Need Confirmation: Is Motif farming a bannable offense?

steven_shidiwenb16_ESO · April 2014

LadyDestiny wrote: »

Moroch wrote: »

steven_shidiwenb16_ESO wrote: »

Send me some of that Motif love @Moroch

Isn't there a problem with the color variations of these in the veteran gear all Daedric, primal, barbaric coming out green or so I had been reading. If that is the case.........lol I would not pay 2 gold for one till it is fixed. The lower end armors look just find to me

You mean that?

Vehadrah · April 2014

I wouldn't think so. So long as you are not botting to do it.

Laerian · April 2014

I thought I had seen ugly toons...For being someone who's been bragging all night at least wear something decent for god's sake.

Note: usually I don't use the word "toon"

Tipsy · April 2014

Moroch wrote: »

steven_shidiwenb16_ESO wrote: »

Send me some of that Motif love @Moroch

10x the amount I have and I play constantly and earned my money the hard way
When someone asks 60K for ancient elves 50k for deadric and 40k for barbaric
I say goodbye and goodluck

I'd rather find it myself

Tipsy · April 2014

Perhaps that is what the bots in Coldharbour rags teleporting to certain indoor chests are after? Now that public dungeon bosses have been altered?

I find it hard to imagine that anyone would pay that amount but well if someone wants to spend their hard earned cash on something trivial like this to feed these greedy, its their problem.

steven_shidiwenb16_ESO · April 2014

Tipsy wrote: »

Perhaps that is what the bots in Coldharbour rags teleporting to certain indoor chests are after? Now that public dungeon bosses have been altered?

I find it hard to imagine that anyone would pay that amount but well if someone wants to spend their hard earned cash on something trivial like this to feed these greedy, its their problem.

Not complaining, you shouldn't either. One of these days those people will fill your pocket with GOLLDDDD.

reggielee · April 2014

using game mechanics to reset resources infinitely should be a banable offense

Moroch · April 2014

reggielee wrote: »

using game mechanics to reset resources infinitely should be a banable offense

Greeny said it was fine. Stop crying.

[Deleted User] · April 2014

The user and all related content has been deleted.

Sanspoof · April 2014

AngryOlek wrote: »

Those worrying about a nerf, worry no longer, it happened.

So this is why I haven't found a nightstand, desk or cabinet that isn't either empty or has lockpicks in since moving to Reaper's March? I just reached vr1 yesterday and it's so bad I was about to report it as a bug. Is this a fix? Making containers completely useless?

steven_shidiwenb16_ESO · April 2014

Spectral_Lord wrote: »

Moroch wrote: »

steven_shidiwenb16_ESO wrote: »

Send me some of that Motif love @Moroch

He said it is an older picture. There's no way to tell if he still has those, as he said he has 1 million gold now. PM him/her, easier to get an answer that way.

Yea they are all gone, i did give a few away to people. Don't think they will be as easily found now.

Tipsy · April 2014

steven_shidiwenb16_ESO wrote: »

Not complaining, you shouldn't either. One of these days those people will fill your pocket with GOLLDDDD.

I think they'd rather exploit it and try to rob clueless players of their hard earned coin.
While they can sit back and laugh as their bank is full of rare deadric/ancient elf/barbaric motifs..
I'd like to see the look on their face when these ever become buyable in the game store xD
Or when there comes a personal instance with the choice to become vampire /werewolf
since I see they ask 20K for just a bite in public chat

Finito exploiting.

AngryOlek · April 2014

It seems this was fixed in the last 12ish hours. For about a day roughly I was getting what seemed like a 5% chance on each container to contain loot. But now, it seems it's back to normal, I'm hoping it was a mistake on their part and this wasn't an early roll out of how they intend to reduce the rarity of motifs.

I'm really hoping they don't do the same to recipes though, the amount of recipes compared to motifs is crazy, and the majority of the recipes are arguably less useful than motifs. You get to use the racial style forever, on all tiers and as much as you want. Yet the recipes(besides 50+ recipes)all basically become useless after you level past them, nobody buys food at the lower levels.

Considering the game has a few hundred recipes across all factions and that motifs have only 14 universally, please, to any staff reading this: consider making recipes MORE common while increasing the rarity of motifs. I found TEN motifs before I found a single blue recipe, and I had that recipe already! It took me over 5 days of advertising and checking containers to find the last blue recipe I needed for my prior tier.

Malediktus · April 2014

I think green recipes are common enough. Blue seems to be as common as the regular motifs 1-9 and purple noticeable more rare.
I farmed chests for an hour today and had 4 motifs, 6 blue recipes, like 40 green ones and no purple ones.

