Best Of
Re: April 20th Vengeance Only..
albertberku wrote: »Use almost exact same or identical skill lines, and playstyle.
Your argument that PvP is boring because every build is similar actually baffles me considering everyone in PvE plays a variant of the same beam build and have done so since the Arc was released.
You realise people will naturally migrate to whatever is meta in a game like this? Not just PvP but in every aspect of this game? They want to hit the hardest they can. Even people with accessibility issues and perhaps can’t bar swap easily, they will still aim to make the best one-bar build available to them.
There’s even a meta in Vengeance with people favouring NB for damage.
Poss
5
Re: U50 Feedback Thread for Class Mastery
I've touched Sorc lots. It has been underbaked as a class for 12 years now, but the Mastery is undeniably strong. If you guys are referring to relatively underpowered MagSorc builds, there have been 0 metas where "stack max mag to do everything (from range)" has been balanced, either busted op or useless garbage, here's hoping the upcoming rework resolves this.Have you even touched the Sorc with anecdotal gameplay in actual content or are you still disillusioned based ONLY on PTS parse numbers/ number statistics? Sorc is still way underbaked, Idk what kind of stuff you're seeing but Sorc passives still need alot of work.
This is the crux of the issue and a lot of it stems from the fact there seems to be no real "Sorc Dev" on the team and hasn't been since probably Vvardenfell (or maybe even earlier) given how the Sorcerer changes have been handled over the years.
Overload 3rd bar removal (completely killed the pets as a synergistic and integrated part of the class kit), that resulted in splitting the class into 2 separate distinct and conflicting playstyles that resulted in both of them needing to outsource many key aspects of their builds to non-class skills (or other class lines post sub-classing).
The refusal to expand Sorcerers abilities to have secondary effects/buff/debuff access, etc. Stems from some outdated (launch era) notion that classes need to rely on other classes to gain access the buffs that all of the other classes have not had to live be for years now, but sorcerer still suffers under (see some of the dev notes during U38-45 patch notes for proof of this).
U41 ward changes that were insane numbers buffs, but with zero added functionality beyond flat numbers increases, the numbers had to be that big or the buff would completely flop (see the ward nerf in U46 where the line just fell off a cliff in PvP, especially with sub-classing pushing damage infinitely high on top of that nerf and the line is only used for atro in PvE).
Design of crit surge needing to deal critical strikes to "heal over time" but no sticky DoTs in the kit for consistent damage ticks or access to major Prophecy/Savagery for years (and only really stamsorc eventually got that buff on armaments), oh and pets cannot proc this ability either.
The changes to max stats, their removal from the switch of Champion Point 1 system to Champion Point 2 system, the changes to the damage formula years ago to make max stats significantly lower than stacking weapon/spell damage, the shift of scaling healing off weapon/spell damage instead of max stats, and the constant changes to Sorcerers max stats passives/effects so that they are now a janky unreliable mess spread across multiple passives and skill lines (both of which are borderline useless in a sub-classing world).
Cast times on Sorcerer abilities to balance out access to streak (Sorc needing to keep away to ensure reliable use of defensive capabilities), but then giving every class infinite baseline speed at no cost and now sub-classing for streak on top of that speed as well without any cost to their other defensive capabilities such as removal of mitigation, cast times on their healing abilities, etc.
Everything being so generic it works better for non-sorc abilities than it does for sorc abilities
The refusal to expand Sorcerers abilities to have secondary effects/buff/debuff access, etc. Stems from some outdated (launch era) notion that classes need to rely on other classes to gain access the buffs that all of the other classes have not had to live be for years now, but sorcerer still suffers under (see some of the dev notes during U38-45 patch notes for proof of this).
U41 ward changes that were insane numbers buffs, but with zero added functionality beyond flat numbers increases, the numbers had to be that big or the buff would completely flop (see the ward nerf in U46 where the line just fell off a cliff in PvP, especially with sub-classing pushing damage infinitely high on top of that nerf and the line is only used for atro in PvE).
