ESO Event Design, Rewarding Players or Burning Them Out?

Furyous · November 11

I’ve been grinding this event from day one on two accounts and twelve toons.
That means every single day I’m averaging:
- 3 gold boxes per account → 6 total
- 6 blue boxes per toon → 72 total across 12 toons
- Daily average = 78 boxes

Since phase two started on October 28, that’s 15 days of grinding.
Which adds up to:

- 90 gold boxes
- 1,080 blue boxes
- 1,170 boxes total

And after all that effort, I’ve only gotten 23 Writhing Bones out of the 25 required.
At this point, I’m so sick of the event, and the game, that I’m ready to quit both.

Now compare that to the average player who only runs one toon.
They would typically earn:

- 3 gold boxes per day
- 6 blue boxes per day
- 9 boxes total per day

Over the same 15 days, that’s just 135 boxes.
That’s only about 11.5% of what I’ve earned with two accounts and 12 toons.
To match my 1,170 boxes, they’d have to grind nonstop for 130 days straight.
And the event doesn’t even last that long.

For clarity: the true maximum per toon is 3 gold boxes and 21 blue boxes per day for the first toon, and 24 blue boxes per day for each additional toon.
But most players, myself included, average closer to 6 blue boxes per toon daily.
That’s the baseline I’ve been using in these calculations.

And here’s what completely astonishes me: the average player who participates faithfully for weeks still isn’t rewarded because of the abysmal drop rate.
Who thinks this is a good idea?
How does it make sense to punish the majority of players who actually show up and put in the time?

If I wanted more tedious, repetitive stress in my life, I’d just work more. At least I get paid for that.
The game is supposed to be my escape from the drudgery of real life, a bit of fun and excitement.
This event, and by extension the game itself, is the furthest thing from that possible.

The fact that I’m paying you money to subject me to this grind is something I will no longer tolerate.
This isn’t a challenge.
It’s BS.

So here’s my vote: this event is not worth it.
The design punishes average players and burns out the dedicated ones.
If the goal was to frustrate the community, mission accomplished.

lei.aili_ESO · November 11

I hate it, but I’ll keep playing the rest of the game

If the drop rate on the style pages, furnishing plans, and bone shards wasn't so abysmal, it wouldn't be so bad. But it does feel like very little reward for the effort. There's no reason for the drop rates on these things to be so low. It's discouraging to open a bunch of boxes and get nothing new, just three more Haj Mota fragments to destroy or maybe try to sell for 50 gold because those are worthless at this point, and maybe a Stirk Fellowship page but it'll be one of the ones you already got six times and not the one that you need. Why aren't those curated? You can do that with armor, but not style pages?

Not to mention the weird drop rates on the quest items themselves. Sometimes I'll do a siege camp and not get a single vitrified soul even though I was there killing mobs from the start, then I'll do go and another one and there are lootable enemies with vitrified souls before I even get there, ones that I haven't even damaged (and no I'm not in a group when this happens). It's so inconsistent. I kill two zombies and get all the undead essence or whatever it is, but then I gotta kill 35 wolves before I get one mangy pelt?

This event was WAAAAAAAAAY overhyped. This is easily the most boring one they have ever done, and I've been playing since beta. Even doing the same repetitive New Life quests every year feels more fun, because at least those quests are unique and interesting and not just "collect [x] of [whatever thing]."

So we've got boring and grindy quests, lackluster rewards with low drop rates, and an event dragging on for FAR longer than it should (this should have been a few weeks max, not a couple months). So yeah, it feels more like a chore than a game at this point. And I've got enough chores in my real life.

Katahdin · November 11

It’s just a grind, some folks don’t mind the hamster wheel

Ive been farming it in 3 accounts.

I finally had enough the other day when I went to a camp, was the first one there, ran around like mad to hit things at every reaper and didnt get one freaking soul to drop. I abandoned the quest and moved my character back to Rimmen.

Ive farmed the motif x3, sold a ton, got 75+ haj mota pieces, about 40 of the caltrops pieces and most of the crafting recipes, all of the wormwrithe armor pieces x 3 and a few of the wormwrithe weapon pages, I bought the things I didnt have (Wormwirthe weapons and a couple crafting recipes). Got the coldharbor house on the one account that didnt have it which I am grateful for.

I just cant keep grinding these quests for another 2 weeks to get to 100%. I also have a lot of other things to do with my time both in game and real life that need my attention

CalamityCat · November 11

I hate it, but I’ll keep playing the rest of the game

When I'm playing a game, the whole point is to have fun. Also to get some cool and interesting stuff along the way. The minute it gets grindy or feels like a job, I play something else. Which is why I don't bother with ESO dailies or many events now. Other more entertaining games/activities exist

The thing with ESO events is that they tend to be a bit repetitive and grindy and the rewards aren't desirable enough to spend hours a day obtaining them. When I was new to events there was a novelty of collecting things, but now I tend to make a minimal effort to get event tickets or the few things I want, then I'll log out.

