damage decrease, or stun removal.

Take the stun, and make the ult so that stamblades wont all flock to soul harvest due to ult on kill > disease damage and we have a deal

NightbladeMechanics

_Salty_ wrote: »

Ive mained a Nightblade tank since console launch. It used to be a very dynamic way of tanking. Every update has gutted the class skills that defined the spec. Its a shred of its former glory. We are left with using sets to replace these skills.

My guild used to love running with me because I provided off heals and extra damage that made Vet dungeon runs quick and painless. While a Nightblade lacked group synergies and skills/passives/utilities that benifit the whole group, they made up for by providing what other tanks cannot. It had an identity.

There are obvious pain points stated by others that I wont bother touching on since they have been heavily discussed.

2 pain points.

1. Power extraction is pure garbage. Under powered and honestly a lazy half baked morph that provides nothing unique.

There is no reason to pick this skill on a stamblade unless you hate yourself. Id rather slam my baby maker in a car door than slot this skill.

Zos decided to make Nighblades a disease class. The skill does disease damage but there isn't anything disease related about it other than scaling. Make it have a percent chance to proc minor defile like siphoning had a 15% chance of procing resource return. (I believe they should remove the befoul CP all together and take a look at defile sets in general) I say this since it ties into Zos's half baked idea of disease/Nightbade pairing.

Or what Id prefer is to make it an AOE taunt, or heroism or both. Nightblade has access to maim with shades so why not give minor heroism through another skill so nightblades dont have to run heroic slash if they dont want to.

Or Just up the damage or reduce cost.

Give stamina Nightblade tanks(or all specs ) a reason to run it. Currently their isn't one. For a skill called power extraction it only extract the casters stamina. You can do better Zos.

2. No group utility other than ult gen.

There is no reason to take a Nightblade tank of any spec over a DK or even a Warden in the hardest content. Now before someone says "hurdur I have tanked all content on my Nightblade, L2P Salty" remind yourselves that Templar and Nightblade are still far behind in their current state. This is fact.

Idea for group utilty:

Make dark cloak morph heal the caster and provide an AOE minor protection to the group in a 8 Meter radius. Up the protection time for the group to 8 seconds and keep the timer at 3 seconds for the caster. This will provide protection to all the mele stam and mele mag specs. Its supposed to be a cloak right? This might encourage different group compositions and give Nightblades a niche for tanking. As we know tanks can be more than meat shields and each one should provide different group benifits.

I could go on. But Ill keep the giant wall of text to a minimum.

I would like to hear your giant wall.

Maryal

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Maryal wrote: »

This thread is supposed to be for 'pain points' only ... not solutions, not opinions about what is OP and needs to be nerfed.

* Pain points are not complaints/comments about NBs, their class, or their skills

* Pain points are complaints from NBs about what frustrates them about playing their class (what they are having problems with, what is making it difficult for them to play their class, etc.)

I don't want to call anyone out in particular on this, but I think it's important for it to be said in hopes that this thread doesn't end up like the overwhelming majority of other threads about NBs. Just saying.

"Pain points" refers to both frustrations playing as or playing against nightblades. Imbalances will cause frustrations in both directions.

We want to hear how players feel about nightblades as nightblade mains, as players completely unfamiliar with nightblades who only play against them, and every shade of gray in between. Don't worry, we'll be able to tell the complainer dribble apart from meaningful feedback. We've been around the block more than once.

I apologize for whatever I said that made you think I viewed the community reps as somehow lacking the ability to sort out relevant from irrelevant information. I assure you that thought never entered my mind.

Without a doubt, the ability to sift through the written comments and pull out relevant data is important. But, that's just half of it. The other half is having a large enough data pool to make this type of 'information gathering' statistically significant. And, by that, I mean the importance having as many unique user names as possible posting their comments in the community rep threads.

Unfortunately there is a problem - many people have not be willing to post on the forums - they avoid it. Why? What's the point when so many reasonably made comments (either their own or from others ) are simply ridiculed, belittled, or denigrated by others as if it were some sort of game.

