Bolt Escape is Useless and Sorc Survivability

CheesyDaedra

You know one of BE's morphs was the most useful AoE attack against small groups in vet zones, by keeping the mobs disoriented, now i should only wait for them to reach me and insta kill me with their overpowered stats.

Also, in PvP sorcerers would chase other bolt escaping sorcs, but since it now uses your whole magicka pool in 5 seconds it's really not worth it to follow bolt escaping sorcerers anymore.

Snit

Axer wrote: »

At the very most you should be able to cast 3 in a 16 second window, getting off 4+ means your nearly invulnerable if your playing a strong, high magicka/regen build.

Bolt Escape shuts down all magicka regen for 4 seconds after use.

Snit

Thor wrote: »

It's hard to tell if BE is useless or overpowered if we have sorcs with infinite mana running around. Some are still able circle around you multiple times and then warp out of clipping range.

You're talking about someone spamming a 450 magicka ability, when that ability also shuts down magicka regen for 4 seconds after use. Magicka pools only get so big.

Thor

Snit wrote: »

You're talking about someone spamming a 450 magicka ability, when that ability also shuts down magicka regen for 4 seconds after use. Magicka pools only get so big.

I know. These players are reported, so far no outcome.

killedbyping

Bols escape is still most OP escape ability in game.
You can use it while immobolized and 1 blink is enought to outrange any chasing ability.
Magicka cost doesnt fixed anything.

Snit

killedbyping wrote: »

Bols escape is still most OP escape ability in game.
You can use it while immobolized and 1 blink is enought to outrange any chasing ability.
Magicka cost doesnt fixed anything.

This is incorrect. One BE will leave you in range of DK chains, etc. I've been demonstrating this every day, though not on purpose

As I said above, before the nerf I would usually escape even groups of four or more, unless they had someone who knew how to stop it (it was always possible). Now, escape is rare. You might get away if BE made you a slightly tougher target than some slower allies, and the other side chases them down instead. Otherwise, you're just draining your magicka pool while moving the fight a few meters.

AZRainman

inspiral1 wrote: »

Stop moaning i play sorc and i think the chance is fine i still use it and its still fantastic! You can use it just dnt spam it and that's the way it should be it was ridiculously fun but still OP get over it srsly

'
You don't play much. Talon and stun spamming will make a quick death of you and your feeble bolt escape fantasies.

Kiljaz

Fact pf the matter is, it's supposed to be an escape spell... Like guise for NB. To get out of range of ranged attacks you have to cast it 3 times which is about 60% magicka. That's if you're enemy is standing still.

Duel wielding leather wearer is impossible to get away from if they're even mediocre. Throw dagger snare, dodge roll sprint and you move faster than a bolt 'escaping' sorc.

Shaggygaming

Coming from a Templar I think the nerf was a little too much. Sure the stun on streak was annoying but Sorcs don't really have any self healing like other classes. DKs are by far the best class in the game. At least Sorcs got to get away when they were low on health. Now they can't do anything because the spell cost 450+ magicka but it also stops magicka regen? That is kind of crappy. I seriously am scared this game will never get balanced with crap like that.

Nijjion

@Adonikam They have healing on crits if they choose to and a channelled heal with magicka gain on it that costs stamina.

Snit wrote: »

you're just draining your magicka pool while moving the fight a few meters.

That's how it is in pretty much in every other game.

Shaggygaming

Nijjion wrote: »

@Adonikam They have healing on crits if they choose to and a channelled heal with magicka gain on it that costs stamina.

Snit wrote: »

you're just draining your magicka pool while moving the fight a few meters.

That's how it is in pretty much in every other game.

I'm sure not everyone wants to build 45%+ crit. Just because a majority of people run around with high crit and resto/destro staves doesn't mean everyone wants to do it. Other classes heals are not based off good gear. All I am saying is, the devs listened to a bunch of people crying and it wasn't really hurting them. There were other ways to adjust the skill without destroying it.

Sheaden

The only thing that's been more broken than Bolt Escape was DK vampires. Period. Previously if some sorc swept in and tried to gank you... you either A. Died a horrible electrified death ending in crystal fragments spam or B. They couldn't burn you down but were never in danger themselves because they could 100% of the time out-range you once they triggered stun immunity 1x. No single class should have the capacity to do that ever. It's too powerful.

Shaggygaming

Sheaden wrote: »

The only thing that's been more broken than Bolt Escape was DK vampires. Period. Previously if some sorc swept in and tried to gank you... you either A. Died a horrible electrified death ending in crystal fragments spam or B. They couldn't burn you down but were never in danger themselves because they could 100% of the time out-range you once they triggered stun immunity 1x. No single class should have the capacity to do that ever. It's too powerful.

