Zenimax going back on a promise about Racial Motiff's in 1.2

vyal

pcdunkleyub17_ESO wrote: »

I logged in the other day, went straight to a cabinet and found the daedric motif. Found another about a week later. Don't think it has anything to do with a timer on logins. It's just a drop rate that's been "slightly reduced", which means o.ooooo1.

Well it's good to have another data point, but 50 tests yesterday proved out the if you wait, you get a recipe theory. The motif theory I only saw 3 times since 1.0.6, so, not enough data points.
Good to know, though, thanks for the contribution.

Reenlister

Well, I have to agree, the nerf of drops again if it is actually happening again,,, is just a frustration.
I have not found anything blue or above recipe wise since I made Vet, but lo' and behold, yesterday after making V3 I just looked in a backpack laying out in no where in particular and found a Barbaric. It really made my day.
Now I am not really sweating over getting the Rares, but it is nice to actually find one, but as far as game play goes, there is no way I will spend the kind of money they are asking for now in selling simply to be able to make a cool look.
There are however tons of people more than happy to run off to the RMT to get the coin to buy one... That has just been given a boost if the nerf is going through...

SK1TZ0FR3N1K

Pangnirtung wrote: »

SK1TZ0FR3N1K wrote: »

AlexCala7b14_ESO wrote: »

Noone's been finding them. I know that because I'm in five different guilds, and 1300 people can't all be having the same amount of *** luck.

Yeah, so the 2 I got in Woodhearth last night were a figment of my imagination.

Even a blind squirrel finds the occasional nut.

I take it you are one of the" I haven't found something so NO ONE is finding it" kind of people.

I average 3 to 5 in a 12 hour period. The most I got was actually last Friday, when I got 7 of them between noon CST and 11PM CST. That's still a pretty damn good drop rate. The 2 I found in Woodhearth, I found within 5 minutes of each other. Some days I get only 1 in a 12 hour run. It's RNG.

They are still there, why don't you get off your lazy ass, and go look for them like the people are that are selling them.

@AlexCala7b14_ESO‌
Because they commented in one forum post and not another, does not a cover up make. The fact they posted that they would look into it, is the exact opposite of not acknowledging it.

If they lowered it again, that would mean they looked into it, didn't see a problem, and decided to go lower with the drop rate. But the people like you, that ruin every single MMO out there with your "I want it, and I want it now because he/she has it!" mentality, will sooner or later get them to increase the drop chance again.

I will pay a company to make a game for the people like you. When you log in, you will receive an in game mail with every item in the game attached, then you can all sit around town with nothing to do except circle jerk together.

I don't have every Motif either, and I don't give a rat's ass that I don't. I'm not gonna get butthurt that I keep getting the damn Breton and Altmer one. If you were meant to have it all, I think they would have given it to you by now.

As for the person who said "nothing in an MMO should take you a year to find or get all of", it took me 7 years to get the damn Fiery Warhorse's reigns in WoW.

MMO's shouldn't give out loot like piñatas. If you guys want loot like that, go back to your single player RPG's.

BaddLarry

AlexCala7b14_ESO wrote: »

Also, @BaddLarry, nothing in an MMO should take you a year to find or get all of. That's just ridiculous and kills the enthusiasm people have for a game. Noone does that.

So what's the plan? Get everything the game has to offer in two months, get bored, then start complaining about lack of content? Then this starts pushing the developers to keep churning out veteran material to sate the powerlevelers while doing almost nothing for the more casual players.

This is generally how MMO's end up getting ruined. Hopefully at least one game company will figure out that powerlevelers are not the target audience for MMO's, especially those that require a montly payment for subscription. I find it funny that there are "Veterans" in a game that's less than two months old. While I don't like a grind, I have zero interest in acquiring everything in PvE in four days and then standing around in Cyrodil begging for someone to come fight me in my new armor.

Just saying...

Arreyanne

reggielee wrote: »

geeze, the easiest option would have been to make them bound to acct. all the exploiters would have useless stock to sell. the drop rate would have remained the same so in effect an active player leveling and looting along the way would get eventually all the motiffs

this only benefits the exploiters and bots that stockpiled the high motiffs already

This would be a wonderful change leave the drop rate as it was at release and account bound so u can give it to alt

Pangnirtung

seaxrisingnub18_ESO wrote: »

AlexCala7b14_ESO wrote: »

Noone's been finding them. I know that because I'm in five different guilds, and 1300 people can't all be having the same amount of *** luck.

