secondrowforward wrote: »

silvereyes wrote: »

secondrowforward wrote: »

When this character is done with it's adventure, will it then be able to delete it and reset all stats to zero. Starting a new character on a new skill tree. Starting from scratch so to speak with just one character. So on and so on.

Deleting a character does not roll back its account-wide achievements that it earned. They are associated with the server account, not the character. The only way to start from scratch is to buy a new player account or join a server (PC, EU) that the player hasn't played on before.

Note: this will not only wipe out the account's progress, but also any collections, currency and DLC the account owns. The exception is that Chapter and Crowns ownership is at least preserved between servers on the same player account, but that's it.

In that case any cash purchases made would be lost without a reset of an account. In which case only a fool would use the crown store in multiple future accounts. Some time past I used to play World of Tanks where someone could reset their account to zero/start but keep all their cash purchases. With this in mind I was trying to indicate if this could be implemented into ESO, and so any Crown Store items would not be lost. As the owner of two accounts and uses both servers I was already aware of the implications buying multiple accounts presented.

Elsonso wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

Bear in mind that if you give up on one account and start another then you can use any outstanding crowns on the original account to gift purchases to the new one. I noticed when opening a new account this week for the express purpose of running a single character only in the light of these changes that gifting is only allowed after 30 days, but whether that is receiving or sending gifts, or both, I've no idea. I guess you could also submit a ticket requesting a transfer of crowns between the accounts but whether that would be accepted again I've no idea.

Yes. I have been using Gifting across my multiple accounts as often as possible. It is more efficient than buying Crowns for each account, since it reduces the amount of "excess" when the number Crowns get below what they can be spent on.

Good to know about the 30 day delay, which is likely to combat RMT.

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

peacenote wrote: »

Fennwitty wrote: »

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

...
If someone views their characters as a tool- then accomplishing something with a hammer doesn't mean that you also accomplished the same task while using a wrench. Doing a quest line on Character A does not mean that quest line has been completed on Character B, even if your account says you have the achievements for it. This is simply how the game is set up.

I appreciate there is a distinction for people.

To some extent it's how specific you want to think about character vs. player.

I don't think it's that black and white, even. Say I wholeheartedly agree that if I completed something on one character, I want the community to look at me as an experienced player even if the next time I try to do that thing, I'm on a different character. "It's still ME, everyone!" I might think.

Well, right now those folks are also losing something. The ability to go back and look at points in their ESO journey that are currently documented and will be wiped away.

Right now, if someone has 8 characters, and did no death runs on, say, Depths of Malatar, on each one... they have 8 different dates saved in the system on when they did this accomplishment. "Oh, I did this in April of 2017, and I did it again in May of 2018, and again in June 2018 (ha! that was my birthday), and I stayed out of that dungeon for a while and went back in 2019." Whatever. After the change, they will be only able to look fondly back on one date. And they won't get to pick. Maybe the most memorable experience was the one where they did it on their birthday... that date is likely soon to be erased. Fun things like what dungeons and trials you ran on your account, and in what order, will be blurred and unclear.

We don't currently get credit for each time we do something on the same character. If you like to look back on what you've done that could be viewed as a flaw. But at least, right now, you have the timeline of each character. Even if you have the perspective that it is always the same person and it doesn't matter which character, you still might like the ability to know how many times you've done something, and when, at least to the level of the number of characters you have.

I do understand that some people don't care about this at all. I'm not saying everyone does or should. I'm just pointing out that even people who think about the player perspective are losing potentially a good bit of information on their historical play history. "This is the year I switched from sorc to NB." Soon that type of observation will be difficult to have. Account-wide achievements is a destructive change in its current state and game milestones for all are set to be overwritten if nothing changes.

Well said! This information regarding the history of my characters is also part of what concerns me so deeply about this update. Knowing that this will be wiped out on one character simply by logging into another is upsetting, to say the least. Being forced to choose who to log into "first" knowing that the history of another character will be deleted permanently is heartbreaking for so many of us. Some people don't care about these dates at all, and I understand that. But for some of us, they're meaningful- either because looking back on those memories holds some sentimental value, or because we want to track progress, or because we simply want to record the characters history. They hold value to many- and reading many of the deeply heartfelt stories here, it is easy to see why.