Design of crit surge needing to deal critical strikes to "heal over time" but no sticky DoTs in the kit for consistent damage ticks or access to major Prophecy/Savagery for years (and only really stamsorc eventually got that buff on armaments), oh and pets cannot proc this ability either.
The changes to max stats, their removal from the switch of Champion Point 1 system to Champion Point 2 system, the changes to the damage formula years ago to make max stats significantly lower than stacking weapon/spell damage, the shift of scaling healing off weapon/spell damage instead of max stats, and the constant changes to Sorcerers max stats passives/effects so that they are now a janky unreliable mess spread across multiple passives and skill lines (both of which are borderline useless in a sub-classing world).
Cast times on Sorcerer abilities to balance out access to streak (Sorc needing to keep away to ensure reliable use of defensive capabilities), but then giving every class infinite baseline speed at no cost and now sub-classing for streak on top of that speed as well without any cost to their other defensive capabilities such as removal of mitigation, cast times on their healing abilities, etc.
Everything being so generic it works better for non-sorc abilities than it does for sorc abilities
Keeping these flaws in the Sorcerers class kit has meant that the only way to make Sorcerer competitive (in any setting) is to bump the numbers up so stupidly high (see U41 ward changes, class sets and class masteries as proof) that there's no way to truly balance them.
These design fallacies ZOS has with Sorc really need to be addressed or the Sorc refresh will flop just as bad as everything else ZOS has tried with Sorc.
When doing Sorcs refresh, ZOS needs to:
- delete the extremely outdated notion from their minds that Sorc needs other classes for basic buffs (resolve, brut/sorc, proph/sav) or debuffs (breach).
- delete cast times (especially hidden ones such as on fury/flood) as the "balancing" mechanics for streak now that every class sits at speed cap and has access to streak anyway (with sub-classing).
- delete the many internal conflicts inherent within sorcs design (the crit surge case and the pet v no pet resulting from overload 3rd bar removal as examples).
- stop trying to simply force big numbers through as the way to fix the classes inherent design flaws when a complete redesign from the ground up is required.
- start tying some of sorcs strengths to actual sorc abilities rather than being completely generic that better suits everything else than it does sorc abilities.
- remove the extreme redundancy from sorcs abilities (the class doesn't need like 6 sustain passives on top of 4-5 sustain based secondary effects and a sustain based class mastery, it's complete overkill).
- revert the shift of all of sorcs abilities into delayed burst for this "one big 5 stacked ability combo" that still deals less damage than just casting a single molten whip or timing MR + shulks does for DK or sub-classed builds respectively, allow the class some actual pressure abilities in its kit outside of overload to facilitate other playstyles.
- delete cast times (especially hidden ones such as on fury/flood) as the "balancing" mechanics for streak now that every class sits at speed cap and has access to streak anyway (with sub-classing).
- delete the many internal conflicts inherent within sorcs design (the crit surge case and the pet v no pet resulting from overload 3rd bar removal as examples).
- stop trying to simply force big numbers through as the way to fix the classes inherent design flaws when a complete redesign from the ground up is required.
- start tying some of sorcs strengths to actual sorc abilities rather than being completely generic that better suits everything else than it does sorc abilities.
- remove the extreme redundancy from sorcs abilities (the class doesn't need like 6 sustain passives on top of 4-5 sustain based secondary effects and a sustain based class mastery, it's complete overkill).
- revert the shift of all of sorcs abilities into delayed burst for this "one big 5 stacked ability combo" that still deals less damage than just casting a single molten whip or timing MR + shulks does for DK or sub-classed builds respectively, allow the class some actual pressure abilities in its kit outside of overload to facilitate other playstyles.
