Sorc 1.6.3 Preview (From Livestream)

Dracane

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Well that has been fixed and I tested it with my pvp guild on pts. So I can confim lightning splash and its morph dont disappear upon activation anymore. It does disappear when you cast it a second time before the effect has ended, just like elemental wall btw.

Good, if this is true. Then there is one problem less to worry about

Aimelin

Dracane wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Well that has been fixed and I tested it with my pvp guild on pts. So I can confim lightning splash and its morph dont disappear upon activation anymore. It does disappear when you cast it a second time before the effect has ended, just like elemental wall btw.

Good, if this is true. Then there is one problem less to worry about

yea, great, its still a 4 meter (sry 6 if you took that morph) useless aoe "dps" skill you can sidestep out of

Snit

Aimelin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Well that has been fixed and I tested it with my pvp guild on pts. So I can confim lightning splash and its morph dont disappear upon activation anymore. It does disappear when you cast it a second time before the effect has ended, just like elemental wall btw.

Good, if this is true. Then there is one problem less to worry about

yea, great, its still a 4 meter (sry 6 if you took that morph) useless aoe "dps" skill you can sidestep out of

I can't imagine either morph of Splash is going to earn a spot on anyone's PvP bar. Though, it might fit well on the Overload bar.

ItsRejectz

4 meters? Isn't that one of the smallest AOE radius in game?

Dracane

Snit wrote: »

I can't imagine either morph of Splash is going to earn a spot on anyone's PvP bar. Though, it might fit well on the Overload bar.

No, never. Even in PvE, it is not very impressive. the radius is just too small. If it had a 6 meter base radius, it would be better.

Aimelin

Dracane wrote: »

Snit wrote: »

I can't imagine either morph of Splash is going to earn a spot on anyone's PvP bar. Though, it might fit well on the Overload bar.

No, never. Even in PvE, it is not very impressive. the radius is just too small. If it had a 6 meter base radius, it would be better.

even that wouldn't rly help tho

"Storm calling" yea, i call a puddle of something flashy that everyone laughs at, the only other "storm calling" ability only procs at 20% hp

Dracane

Aimelin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Snit wrote: »

I can't imagine either morph of Splash is going to earn a spot on anyone's PvP bar. Though, it might fit well on the Overload bar.

No, never. Even in PvE, it is not very impressive. the radius is just too small. If it had a 6 meter base radius, it would be better.

even that wouldn't rly help tho

"Storm calling" yea, i call a puddle of something flashy that everyone laughs at, the only other "storm calling" ability only procs at 20% hp

I agree, it was a foolish idea. Storm calling is meant to be the damage tree I believe and it is actually the worst damage tree in the entire game. Increasing lightning splashs duration, is not going to increase its DPS

Nightreaver

Not sure what to make of the change to Lightning Splash.

At 4M it isn't one of the smallest, it is THE smallest AOE in the game. A 2nd target would need to be standing on the shoulders of the first in order to hit it.

So glad I put a point into the Mage Guild Persuasion skill in order to convince targets to remain within that tiny circle for 10 seconds.

If it is intended as an ST DOT then I would much rather see a 10 second ST DOT that is placed directly on the target. A ground effect too small to keep both feet in at the same time seems very situational. Unless of course they make it one of those that remain with target even when it moves.

If it is intended as an AOE then I personally would prefer one with a larger AOE, shorter duration but with greater damage.

As it is, the greatest difficulty with the new change will be trying to remain within that tiny circle for 10 seconds during an encounter. Now that would be a challenge.

I'm guessing this was thought up by one of the melee players who are convinced that Casters always remain in one spot and will refuse to take a single step to move no matter what they are standing in.

Dracane

Nightreaver wrote: »

Not sure what to make of the change to Lightning Splash.

At 4M it isn't one of the smallest, it is THE smallest AOE in the game. A 2nd target would need to be standing on the shoulders of the first in order to hit it.

So glad I put a point into the Mage Guild Persuasion skill in order to convince targets to remain within that tiny circle for 10 seconds.

If it is intended as an ST DOT then I would much rather see a 10 second ST DOT that is placed directly on the target. A ground effect too small to keep both feet in at the same time seems very situational. Unless of course they make it one of those that remain with target even when it moves.

If it is intended as an AOE then I personally would prefer one with a larger AOE, shorter duration but with greater damage.

