Update 49 is now available for testing on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/categories/pts
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• PC/Mac: No maintenance – January 19
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• EU megaservers for patch maintenance – January 21, 9:00 UTC (4:00AM EST) - 15:00 UTC (10:00AM EST)
Please remove Dungeon DLC from ESO+
-
AlnilamE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭etchedpixels wrote: »Much of the time all DLC dungeons in randoms ensures is half the group quitting because it's faster to do
random
oh its a DLC, quit group
walk into a pledge
random
oh its a DLC, quit group
walk into a pledge
random
oh its an ok one - finish it.
Or people either queue as a 4 or with one non ESO+ member in order to avoid the DLC dungeons, which also doesn't help anyone else.
My alt account doesn't have ESO+ solely because of this silly policy.
I ran about 100 dungeons over the holidays and I don't remember anyone quitting because it was a DLC. Is this a EU server thing?The Moot Councillor1 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭etchedpixels wrote: »Much of the time all DLC dungeons in randoms ensures is half the group quitting because it's faster to do
random
oh its a DLC, quit group
walk into a pledge
random
oh its a DLC, quit group
walk into a pledge
random
oh its an ok one - finish it.
Or people either queue as a 4 or with one non ESO+ member in order to avoid the DLC dungeons, which also doesn't help anyone else.
My alt account doesn't have ESO+ solely because of this silly policy.
I ran about 100 dungeons over the holidays and I don't remember anyone quitting because it was a DLC. Is this a EU server thing?
I have that happen in about 10% of my dungeons on ps4. It's annoying but definitely most groups at least attempt the to succeed and only drop if it they wipe a couple of times.0 -
renne✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »etchedpixels wrote: »Much of the time all DLC dungeons in randoms ensures is half the group quitting because it's faster to do
random
oh its a DLC, quit group
walk into a pledge
random
oh its a DLC, quit group
walk into a pledge
random
oh its an ok one - finish it.
Or people either queue as a 4 or with one non ESO+ member in order to avoid the DLC dungeons, which also doesn't help anyone else.
My alt account doesn't have ESO+ solely because of this silly policy.
I ran about 100 dungeons over the holidays and I don't remember anyone quitting because it was a DLC. Is this a EU server thing?
I have that happen in about 10% of my dungeons on ps4. It's annoying but definitely most groups at least attempt the to succeed and only drop if it they wipe a couple of times.
Whereas I am also on PS and my anecdata is that people never drop at the very start, even in normal March of Sacrifices where the first boss will absolutely decide you on if it's worth sticking with the group or not. A couple of wipes then people drop.0 -
kargen27✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The daily random was created to help players wanting to run specific dungeons fill a group. It is already hard to fill a group for DLC dungeons because not all players have access to them. So we are drawing from a limited pool. You are asking they remove the reason dailies were created. Better to just get rid of the daily random all together than exclude players based on the dungeon they wish to run.
I think a better solution if a change needs to be made is after a year the dlc dungeon gets added to all players lists of possible dungeons in the random queue whether they have the dlc or not. They wouldn't have access to the rest of the DLC nor the dungeon outside the daily random queue. Could inspire more players to queue if they had access to more content.and then the parrot said, "must be the water mines green too."2 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »etchedpixels wrote: »Much of the time all DLC dungeons in randoms ensures is half the group quitting because it's faster to do
random
oh its a DLC, quit group
walk into a pledge
random
oh its a DLC, quit group
walk into a pledge
random
oh its an ok one - finish it.
Or people either queue as a 4 or with one non ESO+ member in order to avoid the DLC dungeons, which also doesn't help anyone else.
My alt account doesn't have ESO+ solely because of this silly policy.
I ran about 100 dungeons over the holidays and I don't remember anyone quitting because it was a DLC. Is this a EU server thing?
I have that happen in about 10% of my dungeons on ps4. It's annoying but definitely most groups at least attempt the to succeed and only drop if it they wipe a couple of times.
Whereas I am also on PS and my anecdata is that people never drop at the very start, even in normal March of Sacrifices where the first boss will absolutely decide you on if it's worth sticking with the group or not. A couple of wipes then people drop.
I probably should have mentioned that when I see people drop, it's typically Vet. I think it's only like 1% of my normals where people drop at the very beginning.1 -
O_LYKOS✭✭✭✭✭
✭That’s it. You don’t like something so request it be removed lol the game is not catered to you. If you don’t want to get a “random” dungeon perhaps it’s a good idea to select the dungeons you actually do like. But even then it will still be a random group so they might be Russian. What a pickle hey.
