Sorc 1.6.3 Preview (From Livestream)

kkampaseb17_ESO

If they allow crits and procs, that will be enough imo. Further reducing 15% is a tad overkill I think.

XEVENEX

Nightreaver wrote: »

Not sure what to make of the change to Lightning Splash.

At 4M it isn't one of the smallest, it is THE smallest AOE in the game. A 2nd target would need to be standing on the shoulders of the first in order to hit it.

You know whats really sad? 4M is how far Bolt Escape and its morphs teleports us. I can freekin jump 4 meters IRL without using any magicka.

Vis

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

woodsro wrote: »

I have decided to shelf my sorc for now. Leveling a templar using heavy armor, I have pretty good build in mind for it.

I'd really rather play my sorc, I miss bolt escape, but maybe they will fix it down the road, but as it stands now it doesn't look like it will be competitive now. 1.6 sorc is actually worse in many ways from the 1.5 sorc.

The large numbers, big magic pool doesn't make up for the light armor terrible damage mitigation and the coming Nerf to shields along with CS Being 1 or 2 shotted with a two handed weapon don't sound fun.

Prior to this nerf I could probably survive somewhat but now, those damage shields will be worthless and gap closer spam, crit charge in particular will all but ensure death quite quickly.

I really hope i can go back to my sorc one day sadly I doubt that will be anytime soon.

got on pts again to try some variations with LA and using 70 cp against a dk with 70 cp he 2 shot me with 1 shield up. roughly 30k health/shield total. crit charge+ wrecking blow = game over.

And with auto reflect up the whole time too no doubt.

I wish the devs would note how often frags kills ourselves. On my dk, timing a reflect on frag (even in mid air) is as natural as breathing. You can't say we have burst if half our burst hits ourselves more than our targets.

We need a better dps option, something that allows for a hybrid. Something that is not auto absorbed, dodged, or reflected by every class/major build in-game.

Vis

XEVENEX wrote: »

Nightreaver wrote: »

Not sure what to make of the change to Lightning Splash.

At 4M it isn't one of the smallest, it is THE smallest AOE in the game. A 2nd target would need to be standing on the shoulders of the first in order to hit it.

You know whats really sad? 4M is how far Bolt Escape and its morphs teleports us. I can freekin jump 4 meters IRL without using any magicka.

You're a real life sorc???

(Impressed)

Vis

XEVENEX wrote: »

Nightreaver wrote: »

Not sure what to make of the change to Lightning Splash.

At 4M it isn't one of the smallest, it is THE smallest AOE in the game. A 2nd target would need to be standing on the shoulders of the first in order to hit it.

You know whats really sad? 4M is how far Bolt Escape and its morphs teleports us. I can freekin jump 4 meters IRL without using any magicka.

But really, bolt these days is just a freebie for 2h'ers to crit us in the back with charge. It's like doing them a favor.

Dracane

Vis wrote: »

I wish the devs would note how often frags kills ourselves. On my dk, timing a reflect on frag (even in mid air) is as natural as breathing. You can't say we have burst if half our burst hits ourselves more than our targets.

We need a better dps option, something that allows for a hybrid. Something that is not auto absorbed, dodged, or reflected by every class/major build in-game.

I don't even know, who had the idea to claim "Sorcerers have high burst damage in PvP"

But let's wait a few days. The PTS is a bit empty this week, because of the bug. Next week, everyone is going to see, how OP melee's and tanks are with 3600 CP and how weak Sorc damage and sustain is (especially with the massive nerf to damage shields) Just wait a bit

TheLaw

Here are some ideas:

Surge: Make this a magicka-based version of momentum. RNG based on crits is not reliable.

Skill Description: Focus lightning to gain Major Sorcery for 30 seconds. Also heals X amount every 2 seconds for the duration.

Morphs

Power Surge: The ability now applies the Major Brutality and Major Sorcery buffs.

Rejuvenating Surge: Heals for X amount when the effect ends. The final heal is increased based on the length of the time that Surge has been active. Press ability again to instantly use the heal and refresh the duration.

---

New Ability

Spell Strike: Sorcs need an instant/reliable damage ability.

