The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
Nerf warden
Pauls
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Automatic free purge that can be spammed, unblockable melee aoe stun on top of hp based heal. C'mon, you all know about it.
14
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Sanctum74✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Free purge only removes 1 random effect and costs a global cool down, the stun requires you to be in melee the full duration and rarely works, and the heal is getting a huge nerf so let’s wait a week to see how the changes work before asking for more nerfs.
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Pauls✭✭✭✭✭
Betty Netch: Duration: [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Call a betty netch to your side, which grants you Major Brutality and Sorcery, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20% for [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Every 5 seconds, the netch removes 1 negative effect from you.Free purge only removes 1 random effect and costs a global cool down
Are we playing same game?10 -
Sanctum74✭✭✭✭✭
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Betty Netch: Duration: [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Call a betty netch to your side, which grants you Major Brutality and Sorcery, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20% for [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Every 5 seconds, the netch removes 1 negative effect from you.Free purge only removes 1 random effect and costs a global cool down
Are we playing same game?
Yes every 5 seconds or spam it, regardless it only removes 1 random effect. I can easily get 10+ status effects in 5 seconds so removing 1 is far from being op.
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Rhaegar75✭✭✭✭✭It’s undeniable that Wardens are overtuned... the problem is the inherent ability to be very tanky and deal damage without any major efforts from the actual human counterpart wielding keyboard and mouse.
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Kaysha✭✭✭✭When you see that players start to choose only between two of 6 classes in PvP, you know that something with these classes is wrong.20 -
Arbiter7070✭✭✭Warden is definitely way too powerful right now.. ZOS really needs to evaluate the wardens entire and make some changes. For instance why does the Warden get minor toughness for 20 seconds from using any heal including their Betty netch? Who decided to give this class the single best heal in the game and then on top of that, 10% more HP at all times? Animal companions passives give recovery and damage. Frost passives give more armor, 10% more magic and frost damage. They legit designed this class to not just do everything well, but the best. No proc Cyro is getting run through by Wardens rn and it’s because they are far and away the best class in the game. This 20% nerf to arctic winds coming isn’t going to do much to change this because Arctic winds isn’t the total problem. The problem is the way the class was designed.10
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DrSlaughtr✭✭✭✭✭
✭Netch should be stripped of purge and add a cost. There's no other skill in the game I can think of that gives that much resource restore with no cost plus free buffs plus free cleanse that you can cheese the cooldown by spamming.
Everyone else has to pay a price to cleanse. Warden shouldn't be any different.
Sub assault needs to be adjusted. It currently has no vertical limit. You can be on a third floor and a sub assault on the ground will hit you. It's dumb. It does crazy damage. Something needs to give.
I play a stam warden. It's easy mode. And most people are now playing either warden or, to a lesser disagree, necro. Wanna see an unstoppable 30+ warden zerg taking an entire map during prime time? Come to XB NA.I drink and I stream things.
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Thraben✭✭✭✭✭Wardens are already getting a 20% nerf on artic blast, which I am very happy about.
Won't do anything, there are at least 3 Warden skills of similar power, healing- wise. Blast was just the simplest to use.
At this point I would take away the AoE effect of SubAssault - if a class is strong as a solo class, makes up 75% of small scale groups, and is the only class to be stacked in groups larger than 4, something has to be done.Edited by Thraben on May 24, 2021 1:06PMHauptmann der Dolche des Königs
DDK ist die letzte Verteidigungslinie des Dolchsturz- Bündnisses auf der 30-Tage-No-CP- Kampagne(EU) mit dem Anspruch, in kleinen, anfängerfreundlichen Raid-Gruppen möglichst epische Schlachten auszufechten.
DDK is the Daggerfall Covenant´s last line of defense on the 30 days no-cp campaign (EU). We intend to fight epic battles in small, casual player friendly raid groups.4 -
xylena_lazarow✭✭✭✭✭
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Necro Expunge, which likewise deserves a massive nerf. Or just ban necro and warden from PvP.TheEndBringer wrote: »There's no other skill in the game I can think of that gives that much resource restore with no cost plus free buffs plus free cleanse that you can cheese the cooldown by spamming.PC/NA || CP/Cyro || RIP soft caps4 -
Tommy_The_Gun✭✭✭✭✭
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3 - 5 status effects on any other class are kinda like Death sentence... I mean curse, mage's wrath, dot, snare or stun... but I guess it is fine if one class can just ignore it lol...