PC NA - GreggsSausageRoll4 -
Amottica✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭SilverBride wrote: »...we can queue for a solo or drop ESO+ and buy the zone DLCs.
Why should we have to drop ESO+ and lose all the perks we love just because of one thing that is not even listed as an ESO+ perk? The only thing it says about DLCs is "Access to all DLC game packs available in the Crown Store for the duration of membership".
It doesn't mention queueing for DLC dungeons as a perk, so doesn't anyone who owns DLC games packs, even if not subbed, also have those dungeons in the queue?
That part of my post you edited out pretty much gives the reason why this is the way it is which in turn answers your question here.
0 -
Tsar_Gekkou✭✭✭✭✭
✭People who pay monthly to support the game get screwed over while people who don't never have to deal with 2 dds spamming arrow spray and a fank tank just heavy attacking in lair of maarselok. Zos probably won't change this for another 2 years or so.Xbox NA healer main
vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vMoL HM | vHoF HM | vAS+2 | vCR+3 | vBRP | vSS HM | vKA HM | vRG HM |
Flawless Conqueror | Spirit Slayer | Dro-mA'thra Destroyer | Tick-Tock-Tormentor | Immortal Redeemer | Gryphon Heart | Godslayer | Dawnbringer | Planesbreaker |6 -
Galbsadi✭✭✭What the title says. Ideally remove it from the game and stop developing them. But at the very least don’t have me queue for a normal dungeon and get cradle of shadows where the healer immediately quits and leaves me [snip]
I love the craft bag but having dlc dungeons in my random queue when I want to just get my endeavour done and get some exp for my necro is a punishment I’m not sure is worth it. 90% of these dungeons you keep adding drop trash sets nobody uses and stories the go-go-go multiplayer part of the game has no interest in letting me experience. They’re pointless wastes of dev time that would be better served producing a second small zone dlc.
*Deep Breath* Just please let me untick DLC in ESO+ I don’t want access to.
[Snip for Insulting/Baiting]
You know what? Sure.
I'd be a fan of slightly modifying this: allow 3 queues: Random Normal Dungeon (Legacy), for folks like you that don't want the DLC stuff, or your healer that ran away; Random Normal Dungeon (DLC), for folks like me that enjoy the extra mechanics and find the DLC dungeons way more fun; and Random Veteran Dungeon.
Everybody wins.3 -
di_rty✭✭✭[snip]
Random is random. If you want to only play non-DLC dungeons, then use the dungeon selector tool to select the dungeons you're fit to run.
[edited for baiting]Edited by ZOS_Lunar on February 3, 2022 1:54PM6 -
alienmz✭✭✭Please add an option for every single dungeon to untick it from being queued
Edited by alienmz on February 3, 2022 1:20PM1 -
Vrienda✭✭✭✭✭
✭Just want to add to the mod team. I wasn't insulting or baiting. I was legit put with people I tried to communicate with and they simply weren't able to understand me (All they did was respond in Cyrillic) due to a language barrier issue. Otherwise I would have simply explained the tactics. Alas my Cyrillic is non-existent.Desperate for Roleplaying servers to bring open world non-organised RP to Elder Scrolls Online. Please ZOS.0 -
BXR_Lonestar✭✭✭✭✭
✭All they need to do is allow us to deselect "include DLC Dungeons" in the random que menu and things would be fine. Having the dungeons for free is one of the major perks of having Plus, so getting rid of it wouldn't make a lot of sense.0 -
Astrid✭✭✭✭✭… But it’s normal. There is nothing difficult about any of the dungeons on normal. DLC or otherwise.3 -
MakoRuu✭✭✭✭>have level 48 necro
>might as well do a daily to see if I can hit 50
>wearing level 20 training gear
>too lazy to make more so close to 50
>queue for random normal
>Frostvault
>fake tank
>get rolled cause team is dog water0 -
xXSilverDragonXx✭✭✭✭✭Some weeks ago I logged in and did eight random dungeons. Five of them were DLC. One was a lowbie leveling thus not DLC optional. That's a lot of DLC to end up in for the day. More than half. Almost 100% DLC in my randoms. . I unsubbed that day.
I've posted about this and while most want this quality of life change, there are always a few naysayers who blah blah blah something about randoms needing them to be truly random which is an argument that fails as people who are not giving ZOS $15 a month for plus do not have this 'feature'. There's also grumbles about how all the DLC are super easy on normal blah blah blah, but that doesn't account for 1) length of them which equates to them taking more time, regardless and 2) more mechanics and people don't bother explaining much of the time or don't read group chat if you try to explain to them and 3) fake tank, fake healers making them a special kind of hell because there are still mechanics involved and usually you need a tank and definitely most of them require healing.