Actually, I find them more NOW than I did 2 weeks ago. I have 1 toon who found Nord, Wood Elf, Orc, Khajit and Redguard all in 1 day.

Those aren't the rare motifs. I think we're all at least I was the daedric, etc. motifs.

AlexCala7b14_ESO

vyal wrote: »

The more you look (the more you check furniture/vases) the less likely you are to find them.

I did some testing since 1.0.6, and you get a recipe (within 15 checks) if you wait 7 minutes or more after you login. If you check furniture immediately after logging in, you never get a recipe, and in fact, rarely even get improvement provisioning components. (just lockpicks)

Motif's appear to be an even longer timer, possibly 30+ minutes after login, if you don't check -any- furniture between login and the 30 minute mark, you may get a motif. Not 100% sure on this one, didn't have enough time to test it enough. It seems to be the knee jerk reaction they put in to players trying desperately to get these motifs before they were nerfed.

This was specifically put it place to halt players who logout, login, and immediately check a bunch of furniture, which was happening prior to 1.0.6. So now, if you do that, you'll ~never (or far less frequently, at least) find a motif or recipe. Well, guess what? Normal players check furniture all the time, as part of their normal gameplay, and are being caught in the exploit/cheat/hack dragnet, once again. Zenimax, as usual, picked the worst possible solution to a problem, and refuse to admit they're wrong and fix it.

I may need to try this. But yeah, if that is the case, it's an absurdly dumb system to put a timer on logging in. People always check the chests and such around them, and if it's thirty minutes, that even more ridiculous. Zenimax is essentially saying they want you to sit there for thirty minutes with your thumbs up your ass doing nothing until you /might/ be able to get a motiff.

Lukati_K wrote: »

AlexCala7b14_ESO wrote: »

Also, @BaddLarry, nothing in an MMO should take you a year to find or get all of. That's just ridiculous and kills the enthusiasm people have for a game. Noone does that.

AlexCala7b14_ESO wrote: »

Count your blessings sir, because I and hundreds, if not thousands of others have looked in every barrel, every desk, in every area, and have found squat over the course of a month. By that time, any one of us should have found /something/. But instead we've found /nothing/. That was not the case before the first nerf, and now the nerf has been made worse. That's all a sign of a nerf gone wrong, and one Zenimax seems to be unwilling to fix, based on their silence and their desire to not even want to acknowledge they were going to look into the issue.

I feel like you speak for yourself, because plenty of people enjoy games that have /ridiculous/ time-sinks involved, and plenty of people are currently reporting in this very thread that they are /finding/ motifs. /Your/ enthusiasm may wane, and /your/ luck may just suck right now, I do not know for sure, but please stop trying to speak for others as if your finger is on the pulse of all ESO players.

PS: I like your /.

Either they're hitting the lower end ones, which seem to be more common, or they're the exceptions that prove the rule. Because the majority of people? Aren't finding them. That's what it seems based on talks in game, and on the forums. So, there's data for you, but you're not going to look at all those people are you? No. Just the few who say they have found them.

Alpha_Protocol

I have like 30 motifs floating around in my mail... I'm nearly ready to vendor them for 5g each... pst with an offer on the ones you need...

Lalaeith

vyal wrote: »

Lalaeith wrote: »

Maybe (and don't ask me how) the issue with you and hundreds others finding no motifs isn't due to low droprates. Because however low the droprate, it should be possible to find one eventually.

I and also other players have had no problem finding more than enough motifs during the last weeks without even looking too closely. So from my point of view a decreased drop rate is no real problem and doesn't keep zenimax from investigating or even fixing the issue of people, like you, finding none at all for weeks.

I found 4 motifs in the last 2 weeks. Two of them even minutes apart in the same building. So this really doesn't seem to affect everyone.

You need to state:
What level you were.
What motifs you obtained.
How long since you logged in and checked furniture did you obtain the motif?

Then you'll know if it's "normal" or an exception. Motifs 1-9 are an entirely different bag of cats than motifs 10-14 (imperial -> daedric) The first are often trivial to get, while the latter often "impossible".

Finally, four in 2 weeks would mean that at that rate, it would take seven weeks to obtain all the motifs. In that time, it would be trivial to level up several characters from 1-VR1, given the leveling rate while questing is about 1 level per hour. Is that working as intended? I hope not. Hence why the original drop rate was fine, the problem was just they weren't bind-to-account-on-pickup.

