Rageypoo wrote: »

Just curious why there isn't an ability to inspect gear and skills like you can in games like WoW, would being able to inspect a player be something that ESO players would be interested in?

Not interested thank you. I didn't like that feature in WoW anyways.

BlueRaven wrote: »

Galiferno wrote: »

You can with the built-in encounter log command and using the ESO Logs website. We use it on trials to look at players' gear/skills/casts to see if they're playing optimally in vet content and what we can do to help them improve. Without this feature, we would have no idea how to help players get better in content where it matters.

I also use it in random vets to inspect what pugs are using. If I'm doing 70% of the dps in a vet dlc dungeon and you ask for gear at the end, you better believe I logged, checked your setup, and decided I won't give you anything because you didn't have the decency to make sure you were geared and ready for the content and relied on pugs to carry you. No free carries, no free gear.

What??!!

They are trying to get better with armor sets and you deny them. That is the exact opposite way you should behave.

"...you didn't have the decency to make sure you were geared..." How should they get geared then?

This right here is the best argument on why gear inspection should not exist.

So basically "You can't get vet gear unless you already have vet gear....which means no one can get vet gear. Logic"

Wolf_Eye wrote: »

BlueRaven wrote: »

Galiferno wrote: »

You can with the built-in encounter log command and using the ESO Logs website. We use it on trials to look at players' gear/skills/casts to see if they're playing optimally in vet content and what we can do to help them improve. Without this feature, we would have no idea how to help players get better in content where it matters.

I also use it in random vets to inspect what pugs are using. If I'm doing 70% of the dps in a vet dlc dungeon and you ask for gear at the end, you better believe I logged, checked your setup, and decided I won't give you anything because you didn't have the decency to make sure you were geared and ready for the content and relied on pugs to carry you. No free carries, no free gear.

What??!!

They are trying to get better with armor sets and you deny them. That is the exact opposite way you should behave.

"...you didn't have the decency to make sure you were geared..." How should they get geared then?

This right here is the best argument on why gear inspection should not exist.

So basically "You can't get vet gear unless you already have vet gear....which means no one can get vet gear. Logic"

Exactly.

With only a slight language change this is how it worked (works?) in WoW. A community I gladly left behind in 2014.

BlueRaven wrote: »

Wolf_Eye wrote: »

BlueRaven wrote: »

Galiferno wrote: »

You can with the built-in encounter log command and using the ESO Logs website. We use it on trials to look at players' gear/skills/casts to see if they're playing optimally in vet content and what we can do to help them improve. Without this feature, we would have no idea how to help players get better in content where it matters.

I also use it in random vets to inspect what pugs are using. If I'm doing 70% of the dps in a vet dlc dungeon and you ask for gear at the end, you better believe I logged, checked your setup, and decided I won't give you anything because you didn't have the decency to make sure you were geared and ready for the content and relied on pugs to carry you. No free carries, no free gear.

What??!!

They are trying to get better with armor sets and you deny them. That is the exact opposite way you should behave.

"...you didn't have the decency to make sure you were geared..." How should they get geared then?

This right here is the best argument on why gear inspection should not exist.

So basically "You can't get vet gear unless you already have vet gear....which means no one can get vet gear. Logic"

Exactly.

With only a slight language change this is how it worked (works?) in WoW. A community I gladly left behind in 2014.

I left WoW almost 5 years ago. I met a lot of really solid friends on there but the community was a total cesspool of racist behavior.

Features like this were catalysts for most of it.

Chadak wrote: »

Gotta say that I'm glad there is no such ability in ESO.

Why? Because prior experience has made me 100% certain that the only appropriate way to deal with this is to make people ask and to allow people to refuse to engage with this topic if they don't want to do so. If you want to know what gear someone's running, ask. It should be up to them to tell you or not tell you as they see fit.

'Examine' options that let you snoop on other peoples' gear loadouts encourage one thing and one thing alone - nosiness. It's pure indulgence of nosiness that inclines some people to start to think that they're going to start Helping People™ by commenting on/criticizing their gear.

At its absolute best, this function can be marginally convenient when someone's asking you for help in figuring out their gear situation and you can look for yourself to see what they're starting with. This can also be accomplished by asking them to link their gear in a chat window, and IMO, that's how it *should* be addressed.

There is not one single good argument for why this needs to exist that cannot be resolved by simply asking if you're so concerned about someone's gear situation. If your concern is legit and the person in question wants your input, feedback or opinion, you can ask them about it and they can engage you on the subject.

Otherwise, live in your own yard and stop acting like you're entitled to live in mine as well.

While I don't disagree with the underlying sentiment of the post, I feel the need to bring up the subject of collaboration.