I vote with my dollars. ZOS lost mine. I refuse to pay to end up with annoyances that people who don't pay don't have to deal with.
And frankly, while I think dlc in the queue for randoms should absolutely be a CHOICE if you have plus rather than forced on you, I also believe that transmutes should be adjusted. Vets should get 15. DLC should get 13 and non DLC should get 10. Vet DLC should get 18. Queue with DLC you get the higher amount. For some it will be worth it especially if they have many toons. For others who don't want the hassle or have some days where they don't, they have that choice to not do them.
This isn't rocket science. It's just being fair. ESO plus people should not have to pay for extra headaches they don't want.
I really believe they will make this kind of change. I believe it for two reasons:
They have made MANY wonderful quality of life changes over the years that most of us never imagined, and of course, they always did it when they found a way it could earn them money. But they have also done it when it was not about money, but rather the community really wanted it. Examples of that are:- Unlocking faction maps
- Making all zones adjust for cp 160 so we could have TES level of freedom to roam the land
- Transmutes to change traits
- Adding Housing
- Adding Companions
- Using transmutes now to make it so you never have to farm again
I have been on and off playing this game for over half a decade. When I come back from time off, I always find some very nice QoL changes they made. So I do believe they absolutely will do this at some point. They just need to understand how much it is bothering people who don't want to be forced into DLC and how much it is costing them from people who have either unsubbed or used it as one more reason they eventually stopped playing.Edited by xXSilverDragonXx on February 3, 2022 7:52PM2 -
Vrienda✭✭✭✭✭
✭xXSilverDragonXx wrote: »Some weeks ago I logged in and did eight random dungeons. Five of them were DLC. One was a lowbie leveling thus not DLC optional. That's a lot of DLC to end up in for the day. More than half. Almost 100% DLC in my randoms. . I unsubbed that day.
I've posted about this and while most want this quality of life change, there are always a few naysayers who blah blah blah something about randoms needing them to be truly random which is an argument that fails as people who are not giving ZOS $15 a month for plus do not have this 'feature'. There's also grumbles about how all the DLC are super easy on normal blah blah blah, but that doesn't account for 1) length of them which equates to them taking more time, regardless and 2) more mechanics and people don't bother explaining much of the time or don't read group chat if you try to explain to them and 3) fake tank, fake healers making them a special kind of hell because there are still mechanics involved and usually you need a tank and definitely most of them require healing.
I vote with my dollars. ZOS lost mine. I refuse to pay to end up with annoyances that people who don't pay don't have to deal with.
And frankly, while I think dlc in the queue for randoms should absolutely be a CHOICE if you have plus rather than forced on you, I also believe that transmutes should be adjusted. Vets should get 15. DLC should get 13 and non DLC should get 10. Vet DLC should get 18. Queue with DLC you get the higher amount. For some it will be worth it especially if they have many toons. For others who don't want the hassle or have some days where they don't, they have that choice to not do them.
This isn't rocket science. It's just being fair. ESO plus people should not have to pay for extra headaches they don't want.
On board with this idea. I haven't/won't unsub personally because I use ESO+'s other features too much. But I rarely do dungeons as a result. Only for events/endeavours when I can combo it with my other goals like getting undaunted rep up/a level or two on an alt.Desperate for Roleplaying servers to bring open world non-organised RP to Elder Scrolls Online. Please ZOS.4 -
xXSilverDragonXx✭✭✭✭✭Parasaurolophus wrote: »It's actually quite a broken system when the dungeons vary so much in difficulty. Just accept the rules of the game that this is a real RANDOM dungeon and not a handy farming tool for you.
Poor argument. Real random differs for people with ESO plus and those without it. Thus, you point is lost.2 -
AlnilamE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭xXSilverDragonXx wrote: »Some weeks ago I logged in and did eight random dungeons. Five of them were DLC. One was a lowbie leveling thus not DLC optional. That's a lot of DLC to end up in for the day. More than half. Almost 100% DLC in my randoms. . I unsubbed that day.