I think we all agree it could be used in an OP way, but the changes or fix they implemented for it was a terrible design. The time they had to think about it they could of come up with a slightly better design. The increase magicka cost of it would of been fine, but they also added a stop of magicka regen? In a way, two cooldowns?

zScars

i can still own with it, i just cant use it for transportation

Sheaden

Adonikam wrote: »

Sheaden wrote: »

The only thing that's been more broken than Bolt Escape was DK vampires. Period. Previously if some sorc swept in and tried to gank you... you either A. Died a horrible electrified death ending in crystal fragments spam or B. They couldn't burn you down but were never in danger themselves because they could 100% of the time out-range you once they triggered stun immunity 1x. No single class should have the capacity to do that ever. It's too powerful.

I think we all agree it could be used in an OP way, but the changes or fix they implemented for it was a terrible design. The time they had to think about it they could of come up with a slightly better design. The increase magicka cost of it would of been fine, but they also added a stop of magicka regen? In a way, two cooldowns?

You sir, do not know what a cooldown is. A cooldown traditionally speaking in terms of mmo's has always referred to a period of time in which the ability goes on "cooldown" thus rendering the ability completely disabled until the predetermined "cooldown" duration has expired. In that sense, there are ZERO cooldowns to this ability. It's mechanics were altered to reign in how many times it can be used in succession, however you can still cast this ability enough times back to back to get out of harms way with a decent amount of success. It simply takes a bit of resource management. If you're arguing these changes are too severe because one class SHOULD be extended the ability to get out of harm's way 100% of the time, then I'm afraid I disagree.

Additionally, it's still extremely valuable since sorcs who use this ability are not bound by the same ruleset other classes must abide by when it comes in terms of being immobilized. A sorc with Bolt Escape can still move so far away so fast if they are caught in an immobilization that it renders the CC attempt a complete waste of magicka.

95% of sorcs I see in pvp are Bolt Escape/crystal fragment spammers that toss in the occasional endless fury. They don't want to theorycraft a new build or alter their respective play style which made pvp an easy-mode faceroll.

The reason so many sorcs are crying about this now is the simple fact that because of the increased cost and temporary regen debuff, now they can't dump a ton of magicka based damage on you and bail if things go sour. It's one or the other.

If a sorc is about to get ganked and has a full magicka bar...good luck catching them even with these changes. It still provides as an excellent anti-gank escape (hence the name Bolt ESCAPE) as the name implies. It just can't be abused as hard from an offensive perspective as it once was which is what caused the change to be implemented in the first place.

NakedSnake

Just finished the Molag Bal fight with my Sorc and BE was invaluable while dodging his big attacks.
The "escape" in BE is meant for attacks not encounters.

circilion

I play Sorc, I agree Bolt escape was overpowered. But they went to far and completely broke the ability. I would never use this ability anymore. Unless I had 10 slots to work with.

Its odd that the Dev's made such a dramatic change. usually when your seeking balance you make tweaks here and there.

And for you sorc's you think the ability was fine before, you didn't have great gear or the build for it. I have seen PvP videos of the most average player dominating, Or really crappy players taking pot shots over and over and running for their lives, with zero consequences to their terrible playing.

Bolt was to good, now its too crappy.

We're still not NB's though, so thats good haha.

cfriedman71ub17_ESO

Sheaden wrote: »

The only thing that's been more broken than Bolt Escape was DK vampires. Period. Previously if some sorc swept in and tried to gank you... you either A. Died a horrible electrified death ending in crystal fragments spam or B. They couldn't burn you down but were never in danger themselves because they could 100% of the time out-range you once they triggered stun immunity 1x. No single class should have the capacity to do that ever. It's too powerful.

No you are just really bad at the game.

indigoblades

i think it was nerfed way to much for being a top tier 42 skill. Either nerf would of been ok for balance, but both COMBINED (increased cost and no magika regin) make it useful only certain situations now.

Now i only use BE if i am farming stuff. In combat there are way better skills, just not as much fun. Every class should have some useful skills that are FUN to use. As combat degenerates to light armor with staffs and high crits the fun factor is way low too low.

Me, i really like speed and mobility, its my fun. I tried a nightblade in beta, but there speed buffs are so minor i settled on the sorc.

Also i think staffs/light armor vs weapons/med armor is wear the imbalance is not the classes.

Shaggygaming

Sheaden wrote: »

Adonikam wrote: »

Sheaden wrote: »

The only thing that's been more broken than Bolt Escape was DK vampires. Period. Previously if some sorc swept in and tried to gank you... you either A. Died a horrible electrified death ending in crystal fragments spam or B. They couldn't burn you down but were never in danger themselves because they could 100% of the time out-range you once they triggered stun immunity 1x. No single class should have the capacity to do that ever. It's too powerful.

I think we all agree it could be used in an OP way, but the changes or fix they implemented for it was a terrible design. The time they had to think about it they could of come up with a slightly better design. The increase magicka cost of it would of been fine, but they also added a stop of magicka regen? In a way, two cooldowns?

You sir, do not know what a cooldown is. A cooldown traditionally speaking in terms of mmo's has always referred to a period of time in which the ability goes on "cooldown" thus rendering the ability completely disabled until the predetermined "cooldown" duration has expired. In that sense, there are ZERO cooldowns to this ability. It's mechanics were altered to reign in how many times it can be used in succession, however you can still cast this ability enough times back to back to get out of harms way with a decent amount of success. It simply takes a bit of resource management. If you're arguing these changes are too severe because one class SHOULD be extended the ability to get out of harm's way 100% of the time, then I'm afraid I disagree.