Now you say that folks need to stick to their own yard and you're entitled to do the same. Great. But I must ask you, what happens when you want to join a group?

Allow me to briefly explain. Trust is the key to any relationship and its the one thing that many random groups just don't seem to have anymore. However, even still, in order for a Team (or otherwise what we call a group) to work together then everyone has to give something. And, for some runs its perfectly reasonable for me to ask what gear everyone is running or possibly other questions as well, what build are you running with this or that role etc. So building trust requires letting someone else in.

Like you, I'm most def against someone creepin' on my account. But at the same time, if there is a need for collaboration then everyone is going to have to learn to work together in order to move forward. Everyone cannot always go in their own direction, and this is a reason why many groups fail, its why many pvp campaigns fail, including one going on right now in Grayhost lol.

Its natural and in my opinion perfectly fine for people to be comfortable however being comfortable and staying in your lane only takes you so far when you realize the need to work with someone else. And I mention this because it seems like many times, I'm basically the one carrying folks and am just getting kind of tired of eating all the risk, taking the heat, including a few abusive chat messages, while everyone else saves face and stays safe and comfortable... with a few of them also trying to take all the credit too.

I guess I just wish eso was more like it was back a couple years ago where it seemed like people were more forthcoming about working together as a Team.

No thanks.

lol, the amount of "no" is crazy here.
and btw about visible @id , I think this is a protective mesure which is necessary today, even if i wasnt a big fan of it when it changed on eso.
elder scrolls game has this particularity to have minimal informations on screen, and personnally i like it.

This may be a good idea for those lower level players to inspect higher level players to see what gear and abilities they're using to increase their own damage, healing or tankyness in the game and whatnot. However, there is always going to be people that will abuse that feature to bully and kick others from groups.

I would propose that if this option was added, it would be an option where you can ALLOW or DISALLOW others to see your gear and skills, and that the default option would be disabled so it's a choice then if people want it on so they can be inspected.

fizl101 wrote: »

Blackbird_V wrote: »

This may be a good idea for those lower level players to inspect higher level players to see what gear and abilities they're using to increase their own damage, healing or tankyness in the game and whatnot. However, there is always going to be people that will abuse that feature to bully and kick others from groups.

I would propose that if this option was added, it would be an option where you can ALLOW or DISALLOW others to see your gear and skills, and that the default option would be disabled so it's a choice then if people want it on so they can be inspected.

Even that could be abused though unfortunately. Enable the ability to see your gear etc or you get kicked/can't join this dungeon/raid etc

Then they're [snip] you don't wanna be with.

[edited for profanity bypass]

Hard pass. Given the one time I got mocked by someone I killed in cyrodill before I got around to replacing vipers I can only imagine it'd be even more widespread.

Rageypoo wrote: »

Just curious why there isn't an ability to inspect gear and skills like you can in games like WoW, would being able to inspect a player be something that ESO players would be interested in?

This would kill the game. Trust me.

fizl101 wrote: »

Blackbird_V wrote: »

This may be a good idea for those lower level players to inspect higher level players to see what gear and abilities they're using to increase their own damage, healing or tankyness in the game and whatnot. However, there is always going to be people that will abuse that feature to bully and kick others from groups.

I would propose that if this option was added, it would be an option where you can ALLOW or DISALLOW others to see your gear and skills, and that the default option would be disabled so it's a choice then if people want it on so they can be inspected.

Even that could be abused though unfortunately. Enable the ability to see your gear etc or you get kicked/can't join this dungeon/raid etc

Everything in ESO like chat, crouching, or emotes can be abused or used to offend someone so why draw the line at a useful tool? Some things people think is abuse such as telling people to get into voice chat for a raid isn't abuse and is just touchy players wanting to be catered to. Anything that is really abuse is already against the ToS and can be solved with a report to CS. Everything that isn't in violation of ToS can be embraced or denied with one's comfort level and goals - but if you want to raid then you have to play the game and adhere to the group's standards or you don't get to raid. Nobody will get kicked from RNDs if we have a gear inspection. The only time I see people get kicked nowadays is when they AFK, leave the dungeon without leaving group, or fake tank with a bow, no taunt, and 18K health running around in circles from the boss. I see people leaving dungeons due to low DPS or fake tanks more than asking to kick anyone and I run several RNDs a day for transmutes.

Chadak wrote: »

Vulkunne wrote: »

Chadak wrote: »

Gotta say that I'm glad there is no such ability in ESO.

Why? Because prior experience has made me 100% certain that the only appropriate way to deal with this is to make people ask and to allow people to refuse to engage with this topic if they don't want to do so. If you want to know what gear someone's running, ask. It should be up to them to tell you or not tell you as they see fit.