I've posted about this and while most want this quality of life change, there are always a few naysayers who blah blah blah something about randoms needing them to be truly random which is an argument that fails as people who are not giving ZOS $15 a month for plus do not have this 'feature'. There's also grumbles about how all the DLC are super easy on normal blah blah blah, but that doesn't account for 1) length of them which equates to them taking more time, regardless and 2) more mechanics and people don't bother explaining much of the time or don't read group chat if you try to explain to them and 3) fake tank, fake healers making them a special kind of hell because there are still mechanics involved and usually you need a tank and definitely most of them require healing.
I vote with my dollars. ZOS lost mine. I refuse to pay to end up with annoyances that people who don't pay don't have to deal with.
And frankly, while I think dlc in the queue for randoms should absolutely be a CHOICE if you have plus rather than forced on you, I also believe that transmutes should be adjusted. Vets should get 15. DLC should get 13 and non DLC should get 10. Vet DLC should get 18. Queue with DLC you get the higher amount. For some it will be worth it especially if they have many toons. For others who don't want the hassle or have some days where they don't, they have that choice to not do them.
This isn't rocket science. It's just being fair. ESO plus people should not have to pay for extra headaches they don't want.
I really believe they will make this kind of change. I believe it for two reasons:
They have made MANY wonderful quality of life changes over the years that most of us never imagined, and of course, they always did it when they found a way it could earn them money. But they have also done it when it was not about money, but rather the community really wanted it. Examples of that are:- Unlocking faction maps
- Making all zones adjust for cp 160 so we could have TES level of freedom to roam the land
- Transmutes to change traits
- Adding Housing
- Adding Companions
- Using transmutes now to make it so you never have to farm again
I have been on and off playing this game for over half a decade. When I come back from time off, I always find some very nice QoL changes they made. So I do believe they absolutely will do this at some point. They just need to understand how much it is bothering people who don't want to be forced into DLC and how much it is costing them from people who have either unsubbed or used it as one more reason they eventually stopped playing.
So what would be a reasonable duration for a random dungeon?
10 minutes? 15? 20? 30?
Should the game just give you the reward once you get to that time limit regardless of whether the dungeon is finished so you can bail on the group?
You understand that you are getting DLC dungeons because you are filling groups for people that are actually queueing for those dungeons specifically, right?The Moot Councillor6 -
DaveMoeDee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Ah, I wondered when we were going to have another thread on this. I was betting it would be tuesday this week but no, we got it in on monday
Yey.
Seriously, just cancel ESO+ use the money you save to buy the chapters (its like 2 months eso+ on sale) and (assuming you're on pc) install a loot manager add on like bandit's. 95% of the stuff you pick up in game is crap you'll never use.
And never look back. Or, look back laughing. Maniacally. Because, now dungeon finder can only assign you to base game dungeons, it has to find someone else to fill out groups for people who want to run a DLC. So, yes, those poor saps that, you know, support the game are going to find themselves doing even more DLCs when they RND.
People who are dismissive of these kinds of posts rarely acknowledge that last part. They talk about "random," but the randomness in the queue is the pairing. The dungeon chosen is regularly not at all random. It is often a dungeon one of the people picked. I remember queuing for a base game dungeon and the 3 other people wanted to leave the dungeon to run another. They got it as a "random" dungeon, but is wasn't random. It was the dungeon I chose.
So people queuing for DLC dungeons are pulling in the random dungeon people. This is great when it is a pledge, but a pain when a lot of people are queuing for a new DLC dungeon. Sadly, the random queue exists to fill groups for those people, not to get random dungeons. And getting ESO+ penalizes you into longer daily randoms. When my alts hit 45 like 2 or so years ago when I was mass-leveling, like 80% of random queues ended up being DLC dungeons. The imbalance was ridiculous. My first only clears for some DLC dungeons were on alts I was leveling to 50. I don't mind DLC dungeons (esp on normal), but the ESO+ penalty is real.Edited by DaveMoeDee on February 3, 2022 8:30PM2 -
DaveMoeDee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭xXSilverDragonXx wrote: »Some weeks ago I logged in and did eight random dungeons. Five of them were DLC. One was a lowbie leveling thus not DLC optional. That's a lot of DLC to end up in for the day. More than half. Almost 100% DLC in my randoms. . I unsubbed that day.
I've posted about this and while most want this quality of life change, there are always a few naysayers who blah blah blah something about randoms needing them to be truly random which is an argument that fails as people who are not giving ZOS $15 a month for plus do not have this 'feature'. There's also grumbles about how all the DLC are super easy on normal blah blah blah, but that doesn't account for 1) length of them which equates to them taking more time, regardless and 2) more mechanics and people don't bother explaining much of the time or don't read group chat if you try to explain to them and 3) fake tank, fake healers making them a special kind of hell because there are still mechanics involved and usually you need a tank and definitely most of them require healing.
