Why ESO is failing. (and I'm NOT happy about it :( )

tyranade · May 2014

babylon wrote: »

I just want the containers back with tons of cool stuff in them, hope of endgame pve that doesn't force grouping or grinding, and the bots to go. Then player housing and Thieves Guild and Dark Brotherhood. Oh and would be nice to reduce that gear decay crap as well.

This. I've lost much of my interest due to the diminishing returns when looting containers, wardrobes, desks etc. I loved crafting in this game and this have completely ruined it for me. Most of the containers are greyed out and empty. I'm seriously considering to unsubscribe from this game.

Hermies · May 2014

My first MMO was Asherons Call, if you died your body stayed and had depending on level x amount of money and items which could include that sword you spent 3 months trying to get. I played AC for 5 years and only left because it became a bot fest, with bots for buffing and bots for selling. Housing when it was introduced in AC was great, you had storage depending on the type of house you bought and your guild could buy a guild home and storage to match for guild use and guild master use. PVP was handled by an open pvp world so every one could attack anyone no safe zones and was that excitement. Otherwise on the PVE world you could go to an Alter and change to PVP and then only other PVPers could engae and you could have PVPers and PVEers in the same area with no hassles. Open world as you could go anywhere you wanted at any level, whether you lived for very long was a different story but that was your choice. I once went through a new area and was half way into it before I ran close enough to a creature and suddenly the whole area lit up with creatures well above my ability to kill and lost 3 of my best items and a lot of money and plats and a few other items. My friends in the game had a great laugh. Asherons Call is still going and if Asherons Call 2 would have been a more advanced version of AC1 then I would still be there, instead AC2 was WoW a moronified version that any simpleton could play. All MMo's these days are aimed at the simpletons as the majority don't want to use their brains to play a game. No game where you need to use a brain gains enough of a following to get of the ground. Imagine a game where you had to experiment to make a spell and you could blow yourself up or those near you (AC) Imagine tinkering an item and over doing it and it's destroyed after taking 3 months or so to get all the items to make it and then tinker it. As said previously the majority don't want consequences to your actions that can cost you time or effort unless it's under 30 minutes. In AC you could as previously mentioned gimp your char by choosing incorrect skills and it wasn't a matter of just going to an alter and spend a few gold and bingo alls well.
My friends and I plus quite a lot of others I have spoken to as well as quite a few in these forums would play these types of games it's just there aren't enough of us to warrant a Games company to make it.
I still have fond memories of AC but try as we might you just can't play a game with Doom style graphics no matter how good it was. So the only choice is play WoW or ESO and with that choice the way WoW has gone from Vanilla WoW which I played and enjoyed to the offering it's become the choice is simple so ESO will be my home for the next couple of years at least and bring on some really good changes more towards the old style of game play I hope and please not towards WoW. Cheers

and stop whining, play or don't play ;P

Wolfshead · May 2014

Woooow just woooow i love the fact that people still think the should 100% work game right way from day 1 when the buy the new mmo game serious a mmo game is only game that is actually evolve over time and will get add new thing over course of time and we the community have chance to help Zennimax to make this game even better then it is today.

The day people will understand that maybe the should not have so high hope at start of new MMO game then will stop go to forum scream and say after 1 month this game is doom i mean come on if you really think like why the hell did you even buy to start with and OP say ESO is lose people for not login anymore will here is little new flash for you WildStar have 10 day open beta now and also people that is play ESO so much old age group which mean the many do have life outside this game which mean the play when the have time for it and also many player only play 1st free 30 day and the push to hit end game or play so much so when this 30 day is over the stop and go back to old game again.

pronkg · May 2014

jaygraeb14a_ESO wrote: »

As stated in the title, this game is failing.

Now before you attack me, rant, or fanboi it up; hear me out. This is NOT something I want to happen nor something i'm happy about. But let me ask you this...Out of the 5 guilds you've joined..have you noticed a decrease in sign-ins and population online???