Skill Description: Conjure a bound weapon, instantly striking a single target for X amount of magic damage. (6 meter range)

Morphs

Lightning Strike: This ability now deals lightning damage and applies minor defile to the target for 6 seconds. (8 meter range)

Hardened Strike: This this ability is now stamina-based and applies minor fracture to the target for 6 seconds. (5 meter range)

Exstazik

Critical Charge:3.5-22m range 3351 Stamina(Adds snare.)
Bolt Escape : 4m 3351 Magicka (Casting again within 4 seconds cost 50% more Magicka.)

Suggestion:Critical Charge:3.5-22m range 3351 Stamina(Adds snare.)
(Casting again within 4 seconds cost 50% more Stamina.)

danovic

The only use i've found for lighting splash is to set up as a sorcerer tank. 5 light 2 heavy sword and board, lightning shield and call it down on yourself. It cooks any mobs on you in pve fast. the duration is useless for pvp as nothing else but npcs will stay in the field long enough. But I think that was intended. Crystal shards useless for this setup. Cook them for a bit and finish them off with the mages wrath. Even use sword and board skill on same bar to taunt them into the field.

Xiroku

My biggest concern is how insignificant light armor is right now, they'd have to give it a huge spell resistance ignore/spell power boost passive for me to even considering going it again. Heavy armor is just far superior to light armor.

Heavy armor gives nearly nearly 5-10x more armor and 3x more spell resist, more HP, and then more healing. Light armor's passive can't compete with that. You can easily make up for the spell cost reduction and magicka regen, the current spell resist ignore is just terrible. The Champion System gives 25% ignore, that's good enough, Medium armor has a physical attack boost, why not give Light Armor a spell power boost?

Aimelin

Xiroku wrote: »

My biggest concern is how insignificant light armor is right now, they'd have to give it a huge spell resistance ignore/spell power boost passive for me to even considering going it again. Heavy armor is just far superior to light armor.

Heavy armor gives nearly nearly 5-10x more armor and 3x more spell resist, more HP, and then more healing. Light armor's passive can't compete with that. You can easily make up for the spell cost reduction and magicka regen, the current spell resist ignore is just terrible. The Champion System gives 25% ignore, that's good enough, Medium armor has a physical attack boost, why not give Light Armor a spell power boost?

What's even more funny is they allready nerfed LA's spell pen before ... now they're going to make "improvements" again? lmao

Nightreaver

Aimelin wrote: »

What's even more funny is they allready nerfed LA's spell pen before ... now they're going to make "improvements" again? lmao

Nah, the funny part is that LA got nerfed due to a bug caused by the Sharpened Trait that LA had nothing to do with. But people whined about LA causing it so it got nerfed and remained nerfed even after the problem was found to be caused by the Sharpened trait.

Seraphyel

TheLaw wrote: »

Here are some ideas:

Surge: Make this a magicka-based version of momentum. RNG based on crits is not reliable.

Skill Description: Focus lightning to gain Major Sorcery for 30 seconds. Also heals X amount every 2 seconds for the duration.

Morphs

Power Surge: The ability now applies the Major Brutality and Major Sorcery buffs.

Rejuvenating Surge: Heals for X amount when the effect ends. The final heal is increased based on the length of the time that Surge has been active. Press ability again to instantly use the heal and refresh the duration.

---

New Ability

Spell Strike: Sorcs need an instant/reliable damage ability.

Skill Description: Conjure a bound weapon, instantly striking a single target for X amount of magic damage. (6 meter range)

Morphs

Lightning Strike: This ability now deals lightning damage and applies minor defile to the target for 6 seconds. (8 meter range)

Hardened Strike: This this ability is now stamina-based and applies minor fracture to the target for 6 seconds. (5 meter range)

A Sorcerer shouldn't be limited to melee range as your Spell Strike insists. Daedric Mines are Melee "enough".

Septimus_Magna

Xiroku wrote: »

My biggest concern is how insignificant light armor is right now, they'd have to give it a huge spell resistance ignore/spell power boost passive for me to even considering going it again. Heavy armor is just far superior to light armor.

Heavy armor gives nearly nearly 5-10x more armor and 3x more spell resist, more HP, and then more healing. Light armor's passive can't compete with that. You can easily make up for the spell cost reduction and magicka regen, the current spell resist ignore is just terrible. The Champion System gives 25% ignore, that's good enough, Medium armor has a physical attack boost, why not give Light Armor a spell power boost?

I totally agree, also with the increased cost of blocking you cant block in LA so you're dead within seconds. How is it that MA has far more spell resistance than a sorcerer wearing mages robes ie LA? Its completely ridiculous imo.