I vote with my dollars. ZOS lost mine. I refuse to pay to end up with annoyances that people who don't pay don't have to deal with.
And frankly, while I think dlc in the queue for randoms should absolutely be a CHOICE if you have plus rather than forced on you, I also believe that transmutes should be adjusted. Vets should get 15. DLC should get 13 and non DLC should get 10. Vet DLC should get 18. Queue with DLC you get the higher amount. For some it will be worth it especially if they have many toons. For others who don't want the hassle or have some days where they don't, they have that choice to not do them.
This isn't rocket science. It's just being fair. ESO plus people should not have to pay for extra headaches they don't want.
I really believe they will make this kind of change. I believe it for two reasons:
They have made MANY wonderful quality of life changes over the years that most of us never imagined, and of course, they always did it when they found a way it could earn them money. But they have also done it when it was not about money, but rather the community really wanted it. Examples of that are:- Unlocking faction maps
- Making all zones adjust for cp 160 so we could have TES level of freedom to roam the land
- Transmutes to change traits
- Adding Housing
- Adding Companions
- Using transmutes now to make it so you never have to farm again
I have been on and off playing this game for over half a decade. When I come back from time off, I always find some very nice QoL changes they made. So I do believe they absolutely will do this at some point. They just need to understand how much it is bothering people who don't want to be forced into DLC and how much it is costing them from people who have either unsubbed or used it as one more reason they eventually stopped playing.
So what would be a reasonable duration for a random dungeon?
10 minutes? 15? 20? 30?
Should the game just give you the reward once you get to that time limit regardless of whether the dungeon is finished so you can bail on the group?
You understand that you are getting DLC dungeons because you are filling groups for people that are actually queueing for those dungeons specifically, right?
The point is that ESO+ gets you, on average, longer daily randoms that are more likely to fail. Yes, the only point of the daily random reward is filling groups for people that select dungeons to PUG. But subbing should not be a penalty. And it doesn't help the PUGs much if a bunch of people quit as soon as they see the dungeon.2 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭DaveMoeDee wrote: »xXSilverDragonXx wrote: »Some weeks ago I logged in and did eight random dungeons. Five of them were DLC. One was a lowbie leveling thus not DLC optional. That's a lot of DLC to end up in for the day. More than half. Almost 100% DLC in my randoms. . I unsubbed that day.
I've posted about this and while most want this quality of life change, there are always a few naysayers who blah blah blah something about randoms needing them to be truly random which is an argument that fails as people who are not giving ZOS $15 a month for plus do not have this 'feature'. There's also grumbles about how all the DLC are super easy on normal blah blah blah, but that doesn't account for 1) length of them which equates to them taking more time, regardless and 2) more mechanics and people don't bother explaining much of the time or don't read group chat if you try to explain to them and 3) fake tank, fake healers making them a special kind of hell because there are still mechanics involved and usually you need a tank and definitely most of them require healing.
I vote with my dollars. ZOS lost mine. I refuse to pay to end up with annoyances that people who don't pay don't have to deal with.
And frankly, while I think dlc in the queue for randoms should absolutely be a CHOICE if you have plus rather than forced on you, I also believe that transmutes should be adjusted. Vets should get 15. DLC should get 13 and non DLC should get 10. Vet DLC should get 18. Queue with DLC you get the higher amount. For some it will be worth it especially if they have many toons. For others who don't want the hassle or have some days where they don't, they have that choice to not do them.
This isn't rocket science. It's just being fair. ESO plus people should not have to pay for extra headaches they don't want.
I really believe they will make this kind of change. I believe it for two reasons:
They have made MANY wonderful quality of life changes over the years that most of us never imagined, and of course, they always did it when they found a way it could earn them money. But they have also done it when it was not about money, but rather the community really wanted it. Examples of that are:- Unlocking faction maps
- Making all zones adjust for cp 160 so we could have TES level of freedom to roam the land
- Transmutes to change traits
- Adding Housing
- Adding Companions
- Using transmutes now to make it so you never have to farm again
I have been on and off playing this game for over half a decade. When I come back from time off, I always find some very nice QoL changes they made. So I do believe they absolutely will do this at some point. They just need to understand how much it is bothering people who don't want to be forced into DLC and how much it is costing them from people who have either unsubbed or used it as one more reason they eventually stopped playing.
So what would be a reasonable duration for a random dungeon?
10 minutes? 15? 20? 30?