As it is, the greatest difficulty with the new change will be trying to remain within that tiny circle for 10 seconds during an encounter. Now that would be a challenge.

I'm guessing this was thought up by one of the melee players who are convinced that Casters always remain in one spot and will refuse to take a single step to move no matter what they are standing in.

True. Okay, if they would consider to make it a targeted spell, so that it basically stucks with the target, it would be quiet good actually and the 4 meter radius wouldn't matter.

They want lightning splash to be our new DPS spell against Bosses and bosses are mostly single targets. So I don't want to hit many targets, I want to hit ONE target and this target will most likely not remain in the tiny circle.

ToRelax

Dracane wrote: »

Nightreaver wrote: »

Not sure what to make of the change to Lightning Splash.

At 4M it isn't one of the smallest, it is THE smallest AOE in the game. A 2nd target would need to be standing on the shoulders of the first in order to hit it.

So glad I put a point into the Mage Guild Persuasion skill in order to convince targets to remain within that tiny circle for 10 seconds.

If it is intended as an ST DOT then I would much rather see a 10 second ST DOT that is placed directly on the target. A ground effect too small to keep both feet in at the same time seems very situational. Unless of course they make it one of those that remain with target even when it moves.

If it is intended as an AOE then I personally would prefer one with a larger AOE, shorter duration but with greater damage.

As it is, the greatest difficulty with the new change will be trying to remain within that tiny circle for 10 seconds during an encounter. Now that would be a challenge.

I'm guessing this was thought up by one of the melee players who are convinced that Casters always remain in one spot and will refuse to take a single step to move no matter what they are standing in.

True. Okay, if they would consider to make it a targeted spell, so that it basically stucks with the target, it would be quiet good actually and the 4 meter radius wouldn't matter.

They want lightning splash to be our new DPS spell against Bosses and bosses are mostly single targets. So I don't want to hit many targets, I want to hit ONE target and this target will most likely not remain in the tiny circle.

That would actually help our dps a lot i think. It would also effect PvP, but in the way giving us an AoE that is only useful against really stacked up groups, in no way increasing burst damage.

glak

angelyn wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

Jahosefat wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

And please don't leave, I need you. How about 3) ?

Thank you, I actually do appreciate that comment and your other comments on the sorc subject

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

Jahosefat wrote: »

It's getting about the time to decide if 1) need to roll an alt 2) move on to another game until this gets settled out (if ever) 3) organize a sorc boycott or protest.

Who would notice a sorc boycott? or even care?

I'm feeling more of a sorc "protest". Lets brainstorm, what is the most annoying thing a large group of angry and frustrated sorcs could do? This would probably play out best in Cyr where we could have a "mass trolling". I'm beginning to envision a herd of bolt escaping sorcs, all stacked with every shield in the game trolling the heck out of something...

Not sure what we can do... maybe all Sorcs from all factions group up (All AD Sorcs in a group(s), All EP Sorcs in a group(s) and all DC Sorcs in a group(s)) And we all hold one individual keep. AD Sorcs take over and hold Arrius. EP Sorcs take over and hold Glademist. DC Sorcs take over and hold Faregyl. It could be a weekend where the most people can play and just do it all day.. try to hold the keeps all day no matter what. Or... we could just take over a city in one of the zones. Warn people in PvE before we do it and just get all Sorcs together and kill everyone we can and take over a city somehow.

But then we may get a response of "See?!There's nothing wrong with sorcs, sorcs are OP..I think we need more nerfs"

That's why I'm thinking of a hand-holding phenomenon in Cyrodiil.

Orange Sorcerer Alliance: Half all AD and EP sorcs take and hold Glademist and singing Kumbayah is optional, each taking a flag.
Green Sorcerer Alliance: half all AD and DC sorcs take and hold Arrius, each taking a flag.
And can't forget the Purple Alliance: half all EP and DC sorcs take and hold Faregyl, each taking a flag.

Dye your armor the appropriate color. Hold these keeps down with NPC guards gone. Fly your armor dye colors proudly on the top of the inner walls and let the opposing alliance know the reason why!

RinaldoGandolphi

I have decided to shelf my sorc for now. Leveling a templar using heavy armor, I have pretty good build in mind for it.

