Would you refuse a healer based on race?

noblecron · January 2021

No

I've had a khajiit healer before they even had the change to racials and I was brought on vet content. My Dunmer necro also says hi!

ATomiX69 · January 2021

No

The only time race matters is in the highest of the high end content, literally the top 0.1% of people pushing new world record scores and times in vet trials and arenas, so 99.9% of the time, the race would not have enough impact (on a healer) to matter.
For other roles race would have more impact sure, but also a good player with the worst race possible will always outperform an decent player with the "meta" race.

Dark_Lord_Kuro · January 2021

No

As long has they do their part i coulnt care lees about what a healer play

VaranisArano · January 2021

Ryuvain wrote: »

Syldras wrote: »

Ryuvain wrote: »

I will never understand why some enjoy role-playing racism.

Not sure if it would become too off-topic if we discuss this here... But do I make snarky remarks about humans and betmer from time to time when roleplaying a Dunmer. It's more a kind of ironic taunting (extremely self-ironic if nagging about humans, actually) and I'm not running around molesting random players or something. Why do I do it? It's an unfortunate part of my characters' mindset, based on the influence of growing up on Vvardenfell - the traditions, the common way of thinking, and so on. If you grow up in that society, isolated from the rest of Tamriel for a long time, and the only strangers you ever saw were mostly slaves, and you were taught that they were nothing more than that, maybe even that they weren't really sentient beings - how likely would it be then to see humans and beastfolk as equals? No so much, I assume (at least when you start your journey and haven't travelled much so far). And I'm interested in playing some "average" person, not the only one super-educated super-openminded exception of his whole people. That said, I don't just walk around and think of Argonians as slaves, I try to see all (from a Dunmer perspective) foreign things as alien and confusing - even dogs, horses and beer This is the most interesting aspect for me actually: Seeing things that are so common to us as real life humans from a completely different, outside perspective.

This is one thing, though - roleplaying. When I don't roleplay, but just fight together with other players at a dolmen or harrowstorm or in some group dungeon - I don't care for their race at all. That's not the time to think strictly "in-character". And rejecting another player in that situation would seem extremely inappropriate to me. I definitively wouldn't do it.

I mean, I suppose that's fine. I still don't like slavery/rascism anywhere but thats me. But there are players who definitely take it everywhere including with groups, guilds, and even zone chat. Theres even some who praise it constantly, be it in-game or forums. I just think it should never be seen as a good thing or even reasonable.

That's all my opinion though.

I don't mind it in consensual role-playing situations. As long as everyone involved has a firm grasp on out-of-character and in-character and consents, I think its possible for it be done well. Sort of like roleplaying an evil character in D&D.

I think that roleplaying out racism in non-consensual settings like groups, or in public settings like zone chat is on the trolling spectrum. Part of responsible roleplaying is caring about the people behind the character you are interacting with, and that's, ah, not usually the goal of people acting out Dunmer racism or Altmer xenophobia or "Skyrim for the Nords" in public. Quite the opposite.

To riff on a phrase, "My liberty to swing my fist ends where your nose begins." In the same way, we're allowed to roleplay the nastier aspects of TES races...but we should always be bound by the responsible desire to care for the real people impacted by our roleplay. Being allowed to roleplay nasty people doesn't ever give us the right to hurt other players.

meekmiko · January 2021

No

Girl_Number8 wrote: »

No that would be stupid.

I would refuse a healer if they had a bow in a vet trial or certain vet dlc dungeons.

Only exception would be if they had dps high as mine and it wasn’t any content the required a healer. But I would still kick them for the queuing as one at the end and finish whatever we were doing ourselves.

Ouch.
I've actually healed through vet Trials and Dungeons on my Khajiit StamWarden Healer... and she uses double bow.

Pauls · January 2021

Yes

I dont like orc healers

zvavi · January 2021

No

meekmiko wrote: »

Girl_Number8 wrote: »

No that would be stupid.

I would refuse a healer if they had a bow in a vet trial or certain vet dlc dungeons.

Only exception would be if they had dps high as mine and it wasn’t any content the required a healer. But I would still kick them for the queuing as one at the end and finish whatever we were doing ourselves.

Ouch.
I've actually healed through vet Trials and Dungeons on my Khajiit StamWarden Healer... and she uses double bow.

Wait, what buffs other than minor toughness were you providing?

starkerealm · January 2021

No

zvavi wrote: »

meekmiko wrote: »

Girl_Number8 wrote: »

No that would be stupid.