Thats a fact. The guilds (even Auction style) are becoming fewer and fewer online. I've played MMORPG's before the "internet", back when we used telephone wires connected to BBS. (yes look that up!)

I've played just about EVERY, and I mean EVERY MMO since Ultima Online made its huge push into the market as the sole MMO existing at the time commercially, and Oh how times have changed...

A small break down of what has happened in the MMO market.

1. Risk vs Reward = This WAS/IS huge, unfortunately this no longer applies. You can go out, die over and over, nothing happens. NOTHING. No loss, no shame, you really just dont care- nor should you. Vacuum your house, eat a bowl of cereal; mash that keyboard with your toes for all you care. Cuz your gonna get XP and WIN somehow.

2. Simplification = Yup, Remember when you could play games and completely make a massive mistake to your build??? Your character was GIMP and everyone knew it. Want to somehow fix it??? Well now you are looking at HOURS/DAYS to somehow find a magic stone...or some massive quest that allows you to FIX what you did wrong.

3. Pointless Opportunity = Hows that FPS shooter out there doing for ya??? You enjoying the hamster wheel of EVERYTHING EVERYDAY being the same??? You take a keep for what? To steal some scroll/item that gives you perks you barely notice nor care about? Whats that, you dont care about dying? (look at point 1)

4. Graphics/Hollywood= Yup! Its now more important to hire top tier artists, 3d designers, Media and advertising OVER gameplay. Its no different than dating some woman whos a perfect 10 in looks; But thats all she's got. Yea your happy for awhile until you realize there is NOTHING else there.

5. Non-sandbox = Gamers used to MAKE their adventures. Now its "scripted" questing, hand-tied governed GM/Designer control. Its not about YOU/US; its about THEM! Cant you feel this when you play??? Listen to how game companies talk to us. "Yea we realized its too hard for you to figure out YOUR character so were gonna dumb stuff down even further. Whats that??? You wanted us to leave the characters alone and let you design and do things yourself? No no...you are just too STUPID to know what you want. Let us do it for you."

6. Community= There is no community. Its now about ME ME ME. You wonder why dungeons just are'nt that fun? Or questing is more "work" than "enjoyment"?
Its because 99% of the player(s) are ONLY looking out for themselves. Item just dropped they needed. Why finish, EXIT/QUIT out with your item, why finish the dungeon. Oh someone is better at tanking than you but you wanted to do it?? Well cry some more and just "quit/exit" out.

Folks: 15 years ago games were FAR different than they are now. And unfortunately ESO has NOT paid attention. Yes they WILL make their money back; and honestly thats what they care about. After all they are a business. But it was'nt always like this.

*******************************************************************************
Alright then Wrain, so tell us what you think needs to happen to turn this around?

Simple: STRAY from WoW and every other game thats been pushed out for the past 8 years.

1. Give us a REASON to PvP. Give us XP out there, were SICK of questing!!! Give us DUNGEONS that we fight over that drop EXCLUSIVE items! How about some form of PvP points that give us SKILLS to BUY! (DAOC anyone???)

2. Fix your mob placement. I have NEVER seen so few of mobs spread out as in this game. (- Shadowbane) You push pvp but again...there's NO POINT!!! Give us camps of mobs to fight over out there that actually DROP items!!! Right now its just one big FPS of boredom.

3. Four classes really??? Yes the game IS new but you have GOT to add skills to fight for, earn, or give us some type of unique feeling. Both of my friends have already quit this game after realizing just how basic their toons are. Even at 50, its just the same thing!!!

