Welcome to PVP played by PVE players. We're talking about an audience that has no tolerance for failure or dying at any level.

IMO even most players in this game who identify as PVP mains wouldn't be able to tolerate an actually competitive PVP environment. Most PVP mains are thinly disguised PVE players who take pleasure in farming ESO ultracasuals incentivized to go into PVP areas for rewards with no desire for actual competition.

Why is this so? First ask yourself why a true PVP enthusiast would play ESO as it has been for at least 6-8 years?

colossalvoids wrote: »

I vividly remember one of the citations from the combat team years back, that we should easily and precisely determine what class we're going up against and now I'm quite puzzled to how this philosophy should work nowadays when there's no pure classes to expect, to begin with.

Yea this is a really good point that's especially relevant for PvP accessibility.

So when I was new to ESO PvP, I like many others, thought that magsorcs were overpowered. It's one of those classes that I would see complaints about constantly. Now it was a strong class no doubt, but I was able to learn certain things that made it very easy to handle magsorcs in the long run. Everything became somewhat predictable. For example, at the time Crystal Fragments stunned, but there was a very clear indicator when an enemy player had one ready. I also developed an internal sense of timing for when a Daedric Curse was about to explode due to encountering it often. So since sorcs tended to have a predictable kit and play style, I gradually learned to block or roll at times to prevent dying to either a Daedric curse frag combo, or a Dawnbreaker Curse combo.

Now really experienced sorcs knew how to mix things up or time things in a way to still get kills. Some level of predictability was absolutely crucial when it came to me learning how to PvP though.

Subclassing takes this away. While skills still have indicators, there's so many more things for newer players to die to. In many cases they won't see clear patterns that help them learn. They might get shalked into a double merciless resolve, or defiled and DOTed down by a Necro/DK combo... who knows, a lot is possible.

This absolutely isn't to say that I'm against burst in PvP as a whole, I think it's great. However, PvP will now be more difficult to learn and to get into now that subclassing is in the game. That's a really bad thing for a game that's losing almost all of its veterans. There were better ways to bring burst and lower TTK back into PvP, subclassing did it in a very unhealthy way and PvP is worse for it.

Mats are already dirt cheap on my server. And the people who do surveys are already the ones not buying mats because they have plenty. So, I doubt there'd be some great harm to the economy. Like a stack of refined metal is like 2k coins.

I hate surveys because I actually care about gameplay. Surveys are just cookie clicker mindless busywork.

People on console have had no add-ons for most of this game's lifespan and yet they clog up our inventory just the same. So the idea that it's add-on fault that tons of people find them boring and not that they simply don't offer anything in the way of engaging gameplay is demonstrably untrue. Perceptions that are the same on both console and PC didn't come from add-ons because console has barely had any time with add-ons.

Like the developers literally had to spend time developing new tech because surveys are so awful to do that they are clogging tons and tons of players inventory space. Literally just wasting valuable server resource because people don't want to do them but they're too valuable to trash since people want to be able to upgrade their gear, craft sets or just do more writs for coin.

I don't see why this game needs to be held back by outdated design from 15 years ago.

Many newer games make time sinks engaging and have moved away from outdated things like surveys. It's outdated and tedious design. There is no way they didn't intend for people to build them up. They know such boring things are things players will build up and do later. They're counting on it.

Games should offer engaging gameplay that players will want to do because it is fun not because they feel compelled to do it to keep up with other players.

Edit

I'm not saying they don't exist but it will be stuff you pickup during engaging gameplay not just boring stuff like click a plant all day.

This absolutely should be done. Microsoft is already sinking this game, so making less things tedious would be great for retention. Just thinking about picking up surveys makes me consider logging into another game. ESO has so much grind in everything. I play for fun, not tedium.

thorwyn wrote: »

Anything that's not tank'n'spank is bad game design. Got it.