Many people who don't understand the desire for players wanting character specific achievements to remain in tact have often commented that "you shouldn't need an achievement or an incentive to play the game, just play it for the game!" what they don't seem to realize is that we are playing for the game. We connect to the game on a very deep level- and the record those achievements represent is a part of that. For many of us, the achievements are not about getting a cookie or a gold star or a reward at the end of a quest. They're about preserving a memory to look back on, like a scrap book or a journal. When I look back on those dates, I remember certain events at the time, what I was doing, why I was doing it, and who I was doing it with.

Some of them are special because they're achievements I got on special days with special characters, like my birthday or Christmas, or other holidays where I wanted to play and have a special date associated with a certain achievement. I had so much fun last year getting the hilarious "disrobed" achievements on my birthday, for example.

Others are special because they represent time I have spent with my parents in game, who also play. For example, my very first Fungal Grotto 1 achievement on my very first character always reminds me of the day my mom, who is in her 60's and has severe arthritis, solo tanked the last boss and killed it while me and my dad lay there on the floor like a carpet because we died, but she wouldn't give up no matter how long it took. She's an amazing lady and seeing the achievement date always makes me smile, also because it was the first time we'd set foot in a dungeon in ESO.

And other achievements are deeply important to me, because seeing them reminds me of times when I was fighting tooth and nail against the pull of my anxiety- days when I struggled, but logging into ESO held me up, helped me through the fear and gave me something to focus on other than my nagging worries. Days when I chose to focus on a quest rather than letting my anxiety get the best of me, days when I did something -I wanted- to do rather than allowing fear to take hold and control what became of my day. Rather than focusing on that stuff, I focused on my creative side, developed a character, built its story, occasionally tabbing out of the game to actually write because I was so inspired by the quests I was doing. I like looking back on those dates. They make me remember that no matter how frightening something seems, I can fight.

ESO gives many of us strength, and our character's achievements in game often remind us of that. So many of us who have endured fear, loss, and pain have found a second home here. I find myself inspired to share my own feelings here, because I see many others who are brave enough to share their own experiences, and I want the developers to understand how deeply this game has touched so many hearts.

Both from a character perspective connecting to the story of who my characters are, and from a personal player perspective, this character history means a lot to so many of us. It's so much more than just a reward at the end of a quest, or a record of events. It's memory, it's story, it's the love of so many creators for their creations and the time they spent crafting them.

Undoubtedly I will find a way to make my own records even if we loose our characters personal achievements. But having it in game, right there, where we can see it, for so long as the game exists, gives our experience a richness that is lost without it.

Please. Don't take this from us. Find a compromise that allows us to relive our favorite stories and hold a record of them.

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

peacenote wrote: »

Fennwitty wrote: »

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

...
If someone views their characters as a tool- then accomplishing something with a hammer doesn't mean that you also accomplished the same task while using a wrench. Doing a quest line on Character A does not mean that quest line has been completed on Character B, even if your account says you have the achievements for it. This is simply how the game is set up.

I appreciate there is a distinction for people.

To some extent it's how specific you want to think about character vs. player.

I don't think it's that black and white, even. Say I wholeheartedly agree that if I completed something on one character, I want the community to look at me as an experienced player even if the next time I try to do that thing, I'm on a different character. "It's still ME, everyone!" I might think.

Well, right now those folks are also losing something. The ability to go back and look at points in their ESO journey that are currently documented and will be wiped away.

Right now, if someone has 8 characters, and did no death runs on, say, Depths of Malatar, on each one... they have 8 different dates saved in the system on when they did this accomplishment. "Oh, I did this in April of 2017, and I did it again in May of 2018, and again in June 2018 (ha! that was my birthday), and I stayed out of that dungeon for a while and went back in 2019." Whatever. After the change, they will be only able to look fondly back on one date. And they won't get to pick. Maybe the most memorable experience was the one where they did it on their birthday... that date is likely soon to be erased. Fun things like what dungeons and trials you ran on your account, and in what order, will be blurred and unclear.

We don't currently get credit for each time we do something on the same character. If you like to look back on what you've done that could be viewed as a flaw. But at least, right now, you have the timeline of each character. Even if you have the perspective that it is always the same person and it doesn't matter which character, you still might like the ability to know how many times you've done something, and when, at least to the level of the number of characters you have.