I would refuse a healer if they had a bow in a vet trial or certain vet dlc dungeons.

Only exception would be if they had dps high as mine and it wasn’t any content the required a healer. But I would still kick them for the queuing as one at the end and finish whatever we were doing ourselves.

Ouch.
I've actually healed through vet Trials and Dungeons on my Khajiit StamWarden Healer... and she uses double bow.

Wait, what buffs other than minor toughness were you providing?

Mag/Stam return (to the tune of 250 per second, so not exceptional, but it's there), Minor Vulnerability, Major Protection (requires an ult, so not recommended), Major Resolve, and Major Expedition (not recommended, and yes I do mean you can give this to other party members.) I'm sure there are other options, even before you go out of class. It's not the best skillset in the game, but there are options here.

Bow gives you Major Defile (not recommended for PvE, but here we are), with two CCs, (draining shot and bombard.) Again, not the best toolkit, but it is workable. The biggest upside to running the bow is that it increases your crit chance, and that it allows you to stand at range while still weaving.

Common, out of class options, include Barrier, Blood Altar, Bone Shield (Major Vitality), Vigor and Warhorn.

Is it the best? Probably not, but it is entirely viable.

zvavi · January 2021

No

starkerealm wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

meekmiko wrote: »

Girl_Number8 wrote: »

No that would be stupid.

I would refuse a healer if they had a bow in a vet trial or certain vet dlc dungeons.

Only exception would be if they had dps high as mine and it wasn’t any content the required a healer. But I would still kick them for the queuing as one at the end and finish whatever we were doing ourselves.

Ouch.
I've actually healed through vet Trials and Dungeons on my Khajiit StamWarden Healer... and she uses double bow.

Wait, what buffs other than minor toughness were you providing?

Mag/Stam return (to the tune of 250 per second, so not exceptional, but it's there), Minor Vulnerability, Major Protection (requires an ult, so not recommended), Major Resolve, and Major Expedition (not recommended, and yes I do mean you can give this to other party members.) I'm sure there are other options, even before you go out of class. It's not the best skillset in the game, but there are options here.

Bow gives you Major Defile (not recommended for PvE, but here we are), with two CCs, (draining shot and bombard.) Again, not the best toolkit, but it is workable. The biggest upside to running the bow is that it increases your crit chance, and that it allows you to stand at range while still weaving.

Common, out of class options, include Barrier, Blood Altar, Bone Shield (Major Vitality), Vigor and Warhorn.

Is it the best? Probably not, but it is entirely viable.

Interesting, the resource return is orbs? Well, it is already more than the average pug healer. I had a plan at some point of trying something like that, but I scrapped it because of no way to provide mag steal and minor berserk, which I didn't want to lose on.

Reverb · January 2021

If we have a progression group going for times and leaderboard spot, and everyone else in the group was min/maxed, I might veto an orc or red guard healer in favor of a mag aligned race.

But that’s the only case I can think of where it would be a factor.

starkerealm · January 2021

No

zvavi wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

meekmiko wrote: »

Girl_Number8 wrote: »

No that would be stupid.

I would refuse a healer if they had a bow in a vet trial or certain vet dlc dungeons.

Only exception would be if they had dps high as mine and it wasn’t any content the required a healer. But I would still kick them for the queuing as one at the end and finish whatever we were doing ourselves.

Ouch.
I've actually healed through vet Trials and Dungeons on my Khajiit StamWarden Healer... and she uses double bow.

Wait, what buffs other than minor toughness were you providing?

Mag/Stam return (to the tune of 250 per second, so not exceptional, but it's there), Minor Vulnerability, Major Protection (requires an ult, so not recommended), Major Resolve, and Major Expedition (not recommended, and yes I do mean you can give this to other party members.) I'm sure there are other options, even before you go out of class. It's not the best skillset in the game, but there are options here.

Bow gives you Major Defile (not recommended for PvE, but here we are), with two CCs, (draining shot and bombard.) Again, not the best toolkit, but it is workable. The biggest upside to running the bow is that it increases your crit chance, and that it allows you to stand at range while still weaving.

Common, out of class options, include Barrier, Blood Altar, Bone Shield (Major Vitality), Vigor and Warhorn.

Is it the best? Probably not, but it is entirely viable.