AngryOlek · April 2014

Malediktus wrote: »

I think green recipes are common enough. Blue seems to be as common as the regular motifs 1-9 and purple noticeable more rare.
I farmed chests for an hour today and had 4 motifs, 6 blue recipes, like 40 green ones and no purple ones.

You have far better luck than me with recipes, but consider the point I made about the number differences between motifs and recipes. You had an almost equal amount of motifs and blue recipes, yet there is a very large difference between the amount of recipes in game vs the amount of motifs, and again motifs are far more useful(and valuable)until end game. And even then purple food sells for what, 100-200 gp for a serving? The rare motifs will keep their high value for a while to come.

Also yeah green recipes are common as heck, I concur. My issue is mostly just with the blue and purple ones.

Malediktus · April 2014

Maybe food would be more valuable if provisioning ingredients wouldnt exist in overabundance and if provisiong wouldnt be the fastest and easiest to get to lvl 50. If you want to make money with provisioning you should ask them to make it harder (both aquisation of recipes and materials and the level up process).

AngryOlek · April 2014

Actually, some provisioning mats are impossible to find and are based off a lottery system. Oats and Tomatoes work this way, and are both used in high end purple recipes.

You have to remember that my points are about the incoming nerf, which will hit both motifs and provisioning equally. Don't kid yourself, nobody makes money with provisioning, not since they cut the prices you can sell stuff for in half.

So, it already is a crazy pain to get certain ingredients, why should recipes be as hard if not harder to get as well? As I said, basically nobody uses provisioning as a major or probably even a minor source of income. Increasing the difficulty does nothing to change that.

You are confusing difficulty with usefulness, purple and blue recipes are better than greens, sure, but in such a way to demand such problems making or acquiring them?
No, not by a long shot.

Also I'd like to add, asking for even more nerfs is why certain things are busted in this game, it is a very negative attitude and does not equalize the important issues. Please don't cloud the problem.

Arsenic_Touch · April 2014

"Improvements" for motifs.... gotta love it when improvements are a nerf to the drop rates. Looks like everyone that didn't rush to veteran content is going to be screwed. Surprise surprise.

pecheckler · April 2014

That is completely unfair that you're going to decrease rare motif drop rates. Stop making changes that are bad for casual players when ESO is the go-to casual MMORPG.

Valn · April 2014

It should be ban-able

Players are doing things that weren't meant to be intended for players to do for their own benefit to basically get unlimited chances of getting these items. It's an exploit fair and square

AngryOlek · April 2014

Valn wrote: »

It should be ban-able

Players are doing things that weren't meant to be intended for players to do for their own benefit to basically get unlimited chances of getting these items. It's an exploit fair and square

Exploit is a very vague term. For mmos, it is based off what the developers and majority of the player base believe. In this case, and many other similar cases on this forum(boss farming)it has been recognized as not being an exploit.

You are part of the very vocal minority, and just because you don't want to do such things personally, doesn't mean others should be banned for it.

Also your last statement is a bit silly, you do realize that grinding/farming is still very much a part of this game, should you choose it to be, right? You may not like it, I may not like it, but it's an established mmo concept and most players do like it, or don't care. Personally, I think it's boring, but why should I attempt to restrict others from doing so?

Final point: How exactly can you say that the act of looting items was never intended to provide a benefit to the player....looting the items? Everything in the game has "unlimited chances" because it's an mmo. That's the point of an mmo.

Tipsy · April 2014

Is it really a vague term?

"exploit 'using something to one's own advantage'
Taking advantage of a vulnerability in order to cause unintended or unanticipated behaviour to occur on computer software.
Such behavior frequently includes things like gaining controle of a computer system,allowing privilege escalation,or a denial of service attack"

Concerning your final point,I think its more a matter of privilege escalation and gaining controle of the ingame economy through exploiting the game system.
Trying to take the hard earned money of players by selling easily farmed motifs which are supposed to be rare=privilege escalation,using this to one's own advantage,thus an exploit.
Just like selling vampire bites for 20K are attempts to exploit fellow players within the game by denial of service,or rather denail ofcontent here that should be available to them as much as it is to you...

Which in turn allures some players to turn to cheating because the reward as was intended by the gamedesign has little weight compared to the escalated economy.
Or perhaps its safe to say that these kinds of expoits result in market price escalations.
Luckily guildstores might be somewhat of a solution to this,although most of the prices asked in public will be laughable at best.

Rotherhans · April 2014

Uhm, just quoting this again ..

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

This is not something we consider an exploit or bannable offense. Though it's working as designed, we do intend to make some improvements to the current design.

Some people don´t seem to get how irrelevant their opinions are on what constitutes fair or unfair in this MMO.

The official answer has been given.
This is how you have to treat this "problem" from now on.