I genuinely gave the writhing wall quests a chance, thinking I'd get some experience on my untrained templar as I did the quests. But it was immediately boring and repetitive. The golden pursuit reward pets just aren't ones I'd want to collect and I haven't seen other rewards that I've really wanted. So I just abandoned the wall stuff entirely as it was just miserable repeatedly doing the same things!

metheglyn · November 11

I don't hate it. I'm just not participating in it any more. If I'm in game, I'm doing something else.

AzuraFan · November 11

None of the above. For me, there is no grind. I do what I need to do to get 3 gold boxes/day and that's it.

(I think the RNG in this game is brutal and burns people out.)

Destai · November 11

I hate it, but I’ll keep playing the rest of the game

I'm burnt out on them and do not participate at this point.

Many of the returning events - like Halloween's - I've done all of the activities and there's no real incentive to do it again. For a lot of these events, I only enjoy the broader bonuses like double XP or drops. There's been a few events with attractive styles. But more often than not, I'll just go buy those from a trader if the event seems like too much trouble.

AcadianPaladin · November 11

It’s kind of fun, at least it breaks up the routine

Like any event, I take this one on my terms – which revolve around having fun. There are extremely few rewards that I don’t have but want, so I don’t play for rewards. I enjoy the current event to the point of defending a couple camps a day, as well as doing one quest for the crafting and supply NPCs at the camp. I also simply keep a vitrified souls quest active all the time – turning it in whenever it reaches 15 since I gather those all over the game in the normal course of play. No grinding, simply a few quests that remain enjoyable when done in moderation.

Additionally, because this is a community event and my elf is a good citizen of Tamriel, I'm happy to do my part to move the bar along.

Hapexamendios · 12:00AM

Different for me. I'm not burnt out nor am I grinding. Some days I get the box. Some I don't. The rewards for doing the events are lackluster and not really worth pursuing imo. A lot of the quests are also pretty boring. The exceptions recently have been the Hollowjack fight and camp defenses. Those at least were kind of fun to do for a bit.

Carcamongus · 12:28AM

I hate it, but I’ll keep playing the rest of the game

RNGeesus on phase 2 furnishing plans and caltrop parts is brutal, yet another instance in this game of depending on the almighty's graces. It's getting annoying. Having this Wall event concurrent with the Witches Festival even spoiled the latter for me. I'm not about to quit the game, but I must admit my enjoyment of it has been decreasing for a while. I wouldn't mind the grind so much if I could trust my efforts are actually making a (tiny) difference, but with these manipulated numbers, I'm not sure. Previous community events, such as the one that awarded us the Grand Psijic Villa or the "kill dragons save kitties", had more trustworthy percentages, even if we knew it was highly unlikely the community would fail them. Those didn't needlessly divide us by server either.

Be that as it may, I'm still doing about the same amount of event quests as when I still believed my efforts mattered. I'm just annoyed some of the stuff I want drops from the NPC that's driving me nuts with his repetitive dialogue about keeping my wits and how the steaks got high. And I have to keep poking him until he gives me the quests I want.

valenwood_vegan · 12:43AM

I hate it, this grind makes me want to uninstall

I've admittedly been less happy with eso in general for the last couple years, but the wall event was like someone smacking me in the face with a dose of reality. What am I even doing? I've essentially stopped playing now except for endeavors and just logging into talk to / do something with friends, and I'm not sure how much longer I'll continue, unless next year is somehow better.

spartaxoxo · 12:52AM

It’s just a grind, some folks don’t mind the hamster wheel

I think the rewards drop rate for the shards and weapons are too low but I'm kind of glad they aren't worthless from dropping too much like the pet and motifs. There's gotta be some kind of middle ground there.

Either way, I'm happily not grinding everything. I'll just buy what I don't get. I have done the event here and there. Sometimes I'll just get gold boxes. Sometimes I'll do them all for server completion help. And sometimes I don't do it at all or play other games.

I know there's people who like this sort of thing but they seem rare. Either way, it's not my cuppa.

whitecrow · 12:55AM

I hate it, but I’ll keep playing the rest of the game

So burned out. I did a couple quests for the Wall thing and that was enough for me. I only participated in WitchFest for the Hollowjack achievement and to get tickets for house parts.

ESO_player123 · 1:09AM

I do not really care about this event. I did not expect it to be spectacular in the first place, but I have to admit that even with my low expectations it overstayed its welcome. Hate is a too strong word for describing my feeling towards it (apathy is more like it), so I do not really see a suitable option in the poll for me.