Interesting, the resource return is orbs? Well, it is already more than the average pug healer. I had a plan at some point of trying something like that, but I scrapped it because of no way to provide mag steal and minor berserk, which I didn't want to lose on.

The resource return is from Nature's Gift, which applies direct resource return when you heal using a Green Balance ability (realistically, this is 'shrooms and trees, though you could use some of the others, they'd just be drastically less effective. (In theory, you can apply Minor Life Steal using Leeching Vines, which would apply that buff, and also return resources everytime they took damage, but that's still running a mag skill on a stam build, so the ability's basic value would be limited.)

starkerealm · January 2021

No

Reverb wrote: »

If we have a progression group going for times and leaderboard spot, and everyone else in the group was min/maxed, I might veto an orc or red guard healer in favor of a mag aligned race.

But that’s the only case I can think of where it would be a factor.

Wacky thought: The Redguard weapon skill cost discount is 1% better than the Breton's mag ability discount. Probably not that important, but it is there. Also, Redguards will regain stamina as they weave, meaning running out of stam because of sprinting/dodge rolling/blocking should be less common.

Not saying, "you need to run this," but depending on the build it wouldn't be the end of the world. (They might, actually, be a major pick in the weird territory of stam healers.)

Orcs are just faster and more durable. These aren't bad things for a healer, though, I doubt you'd find many players in that subset of players who'd try to run it for those perks.

zvavi · January 2021

No

starkerealm wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

meekmiko wrote: »

Girl_Number8 wrote: »

No that would be stupid.

I would refuse a healer if they had a bow in a vet trial or certain vet dlc dungeons.

Only exception would be if they had dps high as mine and it wasn’t any content the required a healer. But I would still kick them for the queuing as one at the end and finish whatever we were doing ourselves.

Ouch.
I've actually healed through vet Trials and Dungeons on my Khajiit StamWarden Healer... and she uses double bow.

Wait, what buffs other than minor toughness were you providing?

Mag/Stam return (to the tune of 250 per second, so not exceptional, but it's there), Minor Vulnerability, Major Protection (requires an ult, so not recommended), Major Resolve, and Major Expedition (not recommended, and yes I do mean you can give this to other party members.) I'm sure there are other options, even before you go out of class. It's not the best skillset in the game, but there are options here.

Bow gives you Major Defile (not recommended for PvE, but here we are), with two CCs, (draining shot and bombard.) Again, not the best toolkit, but it is workable. The biggest upside to running the bow is that it increases your crit chance, and that it allows you to stand at range while still weaving.

Common, out of class options, include Barrier, Blood Altar, Bone Shield (Major Vitality), Vigor and Warhorn.

Is it the best? Probably not, but it is entirely viable.

Interesting, the resource return is orbs? Well, it is already more than the average pug healer. I had a plan at some point of trying something like that, but I scrapped it because of no way to provide mag steal and minor berserk, which I didn't want to lose on.

The resource return is from Nature's Gift, which applies direct resource return when you heal using a Green Balance ability (realistically, this is 'shrooms and trees, though you could use some of the others, they'd just be drastically less effective. (In theory, you can apply Minor Life Steal using Leeching Vines, which would apply that buff, and also return resources everytime they took damage, but that's still running a mag skill on a stam build, so the ability's basic value would be limited.)

Nature's gift only give you resources, not your allies
...

starkerealm · January 2021

No

zvavi wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

meekmiko wrote: »

Girl_Number8 wrote: »

No that would be stupid.

I would refuse a healer if they had a bow in a vet trial or certain vet dlc dungeons.

Only exception would be if they had dps high as mine and it wasn’t any content the required a healer. But I would still kick them for the queuing as one at the end and finish whatever we were doing ourselves.

Ouch.
I've actually healed through vet Trials and Dungeons on my Khajiit StamWarden Healer... and she uses double bow.

Wait, what buffs other than minor toughness were you providing?

Mag/Stam return (to the tune of 250 per second, so not exceptional, but it's there), Minor Vulnerability, Major Protection (requires an ult, so not recommended), Major Resolve, and Major Expedition (not recommended, and yes I do mean you can give this to other party members.) I'm sure there are other options, even before you go out of class. It's not the best skillset in the game, but there are options here.

Bow gives you Major Defile (not recommended for PvE, but here we are), with two CCs, (draining shot and bombard.) Again, not the best toolkit, but it is workable. The biggest upside to running the bow is that it increases your crit chance, and that it allows you to stand at range while still weaving.