I do understand that some people don't care about this at all. I'm not saying everyone does or should. I'm just pointing out that even people who think about the player perspective are losing potentially a good bit of information on their historical play history. "This is the year I switched from sorc to NB." Soon that type of observation will be difficult to have. Account-wide achievements is a destructive change in its current state and game milestones for all are set to be overwritten if nothing changes.

Well said! This information regarding the history of my characters is also part of what concerns me so deeply about this update. Knowing that this will be wiped out on one character simply by logging into another is upsetting, to say the least. Being forced to choose who to log into "first" knowing that the history of another character will be deleted permanently is heartbreaking for so many of us. Some people don't care about these dates at all, and I understand that. But for some of us, they're meaningful- either because looking back on those memories holds some sentimental value, or because we want to track progress, or because we simply want to record the characters history. They hold value to many- and reading many of the deeply heartfelt stories here, it is easy to see why.

Many people who don't understand the desire for players wanting character specific achievements to remain in tact have often commented that "you shouldn't need an achievement or an incentive to play the game, just play it for the game!" what they don't seem to realize is that we are playing for the game. We connect to the game on a very deep level- and the record those achievements represent is a part of that. For many of us, the achievements are not about getting a cookie or a gold star or a reward at the end of a quest. They're about preserving a memory to look back on, like a scrap book or a journal. When I look back on those dates, I remember certain events at the time, what I was doing, why I was doing it, and who I was doing it with.

Some of them are special because they're achievements I got on special days with special characters, like my birthday or Christmas, or other holidays where I wanted to play and have a special date associated with a certain achievement. I had so much fun last year getting the hilarious "disrobed" achievements on my birthday, for example.

Others are special because they represent time I have spent with my parents in game, who also play. For example, my very first Fungal Grotto 1 achievement on my very first character always reminds me of the day my mom, who is in her 60's and has severe arthritis, solo tanked the last boss and killed it while me and my dad lay there on the floor like a carpet because we died, but she wouldn't give up no matter how long it took. She's an amazing lady and seeing the achievement date always makes me smile, also because it was the first time we'd set foot in a dungeon in ESO.

And other achievements are deeply important to me, because seeing them reminds me of times when I was fighting tooth and nail against the pull of my anxiety- days when I struggled, but logging into ESO held me up, helped me through the fear and gave me something to focus on other than my nagging worries. Days when I chose to focus on a quest rather than letting my anxiety get the best of me, days when I did something -I wanted- to do rather than allowing fear to take hold and control what became of my day. Rather than focusing on that stuff, I focused on my creative side, developed a character, built its story, occasionally tabbing out of the game to actually write because I was so inspired by the quests I was doing. I like looking back on those dates. They make me remember that no matter how frightening something seems, I can fight.

ESO gives many of us strength, and our character's achievements in game often remind us of that. So many of us who have endured fear, loss, and pain have found a second home here. I find myself inspired to share my own feelings here, because I see many others who are brave enough to share their own experiences, and I want the developers to understand how deeply this game has touched so many hearts.

Both from a character perspective connecting to the story of who my characters are, and from a personal player perspective, this character history means a lot to so many of us. It's so much more than just a reward at the end of a quest, or a record of events. It's memory, it's story, it's the love of so many creators for their creations and the time they spent crafting them.

Undoubtedly I will find a way to make my own records even if we loose our characters personal achievements. But having it in game, right there, where we can see it, for so long as the game exists, gives our experience a richness that is lost without it.

Please. Don't take this from us. Find a compromise that allows us to relive our favorite stories and hold a record of them.

Katheriah wrote: »

This is something that will change how people will play the game and if they even want to repeat things. You are taking away part of our characters, and you will do it during the next update.

And what information do we get? We don't get to hear why this is done. It's presented as some sort of blessing, but it's crafted like a hasty handmade gift by someone that forgot to buy something for a special date. Why is it not an extra tab of account achievements, next to our character achievements. Are you throwing away all our characer data? Will this be reversable? Will character achievement progress be an extra feature for ESO+ members in the future?

What is the whole idea behind this? Why are you not answering these questions?

Tandor wrote: »

@ZOS_Kevin Could you please ensure that @ZOS_MattFiror and @ZOS_RichLambert both see this post from @ArchangelIsraphel ? It encapsulates what so many of us have been saying about this subject, and in such a moving way.