Which obviously means to log the frack out of the Glenumbra bank NOW until again they nerf the whole thing into utter uselessness.

Tipsy · April 2014

I'm glad that they recognize that it needs "improvement"
But I don't take that quote for the answer

Cpt_Teemo · April 2014

Tipsy wrote: »

Is it really a vague term?

"exploit 'using something to one's own advantage'
Taking advantage of a vulnerability in order to cause unintended or unanticipated behaviour to occur on computer software.
Such behavior frequently includes things like gaining controle of a computer system,allowing privilege escalation,or a denial of service attack"

Concerning your final point,I think its more a matter of privilege escalation and gaining controle of the ingame economy through exploiting the game system.
Trying to take the hard earned money of players by selling easily farmed motifs which are suppos ed to be rare=privilege escalation,using this to one's own advantage,thus an exploit.
Just like selling vampire bites for 20K are attempts to exploit fellow players within the game by denial of service,or rather denail ofcontent here that should be available to them as much as it is to you...

Which in turn allures some players to turn to cheating because the reward as was intended by the gamedesign has little weight compared to the escalated economy.
Or perhaps its safe to say that these kinds of expoits result in market price escalations.
Luckily guildstores might be somewhat of a solution to this,although most of the prices asked in public will be laughable at best.

Did I miss something there? Trying to take money, really its your choice whether to buy it or not, no ones forcing anyone to obtain anything in the game.

Valn · April 2014

AngryOlek wrote: »

Valn wrote: »

It should be ban-able

Players are doing things that weren't meant to be intended for players to do for their own benefit to basically get unlimited chances of getting these items. It's an exploit fair and square

Exploit is a very vague term. For mmos, it is based off what the developers and majority of the player base believe. In this case, and many other similar cases on this forum(boss farming)it has been recognized as not being an exploit.

You are part of the very vocal minority, and just because you don't want to do such things personally, doesn't mean others should be banned for it.

Also your last statement is a bit silly, you do realize that grinding/farming is still very much a part of this game, should you choose it to be, right? You may not like it, I may not like it, but it's an established mmo concept and most players do like it, or don't care. Personally, I think it's boring, but why should I attempt to restrict others from doing so?

Final point: How exactly can you say that the act of looting items was never intended to provide a benefit to the player....looting the items? Everything in the game has "unlimited chances" because it's an mmo. That's the point of an mmo.

The point of an mmo does not mean logging out and in again in order to reset resources. And you're wrong, looting the items from a house you'll only get limited chances for that house, but if you're constantly logging out and back in again in the same house to reset the crates then you'll get as many chances as you desire, which isn't fair.

It's an exploit. Simple. You are deliberately bypassing the games intended systems in order to have an advantage.

Boss farming is different because you're not logging out, you're just waiting for the mobs to spawn again, which is normal. But imagine if it takes 5 minutes to spawn the boss, instead you decide to log out and back in again in order to spawn the boss instantly, that's an exploit.

Tipsy · April 2014

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Trying to take money, really its your choice whether to buy it or not, no ones forcing anyone to obtain anything in the game.

they try to scam player and apparently sometimes succeed to get these amounts of money for rare things they had no effort obtaining themselves.(otherwise they wouldn't keep asking these prices,trying to make them the standard prices)
Its not about who gives in and who not;
its the privilege escalation of these exploiters that is the problem

Bandits who'd ask a toll to pass could also say "no one is forced to use this road,we're not forcing anyone to do so"
It does not justify that behavior at all.
The difference with the vampire bite exploiting is that here people have been exploiting this vulnerability in the gamesystem to gain this domination,
escalated privilage,mass distribution and profit for an item that supposes to be rare,screwing with the whole game economy in the process

the vampire bite selling and easily farmed rare motif selling
are in a way paywalls set up by some exploiters who think they have more privileges than other players.
They want the easy fast way to rich by scamming ,attempting to scam fair players who work hard,so hard for the money xD
Although I think this one has a heavier impact than the vamp thing going on..if you give 20k for a vampire bite you're not smart,sorry.

Blackwidow · April 2014

Kn1ghtmare wrote: »

Ok we finally need to hear this from the Dev's and I will bump until will get a clearcut answer cause I'm sick of hearing about all the mixed responses, okay Is it bannable to farm Motifs by using the games mechanics?

We all do it to some degree. Who does not log onto a character and check boxes?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byVrloNIcKQ

KerinKor · April 2014

Jonnymorrow wrote: »

Logging in and out many times flags your account as suspicious. Since certain other exploits require you to do that.

If they banned me for farming motifs id laugh and be on my way.

It's ironic that repeated logging in and out is WAI, forced on us by crass limitations on inventory and bank space.

WitchAngel · April 2014

lol@zos claiming the economy ain't broke.