Common, out of class options, include Barrier, Blood Altar, Bone Shield (Major Vitality), Vigor and Warhorn.

Is it the best? Probably not, but it is entirely viable.

Interesting, the resource return is orbs? Well, it is already more than the average pug healer. I had a plan at some point of trying something like that, but I scrapped it because of no way to provide mag steal and minor berserk, which I didn't want to lose on.

The resource return is from Nature's Gift, which applies direct resource return when you heal using a Green Balance ability (realistically, this is 'shrooms and trees, though you could use some of the others, they'd just be drastically less effective. (In theory, you can apply Minor Life Steal using Leeching Vines, which would apply that buff, and also return resources everytime they took damage, but that's still running a mag skill on a stam build, so the ability's basic value would be limited.)

Nature's gift only give you resources, not your allies
...

****. Well, that's what I get for going from memory.

Chufu · January 2021

No

My healers are Orc healers. Nobody so far has rejected me just because of the race, so I am glad that the ESO world is very tolerant. Nevertheless though I wouldn't even join groups that would tell me to respecc my race just because another race has more Magicka, etc.

Even though I still think ESO could have done better with the races then we wouldn't even have this problem that some races just have better bonuses in specific areas and others don't. I really don't enjoy "Meta races".

starkerealm · January 2021

No

Thinking about it, an Orc Necrohealer, running some combination of Shalk Exo, Akaviri Dragonguard, and Werewolf Hide wouldn't be the worst thing for a progression group struggling with recovers. It'd be a very niche build goal, but it could help. That said, it would put more stress on the other healer, and a Nord would probably be a better choice for that role. (To be fair, being a necro-rez bot is usually shuffled over to the off tank in situations like this, but either approach is valid, based on the group's idiosyncrasies.)

StarOfElyon · January 2021

No

Ratzkifal wrote: »

StarOfElyon wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

BXR_Lonestar wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

BXR_Lonestar wrote: »

I voted no. My main healer is a nord templar and I've healed a crap-ton of difficult content on him, including solo trials. Race doesn't matter as much for healers and even a non-meta race like the nord has a lot to offer for the healer role. Extra defense and health makes him more survivable right out of the box, and extra ultimate generation means more warhorns. There's no build in magika sustain, but that can be compensated for with smart play.

Yes, there are races that have racial passives that add ZERO benefit to the healer role (Woodelf and orc, unless you are a stam-healer), but for most other races, the racials can add at least a little something to the healer toolkit that can be beneficial.

Woodelves are just in a bad place right now. Ironically, I could even see an argument for orcs with their movement buff and extra health making them a bit faster and tankier for trying to pull off a recovery. Granted it's an edge case, but you could get some value there.

Even some weird cases, like Redguards, could have some legitimate uses on healers, so... yeah, it's more a question of whether the player running the character can play the role than the race. Then again, I've never been particularly hung up on player's races.

Yes, it pains me to say it, but Bosmer are not in a good place right now, and it sucks, because they are one of my favorite races in the ES Universe. I would love to see them rework their passives to give them bonus armor penetration or weapon damage when using a bow, perhaps a race-specific bonus like minor evasion that stacks with the evasion skill that allows them to take less AOE damage to compensate for the fact that they have so little health.

Bottom line is that they're supposed to be a stealth-based race, but the Khajit's passives are far better for that kind of play. The lore also makes Bosmer some of the best archers in the ES universe, so why not lean into that role with some reworks that give them a leg up when using a bow?

Yeah, it's really unfortunate. I get that Brian wanted each race to be distinct, but giving Bosmer a detect stealth bonus in place of their stealth radius reduction (because they shared it with the Khajiit) really weakened them. Stealth in general is pretty niche, but detect radius is useful in both PvE and PvP, while detect stealth is only useful in PvP (if you have a PvE encounter involving stealth, either the enemy is completely hidden, or not. Giving the Bosmer a penetration bonus would give them a very distinct identity, and there are other ways to balance stealth bonuses (like giving the Bosmer faster movement in stealth or reduced stealth cost instead of reduced detection radius.)

But Altmer is supposed to be the best magicka race and yet they have nothing over the Dunmer.

They have something over Dunmer. 125 max magicka to be exact.
And if you are playing a Templar then you have 5% less damage taken during Rememberance or when using Jabs or Jesus Beam.
I would like it if they changed the other part of Spell Recharge to do something more useful than restoring a negligible amount of your lower max resource, particularly for tanks or healers, but they do not need a damage boost.