I think a lot of people will walk around in 5 HA + 2 LA and try to reduce spell cost with CPs and set bonuses like seducer. This way you get good damage mitigation, low blocking cost and some magicka cost reduction.

Gandogal

The hits from lightning splash (2 per second) should also trigger elemental drain 2 times per second, right?

Liquid lightning costs 2566 magicka on PTS right now (dont know how much the other moprh costs).

if the spell goes for 10 secs at 2 ticks per second, that would be 322 magicka from elemental drain x 20 = 6440 magicka. Provided that using the synergy doenst stop the effect.

Should this be the case, this would be a major magicka regen for sorce from a spell, which also grants high damage per execution time.

ToRelax

Gandogal wrote: »

The hits from lightning splash (2 per second) should also trigger elemental drain 2 times per second, right?

Liquid lightning costs 2566 magicka on PTS right now (dont know how much the other moprh costs).

if the spell goes for 10 secs at 2 ticks per second, that would be 322 magicka from elemental drain x 20 = 6440 magicka. Provided that using the synergy doenst stop the effect.

Should this be the case, this would be a major magicka regen for sorce from a spell, which also grants high damage per execution time.

Actually you could compare that to ~13 magicka regen on live (below the softcap) and I am not sure but don't think the elemental drain works for anything but destro staff skills and normal attacks.

Dracane

ToRelax wrote: »

Gandogal wrote: »

The hits from lightning splash (2 per second) should also trigger elemental drain 2 times per second, right?

Liquid lightning costs 2566 magicka on PTS right now (dont know how much the other moprh costs).

if the spell goes for 10 secs at 2 ticks per second, that would be 322 magicka from elemental drain x 20 = 6440 magicka. Provided that using the synergy doenst stop the effect.

Should this be the case, this would be a major magicka regen for sorce from a spell, which also grants high damage per execution time.

Actually you could compare that to ~13 magicka regen on live (below the softcap) and I am not sure but don't think the elemental drain works for anything but destro staff skills and normal attacks.

It does work with almost each elemental ability. Mage's fury, bolt escape and the first tick of lightning splash. Also flame lash and I also believe, it procs on fire DoT ticks.

But it does not work with Overload. Don't know, if this is different in 1.6. It also does not work with wall of elements as it seems.

GreyRanger

I am still disappointed that Surge still has the cool down.

What is the primary ST attack for a magicka based Sorc supposed to be:
Devs want folks to move away from Force Shock
Shards is not viable due to cast time
Mage's fury - obviously too little damage

While the extended time for Lightning Splash is nice, it won't really get the job done in vet dungeons, where the issue has not been being able to recast lightning splash often enough, but that its DPS is too low to pass the DPS check for the killer bosses who summon swarms of spiders (think spiders). What the is problem with simply giving Splash a reasonable damage magnitude.

Last team I tried to join for a vet dungeon with my Sorc dropped me because Srocs just don't add enough DPS to get through the tougher bosses, are the worst tanks, and not particularly good healers (Temps and NB). So no role for Sroc.

Gandogal

Ah so just the first tick. Thats appropriate id say. would have been OP ^^

Dracane

GreyRanger wrote: »

I am still disappointed that Surge still has the cool down.

What is the primary ST attack for a magicka based Sorc supposed to be:
Devs want folks to move away from Force Shock
Shards is not viable due to cast time
Mage's fury - obviously too little damage

While the extended time for Lightning Splash is nice, it won't really get the job done in vet dungeons, where the issue has not been being able to recast lightning splash often enough, but that its DPS is too low to pass the DPS check for the killer bosses who summon swarms of spiders (think spiders). What the is problem with simply giving Splash a reasonable damage magnitude.

Last team I tried to join for a vet dungeon with my Sorc dropped me because Srocs just don't add enough DPS to get through the tougher bosses, are the worst tanks, and not particularly good healers (Temps and NB). So no role for Sroc.

And don't forget the tiny radius of lightning splash and, that we can't even use it against every boss.

Many bosses are moving all the time and lightning splash requires the enemy to nicely stand still in the 4 meter radius. In some fights, lightning splash can be viable. But again in many other fights, it can not

And that's the problem: It's not reliable

GreyRanger

Dracane wrote: »

GreyRanger wrote: »

I am still disappointed that Surge still has the cool down.

