@relentless_turnip

Yeah I agree, if you have ever read my past posts I am an advocate for controlling the stacking if proc sets. I don't have any particular problem with a single set.

I would like to see a shared global cooldown, stat scaling or diminishing returns. I would be happy with any element of control and would also like to see malacath no longer work with them.

I don't think you can make any claim of impartiality if you believe that proc sets aren't overturned ATM though. You can make a one button tank and out perform everyone who's damage scales with stats. This has been proven by many content creators, with no counter argument made that bears any relevance.

Proc sets also encourage the tank meta. People bulk up to avoid the free damage that is everywhere. On top of that those running proc sets need no offensive stat investment to be effective, so everything is stacked into health and armor.

I made this thread, highlighting exactly this:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/549677/me-make-build-me-good-at-elder-scrolls#latest[/quote]

Even devs are not able to predict how some small change will impact gameplay. There are some changes that were reversed in the past. They should stop with it in my opinion and just do major changes using expirence they learnd over all of these years. Any free damge or free healing, shielding is at some problem causing the lack of control over combat. For a lot of people proc sets are fun, the like the effects and all that stuff. ZoS won't change it

relentless_turnip wrote: »

Swordancer wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Anyone trying to talk down how overpowered this set is either using it and don't want it nerfed because it will hurt their noob carry setup, or they don't have any clue about combat or balance. I'm not gonna discuss this with anyone here because it is far from a topic imo.

It is very easy to assume what somone thinks and what somone want with such provocative comments when you could just accepts that the world is not ending in the place where your opinion is the only right one and the other people are always wrong. The goal of civilized discussion is to exchange arguments in a cultural way, not to attack others with comments of such style.

I think the only part I can agree with is that this thread is actually off topic right now and this is not what I intended creating it.

It isn't an opinion though...
It has been shown and can be proven mathematically. You can run more offensive and defensive power by running proc sets alone than with a stat based set up. We can gloss over the fact they're incredibly easy to play.

I am not advocating anything but a civil conversation. It is worth establishing that proc set balance is not an opinion based discussion though. The simple fact is you can run higher defence and offence on a proc set build than you can with a stat based build.

Unfortunately saying you think they are balanced isn't a counter argument. If you can make a stat based build with more an offence than this two button build:
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=284300

Then we can go back to discuss opinions...

Sure it is. But try to fix it nerfing one set. Nothing is going to change. Everytime they creating some set it might become populare becouse it gives you advantage. Changing one of them is just mess it's a mistake. You will make people to change the way they are plaing to get the same results, same problem. There is major change required but any other small change is just aproval for them to keep doing these changes the wrong way with the same results like in the past.

Now when you look at some changes in the past you will notice that some usless sets were also nerfed. Why? Is bal;ance realy the reason why they nerfing some sets? I don't think so.

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Swordancer wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Swordancer wrote: »

Blackleopardex wrote: »

Anyone trying to talk down how overpowered this set is either using it and don't want it nerfed because it will hurt their noob carry setup, or they don't have any clue about combat or balance. I'm not gonna discuss this with anyone here because it is far from a topic imo.

It is very easy to assume what somone thinks and what somone want with such provocative comments when you could just accepts that the world is not ending in the place where your opinion is the only right one and the other people are always wrong. The goal of civilized discussion is to exchange arguments in a cultural way, not to attack others with comments of such style.

I think the only part I can agree with is that this thread is actually off topic right now and this is not what I intended creating it.

There is not a single argument made in this thread that supports this set that also benefit the overall balance of the combat in the game. I can be wrong like everyone else and I do like a civilized discussion. However when the discussion is just to benefit personal gain I don't really see what is there to be discussed.

Edit: If you really need me to spell it out for you why this set is overpowered I can do that, but I think you actually know it deep down.

Devs were doing it since the game was released and now the game is going the same way. Stoll a lot of problems with balance. This threard wasn't intended to support any set. What you wrote just proves that you don't want to understand what I meant by creating it. When you are going to nerf this one set it will impact all other that are spammy, tanky already. If you really truly belive this set is so OP, record your own video and prove it. Go for hunt xD Show me how you fight with random people in your team against other random teams and how you are goodlike out there.

The set is usefull, can be powerfull in some cases same as most powerfull sets can suck in one situation and looks OP in others. There are sets that were created just to give advantage over specific builds in the PvP. Some of these got nerfed and you know why? Becouse devs created them becouse people were complaining about OP builds and then they started to complain about the sets created in response to what they were complaining about earlier. Neverending problem.

There are others reasons why this set is nerfed. It become the problem only for those who cannot adapt to the gameplay. Of course this is my opinion and on one is forcung you to accept my point of view but don't tell me what I I think, intended or what I feel deep down becouse this is simply rude.

You have started this thread without posting any kind of footage or documentation at all. You have danced around your arguments using other ridicules comparisons on why you wanna keep the set the way it is. If you think your claims of exp with and without the set bare any meaningful meaning, you are wrong. I read the full post from you, many of your answers to other people arguing with you. I am not blind on what you are trying to say, I understand perfectly what you are trying to say, but I see past your poor arguments that see straight into the real reason why you made this post in the first place.