4. Make a decision. Dont 1/2 way your game. Either focus on the PvP end or focus on the PVE. You cannot expect this game to make it if you dont pick a path. If you are gonna go PVE then dont bait pvper's into wasting their time always "hoping" for some fix. If you are gonna go PvP then SEPERATE the 2. DAOC did a GREAT job at doing this. They kept PVE SEPERATE from the designated PVP areas and BOTH sides were happy!!! Do NOT do what WOW, RIFT, AION and the rest of these games are doing. IT DOES"NT WORK!!! And before you spout Wow works...Remember ONE thing. WoW had NO competition. EQ2 dropped the ball (NO PVP). (Not to mention WoW had a huge following from Blizzard. And I will state Blizzard was and IS not the company they are today)

5. LISTEN TO YOUR CUSTOMERS!!! People who take the time to jump on test servers are usually people who are really really trying to better something. Far to often i've seen in forums children just screaming about something being "too hard" or "unfair" and eventually you cave to them. Something EARNED is far far more addictive/contagious than something GIVEN.

I did'nt mean to ramble, but in all honesty this game was the final nail in the coffin for my friends and I. We are no longer playing but wish well to those who enjoy it. I just wish a company would take a RISK rather than trying to follow the same old routine. GW2 was before this..and now ESO. Look at both games...see a similiar pattern???

Thanks,
Wrain

I totally agree, though on the other side I'm really enjoying the game despite all of these points.

I've been playing video games a long time. But also haven't played about 4 years before starting eso. Maybe I'm not used to modern games. But this game exceeded my expectations by far. I really thought it would be far worse

Btw the attitude of some type of players is more a global IRL thing that's happening. I don't expect Zenimax being able to educate people

cdepulse · May 2014

I also just cancelled my Subscription with a free day to spare before being charged. Really want to see this game do well and was looking forward to it.
The Vet Exp is frustrating. It felt like i was punishing myself by just logging in and grinding the endless boring quests and finding NPC's Pigs and Flowers and the occasional bottle of Wine for a measly 3K out out 1.2 Million Vet points required to level...YAWN. PVP is beyond broken and in complete dis-repair with no real Vet Exp. Really sad.
First impressions last and many that un-subscribe or quit (similar to Guild wars 2 and Diablo 3) dont return.

Jade1986 · May 2014

randomriffyrocksprerb18_ESO wrote: »

For those who think, just wait a while, its only been a couple of months, its gonna improve.

Well of course it can improve and it will improve but only to the extent of the foundations it has placed. The foundations so far is average. It could've taken a better route with a bunch of illusion, alteration,destruction etc spells, stealth trees, with a bunch of morphs for each spell and no classes at all, no softlocks, high end graphics

I vote for a revamp or ESO2

I honestly think they should go the path the FF14 did, completely roll back the game , give people that have subs credit so they can use their subs when the game comes back out, and redesign the game. As it is right now, it is in a poor state, too many glithces, too many thngs are unbalanced, too mans bots, too many gold sellers, no proper EU servers, no PVE end game for people that don't wanna grind their teeth to powder, etc etc etc.

Zarec · May 2014

World of Warcraft set the standard for MMORPG's these days. In every forum for every MMO it is inevitable for someone to compare that game to world of warcraft. And they are right to do so. If that game does not bring to the table what world of warcraft offers at minimum, then the game is really not worth playing as we can get a better experience playing an 8 year old game. New MMO's need to exceed what World of Warcraft offers. It's plain and simple. Many of us if not most have played WoW throughout the years (I played for 6 and left after cata) so we know what to expect from a game based on those standards. When we come to a game that doesn't even reach those as I feel this game hasn't, it feels like an utter waste of time and money.

This game doesn't push players to group outside of dungeons (heaven forbid you do a quest one stage ahead of someone or you won't be able to group with them). It doesn't push for community cooperation via crafting outside of 5 guilds (their answer to that is have guilds bid on a kiosk? no thanks I would rather just make crap myself rather then buy overpriced junk so they can try and recoup their losses of bidding on the kiosk). This game doesn't have staple ES things like Dark Brotherhood, Player housing (huge part of ES titles...loved spending hours decorating my various homes). Community creation projects through mods was a huge staple of ES content and we don't have that outside of needed mods for the travesty that is the UI. Exploration is minimal outside of your dominion and very linear. It's just plain boring. I had more fun playing vindictus than this game (and vindictus is a freaking korean made grind fest if you were able to log in). This game doesn't really feel like a game, it feels like a chore as there are really no surprises (besides the bots being able to fly....that was a surprise, thought i was playing aion for a sec but never saw them fly there....GO ASMO'S!!!) No matter what you do, the NPC's don't react negatively to you even at stage 4 vamp (when you had to use a charm spell to get vendors to actually sell to you or rest at an inn).