When I read the post from Gina that said "The purpose of this thread is to give you a place to post your current top two pain points ..." I got a little excited and thought for once, we would actually have a place where people having issues playing their class could post their 'pains' without all the negative and tunnel-visioned comments. It was refreshing to think we would have a place to actually have meaningful dialog, you know, where people would actually speak up (not be afraid to speak up) ... people who (for the most part) were working off the same page. I was sad to find out otherwise when I read your comment.


My 'pain point' - not having a place on the forums to discuss issues with the NB class/skills without the discussion getting derailed by haters and know-it-alls.

efster

I main a NB and I do all 3 roles (on the same toon, swapping attributes, CP, and gear) and my NB pain points are both related to tanking.

1. No class based root. Silver leash going back to pulling enemies again is a fantastic change -- but chaining in ranged casters without a root just means they're going to run right out of the stack unless the group has massive AOE DPS, which isn't always going to happen in pugs. I personally rarely run with pugs, but I think that a tank needs to be able to do their job in any situation, not just in an optimised group.

Yes, we can use Time Stop, but it's not a class skill and it's paywalled, and NBs already have a skill that deals with Fear. Thematically, fear can cause you to flee OR be frozen in place. So, I would like to see a change to the Manifestation of Terror morph to turn into a root IF the caster has a taunt on the enemy, i.e.

Conceal two sinister traps, one at the targeted location and another next to you, which arm after 3 seconds. When each trap is triggered, a dark spirit is summoned to terrify 2 enemies, causing them to flee in fear for 4 seconds.|Even after recovering, the enemy has their movement speed reduced by 50% for 4 seconds.

If the enemies are Taunted, they will be frozen in fear for the duration instead of fleeing.

So a NB tank would have to first lay down Terror traps, then range taunt, then chain, in order to root enemies. Pain in the proverbial, perhaps, but active and challenging, like NB tanking in general.

2. No class shield. I don't want something like Igneous Shield or Hardened Ward as NBs are not a "shield" class -- we're about evasion and mitigation, but you can't dodge and Minor Ward/Resolve your way through the vCR gryphon bleed, 2 Mantikoras and 4 Lamias in vSO or on Refabrication execute phase. Our lack of options for reliable shields (thanks for taking Harness away, ZoS, really appreciate it ) basically means that a NB tank needs a healer to babysit them far more often than the other classes -- who all have either massive shields or burst heals -- do. This has improved A LOT with the Dark Cloak change, but it's not enough.

I don't know what would work well, though, without being OP, I just know that Bone Shield is not great and we have no other decent options for a shield unless I'm missing something very obvious. And again, I don't want a massive shield with one button-press or a spammable. I want one that requires the NB to do stuff to maintain.

Narvuntien

JobooAGS wrote: »

What patch are you in? Minor force is 10% now

Argh! it is so hard to get accurate information, I had just googled its value apparently that is out of date.. i don't just remember their values off the top of my head.

Daus wrote: »

Nightblades need to be top dog in pve otherwise there wouldn't be a point in bringing them due to how difficult their rotation is. Remember when they had comparable DPS to stamDKs? People just brought in DKs. Why? Because they were easier to use. Higher risk should be associated with higher reward. Hence why stam needs to deal significantly more damage than magicka in order to justify bringing them into trials.

Removing defile from Incap is a terrible suggestion. It would literally kill the move in PvP, and would make killing anything tanky near impossible. Not to mention it's a single target ultimate. Templars have a hard hitting spammable that causes Major defile called Dark Flare, and wardens have an AoE heal that causes Major Defile to enemies called corrupting pollen. You can let Nightblades have their only class defile associated with their ultimate.

That kind of seems a bit unfair to other classes, you have a class that is the best in PVE and PVP and has stack of ultilty. You just can't have everything. Now perhaps I will agree Stamblade should have the best dps but right now Magblade also has the best DPS and that's is a problem with their ranged auto attacks and potential for healing. Look I'd nerf both then buff stamblade again that would just be a numbers tweak. Magnbs whined about the funnel health change and they are still top dog for dps . The point is that you like the playstyle and the challange of playing nightblade

Please take a look at incap. I know some selfish nb's who wants to keep their powerful toy will be in denial but it needs an adjustment. Get rid of ONE of the perks. increase cost, or delete major defile, or slight damage decrease, or stun removal.

