What's the point in ESO+ now?

ddtemplar · April 13

Cooperharley wrote: »

ESO+ = previous DLC, dungeons, infinite craft bag, crowns monthly

Don't know about adding much to the future though. Not really as good of a deal anymore. I definitely think they should've discussed how ESO+ would be bolstered in this transition.

I personally couldn't care less about housing - I'm excited for the furnishing vault for those of y'all that enjoy it, but it doesn't increase the value for me whatsoever.

Maybe wouldn't be as bad if you could purchase the content pass with crowns, but you have to buy that with new money.

Though I think I saw Fallen Banners as purchasable with crowns -- but you can't just buy the new story content at its own price.

thedocbwarren · April 13

Wonder if the content pass is yearly and never to be obtained after? Or is that more FOMO stuff? In the past chapters rolled up, so would a 2026 content pass roll up 2025? Or would you have to buy two passes? But then the FAQ says they don't know what 2026 looks like.

Lugaldu · April 13

jle30303 wrote: »

There are people who have deliberately NOT purchased ESO+ because they do not want the DLC dungeons to be available for RND, because they do not like doing DLC dungeons.

In the past, people have been able to buy the actual Content (e.g. Greymoor and Markarth) WITHOUT having to buy the Dungeons permanently (e.g. Stonethorn and Harrowstorm).

This appears to be no longer possible: if you want to get the new Content areas, you HAVE to buy the Season Pass, which means buying the Dungeons.

I honestly don't understand the problem with people getting DLC dungeons bundled into a package that they don't actually need to use. I've had ESO Plus for years for the crafting bag and have never used the DLC dungeons because I'm not interested in DLC dungeons. So, for years, I've been paying for something I don't use. But it's the same with every chapter, because I'm not interested in everything there either (i.e., dungeons, trials, tales of tribute, anything PvP-related).
You'll always pay for things you don't use in such games (except you like really every aspect of the game).
And then someone argued that "if you have the DLC dungeons, you'll also be included in the DLC dungeons in the random group finder," and that some people don't want that. I understand that even less, because if you're already doing dungeons via the group finder, why not also do new DLC dungeons?

Ph1p · April 13

Lugaldu wrote: »

jle30303 wrote: »

There are people who have deliberately NOT purchased ESO+ because they do not want the DLC dungeons to be available for RND, because they do not like doing DLC dungeons.

In the past, people have been able to buy the actual Content (e.g. Greymoor and Markarth) WITHOUT having to buy the Dungeons permanently (e.g. Stonethorn and Harrowstorm).

This appears to be no longer possible: if you want to get the new Content areas, you HAVE to buy the Season Pass, which means buying the Dungeons.

I honestly don't understand the problem with people getting DLC dungeons bundled into a package that they don't actually need to use. I've had ESO Plus for years for the crafting bag and have never used the DLC dungeons because I'm not interested in DLC dungeons. So, for years, I've been paying for something I don't use. But it's the same with every chapter, because I'm not interested in everything there either (i.e., dungeons, trials, tales of tribute, anything PvP-related).
You'll always pay for things you don't use in such games (except you like really every aspect of the game).
And then someone argued that "if you have the DLC dungeons, you'll also be included in the DLC dungeons in the random group finder," and that some people don't want that. I understand that even less, because if you're already doing dungeons via the group finder, why not also do new DLC dungeons?

You're misunderstanding the premise of both situations: In the first case, people who actually want the new dungeons have an issue with the pricing of the new content pass. Depending on your country, it's perhaps 25-33% more expensive than new chapters used to be, partially because the 2025 pass now also includes 2 dungeon DLCs. But as a subscriber you already get access to those anyway, so people are rightfully annoyed that they seem to be paying for it twice.