-You can not excuse a high damage set on tanks when it is just as useful against non-tanky people.

-You can not excuse a set for being anti-zerg when it is just as useful in 1v1.

-You can not excuse in general a high damage set, scaling up with execute and being a no brain mechanic to apply on range even(yes I have tried it, and yes it is that easy to get kills with it, but it makes for zero because the set is carrying you).

You have zero arguments that really benefit the over all combat because there are better other ways to attack the problem you try to hide behind when desperately defending this set.

You put the set in the title, you called the set "not over powered at all". You must be one of the least effective people of trying to hide a personal gain change by trying to sound like you have an argument. [snip]

[snip] I am aware that some part of the game is broken and need to be fixed but I played too much time trying this OP set of yours to know it isn't so OP as some people claim and I will keep that opinion of my own.

[snip]

[Edited to remove Baiting]

Swordancer wrote: »

What is stupid is nerfing one set when it is required to nerf all of them at ones. Otherewise we get the same results as in the past, which is not possitive effects at all and the same problem never fixed. We swap builds to other spammy one and another patch we get other nerfs and buffs becouse some ppl are crying too much.

Yes, ZOS needs to understand the fundamental, mechanical problems with proc sets and address those, not just reduce the tooltip for the most common offender. But:

1) That is not the view you tried to defend in the OP. If you've changed your mind, say so.
2) It actually is better to nerf one set at a time than not to nerf them at all, and it's arguably better not to make massive, lurching changes because that's exactly what happened this patch and made so many proc sets viable. If ZOS had made it a goal to gradually buff a few old sets each patch and just see how the meta shakes out, they could learn from their mistakes and they wouldn't now have the task of readjusting each value/adding coefficients for each set or coming up with global solutions like diminishing returns, reduced tooltips+allowing crit, global cooldowns on sets etc.

Recapitated wrote: »

Swordancer wrote: »

What is stupid is nerfing one set when it is required to nerf all of them at ones. Otherewise we get the same results as in the past, which is not possitive effects at all and the same problem never fixed. We swap builds to other spammy one and another patch we get other nerfs and buffs becouse some ppl are crying too much.

Yes, ZOS needs to understand the fundamental, mechanical problems with proc sets and address those, not just reduce the tooltip for the most common offender. But:

1) That is not the view you tried to defend in the OP. If you've changed your mind, say so.
2) It actually is better to nerf one set at a time than not to nerf them at all, and it's arguably better not to make massive, lurching changes because that's exactly what happened this patch and made so many proc sets viable. If ZOS had made it a goal to gradually buff a few old sets each patch and just see how the meta shakes out they wouldn't now have the task of readjusting each value/adding coefficients for each set or coming up with global solutions like diminishing returns, reduced tooltips+allowing crit, global cooldowns on sets etc.

I think more about these sets mechanics change. I think if you nerf single stat this set is becoming less usefull, if you nerf all at once it might be dificult to predict how it will impact all gameplay, but changing mechanics so you can't spam this sets and you actually need to do something that require much more effort then they can even double the damage it cause. With sheer venom all you have to do is to use execution ability, changing it to rechargeable additional ability would be much more interesting. For example to use it you need to fight for some time and then get unique effect like this poison damage you can use whenever you want. More powerfull but it require you to do more action to use it. Of course there are many other ways how you can fix the problem with major change without causing people who like playing them to be mad.

Next dlc:

Zaan
Explosive Rebuke
Frenzied Momentum
Malacath
Endurance x3
Trainee

All into health and regen:

Im gonna do it on warden personally, SnB and 2h, gripping, Artic, pierce for the 9k resistance removal

Zaan for pressure and some kills. Frenzied and Rebuke for burst. Artic, and gripping for added pressure.

Should be mad unkillable with too much damage

Edit: health sorc equally if not more busted but I just got my other sorc set up for pve so.... Warden it is

hexentb16_ESO wrote: »

I rose to the challenge proc sets provided and enjoy them being such a big part of the pvp meta now. In the words of Dark Souls fans, I got gud.

I'm not saying those of you complaining are wrong to do so or bad at the game but if you're unhappy with how easily you're dying to these newer proc builds maybe you should try adapting. ZOS probably isn't going to nerf things as much as you want so you might as well take the challenge on.

Improvise, adapt, overcome!

Hehehehe. I used the proc sets for the first time this weekend. The first thing I realized was that I had to dumb down my play style and use far less skills. Poison Arrow was the only thing I needed. The second thing I realized was that with gear that was all purple except for the bow, and with bad traits overall, I just nuked people. I adapted, but also took a large step down in terms of the amount of skill I used.

It's not a challenge, it's just allowing the gear to make the job for you while you stop caring about complicated things like skills.
To make a comparison to Dark Souls, you didn't get good, you lowered the difficulty settings to the lowest possible instead of mastering the game on the higher ones.

Nerf tanks along with proc sets.

If the advice of all these tank players is followed, it just insulates garbage tank playstyle.

Most complainers are only looking for an edge.

Keeping one thing over-performing because something else is, is not a justification for balance. Adjust both.