Additionally, it's still extremely valuable since sorcs who use this ability are not bound by the same ruleset other classes must abide by when it comes in terms of being immobilized. A sorc with Bolt Escape can still move so far away so fast if they are caught in an immobilization that it renders the CC attempt a complete waste of magicka.

95% of sorcs I see in pvp are Bolt Escape/crystal fragment spammers that toss in the occasional endless fury. They don't want to theorycraft a new build or alter their respective play style which made pvp an easy-mode faceroll.

The reason so many sorcs are crying about this now is the simple fact that because of the increased cost and temporary regen debuff, now they can't dump a ton of magicka based damage on you and bail if things go sour. It's one or the other.

If a sorc is about to get ganked and has a full magicka bar...good luck catching them even with these changes. It still provides as an excellent anti-gank escape (hence the name Bolt ESCAPE) as the name implies. It just can't be abused as hard from an offensive perspective as it once was which is what caused the change to be implemented in the first place.

You wrote a whole lot of nothing. I leveled a Sorc to VR12 a couple weeks ago and I have experienced first hand how non OP Bolt Escape is now. Bolt Escape has a lag on it so it is easily caught with any gap closer. Lightning ball helps a little but is completely useless because it leaves breadcrumbs to exactly where you stop.

If you only see BE Sorcs casting fragments it kind of makes you think that is all Sorcs have right? So... why do you think Sorcs don't need a good BE?

Yolokin_Swagonborn

The worst part of the BE nerf is that it isn't a 50% cost increase. It's more like 80%.

The second bolt doesn't take spell cost reduction passives or jewelry into account like every other spell in the game does.

Now looking at the PTS with all the nerfs to magicka builds, the warlock set will probably be nerfed to 5pcs for magicka flood.

When ZOS nerfed this they did it before the upcoming magicka nerf. This is the only ability that has been effectively nerfed 4 times.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Lol. I just have to bump this thread. One year later and Bolt escape is getting another nerf.

NotSo

If my Bolt Escape keeps getting nerfed, I want all gap closers to get nerfed.

Folkb

Bolt escape was OP, cry more noob.

Mos-De-Atmo

NotSo wrote: »

If my Bolt Escape keeps getting nerfed, I want all gap closers to get nerfed.

Bolt Escape is a gap opener, or distance creator, often used to escape as well as to close gaps. Gap closers require a target.

Cyantific87

Just remove bolt escape from the game now, it's useless, replace it with the skill those NPC's use when they teleport and a large electric aoe circle appears.. Gap closer and aoe in one. Would be nice.. I would use it!

Ernest145

My main is a templar and I leveled a sorc to v14 at the beginning of 1.6 and it is literally so easy mode in pvp. Even when i get jesus beam at low health I don't care because i can throw up 3 shields and bolt away and get my resources back. For everyone saying sorcs are not op really need to really stop protecting their easy mode broken class. I am glad sorcs are getting a nerf. They do really high burst damage(to people not stacking a lot of nirn), one of the hardest things to kill if they players knows how to keep their shields up, and can blink away when they get into too much trouble NO CLASS should be able to do that. I have had night blades try to chase me down and if you know how to line of sight and use the environment you can easily get away unless you had low majicka to begin with. Sorcs are just crying because they won't be the "The 1vX Kings anymore" anymore.

NotSo

Im a stamina sorc, everything you mentioned is irrelevant to 50% of sorc builds. All you said about pvp was how easy it was to not get killed. Good job, you used bolt escape to escape.

Ernest145

Well stam sorcs are just in a horrible place and are going to be worst of with the new patch so that sucks, but I'm talking about the other 80 percent of majicka sorcs running the same builds. The group utility Streak had was great but sorcs are just going to have to learn how to get along without streaking into a group with prox det and streaking out. Templars can't cc a whole group and jump out and DKs have to have dragon leap up to do that and both have to either be really tanky or have people with them. And the main point of my comment was to describe how easy it is for a sorcs to get into a fight with multiple players burst some down and when they get into trouble they can get away.

vichoi

I understand ZOS want sorc to stay in the fight instead of running, however, those sorc gave up dps for survibility are rely on BE to stay alive, the BE spam sorcs have far less dps.

Unlike DK and Templar they can tank for a while and wait for ally when outnumber. Sorc need BE to stay alive and wait for help, or they just die.

Also, we don't want to count 4sec to use next bolt, but at the same time we count 3 for curse, count to 4 for DK reflect? I'd rather they put a cooldown, I hate counting in a fight.

If ZOS don't want player to escape from fight, why they nerf sorc but buff NB's cloak, so NB go full dps can run but not an option for dps sorc? It sounds unfair.

'Take away bolt escape and give us a skill to kill ourselves, I don't want to be free AP' just kidding

Btw , I agree BE need a treatment, but please no more COUNTING!!!