In the second case, non-subscribers who want to play the new zones but don't like DLC dungeons now automatically get 4 of those with the content pass. These players still do RND queues for the XP, transmutes, or the quest, but prefer to only have base game dungeons in that queue, because those are shorter and easier. In the past, they had a choice, now they don't.

lillybit · April 13

licenturion wrote: »

sans-culottes wrote: »

Instead of streamlining access and reinforcing ESO+ as the central premium offering, ZOS seems to be fragmenting the model and eroding player trust in the process. This shift could have been an opportunity to add value and reward loyalty. Instead, it feels like an unforced error that may drive people away rather than draw them back in.

Seeing all this, plus the metrics they have Fallen Banners had on subscriptions, it is clear a lot of people still like buying stuff. That is probably why they are doubling down on it by mentioning it a few times and including the ownership of the dungeons in the year pass, because a giant portion of the player base always bought them already in the past.

Companies always take decisions on data, and the new model is also built around this. If you don't find value in ESO+ anymore, just cancel. If enough people do that, they will include more perks or lower the price. But if people just keep paying, that means the product is still valuable to them. The people they lose over the dungeons could be offset by the housing fans who will subscribe for the furniture vault.

I disagree.

I think the point of this is people, especially subscribers, don't buy dungeons. If enough people were buying them anyway there would be no need to suddenly start forcing the sale of them. If enough people were buying them anyway, the content pass would be an optional way of getting all of the content at a discounted price, instead of charging a premium for it and gating content behind it.

They've seen a way to produce less content and charge more for it by bundling it with the stuff that doesn't sell.

Edited because it messed up the quote!

Ishtarknows · April 13

lillybit wrote: »

They've seen a way to produce less content and charge more for it by bundling it with the stuff that doesn't sell.

Exactly!

Lugaldu · April 13

Ph1p wrote: »

Lugaldu wrote: »

jle30303 wrote: »

There are people who have deliberately NOT purchased ESO+ because they do not want the DLC dungeons to be available for RND, because they do not like doing DLC dungeons.

In the past, people have been able to buy the actual Content (e.g. Greymoor and Markarth) WITHOUT having to buy the Dungeons permanently (e.g. Stonethorn and Harrowstorm).

This appears to be no longer possible: if you want to get the new Content areas, you HAVE to buy the Season Pass, which means buying the Dungeons.

I honestly don't understand the problem with people getting DLC dungeons bundled into a package that they don't actually need to use. I've had ESO Plus for years for the crafting bag and have never used the DLC dungeons because I'm not interested in DLC dungeons. So, for years, I've been paying for something I don't use. But it's the same with every chapter, because I'm not interested in everything there either (i.e., dungeons, trials, tales of tribute, anything PvP-related).
You'll always pay for things you don't use in such games (except you like really every aspect of the game).
And then someone argued that "if you have the DLC dungeons, you'll also be included in the DLC dungeons in the random group finder," and that some people don't want that. I understand that even less, because if you're already doing dungeons via the group finder, why not also do new DLC dungeons?

You're misunderstanding the premise of both situations: In the first case, people who actually want the new dungeons have an issue with the pricing of the new content pass. Depending on your country, it's perhaps 25-33% more expensive than new chapters used to be, partially because the 2025 pass now also includes 2 dungeon DLCs. But as a subscriber you already get access to those anyway, so people are rightfully annoyed that they seem to be paying for it twice.

Okay, I had to look at the billing history to see what the chapters previously cost in the basic and deluxe versions to see the problem, thanks for pointing this out. Now the basic upgrade is €49, which is €10 more expensive. That's unfortunate, but on the other hand, everything is more expensive in 2025, so it doesn't surprise me if game prices are rising too (I don't like it either, but it's no surprise).

Ph1p · April 13

Lugaldu wrote: »

Ph1p wrote: »

Lugaldu wrote: »

jle30303 wrote: »

There are people who have deliberately NOT purchased ESO+ because they do not want the DLC dungeons to be available for RND, because they do not like doing DLC dungeons.

In the past, people have been able to buy the actual Content (e.g. Greymoor and Markarth) WITHOUT having to buy the Dungeons permanently (e.g. Stonethorn and Harrowstorm).

This appears to be no longer possible: if you want to get the new Content areas, you HAVE to buy the Season Pass, which means buying the Dungeons.