I'd really rather play my sorc, I miss bolt escape, but maybe they will fix it down the road, but as it stands now it doesn't look like it will be competitive now. 1.6 sorc is actually worse in many ways from the 1.5 sorc.

The large numbers, big magic pool doesn't make up for the light armor terrible damage mitigation and the coming Nerf to shields along with CS Being 1 or 2 shotted with a two handed weapon don't sound fun.

Prior to this nerf I could probably survive somewhat but now, those damage shields will be worthless and gap closer spam, crit charge in particular will all but ensure death quite quickly.

I really hope i can go back to my sorc one day sadly I doubt that will be anytime soon.

Asgari

woodsro wrote: »

I have decided to shelf my sorc for now. Leveling a templar using heavy armor, I have pretty good build in mind for it.

I'd really rather play my sorc, I miss bolt escape, but maybe they will fix it down the road, but as it stands now it doesn't look like it will be competitive now. 1.6 sorc is actually worse in many ways from the 1.5 sorc.

The large numbers, big magic pool doesn't make up for the light armor terrible damage mitigation and the coming Nerf to shields along with CS Being 1 or 2 shotted with a two handed weapon don't sound fun.

Prior to this nerf I could probably survive somewhat but now, those damage shields will be worthless and gap closer spam, crit charge in particular will all but ensure death quite quickly.

I really hope i can go back to my sorc one day sadly I doubt that will be anytime soon.

got on pts again to try some variations with LA and using 70 cp against a dk with 70 cp he 2 shot me with 1 shield up. roughly 30k health/shield total. crit charge+ wrecking blow = game over.

OtarTheMad

woodsro wrote: »

I have decided to shelf my sorc for now. Leveling a templar using heavy armor, I have pretty good build in mind for it.

I'd really rather play my sorc, I miss bolt escape, but maybe they will fix it down the road, but as it stands now it doesn't look like it will be competitive now. 1.6 sorc is actually worse in many ways from the 1.5 sorc.

The large numbers, big magic pool doesn't make up for the light armor terrible damage mitigation and the coming Nerf to shields along with CS Being 1 or 2 shotted with a two handed weapon don't sound fun.

Prior to this nerf I could probably survive somewhat but now, those damage shields will be worthless and gap closer spam, crit charge in particular will all but ensure death quite quickly.

I really hope i can go back to my sorc one day sadly I doubt that will be anytime soon.

I hear ya man.... shelved mine too and decided to focus on my Templar for now. Making him into a Battlemage... heavy armor (5 HA 2 LA) with Destro/Resto combo. Also has a third weapon option which is 1h.

Septimus_Magna

The biggest problem with synnergies is the small activation radius. Even on standard you need to be very close to the middle to activate it. With lightning splash its pretty hard to activate it because there is no visual centre like with standard. So I think lightning splash wont be good in pvp unless you run with a trained group who activate all the synnergies.

Septimus_Magna

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

got on pts again to try some variations with LA and using 70 cp against a dk with 70 cp he 2 shot me with 1 shield up. roughly 30k health/shield total. crit charge+ wrecking blow = game over.

This also happened to me on pts but dont forget they use dueling builds. These medium armor high damage build will melt in 2 sec it they are attacked by a small group because they have very little defensive capabilities. So I dont think we will see many builds like that once 1.6 goed live. Maybe a few gankers will use similar builds but those have always been very annoying.

Snit

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

These medium armor high damage build will melt in 2 sec it they are attacked by a small group because they have very little defensive capabilities

They have higher mitigation than a sorcerer in full light armor, even if the sorc has both Bound Armor and Thundering Presence up. The armor difference remains considerable. Medium is just that much better than light.

So, these builds have more damage output and more survivability than a caster. I don't share your view that they will vanish at launch.

Glantir

Make all Crystal Morphs Instant, cancel the Knockback (maybe a slightly damage reduce)
Crystal Fragments adds a DoT on Proc
Crystal Blast still AoE

Change Daedric Curse into a DoT and Mages Wrath execution by 25% instead of 20% (like NB execute).

That would be nice

Derra

Snit wrote: »

Aimelin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Well that has been fixed and I tested it with my pvp guild on pts. So I can confim lightning splash and its morph dont disappear upon activation anymore. It does disappear when you cast it a second time before the effect has ended, just like elemental wall btw.