As for the second point basically this. Being tanky is how you should be able to beat an assassin. An assassin should have to pick their target not just take anyone out. Plus you still have tools for stopping healing, cost poisons, powerful defile sets lethal arrow. Heavy armor builds can struggle more with sustain than medium/light builds. You can shred armor with surprise attack. I choose removing defile mostly because large amounts of defile in PVP atm and I'd still prefer access to the stun. My PVP build is the turbo Incap build so I don't want its cost increased or damage reduced.

Aztlan

Long-time stamblade main here, both PvE and PvP.

1) I would like to see a buff to Power Extraction such that it might sometimes be a better AoE option than Steel Tornado. It would be great if this helped to make stamblades more viable in larger organized PvP groups.

2) I'm sick and tired of people complaining about Incapacitating Strike. NBs are supposed to be assassins. They should continue to have a strong, cheap, but dodgable single-target ultimate. It's fine. If anything, figure out how to buff Soul Harvest to make it more attractive.

xI_The_Owl_Ix

As a Nightblade Tank Main, who completed several vet Trials and all vet DLC dungeons (hardmode):


1. Lack of a decent PvE AoE CC
- This is one of the bigger issues the NB Tank has. We only have "Aspect of Terror" and that usually doesnt work in PvE or it doesnt benefit the group, scattering the Mob around. The only use I found for "Mass Hysteria" was in vet Fang Lair Hardmode to get the scarabs away from me. But then again the DPS had to look out for them because the scarabs were running around.
Suggestion: Change the "Manifestation of Terror" Morph so it doesnt "fear" the enemies anymore instead it roots/immobolizes them in fear at one place/holds the ads with shadow/ghost arms on one spot.


2. Bad resource management
- "Siphoning Strikes" doesnt benefit the NB Tank at all. It forces us to light attack to gain 100 Stamina/Magicka each hit. It also punishes heavy attack weaving by giving only 100 Stamina/Magicka back, just like light attacking. The 20 secs timer of the morph is too long as well.
Suggestion: Give heavy attacking more than 100 Stamina/Magicka.
Give an additional Stamina/Magicka at the end of the 20secs based on your max Health (for example: You restore up to 4270 additonal Stamina as well as extra Stamina/Magicka based on 8% of your max Health). That should keep the DPS resource management fair while giving Tanks with more HP more resources.
OR shorten the 20sec timer by 1sec per heavy armor piece equipped. That would mean we get a 13 seconds timer if we wear 7 heavy pieces. (shorter time to get anything back from light attacks but faster additonal resources)

Other issues:
- 16secs Major Ward/Major Resolve for having 7 piece heavy is way too short if you compare it with DKs 30sec one
- "Executioner" passive should be reworked to include Tanks to give them resources back
- Put "Blur" and Morphs into the Shadow Tree

Juhasow

Make Shadowy Disguise reducing stamina recovery by X and increasing magicka recovery by Y where X > Y..

Strider__Roshin

Mazbt wrote: »

Please take a look at incap. I know some selfish nb's who wants to keep their powerful toy will be in denial but it needs an adjustment. Get rid of ONE of the perks. increase cost, or delete major defile, or slight damage decrease, or stun removal.

The stun is the only effect you could take away without killing the move in PvP or PvE.

Datthaw

Daus wrote: »

Mazbt wrote: »

Please take a look at incap. I know some selfish nb's who wants to keep their powerful toy will be in denial but it needs an adjustment. Get rid of ONE of the perks. increase cost, or delete major defile, or slight damage decrease, or stun removal.

The stun is the only effect you could take away without killing the move in PvP or PvE.

I would be ok with no stun. Most of the nb's I see that are better than I am (which is alot of them) mainly use fear as the cc and dump it every cc immunity cd. I don't think alot of us would really lose much from the stun being absent. I feel this would really only hurt the 1 shot ganker builds which might make everyone happy...besides the gankers ofcourse.