I honestly don't understand the problem with people getting DLC dungeons bundled into a package that they don't actually need to use. I've had ESO Plus for years for the crafting bag and have never used the DLC dungeons because I'm not interested in DLC dungeons. So, for years, I've been paying for something I don't use. But it's the same with every chapter, because I'm not interested in everything there either (i.e., dungeons, trials, tales of tribute, anything PvP-related).
You'll always pay for things you don't use in such games (except you like really every aspect of the game).
And then someone argued that "if you have the DLC dungeons, you'll also be included in the DLC dungeons in the random group finder," and that some people don't want that. I understand that even less, because if you're already doing dungeons via the group finder, why not also do new DLC dungeons?

You're misunderstanding the premise of both situations: In the first case, people who actually want the new dungeons have an issue with the pricing of the new content pass. Depending on your country, it's perhaps 25-33% more expensive than new chapters used to be, partially because the 2025 pass now also includes 2 dungeon DLCs. But as a subscriber you already get access to those anyway, so people are rightfully annoyed that they seem to be paying for it twice.

Okay, I had to look at the billing history to see what the chapters previously cost in the basic and deluxe versions to see the problem, thanks for pointing this out. Now the basic upgrade is €49, which is €10 more expensive. That's unfortunate, but on the other hand, everything is more expensive in 2025, so it doesn't surprise me if game prices are rising too (I don't like it either, but it's no surprise).

I think ZOS would be catching a lot less flak if they had just slightly increased the price of the pass compared to previous chapters, say from €40 to €45. That's still a substantial increase of 12.5%, but players wouldn't have much of a counterargument, given the obvious inflation all around us. Instead, they chose a new model where some players would inevitably feel short-changed. Just like when they locked the Fallen Banners dungeon DLC behind ESO+ for a month...

WhiteScythe · April 16

I just did Lep Seclusa I think that's how you spell it.. on normal mode.

Holy mother of WHAT.

Why are dungeon difficulties so mismatched?

Also ESO+ getting rolled, nice.

ddtemplar · April 16

My login store pop up now is advertising the content pass as a "chapter upgrade"

Thorncrypt · April 16

I wonder what % of the total playerbase actually do dungeons and trials to begin with.

ImmortalCX · April 16

Ph1p wrote: »

Lugaldu wrote: »

jle30303 wrote: »

There are people who have deliberately NOT purchased ESO+ because they do not want the DLC dungeons to be available for RND, because they do not like doing DLC dungeons.

In the past, people have been able to buy the actual Content (e.g. Greymoor and Markarth) WITHOUT having to buy the Dungeons permanently (e.g. Stonethorn and Harrowstorm).

This appears to be no longer possible: if you want to get the new Content areas, you HAVE to buy the Season Pass, which means buying the Dungeons.

I honestly don't understand the problem with people getting DLC dungeons bundled into a package that they don't actually need to use. I've had ESO Plus for years for the crafting bag and have never used the DLC dungeons because I'm not interested in DLC dungeons. So, for years, I've been paying for something I don't use. But it's the same with every chapter, because I'm not interested in everything there either (i.e., dungeons, trials, tales of tribute, anything PvP-related).
You'll always pay for things you don't use in such games (except you like really every aspect of the game).
And then someone argued that "if you have the DLC dungeons, you'll also be included in the DLC dungeons in the random group finder," and that some people don't want that. I understand that even less, because if you're already doing dungeons via the group finder, why not also do new DLC dungeons?

You're misunderstanding the premise of both situations: In the first case, people who actually want the new dungeons have an issue with the pricing of the new content pass. Depending on your country, it's perhaps 25-33% more expensive than new chapters used to be, partially because the 2025 pass now also includes 2 dungeon DLCs. But as a subscriber you already get access to those anyway, so people are rightfully annoyed that they seem to be paying for it twice.

In the second case, non-subscribers who want to play the new zones but don't like DLC dungeons now automatically get 4 of those with the content pass. These players still do RND queues for the XP, transmutes, or the quest, but prefer to only have base game dungeons in that queue, because those are shorter and easier. In the past, they had a choice, now they don't.