Overall....this felt like an expensive mistake after a night of binge drinking rather than a content excited feeling as you open presents on christmas morning. Would I refer this game to other players..no and I have actually told many people to avoid this game for the time being till it is actually finished unless you want to pay not only to buy the game but to sub to a game that is still in beta if not alpha (broken abilities should never make it to live no matter what, no one likes playing a completely gimped character or where you have to sacrifice your first born to try and get your abilities to work).

Bromburak · May 2014

Zarec wrote: »

World of Warcraft set the standard for MMORPG's these days.

No, its a bliz standard but the industry has a bit more to offer especially when it comes to creativity.

In every forum for every MMO it is inevitable for someone to compare that game to world of warcraft. And they are right to do so.

If that game does not bring to the table what world of warcraft offers at minimum, then the game is really not worth playing as we can get a better experience playing an 8 year old game.

That might counts for a WoW fan, nothing more.
Very easy, just wait for the next bliz title if you like blizzards style.

New MMO's need to exceed what World of Warcraft offers.

Hilarious World of Warcraft did not exceed what was offered long before WoW.

It's plain and simple. Many of us if not most have played WoW throughout the years (I played for 6 and left after cata) so we know what to expect from a game based on those standards.

It's plain and simple thats what you can expect from WoW but not from other games.

Alexandrious · May 2014

Wolfshead wrote: »

Woooow just woooow i love the fact that people still think the should 100% work game right way from day 1 when the buy the new mmo game serious a mmo game is only game that is actually evolve over time and will get add new thing over course of time and we the community have chance to help Zennimax to make this game even better then it is today.

The day people will understand that maybe the should not have so high hope at start of new MMO game then will stop go to forum scream and say after 1 month this game is doom i mean come on if you really think like why the hell did you even buy to start with and OP say ESO is lose people for not login anymore will here is little new flash for you WildStar have 10 day open beta now and also people that is play ESO so much old age group which mean the many do have life outside this game which mean the play when the have time for it and also many player only play 1st free 30 day and the push to hit end game or play so much so when this 30 day is over the stop and go back to old game again.

Wildstar had only about 2 more years of Dev time, and its out almost polished and very much complete with all the endgame and pvp you could want.

Please dont raise the *** about how a mmo shouldn't have to be at least near 100 percent when launched. They rushed it out, cuz of wildstar and other mmos coming, they rushed it out, so we the paying PC players, can beta test it and find all the serious quest related bugs and balancing issues before they put it on the new next gen consoles, which is where they are banking alot of their profits on. I played the game from lv 1 to Vr5 currently at the 10th Zone area of questing, doing all the quests, explored all the places, something very few people bother to do cuz most of them get fed up eventually and just dungeon grind to VR10 so they can go PVP. From everything I saw, the game is hardly out of Alpha, bad imbalances everywhere, half of the templar and nightblade skills broken, alot of skills unbalanced as all hell.

I kept count and listed over 61 buggy quests, that required restarts, reload UIs, even logging off for 15 mins to restart the damn special instances some of them are in. My partner fell thru the world a total of 17 times in 15 different places. Thanks to that she gets a big durability decrease, which pisses her off cuz now she has to pay ass loads of money to repair, or just make something, enchant it with a trash glyph she got and wear it. If she didnt had the golden saint costume she would go crazy. I have seen 7 different areas with missing textures, and 10 areas with missing textures that appeared pink with the comical "Missing" word spelled out on it. The massive durability loss, again is a joke, they are fixing it in craglorn at least, along with alot of things, but too little too friggen late, alot of people got disgusted with the game and left for Wildstar or FFXIV or even *Shudders* Archeage.

