ItsNotLiving wrote: »

CAB_Life wrote: »

Templar is underwhelming across the board. The support passives, in particular, simply do not compete with stuff like major force. The damage passives will not convince people to trade beams/ whips for jabs. Hopefully, we see some changes in PTS week 5, but I doubt it.

They need to move the Templar refresh ahead of sorcerer since sorc is already in a a good spot.

How about no.

If Necromancers can wait their turn then so can Templars.

This marginal difference in personal best case parses on 1bar oakens feels about right. I'm enjoying the ~2.5% advantage to pureclassing. My only note is that purelcassing somehow introduces a wider deviation over many parses than subclassing, potentially indicating an unintended behavior with pureclassing. Evidence for that isn't pictured, but I'd be happy to provide.

Pureclassed personal high end


Subclassed personal high end

acanca wrote: »

Static Reverberation

This passive was a huge problem for pvp week 1. It was in a fine state after getting adjusted to 0.5 seconds. Its now back to being too powerful with 0.3 seconds cool down and being buffed to base 5% proc rate.

Part of the problem comes from sorc being too good at being able to proc it. 5% proc base doesnt sound like much but consider that a regular status effect build can deal up to 10 instances of seperate damage per second. For example

1-Vateshran destro proc
2-Burning status effect from vateshran
3-Light attack
4-Concussion from thread of war
5-Crushing shock (frost)
6-Crushing shock (fire)
7-Crushing shock (shock)
8-Chill from crushing shock
9-Burning from crushing shock
10- Concussion from crushing shock
11-Hurricane

10+ instances of seperate damage in a single second with a 5% base proc chance at full hp, skyrocketing to a certainty at lower health thresholds. This isnt just limited to this specific scenario either, bound armamant is 4 instance of seperate damage by itself and is by itself a burst damage and the burst damage having near certainty to proc additional damage turns it from a burst to an easy execute. In fact it turns basically everything in sorcs arsenal to an execute extremely easily.

Malevolent Promise was excluded from pvp for being too war crimey, well, this passive is the actual war crime. Please consider adding a once per second clause to it with battle spirit active. Proccing an extra instance of damage every second easily makes it one of the best pure class passives in the game, simply makes it less toxic by preventing it from being oppressive in pvp.

TBH, this is more of a condemnation of how status effects and ticky-tack micro ticks of damage have gotten out of control in recent updates than it says anything about Sorc itself. The only actual Sorc skill even in here is Hurricane.

Would much prefer that the Vate Crutch Staff, Ele Sus, and Force Pulse get nerfed before anything else happens. Why do we have things like Rapid Strikes having nerfed status effect chance per tick while Force Pulse skates with the full Single Target Direct Damage multiplier? Seems like nerfing that down to Single Target DOT levels would be a nice place to start balancing. Then we can remove the free cast status of Ele Sus and perhaps delete the auto status effect proc as well.

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

acanca wrote: »

Static Reverberation

This passive was a huge problem for pvp week 1. It was in a fine state after getting adjusted to 0.5 seconds. Its now back to being too powerful with 0.3 seconds cool down and being buffed to base 5% proc rate.

Part of the problem comes from sorc being too good at being able to proc it. 5% proc base doesnt sound like much but consider that a regular status effect build can deal up to 10 instances of seperate damage per second. For example

1-Vateshran destro proc
2-Burning status effect from vateshran
3-Light attack
4-Concussion from thread of war
5-Crushing shock (frost)
6-Crushing shock (fire)
7-Crushing shock (shock)
8-Chill from crushing shock
9-Burning from crushing shock
10- Concussion from crushing shock
11-Hurricane

10+ instances of seperate damage in a single second with a 5% base proc chance at full hp, skyrocketing to a certainty at lower health thresholds. This isnt just limited to this specific scenario either, bound armamant is 4 instance of seperate damage by itself and is by itself a burst damage and the burst damage having near certainty to proc additional damage turns it from a burst to an easy execute. In fact it turns basically everything in sorcs arsenal to an execute extremely easily.

Malevolent Promise was excluded from pvp for being too war crimey, well, this passive is the actual war crime. Please consider adding a once per second clause to it with battle spirit active. Proccing an extra instance of damage every second easily makes it one of the best pure class passives in the game, simply makes it less toxic by preventing it from being oppressive in pvp.

TBH, this is more of a condemnation of how status effects and ticky-tack micro ticks of damage have gotten out of control in recent updates than it says anything about Sorc itself. The only actual Sorc skill even in here is Hurricane.