'Examine' options that let you snoop on other peoples' gear loadouts encourage one thing and one thing alone - nosiness. It's pure indulgence of nosiness that inclines some people to start to think that they're going to start Helping People™ by commenting on/criticizing their gear.

At its absolute best, this function can be marginally convenient when someone's asking you for help in figuring out their gear situation and you can look for yourself to see what they're starting with. This can also be accomplished by asking them to link their gear in a chat window, and IMO, that's how it *should* be addressed.

There is not one single good argument for why this needs to exist that cannot be resolved by simply asking if you're so concerned about someone's gear situation. If your concern is legit and the person in question wants your input, feedback or opinion, you can ask them about it and they can engage you on the subject.

Otherwise, live in your own yard and stop acting like you're entitled to live in mine as well.

While I don't disagree with the underlying sentiment of the post, I feel the need to bring up the subject of collaboration.

Now you say that folks need to stick to their own yard and you're entitled to do the same. Great. But I must ask you, what happens when you want to join a group?

Allow me to briefly explain. Trust is the key to any relationship and its the one thing that many random groups just don't seem to have anymore. However, even still, in order for a Team (or otherwise what we call a group) to work together then everyone has to give something. And, for some runs its perfectly reasonable for me to ask what gear everyone is running or possibly other questions as well, what build are you running with this or that role etc. So building trust requires letting someone else in.

Like you, I'm most def against someone creepin' on my account. But at the same time, if there is a need for collaboration then everyone is going to have to learn to work together in order to move forward. Everyone cannot always go in their own direction, and this is a reason why many groups fail, its why many pvp campaigns fail, including one going on right now in Grayhost lol.

Its natural and in my opinion perfectly fine for people to be comfortable however being comfortable and staying in your lane only takes you so far when you realize the need to work with someone else. And I mention this because it seems like many times, I'm basically the one carrying folks and am just getting kind of tired of eating all the risk, taking the heat, including a few abusive chat messages, while everyone else saves face and stays safe and comfortable... with a few of them also trying to take all the credit too.

I guess I just wish eso was more like it was back a couple years ago where it seemed like people were more forthcoming about working together as a Team.

DLC Vet dungeons and trials are the only group content in which caring about other peoples' gear can be justified, and even there, ask them. Ask. Fingers go clickety clack, Discord go yippety-yap.

Turns out that there's no such thing as a problem in this respect that cannot be resolved by people simply talking to each other. No special tools need to be coded in. No extra snoop features need to be programmed.

Talk to people. What are you doing in group content if you're so averse to socialization that talking to people is a mountain you just won't climb?

Right and my reply to your post was about the importance of Collaboration.

What does collaboration really mean?

The dictionary defines collaboration as the: col·lab·o·ra·tion (kəˌlabəˈrāSHən) noun. the action of working together with someone to produce or create something. This is different from cooperation. To cooperate means to be helpful by doing what someone asks or tells you to do or to act in a way that makes something possible or likely.

Now you're saying that I'm adverse to socialization and that I have not already considered the basic need to talk to people, when your original post was more in favor of an attitude that will prevent both from happening by putting the burden of proof on everyone else. You must have me mistaken for another post cause that doesn't flow with what I was saying, which is very much in favor of socializing and being prepared to discuss your build and ideas with another party. Sometimes what I post can be lengthy, probably need to work on that but your reply does not match my content. In fact speaking of content, I visit this place frequently for the very purpose that you have stated that I don't seem to understand? Feel free to review and visit any of my previous posts.

Just trying to be helpful however you might want to be careful using definitive words such as 'only' and 'no such thing' because of all the years I've been playing MMOs you'd be surprised what situations might arise. Which is another reason why I felt the need to reply because I totally agree with you that people's privacy needs to be protected and they should most def be free to choose who to associate with however it just seems like no one wants to work together anymore.

At one time I regularly ran 4 man groups as well as Trial runs all the time, all hours of the night and weekends, including PvP Groups in both Cyrodiil and Imperial City and anymore it just seems like too many people want to get carried and if I ask anything of them its like I don't have right to know what's going on yet they want everything done for nothing and quite frankly alot of us are tired of this. But that's alright as this is one reason why I no longer helm many of those group activities, not the only one however.

And before you go there, some of us have tried talking to them, offered builds, ideas and so on, so forth... they just don't care. Hence, why I make it a point to take many of these types of arguments to the ESO Forums (vs being virtually ignored in zone chat) in order to publicly talk about things like Collaboration on here (once in a while) in the hopes that maybe things might change a little, with the understanding that meaningful change takes time. Sometimes it seems to help generate quite a bit of discussion and if nothing else I meet people with similar interest, hence the value of Collaboration.