I do my 3 gold boxes + 3 new crafting dailies on several alts (hoping for furnishing plans). It does not take a lot of time and I cycle through my toons anyway for ToT games. I have to agree with the players saying that the drop rate for shards and plans is simply awful.

And I'm one of those slackers on PCNA

Rohamad_Ali · 1:13AM

I hate it, this grind makes me want to uninstall

I wish there were new types of rewards. I'm so tired of more sets all the time. I would be more happy with a painting of a fish over another full set of fat belly. A temporary fun trap to set in a friends house or even a song to learn on the lute over anymore of the same old same old.

Vonnegut2506 · 2:54AM

I hate it, but I’ll keep playing the rest of the game

None of the options really fit, but this is probably the closest. Although, it should be "I hate it, so I play another game" rather than this event.

BretonMage · 3:30AM

I don't grind for non-existent rewards, I just disengage and play less.

These kinds of absolutely minuscule chances for desired loot leave a really bad taste in my mouth. It reminds me of my experience with the West Weald treasure maps, and I'm still floored that someone at ZOS would think this an acceptable way to treat their customers. Additionally, I find myself engaging a lot less when there's practically no chance for the reward, so I don't know what they hope to achieve with this new direction of theirs.

Kappachi · 3:39AM

It’s kind of fun, at least it breaks up the routine

it's fine. also, you know those other goods you got, such as plans, recipes, etc? Sell to other players for gold and BUY the shards. Having shards be so rare is a good point of the event, makes it worth grinding to sell and earn gold.

SilverBride · 3:44AM

I hate it, but I’ll keep playing the rest of the game

I hate it and stopped participating.

SummersetCitizen · 4:32AM

Event design, much like new content more broadly, has become stale and lazy.

Davvy123 · 4:52AM

I hate it, but I’ll keep playing the rest of the game

I started on the Writhing Wall event part 1 and stuck with it for a few days.

Then I saw how the drop rates were so terrible and stopped working at it.

I haven't participated ever since, just log in, do a few crafting writs on several of my toons (I have 8 at level cap, so I can collect 5.1K gold each) - but I don't do all of them either, as that's another grind, and I don't care for them at all.

The rest of the time, I do zone/story quests. The game still has a ton that I haven't completed, so that's good.

Maybe once I've finished them all, then it'll be time to think about taking a break from the game.

Insofar as this game pass and first event, it's all been rather underwhelming.

Nemesis7884 · 5:14AM

It’s just a grind, some folks don’t mind the hamster wheel

its boring tbh...normal events arent that bad because the grind is limited...this event supercharges the grind that why it feels so mind numbingly boring...

THE ONLY events i like are whitestrake mayhem cause its the only time i do pvp, lots of people and the servers dont catch fire and the other one is the new life festival...not that it is not extremely boring, its just that i am than in the holiday spirit which enhances everything and in the past it was also the time to look forward to the January reveal....

karthrag_inak · 5:32AM

I hate it, but I’ll keep playing the rest of the game

khajiit has said it before. the issue is the crappy loot. this grinding would have been a lot more enjoyable if a tiny bit of creativity and effort had been invested in the loot schedule for this event. as it is, the "rewards " have been embarrassingly shameful.

all khajiit can say now is he better get access to the content he paid for soon or that will be the last expansion/dlc he purchases.

code65536 · 5:36AM

The question that must be asked is, if you know that the blue boxes are worthless, why do you keep grinding for them?

You know how many blue boxes I get on a typical day? Zero. Not even the crafting ones. Just three gold boxes a day (which takes only 5-10 minutes), and I'm done with the event for the day and move on to do the things that I actually want to do instead of slaving away at the event.

And the reward from just doing 3 golds a day is pretty good--about half of what someone who grinds hundreds of blues would get. Half the rewards for a tiny, tiny fraction of the time and effort.

That's the thing that I don't understand about this event: it should've been clear to everyone that blue boxes aren't worth the time and effort it takes to get them. So why do so many people still go for them? Why burn yourself out? Why treat this game like a job? Just don't.

aetherix8 · 6:11AM

It’s kind of fun, at least it breaks up the routine

Personally, I find this event as grindy as any other, just lasting much longer (too long for what it is imho).
I’m doing all daily quests on my main only, and fat and sap drops real nice in phase 2, so it’s pretty straightforward. I’m at 22 shards and very far from a burn out.
Also, I think that this grind can be immersive to a degree; one can imagine that preparing for a big offensive takes time and effort, amassing resources, stocking on gear, fighting enemy forces, etc. It kind of makes sense.

code65536 wrote: »

That's the thing that I don't understand about this event: it should've been clear to everyone that blue boxes aren't worth the time and effort it takes to get them. So why do so many people still go for them? Why burn yourself out? Why treat this game like a job? Just don't.