Would much prefer that the Vate Crutch Staff, Ele Sus, and Force Pulse get nerfed before anything else happens. Why do we have things like Rapid Strikes having nerfed status effect chance per tick while Force Pulse skates with the full Single Target Direct Damage multiplier? Seems like nerfing that down to Single Target DOT levels would be a nice place to start balancing. Then we can remove the free cast status of Ele Sus and perhaps delete the auto status effect proc as well.

I think maybe just nerfing ele sus to cost 1-2k mag would be a fine nerf. I wouldnt wanna see the 7.5 seconds status procs removed because its such a unique thing but yes its a really strong skill, maybe adjusting the proc rate to 8-10? Dunno.

I am and honestly have always been a fan of the status effect playstyle and i'll be honest what i described has also been possible a few years back, its just that the buff to status effects uhhh was it last year, in combination with signet made the playstyle a lot more viable, but static reverbation might be too synergistic with the playstyle and sorc in general. I mean, 4 hits on BA itself, 5 with la and did i mention each hit of BA can proc sundered individually and has higher than normal sundered proc rate not mentioned on the skill itself?, yeah thats up to 9 individual damage instances with nothing but a light attack and a single skill

ZhuJiuyin wrote: »

acanca wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

acanca wrote: »

Static Reverberation

This passive was a huge problem for pvp week 1. It was in a fine state after getting adjusted to 0.5 seconds. Its now back to being too powerful with 0.3 seconds cool down and being buffed to base 5% proc rate.

Part of the problem comes from sorc being too good at being able to proc it. 5% proc base doesnt sound like much but consider that a regular status effect build can deal up to 10 instances of seperate damage per second. For example

1-Vateshran destro proc
2-Burning status effect from vateshran
3-Light attack
4-Concussion from thread of war
5-Crushing shock (frost)
6-Crushing shock (fire)
7-Crushing shock (shock)
8-Chill from crushing shock
9-Burning from crushing shock
10- Concussion from crushing shock
11-Hurricane

10+ instances of seperate damage in a single second with a 5% base proc chance at full hp, skyrocketing to a certainty at lower health thresholds. This isnt just limited to this specific scenario either, bound armamant is 4 instance of seperate damage by itself and is by itself a burst damage and the burst damage having near certainty to proc additional damage turns it from a burst to an easy execute. In fact it turns basically everything in sorcs arsenal to an execute extremely easily.

Malevolent Promise was excluded from pvp for being too war crimey, well, this passive is the actual war crime. Please consider adding a once per second clause to it with battle spirit active. Proccing an extra instance of damage every second easily makes it one of the best pure class passives in the game, simply makes it less toxic by preventing it from being oppressive in pvp.

TBH, this is more of a condemnation of how status effects and ticky-tack micro ticks of damage have gotten out of control in recent updates than it says anything about Sorc itself. The only actual Sorc skill even in here is Hurricane.

Would much prefer that the Vate Crutch Staff, Ele Sus, and Force Pulse get nerfed before anything else happens. Why do we have things like Rapid Strikes having nerfed status effect chance per tick while Force Pulse skates with the full Single Target Direct Damage multiplier? Seems like nerfing that down to Single Target DOT levels would be a nice place to start balancing. Then we can remove the free cast status of Ele Sus and perhaps delete the auto status effect proc as well.

I think maybe just nerfing ele sus to cost 1-2k mag would be a fine nerf. I wouldnt wanna see the 7.5 seconds status procs removed because its such a unique thing but yes its a really strong skill, maybe adjusting the proc rate to 8-10? Dunno.

I am and honestly have always been a fan of the status effect playstyle and i'll be honest what i described has also been possible a few years back, its just that the buff to status effects uhhh was it last year, in combination with signet made the playstyle a lot more viable, but static reverbation might be too synergistic with the playstyle and sorc in general. I mean, 4 hits on BA itself, 5 with la and did i mention each hit of BA can proc sundered individually and has higher than normal sundered proc rate not mentioned on the skill itself?, yeah thats up to 9 individual damage instances with nothing but a light attack and a single skill

I disagree, because this will impact PvE, especially since Staff is already significantly weaker than Dual Wield. Not to mention the current state of Bound Armaments now, which was hard-won by many sorc players; otherwise, Bound Armaments would simply be a degraded version of Grim Focus.

I believe a better balancing approach would be to prevent status effects from triggering Static Reverberatio. This should reduce the trigger frequency and maintain relative balance until the Sorc is reworked.