It is so Byzantine.

I think we should all just buy it to stop our brains from hurting.

WhiteScythe · April 16

ddtemplar wrote: »

My login store pop up now is advertising the content pass as a "chapter upgrade"

HAHA really? I haven't even looked in the store since.

Amottica · April 16

ESO+ seems to be the rental of bank space and the crafting back. Access to the new dungeons to be added seems to be the only new content that will be part of ESO+.

It seems they are forcing players to pay more to access any zone content. At least the chapter zone was added to ESO+ a year later.

This is based on specific statements @ZOS_Kevin made in his Q&A thread.

Below is the thread I am referring to. Towards the end the question asks if the content that requires the season pass will be available via ESO+. The only content he lists that will be available via ESO+ are the two dungeon packs. ☹️

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/675896/eso-2025-content-pass-faq

WhiteScythe · April 16

Amottica wrote: »

ESO+ seems to be the rental of bank space and the crafting back. Access to the new dungeons to be added seems to be the only new content that will be part of ESO+.

It seems they are forcing players to pay more to access any zone content. At least the chapter zone was added to ESO+ a year later.

This is based on specific statements @ZOS_Kevin made in his Q&A thread.

Below is the thread I am referring to. Towards the end the question asks if the content that requires the season pass will be available via ESO+. The only content he lists that will be available via ESO+ are the two dungeon packs. ☹️

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/675896/eso-2025-content-pass-faq

It's predatory.

I did Lep Seclusa the new dungeon yesterday and my GOD I hated it. I hated every second of it. This was on NORMAL so I can't imagine what it's like on Vet.

MedicInTheWild · April 16

Personally I think ESO+ is a waste, Crafting bag only is helpful for newer player or those that flip goods all the time. Most seasoned players buy enough during free weeks to fill bags until the next free week which is what I feel will happen with the furnishing vault. If it was cheaper I think more would invest but I think Subclassing is going to cause alot of chaos which may bring new players in but more players overall will leave. I have played several hours and have not enjoyed the ease of solo builds being overpowered... which means small mans and ballgroups/uncoordinated zergs will just run around wiping everyone to the floor in pvp, not sure how unbalanced pve will be but sure another 10% increase in DPS is obtainable.

They need to slow down and do what they said they were focusing on this year and FIX THE PERFORMANCE OF THE GAME FIRST otherwise the last 6 years of promising that will inevitably be the death of a game that many fell in love with years ago that went the wrong direction....... Im not saying subclassing is not a viable thing just not being rolled out correctly to make me not want to invest in the game anymore.

Simply enough, either reduce cost of bag or bring in better rewards/deals/free stuff, all the miniature statues just fill space give us something notable, sad when the login rewards are 100K gold and sometimes crates and those that pay get a painting/statue and a small discount on crown items which are overpriced as is. $75 usd+ for a in game house is crazy...

Elsonso · April 17

Thorncrypt wrote: »

I wonder what % of the total playerbase actually do dungeons and trials to begin with.

That's a pretty broad set of criteria. I think it is easy to say dungeons more than trials. Normal a lot more than veteran. None of it as much as people probably think.

Given the past complaints about DLC dungeons coming up in the random rotation due to ESO Plus, I actually wonder how many people subscribe to ESO Plus with the intention of getting the included DLC dungeons. I wonder how many people would take an ESO Plus Lite that did not include the DLC dungeons.

lillybit · April 17

.

Elsonso wrote: »

Thorncrypt wrote: »

I wonder what % of the total playerbase actually do dungeons and trials to begin with.

That's a pretty broad set of criteria. I think it is easy to say dungeons more than trials. Normal a lot more than veteran. None of it as much as people probably think.

Given the past complaints about DLC dungeons coming up in the random rotation due to ESO Plus, I actually wonder how many people subscribe to ESO Plus with the intention of getting the included DLC dungeons. I wonder how many people would take an ESO Plus Lite that did not include the DLC dungeons.