This is veretal content. Veteran... as in "not supposed to be easy". Veteran as in "not designed for PUGs with no or limited knowledge". How can we possibly expect players to get used to more complicated trial mechanics if we dull down each and every opportunity to teachand practice by removing even the easiest mechanics and allowing them to burn everything?

It's bad game design because you can complete the entire encounter without ever knowing that you missed a mechanic for HM rewards.

If you could read a scroll that would make it so that killing a Daedroth/Wraith automatically wipes the group, new players will understand that there are extra mechanics that need to be completed.

If you can't PUG base game veteran dungeons, that's... sort of your problem. 😂
Most people can, and regularly do PUG veteran HM pledges, with zero issues. The things that make those two dungeons unique (in a bad way) are the missable HM mechanics. You don't see them in normal mode, and they are not a completion condition on veteran mode.

I'm also a little surprised that you think these mechanics are good practice to prepare players for trials... I mean, in BC2, the HM mechanic is literally for the dd's to ignore the adds and focus on the boss (the complete opposite of what you're supposed to do in 99% of trials,) and in CoH2, you just have to slow down your dps, plus ignore adds (which, again, is the complete opposite of what you're supposed to do in 99% of trials.)

It's bad game design, plain and simple.

I was worried the day I learned Microsoft had taken over.
Then came the news that Matt "The Creator/Driving force" behind the games sudden departure.
and the latest thing, Microsoft laying of so many loyal, creative and hard working people.

I am worried about the games future, I have been playing this game since BETA and this is the most worrying time for me.

My confidence in Microsoft has been shaken to its core, so much so I have cancelled my subscription.

I see dwindling numbers playing this beautiful game (my eyes don't lie), I have seen content decline over the past 2, 3, even 4 years. This years 'Content Pass' has to be the weakest yet..

I am really worried about the future of the game I have spent so many hundreds of hours playing, I have seen guilds rise and then vanish. Made many many friends from across the world. Have lost some friends I have made here to Illness and I miss them still. When I started in Beta, I was I was 53 years old, I am now 65.

I just have this nagging feeling that this is the beginning of the end.

Hi all, if you are having issues in MYM, could you note where you are playing from and add any footage you may have? We escalated this internally, but our graphs are not showing any issue with server health. It is all within margin. So any additional data you can provide, would be helpful. We can send that over to the team to assist in investigating this issue.

Sllocsredle wrote: »

The engine is Hero Engine, someone got into the mainframe, the Acapela Group is in the copyrighted info for ZOS, there is no information on the Grammar Engine, no copyright is seen, would normally be okay with a change; however there is no information on that engin<snip>

A visual aid just in case you honestly don't know what a 'necro' is.

Vulkunne wrote: »

Stamicka wrote: »

I'm curious to hear why so many players avoided this most recent Midyear Mayhem event. Each event the turnout gets lower, but this time it's shockingly low. The added campaigns were not needed at all. Personally speaking, I only played a little for the first 2 days and lost interest after that. I have a long list of reasons, but it would probably be useful for ZOS to see other perspectives.

Feel free to share your reasons.

Consistent bombings. You can't take 5 to 10 steps outside without getting dragged and insta-killed along with 2 or 3 other people.

I love PvP and I love Vengeance. Didn't have time for it last time, but glad I made time. But this here is just foolishness. Its silly, its one thing by itself but people are taking the bombings to ridiculous lengths, meta subclasses everywhere, obscene amounts of damage being dished out with no counter-play, so on so forth.

It's a hot mess and I don't have the time or inclination anymore to sort out a bunch of people more or less reacting and griefing one another. That is not PvP, and I just can only imagine what fresh hell the new folks and casuals much be dealing with. I saw a bunch of PvE folks doing quests and so forth the other day, didn't bother them.

No reason to when you can't even PvP without getting constantly instant-killed. It's real sad but not my fault.

Yeah... I'm getting this vibe too after playing for a few days in a row. The bombings, the subclassing meta.. it's just... to be blunt it sucks and it needs a massive change in cyro. And sooner not later.