Sorc should also be subject to a "battle spirit" mechanic, reducing the base chance of Static Reverberation in PvP to -10%!

gammelscroll wrote: »

Templar masteries is a joke. How on earth would someone play pure Templar over subclass? (I do)
If pure classes is gonna compete with subbing, we need some real good ***.
More wep.power, healing reduce, 10 % more DMG to subclass. And more reward for playing pure class.
Or just revert the whole subclass. Cyrodil is almost dead after subclass was introduced. But hey, when did zos care about cyrodil?
@ZOS_Kevin fix templar class masteries

I've been saying this all along. Templars seem to be getting the shaft... AGAIN. There is absolutely no reason for me to play a pure class when subclassing still highly outperforms class mastery on Templars; the masteries for them are truly a joke. And what seems to be worse, is the devs either don't seem to see that, or don't agree... even though EVERYONE is saying how bad Templar class masteries are.

Dracane wrote: »

acanca wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

acanca wrote: »

Static Reverberation

This passive was a huge problem for pvp week 1. It was in a fine state after getting adjusted to 0.5 seconds. Its now back to being too powerful with 0.3 seconds cool down and being buffed to base 5% proc rate.

Part of the problem comes from sorc being too good at being able to proc it. 5% proc base doesnt sound like much but consider that a regular status effect build can deal up to 10 instances of seperate damage per second. For example

1-Vateshran destro proc
2-Burning status effect from vateshran
3-Light attack
4-Concussion from thread of war
5-Crushing shock (frost)
6-Crushing shock (fire)
7-Crushing shock (shock)
8-Chill from crushing shock
9-Burning from crushing shock
10- Concussion from crushing shock
11-Hurricane

10+ instances of seperate damage in a single second with a 5% base proc chance at full hp, skyrocketing to a certainty at lower health thresholds. This isnt just limited to this specific scenario either, bound armamant is 4 instance of seperate damage by itself and is by itself a burst damage and the burst damage having near certainty to proc additional damage turns it from a burst to an easy execute. In fact it turns basically everything in sorcs arsenal to an execute extremely easily.

Malevolent Promise was excluded from pvp for being too war crimey, well, this passive is the actual war crime. Please consider adding a once per second clause to it with battle spirit active. Proccing an extra instance of damage every second easily makes it one of the best pure class passives in the game, simply makes it less toxic by preventing it from being oppressive in pvp.

TBH, this is more of a condemnation of how status effects and ticky-tack micro ticks of damage have gotten out of control in recent updates than it says anything about Sorc itself. The only actual Sorc skill even in here is Hurricane.

Would much prefer that the Vate Crutch Staff, Ele Sus, and Force Pulse get nerfed before anything else happens. Why do we have things like Rapid Strikes having nerfed status effect chance per tick while Force Pulse skates with the full Single Target Direct Damage multiplier? Seems like nerfing that down to Single Target DOT levels would be a nice place to start balancing. Then we can remove the free cast status of Ele Sus and perhaps delete the auto status effect proc as well.

I think maybe just nerfing ele sus to cost 1-2k mag would be a fine nerf. I wouldnt wanna see the 7.5 seconds status procs removed because its such a unique thing but yes its a really strong skill, maybe adjusting the proc rate to 8-10? Dunno.

I am and honestly have always been a fan of the status effect playstyle and i'll be honest what i described has also been possible a few years back, its just that the buff to status effects uhhh was it last year, in combination with signet made the playstyle a lot more viable, but static reverbation might be too synergistic with the playstyle and sorc in general. I mean, 4 hits on BA itself, 5 with la and did i mention each hit of BA can proc sundered individually and has higher than normal sundered proc rate not mentioned on the skill itself?, yeah thats up to 9 individual damage instances with nothing but a light attack and a single skill

When it comes to Static Reverberation, the build matters I think. The cost of running Static Reverberation can't be neglected. Because what do you choose? Conservation and Static? That means you lose a lot of base damage from Font of Power that makes all your other stuff hit for less, and if you want to run Font and Static Reverb together for full offense, then you have sustain issues unless you build around it, thus once again losing damage elsewhere.

I'd rather Static Reverberation did not exist, because I see it being broken in the hands of some builds, or useless on other, more burst oriented ones.

To be fair that's true for most classes with 2 offensive masteries.

Dracane wrote: »

acanca wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

acanca wrote: »

Static Reverberation

This passive was a huge problem for pvp week 1. It was in a fine state after getting adjusted to 0.5 seconds. Its now back to being too powerful with 0.3 seconds cool down and being buffed to base 5% proc rate.