What is the primary ST attack for a magicka based Sorc supposed to be:
Devs want folks to move away from Force Shock
Shards is not viable due to cast time
Mage's fury - obviously too little damage

While the extended time for Lightning Splash is nice, it won't really get the job done in vet dungeons, where the issue has not been being able to recast lightning splash often enough, but that its DPS is too low to pass the DPS check for the killer bosses who summon swarms of spiders (think spiders). What the is problem with simply giving Splash a reasonable damage magnitude.

Last team I tried to join for a vet dungeon with my Sorc dropped me because Srocs just don't add enough DPS to get through the tougher bosses, are the worst tanks, and not particularly good healers (Temps and NB). So no role for Sroc.

And don't forget the tiny radius of lightning splash and, that we can't even use it against every boss.

Many bosses are moving all the time and lightning splash requires the enemy to nicely stand still in the 4 meter radius. In some fights, lightning splash can be viable. But again in many other fights, it can not

And that's the problem: It's not reliable

Nice point, I forgot about the many bosses (and players) who move about a lot, effectively negating Splash. Makes me wonder again if the people working on balance play their game. If the Devs would be willing to do 3 things I think it would get us "there"

1. Remove the CD from Surge, limit AOE targets to 6
2. Give Splash a reasonable magnitude, shorten the duration (because bosses and players MOVE)
3. Figure out a viable single target sustained damage attack for Sorcs. I don't care which one it is, there just needs to be one.
4. Give Sorcs a reasonable instant cast self heal that is parallel to ALL the other classes. It can be a straight heal (TEMPS), a heal + buff (DK), a drain (NB), or something new (which would be nice).

Snit

GreyRanger wrote: »

What is the primary ST attack for a magicka based Sorc supposed to be:
Devs want folks to move away from Force Shock

I think our spammable filler attack will still be Force Shock, and that the devs want us to choose between Crushing Shock (for interrupts in PvP) or Force Pulse (for increased damage* in PvE). It will be one of those 'hard choice' morphs. The game needs more of those, frankly.

I'm fine with that. Using a weapon skill affects our overall DPS, but the devs can still adjust that overall output to any level they wish without having to create a new ability. If the new Expert Mage passive helps us pile up the spell damage, all the destruction staff abilities become more attractive


*The increased damage does not appear to be added in 1.6.2. Oh, and Streak still does not proc Crystal Fragments (though Ball of Lightning does)

cschwingeb14_ESO

I think that the real solution to making lightning splash usable in PvP and pve is to make it enemy-targetted.

Then the enemy that has the effect on them always takes the DoT damage, and follows normal DoT rules (unblockable, purgable). And, the effect pulses around them for 6 or 10 seconds, following the normal rules of pulsing AE DoT (blockable)

Now the skill actually is reliable single target damage and AE damage.

Merlin13KAGL

olsborg wrote: »

What worries me, is if critical hits will work on wards/shields. Light armor users are gonna be superduper squishy, like riciulously so.

@olsborg , it's fine w/additions:

• If Shields can be Crit, you should be able to Crit cast a shield (+50% mitigation based on your Crit %)
• If Shields can takes DoTs, shields should have regens, based on your MR)

With armor, it still needs to be 1/3 , 2/3 , 3/3 regarding physical attacks.

It should also be 3/3 , 2/3 , 1/3 regarding magicka attacks. The fact hat heavy gives you best survivability against both types of attacks is absurd. Medium being essentially as good as HA is absurd as well.

There has to be more benefit to LA than regen and some increased pool.

We're already still burnt with 2 handed weapons not counting as two set items slots. We have no class reflect (save your Annulment argument - that's armor based and absorbs)

No heals, and AoE last two patches has been a complete joke in any difficult content. (Longer duration Splash in Spindle won't help you when you're dead.)

It's changed from LA/Staves to Heavy or Medium and the stamina based weapon of your choice. No good uses ( to the level it should have been) for class skills before. No good uses for class skills after (with the exception of familiars).

The intention for diversity is a ruse. They simply want to find a way to (half way) make it work so people will leave them (Devs) alone. Here, familiars are better, stop bothering us.

As for the remaining classes, I don't believe equality is their intention either, with a handful of exceptions.

Each class should have its purpose, its specialty, and its weaknesses.

If they can't find and fix the glaring things, my faith is not strong that they will find and fix the subtle ones.