Should the game just give you the reward once you get to that time limit regardless of whether the dungeon is finished so you can bail on the group?
You understand that you are getting DLC dungeons because you are filling groups for people that are actually queueing for those dungeons specifically, right?
The point is that ESO+ gets you, on average, longer daily randoms that are more likely to fail. Yes, the only point of the daily random reward is filling groups for people that select dungeons to PUG. But subbing should not be a penalty. And it doesn't help the PUGs much if a bunch of people quit as soon as they see the dungeon.
Subbing is not a penalty.
The game doesn't give people access to content they have not paid for, that is why they don't have it in their queue.
It has nothing to do with punishing ESO+.
It's about giving everyone access to content they paid to access. People who did not pay for access don't get it. People who did pay for access are matched with other people who paid for access.
It's only a being considered a punishment by people who pay for something they don't want and then want to get rewarded for helping anyone they can without actually helping anyone they can.
And anyone who says it's not about rewards must be either unaware they can already forgo the rewards and queue for all the base game dungeons, or it is about the rewards but they just don't want to say that IMO.
Because the one and only thing you don't get is the rewards for helping someone with every dungeon you are qualified to run, and the entire point of the rewards is to give you a bonus for helping someone else with what they need rather than picking the dungeons you want to run.Edited by spartaxoxo on February 3, 2022 10:04PM9 -
AlnilamE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭DaveMoeDee wrote: »xXSilverDragonXx wrote: »Some weeks ago I logged in and did eight random dungeons. Five of them were DLC. One was a lowbie leveling thus not DLC optional. That's a lot of DLC to end up in for the day. More than half. Almost 100% DLC in my randoms. . I unsubbed that day.
I've posted about this and while most want this quality of life change, there are always a few naysayers who blah blah blah something about randoms needing them to be truly random which is an argument that fails as people who are not giving ZOS $15 a month for plus do not have this 'feature'. There's also grumbles about how all the DLC are super easy on normal blah blah blah, but that doesn't account for 1) length of them which equates to them taking more time, regardless and 2) more mechanics and people don't bother explaining much of the time or don't read group chat if you try to explain to them and 3) fake tank, fake healers making them a special kind of hell because there are still mechanics involved and usually you need a tank and definitely most of them require healing.
I vote with my dollars. ZOS lost mine. I refuse to pay to end up with annoyances that people who don't pay don't have to deal with.
And frankly, while I think dlc in the queue for randoms should absolutely be a CHOICE if you have plus rather than forced on you, I also believe that transmutes should be adjusted. Vets should get 15. DLC should get 13 and non DLC should get 10. Vet DLC should get 18. Queue with DLC you get the higher amount. For some it will be worth it especially if they have many toons. For others who don't want the hassle or have some days where they don't, they have that choice to not do them.
This isn't rocket science. It's just being fair. ESO plus people should not have to pay for extra headaches they don't want.
I really believe they will make this kind of change. I believe it for two reasons:
They have made MANY wonderful quality of life changes over the years that most of us never imagined, and of course, they always did it when they found a way it could earn them money. But they have also done it when it was not about money, but rather the community really wanted it. Examples of that are:- Unlocking faction maps
- Making all zones adjust for cp 160 so we could have TES level of freedom to roam the land
- Transmutes to change traits
- Adding Housing
- Adding Companions
- Using transmutes now to make it so you never have to farm again
I have been on and off playing this game for over half a decade. When I come back from time off, I always find some very nice QoL changes they made. So I do believe they absolutely will do this at some point. They just need to understand how much it is bothering people who don't want to be forced into DLC and how much it is costing them from people who have either unsubbed or used it as one more reason they eventually stopped playing.
So what would be a reasonable duration for a random dungeon?
10 minutes? 15? 20? 30?
Should the game just give you the reward once you get to that time limit regardless of whether the dungeon is finished so you can bail on the group?
You understand that you are getting DLC dungeons because you are filling groups for people that are actually queueing for those dungeons specifically, right?
The point is that ESO+ gets you, on average, longer daily randoms that are more likely to fail. Yes, the only point of the daily random reward is filling groups for people that select dungeons to PUG. But subbing should not be a penalty. And it doesn't help the PUGs much if a bunch of people quit as soon as they see the dungeon.
I'm working on a project right now (which was sadly interrupted by a death in the family), but I ran over 100 randoms over the holidays and the average difference in length between a DLC and a non-DLC so far is 5 minutes.