ZOS_JesC

Greetings, we will be actively removing comments that do not follow our forum guidelines and have not remained on topic with the thread. Thank you for your understanding.

oXI_Viper_IXo

@ZOS_GinaBruno still waiting for a response to my initial post so that I might respond properly to this thread.

Shinshadow

The one thing that I would LOVE to see happen, is make it to where nightblades can actually cloak AND stealth in dungeons / trials. It feels silly that the basis of our class is to be stealthy, but we can't use it to our benefit in endgame content.

NightbladeMechanics

oXI_Viper_IXo wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno still waiting for a response to my initial post so that I might respond properly to this thread.

See my reply to this person here:

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Maryal wrote: »

This thread is supposed to be for 'pain points' only ... not solutions, not opinions about what is OP and needs to be nerfed.

* Pain points are not complaints/comments about NBs, their class, or their skills

* Pain points are complaints from NBs about what frustrates them about playing their class (what they are having problems with, what is making it difficult for them to play their class, etc.)

I don't want to call anyone out in particular on this, but I think it's important for it to be said in hopes that this thread doesn't end up like the overwhelming majority of other threads about NBs. Just saying.

"Pain points" refers to both frustrations playing as or playing against nightblades. Imbalances will cause frustrations in both directions.

We want to hear how players feel about nightblades as nightblade mains, as players completely unfamiliar with nightblades who only play against them, and every shade of gray in between. Don't worry, we'll be able to tell the complainer dribble apart from meaningful feedback. We've been around the block more than once.

We want to know how you feel about the class. What frustrates you as a nightblade main, when playing against nightblades, and every other facet of play involving nightblades belongs in this thread.

NightbladeMechanics

Maryal wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Maryal wrote: »

This thread is supposed to be for 'pain points' only ... not solutions, not opinions about what is OP and needs to be nerfed.

* Pain points are not complaints/comments about NBs, their class, or their skills

* Pain points are complaints from NBs about what frustrates them about playing their class (what they are having problems with, what is making it difficult for them to play their class, etc.)

I don't want to call anyone out in particular on this, but I think it's important for it to be said in hopes that this thread doesn't end up like the overwhelming majority of other threads about NBs. Just saying.

"Pain points" refers to both frustrations playing as or playing against nightblades. Imbalances will cause frustrations in both directions.

We want to hear how players feel about nightblades as nightblade mains, as players completely unfamiliar with nightblades who only play against them, and every shade of gray in between. Don't worry, we'll be able to tell the complainer dribble apart from meaningful feedback. We've been around the block more than once.

I apologize for whatever I said that made you think I viewed the community reps as somehow lacking the ability to sort out relevant from irrelevant information. I assure you that thought never entered my mind.

Without a doubt, the ability to sift through the written comments and pull out relevant data is important. But, that's just half of it. The other half is having a large enough data pool to make this type of 'information gathering' statistically significant. And, by that, I mean the importance having as many unique user names as possible posting their comments in the community rep threads.

Unfortunately there is a problem - many people have not be willing to post on the forums - they avoid it. Why? What's the point when so many reasonably made comments (either their own or from others ) are simply ridiculed, belittled, or denigrated by others as if it were some sort of game.

When I read the post from Gina that said "The purpose of this thread is to give you a place to post your current top two pain points ..." I got a little excited and thought for once, we would actually have a place where people having issues playing their class could post their 'pains' without all the negative and tunnel-visioned comments. It was refreshing to think we would have a place to actually have meaningful dialog, you know, where people would actually speak up (not be afraid to speak up) ... people who (for the most part) were working off the same page. I was sad to find out otherwise when I read your comment.


My 'pain point' - not having a place on the forums to discuss issues with the NB class/skills without the discussion getting derailed by haters and know-it-alls.

The point is to be heard.

If you wish to have an intelligent and valuable conversation about nightblade balance, then by all means, let's have one. I read every comment in this thread, and myself and many other players are willing to carry such a conversation with you.

However, class balance is a two-way street. We need to take into account how each class performs from the perspectives of those playing it and those playing against it. I will not attempt to limit a class feedback thread to only that class's mains.