Shards drop from blue boxes too, so they are worth farming. But I also can’t understand why people burn themselves out like it is some kind of a job.

code65536 · 8:16AM

aetherix8 wrote: »

Shards drop from blue boxes too, so they are worth farming.

I mean, everything can drop form blue. But at a rate that is so much lower than gold. And since it takes the same amount of time to get a blue as it does to get a gold, it means that the reward-for-time drops off a cliff with blues.

There was another thread, where I said that it was worth rerolling your first crafting quest to make sure that you get a profession from which you were still missing stuff. And someone in that thread said that you can get the plans from blues and that in fact, almost all of her plans came from blues.

But there was a catch: she was farming those blues on every character, so we're talking about over a hundred blues per day, whereas I was just getting my one gold. And yes, she's completed all the plans faster than me that way, but I've made good progress with just the gold boxes, and with how much longer the event has to go, I've no doubt that it will be completed before the end.

I'm not saying that blues are of zero value. But I'm saying that the value-to-time-spent ratio falls off a huge cliff with blues. And, most importantly, if you are patient, you will probably get everything from just golds. Sure, it'll take more time, but in case people haven't noticed, this is a long event. It's a marathon, not a sprint: pace yourself.

What I don't get are the people who choose to farm these low-value blues and then complain about the burn out, such as the OP of this thread. Just choose to get only golds. You'll still complete everything before the event ends, except this way, you're not driving yourself mad in the process.

frogthroat · 8:23AM

Microsoft recently did a lot of house cleaning. Many game studios, including ZOS, lost many workers. With this new, smaller crew, and new people working on the project they still need to provide content to justify selling the next yearly update and keep the current subscriptions. Repeatable quests (ie. grinding) is a very cost effective way to provide hours and hours of playtime -- as long as the players are willing to grind.

Don't hate the player game, hate the game parent company.

Tavore1138 · 8:52AM

I hate it, this grind makes me want to uninstall

i returned after a couple of years break to see what subclassing was like and slipped easily back into old routines, levelled an arcanist to try the class, rebuilt the habit of logging in to do craft writs on most characters and so on.

after a couple of months this thing comes up and i dived into it but after a couple of weeks i can't do it, i can't even face logging into my craft characters... logically i should be able to ignore this dreadful bland event and continue as normal but somehow it's leeched the life out of the whole game for me.

and did not one person at ZOS central consider that if you make people work to access something for weeks on end the thing on the other side of that wall has to be beyond epic, the prize needs to be truly legendary like nothing you've ever seen before to justify so much repetitive grind by so many people - and bear in mind these are the people who were keen enough to buy the content.... how will they live up to the expectations they build? well, obviously they won't, they can't, nobody could.

so you offer weeks of grind and inevitably disappointing results at the end - the absolute opposite of what you want to achieve... I can't help wondering if AI was involved in this design because it doesn't seem targeted at the human brain.

to be more succinct - grrr...

LunaFlora · 9:10AM

It’s great—give me more of this type of event

quoting myself from another thread
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/684945/writhing-wall-event-what-do-you-like-about-it

LunaFlora wrote: »

i like that i have extra stuff to do.

i like that the phases of the Writhing Wall event have little differences like the defense towers growing. Writhing Fortress from phase 3 seems awesome too, but i wish it stayed after the event.

i like the rewards, the furniture especially.

i do not grind the events and with how long the event is, the drop rates of rewards seem good.

i hope in the future we get similar events, but not the same.
ideally to me,
an event to break a border between 2 parts of a zone would end when that second part releases. For the Writhing Wall that would be today, but it will likely end in a few days so not super different.

Estin · 9:49AM

The only good events are ones that increase player engagement in otherwise dead areas of the game, like undaunted or whitestrake's. Every other event is usually a grind fest with very low drop rates for the main item. I get that an event and its awards shouldn't be knocked out in 2 hours, but seeing how some players can go 5+ hours a day grinding for an event reward and not even obtain it is absurd. That's what it was like with the anniversary event items when they first dropped. I did geysers some 40 times a day every day, and only got the staff drop when there were only 2 days left. I haven't even touched this event because I knew it would be a waste of my time when looking at the event design philosophy in recent years.

Mathius_Mordred · 10:29AM

It’s just a grind, some folks don’t mind the hamster wheel

I really don't see what the problem is. The fact that the rewards are so utterly abysmal is a good thing; it means that at most, you just get the three gold boxes a day, then ignore them and go do something else. Why would anyone farm purple boxes at this event, knowing the chances of getting anything great are incredibly low?

You chose to farm this even on two accounts for utterly pathetic rewards rather than go do something else, and it has affected you adversely; well, whose fault is that?

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