You hear the complaints coming from PTS. Wait until the live-types get a whiff of this. You know, they one's that have no idea what's coming. They also forget that this is going to be the F2P's first taste as well - how well will that go over when play as you want translates to don't play at all?

RinaldoGandolphi

Snit wrote: »

GreyRanger wrote: »

What is the primary ST attack for a magicka based Sorc supposed to be:
Devs want folks to move away from Force Shock

I think our spammable filler attack will still be Force Shock, and that the devs want us to choose between Crushing Shock (for interrupts in PvP) or Force Pulse (for increased damage* in PvE). It will be one of those 'hard choice' morphs. The game needs more of those, frankly.

I'm fine with that. Using a weapon skill affects our overall DPS, but the devs can still adjust that overall output to any level they wish without having to create a new ability. If the new Expert Mage passive helps us pile up the spell damage, all the destruction staff abilities become more attractive


*The increased damage does not appear to be added in 1.6.2. Oh, and Streak still does not proc Crystal Fragments (though Ball of Lightning does)

As of the crushing shock Nerf, force pulse is a no brainer in both pve and pvp due to the fact one wall of elements will allow your force pulse to hit multiple targets with increased damage, the interrupt is useless when you can kill more things faster. Oh and those addition hits from force pulse can crit as well.

The increased damage when they fix force pulse will be much more valuable then lesser damage interrupt. Imo

Snit

woodsro wrote: »

As of the crushing shock Nerf, force pulse is a no brainer in both pve and pvp...

Mmmmmaybe. I may still take Crushing Shock specifically for PvE. There are encounters where having a ranged interrupt is extremely helpful. That may be worth an overall 5% drop in DPS.

Seraphyel

cschwingeb14_ESO wrote: »

I think that the real solution to making lightning splash usable in PvP and pve is to make it enemy-targetted.

Then the enemy that has the effect on them always takes the DoT damage, and follows normal DoT rules (unblockable, purgable). And, the effect pulses around them for 6 or 10 seconds, following the normal rules of pulsing AE DoT (blockable)

Now the skill actually is reliable single target damage and AE damage.

That's what I said, too.

Make it enemy-centric and it would be a better skill. It could be purged then, but...

Aimelin

woodsro wrote: »

Snit wrote: »

GreyRanger wrote: »

What is the primary ST attack for a magicka based Sorc supposed to be:
Devs want folks to move away from Force Shock

I think our spammable filler attack will still be Force Shock, and that the devs want us to choose between Crushing Shock (for interrupts in PvP) or Force Pulse (for increased damage* in PvE). It will be one of those 'hard choice' morphs. The game needs more of those, frankly.

I'm fine with that. Using a weapon skill affects our overall DPS, but the devs can still adjust that overall output to any level they wish without having to create a new ability. If the new Expert Mage passive helps us pile up the spell damage, all the destruction staff abilities become more attractive


*The increased damage does not appear to be added in 1.6.2. Oh, and Streak still does not proc Crystal Fragments (though Ball of Lightning does)

As of the crushing shock Nerf, force pulse is a no brainer in both pve and pvp due to the fact one wall of elements will allow your force pulse to hit multiple targets with increased damage, the interrupt is useless when you can kill more things faster. Oh and those addition hits from force pulse can crit as well.

The increased damage when they fix force pulse will be much more valuable then lesser damage interrupt. Imo

if only wall of elements did more than 350 dmg / 0.5s ..... the entire destruction line is becoming a joke ...

XEVENEX

Snit wrote: »

woodsro wrote: »

As of the crushing shock Nerf, force pulse is a no brainer in both pve and pvp...

Mmmmmaybe. I may still take Crushing Shock specifically for PvE. There are encounters where having a ranged interrupt is extremely helpful. That may be worth an overall 5% drop in DPS.

I'll still be using crushing shock for PvP, too. Snipe hurts and so to frag spamming sorcs.

Nightreaver

cschwingeb14_ESO wrote: »

I think that the real solution to making lightning splash usable in PvP and pve is to make it enemy-targetted.

Then the enemy that has the effect on them always takes the DoT damage, and follows normal DoT rules (unblockable, purgable). And, the effect pulses around them for 6 or 10 seconds, following the normal rules of pulsing AE DoT (blockable)

Now the skill actually is reliable single target damage and AE damage.

I also really like this idea causing the target to become as someone else called it a Lightning Rod. Having a small red circle at their feet remain with them even when they move to let everyone know if they get near that person they will get a static shock.