And we also need to collect the broad data sample which you referenced. It's impossible to filter every comment based on how knowledgeable the player is or its content before it is posted, so it's the forum mods' job to delete off topic or hateful comments after they're made, and our job to mentally disregard uninformed ones after we read them.

If you cannot muster the mental fortitude to carry a conversation with those sorts of comments in the mix, ignoring them, then sorry, but you won't last very long on the internet or playing an mmo game.

We're here listening to you. If you want to be heard, then now's your opportunity. Lots of others have.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO

1) Lack of good class ultimates Soul Tether thens a human sacrifice in order to land them it’s broken 1.2 seconds longer.

2) Countering DoTs on a stamina build is like fighting a fire with a water gun. You can’t give us all HoTs and no burst then start cutting our damage. We can’t burst heal and we are getting a burst damage nerfed every update so how are we to fight?

Maryal

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Maryal wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Maryal wrote: »

This thread is supposed to be for 'pain points' only ... not solutions, not opinions about what is OP and needs to be nerfed.

* Pain points are not complaints/comments about NBs, their class, or their skills

* Pain points are complaints from NBs about what frustrates them about playing their class (what they are having problems with, what is making it difficult for them to play their class, etc.)

I don't want to call anyone out in particular on this, but I think it's important for it to be said in hopes that this thread doesn't end up like the overwhelming majority of other threads about NBs. Just saying.

"Pain points" refers to both frustrations playing as or playing against nightblades. Imbalances will cause frustrations in both directions.

We want to hear how players feel about nightblades as nightblade mains, as players completely unfamiliar with nightblades who only play against them, and every shade of gray in between. Don't worry, we'll be able to tell the complainer dribble apart from meaningful feedback. We've been around the block more than once.

I apologize for whatever I said that made you think I viewed the community reps as somehow lacking the ability to sort out relevant from irrelevant information. I assure you that thought never entered my mind.

Without a doubt, the ability to sift through the written comments and pull out relevant data is important. But, that's just half of it. The other half is having a large enough data pool to make this type of 'information gathering' statistically significant. And, by that, I mean the importance having as many unique user names as possible posting their comments in the community rep threads.

Unfortunately there is a problem - many people have not be willing to post on the forums - they avoid it. Why? What's the point when so many reasonably made comments (either their own or from others ) are simply ridiculed, belittled, or denigrated by others as if it were some sort of game.

When I read the post from Gina that said "The purpose of this thread is to give you a place to post your current top two pain points ..." I got a little excited and thought for once, we would actually have a place where people having issues playing their class could post their 'pains' without all the negative and tunnel-visioned comments. It was refreshing to think we would have a place to actually have meaningful dialog, you know, where people would actually speak up (not be afraid to speak up) ... people who (for the most part) were working off the same page. I was sad to find out otherwise when I read your comment.


My 'pain point' - not having a place on the forums to discuss issues with the NB class/skills without the discussion getting derailed by haters and know-it-alls.

If you cannot muster the mental fortitude to carry a conversation with those sorts of comments in the mix, ignoring them, then sorry, but you won't last very long on the internet or playing an mmo game.

This comment was not helpful and not the type of response one would expect from someone in your newly created position. Instead of asking me how long I have been playing mmos, or have been on the internet, about my education/background, or anything that would help you understand why I said what I did, you simply made a very inaccurate assumption, and missed the far-reaching implications of my main point altogether. If you wish to carry on this conversation any further, it would be better to do so in private, via emails.

hesobad

Soul Harvest should be a ranged ability like Impale.

Soul Harvest is significantly worse that Incap due to not being able to stun your opponent, the only I run Soul Harvest in PvP or PvE is for the ulti gen and that's it. I don't use if for damage, Meteor is a much better ult than Soul Harvest for damage that can be used at range. I only slot SH for the ult, than have to decide if I'm going to use meteor or resto ult back bar.

I don't like that Mag NBs in pvp don't have a reliable stun or crowd control ability apart from our fear which requires you to be in melee range. Sorcs have Rune Cage which is so insanely overpowered in pvp and especially BGs. I would like to see the Mag NB have some kind of reliable CC other than fear.