Part of the problem comes from sorc being too good at being able to proc it. 5% proc base doesnt sound like much but consider that a regular status effect build can deal up to 10 instances of seperate damage per second. For example

1-Vateshran destro proc
2-Burning status effect from vateshran
3-Light attack
4-Concussion from thread of war
5-Crushing shock (frost)
6-Crushing shock (fire)
7-Crushing shock (shock)
8-Chill from crushing shock
9-Burning from crushing shock
10- Concussion from crushing shock
11-Hurricane

10+ instances of seperate damage in a single second with a 5% base proc chance at full hp, skyrocketing to a certainty at lower health thresholds. This isnt just limited to this specific scenario either, bound armamant is 4 instance of seperate damage by itself and is by itself a burst damage and the burst damage having near certainty to proc additional damage turns it from a burst to an easy execute. In fact it turns basically everything in sorcs arsenal to an execute extremely easily.

Malevolent Promise was excluded from pvp for being too war crimey, well, this passive is the actual war crime. Please consider adding a once per second clause to it with battle spirit active. Proccing an extra instance of damage every second easily makes it one of the best pure class passives in the game, simply makes it less toxic by preventing it from being oppressive in pvp.

TBH, this is more of a condemnation of how status effects and ticky-tack micro ticks of damage have gotten out of control in recent updates than it says anything about Sorc itself. The only actual Sorc skill even in here is Hurricane.

Would much prefer that the Vate Crutch Staff, Ele Sus, and Force Pulse get nerfed before anything else happens. Why do we have things like Rapid Strikes having nerfed status effect chance per tick while Force Pulse skates with the full Single Target Direct Damage multiplier? Seems like nerfing that down to Single Target DOT levels would be a nice place to start balancing. Then we can remove the free cast status of Ele Sus and perhaps delete the auto status effect proc as well.

I think maybe just nerfing ele sus to cost 1-2k mag would be a fine nerf. I wouldnt wanna see the 7.5 seconds status procs removed because its such a unique thing but yes its a really strong skill, maybe adjusting the proc rate to 8-10? Dunno.

I am and honestly have always been a fan of the status effect playstyle and i'll be honest what i described has also been possible a few years back, its just that the buff to status effects uhhh was it last year, in combination with signet made the playstyle a lot more viable, but static reverbation might be too synergistic with the playstyle and sorc in general. I mean, 4 hits on BA itself, 5 with la and did i mention each hit of BA can proc sundered individually and has higher than normal sundered proc rate not mentioned on the skill itself?, yeah thats up to 9 individual damage instances with nothing but a light attack and a single skill

When it comes to Static Reverberation, the build matters I think. The cost of running Static Reverberation can't be neglected. Because what do you choose? Conservation and Static? That means you lose a lot of base damage from Font of Power that makes all your other stuff hit for less, and if you want to run Font and Static Reverb together for full offense, then you have sustain issues unless you build around it, thus once again losing damage elsewhere.

I'd rather Static Reverberation did not exist, because I see it being broken in the hands of some builds, or useless on other, more burst oriented ones.

Sorc has way too many good choices for class masteries and this makes choosing only 2 difficult.

Prionyx wrote: »

NxJoeyD wrote: »

Prionyx wrote: »

NxJoeyD wrote: »

Prionyx wrote: »

NxJoeyD wrote: »

Prionyx wrote: »

NxJoeyD wrote: »

Prionyx wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

danko355 wrote: »

I don’t get the nerfs for nightblade masteries in PVP specifically. Who actually thinks nightblades overperform in PvP? You have dk whips dealing the same damage as bow procs, necros with unlimited stamina-health sustain, sorcs with overpowered masteries and yet nightblade gets the nerfs? The class with already the worst class masteries for PVP?

What is wrong with Whips being on par with Bowproc? One is melee and the other is ranged.

This sort of bias that only NBs are allowed to have high burst makes me tune-out these conversations.

NB has been subclassed in every PvP metabuild since forever so we should not pretend that they are hurting the same as, say, Necromancer has been.

What's your point? Bow being ranged is a massive disadvantage, this is the only reason mericless is soo bad. Because it's ranged you can't hit it after incap and will always be dodged, but whip is guaranteed after leap or db. NB is a melee class, you can't realy take advantage of it anyway. Incap is melee, fear is melee, your spammable is melee, axes are melee, bow only heals in melee...