I'd literally jump on a lite version - if it was half the price, I'd save £60 a year and 2 dungeon packs and a zone cost half of that if I felt like buying them. Of course with the new Content pack model, it's a no-brainer.

They could even lose the added crowns from it too and it'd still be a better deal. Imo the amount they include is just designed to make us buy more anyway.

Of course this is ZoS so that's not what would happen. They'd go the Disney+ route of doubling the price and making the lite one what we pay now.

lillybit · April 17

I guess enough people have unsubbed to worry them, it's half price for the next few days. That is, if you're not on Playstation

freespirit · April 17

lillybit wrote: »

I guess enough people have unsubbed to worry them, it's half price for the next few days. That is, if you're not on Playstation

Not for current subscribers on PC unless you are playing via Steam...

I am not using Steam so although I have subbed since launch I cannot add a discounted month to my sub.

This has really annoyed me wth???

Now this is disrespectful!!! What on earth is going on @ZOS_Kevin ??

ESO_player123 · April 17

freespirit wrote: »

lillybit wrote: »

I guess enough people have unsubbed to worry them, it's half price for the next few days. That is, if you're not on Playstation

Not for current subscribers on PC unless you are playing via Steam...

I am not using Steam so although I have subbed since launch I cannot add a discounted month to my sub.

This has really annoyed me wth???

Now this is disrespectful!!! What on earth is going on @ZOS_Kevin ??

I do not think you can do it on Steam either if you have a current subscription. I have, and when I clicked on the discounted month it says "Plus membership is already in your Steam library". Of course I could try cancelling the recurring one, buying the discounted one, and then enabling again. But that is too much hassle for me.

Elsonso · April 17

ESO_player123 wrote: »

freespirit wrote: »

lillybit wrote: »

I guess enough people have unsubbed to worry them, it's half price for the next few days. That is, if you're not on Playstation

Not for current subscribers on PC unless you are playing via Steam...

I am not using Steam so although I have subbed since launch I cannot add a discounted month to my sub.

This has really annoyed me wth???

Now this is disrespectful!!! What on earth is going on @ZOS_Kevin ??

I do not think you can do it on Steam either if you have a current subscription. I have, and when I clicked on the discounted month it says "Plus membership is already in your Steam library". Of course I could try cancelling the recurring one, buying the discounted one, and then enabling again. But that is too much hassle for me.

According to the ESO website, Steam players can purchase ESO Plus if they already have ESO Plus.
I think they should have extended this to everyone, though.

ESO_player123 · April 17

Elsonso wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

freespirit wrote: »

lillybit wrote: »

I guess enough people have unsubbed to worry them, it's half price for the next few days. That is, if you're not on Playstation

Not for current subscribers on PC unless you are playing via Steam...

I am not using Steam so although I have subbed since launch I cannot add a discounted month to my sub.

This has really annoyed me wth???

Now this is disrespectful!!! What on earth is going on @ZOS_Kevin ??

I do not think you can do it on Steam either if you have a current subscription. I have, and when I clicked on the discounted month it says "Plus membership is already in your Steam library". Of course I could try cancelling the recurring one, buying the discounted one, and then enabling again. But that is too much hassle for me.

According to the ESO website, Steam players can purchase ESO Plus if they already have ESO Plus.
I think they should have extended this to everyone, though.

Yes, I just read that too. But I do not see a way to actually do it. As I said, when I click on that on Steam I'm told that I already have Plus in my library. So, is there a way for Steam players with active plus to get that offer?

NVM. Regardless of the message, if you scroll down and click to reveal a drop down menu you can choose option "7.99 and 14.99 after that". Personally, I'm not going to bother since I have recurring 3 months one and turning that back and forth is not worth it for me.

WhiteScythe · April 17

OOF announced a discount on ESO+ well done ZOS.

Way to be even MORE predatory.

Absolutely disgusting.

peacenote · April 18

SilverBride wrote: »

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

ZOS makes what, 17 million a month on ESO. None of us have their numbers, but I am betting most of the money is made from the crown store.