Also; Mag NBs are completely dead if theyre stunned or rooted in pvp especially BGs. Our only form of using a shadow ability which is a very short duration and can not be used while stunned

Gorilla

Lexxypwns wrote: »

I only have one pain point with Nightblade.

Cloak exists in state much like Schrodinger's Cat. You never know until you cast it if it will be the most OP mechanic in the game or totally useless or somewhere in between. It should consistently be somewhere in between OP and useless.

This is an interesting comment. I would go for a weaker cloak if I could tell whether it was actually working.

Avran_Sylt

Ya know, To be honest there'es always been one thing that bothers me about the nightblade.

The DoT suppression while cloaked.

I mean, honestly, for me that is the LARGEST defensive benefit asides from the second of 'dodge' you get for direct damage projectiles.

That Coldfire Ballista DoT, or the Poison Injection DoT? Cloak, and it aint a problem.

I kinda wish that it wouldn't suppress the DoT (but not break the invisibility), but then expand upon the interactions the class has with stealth and invisibility.

Gorilla

I have played PVE MNB since console launch. I just started PVPing with my BowBlade 30 days ago.

My Pain Points

1. Grim Focus and Morphs -- clumsy, clumsy, clumsy...the skill needs to completely dropped and re-worked. I know its a point of pride with some to master the NB rotation, but it's clumsy skill even with the recent changes.

2. Cloak -- I am happy to take a cut to Incap in exchange for better cloak options. They are a mess now...At least one should have Purge benefits. Also, a NB in cloak should be in cloak; if viewable then that should be noticed.

The class doesn't need to be obnoxious; it just needs to be sneaky. We'll figure out ways to kill things

Oh yea, can we make at least on shades option a permanent pet and please bring back sap tanking.

FloppyTouch

Cloak should do nothing but make you invisible that is all not suppress dots not give crit heals.

Its strong as is with out all the benefits. They should still get a damage boost but nothing else. Make it harder to pull out of stealth but this resetting fights over and over is way to much.

Dots and abilities like curses blowing up should not take a nb out of cloak still take the damage but can stay hidden.

Qbiken

Daus wrote: »

Narvuntien wrote: »

Hemorrhage
With an assasination ability slotted

Gains Minor Force

Dealing Critical Damage grants you and your group Minor Savagery, increasing Weapon Critical Strike rating by 657 for 20 seconds.

Part of the reason NB are so strong in PVE is that have a bonus crit damage over and above minor force. I suggest they just get minor force so it cannot be stacked.

This will be a buff to solo players....

Remove the Major Defile from Death Stroke, I think that is the biggest frustration with the skill, its just too overloaded for how little it costs. Killers blade is such a good execute I just don't feel like I need that defile. Incap, Killers blade, Dead.

Nightblades need to be top dog in pve otherwise there wouldn't be a point in bringing them due to how difficult their rotation is. Remember when they had comparable DPS to stamDKs? People just brought in DKs. Why? Because they were easier to use. Higher risk should be associated with higher reward. Hence why stam needs to deal significantly more damage than magicka in order to justify bringing them into trials.

Removing defile from Incap is a terrible suggestion. It would literally kill the move in PvP, and would make killing anything tanky near impossible. Not to mention it's a single target ultimate. Templars have a hard hitting spammable that causes Major defile called Dark Flare, and wardens have an AoE heal that causes Major Defile to enemies called corrupting pollen. You can let Nightblades have their only class defile associated with their ultimate.

Nightblades are overperforming in PvE. A big part of it is due to the design of the content ZOS creates, that favours certain builds (especially magblades). There´s a reason Cloudrest is called "Nightrest" or "Cloudblade".

Justifying that a certain class need to be #1 due to having a slightly more difficult rotation (which is mastered after a few days of practice btw) than other classes is not a good standpoint for balance.

The problematic thing with incap is the stun. Defiles are a bigger problem that isn´t associated with nightblades.

Edziu

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Ya know, To be honest there'es always been one thing that bothers me about the nightblade.

The DoT suppression while cloaked.

I mean, honestly, for me that is the LARGEST defensive benefit asides from the second of 'dodge' you get for direct damage projectiles.