"NB has been subclassed in every PvP metabuild" - no. Assassination was tier 3 skill line and far from must have unlike tier 1 lines(storm/restoring) and tier 2 lines(grave/animal)

I have to agree with @YandereGirlfriend on this one. I'm watching the lions share of builds run to Assassination for subclassing, honestly, seeing that as one of the top 2 choices (between Animal Companions & Assassination).

Most grab Assassin for Surprise Attack and Merciless Resolve specifically, because they perform so well.

Merciless isn't a range only skill and bow being a ranged attack and having issues I don't disagree with but that's not a NB specific issue nor does it have anything to do with Merciless.

Merciless has been one of the strongest performers in PvP since subclassing.

The majority of what I've seen for Subclassing is: Assassination, Animal Companion, & Aedric Spear. .. Storm Calling would be a solid 4th. This was only further amplified after the DK refresh where anyone who wanted to subclass Flame Lash would also grab either Surprise Attack or Toppling Charge to better proc Power Lash with as max uptime as possible.

How is merciless being ranged isn't a NB issue? It's NB's skill, and it being ranged is NB's core problem. If it was a melee skill NB would be miles stronger

Merciless isn't a ranged skill per se. It's not melee in the sense that it's not physical damage or a physical attack but it provides a significant health restore if used within melee range which is incredibly easy to do for most melee builds, especially those running dual wield.

You don't have to cast Merciless from a distance and it provides an incentive to synergize the skill with melee play styles. Merciless isn't "ranged" in the bow sense where you really only want to use it at considerable range.

Merciless executes it's function blisteringly quick. There are so many sources of CC in the game now, thanks to subclassing that applying a hard CC followed by Merciless is common and easy.

I admit that Merciless synergizes much better with subclassed builds than it does with pure NB but that's true for basically any class and skill at this point.

Merciless being an instant application that can scale to 15k to 20k damage, after resistances, it's hard to make a case for this skill being a poor performer; especially when it's so consistently slotted in PvP now.

If you want bad skills go slot Sorcs. Mostly redundant utility and no burst. The Sorcs dueling in Riften on PTS are mostly leaning on the Signet mythic to buff Overcharged with big pools while sitting behind shields. .. The funny part is that's not a Sorc-specific thing. Any class could do that very same thing, DKs could use that to jack Burning way up, but they don't need to. They have competitive skills.

The NB passives do need a bump up and the BS condition removed. Merciless though, that's a popular skill for good reason.

There are so many sources of CC in the game now, thanks to subclassing that applying a hard CC followed by Merciless is common and easy. - no. Only very low skilled players will not dodge bow because it's a ranged skill with a long travel time, there is not a single stun that will guarantee you a merciless excluding shattering rocks, but shattering rocks is a DK skill + everyone dodges it. People were using assassination because of passives and stats, while assassinastion skills by itself are super mid, this is THE ONLY class in the game without delayed burst

Most players slotting Merciless aren't using it in that way, nor is that the only way or even prime way to use it.

Sure, activating Merciless from Bow range will result in a dodge but most players who are experienced know to use it at much closer range where the execution of the function is so quick there's a lot more opportunity to use it and land damage. I see it every day in PvP.

You didn't get the point. There are no opportunities to guarantee it in a combo with incap because it's a ranged skill not because it's used in range but because it's a ranged skill with a travel time. It's impossible to land in a burst combo

Well, for starters no skill should deliver a “guarantee” to combo or land damage, that’s insanely broken. Every skill is (or should) have some element of counter-play to it; whatever that might be.

It’s one thing to guarantee that a particular skill can have or proc a particular effect, periodically, but that’s wholly different from guaranteeing actually landing that attack.

As for the travel time, for Merciless it’s exceptionally low. Pairing with Incap is easy but, thanks to subclassing, there’s even more available counter to a combo strategy like that. If you use Incap and the target currently has immunity then the stun isn’t going to apply and that’s the key thing needed to have a combo like Incap + Merciless land.

And I’m absolutely ok with that because a combination of Incap + Merciless in the current state of a crit meta shouldn’t be a guarantee, that would be literally giving someone free or low skill kills which shouldn’t be a cornerstone of combat (although I know it is with other combos).

Merciless is an incredibly hard hitting skill and has a blusteringly fast execution time, especially in the context of being compared to every other hard hitting skill in the game.