If ESO+ disappeared tomorrow they would still make enough to keep the lights on, and continue development for the game.

I disagree. I can count on one hand how many times I've purchased anything from the Crown Store, but I have been subscribed for years. I'm sure there must be others like me. Losing all our subs would drop their revenue.

I'm like you! I always subscribe to one MMO. When I switch to another one, I stop paying for my current one. I have been with ESO since the beginning, subscribed the whole time. I like the perks and I like supporting my current MMO with a sub.

For me, I wish ESO+ included everything, even if the price was raised. I would like to subscribe, and that's it. Not also trying to figure out when and what edition to buy of other stuff. I have found this whole thread really confusing. I want immediate access to all new non cosmetic content due to my sub... new stories, new zones, dungeons, trials, new classes... whatever, and to never lose access to any content as long as I'm subbed. Just my opinion. I'm not clear on whether this "season pass" is better or worse than what we had before.

exiars10 · April 18

Elsonso wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

freespirit wrote: »

lillybit wrote: »

I guess enough people have unsubbed to worry them, it's half price for the next few days. That is, if you're not on Playstation

Not for current subscribers on PC unless you are playing via Steam...

I am not using Steam so although I have subbed since launch I cannot add a discounted month to my sub.

This has really annoyed me wth???

Now this is disrespectful!!! What on earth is going on @ZOS_Kevin ??

I do not think you can do it on Steam either if you have a current subscription. I have, and when I clicked on the discounted month it says "Plus membership is already in your Steam library". Of course I could try cancelling the recurring one, buying the discounted one, and then enabling again. But that is too much hassle for me.

According to the ESO website, Steam players can purchase ESO Plus if they already have ESO Plus.
I think they should have extended this to everyone, though.

Nobody can buy it on Steam regardless of your status (never subscribed, subsribed in the past, current subscriber).
We have a long thread:
https://steamcommunity.com/app/306130/eventcomments/599650146629765915

And some users are fully charged because they didn't read when they subscribed.

MiathTheRed · April 18

I canceled mine due to other concerns but I don't really see a point in resubbing in the future with the constant redefining of what's included or excluded. Neither I nor anyone else should have to buy a game three times.

Tandor · April 18

Elsonso wrote: »

Thorncrypt wrote: »

I wonder what % of the total playerbase actually do dungeons and trials to begin with.

That's a pretty broad set of criteria. I think it is easy to say dungeons more than trials. Normal a lot more than veteran. None of it as much as people probably think.

Given the past complaints about DLC dungeons coming up in the random rotation due to ESO Plus, I actually wonder how many people subscribe to ESO Plus with the intention of getting the included DLC dungeons. I wonder how many people would take an ESO Plus Lite that did not include the DLC dungeons.

There was certainly a time when I'd have jumped at that, but since my young grandson has been joining me for a session or two each week that has changed in that as a duo we only do dungeons and world bosses - "Anything else is too easy, Grandad"

!

I think in most MMORPGs it's generally accepted that about 10% of the playerbase run trials, but rather more than that run dungeons whether solo, duo, or in groups. I suspect most of those are running normal mode dungeons.

Twohothardware · April 18

I honestly think they should shut down the ESO+ subscription and just have the new Season Pass and the Crown Store.

Elder Scrolls Online isn't even free to play and yet they're charging customers monthly, yearly, and then regularly in the Crown Store for content which is over the top for the number of players still playing the game.

Make the ESO+ bonuses like the craft bag, double bank space and furniture space for sale in the Crown Store but not giftable.

You instantly improve the quality of life in the game for everyone and have more people that are happy with buying the Season Pass and not feeling jaded over the value of ESO+.

LadyLethalla · April 18

I'm more concerned that the "upgrade" version price of the *Season Pass" is $85 AUD whereas the "upgrade" version of the new Chapters was $50 AUD. That's one hell of a price hike for not terribly much. I'm starting to consider perhaps not getting the "upgrade".