Betty Netch: Duration: [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Call a betty netch to your side, which grants you Major Brutality and Sorcery, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20% for [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Every 5 seconds, the netch removes 1 negative effect from you.Free purge only removes 1 random effect and costs a global cool down
Are we playing same game?
Yes every 5 seconds or spam it, regardless it only removes 1 random effect. I can easily get 10+ status effects in 5 seconds so removing 1 is far from being op.
Edited by Tommy_The_Gun on May 24, 2021 1:24PM0 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
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Betty Netch: Duration: [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Call a betty netch to your side, which grants you Major Brutality and Sorcery, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20% for [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Every 5 seconds, the netch removes 1 negative effect from you.Free purge only removes 1 random effect and costs a global cool down
Are we playing same game?
Yes every 5 seconds or spam it, regardless it only removes 1 random effect. I can easily get 10+ status effects in 5 seconds so removing 1 is far from being op.
You make it sound like it's no big deal. Class has been top tier since the day it hit the servers and Warden mains will still downplay how good their kit is.Edited by Joy_Division on May 24, 2021 1:58PM6 -
Sanctum74✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »
Betty Netch: Duration: [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Call a betty netch to your side, which grants you Major Brutality and Sorcery, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20% for [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Every 5 seconds, the netch removes 1 negative effect from you.Free purge only removes 1 random effect and costs a global cool down
Are we playing same game?
Yes every 5 seconds or spam it, regardless it only removes 1 random effect. I can easily get 10+ status effects in 5 seconds so removing 1 is far from being op.
You make it sound like it's no big deal. Class has been top tier since the day it hit the servers and Warden mains will still downplay how good their kit is.
I’d be all for adding a cost to netch, but I hardly think the skill is op. You can easily add more status effects much quicker than a warden can remove them.
Personally I think their biggest strength is healing. They have access to more hots and burst heals then any other class. They get toughness health buff when healed, and all their animal skills heal them when they expire.
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martinhpb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Something needs to be done because to me Cyro is in the worst state it has ever been.
The Warden meta is worse even than the tank meta, at least there was more than one class to choose from.
It's getting to be boring as hell
Sorry there are no suggestions in this post, but I'm tired of making them and being ignored
Edited by martinhpb16_ESO on May 24, 2021 5:05PMAt least the spelling is difficult for you.
Hew's Bane*5 -
Nord_Raseri✭✭✭✭✭
✭They really do need to buff the underperforming classes. Seeing them nerfed constantly(mine included) has me beyond nerf-fatigued(which is why I'll forever be a voice against nerfs, and zos nerfs with a warhead).Veit ég aðég hékk vindga meiði á nætr allar níu, geiri undaðr og gefinn Oðni, sjálfr sjálfum mér, á þeim meiði er manngi veit hvers hann af rótum rennr.3 -
WoppaBoem✭✭✭✭✭Other Classes need to be buffed,
And please note my warden build as of today will be hit hard next patch. Ice heal nerf, nerf to health recovery, nerf to malacath, last patch addressed the heavy armor being way to OP.
Its good steps are made 100% but as it now wait and see what the meta will be of next patch and move one.
One fact remains they are paid classes and seems to be very much favored by the dev team.Xbox EU & NA - PVP Only4 -
xylena_lazarow✭✭✭✭✭
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I often hear devs say that players are much better at identifying problems than suggesting solutions, so you're forgiven. [snip]martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »Sorry there are no suggestions in this post
[Edited to remove Petition/Protest]Edited by ZOS_ConnorG on May 25, 2021 4:19PMPC/NA || CP/Cyro || RIP soft caps1 -
WrathOfInnos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »
Betty Netch: Duration: [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Call a betty netch to your side, which grants you Major Brutality and Sorcery, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20% for [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Every 5 seconds, the netch removes 1 negative effect from you.Free purge only removes 1 random effect and costs a global cool down
Are we playing same game?