If you say that no skill should guarantee a combo then mormally I shouldn't even read your message because you have no idea how pvp works. It's a core of ESO's PVP and always has been. But for some reason I did

"As for the travel time, for Merciless it’s exceptionally low" - it doesn't matter as long as it's there. It's impossible to guarantee it after ulti like you can guarantee bfb with shalks unless you are using it against a very low skilled player, since anyone who is average or above will always dodge it, which makes merciless weakest "special" skill among all classes since literally every other skill is delayed

Also counterplay is block

I’m going to disagree on that one. Just because something exists in the game doesn’t mean that it’s a cornerstone or even the intended result. If you want an example of that just look at subclassing; the Devs admitted as such and hence that’s why they’re doing the class refreshes. There have been arguably many unintended results in ESO combat over the years.

If you read the progressive statements from the Devs on the philosophy of ESO combat it becomes clear that the intent isn’t to give anyone “guarantees” on combos; rather, there’s supposed to be a skill check involved. Do recurring combos happen? Yes, but to go so far as to say that it’s a designed cornerstone is a stretch.

There are a number of combos out there that have a high liklihood of landing a consistent combination; I don’t agree with them all nor do I believe they’re all intended. One example is Temps Toppling Charge providing a pre-stun lock on cast. This gives casters insane combo potential but I don’t think the mechanics are intended, moreover a bug, but that doesn’t stop players from leaning on it. In fact, I see SO many people landing Toppling + Merciless in PvP regularly, they don’t seem to be having a problem.

Players like to use easy combos, that’s nothing new. There’s nothing out there, from the Devs, that’s says the design intent of the game is that players should have some guarantee to pair Incap + Merciless.

Block is a counter for many things but block isn’t the end-all-say-all counterplay component to combat. Block has become so over utilized and over leaned on and it’s clear that a lot of players seemingly have blinders on when they say that, presuming that everyone is a Stam main and thinks that combat revolves around near-perma-blocking and that just isn’t true.

Mobility, resistance, dodge, set procs, etc are all counterplay components to combat and, IMO, we shouldn’t be prioritizing the block mechanic over all other forms of counterplay.

We don’t see droves of players on these forums complaining about Merciless being useless, in fact, we see a lot of the opposite and a lot of experienced players will tell you the skill is effective and hard hitting.

Just because a skill doesn’t function precisely the way you want to use it doesn’t mean it’s broken. The tradeoff for the high scaling of Merciless are its underlying mechanics, which, are still incredibly gracious! If you think Merciless has a problem with the fast execution time it has then take a look at Bound Armaments, a full charge 4 stack takes 1.3 seconds to fully execute its function! That’s insanely longer than Merciless and it doesn’t scale to as high of damage. Two mechanically similar skills but one clearly out performs the other.

Factually, in the scope of mechanics across the board players are getting kills in PvP with Merciless daily so it can’t be so underperforming otherwise nobody would use it.

acanca wrote: »

Static Reverberation

This passive was a huge problem for pvp week 1. It was in a fine state after getting adjusted to 0.5 seconds. Its now back to being too powerful with 0.3 seconds cool down and being buffed to base 5% proc rate.

Part of the problem comes from sorc being too good at being able to proc it. 5% proc base doesnt sound like much but consider that a regular status effect build can deal up to 10 instances of seperate damage per second. For example

1-Vateshran destro proc
2-Burning status effect from vateshran
3-Light attack
4-Concussion from thread of war
5-Crushing shock (frost)
6-Crushing shock (fire)
7-Crushing shock (shock)
8-Chill from crushing shock
9-Burning from crushing shock
10- Concussion from crushing shock
11-Hurricane

10+ instances of seperate damage in a single second with a 5% base proc chance at full hp, skyrocketing to a certainty at lower health thresholds. This isnt just limited to this specific scenario either, bound armamant is 4 instance of seperate damage by itself and is by itself a burst damage and the burst damage having near certainty to proc additional damage turns it from a burst to an easy execute. In fact it turns basically everything in sorcs arsenal to an execute extremely easily.

Malevolent Promise was excluded from pvp for being too war crimey, well, this passive is the actual war crime. Please consider adding a once per second clause to it with battle spirit active. Proccing an extra instance of damage every second easily makes it one of the best pure class passives in the game, simply makes it less toxic by preventing it from being oppressive in pvp.

I have to disagree here.

You’re right about being able to stack stand effects but re-read your own post. Out of the 10 sources of status application only one comes from Sorc … just one.

Nothing else on that list is Sorc Specific which means that being a Sorc doesn’t make those skills any more effective. It’s not as though Sorcs can synergize those status effects better than any other class because any and every other class can slot 9 out of those 10 abilities, it’s just that Sorcs have the passive.

To be honest the main status I see Sorcs using here is Overcharge rather than any of the elementals and that’s really leaning a bit on LA & scribing, also outside of the class skill set.