I was something between lvl 48 and VR1 in Coldharbour and yes, they were 1-9 Motifs, but this thread, as well as the patch notes and the 'promise' from ZOS refered to racial motifs in general so my post is still valid.
There are also comments about people finding 10-14 motifs somewhere here in this thread.

Also I think I found 2 of them right after logging in, because I have not done any looking for motifs except for the hollow city bank where I usually start my 'day'. And for checking only the few containers I checked, this is a pretty good number also I think it would still be perfectly fine if it took 7 weeks or more to find all the motifs if you are not actively looking for them as I really wasn't.

I was not trying to tell the OP and all the other guys who have problems finding motifs, that they are wrong. It is just important to take all experiences into account before raging about zos breaking promises even though the patch is not even live and we don't really know what the problem could be exactly.

And I would greatly approve of a bind-to-account-pickup. After all, they don't provide any real advantages and shouldn't cause so much trouble and provide incentives for botters.

Drachenfier

seaxrisingnub18_ESO wrote: »

AlexCala7b14_ESO wrote: »

Noone's been finding them. I know that because I'm in five different guilds, and 1300 people can't all be having the same amount of *** luck.

Actually, I find them more NOW than I did 2 weeks ago. I have 1 toon who found Nord, Wood Elf, Orc, Khajit and Redguard all in 1 day.

Man....i've found one in the last three weeks And I'm leveling provisioning, so I search every damn container I can get my hands on.

ZOS_GinaBruno

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to clarify a couple things for you about this issue -

The note you’re seeing in today’s patch notes regarding the reduced rate of earning racial motifs and provisioning recipes is actually for a reduction that already happened in patch v1.0.5, but we unintentionally missed the patch note for it when it was first introduced. Our apologies for the confusion this may have caused.

When this reduction initially happened, it presented an issue that caused more empty containers and furniture than intended. That issue has been fixed in today’s patch, so you will no longer find interactable objects saying they have items, but are actually empty.


Note: Post edited for a spelling mistake, oops!

AlexCala7b14_ESO

@SK1TZ0FR3N1K‌

My mentioning of them not acknowledging their investigation is due to a second thread that was made on this, the only ZoS message was them moving it from wherever it was to General Discussion. No mention of the previous post made elsewhere by ZoS GinaBruno.

So, either..

1. ZoS is trying to not acknowledge an ivnestigation that should not be taking that long to corroborate data on.

Or...

2. ZoS has such poor communication between it's team that they don't know what others are doing. Which is a bad thing. A very bad thing. Especially in an MMO.

@BaddLarry‌
If I wanted to churn through content at a break neck pace, I'd probably have been Vet 10 three weeks ago. I'm the sort of person who likes to explore and look at everything though, and I also took a week break to detox from going back to back in questing in the Vet areas without much of a break. So, no, I don't want everything immediately or not.

But I /do/ want to be able to get stuff that I should be able to get without having to had to exploit to get it, not have to suffer for the actions of people who got /unbanned/ after getting /banned/, not have to spend twelve hours farming boxes to /possibly/ get something I should have been able to get more easily three weeks ago, before I was penalized for others doing wrong, and not feel as though looking through everything is pointless, when before it had purpose.

AlexCala7b14_ESO

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to clarify a couple things for you about this issue -

The note you’re seeing in today’s patch notes regarding the reduced rate of earning racial motifs and provisioning recipes is actually for a reduction that already happened in patch v1.0.5, but we unintentionally missed the patch note for it when it was first introduced. Our apologies for the confusion this may have caused.

When this reduction initially happened, it presented an issue that caused more empty containers and furniture than intended. That issue has been fixed in today’s patch, so you will no longer find intractable objects saying they have items, but are actually empty.

Will this in effect help with the hunting of the items? Or is it going to be the same drop rate overall, just now there will be more empty furniture?

vyal

Just to be clear regarding my testing method... This was done with a VR5 character in a VR5 zone.

Login, check immediately 15 objects that can drop a recipe (furniture and vases, in this case)
Did this 10 times, no recipes.

Login, wait one minute, check immediately after one minute has passed 15 objects that can drop a recipe
Did this 10 times, no recipes

Login, wait two minutes, etc, no recipes.
Login, wait three minutes, etc, no recipes.
Login, wait four minutes, etc, no recipes.

Up to seven minutes, where I started seeing results.
Then I backed up to five minutes, and repeated to verify, then six minutes again, then 7 minutes. (perhaps it's 400 seconds?)