People seem to underestimate how long dungeons that are not FG I or EH I take. And some of the more recent DLCs are pretty short if you are just going for straight completion.The Moot Councillor6 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭DaveMoeDee wrote: »xXSilverDragonXx wrote: »Some weeks ago I logged in and did eight random dungeons. Five of them were DLC. One was a lowbie leveling thus not DLC optional. That's a lot of DLC to end up in for the day. More than half. Almost 100% DLC in my randoms. . I unsubbed that day.
I've posted about this and while most want this quality of life change, there are always a few naysayers who blah blah blah something about randoms needing them to be truly random which is an argument that fails as people who are not giving ZOS $15 a month for plus do not have this 'feature'. There's also grumbles about how all the DLC are super easy on normal blah blah blah, but that doesn't account for 1) length of them which equates to them taking more time, regardless and 2) more mechanics and people don't bother explaining much of the time or don't read group chat if you try to explain to them and 3) fake tank, fake healers making them a special kind of hell because there are still mechanics involved and usually you need a tank and definitely most of them require healing.
I vote with my dollars. ZOS lost mine. I refuse to pay to end up with annoyances that people who don't pay don't have to deal with.
And frankly, while I think dlc in the queue for randoms should absolutely be a CHOICE if you have plus rather than forced on you, I also believe that transmutes should be adjusted. Vets should get 15. DLC should get 13 and non DLC should get 10. Vet DLC should get 18. Queue with DLC you get the higher amount. For some it will be worth it especially if they have many toons. For others who don't want the hassle or have some days where they don't, they have that choice to not do them.
This isn't rocket science. It's just being fair. ESO plus people should not have to pay for extra headaches they don't want.
I really believe they will make this kind of change. I believe it for two reasons:
They have made MANY wonderful quality of life changes over the years that most of us never imagined, and of course, they always did it when they found a way it could earn them money. But they have also done it when it was not about money, but rather the community really wanted it. Examples of that are:- Unlocking faction maps
- Making all zones adjust for cp 160 so we could have TES level of freedom to roam the land
- Transmutes to change traits
- Adding Housing
- Adding Companions
- Using transmutes now to make it so you never have to farm again
I have been on and off playing this game for over half a decade. When I come back from time off, I always find some very nice QoL changes they made. So I do believe they absolutely will do this at some point. They just need to understand how much it is bothering people who don't want to be forced into DLC and how much it is costing them from people who have either unsubbed or used it as one more reason they eventually stopped playing.
So what would be a reasonable duration for a random dungeon?
10 minutes? 15? 20? 30?
Should the game just give you the reward once you get to that time limit regardless of whether the dungeon is finished so you can bail on the group?
You understand that you are getting DLC dungeons because you are filling groups for people that are actually queueing for those dungeons specifically, right?
The point is that ESO+ gets you, on average, longer daily randoms that are more likely to fail. Yes, the only point of the daily random reward is filling groups for people that select dungeons to PUG. But subbing should not be a penalty. And it doesn't help the PUGs much if a bunch of people quit as soon as they see the dungeon.
I'm working on a project right now (which was sadly interrupted by a death in the family), but I ran over 100 randoms over the holidays and the average difference in length between a DLC and a non-DLC so far is 5 minutes.
People seem to underestimate how long dungeons that are not FG I or EH I take. And some of the more recent DLCs are pretty short if you are just going for straight completion.
I think that average dungeon length also depends a lot on skill of both the individual and the group. There's no such thing as a 2 hour FG 1 for me (not even on vet HM), even if the entire rest of the team stood their afk. But that's not everyone's experience. And I reference 2 hour FG 1 because I saw a tank player post about he ended up in one of those and proved it. His dps were just that bad. Sounds like a nightmare to me.Edited by spartaxoxo on February 3, 2022 10:09PM2 -
AlnilamE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »DaveMoeDee wrote: »xXSilverDragonXx wrote: »Some weeks ago I logged in and did eight random dungeons. Five of them were DLC. One was a lowbie leveling thus not DLC optional. That's a lot of DLC to end up in for the day. More than half. Almost 100% DLC in my randoms. . I unsubbed that day.
I've posted about this and while most want this quality of life change, there are always a few naysayers who blah blah blah something about randoms needing them to be truly random which is an argument that fails as people who are not giving ZOS $15 a month for plus do not have this 'feature'. There's also grumbles about how all the DLC are super easy on normal blah blah blah, but that doesn't account for 1) length of them which equates to them taking more time, regardless and 2) more mechanics and people don't bother explaining much of the time or don't read group chat if you try to explain to them and 3) fake tank, fake healers making them a special kind of hell because there are still mechanics involved and usually you need a tank and definitely most of them require healing.