That Coldfire Ballista DoT, or the Poison Injection DoT? Cloak, and it aint a problem.

I kinda wish that it wouldn't suppress the DoT (but not break the invisibility), but then expand upon the interactions the class has with stealth and invisibility.

you know as on stamblde you wont be able to outheal single cold balista without dot surpress with just vigor and rally ticks? (not talking about rally burst heal)
yes if you arnt attacked by enything else you can survive this by those heals but you wont outheal them

FloppyTouch wrote: »

Cloak should do nothing but make you invisible that is all not suppress dots not give crit heals.

Its strong as is with out all the benefits. They should still get a damage boost but nothing else. Make it harder to pull out of stealth but this resetting fights over and over is way to much.

Dots and abilities like curses blowing up should not take a nb out of cloak still take the damage but can stay hidden.

WTB more/better heals for stampblade becasue this will just overkill stamblade (not surpressing dots in cloak etc) which have even no single class stamia heal and even when tis going to healing stamblade outside potions have no single buffs to additional healing which have many other classes

EDIT: many qq about cloak which can surpress dots....but they even dont know how these dots are just melting nb's at any dot builds
we now lost your crit heals while in cloak and now its much harder to sruvive especially on noncp because here we have jsut pathetic heals and tbh cant outheal any dot build without cloak, we can get stacked 3k+/sec daamge from dots whiel with vigor and rally tikcing we can achieve average maybe 1.5k healing/s to which are comming ofc normal direct damage for which now we dont have more options to heal if we dont vanish

Datthaw

Edziu wrote: »

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Ya know, To be honest there'es always been one thing that bothers me about the nightblade.

The DoT suppression while cloaked.

I mean, honestly, for me that is the LARGEST defensive benefit asides from the second of 'dodge' you get for direct damage projectiles.

That Coldfire Ballista DoT, or the Poison Injection DoT? Cloak, and it aint a problem.

I kinda wish that it wouldn't suppress the DoT (but not break the invisibility), but then expand upon the interactions the class has with stealth and invisibility.

you know as on stamblde you wont be able to outheal single cold balista without dot surpress with just vigor and rally ticks? (not talking about rally burst heal)
yes if you arnt attacked by enything else you can survive this by those heals but you wont outheal them

FloppyTouch wrote: »

Cloak should do nothing but make you invisible that is all not suppress dots not give crit heals.

Its strong as is with out all the benefits. They should still get a damage boost but nothing else. Make it harder to pull out of stealth but this resetting fights over and over is way to much.

Dots and abilities like curses blowing up should not take a nb out of cloak still take the damage but can stay hidden.

WTB more/better heals for stampblade becasue this will just overkill stamblade (not surpressing dots in cloak etc) which have even no single class stamia heal and even when tis going to healing stamblade outside potions have no single buffs to additional healing which have many other classes

They need to just buff siege damage like...alot in vet pvp. I've been rolling a hybrid through kyne and the amount of damage you take from siege there it's like 3x vet. Vet players have gotten used to just standing in siege and using a purge. kyne you get popped by 2-3 siege at similar times there's a really good chance you're dead just from the initial damage, never mind the dot. They need to make siege more effective in vet in my humble opinion.

Btw kena what's the chance of PVP, PVE reps. I'm a little disappointed they don't want our opinion on cyro, reps are a great idea and long over due, but why not for pvp and pve?

Edit, I get that there is a whole pvp combat and skills section but that section is scattered salty and very biased. Would be nice to have this 2 pain point discussion on it.

Edziu

and another thing as for nb..its stealthy class yes? so why this doesnt have any passive like we have in vampire dark stalker which decrease movement speed penalty in hide

Im just sick like every but every nb is forced to go for vampire even skipping other passives jsut to have this dark stalker as its must have especailly for stamblade

magblade dont need it, magblade ca go only for mist form or regen passives but at all magblade dont need vampire for pvp, he have cloak and concealed weapon

stamblade? how not much magica for cloaing to run in it with normal speed, stamnb mostly is forced to go in crouch if dont want to be seen and only for this going is stealth is forced to be vampire because if not he is movion slowly like he jsut got arrow in knee shot and almost cant move while in crouch