Running a status effect build can hit hard in PvP but it leaves the build open to quite a lot because in order to maximize it requires specific supporting gear and attention to their mitigation. A status-effect Sorc vs a subclassed crit meta build, for example, is going to have a run for their money because they’re going to have to keep up shields & heal in a rotation versus just spamming LA + skill weaves.

Sorcs are not in a good place. I don’t know who thinks that but this observation really is evidence of that if Sorcs are leaning on status effect output rather than their own class skills.

These passives need to hit hard and the buff makes sense, it provides for a viable means to be competitive in the scope of subclasses builds until the Sorc refresh, which is the whole point. Static at 0.3 & 5% is where it needs to be.

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

acanca wrote: »

Static Reverberation

This passive was a huge problem for pvp week 1. It was in a fine state after getting adjusted to 0.5 seconds. Its now back to being too powerful with 0.3 seconds cool down and being buffed to base 5% proc rate.

Part of the problem comes from sorc being too good at being able to proc it. 5% proc base doesnt sound like much but consider that a regular status effect build can deal up to 10 instances of seperate damage per second. For example

1-Vateshran destro proc
2-Burning status effect from vateshran
3-Light attack
4-Concussion from thread of war
5-Crushing shock (frost)
6-Crushing shock (fire)
7-Crushing shock (shock)
8-Chill from crushing shock
9-Burning from crushing shock
10- Concussion from crushing shock
11-Hurricane

10+ instances of seperate damage in a single second with a 5% base proc chance at full hp, skyrocketing to a certainty at lower health thresholds. This isnt just limited to this specific scenario either, bound armamant is 4 instance of seperate damage by itself and is by itself a burst damage and the burst damage having near certainty to proc additional damage turns it from a burst to an easy execute. In fact it turns basically everything in sorcs arsenal to an execute extremely easily.

Malevolent Promise was excluded from pvp for being too war crimey, well, this passive is the actual war crime. Please consider adding a once per second clause to it with battle spirit active. Proccing an extra instance of damage every second easily makes it one of the best pure class passives in the game, simply makes it less toxic by preventing it from being oppressive in pvp.

TBH, this is more of a condemnation of how status effects and ticky-tack micro ticks of damage have gotten out of control in recent updates than it says anything about Sorc itself. The only actual Sorc skill even in here is Hurricane.

Would much prefer that the Vate Crutch Staff, Ele Sus, and Force Pulse get nerfed before anything else happens. Why do we have things like Rapid Strikes having nerfed status effect chance per tick while Force Pulse skates with the full Single Target Direct Damage multiplier? Seems like nerfing that down to Single Target DOT levels would be a nice place to start balancing. Then we can remove the free cast status of Ele Sus and perhaps delete the auto status effect proc as well.

Perhaps it might be best, given that class masteries are about buffing the class itself, that class masteries should only work on class skills themselves?

It would compartmentalize them to a degree that it would allow balancing adjustments looking at a subset of skills, rather than all other world/guild/scribing/set/weapons skills in tandem.

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

acanca wrote: »

Static Reverberation

This passive was a huge problem for pvp week 1. It was in a fine state after getting adjusted to 0.5 seconds. Its now back to being too powerful with 0.3 seconds cool down and being buffed to base 5% proc rate.

Part of the problem comes from sorc being too good at being able to proc it. 5% proc base doesnt sound like much but consider that a regular status effect build can deal up to 10 instances of seperate damage per second. For example

1-Vateshran destro proc
2-Burning status effect from vateshran
3-Light attack
4-Concussion from thread of war
5-Crushing shock (frost)
6-Crushing shock (fire)
7-Crushing shock (shock)
8-Chill from crushing shock
9-Burning from crushing shock
10- Concussion from crushing shock
11-Hurricane

10+ instances of seperate damage in a single second with a 5% base proc chance at full hp, skyrocketing to a certainty at lower health thresholds. This isnt just limited to this specific scenario either, bound armamant is 4 instance of seperate damage by itself and is by itself a burst damage and the burst damage having near certainty to proc additional damage turns it from a burst to an easy execute. In fact it turns basically everything in sorcs arsenal to an execute extremely easily.

Malevolent Promise was excluded from pvp for being too war crimey, well, this passive is the actual war crime. Please consider adding a once per second clause to it with battle spirit active. Proccing an extra instance of damage every second easily makes it one of the best pure class passives in the game, simply makes it less toxic by preventing it from being oppressive in pvp.