Also, now that DK is giving the entire group major berserk when casting an ultimate (any ultimate) from the DK mastery as well as major heroism to the group (that also allows the caster to cast that ultimate much more frequently), on top of being a superior parse DD thanks to the abundance of cleave access DK has that Sorcerer does not have, Sorcerer needs it's own unique reason to bring it to groups since DK is taking the existing only reason to bring Sorcerers into end-game PvE group content at all (that being atro on a support for group major berserk).
YandereGirlfriend wrote: »Exactly.
DK has the (awesome) "problem" where they have SO many great skills that you just want to slot them all and get severe FOMO when you are constrained by your scarce bar space.
Meanwhile, over in Sorc-Land, you could delete 75% of total Sorc skills and nobody would care - or even notice - because they are such collective dogwater that they haven't been slotted by serious players since the age of Elsweyr.
I will say, though, that when every class has as stacked skills as DK... the game will be absolutely cooking again. And it will be glorious.
Also, probably closer to 85% of sorcs abilities could be removed and nobody would notice. The only ones people would notice enough to complain about would be the pets (and only pet mains would complain), hurricane (this specific morph only) and Streak (PvP) (wow a whopping 6 out of 36 morphs of the entire kit would have people notice/complain if they got removed). Everything else is just too niche, completely redundant or just simply outclassed by better alternatives.
p.s. not counting atro anymore since it's redundant with DK mastery passive, also not counting ward anymore because U46 nerf completely killed it to the point that shield soul is a better shield than ward due to secondary effects + utility beyond just being a shield.
Re: U50 Feedback Thread for Class Mastery
I've touched Sorc lots. It has been underbaked as a class for 12 years now, but the Mastery is undeniably strong. If you guys are referring to relatively underpowered MagSorc builds, there have been 0 metas where "stack max mag to do everything (from range)" has been balanced, either busted op or useless garbage, here's hoping the upcoming rework resolves this.Have you even touched the Sorc with anecdotal gameplay in actual content or are you still disillusioned based ONLY on PTS parse numbers/ number statistics? Sorc is still way underbaked, Idk what kind of stuff you're seeing but Sorc passives still need alot of work.
True, and I'm one of those Sorc players who understands you can't be competitive by just stacking everything into Mag and that you're going to have everything you need out of the class, whether it's PvP or PvE.
These passives are strong, IMO, on paper but not in true gameplay. These passives wont' go anywhere near making a Mag based Sorc as competitive as they would be to subclass and that's the issue I have with them.
The values are either too low or the uptime potential is too low or they deliver on redundancy we just don't need. .. A HA Sorc doesn't have a sustain issue and we have one of the best mechanical shields in the game, we don't need a passive that focuses on shields (let alone 2); especially when we're so down on power.
I hope the refresh really brings the burst power we're missing but until then I don't see these passives filling that gap between pure-sorc with these awful skills versus subclassing.
Exactly.
DK has the (awesome) "problem" where they have SO many great skills that you just want to slot them all and get severe FOMO when you are constrained by your scarce bar space.
Meanwhile, over in Sorc-Land, you could delete 75% of total Sorc skills and nobody would care - or even notice - because they are such collective dogwater that they haven't been slotted by serious players since the age of Elsweyr.
I will say, though, that when every class has as stacked skills as DK... the game will be absolutely cooking again. And it will be glorious.
Re: 14 hour maintenance on Monday? Did I read that right?
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691699/
Yes, explained at the link above which mentions cross play development and disabling Vengeance.
Yes, explained at the link above which mentions cross play development and disabling Vengeance.
Dojohoda
5
Re: 14 hour maintenance on Monday? Did I read that right?
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691699/
Yes, explained at the link above which mentions cross play development and disabling Vengeance.
That's unfortunate.
Personally I'd prefer that the PC and game box populations remained separate.
reazea
16
Re: Gambling boxes and why I don't buy them anymore.
When ever you gamble you eventually lose my friend but the odds of losing in Tamriel are way higher then on Tatooine.
Re: I believe outgoing healing in PvP needs to be completely removed.