Then did 50 tests at 7 minutes, took a whole day (May 21) and found only two tests where I didn't obtain a green or blue recipe after logging and waiting, before looting 15 objects that could drop a recipe.
Also, the prior to arriving at the 7 minute mark, all the previous testing was done on a separate account with a separate public IP address, on a separate computer, just to be absolutely sure there was nothing hinky going on there. The results were identical for both setups.

YMMV, of course. It could all be co-incidental data, but I think it's a reasonable testing methodology, given the tools available.

Also, I was in a pre-quest-completion phase, that is, in an area filled with enemies, rather than in a post-quest-completion phase where the enemies are gone. The reason I mention this is that there was typically no-one else in the phase, or at best, one player every hour might show up as part of the quest progress in the area, and would immediately depart the phase.

Lukati_K

AlexCala7b14_ESO wrote: »

Either they're hitting the lower end ones, which seem to be more common, or they're the exceptions that prove the rule. Because the majority of people? Aren't finding them. That's what it seems based on talks in game, and on the forums. So, there's data for you, but you're not going to look at all those people are you? No. Just the few who say they have found them.

That is not data, and I'm not looking at anyone. I haven't found a single one of the higher end motifs, not even once. I know they are rare. I come from games where those types of odds are commonplace. Asheron's Call, to name one. I welcome and expect the challenge that provides, because I relish that one chance that might come my way and the reward becomes that much sweeter. It made it that much more awesome when my RL friend just found the Imperial motif the other day and rubbed it in my face because he had Imperial crafting, a horse, and was $20 richer for not buying the Imperial edition. However, I'm drifting from the point.

I'm agreeing with the fact that they are rare. First of all, let's see if these motifs are actually harder to find once the patch comes out. Second of all, people talk all sorts of poo-poo. You only know what you've seen for yourself. I, again, implore you to simply start speaking for yourself. That is all.

KerinKor

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to clarify a couple things for you about this issue -

The note you’re seeing in today’s patch notes regarding the reduced rate of earning racial motifs and provisioning recipes is actually for a reduction that already happened in patch v1.0.5, but we unintentionally missed the patch note for it when it was first introduced. Our apologies for the confusion this may have caused.

When this reduction initially happened, it presented an issue that caused more empty containers and furniture than intended. That issue has been fixed in today’s patch, so you will no longer find intractable objects saying they have items, but are actually empty.

This thread is about MOTIFS and ZOS have still failed to even ADMIT to a severe stealth nerf in 1.0.6.

SDZald

The casual players are being punished to insure the Gold Farmers stay in biz, after all they must own half of all ESO accounts.

AlexCala7b14_ESO

KerinKor wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to clarify a couple things for you about this issue -

The note you’re seeing in today’s patch notes regarding the reduced rate of earning racial motifs and provisioning recipes is actually for a reduction that already happened in patch v1.0.5, but we unintentionally missed the patch note for it when it was first introduced. Our apologies for the confusion this may have caused.

When this reduction initially happened, it presented an issue that caused more empty containers and furniture than intended. That issue has been fixed in today’s patch, so you will no longer find intractable objects saying they have items, but are actually empty.

This thread is about MOTIFS and ZOS have still failed to even ADMIT to a severe stealth nerf in 1.0.6.

Actually, they said they did it in 1.0.5 and missed the patch note. But what I'm waiting to hear is it the "fix" increases the drop rate by fixing the furniture, or if it is going to be the same as it was before, except now there is just going to be more empty furniture around you.

cjmarsh725b14_ESO

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to clarify a couple things for you about this issue -

The note you’re seeing in today’s patch notes regarding the reduced rate of earning racial motifs and provisioning recipes is actually for a reduction that already happened in patch v1.0.5, but we unintentionally missed the patch note for it when it was first introduced. Our apologies for the confusion this may have caused.

When this reduction initially happened, it presented an issue that caused more empty containers and furniture than intended. That issue has been fixed in today’s patch, so you will no longer find intractable objects saying they have items, but are actually empty.

Now I'm confused... is the drop rate reduction something that's already happened?

Pangnirtung

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to clarify a couple things for you about this issue -

The note you’re seeing in today’s patch notes regarding the reduced rate of earning racial motifs and provisioning recipes is actually for a reduction that already happened in patch v1.0.5, but we unintentionally missed the patch note for it when it was first introduced. Our apologies for the confusion this may have caused.

When this reduction initially happened, it presented an issue that caused more empty containers and furniture than intended. That issue has been fixed in today’s patch, so you will no longer find intractable objects saying they have items, but are actually empty.