TBH, this is more of a condemnation of how status effects and ticky-tack micro ticks of damage have gotten out of control in recent updates than it says anything about Sorc itself. The only actual Sorc skill even in here is Hurricane.

Would much prefer that the Vate Crutch Staff, Ele Sus, and Force Pulse get nerfed before anything else happens. Why do we have things like Rapid Strikes having nerfed status effect chance per tick while Force Pulse skates with the full Single Target Direct Damage multiplier? Seems like nerfing that down to Single Target DOT levels would be a nice place to start balancing. Then we can remove the free cast status of Ele Sus and perhaps delete the auto status effect proc as well.

Perhaps it might be best, given that class masteries are about buffing the class itself, that class masteries should only work on class skills themselves?

It would compartmentalize them to a degree that it would allow balancing adjustments looking at a subset of skills, rather than all other world/guild/scribing/set/weapons skills in tandem.

I don't like that idea. We need more incentives to run non class skills imho not less.

acanca wrote: »

NxJoeyD wrote: »

acanca wrote: »

Static Reverberation

This passive was a huge problem for pvp week 1. It was in a fine state after getting adjusted to 0.5 seconds. Its now back to being too powerful with 0.3 seconds cool down and being buffed to base 5% proc rate.

Part of the problem comes from sorc being too good at being able to proc it. 5% proc base doesnt sound like much but consider that a regular status effect build can deal up to 10 instances of seperate damage per second. For example

1-Vateshran destro proc
2-Burning status effect from vateshran
3-Light attack
4-Concussion from thread of war
5-Crushing shock (frost)
6-Crushing shock (fire)
7-Crushing shock (shock)
8-Chill from crushing shock
9-Burning from crushing shock
10- Concussion from crushing shock
11-Hurricane

10+ instances of seperate damage in a single second with a 5% base proc chance at full hp, skyrocketing to a certainty at lower health thresholds. This isnt just limited to this specific scenario either, bound armamant is 4 instance of seperate damage by itself and is by itself a burst damage and the burst damage having near certainty to proc additional damage turns it from a burst to an easy execute. In fact it turns basically everything in sorcs arsenal to an execute extremely easily.

Malevolent Promise was excluded from pvp for being too war crimey, well, this passive is the actual war crime. Please consider adding a once per second clause to it with battle spirit active. Proccing an extra instance of damage every second easily makes it one of the best pure class passives in the game, simply makes it less toxic by preventing it from being oppressive in pvp.

I have to disagree here.

You’re right about being able to stack stand effects but re-read your own post. Out of the 10 sources of status application only one comes from Sorc … just one.

Nothing else on that list is Sorc Specific which means that being a Sorc doesn’t make those skills any more effective. It’s not as though Sorcs can synergize those status effects better than any other class because any and every other class can slot 9 out of those 10 abilities, it’s just that Sorcs have the passive.

To be honest the main status I see Sorcs using here is Overcharge rather than any of the elementals and that’s really leaning a bit on LA & scribing, also outside of the class skill set.

Running a status effect build can hit hard in PvP but it leaves the build open to quite a lot because in order to maximize it requires specific supporting gear and attention to their mitigation. A status-effect Sorc vs a subclassed crit meta build, for example, is going to have a run for their money because they’re going to have to keep up shields & heal in a rotation versus just spamming LA + skill weaves.

Sorcs are not in a good place. I don’t know who thinks that but this observation really is evidence of that if Sorcs are leaning on status effect output rather than their own class skills.

These passives need to hit hard and the buff makes sense, it provides for a viable means to be competitive in the scope of subclasses builds until the Sorc refresh, which is the whole point. Static at 0.3 & 5% is where it needs to be.

What does the source of the skill have to do with anything? Are you guys just trying to be funny?

Because your argument is that Sorcs are somehow better able to make use of applying status effects.

That, factually, isn’t true because 90% of the sources of applying those status effects are available to every player, they’re not Sorc specific.

This means that, no, Sorcs do not have some extra benefit when it comes to applying status effects, anyone can use Crushing Shock, anyone can run Vateshran, anyone can light attack with a Destro staff, etc.

If Sorcs had clad specific skills that were better able to apply status effects then, yes, you’d be right; Sorcs would have an easier time than other classes but that isn’t the case.

I don’t think it’s right to ask for a passive to be nerfed simply because it synergizes with world skills; especially when the class skills for the class in question are so poor.

Using status effects as a main source of damage in PvP is both interesting and risky; and really only works if the player is running the Signet mythic, which, anyone else can slot too. This leaves a build like that open to quite a lot in PvP despite having some descent damage potential but is far from OP.