That's pretty class specific. Yeah, point is 125 magicka and 5% reduced damage when channeling is measly. They need something more. It doesn't have to be damage.

harmsway · January 2021

No

no that would be racist

Vanya · January 2021

Other

I voted other. I shall accept Lizard healers, Stay out of trouble Lizard, I am quoting Skyrim guard.When it comes to healers, Amphibians are superior, think about it, living in poisonus infested swamps filled with diseases , its hot humid,tArgonians not only have best natural resitanace, and immunity but they were forced and born to be herblists,shamans,natural lizard remedy By Box-xul! Argonians as healers, and scouts,Dunmer's wisdom and magic affinity , Nord's courage and valor andd warrior spirit

LadyNalcarya · January 2021

No

No, for support players their skill is much more important than their race. I will be much more skeptical if they insist on using some weird "unique" builds and refuse to slot skills like elemental drain or orbs, though.

starkerealm wrote: »

Thinking about it, an Orc Necrohealer, running some combination of Shalk Exo, Akaviri Dragonguard, and Werewolf Hide wouldn't be the worst thing for a progression group struggling with recovers. It'd be a very niche build goal, but it could help. That said, it would put more stress on the other healer, and a Nord would probably be a better choice for that role. (To be fair, being a necro-rez bot is usually shuffled over to the off tank in situations like this, but either approach is valid, based on the group's idiosyncrasies.)

I don't think that would help. If the group needs to recover that often, then strong heals would be more beneficial than spamming ressurection ultimate. It would just put too much pressure on another healer.

TwinLamps · January 2021

Other

Why use healer at all when you can equip pale order ring and bring another DD

Elwendryll · January 2021

No

I joined a trial guild around August last year. I immediately started joining their core runs as a backup, sometimes as Tank, sometimes as stam DD, on the same char. I eventually joined the core group as a Tank, starting this month, we got TTT a week ago, we just started IR progression. The other day I was talking with one of the healers, and he said "Your sorc is a kitty? o.o".

1. Khajiit passives are useful for any role.
2. Any competent player will only care about the results. If someone kicks you out of any content based on your race only, they don't know as much about the game as they think they do.

starkerealm · January 2021

No

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Thinking about it, an Orc Necrohealer, running some combination of Shalk Exo, Akaviri Dragonguard, and Werewolf Hide wouldn't be the worst thing for a progression group struggling with recovers. It'd be a very niche build goal, but it could help. That said, it would put more stress on the other healer, and a Nord would probably be a better choice for that role. (To be fair, being a necro-rez bot is usually shuffled over to the off tank in situations like this, but either approach is valid, based on the group's idiosyncrasies.)

I don't think that would help. If the group needs to recover that often, then strong heals would be more beneficial than spamming ressurection ultimate. It would just put too much pressure on another healer.

Depends on the cause of death. If you're looking at situations where people are dying from chip damage, then, no, that wouldn't work. If you're looking at situations where the DPS are getting one tapped by specific mechanics, and the healer's only job beyond that is keeping people topped off, it starts to become a legitimate consideration. So, for example, vAS? No, it wouldn't be a good idea, aside from the steam, you'll rarely be one tapped in there. In vKA? Yeah, there are a number of situations, particularly with the Blood Knights, where you can end up with a cluster of dead DPS, regardless what their health was before the hit.

Syldras · January 2021

No

Ryuvain wrote: »

I mean, I suppose that's fine. I still don't like slavery/rascism anywhere but thats me. But there are players who definitely take it everywhere including with groups, guilds, and even zone chat. Theres even some who praise it constantly, be it in-game or forums.

I think there's a distinctive difference between roleplaying someone from a deeply isolated or even xenophobic society, where viewing other cultures as unequal is one single aspect of many of a character's personality, or behaving "normal" most of the time and just spewing out racist remarks for "fun". I don't want to speculate much about peoples' motives, but I think, in latter case it's not really about roleplaying, but more about trolling. So it's probably better ignored.

Ryuvain wrote: »

I just think it should never be seen as a good thing or even reasonable.

I don't even think it's depicted in a positive way. It's just how ancient societies were. Of course, from a modern real life perspective, it's awful. But you can play a thief or a murderer in ESO, there's even special content for that purpose, or you can play a necromancer who desecrates other persons' dead relatives or ancestors - so why would it be worse to play a slaver?