Yes every 5 seconds or spam it, regardless it only removes 1 random effect. I can easily get 10+ status effects in 5 seconds so removing 1 is far from being op.
You make it sound like it's no big deal. Class has been top tier since the day it hit the servers and Warden mains will still downplay how good their kit is.
I’d be all for adding a cost to netch, but I hardly think the skill is op. You can easily add more status effects much quicker than a warden can remove them.
Personally I think their biggest strength is healing. They have access to more hots and burst heals then any other class. They get toughness health buff when healed, and all their animal skills heal them when they expire.
I don’t think a cost on Netch would be good. It’s primarily a sustain tool, and one of the worst in the game, restoring only 4.4K Magicka over 25s. Dark Conversion returns 6k over 20s, Channeled Focus and Siphoning Attacks are well over 5k after subtracting out the initial cost. If anything the Netch should give about 1k more resource return over its duration.
I could see a nerf to free Purge spam (although IMO this is a poor use of a GCD, to the point I didn’t know it existed because it seemed pointless to try). Maybe make the first purge occur a few seconds after cast. Or if the initial cast cost 2k to prevent spam, then it should restore an additional 2-3k over 25s.1 -
INe_Saninus✭✭✭WrathOfInnos wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »
Betty Netch: Duration: [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Call a betty netch to your side, which grants you Major Brutality and Sorcery, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20% for [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Every 5 seconds, the netch removes 1 negative effect from you.Free purge only removes 1 random effect and costs a global cool down
Are we playing same game?
Yes every 5 seconds or spam it, regardless it only removes 1 random effect. I can easily get 10+ status effects in 5 seconds so removing 1 is far from being op.
You make it sound like it's no big deal. Class has been top tier since the day it hit the servers and Warden mains will still downplay how good their kit is.
I’d be all for adding a cost to netch, but I hardly think the skill is op. You can easily add more status effects much quicker than a warden can remove them.
Personally I think their biggest strength is healing. They have access to more hots and burst heals then any other class. They get toughness health buff when healed, and all their animal skills heal them when they expire.
I don’t think a cost on Netch would be good. It’s primarily a sustain tool, and one of the worst in the game, restoring only 4.4K Magicka over 25s. Dark Conversion returns 6k over 20s, Channeled Focus and Siphoning Attacks are well over 5k after subtracting out the initial cost. If anything the Netch should give about 1k more resource return over its duration.
I could see a nerf to free Purge spam (although IMO this is a poor use of a GCD, to the point I didn’t know it existed because it seemed pointless to try). Maybe make the first purge occur a few seconds after cast. Or if the initial cast cost 2k to prevent spam, then it should restore an additional 2-3k over 25s.
See... but it's not a poor use of a global cooldown.
Pvp doesn't work like parsing on a dummy.
When solo or small scale you're going to have to use line of sight. Reposition. Wait for your burst to line up.
There is a lot of time that once your buffs are reapplied and your HOTs are up, you don't have anything else to do.
It isn't time to go offensive yet.
It's extremely comfortable to spam a few netches in that time to clear 2-4 dots.
You don't spam most abilities when solo or small scale.
Managing your resources CORRECTLY is one of the hardest things to learn.
...now, if you're zerging. Sure. I could see that.Edited by INe_Saninus on May 24, 2021 5:37PM2 -
DrSlaughtr✭✭✭✭✭
✭WrathOfInnos wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »
Betty Netch: Duration: [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Call a betty netch to your side, which grants you Major Brutality and Sorcery, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20% for [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Every 5 seconds, the netch removes 1 negative effect from you.Free purge only removes 1 random effect and costs a global cool down
Are we playing same game?
Yes every 5 seconds or spam it, regardless it only removes 1 random effect. I can easily get 10+ status effects in 5 seconds so removing 1 is far from being op.
You make it sound like it's no big deal. Class has been top tier since the day it hit the servers and Warden mains will still downplay how good their kit is.
I’d be all for adding a cost to netch, but I hardly think the skill is op. You can easily add more status effects much quicker than a warden can remove them.
Personally I think their biggest strength is healing. They have access to more hots and burst heals then any other class. They get toughness health buff when healed, and all their animal skills heal them when they expire.