I vote with my dollars. ZOS lost mine. I refuse to pay to end up with annoyances that people who don't pay don't have to deal with.
And frankly, while I think dlc in the queue for randoms should absolutely be a CHOICE if you have plus rather than forced on you, I also believe that transmutes should be adjusted. Vets should get 15. DLC should get 13 and non DLC should get 10. Vet DLC should get 18. Queue with DLC you get the higher amount. For some it will be worth it especially if they have many toons. For others who don't want the hassle or have some days where they don't, they have that choice to not do them.
This isn't rocket science. It's just being fair. ESO plus people should not have to pay for extra headaches they don't want.
I really believe they will make this kind of change. I believe it for two reasons:
They have made MANY wonderful quality of life changes over the years that most of us never imagined, and of course, they always did it when they found a way it could earn them money. But they have also done it when it was not about money, but rather the community really wanted it. Examples of that are:- Unlocking faction maps
- Making all zones adjust for cp 160 so we could have TES level of freedom to roam the land
- Transmutes to change traits
- Adding Housing
- Adding Companions
- Using transmutes now to make it so you never have to farm again
I have been on and off playing this game for over half a decade. When I come back from time off, I always find some very nice QoL changes they made. So I do believe they absolutely will do this at some point. They just need to understand how much it is bothering people who don't want to be forced into DLC and how much it is costing them from people who have either unsubbed or used it as one more reason they eventually stopped playing.
So what would be a reasonable duration for a random dungeon?
10 minutes? 15? 20? 30?
Should the game just give you the reward once you get to that time limit regardless of whether the dungeon is finished so you can bail on the group?
You understand that you are getting DLC dungeons because you are filling groups for people that are actually queueing for those dungeons specifically, right?
The point is that ESO+ gets you, on average, longer daily randoms that are more likely to fail. Yes, the only point of the daily random reward is filling groups for people that select dungeons to PUG. But subbing should not be a penalty. And it doesn't help the PUGs much if a bunch of people quit as soon as they see the dungeon.
I'm working on a project right now (which was sadly interrupted by a death in the family), but I ran over 100 randoms over the holidays and the average difference in length between a DLC and a non-DLC so far is 5 minutes.
People seem to underestimate how long dungeons that are not FG I or EH I take. And some of the more recent DLCs are pretty short if you are just going for straight completion.
I think that average dungeon length also depends a lot on skill of both the individual and the group. There's no such thing as a 2 hour FG 1 for me (not even on vet HM), even if the entire rest of the team stood their afk. But that's not everyone's experience. And I reference 2 hour FG 1 because I saw a tank player post about he ended up in one of those and proved it. His dps were just that bad. Sounds like a nightmare to me.
Oh, absolutely!
I have 3 runs of Ruins of Mazzatun in my sample so far and they were 12, 15 and 41 minutes respectively. That last run was with 2 players that were new to the dungeon, one of which was having connection issues and crashed several times.
Some dungeons, like Liar of Maarselok and Unhallowed Grave are longer anyway, but some of the DLC dungeons are pretty short.
I'm also trying to keep my data standardized, so I only count runs with my templar healer that I queued up for solo. My goal is to get to 500 runs to have a reasonable sample size.The Moot Councillor6 -
RaveRaveRaveRave✭✭✭I wish there was more tiers of rewards. Like I'll queue for just DLC Dungeon randoms and do the hardmode (if my team is capable) for bonus rewards...and have a bum base-game queue for minimal rewards. Def should get more transmute crystals when I do a recent DLC hardmode random than a 7 year old base game one that I can solo.0
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FlopsyPrince✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭What is being ignored by the supporters of the way things are is that many players auto quit these dungeons, making finishing them even harder. It would be fine to keep them if everyone stayed, but they do not.PC
PS4/PS51 -
kargen27✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭"People who are dismissive of these kinds of posts rarely acknowledge that last part. They talk about "random," but the randomness in the queue is the pairing. The dungeon chosen is regularly not at all random. It is often a dungeon one of the people picked. "
I can group with three other people and we can join the queue and get the daily bonus if we don't select a particular dungeon. If I select a preferred dungeon and get random players I do not get the bonus. They will get the bonus if they selected random dungeon. The queue is there to help fill groups. The rewards are a bit of incentive to join the queue.
If the queue isn't used to fill groups there is no point in having the queue.and then the parrot said, "must be the water mines green too."5