Parasaurolophus wrote: »Simply reducing it doesn’t really solve the problem. I don’t see any realistic way to balance it properly—either it has to go entirely, or be reduced to something like 5–10% effectiveness.
In Battlegrounds, the team with more healers almost always wins. Organized ball groups are largely viable because of cross-healing.
This has been imbalanced for far too long and creates too many systemic issues. At the very least, as an experiment, outgoing healing should be drastically reduced or completely disabled.
Good healers keep their teammates alive. That’s the whole point of their existence. Make friends with a healer in PVP and you’ll survive a lot longer, too.
If you’re struggling with overcoming healing, bring a source of Major Defile, lower their weapon/spell damage, tighten up your rotation for more damage.
The team with more healers should have a higher chance of winning. That’s just how it works. Adjust your strategy or accept that you’ll have to take an L on that one.
Re: 🚨Werewolf NERFS Incoming on PTS Week 3🚨
Wuuffy it's pretty clear you aren't acting in good faith, but I will engage once, and only once.
If it is so clear to you that werewolf is okay how it is, why not provide counter evidence? I skimmed the other thread and people went out on a limb repeatedly to provide evidence and the goal posts moved every time. Please post the CMX's, videos, and math you are using to come to this conclusion.
It seems the devs have looked into the flagged issues and decided there is a problem. Maybe wait and see how they implement these fixes before spamming the forum.
If it is so clear to you that werewolf is okay how it is, why not provide counter evidence? I skimmed the other thread and people went out on a limb repeatedly to provide evidence and the goal posts moved every time. Please post the CMX's, videos, and math you are using to come to this conclusion.
It seems the devs have looked into the flagged issues and decided there is a problem. Maybe wait and see how they implement these fixes before spamming the forum.
Looking forward to the next Dev Stream
Things have been feeling dour on the forums lately. I thought about making a whole post discussing that... but I think for now I'd rather just say something positive by sharing that I'm curious to see what May's stream is like. I look forward to get some good laughs and enthusiasm from the devs– they've been the highlight of content lately.
Malyore
6
Re: SUPRISE ! People dont like VENGEANCE
SeaGtGruff wrote: »Now that I've completed the Golden Pursuits and all of my weekly challenges, I've been spending a few hours in Vengeance. The population bars have never gotten over 1 bar per alliance this morning/afternoon, but there seem to be many players on, and much PvPing and sieging.
I'm warming up to Vengeance-- that is, I'm feeling better about my chances in Vengeance. As a player who's not that good at PvP, much of my time in GH is spent soloing resources, and helping capture or defend keeps if other players from my alliance are on and actively PvPing. But soloing a resource in Vengeance has always been beyond me-- until this morning. Now that I've been able to successfully solo a number of resources, I feel like I could atill enjoy playing in Vengeance even when there are too few players from my alliance on.
Don't be afraid. Vengeance isn't PvP. It's more like Sumo suit wrestling.
Not sure where you read "fear" into anything I wrote. I'm no stranger to GH-- maybe not as much of a regular there as all of the dedicated PvPers, but definitely no stranger-- and I'm sure there are many AD and EP players from GH who will be very happy to verify that they kill me a lot there, and that I am known to run up to enemy siege or enemy camps to try to burn them even though I'm vastly outnumbered, or ride up all alone to a resource that's being flipped by a dozen enemies, or into a keep that's being taken by several dozen enemy players, despite knowing it is going to be certain insta-death for me. Other players might be afraid to die in PvP, but I'm not one of them.
As for your dismissal of Vengeance, I might still be mostly on the fence about it-- I do love GH-- but to claim that Vengeance isn't PvP is just silly. There was a lot of heavy-duty PvP going on this morning in Vengeance on PCNA. And EP seems to be dominating this current Vengeance test campaign on PCNA, so there must be a lot of EP players who enjoy Vengeance. And there were a fair many AD players there, too.