Good, if this is true. Then there is one problem less to worry about

yea, great, its still a 4 meter (sry 6 if you took that morph) useless aoe "dps" skill you can sidestep out of

I can't imagine either morph of Splash is going to earn a spot on anyone's PvP bar. Though, it might fit well on the Overload bar.

There is a build where lightning flood is desirable in pvp. That when using valkyn skoria + ele ring + ele wall + flood + storm armor to play procc the meteor i want to be a dk

olsborg

What worries me, is if critical hits will work on wards/shields. Light armor users are gonna be superduper squishy, like riciulously so.

Septimus_Magna

Snit wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

These medium armor high damage build will melt in 2 sec it they are attacked by a small group because they have very little defensive capabilities

They have higher mitigation than a sorcerer in full light armor, even if the sorc has both Bound Armor and Thundering Presence up. The armor difference remains considerable. Medium is just that much better than light.

So, these builds have more damage output and more survivability than a caster. I don't share your view that they will vanish at launch.

Well there are no big stamina shields and no big stamina heals, only small shields and HOTs. Their mitigation might be higher than LA users but you cant survive long without shields or big heals, once their health is decreasing they have very limited options to restore it. So I think a shield stacking sorc with LA will have more survivability than MA with Two-handed in group fights.

ToRelax

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Snit wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

These medium armor high damage build will melt in 2 sec it they are attacked by a small group because they have very little defensive capabilities

They have higher mitigation than a sorcerer in full light armor, even if the sorc has both Bound Armor and Thundering Presence up. The armor difference remains considerable. Medium is just that much better than light.

So, these builds have more damage output and more survivability than a caster. I don't share your view that they will vanish at launch.

Well there are no big stamina shields and no big stamina heals, only small shields and HOTs. Their mitigation might be higher than LA users but you cant survive long without shields or big heals, once their health is decreasing they have very limited options to restore it. So I think a shield stacking sorc with LA will have more survivability than MA with Two-handed in group fights.

Rally gives you a burst heal when needed while you are using it's HoT + Damage Shields + Vigor to hold you up most of the time and avoid a lot of damage with roll dodging.
I don't think stamina builds are lacking survivability at all.

silentdude

Change Crystal Blast so instead of AOE the damage increases with consecutive hits up to 5 times 100% 120% etc (balance this numbers, no instacast in this morph).

Rework Boundless and Endless Storm so one is good for Hybrids/stamina builds and the other for magicka. Let's say you have an increase in spell damage or dmg output in general while in lightning form with some kind of drawback (maybe increased spell cost).

Delete Rune prison, the skill is terrible.

Either make Surge a possible selfheal (better or on par with entropy) or a decent increase to power (stamina and magicka morphs), or both, wth i rolled sorc because of this skill and it has always been "useless" in pvp with all the impenetrable and now in pve it is just meh. The same with dark exchange (worse than spell simetry, not even situational in pve), if surge is made a self heal, rework dark exchange so it is some sort of damage buff (trade health for possible dps), otherwise make it at least on par with spell simetry.

Aimelin

silentdude wrote: »

Change Crystal Blast so instead of AOE the damage increases with consecutive hits up to 5 times 100% 120% etc (balance this numbers, no instacast in this morph).

Rework Boundless and Endless Storm so one is good for Hybrids/stamina builds and the other for magicka. Let's say you have an increase in spell damage or dmg output in general while in lightning form with some kind of drawback (maybe increased spell cost).

Delete Rune prison, the skill is terrible.

Either make Surge a possible selfheal (better or on par with entropy) or a decent increase to power (stamina and magicka morphs), or both, wth i rolled sorc because of this skill and it has always been "useless" in pvp with all the impenetrable and now in pve it is just meh. The same with dark exchange (worse than spell simetry, not even situational in pve), if surge is made a self heal, rework dark exchange so it is some sort of damage buff (trade health for possible dps), otherwise make it at least on par with spell simetry.

no one even uses crystal blast in pvp, so again, while it might sound "awesome" it would be a useless change to that morph.

even for pve sorcs would pick frags over blast caus of the cost reduction on the proc

RinaldoGandolphi

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

woodsro wrote: »

I have decided to shelf my sorc for now. Leveling a templar using heavy armor, I have pretty good build in mind for it.