I don’t think a cost on Netch would be good. It’s primarily a sustain tool, and one of the worst in the game, restoring only 4.4K Magicka over 25s. Dark Conversion returns 6k over 20s, Channeled Focus and Siphoning Attacks are well over 5k after subtracting out the initial cost. If anything the Netch should give about 1k more resource return over its duration.
I could see a nerf to free Purge spam (although IMO this is a poor use of a GCD, to the point I didn’t know it existed because it seemed pointless to try). Maybe make the first purge occur a few seconds after cast. Or if the initial cast cost 2k to prevent spam, then it should restore an additional 2-3k over 25s.
If all it did was restore resources, totally keep it free. There are other free skills that do the same.
Resorting Aura/Repentance for example. They only give resources and minor recovery buffs.
Netch meanwhile gives you free, spammable cleanse, free Major Brutality, and resources. That's an imbalance.
Either strip away one of those effects or add a cost.
They could also remove the ability to cleanse on spam. If you spam before the 5 second cool down it doesn't remove an effect.
Currently wardens have no real weakness. That is the major issue. With the base game classes they all have significant weaknesses. Warden not only has none but they are the easiest class to play, leading to the current situation where a majority of players are griefing with one class.
I drink and I stream things.
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WrathOfInnos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭TheEndBringer wrote: »They could also remove the ability to cleanse on spam. If you spam before the 5 second cool down it doesn't remove an effect.
Yes, even the first Purge at 5s would be ok IMO. I get the impression its current form wasn’t intended as a spammable Purge, more as a gradual shedding of negative effects over time. Just don’t hit Warden sustain, especially in PVE, it’s bad enough already.
To elaborate on spamming Netch purge, I don’t believe there’s any scenario this is worth doing currently. It removes 1 negative effect, and your opponent is certainly going to be applying more than that as you apply zero pressure and barely heal yourself.Edited by WrathOfInnos on May 24, 2021 5:47PM1 -
xylena_lazarow✭✭✭✭✭
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None of those grant a major damage buff, try comparing Netch to Igneous Weapons. If you're a dk, it's okay to cry now. That said, there's no single skill causing wardens to take over the meta, their entire PvP kit is packed full of overtuned, overloaded, or otherwise strictly better versions of other class abilities. Here's what definitely needs to happen:WrathOfInnos wrote: »It’s primarily a sustain tool, and one of the worst in the game, restoring only 4.4K Magicka over 25s. Dark Conversion returns 6k over 20s, Channeled Focus and Siphoning Attacks are well over 5k after subtracting out the initial cost.
Shalks needs to respect the z-axis, and the invisible free cast needs a telegraph.PC/NA || CP/Cyro || RIP soft caps4 -
Pauwer✭✭✭✭✭No nerfs, just make the other classes better, like the way they used to be before warden and necro. Of course this wont happen as long as you gotta pay for these two classes, but one can wish.2
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Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »
Betty Netch: Duration: [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Call a betty netch to your side, which grants you Major Brutality and Sorcery, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20% for [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Every 5 seconds, the netch removes 1 negative effect from you.Free purge only removes 1 random effect and costs a global cool down
Are we playing same game?
Yes every 5 seconds or spam it, regardless it only removes 1 random effect. I can easily get 10+ status effects in 5 seconds so removing 1 is far from being op.
You make it sound like it's no big deal. Class has been top tier since the day it hit the servers and Warden mains will still downplay how good their kit is.
I’d be all for adding a cost to netch, but I hardly think the skill is op. You can easily add more status effects much quicker than a warden can remove them.
Personally I think their biggest strength is healing. They have access to more hots and burst heals then any other class. They get toughness health buff when healed, and all their animal skills heal them when they expire.
The skill or wardens don't need a nerf.
It would be nice if Warden mains stopped pretending as if their class is mediocre (it never was) or their kit is relatively comparable to the four original classes (not by a long shot. Their only comp is Necro).
