even though i hope this update becomes enjoyable for most it still bothers me that if a game becomes unsutainable in its current form for whatever reason ,why developers cant just say thats the case and make some reasonable to understand changes even if not liked ones. rather than cut the heart out of thier own game piece by piece. and also how its even possible to think telling others that eso will be removing the long standing class system during the 10 year anniversary celebration was ever going to be the right time for it

Heronisan wrote: »

I remember reading a theory someone had that zos struggle to add more classes/skill lines and stuff like that because they have reached the memory capacity on older gen consoles.
They had very good evidence of features getting trimmed down to make room for new stuff, like AWA, increase dot durstions and more, everytime they did something like this, they added something new like necro or arca to the game. I dont know if its true or if that is how programming works but interesting take xD

This subclassing feels like a work around for this problem, no more room to add new skill lines or classes. Maybe even not room to separate PvP and PvE balance, or nerf skills only if subclassed.
These are all rational changes you would think ZOS would adopt instead of this dumpster fire we have now, but for some reason its not happening.

Interesting theory. Are there any facts speaking in favor of this theory, is there any trustful source for this? We hear a lot of lamento based on unsupported assumed facts from people with just a negative attitude. You see in many aspects of live that people are against any changes. So it would be good to have some robust facts in order not to spread speculations which are based on nothing. I mean most of the players I speak to are quite happy to have increased possibilities with sub-classing.

this i just a big ask of developers to ask some long standing players to 'rough it out' like they been here 'roughing it out' for years only for the reason they started playing eso to be totally removed in the end

sans-culottes wrote: »

Maggusemm wrote: »

Heronisan wrote: »

I remember reading a theory someone had that zos struggle to add more classes/skill lines and stuff like that because they have reached the memory capacity on older gen consoles.
They had very good evidence of features getting trimmed down to make room for new stuff, like AWA, increase dot durstions and more, everytime they did something like this, they added something new like necro or arca to the game. I dont know if its true or if that is how programming works but interesting take xD

This subclassing feels like a work around for this problem, no more room to add new skill lines or classes. Maybe even not room to separate PvP and PvE balance, or nerf skills only if subclassed.
These are all rational changes you would think ZOS would adopt instead of this dumpster fire we have now, but for some reason its not happening.

Interesting theory. Are there any facts speaking in favor of this theory, is there any trustful source for this? We hear a lot of lamento based on unsupported assumed facts from people with just a negative attitude. You see in many aspects of live that people are against any changes. So it would be good to have some robust facts in order not to spread speculations which are based on nothing. I mean most of the players I speak to are quite happy to have increased possibilities with sub-classing.

Interesting choice of words—lamento—which I take to mean “lament” in this context. A little dramatic, perhaps, but it does point to something: there’s a pattern of dismissing criticism not based on its content but on how it feels. Players who raise concerns about subclassing or performance aren’t necessarily “negative” or “against any change.” Many are raising concrete, experience-based feedback—about system degradation, loss of class identity, or the long-term consequences of design direction.

Framing this as mere emotional resistance to novelty flattens the discussion and conveniently avoids having to engage with actual points. You mention wanting “robust facts.” Fine. But asking the community for peer-reviewed evidence about internal dev memory budgets while ignoring the avalanche of player-experience data seems a little selective?

Maybe the lamento, such as it is, reflects frustration not with change, but with the way change has been implemented: hastily, unevenly, and with little transparency.

I agree with this 100%. ZOS seems to dismiss any feedback that is not a basic bug report or numbers-based. Being a very numbers-driven person myself, a natural sceptic, always looking for evidence and data... I can't believe I am the person pointing this out: People play games based on the vibes. Whether they are FUN. How they FEEL when they play those games. Feedback about whether players LIKE a change, how they FEEL about it should be prioritized. As much as I like evidence and numbers, even I know it's not always about the numbers. Sometimes it's more about how something makes people feel.

Prime example: The pillagers/pearls change on PTS. Yes, I get the reason for the change, but there needs to be some other solution. This will make healers FEEL completely useless and unwanted. Even in content where they are needed for straight heals, their roles will now be extremely boring. I feel for my healer main friends and I think a lot of them will just stop playing ESO if this goes through as is. No one seems to have given any thought to that before making this change. It's important to understand what is fun to players, why they keep playing your game. (And, conversely, what things make them stop playing the game.)