I'd really rather play my sorc, I miss bolt escape, but maybe they will fix it down the road, but as it stands now it doesn't look like it will be competitive now. 1.6 sorc is actually worse in many ways from the 1.5 sorc.

The large numbers, big magic pool doesn't make up for the light armor terrible damage mitigation and the coming Nerf to shields along with CS Being 1 or 2 shotted with a two handed weapon don't sound fun.

Prior to this nerf I could probably survive somewhat but now, those damage shields will be worthless and gap closer spam, crit charge in particular will all but ensure death quite quickly.

I really hope i can go back to my sorc one day sadly I doubt that will be anytime soon.

got on pts again to try some variations with LA and using 70 cp against a dk with 70 cp he 2 shot me with 1 shield up. roughly 30k health/shield total. crit charge+ wrecking blow = game over.

I had a similar experience, and its what finally made me shelf the sorc.

Those who say those builds will be uncommon, I disagree, folks are already using similar builds on live, I see it on Haderus all the time, the diff is shields allow me to survive a hit or 2 and get away and re-frame the fight, now in 1.6 you get 1 or 2 shotted.

If their proposed changes stand, you will see the sorc class pretty much be rare but in this game. No one is going to play a class that has no survivability at all.

Its funny, the lowest damage class on live that was only useful for negates have taken more direct nerfs then any other class.

At this point, they should just can the class. Its worthless now as is, pets have terrible AI, pathing issues, lackluster damage unless you use daedric prey and stack empowered ward which us weaker then hardened making you even easier to kill.

Crystal frags is probably the most reflected spell in pvp. Velicious Curse is now blockable, the coming changes in the next update will be GG for sorcs. I highly doubt they leave the cost reduction on expert mage, and they would have to leave the cost reduction and add a considerable spell damage buff to it, and folks know they wont do that.

Lighting flood is garbage. It may be useful against the mage in AA that don't move, in pvp...right...the skill overall is blah...

Sorcs will be the easiest class to kill in pvp with a garbage version of negate.. They completely gutted negate, it shouldn't even be an ultimate anymore in its current form, it should be a standard spell now...no other ulty was gutted like negate, then again sorcs have been gutted since launch by all the qq that's been going on, why should I expect any different.

Dracane

I think, crystal shard must remain a knockdown. Sorcerer has no other good CC. The knockdown is essential in pvp.

Digiman

Seriously are the developers utterly ignoring the class? The forums utterly bode destruction for use on this class and I can't help but agree.

Lack of direction and even minute attention to this class and bam we are garbage for a year. This is depressing and grim for me, to a see a favorite class in the ES series become an utter broken joke.

KMN

Derra

Dracane wrote: »

I think, crystal shard most remain a knockdown. Sorcerer has no other good CC. The knockdown is essential in pvp.

They could provide a reliable stun within stormcalling (maybe increase streak stuntime) since its now harmful to actually streak stun your opponent granting them cc immunity for 1.5s stun.

I´d like the rng mechanic of fragments geworked. Make it stack based (like the new nightblade ability). For every magica spell you use casttime gets reduced by 34% and dmg increased by 7% (up to 3 times obviously - resulting in 1 instant cast).
This would open up the sorc pvp gameplay for quite a bit in my opinion bc it would not be based on proccs.

kkampaseb17_ESO

Derra wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I think, crystal shard most remain a knockdown. Sorcerer has no other good CC. The knockdown is essential in pvp.

They could provide a reliable stun within stormcalling (maybe increase streak stuntime) since its now harmful to actually streak stun your opponent granting them cc immunity for 1.5s stun.

I´d like the rng mechanic of fragments geworked. Make it stack based (like the new nightblade ability). For every magica spell you use casttime gets reduced by 34% and dmg increased by 7% (up to 3 times obviously - resulting in 1 instant cast).
This would open up the sorc pvp gameplay for quite a bit in my opinion bc it would not be based on proccs.

Hmm this is interesting proposition since it would provide a stable DPS increase and also something that is not as random for both sides.

McDoogs

ZOS being ham-handed as usual. Damage shields, especially the ones that scaled off of magicka, needed some adjustment, but to reduce all damage shields by 15% AND enable crits against them is typically excessive. One or the other maybe, not both.

This may hurt blazing shield and the dk shield even more than hardened ward/healing ward/annulment though