It would be nicer if someone at ZOS took a step back and asked themselves, "why is it after years and multiple balance patches no matter what our two stamina versions of new classes have always been top tier?" and then threw away the spreadsheets that have been dictating class "balance."Edited by Joy_Division on May 25, 2021 1:43PM2 -
Sanctum74✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »
Betty Netch: Duration: [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Call a betty netch to your side, which grants you Major Brutality and Sorcery, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20% for [19 / 20 / 21 / 22] seconds. Every 5 seconds, the netch removes 1 negative effect from you.Free purge only removes 1 random effect and costs a global cool down
Are we playing same game?
Yes every 5 seconds or spam it, regardless it only removes 1 random effect. I can easily get 10+ status effects in 5 seconds so removing 1 is far from being op.
You make it sound like it's no big deal. Class has been top tier since the day it hit the servers and Warden mains will still downplay how good their kit is.
I’d be all for adding a cost to netch, but I hardly think the skill is op. You can easily add more status effects much quicker than a warden can remove them.
Personally I think their biggest strength is healing. They have access to more hots and burst heals then any other class. They get toughness health buff when healed, and all their animal skills heal them when they expire.
The skill or wardens don't need a nerf.
It would be nice if Warden mains stopped pretending as if their class is mediocre (it never was) or their kit is relatively comparable to the four original classes (not by a long shot. Their only comp is Necro).
It would be nicer if someone at ZOS took a step back and asked themselves, "why is it after years and multiple balance patches no matter what our two stamina versions of new classes have always been top tier?" and then threw away the spreadsheets that have been dictating class "balance."
Warden isn’t my main and I never once said they were mediocre so I’m not sure why you keep bringing that up in your responses to me.
The only thing I argued about was netch and how you can get far more status effects than is possible to purge since people kept saying spamming netch was op. If people are going to make nerf threads then they should at least understand how the class works.
If I was defending the class so much then I wouldn’t have mentioned a cost increase as well looking at the class passives and all of the heals it has access to.
As far as spreadsheets go I do agree it doesn’t follow their own reasoning and one could argue because they are pay classes, but personally I think spreadsheet balancing was a terrible idea and just ended up nerfing and homogenizing the base classes.
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Arbiter7070✭✭✭
[/quote]
I don’t think a cost on Netch would be good. It’s primarily a sustain tool, and one of the worst in the game, restoring only 4.4K Magicka over 25s. Dark Conversion returns 6k over 20s, Channeled Focus and Siphoning Attacks are well over 5k after subtracting out the initial cost. If anything the Netch should give about 1k more resource return over its duration.
I could see a nerf to free Purge spam (although IMO this is a poor use of a GCD, to the point I didn’t know it existed because it seemed pointless to try). Maybe make the first purge occur a few seconds after cast. Or if the initial cast cost 2k to prevent spam, then it should restore an additional 2-3k over 25s.[/quote]
I disagree highly. The Betty netch is a completely overloaded skill and to not have a cost to that is insane. How can you say something that gives major brut/sorc plus sustain and a purge should be free of cost? That should cost the exact same as the DK’s molten armaments. Every other class has to pay a price for those kind of buffs but wardens get them as a free spammable? Just because the sustain isn’t quite as good as some other abilities doesn’t mean it should be a freebie. It has other functions that make it powerful. The sustain is just a bonus.
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LightYagami✭✭✭✭✭Netch:
One single skill giving you:
1. FREE purge
2. FREE buff
3. FREE regeneration
Please feel free to spam as it's completely FREE OF COST.No improvement on Cyrodill servers -> no ESO plus renewal.2 -
Marcus_Aurelius✭✭✭✭✭yeah, spam the skill that does zero damage and zero healing while others hit you, such a great idea!
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LightYagami✭✭✭✭✭Marcus_Aurelius wrote: »yeah, spam the skill that does zero damage and zero healing while others hit you, such a great idea!
I guess you know how expensive PURGE is for other classes comparing to Wardens who can access with ZERO cost?
Why didn't you mention the Major Brutality and Sorcery for ZERO cost?
Why didn't you mention the Stamina / Magicka regen for ZERO cost?
Why didn't you mention the Health regen from the Animal Companions skill line passive that you can spam netch for ZERO cost?
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Betty_Netch_(skill)
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Bond_With_NatureNo improvement on Cyrodill servers -> no ESO plus renewal.2