Jaraal wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

[I am pretty sure they knew, before they even told us. This is not an out of the blue discussion. The forum, at least, has had several threads on the subject. They did not walk into this without knowledge.

And if they do play the "performance" card, it will only make things worse, considering how many sacrifices they have already made to gameplay with no visible results on our end. To throw away the core reason so many have eloquently expressed as to why they play this game in the first place will be hard to justify. It's totally understandable why they are choosing to delay explaining their position. It's a lose/lose proposition all around.

silvereyes wrote: »

The last time we got one of these Q&A sit downs was for the arena weapons:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/531075/twitch-q-and-a-arena-weapons-and-how-community-feedback-is-handled/p1

It was about as well-received as I anticipate this one will be. It was at least insightful, though.

ZOS_RichLambert wrote:

So, when we went in there ... and I actually made the call. Everybody gives Wheeler grief about, "why didn't you upgrade these things?" I was the one that made the call, that said, "no, we're not going to upgrade them, because player's aren't losing any power there." You know, from my point of view - and I run vMA a ton - you know, we got to use these weapons for five years. We didn't lose anything out of there.

If you really have to have the "perfected" in the item name, um, just go run the Maelstrom Arena again. Yes, there's a line there, and yes, I guess it kinda feels arbitrary to some players, and yes, some players don't want to go and do it because they've done it before. I get that. But, again, when you're kinda doing that balancing act, you know, what's more important in the grand scheme of things? And, you know, I made the call of, no, we're not gonna upgrade 'em.

[snip]

He (Wheeler) gets all the hate, and it totally wasn't his call, and he'll never be like, "I didn't make the call, Rich did." He would never do that. So ... um ... yeah. People can blame me for it, which is fine.

[snip]

Yeah, it kinda got lost in the shuffle as well. Like, I know there was a big long post on the forums. Or, several threads on there that got pretty cranky. In general, I try not to respond to cranky threads. But I know the Community Team has been pushing on that to get an official response. So I think they put something up there, but ... um ... honestly it just kinda got lost in the shuffle, from my point of view.

#blamerich

RavenXIV wrote: »

Problem I see is people are so hurt by this change I feel as if people aren't testing the content we could test and fix the things that are bugged like bard college. maybe thats not intended but the more people complain about this change the more things are gonna slip thru pts server. At this rate regardless of how much people do not like change its going to go thru regardless of what everyone feels.

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

A tool is a tool, you can put a wig on it, dress it, say it is a lord and call it bob but the fact is, thats still a tool

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

People are saying that they will not be satisfied with an account wide view. But in truth, an account wide view will be all "Account Wide Achievements" will ever actually BE, regardless of how it is implemented, because you never actually achieved anything on your other characters if you, the player, have not done those tasks on them. You can wipe away character names, you can share progress on certain things...it changes nothing. It will still only ever be an account wide view.

If that was true people disliking the change would not speak of account wide view as a replacement since its the same thing

In fact they are 2 completly different thing, one say that i did x achievement and and the other say that character a did it but not the others

I did those not my character, they are tool I used to do so. I do give them backstory and all but acheivement are separate from who they are

When there is a murder is the murderer arrested or is it is gun? When a kid win an art contest does the reward goes to the kid, his pens or the drawing, ? When a guild does a housing contest is the prize sent to the player or the character who built said house?

A tool is a tool, you can put a wig on it, dress it, say it is a lord and call it bob but the fact is, thats still a tool

Im not saying its a wrong way to play the game tough, as long as people have fun, its a good way to play

heaven13 wrote: »

If I want to use Rich’s argument against him, no one lost anything with vMA weapons. What they had after the patch was the exact same thing as before. At its base level, if you disregard all the time and effort people spent in vMA, sure that’s true. The same can’t be said for AwA. A whole lot is being lost and taken away, unable to even be gained again if this goes live as is.

As others have said, delay the release of this “feature” until it can be done well, until players don’t have to lose something for others to benefit.

CombatCoati wrote: »

RavenXIV wrote: »

I could see them reworking some of it over time possibly.

Oh, I'm sure they'll do that.
Unfortunately, once the character specific data is gone, there is no reworking that
(If the data is actually lost completely, which we cannot know until ZOS tells us)