PVE in this game was barely enjoyable because of all the bugs we ran into. Yes I enjoy the dialogue, the voice acting, the quests all seemingly a bit unique from each other, my girl found the thing with the Lizards sniffing out the bad musk to find the guy responsible was cute. Ok, quests were done, imo, well, cept the ones that were bugged to hell.

Dont get me started on PVP either, my, god.....the horrors in it.

The age of "This mmo is new, dont expect it to be coming out even close to 80 percent or so polished" is over, Wildstar and FFXIV 2.0 proved this, and you know why? Cuz their developers didn't release it, until it was READY, maybe zenimax owed alot of money, maybe they needed to get it out now to make the money back, honestly, ***. They shoulda kept this game in for another year in development and beta testing, releasing it with Craglorn, something else after that, all the PVP options, and everything checked and balanced and bug tested, but they didn't.

Now thanks to this, I wasted 100 dollars, I love elderscrolls, I really, really do, I played all 5 of em, but at least the Molag bal statue is cool, they didnt *** that up. So have fun with your broken game, now im gonna get dragged into wildstar by my girl, ugh. -_-

Dodece · May 2014

@‌ Wolfshead

While I certainly appreciate the point that you are attempting to make. You need to acknowledge the realities of this games design. This game is less a genuine attempt at crafting a virtual world. Then it is an attempt to replicate the drop in experience on a grander scale. As such players aren't limited to just one frame of reference.

In other words there is a valid point of view. That this game should be measured against titles like Borderlands, Dead Island, and I shudder to say Fable. Being fair they too had their own issues. Players routinely hacked them, used exploits, cheated their fellow players, and they did have some serious bugs. However as a group they launched virtually complete. Yes there were some patches needed to resolve some problems, but there weren't a lot of game breaking issues.

I think the reality is somewhere in the middle myself. I think most would agree that we could fairly describe this title as a lite for its supposed genre, and thus has less of a justification for the apparent issues. There really should have been much less to go wrong since they basically kept it simple. People expect to see problems with grand endeavors.

For instance if a game has hundreds of dungeons, dozens of classes, and has a mountain of potential quests. The law of averages says some of them are going to be broken. That is not an accurate portrayal of this game. This game is very conservative. We probably don't even have a hundred dungeons, and most of them are copy pasted. We only have four classes. Six if you include the wolves, and bloodsuckers. Finally most of the quests are just standard filler.

The genre itself just isn't a blanket immunity to criticism. If I build a computer, and you build a space shuttle. I have far less of a justification for problems then you do. I can't just say well they are both machines. So since yours will explode every hundredth time you start it up. Then it is perfectly reasonable to expect that mine will burn someones house down every few months.

Consequentially speaking we should expect parallels between endeavor and outcome. If something is comparatively simple. It shouldn't have anywhere near the same failure rate as something comparatively complex. Now if you want to compare this game to a comparable product. Then you may have something of a argument.

However last year I played a roughly similar game in Defiance, and while that game had its own issues. It had fewer issues, and it was attempting something far grander then this game. While also being free to play. People really do have a point with their complaints. If this game were trying to be something terribly spectacular. You might have a valid point, but this game isn't trying to push any envelopes, and it isn't overly aggressive in its design.

bggoetzb16_ESO · June 2014

This game will be F2P by the end of this year. They messed pretty much everything you dont want to mess up.

1. bugs (terrible)
2. class balance (absolutely horrific)
3. end game content (trials? really thats it?)
4. grouping (non existant)
5. ui is trash (awful)
6. itemization (it is awful in this game)

Sorry folks not resubbing. This game is far from finished. Zenimax is one of the worst dev's I have ever seen.

NadiusMaximus · May 2015

Lol year latter and still rings true.
Pretty sad that, we'll, we have been strung along with promises of fixes and content, and all in all the more thing have changed, the more they have remained the same.