So what you're saying is that the rate drop for rare motifs is still almost non-existent?

Reivax

Why do they even make it a drop? Why not a quest, where you train with a tailor doing dailies for him for like 10 straight days or something.
Motifs are purely aesthetic, aren't they? Who cares if everyone has all of them? Or are there people whose sole ability to enjoy a game is the knowledge that they have something that few people have?

Reenlister

BaddLarry wrote: »

I find it funny that there are "Veterans" in a game that's less than two months old. While I don't like a grind, I have zero interest in acquiring everything in PvE in four days and then standing around in Cyrodil begging for someone to come fight me in my new armor.

Just saying...

I have to point out one thing to you in reference to this part of your post. Not all Vets are Uber Vets. There has been plenty of time to get the levels if you have the time to play. Plus the fact that the levels were not reset to zero at launch, and the pre access players.
So while I agree with you in general, and it is rather bleak to look at the prospect of being out of things to do if you did reach V10, there is new content coming out, and not everyone who is a Vet ground there way up or worked at power leveling.

SotP_Kondor

Nitratas wrote: »

Daedric motif is going for more than half a million gold at the moment.

I found mine in a large backpack in Greenshade the day after I heard the drop rate was nerfed. It is safely ensconced in my bank, so hearing this news makes me.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6Sxv-sUYtM&feature=kp

ZOS_GinaBruno

cjmarsh725b14_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to clarify a couple things for you about this issue -

The note you’re seeing in today’s patch notes regarding the reduced rate of earning racial motifs and provisioning recipes is actually for a reduction that already happened in patch v1.0.5, but we unintentionally missed the patch note for it when it was first introduced. Our apologies for the confusion this may have caused.

When this reduction initially happened, it presented an issue that caused more empty containers and furniture than intended. That issue has been fixed in today’s patch, so you will no longer find intractable objects saying they have items, but are actually empty.

Now I'm confused... is the drop rate reduction something that's already happened?

Yes. The drop rate reduction happened back in 1.0.5. That said, many of the objects where you'd find items (such as motifs) were "empty" due to a bug that is being fixed today.

AlexCala7b14_ESO

@ZoS_GinaBruno is the drop rate the same, and there are just mroe empty furniture when you go into areas? Or does this fix in some way fix the drope rate on these motiffs, especially the higher end ones that have become night impossible to find?

ZOS_GinaBruno

AlexCala7b14_ESO wrote: »

@ZoS_GinaBruno is the drop rate the same, and there are just mroe empty furniture when you go into areas? Or does this fix in some way fix the drope rate on these motiffs, especially the higher end ones that have become night impossible to find?

The drop rate will be the same, but you will find less empty furniture now.

Sorry for the confusion on this, guys. Hope this helps clear things up!

Biggc49042

i'm still trying to figure out how they lied to you or went back on their word? they said they would investigate they did and they felt the "Fluff item" you want should be rarer then it already is.. how is that lieing. Im not saying i agree they should be hard to get but how is it lieing.

AlexCala7b14_ESO

Reivax wrote: »

Why do they even make it a drop? Why not a quest, where you train with a tailor doing dailies for him for like 10 straight days or something.
Motifs are purely aesthetic, aren't they? Who cares if everyone has all of them? Or are there people whose sole ability to enjoy a game is the knowledge that they have something that few people have?

Some people like to look badass/pretty/awesome/play dress up. It's an MMO thing. <.< We like our shiny and like to look awesome, and not all of us believe that we should have to farm for one specific item that enables this to make us look how we want, for twelve hours, when before we figured we'd just get it eventually while questing, or pay exuberant amounts for the same item that we can't possibly afford because we didn't exploit or dupe gold, and the like.

Reenlister

@AlexCala7b14_ESO That is a good question you raise...

vyal

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey there, everyone. We wanted to clarify a couple things for you about this issue -

The note you’re seeing in today’s patch notes regarding the reduced rate of earning racial motifs and provisioning recipes is actually for a reduction that already happened in patch v1.0.5, but we unintentionally missed the patch note for it when it was first introduced. Our apologies for the confusion this may have caused.

When this reduction initially happened, it presented an issue that caused more empty containers and furniture than intended. That issue has been fixed in today’s patch, so you will no longer find intractable objects saying they have items, but are actually empty.

Thank you for finally admitting it changed long before today. I think it was 1.0.6, but whatever, an admission is better than silence.